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					Monday                                    Volume 514
19 July 2010                                  No. 34

                HOUSE OF COMMONS
                  OFFICIAL REPORT


                    Monday 19 July 2010

                   © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2010
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                                      MEMBERS OF THE CABINET

                           (FORMED BY THE RT HON. DAVID CAMERON, MP, MAY 2010)

Hague, MP
May, MP

                              DEPARTMENTS OF STATE AND MINISTERS
Business, Innovation and Skills—
     Minister for Universities and Science—The Rt Hon. David Willetts, MP
     John Hayes, MP
     Mark Prisk, MP
     Edward Davey, MP
     Edward Vaizey, MP §
     Baroness Wilcox
Cabinet Office—
MINISTER OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Oliver Letwin, MP
     Mark Harper, MP
     Nick Hurd, MP
Communities and Local Government—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Eric Pickles, MP
     The Rt Hon. Greg Clark, MP
     The Rt Hon. Grant Shapps, MP
     Andrew Stunell, OBE, MP
     Robert Neill, MP
     Baroness Hanham, CBE
ii                             HER MAJESTY’S GOVERNMENT—cont.

Culture, Media and Sport—
      John Penrose, MP
      Hugh Robertson, MP
      Edward Vaizey, MP §
MINISTER OF STATE—Nick Harvey, MP (Minister for the Armed Forces)
      Gerald Howarth, MP
      Andrew Robathan, MP
      Peter Luff, MP
      Lord Astor of Hever, DL §
Duchy of Lancaster—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Michael Gove, MP
      Sarah Teather, MP
      Nick Gibb, MP
      Tim Loughton, MP
      Lord Hill of Oareford
Energy and Climate Change—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Chris Huhne, MP
      Charles Hendry, MP
      Gregory Barker, MP
Environment, Food and Rural Affairs—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Caroline Spelman, MP
      Richard Benyon, MP
      Lord Henley
Foreign and Commonwealth Office—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. William Hague, MP
      Jeremy Browne, MP
      Minister for Europe—David Lidington, MP
      The Rt Hon. Lord Howell of Guildford
      Henry Bellingham, MP
      Alistair Burt, MP
Government Equalities Office—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Andrew Lansley, CBE, MP
      Paul Burstow, MP
      Simon Burns, MP
      Anne Milton, MP
      Earl Howe
Home Office—
      Minister for Immigration—Damian Green, MP
      Minister for Police—The Rt Hon. Nick Herbert, MP §
      Minister for Security—The Rt Hon. Baroness Neville-Jones
      Lynne Featherstone, MP (Minister for Equalities) §
      James Brokenshire, MP
                                   HER MAJESTY’S GOVERNMENT—cont.                                        iii

International Development—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Andrew Mitchell, MP
MINISTER OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Alan Duncan, MP
      The Rt Hon. Lord McNally
      The Rt Hon. Nick Herbert, MP §
      Crispin Blunt, MP
      Jonathan Djanogly, MP
Law Officers—
ATTORNEY-GENERAL—The Rt Hon. Dominic Grieve, QC, MP
ADVOCATE-GENERAL FOR SCOTLAND—The Rt Hon. Lord Wallace of Tankerness, QC
Leader of the House of Commons—
Northern Ireland—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Owen Paterson, MP
Privy Council Office—
Scotland Office—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Michael Moore, MP
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Philip Hammond, MP
MINISTER OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Theresa Villiers, MP
     Norman Baker, MP
     Mike Penning, MP
CHIEF SECRETARY—The Rt Hon. Danny Alexander, MP
      Michael Fabricant, MP
      Angela Watkinson, MP
      Jeremy Wright, MP
      Brooks Newmark, MP
      James Duddridge, MP
      Philip Dunne, MP
      Stephen Crabb, MP
      Robert Goodwill, MP
      Shailesh Vara, MP
      Bill Wiggin, MP
      Chloe Smith, MP
      Norman Lamb, MP
      Mark Hunter, MP
iv                               HER MAJESTY’S GOVERNMENT—cont.

Wales Office—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Cheryl Gillan, MP
Work and Pensions—
SECRETARY OF STATE—The Rt Hon. Iain Duncan Smith, MP
     The Rt Hon. Chris Grayling, MP
     Steve Webb, MP
     Maria Miller, MP
     Lord Freud
Her Majesty’s Household—
LORD STEWARD—The Earl of Dalhousie
TREASURER—The Rt Hon. John Randall, MP
COMPTROLLER—Alistair Carmichael, MP
VICE-CHAMBERLAIN—The Rt Hon. Mark Francois, MP
BARONESSES IN WAITING—Baroness Northover, Baroness Rawlings, Baroness Verma
LORDS IN WAITING—Earl Attlee, Lord Astor of Hever §, DL, Lord De Mauley, TD, Lord Taylor of Holbeach, CBE,
Lord Wallace of Saltaire

§ Members of the Government with responsibilities in more than one area

                              HOUSE OF COMMONS
THE SPEAKER—The Rt Hon. John Bercow, MP


     Mr David Amess, MP, Hugh Bayley, MP, Miss Anne Begg, MP, Mr Joe Benton, MP,
     Mr Clive Betts, MP, Mr Peter Bone, MP, Mr Graham Brady, MP, Annette Brooke, MP,
     Martin Caton, MP, Mr Christopher Chope, MP, Katy Clark, MP, Mr David Crausby, MP,
     Philip Davies, MP, Jim Dobbin, MP, Mr Roger Gale, MP, Mr James Gray, MP,
     Mr Mike Hancock, MP, Mr Philip Hollobone, MP, Mr Jim Hood, MP,
     The Rt Hon. George Howarth, MP, Mr Edward Leigh, MP, Mrs Anne Main, MP,
     Dr William McCrea, MP, Miss Anne McIntosh, MP, Mrs Linda Riordan, MP,
     John Robertson, MP, Andrew Rosindell, MP, Jim Sheridan, MP, Mr Gary Streeter, MP,
     Mr Andrew Turner, MP, Mr Charles Walker, MP, Joan Walley, MP, Mr Mike Weir, MP,
     Hywel Williams, MP

      The Rt Hon. The Speaker (Chairman), Sir Stuart Bell, MP, Nick Harvey, MP, The Rt Hon. Rosie Winterton, MP,
      The Rt Hon. Sir George Young, MP

     Alex Jablonowski (Chairman), Clive Betts, MP, Nick Harvey, MP, The Rt Hon. Rosie Winterton, MP,
     Stephen Brooker, Mark Clarke

     Malcolm Jack, PhD (Chief Executive), Robert Rogers (Director General, Chamber and Committee Services),
     John Pullinger (Director General, Information Services), Andrew Walker (Director General, Resources),
     John Borley, CB (Director General, Facilities), Joan Miller (Director of Parliamentary ICT) (External Member),
     Alex Jablonowski (External Member)

SPEAKER’S SECRETARY—John Benger (Acting)
SPEAKER’S COUNSEL—Michael Carpenter
SPEAKER’S CHAPLAIN—Rev. Canon Robert Wright



19 July 2010
                                          OFFICIAL REPORT

                                 [WHICH OPENED 18 MAY 2010]

                             FIFTY-NINTH YEAR OF THE REIGN OF
                      HER MAJESTY QUEEN ELIZABETH II

SIXTH SERIES                                                                                       VOLUME 514
                               FIFTH VOLUME OF SESSION 2010-2011

         House of Commons                                   sector, voluntary or other group—anywhere in the country,
                                                            but particularly in the inner cities—that is trying to set
                                                            up work clubs or job clubs?
                 Monday 19 July 2010
                                                               Chris Grayling: My hon. Friend’s offer will be extremely
                                                            welcome throughout the country. There are a small
        The House met at half-past Two o’clock              number of other clubs in operation, but we want to see
                                                            that number expand significantly. Although there is a
                      PRAYERS                               clear role for central Government in providing support
                                                            through the work programme to get people back into
                                                            work, we also want to see communities and individuals
              [MR SPEAKER in the Chair]                     engaged in helping others who are struggling to find
                                                            work, and we will do everything we can, as we unroll
                                                            our plans over the next few weeks and months, to
   Oral Answers to Questions                                ensure that those opportunities exist.

                                                              Chris Leslie (Nottingham East) (Lab/Co-op): All
                                                            Members want to see as much effort as possible to help
              WORK AND PENSIONS                             people off benefits and into work, but how much has
                                                            the right hon. Gentleman estimated it will cost to cover
                                                            the predicted 100,000 extra people who will be out of
          The Secretary of State was asked—                 work because of the Budget delivered by his right hon.
                      Work Clubs                            Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer?

   2. Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con): When he expects the        Chris Grayling: The hon. Gentleman has clearly not
first work clubs to be operational.              [8927]     adequately studied the small print of all the forecasts.
                                                            The reality is that by the end of this Parliament we
   The Minister of State, Department for Work and           expect to have more people in employment—significant
Pensions (Chris Grayling): My hon. Friend has been          increases in employment as a result of our approach to
slightly modest with this question, because through his     dealing with the deficit. The previous Government left
constituency he has been one of the pioneers of work        us with a completely unaffordable deficit; they left this
clubs in the UK. We are looking at his experience, and      Government and this country in deep financial difficulties.
we plan to announce our intention shortly to provide        What we had from them was a culture of irresponsibility.
additional support, so that work clubs can be developed     We will put this country back on the rails.
throughout the country in areas affected by unemployment.
                                                              Mr Speaker: I call Yvette Cooper. I had thought that
   Tony Baldry: I thank my right hon. Friend for those      the right hon. Lady wanted to come in on this question.
kind comments. Does he agree that one benefit of work
clubs and job clubs is that the whole community is able       Yvette Cooper (Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford)
help those who are out of work, while they are out of       (Lab) indicated dissent.
work, to get back into the world of work as speedily as
possible? May I give him an undertaking that we in            Mr Speaker: Perhaps there has been a change of
Banbury and Bicester stand ready to support any third       plan. Never mind.
3                      Oral Answers                    19 JULY 2010                   Oral Answers                        4

   Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con):               over the course of 20 years, for a typical person retiring
In my constituency we have two job clubs. Does my               this year, will add £15,000 in extra state pension compared
right hon. Friend agree that one of the biggest problems        with price indexation, which was the policy of her
facing people looking for work is that, when they look          Government.
for fairly low-paid work, they find that they are better
off staying on unemployment benefit? That is a real                Miss Anne Begg (Aberdeen South) (Lab): In a written
problem.                                                        statement, the Minister said that the Government would
                                                                force occupational pensions to be linked to the consumer
   Chris Grayling: My hon. Friend is right, and it is           prices index instead of the retail prices index. What
clearly an absurd situation when work does not pay. We          powers do they have, or will they have, to take to make
have to make changes, and my right hon. Friend the              that happen?
Secretary of State is leading an effort to address that
problem. In this country we have to ensure that work
                                                                   Steve Webb: I am grateful to the Chair of the Select
pays, and that we do everything possible to help people
                                                                Committee on Work and Pensions for her question, as
off benefit dependency and back into the workplace.
                                                                this matter has not been well understood. Statute provides
                                                                a floor above which occupational pension schemes have
                        Pensioners                              to operate. In other words, we will not force occupational
                                                                pension schemes to cut their increases; we simply provide
  3. John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab): What            a floor, which used to be linked to the RPI and is now
assessment he has made of the likely effect on pensioners       linked to the CPI. Schemes remain entirely free to go
of his proposed changes to the welfare system. [8928]           beyond that if they wish.
   The Minister of State, Department for Work and                                   Industrial Injuries
Pensions (Steve Webb): Since the general election a
number of changes have been announced to benefits
and pensions. The most significant for pensioners was             4. George Eustice (Camborne and Redruth) (Con):
our decision, after 30 years of decline in the pension’s        What discussions he has had with the Industrial
real value, to restore the earnings link with the basic         Injuries Advisory Council on industrial injuries linked
state pension.                                                  to the mining industry.                            [8929]

   John Robertson: I thank the Minister for his answer,           The Minister of State, Department for Work and
but he is well aware that the earnings link will not help       Pensions (Chris Grayling): Ministers have had no discussions
pensioners as of January, when they start to pay their          with the IIAC about industrial injuries linked to the
increased VAT. That increase amounts to almost £8 billion       mining industry. However, my colleague Lord Freud is
over the life of a Parliament, so when will the hon.            planning to meet the IIAC chairman and the council
Gentleman stick by his party’s promise during the general       shortly to discuss their work.
election campaign to fight any VAT rise? What will he
do to protect those elderly people who, through no fault          George Eustice: In 2008 a report by the IIAC concluded
of their own, will be left with enormous debts, thanks to       that activities linked to the mining industry, such as
this Government?                                                kneeling under heavy loads, doubled the risk of suffering
                                                                osteoarthritis of the knee. The activities described in
   Steve Webb: I am not sure whether the hon. Gentleman         the report apply as much to tin miners as to coal miners,
is aware that the Office for Budget Responsibility estimates    but because the report made no specific reference to tin
that the country’s structural deficit is now more than          mining, former tin miners in Cornwall are being denied
£12 billion larger than it was thought to be at the             compensation. Will the Minister review the scope of
election. I do not know where he would have got that            that report to ensure that tin miners are treated fairly?
£12 billion from. As for pensioners, not only will we
ensure that we restore the earnings link, but in April
2011 the full value of the cash increase in the state              Chris Grayling: My hon. Friend makes an important
pension will go through to the poorest pensioners on            point. I have visited his constituency and know what an
pension credit.                                                 important part the mining industry has played in his
                                                                local economy over the years. We all very much hope
   Ms Angela Eagle (Wallasey) (Lab): Does the Minister          that it will have the opportunity to do so again in future.
agree that if the pensions in payment today had been            I am very sympathetic to the points that he makes. I can
linked to the consumer prices index rather than to the          give him an undertaking that I will discuss the matter
retail prices index for the past 20 years, pensions would       with Lord Freud, and we will certainly make representations
be 14% lower than they are now? Does not the proposed           on his behalf to the IIAC to see whether the issue of the
shift in the definition of price indexation represent a         tin mining industry and those who have worked in it can
huge raid on pension benefits, which gets worse and             be addressed again.
worse as time goes on and makes all current and future
pensioners poorer?                                                 John Mann (Bassetlaw) (Lab): I am delighted to hear
                                                                that the Minister is sympathetic to the mining industry
   Steve Webb: It pains me to suggest that the hon. Lady        and miners across the country. Can he give a guarantee
is being selective in her use of statistics, but if she looks   that there will be no cuts whatever in the industrial
at the increase in pensions as a whole—the basic state          injuries compensation that the Government provide to
pension and additional pensions—she will see that we            those in coal mining, tin mining and every other type of
have linked the basic state pension to earnings, which          mining over the next five years?
5                     Oral Answers                   19 JULY 2010                  Oral Answers                        6

  Chris Grayling: It is the goal of this Administration        Mr Duncan Smith: There will not be a gap, all existing
to protect the most vulnerable in our society, and if        programmes are being extended, and the Work programme
people have significant issues in their lives we will do     will be applicable to all those young people in the hon.
everything we can to protect them. Of course, we are         Gentleman’s constituency. Having only just gone into
facing a massive economic headache left to us by the         opposition, he might like to reflect on the past 14 years,
previous Government. I expect to hear Opposition             and the fact that when his party left office it left us with
Members say, “Protect, protect, protect,” to us on many      more than 1.3 million 16 to 24-year-olds not in full-time
occasions over the coming months, but it would not be        education, employment or training. That is 200,000
such a challenge to do so if they had not left such an       more than were left to the Labour party in 1997. It is a
enormous mess for us to deal with.                           shameful record, and we do not need lectures from
                                                             Labour Members about youth unemployment.

                 Youth Unemployment                            Mrs Helen Grant (Maidstone and The Weald) (Con):
                                                             How does my right hon. Friend plan to break the cycle
                                                             of intergenerational unemployment? In my constituency
   5. Dr Sarah Wollaston (Totnes) (Con): What steps he       there are many families in which no one works. That has
is taking to reduce the level of youth unemployment.         a devastating effect not only on those families but on
                                                             their communities.

  6. Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab):                Mr Duncan Smith: My hon. Friend asks an important
What steps he plans to take to increase youth                question. In the past 14 years huge sums of money have
employment in 2010-11.                     [8931]            been narrowly focused on different groups, and we have
                                                             forgotten that in households with families, far too many
   The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Mr Iain     are out of work. That is one reason why child poverty
Duncan Smith): The Government are committed to               has been so difficult to tackle, and why we must change
tackling youth unemployment. Young people can access         the system. We want to consider how to make work pay
a comprehensive range of opportunities, support and          for those on the lowest incomes, and how work can be
advice that will help them find employment, as part of       distributed more among households and less just among
the Work programme. As we introduce that programme,          individuals. Most particularly, we want people to recognise
it will offer integrated employment support to young         that it is more important and more viable for them to be
people, regardless of the benefit that they claim. I         back in work than on benefits. The complicated system
recognise the work that my hon. Friend has done in her       that the previous Government introduced, with all its
constituency among young people. The results there are       different taper rates and withdrawal rates, meant that
good, because youth unemployment is lower than the           people needed to be professors of maths to figure out
national average and has fallen over the past year.          whether they would be better off going to work or
                                                             staying on benefits. Our job is to ensure that the system
                                                             is simpler and easier to understand. Unlike the previous
  Dr Wollaston: In my constituency, at this time of year
                                                             Government, we will value households that take a risk
when there is seasonal work things are not so bad, but
                                                             and try to go to work.
there are up to 470 young people under 24 claiming
jobseeker’s allowance at other times of the year. Can the
Secretary of State clarify what measures will be taken to       Yvette Cooper (Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford)
boost apprenticeships to give young people better life       (Lab): The Secretary of State will know that many
chances?                                                     young people get fantastic help from the voluntary
                                                             sector through, for example, the future jobs fund, the
                                                             youth guarantee, the working neighbourhoods fund,
   Mr Duncan Smith: Yes, I can. As my hon. Friend            and also through small contracts with the jobcentres to
knows, we made provision in the Budget for more than         help people into work. As he is cutting those programmes
50,000 new apprenticeships. It is also worth remembering     by more than £1 billion, does he think that the funding
that one thing that the last Government set in train, and    from his Department for the voluntary sector to help
would have introduced had they been returned, was a          young people and others into work will increase or
hike in national insurance, which would have damaged         decrease in the next 12 months?
any prospect of young people in her constituency being
in long-term viable jobs. There is a good story to tell,        Mr Duncan Smith: I would say to the Secretary of
which could not have happened if we had not taken            State—[HON. MEMBERS: “Oh!”] I mean the shadow
over and found savings within the budget in our first        Secretary of State; I nearly made a mistake there. I
year.                                                        would say to the right hon. Lady that we will provide
                                                             sufficient funds as necessary for the voluntary sector.
   Mr Bain: Given the gap that there will be between the     She should know from all our previous work that the
prevention of the rolling out of the future jobs fund and    voluntary sector is a vital part of finding people work
the introduction of the Work programme next year, and        and putting them in closer touch with their local
as apprenticeships are a devolved matter, what practical     communities. She goes on about the future jobs fund,
help will the Secretary of State be able to provide for my   and she must understand that we are continuing with
constituents, particularly the 1,300 young people who        the programmes that have already been let, but getting
are out of work in Glasgow North East at the moment?         rid of those that have not yet been let. She knows that
Do the Government not need to do more to prevent an          those programmes are incredibly expensive—far more
autumn, winter and spring of discontent for young            expensive than the guarantee. We simply cannot afford
people in Glasgow?                                           them, because of the mess that the previous Government
7                     Oral Answers                    19 JULY 2010                  Oral Answers                       8

left, so she must understand that we will get people             The Minister of State, Department for Work and
back into work through ensuring that the economy is           Pensions (Chris Grayling): The future jobs fund is directed
back on track, providing apprenticeships, which offer         at young working-age people. It continues to provide
real opportunity for young people, and ensuring that          work placements, and all existing contractual commitments
the national insurance hike that she was about to make        are being honoured. Next year we will introduce our
will not happen.                                              Work programme. This will offer integrated employment
                                                              support to young people, regardless of the benefit that
   Yvette Cooper: The right hon. Gentleman will know          they claim. The programme will help them move into
that the consequence of his party’s Budget is to cut, not     sustained employment rather than temporary jobs. The
increase, the number of jobs in the economy. He will          Government believe that that will have positive impact
also know that he is cutting 90,000 planned and funded        on child poverty, and indeed all kinds of poverty, in
jobs from the future jobs fund. He did not answer the         future. However, the recent changes made by the Chancellor
question about whether he would increase or cut the           in the Budget will have no overall measurable impact on
support for the voluntary sector to help get people into      child poverty in the next two years.
work. As he well knows, the Minister in the Lords has
told voluntary sector providers that they are too small          Jim McGovern: I hope that the Minister will agree
to get contracts under the Work programme. The                that a decent living wage is the best way, and the most
Government have quadrupled the size of the contracts,         efficient means, of combating poverty. The previous
and are locking out the voluntary sector for up to seven      Government certainly knew and understood that, and
years. Is not the truth that all the right hon. Gentleman’s   supported and helped many people back into work, not
talk about the big society is simply a big con, to hide       only to their benefit but to the benefit of their families
cuts in jobs, in help for the unemployed and in support       and communities. Will the Minister consider the
to get people back to work?                                   implications of unemployment for poverty? Will the
                                                              Government reconsider their proposal to scrap the future
   Mr Duncan Smith: It is ridiculous for the right hon.       jobs fund?
Lady to stand there, two and a half months after
leaving government with the finances in a total shambles,        Chris Grayling: What the hon. Gentleman does not
and try to lecture us about youth unemployment.               understand is that the future jobs fund does not guarantee
[Interruption.] I remind her that in the whole time for       a sustainable future job. I agree with him about getting
which Labour Members were in government, there were           people off welfare and into work. Nobody will rise out
only three years in which they reduced unemployment           of poverty by remaining on welfare. We want to change
for 16 to 17-year-olds. Youth unemployment rose               things and to get people back into work, but we want to
throughout 10 years, and the Labour Government left it        get people into sustainable work. That is why we announced
worse than they found it. No lectures from the right          50,000 additional apprenticeships, and why the Work
hon. Lady, please; only apologies will do.                    programme will be geared to getting people into long-term
                                                              sustainable employment. We will do people no favours
   Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): Will the             by creating artificial short-term schemes that cost a lot
Secretary of State take no lectures from the Opposition       of money which, thanks to the previous Government,
on unemployment? In Wellingborough unemployment               we can no longer afford.
doubled under the Labour Government.
   What would my right hon. Friend have said if he had           Mr James Clappison (Hertsmere) (Con): Is my right
been in my office on Friday, when a constituent came in       hon. Friend aware that child poverty can also be tackled
and said, “My granddaughter works very hard. She’s a          by helping people on low incomes to get into work or, if
single mum and she’s just getting by, but she doesn’t         they are in work, to earn more? There was talk of a
have a council house. The other granddaughter has             living wage under the previous Government. I am no
given up her job and is on benefits. She has a house and      professor of maths, but is he aware that analysis of
is better off ”? Which granddaughter is doing the right       materials published by his Department shows that a
thing?                                                        single mother with two children under 11 who earns
                                                              £250 a week suffers an effective tax rate of 90% as a
   Mr Duncan Smith: Those who take the risk and try to        result of benefit withdrawal and tax changes? Is not
work and take jobs are the people whom we want to             that a broken, complicated and perverse system?
support in society. The trouble is that endlessly under
the previous Government, the levels of support for               Chris Grayling: My hon. Friend is absolutely right.
those who did not take a risk or a chance were too high       We inherited from the previous Government a system in
for them ever to take those risks. The answer is very         which there are tangible disincentives to move back into
simply this: we will value those who try, and make sure       work. When people do the right thing and move back
that things such as housing benefit and unemployment          into work, they often face penal rates at which they lose
benefit are set at rates that do not discourage people        the money they are earning, either through loss of
from taking work.                                             benefits or through increased taxation. That must change
                                                              if we are to create a genuine incentive for people to do
                      Child Poverty                           the right thing and return to the workplace.

   7. Jim McGovern (Dundee West) (Lab): What                    Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab): The
assessment his Department has made of the effect on           Government have already cut the future jobs fund, child
levels of child poverty of ending the future jobs fund;       tax credits and housing benefit, which will increase
and if he will make a statement.                  [8932]      child poverty in two or three years’ time. Will the
9                     Oral Answers                    19 JULY 2010                    Oral Answers                         10

Minister tell us whether, in addition to that, his right      We have announced plans to implement the Work
hon. Friend the Secretary of State has proposed means-        programme, which will provide personalised help to those
testing child benefit?                                        and other customers to return to work, and we will also
                                                              ensure that there is a specialist package of provision to
   Chris Grayling: I have no intention of taking any          help the most severely disabled people.
lessons from the previous Government on child poverty—
[HON. MEMBERS: “Answer the question.”] The Labour                Nadhim Zahawi: In my constituency, people are rightly
party promised to halve child poverty by 2010, but            worried about relatives with severe mental health disability
missed that target by 1 million children. Its failure on      attending the work capability assessment. Can my hon.
child poverty was lamentable. By contrast, this Government    Friend tell us what safeguards will be put in place for
will take steps over the next few years to reduce child       those people?
poverty and to ensure that we do the right thing by the
people in this country who are at the bottom end of the         Maria Miller: The work capability assessment was, of
income scale.                                                 course, developed in consultation with medical experts
                                                              and disability specialist groups. There will be an annual
                    Future Jobs Fund
                                                              review to ensure that any problems with the assessment
                                                              are dealt with, and there has already been a Department-led
  8. Cathy Jamieson (Kilmarnock and Loudoun) (Lab/            review dealing with some of the issues that my hon.
Co-op): What estimate he has made of the number               Friend raises in connection with people with mental
of jobs in Kilmarnock and Loudoun constituency                health problems. Modifications will be made, especially
supported by the future jobs fund.            [8933]          by expanding the support group to cover people with
                                                              severe disability issues, to ensure that they are not
  The Minister of State, Department for Work and              inappropriately put into groups of activity.
Pensions (Chris Grayling): We do not collect data on a
constituency-only basis, so I cannot help the hon. Lady          Damian Hinds: My hon. Friend will be aware of the
with a detailed response to her question.                     outstanding work done by Treloar college in my
                                                              constituency in assisting students with very severe disabilities
  Cathy Jamieson: As the Minister seems to have no            into work through their world of work and job coaching
idea about the number of young people on future jobs          programmes. What can the Government do to encourage
fund projects at the moment, perhaps he will consider         more firms to partner the college in such programmes?
coming to my constituency and speaking face to face to
those young people who feel that those jobs have been
downgraded by this Government’s attitude to them as              Maria Miller: I join my hon. Friend in paying tribute
unsustainable. Will he ensure that each one of those          to the staff who work at Treloar college and to the many
young people is in a sustainable job within the next          volunteers throughout Hampshire—including in my
24 months?                                                    constituency—who fundraise to help to support the
                                                              excellent work that they do. It is an important independent
   Chris Grayling: I just do not think that Labour Members    specialist provider which supports people with some of
understand. If someone is given a six-month job under         the most complex and profound disabilities. Other providers
the tag of the future jobs fund, the word “future” does       can learn from Treloar’s how to work in partnership
not apply. It is things like apprenticeships that are         with local employers to provide youngsters with severe
genuinely about the future and about creating sustainable     disabilities with skills that make them employable so
employment. That is why this Government announced             that they can get into work.
50,000 extra apprenticeships. That is why the work
programme will focus on long-term opportunities. The             Jim Sheridan (Paisley and Renfrewshire North) (Lab):
tragedy of the future jobs fund is that it is precisely not   Despite the best efforts of the last Government, there is
a future jobs fund: it is a six-month work placement, at      still anecdotal evidence that people with disabilities are
substantial cost to the taxpayer, at the end of which—in      being discriminated against in the workplace. Can the
almost all cases—there is no job. That is a tragedy, but      Minister assure the House that every step will be taken
the fund was all about the engineering of figures under       to ensure that employers responsible for discriminating
the previous Government—unlike the long-term strategy         against people with disabilities will face the severest of
under this Government.                                        penalties?

                Disabled People (Work)                           Maria Miller: There is some important legislation
                                                              in place that will help employers to understand their
   9. Nadhim Zahawi (Stratford-on-Avon) (Con): What           responsibilities. The hon. Gentleman is right to highlight
steps he is taking to assist disabled people to work.         the fact that we are only at the beginning of a process of
                                                     [8934]   implementing that legislation. It is about changing cultural
                                                              norms in the workplace to ensure that reasonable changes
   12. Damian Hinds (East Hampshire) (Con): What              are made to help more disabled people to do the work
steps he is taking to assist disabled people to work.         that they want to do.
                                                                Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab): In the coalition
  The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work         agreement, the Government pledged to reform the access
and Pensions (Maria Miller): Nearly half of all disabled      to work programme. Will the Minister tell us what the
people are already in employment. However, many more          timetable for that reform will be, and can she give us an
could work with the right support, and want to do so.         assurance that the programme will continue to be funded
11                    Oral Answers                    19 JULY 2010                  Oral Answers                       12

at the same level in real terms as the current access            The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Mr Iain
to work programme? Or is reform just another byword           Duncan Smith): All education leavers claiming jobseeker’s
for cuts?                                                     allowance receive help and support from a personal
                                                              adviser, access to jobs and a range of employment and
   Maria Miller: I am sure that the hon. Lady will be         training opportunities. These include help with job search
pleased to know that I have already had meetings with         skills, which is very targeted and very personalised.
officials and with employers who are participating in         Help is also available from partner organisations such
access to work, so as to understand how we can make it        as Connexions.
work better for more disabled people. The real challenge
is to ensure that the money available supports more              Mr Burrowes: Given the previous Government’s legacy
disabled people in an effective way, so that we actually      of youth unemployment, is my right hon. Friend aware
get people into work rather than leaving them languishing     of the additional problem of education leavers with
on benefits.                                                  criminal records seeking employment through the route
                                                              of rehabilitation? What is his Department doing to give
                     Retirement Age                           young offenders a second chance to get on the employment
  10. Miss Anne McIntosh (Thirsk and Malton) (Con):              Mr Duncan Smith: I think my hon. Friend will find
What public consultation will be held on proposed             that the unified Work programme will be one of the
changes to the retirement age for state pensions; and if      better ways of tackling that issue, because it will be very
he will make a statement.                          [8935]     narrowly focused. If we get it absolutely right, it will be
                                                              narrowly focused on the needs and problems of those
  The Minister of State, Department for Work and              individuals. The previous set of programmes was too
Pensions (Steve Webb): On 24 June we published a call         disparate; now we can focus, and we should be able to
for evidence for plans to increase the state pension age      help. Another issue worth raising, although it does not
to 66 on a more rapid time scale. The closing date for        come under the remit of our Department, is what
that consultation is 6 August.                                remains on people’s records, and I hope that in due
                                                              course we will be able to look carefully at that. People
   Miss McIntosh: There is a general understanding of         trying for that second chance sometimes find that employers
the need for such a change, but those who will be             say no to them simply because they have been inside,
affected by what will be an arbitrary date desperately        and a compassionate society should try to do something
need the knowledge to enable them to plan their finances,     about that.
to give them certainty and security in their retirement.
                                                                 Mr David Hanson (Delyn) (Lab): Does the Secretary
  Steve Webb: My hon. Friend makes an important               of State recognise the figure of 120,000 young people
point, and we are seeking to move as quickly as possible      who will be added to the dole queue because of cuts in
to reach a conclusion on the change to the age of 66, to      Government programmes such as the future jobs fund
give people the maximum notice so that they can make          and the long-term guarantee for jobs, as well as the cuts
appropriate plans.                                            to university places taking place in a different Department?
                                                              Does he believe that Jobcentre Plus will be able to cope
   MalcolmWicks(CroydonNorth)(Lab):Notwithstanding            with that increased Government-led demand?
the need to increase the age at which people draw the
state pension, will the Minister and his Department              Mr Duncan Smith: I do not recognise that. The right
look into the social class dimension? According to the        hon. Gentleman was in a Government who completely
latest statistics, 19% of men from the poorest social         failed to deal with youth unemployment. They ended
backgrounds do not survive to get their pension. Those        up leaving office with higher youth unemployment than
from poorer backgrounds, who often do heavy manual            they inherited. That is not something that we want to
work throughout their lives, die much earlier in their        crow about, but it is the reality. We need to do better
pension careers than those from better-off backgrounds.       than that, but we also face the challenge of reducing the
Will he look into the social class dimension?                 deficit that his party’s Government left us. I recognise
                                                              his interest and his compassion, but unless we put the
                                                              economy right, we will not be able to exercise either.
   Steve Webb: The right hon. Gentleman is very
knowledgeable about pensions and social issues, and he
has highlighted an important matter. We specifically            Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark)
referred to this in the call for evidence for the change to   (LD): Will my right hon. Friend look this summer
66. The good news is that life expectancy is increasing       particularly at the 16-year-olds who are leaving school,
across all social groups, but the factor that he mentioned    to make sure that the jobcentre works not just with
is an important one, and we will consider it when we          Connexions but with the relevant parts of the youth
examine state pension ages.                                   service to provide a much more integrated and much
                                                              better informed set of opinions and advice than have
                                                              been offered to young people in the past? There is an
                   Education Leavers                          urgent need for 16-year-olds to have good advice between
                                                              jobs and apprenticeships and further education.
  11. Mr David Burrowes (Enfield, Southgate) (Con):
What steps Jobcentre Plus plans to take to assist               Mr Duncan Smith: I absolutely guarantee to do that,
education leavers into employment and training in             and I will talk to my right hon. Friend the Minister of
2010.                                         [8936]          State about it. It is worth bearing in mind what a real
13                      Oral Answers                       19 JULY 2010                   Oral Answers                      14

challenge this is for us. I have to repeat that, over the           sure that there is a voice on that from groups that have
past 14 years, that group particularly was most failed by           deep and detailed knowledge of the area. For example,
the previous Government. Before they carry on giving                we have the head of Mind acting as an adviser to the
us lectures about it, they should recognise that failure            review. That is how we will get it right; we will do all we
and probably apologise for it.                                      can to do so.

   Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab): Given that the
Secretary of State says that the Labour Government                                     Carer’s Allowance
failed young people and that his policies are going to be
so much better, if youth unemployment goes up, will he
resign?                                                               14. Anas Sarwar (Glasgow Central) (Lab): What
                                                                    plans he has for the future of the carer’s allowance
  Mr Duncan Smith: Unless we can get retrospective                  scheme.                                         [8939]
resignations from the whole pack of the last Cabinet, I
do not think that I should answer that.                               The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work
                                                                    and Pensions (Maria Miller): The Government recognise
                      Work Programme                                that the UK’s 6 million carers play an indispensable role
                                                                    in looking after family, friends and members of the
  13. Julian Smith (Skipton and Ripon) (Con): What                  community who need support. We have set out our
recent representations he has received on his                       commitment to simplify the benefit system in order to
Department’s proposed new Work programme. [8938]                    improve work incentives and to encourage responsibility
                                                                    and fairness. We will consider carefully the needs of
   The Minister of State, Department for Work and                   carers as we develop our thinking on welfare reform.
Pensions (Chris Grayling): We have had a large number
of representations from organisations interested in and                Anas Sarwar: I thank the Minister for that answer. As
interested to participate in the Work programme. My                 you will be aware, Mr Speaker, carers are the unsung
colleagues and I have also had a series of meetings with            heroes in our communities, many of whom work seven
interested parties among the provider community and                 days a week, 24 hours a day in return for a miserly
the financial community.                                            allowance of £53.90. Fairness has been mentioned, but
                                                                    as a result of the VAT increase in the Chancellor’s
  Julian Smith: Will my right hon. Friend pay tribute to            Budget, that allowance is now worth even less. What
the Skipton and Ripon enterprise initiative led by Alan             will the Minister and her Department do to correct that
Halsall, chairman of Silver Cross Prams in my constituency,         unfairness?
which has built a network of established business owners
who are voluntarily giving their time to provide advice                 Maria Miller: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his
to anyone who wants to set up a business?                           question concerning an issue about which I know he
                                                                    cares and puts a lot of thought into. The carers whom
  Chris Grayling: I will indeed pay tribute to my hon.              I have met since taking up my position feel strongly that
Friend’s constituent. As well as Government action to               it is not only the financial benefits and supports that are
address the problems, we should capture the valuable                important, as they also want the ability to get into
experience of communities and individuals in building               work. At the moment, one in five carers are forced to
businesses, and use it positively to help those who are             quit work rather than to carry on as they would like. We
out of work. We particularly want more individuals to               will thus focus on making sure that these people get
move off benefits into self-employment. I have no doubt             access to flexible working, personalised budgets and
that my hon. Friend’s constituent and—I hope—others                 direct payments and, in the long term, we will have a
around the country will be able to make a big difference            commission for long-term care. That is how we can
to these people as they seek to build their businesses in           ensure that the support for carers is in place. There were
the years ahead.                                                    measures in the Budget that will help to make sure that
                                                                    financial support is there for carers, particularly in the
  Ann Clwyd (Cynon Valley) (Lab): Has the right hon.                area of housing.
Gentleman had representations from the academic behind
the new benefit system, who said that
                                                                      Tracey Crouch (Chatham and Aylesford) (Con): There
“ministers should postpone plans to move 2.5 million incapacity
benefit claimants on to the new employment and support allowance…   are 21,000 carers in Medway. They do an invaluable job
until serious errors have been rectified… To go ahead with these    which is often unrecognised, but the benefits system
problems is not just ridiculous. It is, in fact, scary”?            remains incredibly complex, and many are unaware of
That was said by Paul Gregg, Professor of Economics                 their entitlements. What plans has the Minister to simplify
at the university of Bristol.                                       the system to make it more accessible to them?

   Chris Grayling: If one looks at what the last Government           Maria Miller: My hon. Friend has hit the nail on the
first set up with the work capability assessment, I have            head. Carers find it incredibly difficult to navigate the
some sympathy with that view, and I have changed                    benefits system. We will do all that we can to remove
some of these things. The last Government actually                  any disincentives preventing people from going out to
expected people on chemotherapy to be judged fit for                work. The one thing that we will not do is implement
work. We moved quickly to change that, and we have                  the policy of clawing back 1.5% of carer’s allowance, as
also set up a review of the work capability assessment,             the last Government did. That is the last announcement
which will report by the end of the year. I have made               that carers would want to hear at this time.
15                       Oral Answers                 19 JULY 2010                   Oral Answers                       16

                 Work Capability Assessment                     The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Mr Iain
                                                              Duncan Smith): The hon. Gentleman’s experience and
  16. Hywel Williams (Arfon) (PC): What recent                knowledge of these issues is unrivalled in the Chamber,
representations he has received from Citizens Advice on       and he has sought to present them on a non-party-political
the employment and support allowance work capability          basis so that we can continue to discuss them. I have
assessment; and if he will make a statement.      [8941]      had a number of discussions with my right hon. Friend
                                                              the Chancellor of the Exchequer, and, as the hon.
  The Minister of State, Department for Work and              Gentleman knows, I continue to discuss the issues with
Pensions (Chris Grayling): I have read carefully the report   him. I hope that we shall be able to make progress,
on the issue by Citizens Advice. I have had meetings          preferably on a non-party-political basis.
with its national leadership, and have also visited local
volunteers to discuss the issues with them.                      Mr Allen: The Secretary of State will know that early
                                                              intervention to help babies, children and young people
  Hywel Williams: The evidence from Citizens Advice
                                                              to develop socially and emotionally so that they can
on Labour’s work capability assessment is clear and
                                                              make the best of themselves is one of the processes that
damning. It states that
                                                              depend heavily on the bolting together of small bits of
“people are being inappropriately subjected”
                                                              funding, which are likely to suffer most in the current
to the assessment, that it                                    economic climate. Will he talk seriously to the Chancellor
“is not an effective measure of fitness for work”,            of the Exchequer about exploring other means of raising
and that it is                                                sustainable funds so that early intervention can continue
“producing inappropriate outcomes.”                           for a generation, which will be necessary if we are to
The perception among my constituents, however, is that        ensure that our young people get the best out of life?
the Government are responding by making the test even
stiffer. Can the Minister assure me that he is taking that       Mr Duncan Smith: As the hon. Gentleman knows,
evidence seriously?                                           the issue of early intervention is specifically lodged with
                                                              another Department, but I take an interest in it, and
   Chris Grayling: Absolutely. I was profoundly concerned     guarantee that I will continue to do so. I can say
to discover some of the things that the last Government       without fear or favour that I think it has the greatest
had done. That is why we are taking steps to address          potential to change many of the lives that we talk
some of the problems, such as the fact that people            about—lives of worklessness and poverty, including
undergoing chemotherapy have been expected to go to           child poverty. It is arguably one of the most significant
work, which is one of the examples of actions that were       issues in the medium to long term, and I will do my level
completely wrong. We have also commissioned a review          best to ensure that it is pursued.
by a leading professor, backed up by senior figures with
relevant experience of matters such as mental health.                                   Poverty
We will seek to ensure that the work capability assessment,
while being right, fair and proper in the system as a           18. John Glen (Salisbury) (Con): What steps he is
whole, is judged as effectively as possible so that it does   taking together with ministerial colleagues to tackle
not treat unfairly people in genuine need.                    poverty.                                        [8943]

  Duncan Hames (Chippenham) (LD): I welcome the
                                                                 The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work
Minister’s review of the work capability assessment,
                                                              and Pensions (Maria Miller): The Government are
which is long overdue. Two thirds of sufferers from
                                                              committed to creating a stronger society based on the
Parkinson’s disease have been deemed fit for work. Such
                                                              principles of freedom, fairness and responsibility. The
people suffer from a long-term, complex, debilitating
                                                              Cabinet Committee on Social Justice will be the forum
but also fluctuating condition. What assurances can the
                                                              in which Ministers look at how to tackle issues around
Minister give that his review will ensure that future
                                                              poverty. The Committee will ensure that, for the first
assessments are not so crude to brand them benefit
                                                              time, Departments must thoroughly examine the overall
                                                              impact of their policies, so that we can avoid unintended
  Chris Grayling: I assure the hon. Gentleman that            consequences and the poorest being hit hardest.
there is no way on earth that we would seek to brand
people in that position benefit cheats. Our job is to find      John Glen: I thank the Minister for her reply. Last
the right dividing line. When it is practical to do so, we    Friday, I visited the Trussell Trust food bank in my
should help people with disabilities into work. There is      constituency, and it became clear in conversation with
general agreement among all the groups who work with          Chris Mould, the director, that one of the principal
them that that is the positive and the right thing to do.     reasons why the charity had to make £41,000 in grants
However, we must also ensure that people who are              of food aid in emergency circumstances last year was
genuinely not capable of working receive unconditional        that benefits had been delayed. What steps can the
support, and all the care that we can possibly provide.       Minister take to assure my constituents, and those of
That is where we will seek to draw the line.                  other Members, that such delays are minimised so that
                                                              acute poverty—where people need food—will not occur
                      Early Intervention                      again during the next five years?

   17. Mr Graham Allen (Nottingham North) (Lab):                Maria Miller: Delays in getting benefits to recipients
What recent discussions he has had with the Chancellor        are obviously critical, particularly for those whose families
of the Exchequer on the development of early intervention     face the toughest circumstances. I will look into the
policies.                                           [8942]    specific points that my hon. Friend has raised, but I
17                    Oral Answers                    19 JULY 2010                  Oral Answers                       18

remind him that we are in this position, with 2.8 million     large number of them heard absolutely nothing from
children living in poverty, because the previous Government   the state; they were simply left to rot on benefits. I think
left us with a very difficult legacy, and some of these       that is wrong. Many of those people could benefit
issues will take some time to address.                        enormously if we helped them back into the workplace.
                                                              That will be a central goal of the Work programme.
                    Topical Questions                         My one regret is that the Labour party did not do that
                                                              years ago.
 T1. [8951] Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab): If he will
make a statement on his departmental responsibilities.           Yvette Cooper (Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford)
                                                              (Lab): May I ask the Secretary of State particularly
   The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Mr Iain      about the overall impact of the welfare changes announced
Duncan Smith): As a society, we are living longer and         in the Budget and since then, because he will know that,
healthier lives, and we need to make sure that the state      for instance, the value of carer’s allowance is being cut
pension system is sustainable and affordable in the           by about £135 a year over the next few years, which
longer term. As such, I hope that the House will take         particularly hits women, and that the value of attendance
note of the review that we are undertaking into increasing    allowance is being cut by about £185 a year over the
the state retirement age to 66, and I would like to take      next few years, again particularly hitting women? Has
this opportunity to ask Members to add their contributions    his Department done any assessment of the overall
to the call for evidence as and when they can, because        impact of the £11 billion of welfare cuts on women—yes
this is an important debate.                                  or no?

   Chris Bryant: May I ask the Secretary of State about         Mr Duncan Smith: We are assessing all the impacts of
the issue of teenage pregnancy, which, as he knows,           every change we are making. As the right hon. Lady
affects many constituencies around the land? We have a        knows, we will be publishing those relating to housing
very high rate compared with other countries across the       benefit, and as and when we have the full details, I will
world and, unfortunately, research done by the Joseph         quite happily let her know.
Rowntree Foundation suggests that many young women
effectively choose teenage pregnancy and having a baby           T4. [8954] Nadhim Zahawi (Stratford-on-Avon) (Con):
as an alternative career. What is the Secretary of State’s    In my constituency, a large number of people—much
Department going to do, in association with other             larger than the national average—are pensioners, and
Ministers, to make sure that girls have a proper sense of     in my region an amazing 22% of pensioners are in
self-worth, and that when they do have a baby they have       effective poverty. What will my hon. Friend be doing
a chance of getting into work?                                for the most vulnerable pensioners?

   Mr Duncan Smith: The hon. Gentleman has, not for              The Minister of State, Department for Work and
the first time, raised a very important issue. There is no    Pensions (Steve Webb): We need to ensure that, as well
magic wand to solve this, and crucially, as he knows          as lifting the level of the basic state pension, the most
from when he was in government, these are not stand-alone     vulnerable pensioners, who receive the pension credit,
issues. Sometimes it is very easy simply to stigmatise a      get the full benefit of the increase that we will be
group of young women and say, “It’s all your fault,”          introducing next April. However, in the longer term we
when in fact they may well themselves come from               do not want to allow people to retire poor and then try
broken families where they have only witnessed their          to catch them through a means test; we want to ensure
own mothers going through the same circumstances              that more people have, for example, workplace pensions,
and where men have not been involved. There is a much         so that fewer people retire poor in the first place. That is
wider set of circumstances, therefore. Of course, making      a better strategy for the long term.
work pay for such women is important, as is recognising
that, as the hon. Member for Nottingham North (Mr Allen)         T3. [8953] Tom Greatrex (Rutherglen and Hamilton
mentioned, we need to intervene very early. Most of all       West) (Lab/Co-op): Given the brief opportunity afforded
we need to make sure that people are ready, trained and       by Lord Young for others to input into his review of
able to take up work and that that work pays. That will       health and safety legislation, what comfort can the
help enormously in giving them an idea that there is a        Minister give my constituents that its motivation is a
life beyond just having a child on their own and that         serious effort to ensure that the right protection is in
sometimes they need support.                                  place to prevent disasters such as the one that occurred
                                                              in the constituency of my hon. Friend the Member for
   T2.    [8952] Mark Lancaster (Milton Keynes North)         Glasgow North (Ann McKechin), at Stockline, rather
(Con): Last week I met a constituent who had been on          than another excuse to trot out the usual litany of myth
incapacity benefit for many years. Apart from the             and distortion for the gratification of the Daily Mail?
initial medical examination, he had not received an
examination in nine years. Does the Secretary of State          Chris Grayling: The hon. Gentleman has to understand
share my concern about a system that seems to let             that any Administration must find a balance. If we
people down so badly?                                         regulate too much, there will be fewer jobs; at the same
                                                              time, if we do not regulate enough, employees will be
   The Minister of State, Department for Work and             exposed to danger. We have to find the right balance
Pensions (Chris Grayling): My hon. Friend is absolutely       between those two, and I do not believe that over the
right. There are 2.2 million people on incapacity benefit     past 13 years the previous Government did that. They
and an additional 400,000 on employment and support           over-regulated, drove companies overseas and cost jobs.
allowance, and under the previous Government a very           We will endeavour to ensure that we restore a degree of
19                    Oral Answers                    19 JULY 2010                   Oral Answers                       20

common sense, not simply to health and safety regulation      Many are milking the system while neither taking steps
but to the regulatory burden imposed on business right        to control antisocial behaviour by their tenants, nor
across government.                                            undertaking appropriate repairs to stop the house—and,
                                                              indeed, the whole area—falling into decay.
   T5.    [8955] David T. C. Davies (Monmouth) (Con):
People applying for jobs in areas that require Criminal          Mr Duncan Smith: I agree, in part, with the hon.
Records Bureau checks often have to wait weeks or             Gentleman, who raises an important issue, because
months for those checks to come through, and during           housing benefit has been in need of a review. I know for
that time they are ineligible to claim jobseeker’s            a fact that the previous Government were reviewing it,
allowance. Will the Minister look sympathetically at          so we are trying to complete that process. He is right to
these rules, which have the unintended consequence of         say that one of the biggest problems about housing
sometimes discriminating against British nationals?           benefit, and local housing allowance in particular, is
                                                              that because it has been almost open-ended, landlords
   Chris Grayling: My hon. Friend makes a very important      have pushed and pushed on rent levels which have then
point. There are a number of areas we have inherited          pulled up the amount of money that has flowed out; the
from the previous Government in which there is an             increase has been £5 billion over five years. I will be
almighty mess to sweep up. I give him my commitment           discussing with the Department for Communities and
that I will look at the issue he has raised and discuss it    Local Government whether there is a way in which we
with colleagues at the Home Office to see whether we          can rectify that, but he is right to raise it. I am glad that
can find a better way of streamlining the system, so that     someone on the Labour Benches has made a positive
problems such as the one he has outlined do not occur.        statement about the need to sort it out.

  Mary Creagh (Wakefield) (Lab): The Minister said               T7. [8957] Malcolm Bruce (Gordon) (LD): Further to
that the disability living allowance budget will be cut by    the previous answer on disability living allowance, can
more than £1 billion by 2014. Can she tell the House          the Minister say when these definitive objective tests
which groups of disabled people are likely to see their       will be produced? Does she accept that the budget has
benefits cut?                                                 trebled because the allowance is so unclear? Does she
                                                              also accept that objective criteria mean that some
   The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work        people who do not receive the allowance will qualify in
and Pensions (Maria Miller): In the Budget the Chancellor     future and that many who currently get it will lose out,
made it clear that we need to look at the disability living   so the sooner we have the clear criteria, the better for
allowance and put in place an objective assessment to         all concerned?
ensure that money is going to the people who need it
                                                                Maria Miller: I reassure the right hon. Gentleman
most. We will undertake a review, working closely with
                                                              that we will be working quickly on this and we will be
disability lobbies, to ensure that we focus on people who
                                                              involving specialist disability lobbies. As he is no doubt
need that help the most.
                                                              aware, these are complex matters and we need to ensure
                                                              that, whatever actions we take to unravel the problems
  T6. [8956] Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con): Does the           that we have been left with, our solutions have long-term
Minister agree that more must be done to help the             and sustainable merit.
unemployed over-50s, who are not necessarily on benefits?
A constituent of mine, Mr Kevin Forbes, who was                 Nick Smith (Blaenau Gwent) (Lab): My question is
made redundant, has applied for more than 4,700 jobs          on pensioner poverty. Parts of my constituency are
without any luck. What comfort can the Minister give          more than 1,200 feet above sea level and in the winter
him and many others that we will radically improve            they can be very cold, so will the Minister guarantee not
back-to-work schemes for the over-50s?                        to cut the cold weather payments in the coming five
   Steve Webb: My hon. Friend raises an important
point, not least about ageist attitudes, particularly among     Steve Webb: As the hon. Gentleman knows, the
employers. One of the worst examples is that it is            underlying level of cold weather payments has been
currently legal to sack somebody for being over 65. We        £8.50, which was increased to £25 for the past two
think that that is outrageous. The previous Government        winters. We are considering the rate for the coming
talked about it, but we are going to change the law, and      winter, but we take representations each year on cold
that will be part of a cultural change. We need to see        weather stations to make sure that they match the exact
longer working lives. Many people want to go on making        geography of local areas, for the sort of reasons that he
a contribution, and, like my hon. Friend’s constituent,       gives.
they are thwarted in their attempts to do so. We need to
change that culture and to change attitudes.                     T8.   [8958] Mr David Burrowes (Enfield, Southgate)
                                                              (Con): Will my hon. Friend inform the House of the
  Mr Speaker: It is always a pleasure to listen to the        estimate of the number of benefit claimants who are
Minister. May I just ask him to face the House? It is a       addicted to alcohol and/or drugs? Will she outline the
very natural temptation to look backwards, but facing         opportunities that will arise under the Work programme
the House helps us all.                                       to reduce dependency, which can often be both on
                                                              drugs and alcohol, and benefits?
  Mr Ian Davidson (Glasgow South West) (Lab/Co-op):
I welcome the review of housing benefit, but does the           Maria Miller: I thank my hon. Friend for his question,
Minister accept that it perhaps does not go far enough,       and I know the amount of work that he has done in this
inasmuch as it does not examine the role of landlords?        area. Helping people who are trapped on benefits through
21                    Oral Answers                    19 JULY 2010                   Oral Answers                       22

drug and alcohol addiction is, as he knows, a top                Mr Duncan Smith: We are fully aware that there might
priority for the Government. It is estimated that in          be peculiar circumstances in London and we have already
England there are 270,000 problem drug users on working-      trebled the discretionary allowance. We are still considering
age benefits; information is not currently available on       all these matters and making allowances, so I guarantee
the number with alcohol dependency, but I am sure that        that we will continue to watch this matter. My hon.
if it were, the figures would be pushed up even further.      Friend is right that this has been a real issue—working
The new Work programme will recognise the cost of             people on low incomes have had to pay the bill for local
helping someone with multiple barriers and will allow         housing allowance without being able to live in the sort
the flexibility to tailor the support that people need.       of houses that those who are on local housing allowance
                                                              and who are unemployed can live in. There is a real
  Margaret Curran (Glasgow East) (Lab): Given the             disparity and unfairness and we need to sort that out.
Secretary of State’s commitment to my constituency,
which includes Greater Easterhouse, and to children              Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): Does anyone
there, may I ask him directly to take the opportunity         on the Government Front Bench believe that we can
today to rule out the means-testing of child benefit?         effectively tackle poverty without also reducing inequality
                                                              in wealth and income? Any one of them is welcome
  Mr Duncan Smith: I am enormously fond of the hon.           to reply.
Lady’s constituency, but as she knows that is not an             Mr Duncan Smith: Yes, the right hon. Gentleman
area for my Department; it comes under the Treasury           is right that we must do both. Under the previous
brief. I can give her a guarantee that I have had no          Government—theGovernmentof whomhewasamember—
discussions with the Treasury about that matter.              inequality was at its worst since 1961. Clearly, they did
                                                              not think that we must do both, but we do.
  T9. [8959] Julian Smith (Skipton and Ripon) (Con): At
my surgery on Saturday, Liz Harlow, a benefits adviser,          Martin Horwood (Cheltenham) (LD): My constituent,
told me that it is taking weeks to process applications       Jackie Sallis, acquired her lifelong disability at birth,
for crisis loans. Given that they are described as loans      has tried but invariably failed to hold down a job and
that can provide help in “an emergency or disaster”,          has been in receipt of disability living allowance. As
can Ministers reassure me that they will be processed         regards the review that the Minister has already mentioned,
more quickly in future?                                       will she reassure us that adults with lifelong conditions
                                                              will not be subject to a regime of constant medical
   Steve Webb: My hon. Friend raises a vital issue. We        assessments that try to prove them fit for work, which
need to ensure that crisis loans are administered far         will be stressful for them, ultimately pointless and,
more efficiently than they are at present. I am aware         presumably, very expensive for the public purse?
that there are delays. I am happy to look not only into
                                                                 Maria Miller: My hon. Friend raises an important
the individual case that he raises, but more systematically
                                                              point. As we pull together the procedures for the revisions
at whether the social fund is delivering—I do not think
                                                              to disability living allowance, we will consider just those
that it is.
                                                              sorts of things. We want to ensure that it is proportionate
                                                              and that regular reviews are considered, so that the
  Joan Walley (Stoke-on-Trent North) (Lab): Given
                                                              allowance can be given to those with the most need
the vital role that Jobcentre Plus staff play in getting
                                                              without putting too much pressure on those who will
people back to work and given that about 13,500 of
                                                              never move away from DLA.
them are on fixed-term contracts, some of which are
due to end in November, can the Minister give the               Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab): The Minister
House an assurance that talks are taking place to extend      will know that the Welsh Assembly Government have
or make permanent job contracts?                              some of the most progressive policies on poverty alleviation.
                                                              Will she—or any of the Front-Bench team—tell us
   Chris Grayling: The previous Government recruited          what discussions they have had with Welsh Assembly
staff on a short-term basis—on short-term contracts—          Ministers and whether, should those Welsh Assembly
precisely because they were brought in to deal with a         Ministers express any reservations about the net impact
time when unemployment was rising. Unemployment               of their policies on poverty in constituencies such as
is, fortunately, now falling. Inevitably, some of those       mine, they will take those reservations seriously?
contracts will come to an end and it will not be possible
to keep those staff on. I very much hope that those who          Mr Duncan Smith: I have spoken to the Welsh Secretary
have built up good experience in Jobcentre Plus will be       on a number of occasions and I have accepted her
able to find alternative employment, given the fact that      invitation to go and visit the Assembly—[Interruption.]
the employment services sector is growing and that the        I have not yet gone, but I have had correspondence with
Work programme is lying ahead.                                various Ministers. I promise the hon. Gentleman that
                                                              he will have our eagle eye over the course of the process
  Jane Ellison (Battersea) (Con): I very much welcome         just as others have.
the comments made by my right hon. Friend a moment              Several hon. Members rose—
ago about housing benefit. There are particularly difficult
problems in London, where housing benefit has contributed       Mr Speaker: Order. I am sorry that we must move on,
to some enormous discrepancies in rent. May I ask him         as there is an important debate to follow that is heavily
to take a particular interest in the problem in the           subscribed, but not before we have heard a point of
capital, where the poverty trap is one of the greatest in     order from the right hon. Member for Rotherham
the UK?                                                       (Mr MacShane).
23                                                     19 JULY 2010                                                      24

                   Points of Order                                            Academies Bill [Lords]
                                                                  Second Reading
3.32 pm
   Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): On a point              3.35 pm
of order, Mr Speaker. At close of business tonight we              The Secretary of State for Education (Michael Gove):
will pass the estimates—an awful lot of money—without           I beg to move, That the Bill be now read a Second time.
a vote. Bundled into that are the IPSA estimates, which
show that £6.6 million will be spent simply on IPSA                Today’s Second Reading marks the first legislative
administration compared with £2 million under the               step towards the fulfilment of our manifesto commitment
previous regime. In the future, will it be possible to          to improve England’s education system. It grants greater
separate out the IPSA estimate so that we can have, if          autonomy to individual schools, it gives more freedom
necessary, a debate and a vote on it?                           to teachers and it injects a new level of dynamism into a
                                                                programme that has been proven to raise standards for
   Mr Speaker: The short answer to the right hon.               all children and for the disadvantaged most of all.
Gentleman is that it is not possible to devise some new            The need for action to transform our state education
procedure for the purpose that he described. Moreover,          system has never been more urgent. In the past 10 years,
I am not sure that it is necessary. The right hon. Gentleman    we have seen a decline in the performance of our
has just pithily explained his precise understanding of         country’s education in comparison with our competitors.
the size of the IPSA estimate as a feature of the total         We were, 10 years ago, fourth in the world for the
estimate. If he works on the basis that everybody else is       quality of our science education; we are now 14th. We
as capable of interpreting these matters as he is—that is       were, 10 years ago, seventh in the world for the quality
an if, I accept—he might be satisfied that there is a           of our children’s literacy; we are now 17th. And we
general level of understanding of these important matters.      were, 10 years ago, eighth in the world for the quality of
                                                                our children’s mathematics; we are now 24th. At the
   Mr David Blunkett (Sheffield, Brightside and                 same time as we have fallen behind other nations, we
Hillsborough) (Lab): On a point of order, Mr Speaker.           have seen a stubborn gap persist between the educational
As regards the speed with which today’s business is             attainment of the wealthiest and the opportunities available
being taken through the House, the Secretary of State           to the poorest.
for Education suggested on the radio this morning that             Pioneering work by Leon Feinstein for the Institute
comparison could be drawn between the Academies                 of Education has proven that educational disadvantage
Bill, with its 16 clauses and two schedules, and legislation    starts even before children go to school and that children
on the assisted places scheme to remove the subsidy to          of low cognitive ability from wealthy homes overtake
private education, which had three substantive clauses          children of greater cognitive ability from poorer homes
and two technical clauses and for which I was responsible       even before they arrive at school. As they go through
in 1997. I know that you cannot protect Parliament              school, the gap widens. Schools, instead of being engines
from everything that the coalition does, Mr Speaker,            of social mobility and guarantors of equality, are only
but is not the comparison to be made between this Bill          perpetuating the divide between the wealthy and the
and the Dangerous Dogs Act 1991, and will you protect           poorest. At key stage 1, some 71% of pupils who are
us from the dangerous dogma of the coalition Government         eligible for free school meals are reading at the expected
as they push this Bill through?                                 level, compared with 87% of pupils who are not eligible
                                                                for free school meals. At the end of key stage 2, the gap
   Mr Speaker: I am always keen and anxious to protect          has grown wider. By the end of primary school, just
the House and I take considerable steps to do so. I have        53% of pupils who are eligible for free school meals
not made the comparison that the right hon. Gentleman           reach level 4—the expected level in English, compared
suggests, but of course there would be no need for me to        with 76% of pupils who are not eligible for free school
do so because he has just made that comparison extremely        meals.
effectively. It is on the record, and I know that he will          As students go through secondary school, the gap
want to share it with the residents of Sheffield, Brightside.   becomes even wider. By the time they are taking their
                                                                GCSEs, just 27% of pupils who are eligible for free
                                                                school meals get five A to C grades, including English
                                                                and maths. That is exactly half the figure for those
                                                                students who are not eligible for free school meals.
                                                                When it comes to A-levels and university entry, the gap
                                                                is wider still. In the last year for which we have figures,
                                                                of the 81,000 who had been eligible for free school
                                                                meals, just 45 made it to Oxbridge by the time they
                                                                turned 19, whereas one top London school gets an
                                                                average of 82 Oxbridge admissions a year. We cannot
                                                                go on with such a drastic waste of talent, which is why
                                                                we need to legislate now to ensure that opportunity
                                                                becomes more equal in our society.
                                                                   As well as the legislation that we are bringing forward
                                                                today, the coalition Government are bringing forward a
                                                                series of changes to transform our educational system.
                                                                We are hoping to transform teaching for the better by
                                                                doubling the number of graduates on the Teach First
25               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                 26

scheme, which has already been proven to raise attainment,       Mr Tobias Ellwood (Bournemouth East) (Con): I
particularly in the poorest areas. The expansion of            welcome the Second Reading of the Bill. It has gained a
Teach First was backed by every party in the House of          huge amount of support in Bournemouth. Despite
Commons at the time of the last general election, but it       what the unions say, many teachers and schools are
is the coalition Government who have found the money           looking forward to the extra powers they are likely to
to ensure that the very best graduates are in the schools      gain from the Bill.
that need them most. We will be bringing forward                 My right hon. Friend mentioned the curriculum. As
proposals to improve the continuous professional               he knows, I am a huge supporter of the international
development of all teachers to ensure that the current         baccalaureate, and if, as I hope, the Bill becomes law,
crop of teachers—here I agree with the shadow Education        could he say what scope it will allow schools to drop
Secretary that they are among the best ever—can benefit        A-levels and take on the international baccalaureate?
from the best evidence available on how to raise attainment.
   When it comes to attracting great teachers, we know           Michael Gove: My hon. Friend is a great advertisement
that we need to take action on discipline, because the         for the way in which the international baccalaureate
biggest single disincentive for talented people going          develops a rounded individual, with all the characteristics
into the classroom is the standard of behaviour that           needed to succeed in life. It is a pity that the commitment
they encounter. As a result, the Minister of State,            of the previous Prime Minister, Tony Blair, to have a
Department for Education, my hon. Friend the Member            school offering the international baccalaureate in every
for Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (Mr Gibb), has              neighbourhood was one that the right hon. Member for
outlined proposals to change the rules in order to give        Kirkcaldy and Cowdenbeath (Mr Brown) decided to
teachers greater confidence on the use of force, greater       abandon. I assure my hon. Friend that academies can
confidence when they exercise search powers and greater        offer the international baccalaureate and, to be fair to
protection when false or vexatious claims are made             the shadow Education Secretary, some academies opened
against them.                                                  on his watch, including Havelock academy in Grimsby,
   As well as changing the rules on discipline, we are         offer the middle years programme of the international
conducting a thorough-going reform of special educational      baccalaureate. One of the things we want to see is a
needs. The Bill makes it clear that in future there will be    greater degree of curriculum flexibility, so that teachers,
protection for all pupils who have statements when they        not bureaucrats, can decide what is in the best interest
apply for academy schools, so that they are treated on         of their pupils.
an even keel. We shall have a comprehensive review, led
by the Minister of State, Department for Education, my           Vernon Coaker (Gedling) (Lab): You can decide.
hon. Friend the Member for Brent Central (Sarah Teather),
to ensure that the heartache suffered by so many children         Michael Gove: I am going to hand power back to
who cannot get the school they need for their special          teachers. There are some teachers, Vernon, like yourself,
needs is addressed.                                            that I should be a little less reluctant to hand power
   We shall also be taking steps to ensure that our            back to.
children are reading fluently earlier in primary school,          The Bill trusts teachers. It marks a big step forward
and we shall be transforming our curriculum and our            from what happened under the last Government. The
examinations so that they rank with the world’s best—less      last piece of education legislation that Labour tried to
prescription in the curriculum, more rigour in our             bring forward sought to prescribe in excessive detail
examinations.                                                  exactly what should happen in every school, but all the
                                                               evidence suggests that a greater degree of autonomy
   Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab): The right hon. Gentleman      and freedom yields results for all pupils. Even before
was speaking expressly about the curriculum that those         academies, a group of schools—the city technology
schools will pursue. Many of us are worried about two          colleges—was established by my right hon. Friend Lord
areas where the schools may effectively opt out of             Baker of Dorking. All of them were comprehensive
things we believe are important to everybody. The first        schools in working-class, challenged or disadvantaged
is religious education. Schools might advocate a set of        areas. All of them were established independent of local
religious prescriptions that were inimical to the broad        authority control. They are now achieving fantastic
understanding of most people’s expectations about British      results. On average, their GCSE performance involves
society. The second is sex and relationship education.         more than 82% of students getting five good GCSEs,
We believe that it is important that every child should        including English and maths, which is at least half as
have an opportunity to understand their self-worth, so         good again as the average level of all schools in the
that they can make better decisions affecting their future.    country.
                                                                  We know that CTCs have been successful. They have
  Michael Gove: I respect the hon. Gentleman for his           been in existence for more than 20 years and are a
commitment to both those issues. As part of our curriculum     proven model of how autonomy can work. It was their
review later this year, we shall address both religious        persuasive work and the evidence of school improvement
education and sex and relationship education. I agree          they generated that prompted Tony Blair, when he was
that it is important that when sex and relationship            Prime Minister, to go for the academies programme. He
education is reformed—as it will be—we go for the              believed that the autonomy CTCs benefited from should
maximum consensus across the House, and that we do             be extended much more widely.
so in a way that ensures that as many schools as possible
buy into our belief that we should have a 21st-century           Mr David Ward (Bradford East) (LD): Is the Secretary
curriculum that reflects a modern understanding of sex         of State aware that Dixons CTC, one of the first in the
and relationships.                                             country, has hardly any European students at all, yet
27               Academies Bill [Lords]                 19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                   28

[Mr David Ward]                                                  good GCSEs; Burlington Danes academy in Hammersmith,
                                                                 where a school that was in special measures now has
the new Bradford academy, which is less than a mile              more than half its children getting five good GCSEs;
away, is overrun with new arrivals from eastern Europe?          Manchester academy, where Kathy August, on behalf
How does he explain that?                                        of the United Learning Trust, has taken a school in
                                                                 which only 6% of students got five good GCSEs to a
  Michael Gove: My understanding is that the Bradford            point where 35% do so now—all great successes, which
Dixons CTC operates a banded entry system, which is              I am sure the hon. Gentleman will want to applaud.
one of the truest and fairest methods of comprehensive
entry, but I recognise that demographic change in Bradford          Stephen Twigg (Liverpool, West Derby) (Lab/Co-op):
and elsewhere is posing challenges for all schools. One          I do indeed applaud all those successes. Surely the
of the things I believe is that the success of many CTCs         difference between the CTCs and academies that Labour
shows that children, including those with special educational    introduced and the right hon. Gentleman’s proposal is
needs and those who have English as an additional                that the CTCs and academies deliberately focused on
language, can flourish. I hope that other schools in             areas of disadvantage, but his proposal is to give first
Bradford will contemplate—several of them are—taking             priority to outstanding schools, which are disproportionately
on some of the freedoms in the Bill to address the very          in areas of affluence and advantage.
real deprivation that exists in that city and that my hon.
Friend has done so much to address, both as a councillor            Michael Gove: First, outstanding schools can be found
and as a Member of Parliament.                                   in any area, including areas of disadvantage. Secondly,
                                                                 if most of our outstanding schools are in areas of
  Bob Russell (Colchester) (LD): The Secretary of State          advantage, is it not a telling indictment of 13 years of
makes a compelling case about why schools should get             Labour rule that all the best schools are in the richest
away from the control of local education authorities,            areas? The hon. Gentleman lost his seat just five years
such as the dead hand that we have in Essex. In the era          ago; if only he had stayed in the Department for Education,
of the big society, should not the number of elected             perhaps the situation would not be so bad. We will
parents on an academy’s governing body at least match            ensure that every school that acquires academy freedom
the number of elected parents on a secondary school’s            takes an underperforming school under its wing to
governing body?                                                  ensure that all schools improve as a result.

   Michael Gove: My hon. Friend mentions the big                    Ms Karen Buck (Westminster North) (Lab): I believe
society. I was asked earlier today on Radio 5 Live,              that I am the only Member of Parliament who is the
“What is the big society?” and an image of him came to           parent of a child at an academy, and I am a great
my mind. In many respects, he sums up the big society.           believer in what academies have been able to do, but I
He is not only an exemplary legislator, but a dedicated          want to reinforce the point made by my hon. Friend the
citizen activist who has always put Colchester first and         Member for Liverpool, West Derby (Stephen Twigg).
last. I believe that he will be able—I know this from our        Precisely because academies have invested resources in
informal conversations—to use the legislation to ensure          the most disadvantaged areas—the school that my child
that schools in his part of the world can acquire academy        attends is the 16th most deprived in the country—they
status, with an equal number of parent governors and             have been able to exercise a relative improvement. Surely
other governors, thus providing him with the sort of             spreading those resources and the advantages of academy
model that, I am sure, he will press other hon. Members          status to highly privileged schools will do the reverse of
across the House to emulate.                                     what the Secretary of State intends and widen the gap
                                                                 in educational achievement.
  Stephen Pound (Ealing North) (Lab): Before the right
hon. Gentleman completely rewrites the front pages of              Michael Gove: I take the hon. Lady’s point, but she is
every newspaper in Colchester tomorrow, may I return             making the case that only resources drive improvement.
him to CTCs? Can he tell us how many CTCs teach                  Resources are critical, but so is autonomy, and the
creationism as an integral part of the curriculum? Does          record of the CTCs shows that it was their autonomy
he feel that the number is too many, too few or just             that drove improvement. We Government Members all
about right?                                                     know that it is the ethos and quality of a school, and in
                                                                 particular the capacity of a head teacher to lead, that
    Michael Gove: The number is zero, which is just              make all the difference.
about right. It has often been alleged that, for example,
Gateshead Emmanuel CTC teaches creationism as part                  Mr Andy Slaughter (Hammersmith) (Lab): Will the
of the science curriculum. Having visited that school, I         right hon. Gentleman allow me to correct two things
know that it does not. I can tell anyone who is a critic of      that he said? The first relates to Burlington Danes,
CTCs or academies that the cure for such cynicism is to          which has traditionally been a very good school. It got
visit them. It used to be said that the cure for anyone          into special measures, and became an academy, but did
who admired the House of Lords too much was to visit             not improve. It has now improved with a new, second,
it. Having visited the House of Lords during its deliberations   head. Will he accept that often it is not being an
on the Bill, I am full of admiration for the way in which        academy that makes the difference, but having a good
it was debated there and for the many Liberal Democrat           head teacher and a good ethos in the school?
colleagues who helped to improve it. To anyone who                  I come to the second point on which I hope the right
wants to see how our schools can be improved, I recommend        hon. Gentleman will allow me to correct him. We have
visiting academies such as Mossbourne community                  two outstanding schools with a very deprived intake in
academy in Hackney, with 84% of children getting five            my constituency. Both have decided not to become
29               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]                        30

academies. Privately, the schools’ governors have said to      the Children, Schools and Family Committee, as it was
me that they believe that special educational needs            then, in its report on the national curriculum that the
children and non-teaching staff would be discriminated         freedoms enjoyed by academies should be available to
against if the schools became academies, because they          all schools?
have seen that happen in other academies. So will the
Secretary of State not be quite so arrogant in pushing           Michael Gove: My hon. Friend was a distinguished
academies on every level?                                      member of that Committee, and it is precisely because
                                                               the Committee made such a good case that I have been
   Mr Speaker: Order. From now on, interventions need          so influenced by it. The case was also made by my right
to get a bit shorter. The debate is very heavily subscribed,   hon. Friend the Member for Yeovil (Mr Laws), who
and interventions should be brief.                             argued that if academy freedoms were so good, why
                                                               should all schools not have them? If there is a coalition
   Michael Gove: On the second point made by the hon.          of the Select Committee, my right hon. Friend the
Member for Hammersmith (Mr Slaughter), the Bill is             Member for Yeovil and the former Member for Sedgefield,
permissive. If head teachers do not wish to go down the        who am I to stand in its way?
academy route, that is a matter for them. I trust head
teachers, unlike the previous Government who told                Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab): I think
head teachers what was right for them. We believe in           we all accept that the Secretary of State is a humble
professional autonomy. On the first point, I agree. I          man, but will he tell us whom he consulted on his
agree that the current head teacher at Burlington Danes,       proposals and, more importantly, how many schools
Ms Sally Coates, is fantastic; that is why she supports        have applied to make the change under his proposals?
the legislation, and why she appeared with me in public
to say that more schools should embrace the academy               Michael Gove: I consulted head teachers, teachers,
status that allowed her to do so much for the disadvantaged    and parents, and I also took the trouble to consult the
children whom the hon. Gentleman represents, and               electorate at the general election; the proposal was in
who are our first care.                                        our manifesto, and received a great deal of support.
                                                               Following the general election, I was fortunate enough
 Glenda Jackson (Hampstead and Kilburn) (Lab):                 to find out that the proposal received support from not
Will the Secretary of State give way?                          just my right hon. Friend the Member for Yeovil, but
   Michael Gove: In just one second, if I may; first I         my right hon. Friend the Member for Sheffield, Hallam
want to make a point that follows on from that made by         (Mr Clegg) and my many other hon. Friends on the
the hon. Members for Liverpool, West Derby (Stephen            Liberal Democrat Benches.
Twigg) and for Westminster North (Ms Buck), which
                                                                 Malcolm Wicks (Croydon North) (Lab) rose—
was that by extending academy freedoms we do not
help the most disadvantaged. That was not the view of           Michael Gove: I am happy to give way, but then I
Tony Blair in 2005, when he introduced the education           must try to make progress.
White Paper. He made it clear then that he wanted every
school to have academy freedoms so that they could               Malcolm Wicks: Does the Secretary of State feel that
drive up standards for all. In that sense, we are merely       there will be any need for locally elected education
fulfilling the case that was made in 2005. I am happy to       authorities in the future? If so, what will their roles be?
call myself a born-again Blairite, but all I see as I look
at the Opposition Benches are groups of Peters denying—I         Michael Gove: I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman
hesitate to say the messiah—the previous Prime Minister        for his question. If I may quote, I believe:
three times. Now that the cock has crowed, I am happy             “The best local authorities already increasingly see their primary
to give way to the hon. Member for Hampstead and               role as championing parents and pupils rather than being a direct
Kilburn (Glenda Jackson).                                      provider of education. We need to see every local authority
                                                               moving from provider to commissioner, so that the system acquires
  Glenda Jackson: I am grateful to the Secretary of            a local dynamism responsive to the needs of their communities
State. He called the Bill permissive. What it most markedly    and open to change and new forms of school provision. This will
does not permit is any kind of consultation with parents,      liberate local authorities from too often feeling the need to defend
governors, teachers and schools other than the one             the status quo, so that instead they become the champions of
pursuing academy status. That is the antithesis of localism,   innovation and diversity, and the partner of local parents in
                                                               driving continuous improvement.”
which I understood was the bedrock of the Conservative
party’s proposals.                                             That was Tony Blair in October 2005—once again, an
                                                               unimprovable argument.
   Michael Gove: I have great respect for the hon. Lady,
but the Bill includes specific provision for consultation.       Ed Balls (Morley and Outwood) (Lab/Co-op): But
Hitherto, academies had to consult only local authorities,     that speech led directly to the Education and Inspections
but there is provision for wider consultation in the           Act 2006, in which local authorities were given the
legislation. More than that, because the Bill is permissive,   responsibility for commissioning places. The legislation
it is for schools and heads to decide whether to make          before us entirely removes the local authority’s role in
the change. I know that there are a number of schools in       such commissioning, so the idea that the right hon.
the hon. Lady’s constituency that are very interested in       Gentleman is the heir to Tony Blair is complete and
doing so.                                                      utter tosh.

  Mr Edward Timpson (Crewe and Nantwich) (Con):                   Michael Gove: I would never claim to be the heir to
When my right hon. Friend was deciding on the ambit            Blair; I know that the right hon. Gentleman yearns to
of the Bill, did he take note of the recommendation of         fill that role. I was one of the many thousands watching
31               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                 32

[Michael Gove]                                                collaboration help less good schools to become better?
                                                              Is that not just excellence supporting excellence, or has
the Labour leadership hustings on “Newsnight”, when           the right hon. Gentleman had to change that policy?
he said that Tony Blair was the finest Prime Minister the
Labour party ever had. I dropped my cocoa in excitement          Michael Gove: No, it is my belief that all outstanding
at the right hon. Gentleman’s conversion to the cause of      schools should be there to support other schools. I am
Blairism. It is somewhat at variance with what is recorded    grateful to the right hon. Gentleman for drawing that
in Alastair Campbell’s diaries, Peter Mandelson’s memoirs     issue to my attention. Actually, we have made it clear
and various other documents that have thudded on to           that groups of schools in which one school is outstanding
my desk over the past few weeks, but I am very happy to       and the others are not can apply. Woodberry Down may
see him join the conventicle.                                 well be a school that we would like to see enjoy academy
                                                              status and hope will work with other schools, but it may
  Fiona Mactaggart (Slough) (Lab): The right hon.             not be among the very first schools to enjoy academy
Gentleman quoted the former Prime Minister’s words            status. If he would like Woodberry Down’s application
and cited the role of local authorities as champions of       accelerated so that it can become an academy in September,
parents and pupils. Who will champion the parents of          I hope he will join me in the Lobby this evening.
pupils who are excluded from academies?
                                                                 Ed Balls: I have found in the past few weeks that the
   Michael Gove: The hon. Lady will know that academies       right hon. Gentleman is never, ever able to answer a
are governed by the same admissions rules as all local        straight question in the House. I will try again. An
authority schools. They have to abide by the admissions       outstanding school was told that it could federate only
code and subscribe to fair access protocols, so that          with other outstanding schools if it wanted academy
those hard-to-place children are placed appropriately. I      status. Is that his policy, yes or no?
grant the hon. Lady that some academies, when they
have made the journey from failing school to academy            Michael Gove: It is certainly not our policy, and I am
status, have experienced an increase in the number of         sorry that the headmaster of Woodberry Down has
exclusions, but that normally settles down after a short      been told that. I shall write to him later or call him, or
period, as it does in most schools with a good new head       perhaps he, I and the right hon. Gentleman can have a
teacher who is extending discipline and control. Then         cup of tea together, to ensure that that excellent school
we find that once academies have become settled, the          can become an academy by September if it wishes.
number of exclusions falls, and that is certainly the case
with city technology colleges. My hon. Friend the Member
for Gainsborough (Mr Leigh) wished to make a point,              Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): May
and I am delighted to give way.                               I set the right hon. Gentleman straight on one point?
                                                              Yes, the former Children, Schools and Families Committee
                                                              did recommend that all schools should have the same
   Mr Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con): Does the             curriculum freedoms as academies, but it was never
Secretary of State consider the greatest missed opportunity   necessary to expand academy status to outstanding
of the previous Conservative Government to be the             schools in order to do that. It was always under the
failure to make all schools grant maintained? Therefore,      control of central Government and the Department,
philosophically, does he believe that such freedoms           not local authorities.
should gradually spread out so that, in the end, the
head teachers of all state schools have the same freedoms
as the head teachers of independent schools?                     Michael Gove: I appreciate the hon. Gentleman’s
                                                              point, but as a believer in freedom I believe not just that
   Michael Gove: My hon. Friend makes a very good             schools should have the chance to have greater freedom
point, and I want a greater degree of freedom for all         over the curriculum but that they should have other
head teachers. If we compare our proposals with the           freedoms as well. I remember the former Member for
’90s and the world of grant-maintained schools, however,      Dorset South, who is now Lord Knight of Weymouth,
one big difference is that we do not envisage schools         making the point in debate here that academies also
existing in a parallel universe, but collaborating with       have freedoms on pay and conditions, and they need
other schools. One of the great gains of the past 15 years    those freedoms to generate the improvement that has
has been the culture of collaboration that has taken          been such an attractive characteristic of the academies
root between head teachers and throughout state schools.      movement. I agree that the Department can disapply
It is wholly worthwhile, I wish to build on it and I make     the national curriculum when specific schools apply,
no apology for saying that it happened over the course        but I should like to see a wider range of freedoms.
of the past 15 years, because any fair-minded person
would wish to acknowledge it and see it develop.                Mr Don Foster (Bath) (LD): May I say how much I
                                                              welcome many of the freedoms that the Secretary of
  Ed Balls: When the head teacher of Woodberry Down           State proposes, not least freedom for teachers and freeing
community primary school in Hackney, an outstanding           up the curriculum?
school in a federation with two other primary schools,          On consultation with local education authorities, the
approached the Department for Education to ask whether        Secretary of State will be aware that in my constituency
the school might access academy freedoms, the Department      Oldfield girls school wants to become an academy but
said it could do so only if it broke up the federation,       the local authority’s reorganisation plan to reduce surplus
because outstanding schools would be able to federate         places envisages it as a co-educational school. Can he
only with other outstanding schools rather than               assure me that he will not approve academy status if the
underperforming schools. On what basis will such              school remains a single-sex school?
33                Academies Bill [Lords]                 19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]                      34

   Michael Gove: I take my hon. Friend’s point, which             in education—education reform is guided by greater
follows that made by the right hon. Member for Morley             devolution to the front line, greater control for professionals
and Outwood (Ed Balls). Some 1,800 schools have                   and a relentless focus on higher standards.
applied for academy status, and if we were to run
through the pros and cons of each my speech would be                Bill Esterson (Sefton Central) (Lab): Will the Secretary
of interminable length. However, we have discussed that           of State give way?
specific school before and I know that my right hon.
Friend—sorry, I mean my hon. Friend; that will come                  Michael Gove: Not at this stage.
later—is seeking in a fair-minded way to see whether                 The Opposition have tabled a reasoned amendment.
that school can become co-educational and enjoy greater           My problem with it is that it is not reasoned and nor
autonomy. I am sure we can find a way through.                    does it amend matters in our schools for the better. It is
                                                                  simply a list of unjustified assertions. It states that the
   Richard Graham (Gloucester) (Con): Does my right               Bill provides the legal framework for new parent-promoted
hon. Friend agree that it is slightly ironic to hear Opposition   schools. That is not true; that was created in 2002. It
Members make accusations of inadequate consultation               states that our proposals for academy status are funded
on the Bill, given that the previous Secretary of State           by cuts in the Building Schools for the Future programme.
simply dispatched to my constituency his henchman                 That is not true; they are funded using money that was
Mr Badman, who decided to close one of the                        in the harnessing technology grant, and we are making
comprehensive schools there? The consultation was simply          the Building Schools for the Future programme more
on whether to close it or merge it with another one, and          efficient.
it was stated that the new academy must open in September.           The Opposition argue that our proposals are based
Does he agree that this Government are trying to deal             on reforms in other countries with falling standards and
with the problems that have resulted from a very crude            rising inequality. That is not true; they are based on
consultation and a very tight deadline?                           reforms in countries such as President Barack Obama’s
                                                                  America and in Singapore, Canada and Finland, where
  Michael Gove: My hon. Friend makes a very good                  standards are rising and equity is greater. The Opposition
point, and the fact that the electors of Gloucester, even         claim that there are no measures to drive up standards,
though they had a superb Labour MP last time round,               improve discipline or deliver greater equality. At the
chose to elect him, an even better Conservative one,              beginning of my speech, I pointed out what we are
shows what they thought of how the last Government                doing about teaching and discipline, and, thanks to the
dealt with education.                                             impassioned advocacy of my right hon. Friend the
                                                                  Member for Yeovil and the Minister of State, my hon.
  Several hon. Members rose—                                      Friend the Member for Brent Central, we will shortly
                                                                  introduce proposals for a pupil premium.
   Michael Gove: I must try to make progress, because
many Members wish to speak in the debate, so for the                 Mr Ellwood: On a point of order, Mr Speaker. My
moment I shall not take any more interventions.                   right hon. Friend has listed a whole series of aspects of
                                                                  the amendment that show it contains many untruths.
   I stress that although we are following the path set
                                                                  Would it be in order for the Opposition to be given the
down by successful schools in this country, we are also
                                                                  opportunity to walk away, rewrite it and come back
following the one set down by successful jurisdictions
                                                                  with an amendment that might be worthy of the House?
elsewhere in the world. In America, which my right hon.
Friend the Prime Minister is due to visit in just a few
days’ time, President Obama is pressing ahead with                  Mr Speaker: First, that is an utterly specious point of
school reforms exactly analogous to those with which              order. Secondly, it is a waste of time.
we are pressing ahead here. He is making reforms to
ensure that there are better teachers in every classroom             Michael Gove: It is, of course, a point of debate and
and that more schools enjoy greater autonomy. The                 I look forward to hearing the shadow Secretary of State
charter schools in the USA, such as the Knowledge is              shortly.
Power programme schools, with which I know the right                 The reasoned amendment argues that we are not
hon. Member for Tottenham (Mr Lammy) is familiar,                 building on the success of the academies programme,
have done a fantastic job, free from local bureaucratic           but the Bill fulfils it. It makes it easier for failing schools
control, of transforming the life chances of young                to be placed in the hands of great sponsors to turn them
people. Children who would not have expected to graduate          round, for good schools to take faltering schools under
from high school are now going on to elite colleges               their wing and for all children from disadvantaged
because of the quality of the education that they enjoy.          backgrounds to benefit from academy status.
Charter schools in Boston have succeeded in cutting by               I refer those who argue that we are failing children
half the achievement gap between black and white                  with special educational needs to the remarks of Lord
children.                                                         Adonis in the upper House when the Bill was making
   In Chicago, as Caroline Hoxby and Jonah Rockoff                progress there. He said:
have pointed out, charter schools have achieved even                “On the contrary, in crucial areas of special educational needs,
more dramatic gains for children from disadvantaged               particularly EBD”—
backgrounds. The striking thing about Hoxby and Rockoff’s         emotional and behavioural difficulties—
research is that in Chicago the children are drawn                “the dynamic innovation… that academies can bring could lead
overwhelmingly from poorer homes. Whether one goes                to significant improvements… in ways that enhance the overall
to Sweden, Finland, Singapore or Alberta—Alberta is               quality of the state education system.”—[Official Report, House
the highest-performing English-speaking jurisdiction              of Lords, 23 June 2010; Vol. 719, c. 1399.]
35                  Academies Bill [Lords]                      19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                  36

[Michael Gove]                                                           academy status, and to fund hundreds of new free-market
                                                                         schools, and that the role for the local authority in
The expansion of the academies programme will drive                      planning places, allocating capital or guaranteeing fairness
that improvement in state education. I know that some                    or social cohesion is entirely removed. The weakest
Opposition Members say, “Pause, gie canny, slow down,                    schools, children from the poorest communities, and
hesitate”, but that is the argument of the conservative                  children with a special need and those with a disability,
throughout the ages when confronted with the radicalism                  will be left to pick up the pieces with old buildings,
that says we need to do better for our children. We                      fewer teachers and larger class sizes. The fact is that the
cannot afford to wait. We cannot afford Labour’s failed                  Bill will rip apart the community-based comprehensive
approach any more, with teachers directed from the                       education system that we have built in the past 60 years,
centre, regulations stifling innovation and our country                  which has delivered record rising standards in the last
falling behind other nations. We need reform and we                      decade.
need it now. We need the Bill.                                              To rush the Bill through in this way is a complete
                                                                         abuse of Parliament. The Secretary of State should be
     Several hon. Members rose—                                          ashamed of himself. We will challenge this coalition—
                                                                         Conservatives and Liberal Democrats—to support our
  Mr Speaker: Order. I have selected the reasoned                        amendment and put a halt to this deeply ideological,
amendment in the name of the Leader of the Opposition.                   free-market experiment before it is all too late.

4.9 pm                                                                     Mr Graham Stuart (Beverley and Holderness) (Con)
  Ed Balls (Morley and Outwood) (Lab/Co-op): I beg
to move,
                                                                           Ed Balls: Perhaps the hon. Gentleman could repeat
   That this House declines to give a Second Reading to the              the comments he made on television yesterday.
Academies Bill [Lords] because it creates the legal framework for
the expensive free market schools reforms which will be funded by
scrapping existing school building programmes; its approach is              Mr Stuart: The right hon. Gentleman is seeking to be
based on reforms in other countries which have seen falling              a leader, but he seeks leadership in the luddite tendency.
standards and rising inequality; it contains no measures to drive        He has always opposed reform: he opposed it from the
up standards, improve discipline or deliver greater equality in          Back Benches when he first came into Parliament, and
schools; it fails to build on the success of the previous Government’s   he continues to oppose reform that will raise standards.
Academies programme and instead focuses additional support
and resources on those schools that are already succeeding at the           To return to the subject of Building Schools for the
expense of the majority of schools; it deprives schools with the         Future, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State was
biggest behaviour and special educational needs challenges of            absolutely right to intervene. He took a brave decision
local authority support for special needs provision, the funding         to intervene on a programme that is wasteful and that
for which will go to those with the fewest such challenges; it           does not lead to results in our schools. We will now have
permits selective schools to convert to Academy status, which            a system that prioritises need, not political fixes, and
risks the unplanned expansion of selective education; it removes
                                                                         that ensures that the money goes on school buildings—
any proper requirement to consult local authorities or the community
before the creation of an Academy and centralises power in the
hands of the Secretary of State over the future of thousands of             Mr Speaker: Order. Let me just say to the hon.
schools without adequate provision for local accountability.             Gentleman that even though he is the elected Chair of
   The Secretary of State and I have seen a great deal of                the Select Committee on Education, he must be economical
each other across the Dispatch Box in recent weeks. I                    in his interventions.
said to him two weeks ago that the cancellation of the
Building Schools for the Future programme was a black                        Ed Balls: The previous Chair of the Select Committee
day for our country’s schools. Since then, he has had a                  on Children, Schools and Families and I did not always
torrid fortnight. He has gone from under fire to embattled               see eye to eye, but he always had respect on both sides of
to beleaguered in only 15 days.                                          the House for his independence. The hon. Member for
                                                                         Beverley and Holderness (Mr Stuart) got some respect
   The Secretary of State may think that the recess is in                yesterday for saying that the Bill was being railroaded
sight, but the backlash that his statement kicked off two                through Parliament, but he loses it for that ridiculous,
weeks ago has only just begun, and the rushed and                        partisan and stooge-like performance. Maybe he should
flawed provisions in the Bill will make things much                      call some witnesses and hear some evidence before he
worse for our schools and our children in the coming                     decides to write his Select Committee’s report—unless
months. Having had to apologise twice for his                            it is being written for him by Conservative Front Benchers.
announcement two weeks ago and his rushed and botched                    His credibility is very substantially undermined.
decision, even his senior Back Benchers are asking why
he is so contemptuously trying to railroad his academies                   Mr Graham Stuart: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.
and free schools policy through the House in only four                   The shadow Secretary of State may be getting excited,
days. The reason is that the right hon. Gentleman, who                   but I ask him whether he might withdraw that remark,
can never answer a question, is also afraid of scrutiny.                 which brought into question the independence of a
   Let me tell the House what is really going on. Today                  Select Committee.
and over the next week, the Opposition will show that
the Bill will create unfair and two-tier education in this                 Mr Speaker: Order. Frankly, that is not a point of
country. There will be gross unfairness in funding,                      order, but a point of debate. I have known the hon.
standards will not rise but fall, and fairness and social                Gentleman for a number of years, and I know that he
cohesion will be undermined. The Bill will mean that                     will not want to become an unduly sensitive flower.
funding is diverted to the strongest schools to convert to               That would be unwise.
37                 Academies Bill [Lords]                    19 JULY 2010                 Academies Bill [Lords]                        38

  Ed Balls: I have been asked to give evidence to the                 backgrounds. Does my right hon. Friend agree that the
hon. Gentleman’s Committee in a week’s time, as has                   lack of protection for children from such backgrounds
the Secretary of State. My point is that the hon. Gentleman           is a worrying aspect of the legislation?
should probably hear the evidence before he jumps to
conclusions. That is the proper way to act as a Select                   Ed Balls: I visited Sandwell last week, a borough
Committee Chair, rather than jumping up and making                    where several schools were told that their new school
not an intervention but a speech of the most partisan                 buildings were going ahead—in version 1 of the Secretary
and specious nature.                                                  of State’s list—but were told in list 2 or 3 that he had
  Let me begin with capital spending. The Liberal                     made a mistake and all their new buildings were being
Democrats deputy leader, the hon. Member for Bermondsey               cancelled. As part of that discussion, I met the head
and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes), put it very well to                 teacher of a special school whose promised new investment
the BBC when he said:                                                 has been taken away. We discussed the fact that the new
   “It would be a nonsense to take money that could be used for       academies policy will take out of the funding agreement
improving existing schools to create new schools where, on the        the obligation on academies to focus on stopping exclusions
ground, the will of the local community is for the existing schools   of children with special needs. So I have exactly the
to continue”.                                                         same concern as my hon. Friend.
That is precisely what the Bill will do. The fact is that                The head teachers in Sandwell were pleased that I
the dismay across the country at the decision to cancel               visited. They were also pleased that the Secretary of
more than 700 promised new schools, disappoint more                   State has agreed to visit Sandwell to apologise for his
than 2 million children and parents, and put at risk                  dreadful mistake. However, they think that it is odd that
thousands of construction jobs, has turned to anger at                he wants to visit on 5 August. Visiting schools in August
the growing realisation that those schools are being                  is not usually the done thing, as the Secretary of State
cancelled to pay for the free-market schools policy that              will find out. I am sure the reason is that his diary is full.
is set out in the Bill.                                               Perhaps he should share the load. I know that the Prime
                                                                      Minister is today in Liverpool announcing his big society.
  Christopher Pincher (Tamworth) (Con): The right                     Perhaps the Secretary of State should urge the Prime
hon. Gentleman said that this measure is a brake on                   Minister to apologise to the 25 schools in Liverpool and
progress. In my constituency, children going into one of              the many thousands of children who have seen their
the schools—it has an inspirational head teacher—at                   new school taken away from them by the free-market
age 11 have a reading age of 8. After 13 years of Labour              schools policy in this Bill.
Government, what is progressive about that?                              Perhaps while the Prime Minister is there, he could
                                                                      also apologise to the leader of the Liberal Democrat
   Ed Balls: We have 720 schools where children from                  group on Liverpool council, who had some interesting
primary school were looking forward to going into                     things to say about the Secretary of State. Former
brand-new schools. Their hopes have now been dashed                   council leader Councillor Warren Bradley said that
by the Conservatives to pay for their free-market schools
                                                                      “it would be absolute folly if we were to ignore the impact of such
policy—[HON. MEMBERS: “Answer the question.”] Unlike                  a ridiculous decision by Michael Gove, whether or not we are in
the Secretary of State, I have the courage to answer the              coalition. Not only would it show how shallow we are, either in
question, and the fact is that in 1997 70% of children                control or opposition, we would be letting this and future generations
reached the required level in English and maths at                    of young people down.”
age 11, and that rose to 80% under the last Government.               He goes on:
We improved standards because we invested in schools
and teachers. It is the cuts by the Government that will                  “It’s ridiculous. The plans for BSF were so far advanced and
                                                                      it’s unforgivable that other funding options are not in place.”
set back the improvement in standards.
   Members opposite know that the reason the new
schools have been cancelled is not to reduce the deficit.               Mr Sam Gyimah (East Surrey) (Con): Will the right
It is not because of the nonsensical claims about                     hon. Gentleman give way?
bureaucracy. Those claims are as flimsy as the Prime
Minister’s promise to protect the front line. The cuts in               Ed Balls: In just a second. I am going to finish
the school building programme are to pay for the new                  reading this quote. The hon. Gentleman might enjoy it.
free schools policy. We know that because in opposition                  “I think the national party have got to wake up and listen to
the Conservatives said that                                           the people on the ground that are hearing the complaints from
“we propose that capital funding for new academies should come        core voters. Being in coalition should be a two-way street. There
through a new fund, established by reallocating the money available   are times when Clegg has got to say to Cameron, ‘No more’. I
within the building schools for the future programme.”                think BSF is the straw that has broken the camel’s back. You do
                                                                      not fill a hole at the expense of the young people of this country.”
To be fair to them, they promised it in opposition and
they are delivering it in government, so that 700 schools               Wise words indeed, from a Liberal Democrat. I would
around the country are now feeling the reality of a                   be happy to take an intervention from the hon. Member
Conservative-Liberal Administration and do not like it                for Bermondsey and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes)
very much.                                                            on this point.

  Bill Esterson: The Secretary of State talked at length                 Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark)
about various freedoms. One of the freedoms that concerns             (LD): The right hon. Gentleman might like to know
me is the freedom of schools to exclude children with                 that, when I spoke to Councillor Bradley, he said that
special educational needs and looked after children,                  he was very happy to meet the Secretary of State. When
among other categories of children from disadvantaged                 I spoke to the Secretary of State, he said that he was
39               Academies Bill [Lords]                19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                   40

[Simon Hughes]                                                     Ed Balls: Thank you, Mr Speaker.
                                                                   On the subject of the consultation, we had an interesting
very happy to meet all our colleagues in all the metropolitan   answer on the question of schools becoming academies.
boroughs concerned with the educational plans for the           We were told that there would be consultation. The fact
future.                                                         is that the Bill that was published a few weeks ago
                                                                contained no obligation for any consultation at all. It
   Ed Balls: The hon. Gentleman has obviously done a            was only as a result of intervention in the other place
good job of whipping some colleagues, but it is a pity          that a provision was added to say that there should be
that he did not speak to the Liberal Democrat Education         consultation, but what obligation does that provision
Association, which has condemned the very Bill that he          place on schools and governing bodies? It says that they
is being asked to vote for today. We must wait and see          need only consult whomever they think appropriate,
whether the hon. Gentleman signs the association’s              and that they can consult before they decide to become
petition—I do not know whether he is thinking about             an academy or after they have done the deed. The idea
leadership elections to come.                                   that that represents consultation is complete and utter
   My point is that visits to metropolitan areas and            nonsense.
apologies are not enough. That is not what people want.
Parents, teachers and children do not want the Secretary           Andrew Percy (Brigg and Goole) (Con): Listening to
of State to say sorry; they want him to change his mind,        the right hon. Gentleman has certainly taken me back
to throw out this Bill and to let them build the new            to my previous job as a class 1 teacher. On the issue of
schools that they were promised. The people I spoke to          consultation, is he honestly suggesting that governing
today also said to me, “Can’t you get an answer from            bodies, which are made up of schoolteachers, head
the Secretary of State?” I wrote to him two weeks ago to        teachers, parents and interested people from the community,
ask whether the money was being diverted away from              are going to push ahead without going out and talking
Building Schools for the Future to fund the proposals           to parents and other interested parties? If he is saying
in this Bill, but I have had no reply so far. I am going to     that, it is a fairly despicable way to describe governing
ask him the question again, because a lot of taxpayers’         bodies.
money rides on the answer. During the weekend before
he announced the cancellation of Building Schools for              Ed Balls: I am afraid that the reason why the Secretary
the Future, did he at any point receive written or oral         of State and his Front-Bench team have added in an
advice from departmental officials or from Partnerships         obligation to consult is, presumably, that they disagree
for Schools urging him not to publish a list of schools         with the hon. Gentleman. If they were going to consult
until after he had consulted local authorities to ensure        anyway, there would be no need to build the provision
that his criteria were sound and that his facts were            into the Bill. It is there because they know some head
right? I would be very happy to take an intervention            teachers and chairs of governors would consult nobody
from him. Would he like to answer the question? No.             at all, which would be undemocratic and unfair. The
                                                                reality is that under our academies policy—look, let me
  Mr Speaker: Order. We do not have forced interventions.       turn to the details of the Bill. [Interruption.] Government
                                                                Members should note that I am at least talking about
                                                                the Bill, unlike the Secretary of State who did not talk
  Ed Balls: After two weeks of waiting for an answer,
                                                                about it at all, and did not mention any clause, any
my expectations were not very high.
                                                                provision or any of the completely undemocratic ways
  Let me try another question. Is it not the case that the      in which our schools system is being railroaded and
Secretary of State was also advised of the risk of legal        undermined.
challenges from private contractors, and did he not
                                                                   I turn to deal with the detail of the Bill. This Bill does
personally decide to ignore that advice? He can set the
                                                                not build on or expand on our academy scheme at all. It
record straight now, or we can keep on asking these
                                                                is a total and utter perversion of it. Our academies were
questions. People want to know the answers. This is
                                                                in the poorest communities and were turning around
about the cack-handed way in which he did this, and
                                                                underperforming schools. As I exposed earlier, the right
about whether there will be legal challenges from the
                                                                hon. Gentleman’s policy is about outstanding schools
authorities and contractors who will have been left out
                                                                supporting only other outstanding schools—schools
of pocket by hundreds of millions of pounds as a result
                                                                that are disproportionately in higher income areas with
of his decision.
                                                                fewer children with disabilities or special educational
   Mr David Anderson (Blaydon) (Lab): Will my right
hon. Friend also comment on the potential for challenges          Ms Louise Bagshawe (Corby) (Con) rose—
from some of the tens of thousands of workers who will
be affected by this decision? They do not know whether
they are going to be made redundant, or what their                Ed Balls: I will give way in a few moments.
terms and conditions will be. Surely there is a legal             Those schools are not only going to get extra funding,
imperative for them to be consulted properly, but that          they will take their share of extra funding for special
consultation will take place while most of them are on          needs, even though they have, disproportionately, fewer
their summer holidays.                                          children with special needs. It will be other children
                                                                with special needs in other schools in the area who will
  Mr Speaker: Order. The debate is starting to broaden          lose out as a result of this policy.
somewhat. I know that the right hon. Gentleman will
want to focus his reply in a way that relates to the Bill.        Ms Bagshawe rose—
41               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                     42

   Ed Balls: If the hon. Lady would like to defend that       needs disproportionately. There is no requirement for a
policy—[Interruption.] She can sit down for a second.         named member of staff to be responsible for children
[Interruption.] I am helping her out. If she can defend       in care. There is no requirement for careers education.
this policy, she might even make it to the Front Bench.       There is no requirement for academies to observe nutritional
It would be very good if she could explain it, because        standards, or to provide sex and relationship education.
the Secretary of State made no attempt to do so.              We will address all those issues in our amendments, and
                                                              I urge Members to vote for them so that we can put the
  Ms Bagshawe: I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman      Bill on to the straight and narrow.
for giving way. What would be his reply to the group of
parents in my Corby constituency with children on the           Conor Burns (Bournemouth West) (Con): The shadow
autistic spectrum who have written asking for my advice       Secretary of State talks of people from the poorest
on how to apply for a free school? How would he reply         communities. While there are clearly differences between
to the National Autistic Society, which has broadly           those on the two front Benches, it might be generous of
welcomed the Academies Bill, because of how it will           him to acknowledge that my right hon. Friend the
raise standards for children with special needs?              Secretary of State is motivated by the best of intentions:
                                                              he wants to give opportunities to those people from
  Ed Balls: I would say that they should be very fearful      poorer communities. Is it not appalling to look back on
indeed. The reality is that we are on a fast track to treat   13 years of Labour government and see that, in one
as second class the majority of children with special         year, only 45 of 80,000 pupils receiving free school
educational needs who will find their funding cut and         meals made it to Oxford university?
their opportunities reduced by this legislation. They
should be very careful.                                          Ed Balls: I do not doubt the good intentions of the
                                                              Secretary of State when it comes to some schools and
   Pauline Latham (Mid Derbyshire) (Con): Would you           some children, but Labour Members are motivated by
say that the shadow Secretary of State is going back          the need to do the best for all children rather than just
20 years and coming back with the same arguments and          some. That is the deep dividing line between the two
fears that the Labour party put out about grant-maintained    sides of the House, and it brings me to what the Bill is
schools, when there was absolutely nothing wrong with         really all about.
them? They did a very good job for schools, raised
standards and raised attainment for many pupils. They           Several hon. Members rose—
did a really good job, but, like then, you are just coming
back and trying to bully people into saying that the Bill        Ed Balls: I will not give way for the moment.
will not work and should not go ahead.                           The Secretary of State wants us to believe that the Bill
                                                              is about changing existing schools into academies, but
  Mr Speaker: May I gently say that I am not coming           Lord Hill, writing to colleagues in the other place,
back to bully anyone? I have never done that before and       confirmed that it was being used as enabling legislation
I would not do it in future. I know that Members will         for the free-market schools policy. The reason why local
not want to use the word “you” again.                         authorities must be cleared out of the way is to enable
                                                              additional school places to be created in a completely
   Ed Balls: The hon. Lady is absolutely right that we        free-market way, with only the check of the Secretary of
have been here before. We have had freedoms and               State and no role whatever for the local authority. As we
resources given to higher-performing schools in more          have made clear in the House before, substantial questions
affluent areas, and we all know what resulted from it.        about that policy are being completely ignored. The
The academies policy that we introduced was the exact         Secretary of State has ignored them so far today, and we
opposite of that, but our policy is being undermined.         have been given a very limited amount of time in which
   The reality is that this Bill gives extra resources to     to scrutinise them in a Committee of the whole House.
higher-performing schools in more affluent areas while           First, it is clear that there is no new money to cover
at the same time removing any obligation for consultation     the capital or current costs of free schools. The creation
with parents, local authorities or external sponsors.         of additional places will be funded by cuts in budgets
Indeed, the requirement for a sponsor is removed entirely     and the removal of teachers from existing schools. I was
under this legislation. We have talked about consultation,    asked about the impact of the new free schools. Having
but the fact is that the only consultation any school         examined the case for a new parent-promoted school in
need have about how it proceeds and how it teaches its        Kirklees, Professor David Woods said that it would
curriculum is with the Secretary of State. The role of        “have a negative impact on other schools in the area in the form
the local authority is entirely removed. This is the          of surplus places and an adverse effect on revenue and capital
biggest centralisation in education policy in the post-war    budgets”.
period.                                                          The fact is that the cost of the new free schools will be
   Although the Bill makes clear that the academies will      covered by cuts in existing schools. We have seen what
be accountable to the Secretary of State, it is interesting   has happened to the Building Schools for the Future
to note that the model funding agreement circulated by        programme. That is why we will table amendments to
the Government contains no requirement for teachers           stop Building Schools for the Future money being
to have qualified-teacher status. It also contains no         siphoned off to pay for new free-market schools against
requirement for co-operation in regard to behaviour           the wishes of local communities—and given that that is
and exclusion: schools can go their own way and exclude       exactly the policy of the hon. Member for Bermondsey
at will. There will be no independent appeals panels for      and Old Southwark (Simon Hughes), I hope that he will
excluded children, which will hit children with special       join us in the Lobby to vote for it.
43               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                    44

   Mr Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con): If the right          the entire management of schools and touting themselves
hon. Gentleman’s point is that the policy is divisive,         for business. That amounts to completely ripping up the
would he welcome a move to give all schools academy            last 60 years of free state education. Secondly, on this
status?                                                        point, if a group of parents wants to go it alone, there
                                                               must be somebody whose job it is to say, “Will this
   Ed Balls: I was happy with the expansion of academies       contribute to, or undermine, social cohesion?”
under our system, which involved agreement with local          [Interruption.] Well, in that case, if parents know best, I
authorities. As we know from what has happened in              predict this will lead to a huge rise in social division, not
Sweden, the removal of local authorities and the granting      social cohesion, and I am very concerned about that.
of a complete free-for-all is likely to be deeply divisive,
both socially and in a wider sense. I believe that it will        Chris Leslie (Nottingham East) (Lab/Co-op): My
lead to huge unfairness and a complete lack of social          right hon. Friend has hit the nail on the head. The
cohesion. Individual groups of parents will go it alone        reason why the Secretary of State is trying to sweep
for a range of reasons, and there will be absolutely no        away any local democratic accountability for education—
check on the system, because, apart from a back-stop           which, incidentally, is deplored by many Conservative
reserve power for the Secretary of State, nobody has           leaders of local authorities—is precisely that he needs
any obligation at all to ask why that is being done and        to get local government out of the way in order, perhaps,
what the impact will be on other schools. That represents      to introduce these quasi-private, free-market school
an unbelievable centralisation of education policy.            arrangements.
   The Secretary of State has proved that he cannot
even announce a list, so the idea that he will be able to        Ed Balls: Exactly, and that is why I am fearful. The
police social cohesion in 3,500 secondary schools is a         money is not there and there is no evidence that the
complete and utter joke.                                       Government’s proposals will contribute to raising standards,
                                                               and my fear is that we will see, as Sweden did, a rise in
    Mr Slaughter: Does my right hon. Friend think that         social segregation, with children in high-income areas
it is a coincidence that the week after the cancellation of    doing better and children in lower-income areas doing
the capital funding under Building Schools for the             worse. That would be deeply socially divisive, and that is
Future for all schools for secondary-age children in my        not the only social division we may see as a result.
constituency, including three special schools, a private
company put around a flyer to parents in Shepherd’s              Dr John Pugh (Southport) (LD): If Members really
Bush saying that it will soon be opening a new primary         believe that parents know best, is it not our duty to
school in their area? There is no new primary school;          include the need for a parent vote as a precondition of
there is only the idea of attracting children from existing    any move to academy status and thereby give parents
schools and then applying to the Government for the            the choice as well, as happened under the old grant-
money that goes to those schools in order to set up a          maintained legislation?
new free school.
                                                                  Ed Balls: That is a very interesting suggestion, and if
   Ed Balls: Exactly, and that is why my hon. Friend and       an amendment to that effect is tabled, we will look at it.
I both fear that this will turn out to be a deeply divisive    I am all in favour of parent power. What the Secretary
reform which will lead to a two-tier education system.         of State is doing, however, is cutting parents out of the
Indeed, the clauses in the Bill are structured in such a       equation entirely; he is leaving it entirely to the head
way as to allow the Secretary of State to give funding         teacher, the chair of governors and himself. There is no
arrangements to private companies taking over the              parent voice at all in this Bill. That is why I am very
running of schools—and we should have the opportunity          fearful, and that is why I believe that this Bill is the
to scrutinise such aspects of the Bill. We will see exactly    biggest threat to our comprehensive state education
what they saw in Sweden: private companies travelling          system in the post-war period.
around the country touting to parents by saying, “If              We will table amendments to ensure that local authorities
you want to set up a school, we’ll do it for you—and           maintain their role in education as guarantors of fairness
we’ll make a profit out of it.” I think that will be deeply,   and of the public interest—as set out in the very Education
deeply divisive.                                               and Inspections Act 2006 the Secretary of State likes to
                                                               quote from.
   Mrs Eleanor Laing (Epping Forest) (Con): Is the
right hon. Gentleman really saying that he and his party          Ian Mearns (Gateshead) (Lab): On 5 July, I asked the
believe that it is not parents who know best how their         Secretary of State where his much-touted expressions
children should be educated, but local authorities and         of interest had come from—chairs of governors, head
people in Whitehall, because that is what he has just          teachers or full governing bodies. The answer I received
said in reply to the hon. Member for Hammersmith               was that that information is not included in the form
(Mr Slaughter)? Will the right hon. Gentleman acknowledge      that is sent out to schools. In other words, these expressions
that parents should be the people who have the greatest        of interest could have come from the caretaker’s cat. We
say in their children’s education?                             do not know exactly who they have come from in order
                                                               to arrive at the figure of the 1,800 schools that, apparently,
  Ed Balls: There is no obligation on the governing            have expressed an interest in academy status.
body even to consult parents in deciding to opt for the
new academy status. Of course the voice of parents is            Ed Balls: I am afraid that I can give no guidance or
important, as are the choices for parents. What I am           enlightenment to my hon. Friend on that. We read in
worried about—and we will table an amendment to                The Times this morning that only 50 schools will be
prevent this—is profit-making companies taking over            going for academy status, rather than the thousands we
45                 Academies Bill [Lords]                    19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                 46

were told about a few weeks ago. If my hon. Friend is                    Is not the truth about this whole business that during
thinking of putting down a question to the Secretary of               the past few weeks, the Secretary of State’s credibility
State, he should not hold his breath. In my experience,               has been completely shot to pieces? Even his own Back
answers are not very forthcoming.                                     Benchers are now questioning his decision to rush this
   It is clear that, whether we are talking about funding,            legislation on to the statute book and to cancel hundreds
fairness, standards, accountability, the role of local                of new schools. The right hon. Gentleman is on a
authorities, social cohesion, the role of free schools,               slippery slope. The Tory party’s shining intellectual, its
existing schools becoming academies or the incentives                 greatest hope, has in the last fortnight been completely
for collaboration, there are massive questions, none of               found out.
which were addressed—as always—in the Secretary of
State’s speech, but which must now be scrutinised in                     Charlotte Leslie (Bristol North West) (Con): Will the
Committee in just two or three days on the Floor of the               right hon. Gentleman give way?
House. It would not surprise me at all if we end up with
statements on Wednesday, Thursday and the following                      Ed Balls: No, I will not.
Monday in order further to constrict that time.                          The eloquence that brought such prizes as a journalist
   I have to say to the hon. Member for Southport                     has been reduced to a shambles, and this morning
(Dr Pugh) that I cannot believe that the Liberal Democrats            allegations were made of a giant BBC conspiracy. The
are allowing themselves to be led through the Lobby to                Secretary of State should not be attacking the BBC; he
support this Bill. They face a very important choice.                 should be listening to the anger of the thousands of
Interestingly, the Secretary of State’s deputy, the hon.              parents, teachers and pupils around the country who
Member for Brent Central (Sarah Teather), is not availing             have lost their chance of a new school. The fact is that
herself of the opportunity to sum up this Bill tonight.               when faced with the tough job of actually running a
She is leaving it to the hon. Member for Bognor Regis                 Department, he has in the past fortnight been totally
and Littlehampton (Mr Gibb), presumably because,                      exposed. When forced to make decisions, he is just not
having described this policy as a complete shambles, she              up to the job. He can make fancy speeches, but he
does not fancy having to defend it on the Floor of the                cannot make policy. He can write good jokes, but he has
House. The right hon. Member for Yeovil (Mr Laws)                     exposed himself in the past fortnight as having terrible
described this policy as “dotty”, and in their own manifesto          judgment.
the Liberal Democrats said:                                              The battle lines are now drawn for this Bill, which is
“we will ensure a level playing field for admissions and funding      the biggest threat to state education in 60 years. This is
and replace Academies with our own model of ‘Sponsor-Managed          not just a question of policy; it is a question of values.
Schools’. These schools will be commissioned by and accountable
to local authorities and not Whitehall”.
                                                                      Labour Members believe that every school should be
                                                                      able to succeed, not just some; we believe that every
So their manifesto actually said—                                     parent should have a chance of a good school, not just
                                                                      some; and we believe that every child matters, not just
   Chris Leslie: I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for            every other child. That is the shared moral purpose that
giving way. I am quite sure I just heard the hon. Member              drives those on the Labour Benches and it is why we will
for Brent Central (Sarah Teather) explain from a sedentary            be voting for our reasoned amendment this evening.
position to her hon. Friend the Member for Bognor                     That is why the Liberal Democrats should join us in the
Regis and Littlehampton (Mr Gibb) that she did not                    Lobby. We should vote against this deeply divisive
say that this was a shameless policy. Is my right hon.                shambles of a Bill.
Friend prepared to give way to the hon. Lady if she
wants to clarify her position on this point?                            Several hon. Members rose—
  Ed Balls: I will put the hon. Lady out of her misery—I
                                                                         Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. Before
will just quote what she said:
                                                                      I call the next speaker, may I remind everybody that
“unless you give local authorities that power to plan and unless      Mr Speaker has set a 10-minute limit on all speeches?
you actually make sure that there is money’s just a
                                                                      I call Mr Graham Stuart.
That is exactly what we have before us—just a gimmick,
the very gimmick that she warned of. The right hon.                   4.46 pm
Member for Yeovil said,                                                  Mr Graham Stuart (Beverley and Holderness) (Con):
“strategic oversight of all state funded schools should be returned   I would like to say that it is a pleasure to follow the
to Local Government.”                                                 shadow Secretary of State, but that contribution was a
That is precisely the opposite of what this Bill does.                bid for the leadership of not only the luddite tendency,
  As for Building Schools for the Future, the deputy to               but the mean-spirited tendency. I would have thought
the Secretary of State, the hon. Member for Brent                     that, whatever someone’s views about the policies that
Central, clearly wishes the world to know that she is                 this Bill represents, anyone in this House would recognise
very upset with the Secretary of State’s policy. Although             that everyone in this House seeks the best for all our
she is not quite prepared to do that on the record, she               children. To suggest that the Secretary of State would
arranged for friends to tell the newspapers that she is               not do so is low, even for the shadow Secretary of State.
“privately seething”. The giants of the Liberal party                    Cuts in public spending and posts were made inevitable
will count her among their number for her bravery. The                by the disastrous financial stewardship of the Labour
hon. Lady has a choice. She cannot sit on the fence any               party, which took a golden legacy and then blew it.
longer. Either she votes for the coalition or she stands              Labour made promises on school buildings, on teacher
up for the schools of Brent—that is her choice tonight.               training and on so many other areas that, it turned out,
47               Academies Bill [Lords]                19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                   48

[Mr Graham Stuart]                                              Front Bench will be able to allay those concerns. Last
                                                                week I visited an academy, called the Ashcroft technology
it simply could not fund. It now lies with the coalition        academy. It has a centre it calls the ARC, which specialises
Government to clean up the mess that the shadow                 in looking after children on the autistic spectrum, and
Secretary of State played such a major part in creating.        an AWA—an academy within an academy—for children
   So the new Government have to find ways to improve           otherwise at risk of exclusion. By using those innovations,
public services and enhance, rather than reduce, the life       the academy has done a tremendous job of looking
chances of our children without spending additional             after those with special educational needs as well as
money. The two coalition partners are united in believing       intervening to ensure that there is not a higher than
that one of the best ways of doing that is by giving            average number of exclusions from the school. Academies
greater autonomy to local communities and those on              can be part of the answer and the innovation that they
the front line of public services. This Bill will take          allow can improve the situation in the average school
academy freedoms and make them potentially available            today.
to all schools for the first time; primary and special
schools, as well as secondary schools, will be able to             Andrew Percy: I thank my next-door neighbour but
become independent state schools, free at the point of          one for giving way. On that point, does he agree that
use, but with control over their curriculum, their teaching     academies must not be allowed to use exclusions as a
hours—at least, in theory—and their special educational         way of driving up standards? Does he also agree that
needs provision and the like.                                   what we heard from the shadow Secretary of State
   That is a good thing and it is why I support this Bill,      failed to recognise that the people in academies are
despite the fact that, generally speaking, I am a structural    teachers—they are professionals, and people in a caring
change sceptic. Reorganisations are too frequent, too           profession who went into it for the right reasons? They
expensive and too convenient for politicians who wish           care about children, and they are the same as teachers in
to make their mark. This policy, like all education             any other state school.
policies, should be measured by whether it will result in
better teachers, better led. The key determinant of a              Mr Stuart: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for his
good education is the quality of the teaching work              intervention and the last thing I would want to do is to
force. I hope that this Bill, the expansion of Teach First      disrespect those in the teaching profession. On the
and the introduction of a pupil premium for children            other hand, however, in any change in Government, it is
from lower-income families will, along with other measures,     enormously important to examine the incentives created
improve the quality, motivation and retention of high-calibre   for those on the front line. If those incentives incentivise
people in education. If it does that, it will have succeeded.   the wrong behaviour, we can expect more of that behaviour
   The Bill builds on the previous Government’s academies       to happen.
programme, which itself grew from Lord Baker’s                     It is true that academies have twice the rate of permanent
innovations back in the 1980s. It takes those programmes        exclusions of the average school. A question for those
forward and is not, therefore, radically new. The changes       on the Front Bench to answer—perhaps the Schools
that this Bill will bring about are not minor, however.         Minister will do that when he winds up—concerns what
They may not be radically new in concept, but they are          steps can be taken to ensure that that rate of exclusions
potentially radical in effect. If hundreds of schools           does not continue. What if that rate accelerates under
leave local authority control each year—starting in             the incentives for the schools in the academy system
September—the implications for our education system             that have been made free? What powers will remain
overall will be profound. The powers in the Bill are            with the Secretary of State and with local authorities to
essentially permissive, as Ministers emphasise. That does       ensure that that does not happen? We need to understand
mean, though, that different local authorities will be          the incentives in the system. Not every teacher will be
affected in different ways.                                     the best teacher and not every head will always be
   Countries behind the former iron curtain that moved          driven by the highest possible motives. It is necessary to
from centrally controlled economies to free market              build a system that is robust, even when it is staffed by
systems did not always find the transition easy or              people who are not of the highest possible calibre.
pleasant. When the centre collapses, some services and             Such issues are why I am concerned by the speed at
skills are scattered and even destroyed and they take           which the legislation is going through Parliament. It
time to grow again. Even when crying freedom, it is best        would be a great shame if something so potentially
to think deeply, consider carefully and do everything           beneficial were damaged or discredited by over-hasty
possible to minimise the potential downsides of change.         execution. The Bill delivers a Conservative manifesto
                                                                commitment on a policy that has been clear for years,
   Annette Brooke (Mid Dorset and North Poole) (LD):
                                                                but none the less parliamentary scrutiny is necessary
Does the hon. Gentleman agree that despite the welcome
                                                                and beneficial for any policy. It should not be rushed
amendments in the other place, there is great uncertainty
                                                                and when it is, as the last Administration found, the
about the provision of special educational needs education,
                                                                errors usually rebound on the Government who put it
particularly for children with complex needs, with funding
                                                                through. I ask Ministers to think carefully about
split between the academies and the local authorities?
                                                                implementation this September—whether we are talking
I am concerned that we might end up with the worst of
                                                                about hundreds or, perhaps, as few as 50 schools. Is
all worlds for some of our most vulnerable and needy
                                                                it worth the candle to put the Bill through so swiftly?
                                                                I shall leave Ministers to think about that.
   Mr Stuart: I am grateful to the hon. Lady for her               I felt that the Secretary of State was quite right to
intervention and I share some of those concerns. I hope         move swiftly to halt the scandalous waste involved in
that, in this coming week, those on the Government              the Building Schools for the Future programme,
49               Academies Bill [Lords]              19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                 50

notwithstanding the fact that my Committee will take             That clumsy approach risks building opposition to
evidence from both the shadow Secretary of State and          academies and could be a gift to the luddite tendency
the Secretary of State next week. I am clear in my            within the teaching unions, whose members are gathered
opinion on this subject, although I shall of course listen    outside as we speak, and resurgent on the Opposition
to the evidence and weigh it carefully along with my          Benches. Building confidence in the Government’s approach
Committee colleagues.                                         requires sure-footedness and careful consideration of
  The embarrassments caused were of the programme’s           everything they do. I ask the Government to reconsider
making, not the Secretary of State’s. His swift action        the measures on the timing of consultation. I fear that
took courage and will result in more building improvements    they have been drafted in that way not because Ministers
to more schools in more need. Every day of delay cost         think it right in principle but because schools that seek
money and cheated children and he did the right thing.        to gain academy status this September would otherwise
I am not so sure about the speed of this measure,             not be able to do so.
however, and that is why I ask him to reflect on that,           Let me conclude by posing a few more questions to
but I am absolutely sure that history will judge his move     those on the Front Bench. Lord Hill said that the Bill
on Building Schools for the Future as both brave              would lead to “greater partnerships between schools.”
and right.                                                    Will that be a requirement or an expectation? It is
                                                              important to reassure the House that we will not see
   Ed Balls: Is the Chair of the Select Committee fully       schools closing in and only looking after themselves,
confident in saying that the Secretary of State has acted     and we would like to know precisely how the proposal
properly? Is he fully confident that the Secretary of         will be implemented. Lord Hill also talked about “fair
State has in no way ignored advice and acted in a             and open admissions”. What plans do the Government
disorderly manner, therefore opening the way for potential    have for the admissions code and the adjudicator? Have
legal challenges regarding the way in which he has            Front Benchers considered the impact of the changes
treated local authorities and private companies? Is the       on rural areas and the provision of transport in such
hon. Gentleman sure that it is wise to reach his conclusion   areas? I should be interested to hear from them on that.
before he has heard the evidence?                                I have already touched on SEN; how will the parents
                                                              of children with SEN make sure that their voices are
  Mr Stuart: I thank the shadow Secretary of State for        heard? I have talked about good examples in academies,
that intervention. Obviously, we will be taking evidence      but it could be that other schools do not think about
next week not only from him but from the head of              that issue sufficiently. I should particularly like to hear
Partnerships for Schools and from the Secretary of            from Ministers regarding children with SEN who may
State, so we will get more detail. In principle, I am         be suffering from permanent exclusion. What monitoring
absolutely clear that the Secretary of State did the right    will there be and who will have access to it? I support
thing. The shadow Secretary of State could show a little      the Bill and I hope that the Government will give
more humility in the House given the mess that was left       further consideration to the points I have made.
by Building Schools for the Future. He mentions the
700 schools, but he never mentions the dozens of schools
that, on his schedule, should have been built by the time     4.59 pm
he left power, but were not.
                                                                 Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): I
                                                              suppose that one could describe this as the education,
  Ed Balls: Will the hon. Gentleman give way?                 education, education moment for the new Government.
                                                              They have not called it that, but this is their flagship
  Mr Stuart: I do not have time. I must press on,             piece of legislation. The dramatic difference is that, in
because I will not get any extra time if I do.                1997, the new Labour Administration went straight for
                                                              a policy that would help the most underprivileged children
  Glenda Jackson: Will the hon. Gentleman give way?           in our society. The academy programme that emerged
                                                              later was targeted at the children in most need, at the
                                                              poorest towns and cities and at schools that were
   Mr Stuart: I have no time; it is strictly limited.         underperforming badly.
   If the Bill is to be on the statute book in a week’s
time, the House will have to improve its normal powers
                                                                Meg Hillier (Hackney South and Shoreditch) (Lab/
of scrutiny and the effectiveness with which it improves
                                                              Co-op): Does my hon. Friend agree that the proof of
Bills and the Government will likewise have to show
                                                              the pudding is in the eating? In Hackney, six new city
that they are listening as well as leading. Communities
                                                              academies have been built or are being built, and 84% of
and parents need to feel that academy freedoms are
                                                              pupils have gained five A to Cs in the one that has so far
something that they choose and not something that can
                                                              had results. Surely, that proves that the previous
be imposed on them. The Government’s concession in
                                                              Government’s policy was a good one.
clause 5 at least makes governing bodies consult those
whom they deem appropriate, but it is blunted by the
fact that they do not have to do so prior to applying to        Mr Sheerman: I am trying to be even-handed, but I
the Secretary of State and because they can do so even        take my hon. Friend’s point. Over 13 years, the Labour
after they have been issued with an academy order.            Government built more new schools and more new
Those consulted in such circumstances would have good         colleges and renewed more educational facilities than
grounds for feeling that they were participating in a         any Government in the history of our country. That
charade. I ask those on the Government Front Bench to         building programme is indisputable, whatever one thinks
consider that.                                                about BSF and whether if Labour had been returned,
51               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                   52

[Mr Sheerman]                                                 bureaucracy has become unbearable. Dealing with
                                                              bureaucracy may be one of the main incentives for
we would have had to tamp it down or ease it in over a        people to seek academy freedoms. Some of the work
much longer period. However, we can discuss that at           force have been demoralised by excessive bureaucracy
another time.                                                 and they may seek to alleviate it.
   The difference between what we did in 1997 and what
is proposed in the Bill did not come out in the speech           Mr Sheerman: I am afraid that I must disagree with
made by the Secretary of State. Why go for outstanding        the hon. Lady. I go into many schools, and one head will
schools? What is the magic of the outstanding school?         say, “I can’t do my job; I can’t cope; I can’t do anything,
The right hon. Gentleman referred to the work of the          because of the amount of bureaucracy, red tape and all
Children, Schools and Families Committee, saying that         that,” yet in an almost exactly similar school, with a
we wanted to free things up. Yes, we produced three           good leadership, the head will say, “Bureaucracy, red
strong reports that recommended giving schools more           tape. We skip over that. We run the school for the
control over the curriculum, taking away some of the          children. And that all comes later, and we deal with it.” I
testing and assessment and reducing the six levels of         am always suspicious, because I guarantee that the
school accountability. We said all those things, but we       House will spend time over the next years introducing
did so in the spirit of their being particularly important    all sort of things—health and safety, child protection
for all schools, not just the outstanding ones.               and child safety measures, and so on—and that we will
                                                              end up with more bureaucracy in schools. We will gladly
   I believe that the new Administration, like the previous
                                                              do both things at the same time.
one, want to do the best for every child in our country.
We only have one chance for education and both sides            Dr Pugh: Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
of the House—all three parties—want at heart to identify
the talent and potential of our children and push them           Mr Sheerman: May I continue for the moment?
as far as they can go. It is important that we start from
that basis, because when we look, as I have done, having         I worry about the speed at which the Bill is being
spent nearly 10 years as Chair of the Select Committee,       considered and the fact that the debates in Committee
over the past 20 or 30 years—a period that the Committee      will be constrained to three days. That makes the Bill
used to call “From Baker to Balls” or “From Butler to         look like a bit of panicky measure. A couple of interventions
Balls”—we can see that there are many more continuities       rather upset me. An hon. Gentleman—an old friend of
in education policy than we might think if we heard           mine—asked whether the policy was similar to that on
only rousing speeches from Front-Bench speakers on            grant-maintained status, as did another Back Bencher. I
either side.                                                  hope that the policy is not a reversion to that. If that is
                                                              all that it is—a return to the old grant-maintained
   There is a great danger in the Bill. Every Government      situation—I really believe that it is a backward step.
need to be able to deliver their policies, and I have never
known a policy be delivered by a demoralised work                Let us put all this into perspective. Sometimes, even
force. One of the secrets of our success over the last        among colleagues in the Tea Room, I ask, “How many
13 years was that gradually, with difficulty, we got the      secondary schools do you think there are in England?”
teachers on side, partly by paying them better than ever      and they often get it wildly wrong. There are 3,500, and
before, rewarding them and respecting them more. That         there are about 20,000 primary schools. Many people
was the secret of our success and I hope the new              do not know that. How many academies did we aim
Government will continue it.                                  for? Two hundred, rising to 400—between 5% and 6%
                                                              of secondary schools have academy status. It was a
   Another tremendous partnership is needed to deliver        pilot, which makes me wonder why it caused so much
policy—with the people who work in local government.          passion, even among Labour Members. Indeed, the
It is easy to say that they have only back-office functions   shadow Secretary of State was very passionately against
or unnecessary core functions, and that somebody else         academies at one stage in his career, early in the days
could do things better. Over the years, I have visited        when I was Chairman of the Select Committee. Academies
schools and local authorities around the country and I        were an interesting and successful pilot. They have not
found that the one thing most school leaders and most         been given enough time. On the freedoms that we gave
people in schools want is a good, supportive local            academies, yes, schools should be able to have that
authority that knows the system, supports schools,            status on licence if they meet the standard.
knows what the difficulties are and tries to do everything
it can to make the education system a success across the         I want to pursue another point. I, too, believe that the
piece. I am worried that the Bill will be atomising—there     most worrying part of the Bill is the bit about free
will be a direct relationship between a big central           schools. I can understand the argument for academies,
Department and schools, with no intermediary. The             and I know why the Government are doing this—I can
people who were the intermediaries—local government—          understand all that—but the question of free schools
have high skills and it would be sad if the Government        worries me indeed, not because of the suggestion that,
wasted them.                                                  somehow, the private sector will insidiously come in and
                                                              run our schools. The Labour Government used the
  Charlotte Leslie: The hon. Gentleman has put in a lot       private sector all the time in education. Of course, we
of work on education and has great expertise. On the          have to do so, and it is a healthy relationship: the private
point about demoralising the work force, in my work on        sector is a very good partner. It delivers all sorts of
education, where I may have more expertise, I have seen       things. We called it into a number of local authorities to
great demoralisation of head teachers and deputy heads        sort things out when they failed. So let us view the
because of the amount of bureaucracy they feel they           private sector as part of the solution and the answer,
have to do. The head teacher of Avonmouth primary             rather than thinking that it will come in through the
school, where I am a governor, says that the burden of        back door.
53               Academies Bill [Lords]                19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                    54

  I am worried about a different feature of free schools.       of State criticised the involvement of the private sector,
When Tony Blair was very keen on faith schools, those           but he, as the former Select Committee Chairman pointed
of us who looked at them were concerned about the               out, presided over the involvement of the private sector
way in which they were delivered too easily to people           in school provision and in local education authority
who just said, “I want a faith school,” because they            provision. I am entirely relaxed about the involvement
happened to have a certain brand of religion or to be a         of the private sector, where it is appropriate.
certain kind of Muslim or Christian. Without great                 More fundamentally than that, I have always taken
care, that way leads to a deal of disunity and the              the view that good, well-led schools benefit most if they
break-up of social cohesion in our towns and cities. I          have the maximum freedom and liberty to flourish,
would hate free schools to lead to that break-up. Baroness      without excessive bureaucratic intervention. One of the
Sharp put it very well in the other place when she said         main reasons why I take that view is that I represent a
that every area has a community of schools and that, if         constituency that has possibly the best state schools in
the legislation breaks up that community, we will put           the country, and nearly all the secondary schools were
ourselves in great danger of harming the unity of our           grant-maintained prior to the School Standards and
communities.                                                    Framework Act 1998. I sat on the Committee that
  Consultation with schools, pupils and parents is very         considered that Bill, and strongly opposed the Government’s
important, but it is still very weak under the Bill. The        efforts to remove grant-maintained status.
more I look at the Bill, the more concerned I am. We               There was a bit of banter earlier about the qualities
take so much notice of the governors of a school at one         of grant-maintained schools. My experience locally was
moment in time, but the school will go on for another           that they very much worked together. They took great
50 or 100 years. The school that I went to is, I think, still   pride in co-operating and built exactly the community
going after 500 years. The fact is that asking the question     of schooling and education to which Members on both
of one, small set of school governors today will bind in        sides of the House referred, but they did so because
a whole community, and the school at the centre of the          they wanted to, and because they saw that as part of
community. The community should have something to               what would bring greater success to their school, and
say about the future of education in that community.            better educational outcomes for the whole community.
  All the work that I have done in education has led me         I have always supported that. Now I find that the
to believe that we have to give schools a decent chance         enthusiasm in my constituency, in secondary schools in
of teaching a representative bunch of kids from the             particular, for the possibility of academy status is precisely
community—not all the poorest, not all the richest, but         because so many of them have a positive experience of
a good blend. Sometimes one has to be brave in how              grant-maintained status and would very much like to
one selects; sometimes one has to be very brave. People         see returned at least the freedoms that they enjoyed
should read the Sutton Trust report on how to handle            under it.
school admissions. The Committee that I chaired did                Having sat through the proceedings of the School
some very good work on admissions, and the schools              Standards and Framework Bill and served on its Standing
admissions scene has been transformed in the direction          Committee and those of other education Bills in previous
that we recommended. There will always be schools that          Parliaments, I was pleased when the previous Government
are better than others, and envy about not being able to        eventually saw the error of their ways. Having removed
get into those better schools. The Sutton Trust is right:       some freedoms from grant-maintained schools and moved
the only way to sort that out is to have a fair system of       on to foundation schools, which were more restrictive,
banding, and when there is high demand for school               they wanted to build on the academies model precisely
places, there should be admission by ballot.                    because they started to understand that greater freedom,
                                                                fewer restrictions and less bureaucracy for those schools
5.11 pm                                                         would be the way for them to continue to raise standards.
    Mr Graham Brady (Altrincham and Sale West) (Con):              The notion that one can create independent, state-funded
It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Huddersfield     schools is very radical, and my right hon. Friend rightly
(Mr Sheerman), the former Select Committee Chairman,            chided the Opposition for being conservative in their
who rightly gave full credit to Members on both sides of        response to the Bill. We are being radical: we are
the House for our commitment to furthering the interests        pushing forward measures that will not only free schools
of all children and ensuring the best in education. He          to become more successful, but start to break down the
raised concerns about the free schools policy, of which I       barriers—some have referred to it as an apartheid in the
am a strong advocate. I join my right hon. Friend the           education system—between the state and independent
Secretary of State in having visited a KIPP—knowledge           sectors. I would certainly welcome more independent
is power programme—academy in a very deprived                   schools choosing to enter the state sector as academies.
neighbourhood in Washington DC, where I saw tremendous
educational outcomes. It was one of the most exciting             Glenda Jackson: Is it really a radical policy? Surely
schools that I have ever visited. I want that kind of           the Government are proposing to take us back to the
provision and flexibility opened up in this country, so         bad old days of grammar schools and secondary schools.
that people have access to decent state schools, particularly   That will be the next step, because the new academies
people in communities that are too often deprived of            will have their own admissions policies, and they will
any such schools. That is one of the most exciting parts        enforce them through an entrance examination. Do we
of the Bill.                                                    really want to go back to that?
    I am delighted to support the widening of the academies
programme. Again, I have form on that issue, on which             Mr Brady: If only the hon. Lady were right. I am sure
I am entirely consistent. Perhaps it is a great vice of         she knows that I would very much like to go back to
mine, in politics, to be consistent. The former Secretary       exactly that system, because we have it in my constituency,
55               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                 56

[Mr Brady]                                                     courage of our convictions and see this as just the
                                                               beginning of what should be a truly radical, powerful
and that, I suspect, is why the schools in Trafford are        revolution that will lead to much better state education
better than those in her constituency. However, that is        in this country.
probably a debate for another day.
   Today, we have the questions of consistency and of          5.21 pm
real belief in what was proposed by the previous                  Pat Glass (North West Durham) (Lab): Coming from
Government and is now proposed by this Government.             my background, having worked for 25 years in education
I was the shadow Schools Minister at the time of the           and particularly in special educational needs, I am used
legislation that became the Education Act 2002, and at         to making decisions about children and young people
that point I was pleased that we, the then Opposition,         based upon what works for them and what is in their
looked at the Government’s proposals in an entirely            best interests, not upon ideology or my own philosophical
open-minded way, saw the benefits of the academies             beliefs. I am therefore concerned about the speed with
model being offered and welcomed it. In our critique           which the Bill is being rushed through the House and
and scrutiny of the then Government, we urged them to          the impact that that will have on children with special
go further, to have the courage of their convictions and       educational needs. I ask the Secretary of State, although
to ensure that more schools could benefit from the             he has left the Chamber, to think carefully about that
freedoms on offer. In that regard, the removal of the          matter.
requirement for a sponsor is an important step forward.
                                                                  Having examined the Bill in some detail, I do not
                                                               believe that there has been any detailed analysis of its
  Dr Pugh: The hon. Gentleman is making an interesting
                                                               impact on vulnerable children, particularly those with
contribution, but he used the expression “educational
                                                               special educational needs. I am particularly concerned
apartheid”. Under his analysis, and the legislation before
                                                               about two things, based on what we know about the
us, there will still be an educational apartheid: there will
                                                               small number of academies that currently exist. First,
be schools with freedoms, and schools with lesser freedoms
                                                               we know that that group of children has not had a good
or no freedom at all.
                                                               deal in admissions, accountability and exclusion. I am
                                                               concerned that if we increase the number of academies
   Mr Brady: I should like more and more schools to            massively without considering in detail the impact that
attain the outstanding status that will allow them to          it will have on that vulnerable group of children, we will
move more rapidly on to academy status, but a policy of        simply make the problem much greater.
greater freedom for schools that can exercise it well, in
the interests of their pupils, is clearly beneficial.             We know that the educational achievement of vulnerable
                                                               children—those with SEN, those living in care and
   At the time of the 2002 Act, we urged the Government        those living in poverty—is lower than the average in the
to go further, to accelerate their programme and to have       school population. Local authority managers of services
the courage of their convictions. As I look at the             such as admissions at least try to ensure that those
reasoned amendment, I really wish that the current             children are not systematically disadvantaged when it
Opposition had taken a similarly generous approach             comes to admission to good schools. By taking admissions
and been prepared to accept not only that there is             out of the hands of local authorities and handing them
enormous common ground in the proposals before us,             over to academies to administer on their own behalf, we
but that we had reached the point at which the previous        run the risk of taking any pretence of fairness out of
Labour Government and the Conservative party had               the system and systematically disadvantaging the already
recognised the real value in giving greater freedom and        disadvantaged.
flexibility to schools and more autonomy to good head
teachers.                                                         Currently, local authorities have no power to name
                                                               an academy on a statement of special educational needs,
   The previous Government were moving forward slowly          even when a parent particularly wants it and the local
but we want to move forward more quickly, and I really         authority that has assessed the needs of the child in
wish they would join us in that. Instead, in the discussions   question believes that the academy can meet that child’s
relating to the Bill, including by the shadow Secretary        needs. I have come across that a number of times as an
of State today, the Labour party has moved towards             assistant director, when I have looked carefully at a
seeing the whole purpose of the academies programme            child’s assessment and believed that an academy can
that it pursued as being about funding. It sees the            meet their needs, and when the parent particularly
importance of academies as being the insertion of a            wants their child to go to that academy, but the academy
sponsor, an outside partner, preferably investing a very       simply refuses to consider the point.
large sum in sponsorship to help fund the school.
Fundamentally, however, we see the central point of              Bill Esterson: Does my hon. Friend agree that another
academies as being the freedom that they provide. We           problem with the Bill is that the framework does not
understand the importance of allowing good heads,              require academies to have special educational needs
governing bodies and teachers to get on with their jobs        co-ordinators who are qualified, with appropriate training?
and teach.                                                     That is another weakness of the SEN provisions.
   I started by advising Members to be entirely consistent
and I will finish entirely consistently. Having spent the        Pat Glass: My hon. Friend is right. When will we
Committee and Report stages of what became the 2002            realise that children with special educational needs need
Act criticising the previous Government for being too          specialists? That is why they are special—they require
timid in their approach to academies and to giving good        specialists. It is foolish to say that anyone in a school
schools more freedom, I encourage my right hon. Friend         whom the head teacher chooses to act as an unqualified
the Secretary of State to demonstrate with vigour the          support assistant can take the part of an SEN co-ordinator.
57               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                   58

   Currently, cases where an academy decides that it             I am concerned about the accountability framework,
does not want to take a child or cannot meet the child’s      particularly for children with SEN. There is no clarity in
needs go to an adjudicator. That takes valuable time          the Bill on where a parent goes for redress if an academy
and seems designed to put off all but the most determined     fails to deliver on SEN, whether the child is statemented
parents. Parents of children with SEN already have            or not. Currently, parents can go to the local authority
difficult lives and we seem to be putting up additional,      if a school fails to deliver, and ultimately to the SEN
systematic barriers to prevent them from securing a           tribunal. If a school fails to deliver, a parent has redress
place at a local academy that they believe can meet their     through judicial review, but there is no clarity on whether
child’s needs. I fear that that will lead to selective        such redress will be available under the Bill, so parents
admissions through the back door in the new breed of          simply will not know where to go if an academy fails
academies and will make the situation that much worse         to deliver.
for so many more children.                                       It is unclear who will monitor the progress of SEN
                                                              children in academies. If we have learned anything in
  Mr Graham Stuart: The hon. Lady is making a                 the past 10 or 15 years, it is that when the spotlight is
persuasive case and I share some of her concerns. If my       put on the performance of vulnerable children, they
memory of the equalities impact assessment is correct,        improve. We have seen that with looked-after children.
existing academies take rather more statemented children      If there is no clarity on who is monitoring the performance
and those with school support and school support              of SEN children, they will simply be lost in the system.
plus—I think that I am getting my terminology wrong—             Before my voice packs up altogether, I shall move on
than the average school. On the evidence so far, it does      to exclusions. I have worked in a number of local
not look as if academies fail to take on their fair share     authorities, in each of which I have analysed permanent
of children with special needs.                               and fixed-term exclusions. The pattern is the same. In
                                                              my experience, 75% of children who are excluded on a
  Pat Glass: The picture varies throughout the country.       fixed-term or permanent basis have special educational
Some schools in some parts of the country take a larger       needs. Of those, my analysis shows that 100% have
percentage of children with special educational needs,        either behavioural difficulties linked to autistic spectrum
but some schools in other parts of the country—I think        disorder or attention deficit hyperactivity disorder.
that it is particularly true in London—do not. It is
                                                                 TreeHouse, a charity that works with children with
another postcode lottery. It depends on how good the
                                                              autism, has found that SEN children are nine times
system is across the piece.
                                                              more likely to be excluded from school, and the situation
                                                              is more acute in academies. If we massively increase the
   Mr Stuart: Does the hon. Lady think that the pupil         number of academies, we will increase the problem.
premium model might be useful in ensuring that children
from the poorest families have additional resources to           Andrew Percy: The hon. Lady makes a powerful
go with them, which in some ways makes them more              point, with which I have some sympathy, but she must
attractive to schools? Does she agree that a system that      also accept that the Bill gives schools the ability to tailor
provides incentives for schools to attract and look after     their curriculum much more. She will know that part of
the most vulnerable is better than one of bureaucratic        the problem of dealing with some of our more difficult
diktat and fiat that forces children on schools that are      children is that the curriculum is too restrictive for
reluctant to have them? Could not the former prove            them. The Bill will give schools more freedom, so it has
more productive in the end?                                   some positive aspects.
   Pat Glass: That is the problem—we simply do not               Pat Glass: I entirely agree that part of the exclusion
know. We have not got the detail. I do not know what          problem is the formalisation of the curriculum, which
the pupil premium will bring. I was talking to a head         in many cases happens far too early. However, my
teacher today who told me, “On the face of it, the            experience of academies does not give me hope. I do not
premium looks attractive. However, I suspect that when        expect that vast numbers of academies will amend the
I get it, I will actually use the standards fund and lose     curriculum to meet the needs of SEN children. Which
additional educational needs funding. I may end up            children are failing? The gap between those who achieve
with less, not more funding for my vulnerable children.”      the most and those at the bottom is greatest at outstanding
That is the problem. The devil is in the detail and we do     or high-achieving schools. Although I welcome freedom
not have the detail. The Bill is being rushed through,        in the curriculum, I have no hope that it will be used for
without giving us the opportunity to look at those            SEN children.
matters.                                                         The proposals in the Bill are not well thought out and
   I am concerned that academies will be reluctant to         they are likely to adversely affect the education and life
admit vulnerable children because, through no fault of        chances of children with SEN. They will make the
their own, they do not perform as well as their peers.        already difficult lives of children and parents harder,
The likelihood of vulnerable children gaining admission,      and they will become part of the problem, not part of
particularly to outstanding schools, will therefore be        the solution. I ask simply that we take the time to look
reduced. I could see nothing in the Bill—I have looked        at the Bill in relation to the most vulnerable children in
at it carefully—about making the admission of vulnerable      our society. If we take that time, the chances are that we
children a must. I know only too well that telling head       will make the Bill that much better for that many more
teachers and governors that they should admit is very         children.
different from telling them that they must do so. I would
like further reassurances that academies’ admissions            The Minister of State, Department for Education
policies will ensure that children with special educational   (Mr Nick Gibb): May I refer the hon. Lady to clause 1(7),
needs are not disadvantaged.                                  which strengthens the position of children with special
59               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                  60

[Mr Nick Gibb]                                                  The Bill suggests that simply calling schools academies
                                                              without the dosh will work some special magic. I am
educational needs compared with what it was when the          personally intrigued by this relabelling exercise. There
previous Government were in power? Under the Bill,            may be a day when simply calling an institution a
academies are on the same footing as maintained schools.      “school” might be some sort of insult or an indication
                                                              of failure. I do not know whether other hon. Members
  Pat Glass: They are on the same footing in terms of         have read Evelyn Waugh’s “Decline and Fall” but in it
funding, but we have no guarantees about what that            the hapless Paul Pennyfeather seeks a teaching job
funding means. That is what I meant by the problem            through an agency having been expelled from Oxford.
with the detail. The Bill talks about funding without         He is told by the man at the agency:
going into the details and saying what it means. What is        “We class schools…into…Leading School, First-rate School,
the pupil premium and does it affect additional educational   Good School and School. Frankly…School is pretty bad”.
needs funding? Who will be responsible for non-statemented
                                                              Interestingly enough, Waugh’s unfortunate character
pupils? All those details are simply not in the Bill.
                                                              Paul Pennyfeather was expelled from Oxford for indecency,
5.34 pm                                                       having been de-bagged by drunken members of what
                                                              Waugh calls the Bollinger Club. There is a slight resonance
    Dr John Pugh (Southport) (LD): Nobody in the              in that.
Chamber has ever argued that good government benefits
by legislating in a hurry—nobody sane at any rate—and            There is no particularly persuasive evidence that a
nobody in education has ever believed that the best time      plethora of independent academies produces better
to consult schools and parents is during the school           outcomes than a network of schools organised by a
holidays, so the puzzle is this: why is the Secretary of      good local authority. Studies of parallel arrangements
State making us stay in and, at some haste, pass this         in Sweden and the USA have been similarly inconclusive.
legislation, when pressing matters such as reviews of         They are not the ringing endorsement that the Secretary
discipline, special needs and so on need to be undertaken?    of State described, and those who are well informed
Why this sudden and seemingly unjustified imposition,         know that only too well.
when there appear, on the face of it, to be more pressing
                                                                 Vernon Coaker (Gedling) (Lab): Does the hon.
things to do?
                                                              Gentleman find it interesting that in the debates that
    The Secretary of State is, I believe, extraordinarily     have taken place so far on the Academies Bill there has
well intentioned, dedicated, polite and considerate, and      been little reference to the evidence pointing to the
he is keener to convince than to coerce, but on this issue    opposite conclusion to that arrived at by Government
he seems to be possessed by a messianic enthusiasm            on free schools or charter schools? Even more remarkably,
characteristic of Tony Blair—in fact, he admitted as          there has been little reference to the equality impact
much in the debate—who, let it be said, never let             assessment published alongside this Bill, which demonstrates
practical problems cloud pleasing prospects. I find it        some serious concerns about achievements in academies
perfectly understandable that the new Secretary of State,     with respect to special needs pupils, girls and ethnic
not content with simply running his Department well,          minorities. I am not against academies, but I would
wants to make his mark. The way that is customarily           have thought that those conclusions would suggest to a
done is by introducing legislation—legislating for change.    Government who were not acting with such haste that
The easiest thing that a Schools Minister can do is           they should proceed with some caution.
change the governance of schools. It is what Education
Ministers most commonly do—although not necessarily              Dr Pugh: The shadow Minister has the advantage of
what they do best—so we have had comprehensives,              me. I do know that there are a number of studies of
direct grant schools, city technology colleges, grant-        charter schools in the United States, and that some are
maintained schools, specialist schools and academies.         for and some against. The meta-analysis is inconclusive.
There are many variations.                                    It does not show that charter schools necessarily produce
    Ministers argue at every twist and turn that each         the wholesale educational improvement that the Secretary
latest new governance proposal will eradicate bad schools,    of State mentioned in his contribution.
bad teaching and poor pupil performance. If only it              There is no evidence that schools with all their current
were that easy. Addiction to academies is simply the          freedoms—and the ordinary council school has much
latest manifestation of this tendency. The Blair/Adonis       more freedom than it ever used to have—feel oppressed
academies demonstrated the well known truth that if a         rather than supported by local authorities. However, as
school has a fresh start, plenty of money, new staff and      has been said several times today, there is ample evidence
a lovely building, it will produce at least a temporary       that they are sick to death of the bureaucratic overload
fillip in results. What those academies did not demonstrate   imposed by the Department and Ministers. It is downright
—as hon. Members must know—is that academy                    shoddy and unfair to suggest that schools can only be
governance and its freedoms made any difference whatever.     released from the bullying and bossiness of central
    I recommend that Members study carefully the National     Government if they break their relationship with the
Audit Office report on academies. It showed conclusively      local authority. It is dishonest to suggest that academy
that academies in deprived areas produced no better           status is about addressing underperformance, when it is
results than the previous Excellence in Cities programme      those who overperform who are to be fast-tracked and
and at much greater cost. I really do instruct Members        those in the leafy suburbs who are most likely to apply.
to get hold of that report, read it carefully and see that
what made the difference was the funding, not the               Ian Mearns: Does the hon. Gentleman agree that, in
governance. Tellingly too, that report leaves out the         regard to the other part of the coalition, the cat is out of
effect on neighbouring schools. It does not even take         the bag, in that some Conservative Members regard
that into consideration as a problem.                         academy status as grant-maintained status reinvented,
61               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                  62

and as a sort of promised land towards which they have           Annette Brooke (Mid Dorset and North Poole) (LD):
been working? Part of the underlying problem is that,          Does my hon. Friend share my concern that, although
with money for services such as special educational            the Bill now has an amendment on consultation, the
needs, and school improvements in particular, being            desired aim to turn some schools into academies by
dragged back from local education authorities, schools         September seems totally consistent with those words
that are already regarded as outstanding and excellent         and with what might happen in real life?
will be taking from local authorities money that would
otherwise be used to improve other schools, which there           Dr Pugh: Having worked in schools for a large part of
will no longer be the capacity to do.                          my life, and knowing the degree of organisation required
                                                               during the summer recess to prepare for the new term,
   Dr Pugh: To a certain extent, it seems to be a case of      I find it distinctly improbable that any such schools will
“to those that have, shall be given”. It is also highly        be ready to run on a completely different footing in
unlikely that parents in the most deprived areas, where        September. The Minister clearly disagrees, and I defer
attainment is low, will have the skills, the capacity or the   to his knowledge of how things might go. I have to rely
conviction to set up their own schools. Free schools will      on my own experience in these circumstances, however.
probably be created elsewhere, in areas that are already       I have to emphasise that there is a big difference between
stocked with quite decent and reasonable schools.              legislation for a pet project, which we have seen many
   Even if we can force ourselves to ignore the slim           times in this House, particularly in the Blair years, and
evidence and the implausibility of some of the arguments,      mature and considered legislation, and it revolves around
we should not blind ourselves to the risks involved.           whether it is properly handled in this place.
Those risks have been mentioned here and in the other             Bill Esterson: Is the hon. Gentleman aware that schools
place. They include the risk of a two-tier education           in his constituency and mine have made inquiries about
system—the word “apartheid” has been used—and the              academy status and that one head teacher in his constituency
risk of knock-on consequences for other schools. A             commented that the whole process was a shambles?
number of Members have also mentioned the risks to             Does not that underline his point about the haste with
special educational needs and support services. I also         which this legislation is being carried out?
invite Members to inspect the Bill’s treatment of charity
law, which could create the risk of profiteering skewing          Dr Pugh: It is not yet a shambles, but I welcomed the
schooling at some time in the future. There is also a risk     intervention from the Chairman of the Select Committee,
of diminished public accountability for a public resource,     suggesting that there is a proper and appropriate way to
and an enormous risk in the current circumstances,             proceed with an important piece of legislation like this.
with the £150 billion deficit, that we might lose economies    I do not think that we have yet hit on that way here.
of scale and consequently spend more money to less             What is the best I can say of this legislation? It does not
effect. Furthermore, we might have to bear the huge            remind me of the new politics; it reminds me—though
capital cost of providing extra buildings while under-using    Opposition Members might not want to hear this—of
the present buildings in an anarchic, unplanned education      new Labour. That should give us cause for concern in
market.                                                        this corner of the House.
   Steve Baker (Wycombe) (Con): My hon. Friend seems           5.46 pm
to be constructing an argument that freedom is a bad
thing. He has described a number of risks, and yes,               Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East
there are risks, but surely life involves risk. Does he not    Cleveland) (Lab): We have heard excellent speeches
agree that the word “liberal” is derived from “liberty”?       from both sides of the House, but I rise with feelings of
I find it confusing and surprising that he is making such      real unease about the proposals in this Bill. My unease
a strong case against liberty.                                 is real as my constituents’ children will be denied the
                                                               promise, via Building Schools for the Future funding,
   Dr Pugh: I have never thought that liberalism had           of a new secondary school in the town of Guisborough.
anything to do with precipitate, foolish and unresearched      This school is already the largest on Teesside and, under
activity. I am not in any way suggesting that that is what     BSF, it would have partnered a state-of-the-art special
we have here, but I am saying that there are valid             needs school on the same campus, serving the whole of
reasons for an essentially rational liberal to make fair       East Cleveland. My unease is also real because the Bill
and cautious points about where we might be going              contains provisions to allow new, highly dubious and
with this, and to want to be assured that what we are          experimental schools to flourish, while schools like the
doing will have the consequences that we expect.               Laurence Jackson, which has given decades of service
   There are risks involved, many of which have been           to our local community, are being actively undermined
voiced in the other place as well as here. To be fair,         by the Con-Dem coalition.
Ministers have tried to forestall those risks, privately          I also feel anger as these new academies will be
and publicly, and to placate people with their mellifluous     allowed to flourish in a deliberate attempt to marginalise
tones. I welcome that and I accept it; it is a good thing,     old, long-established local education authorities. Indeed,
as it encourages rational discourse. But, however convinced    the new academies will also flourish at the real expense
or unconvinced we might be, what negates all those             of the equally long-established and highly regarded
assurances and soothing words, and what gives the              diocesan school structure, which gave the Church of
game away and convinces me that this is a semblance,           England and the Roman Catholic community a direct
and a rational coating perhaps disguising an unbending         input into education.
ideology—although I hope not—and a visceral dislike               I am particularly concerned about the Bill’s implications
of local authorities, is not the words that Ministers have     for the further growth of faith schools—in the context
used but the haste with which they have moved.                 of the recent history of academies, this really means
63               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                    64

[Tom Blenkinsop]                                              it or separately from it. The same applies to self-governing
                                                              further education and sixth-form colleges. The National
fundamentalist Christian groups—and their ability to          Governors Association, the National Grammar Schools
deploy significant funds to endow academies. In my            Association, the Catholic board of education and many
constituency, we already have the King’s academy, based       major charities are now urging the coalition to slow
in the Middlesbrough estate of Coulby Newham. That            down their consultation for precisely that reason. Indeed,
school was the brainchild of the Vardy Foundation,            the Liberal Democrat Education Association opposes
which I would describe as an evangelist group. To its         the Bill.
credit, the foundation adheres to the national curriculum        None of those organisations asked for the Bill, and I
at the King’s academy—and in other schools it controls—       suspect that, with good reason, they will be wary and
although it has in the past hit local authority headlines     fearful of what may result from it. It could lead to the
for things such as allegedly banning “Harry Potter”           creation of religious academies which, unlike maintained
books from the school library. The King’s academy is          faith schools, would lack the moderating and sensible
popular with parents—partly, I believe, because it still      constraints and influence of local communities. Such
organises its classes around the national curriculum.         academies would be separate from society, big or otherwise.
However, this Bill removes that condition. Although I         Unamended and without clarification, the Bill would
do not believe that the Vardy Foundation will change its      allow academies run by religious groups to devise and
stance, the ability to do so is entrenched by this Bill.      use their own curriculums, to the exclusion of arguments
   Put simply, this deregulation of public education will     and facts that might question the minority beliefs of
significantly increase the power and influence of any         those groups. Some provisions might well allow academies
fringe movement. Worse still, these changes may turn          to discriminate against children in their admissions
out to be irreversible, entrenching views held by only a      policies on the basis of their perception of parental beliefs.
small minority and allowing them to be propagated.               As I said earlier, mainstream faith schools will be
                                                              fearful of some of the ideas contained in the Bill. Some
   Steve Baker: Speaking as a committed Christian, I          of its provisions could ride roughshod over them.
am most surprised to hear the hon. Gentleman talking          Clause 5(8) would force a state-maintained school with
in these terms about minorities. If Conservative Members      a religious character—a faith school—automatically to
spoke in these terms about different minorities, I am         become an independent school with that religious character.
sure he would be quick to condemn us. Although I am a         It would permanently remove any possibility that state-
committed Christian, I spent yesterday evening in the         funded religious schools could choose to become inclusive
mosque. I was happy to be there with those gentlemen;         academies. Such draconian and one-sided powers would
I get on terribly well with them. I ask the hon. Gentleman    remove any element of choice and freedom from the
to use more moderate language in his description of           existing school governing body, and thus run counter to
Christians. I think Christians in this country have had       the parts of the Bill that refer to increasing the autonomy
enough; they deserve to be treated with the same sort of      of schools.
respect that the hon. Gentleman would expect for any             The dialectic between appearance and reality seems
minority.                                                     to be a recurring theme in the coalition Government.
                                                              When it comes to consultation, they give the appearance
   Tom Blenkinsop: Speaking as a Christian myself—a           of thoughtful, reticent appreciation of the opinions of
Roman Catholic Christian—I take the hon. Gentleman’s          all who will potentially be involved, while in reality—in
words into account. However, I am not making any              contravention of the procedure for potentially controversial
allegations about minorities; I am talking about checks       legislation—the Bill was introduced in the House of Lords
and balances for all minorities with respect to other         and then rushed through, and is likely to be given even
minorities.                                                   less time in this place. Indeed, the Secretary of State’s
                                                              insistence that its passage must be completed before the
   Put simply, the deregulation of public education will      summer recess may mean only four days of scrutiny.
significantly increase the power and influence of any            Will the coalition trot out the same old mantras? Will
fringe movement. Worse still, as I said, these changes        they say that this is necessary because of the deficit, or
may turn out to be irreversible, entrenching views held       that it is the new politics of radical reform? That is more
by only a small minority, allowing them to be propagated      than likely. The “words of appearance” will give birth to
to young and impressionable children under the veil of        a reality of fringe interests. Representatives of such
accepted educational practice. Such potential developments    interests, often with deep pockets, will muscle in on the
fill me with great fear. I can see the perverse realisation   people’s education system, presumably at the expense of
of young children, some of primary age, being taught          the pay, terms and conditions of workers in that system.
or indoctrinated with views that border on the near              Professional school support staff play a vital role in
fanatic—and possibly in totally unsuitable premises.          every school, although they are often part-time and
There are also curriculum-related concerns about such         low-paid. As a result of the Bill, school support staff as
matters as the teaching of creationism, and the total         well as teachers would be directly employed by the new
absence of any compulsion to ensure that elements of          academies. That would take staff outside nationally
personal, social or health education are taught. I believe    agreed and recognised pay and conditions, leaving them
that some clauses will serve as a Trojan horse in that        much more vulnerable to cuts, poor working conditions
regard.                                                       and, fundamentally, uncertainty. Support staff would
   Earlier, I referred to maintained schools that are         not be covered by the new School Support Staff Negotiating
managed by their respective dioceses. I should say that I     Body, which has been developed over several years to
am a product of Roman Catholic primary, secondary             deliver long-awaited fairness and consistent, decent equal
and sixth-form education. Those schools worked in             pay for classroom support work that has increased in
harmony with the local education authority, not against       terms of both scope and demand.
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   Kwasi Kwarteng (Spelthorne) (Con): Does the hon.              The country, and even the coalition Government, can
Gentleman believe that the content of the Bill differs        live with co-operative forms of enterprise. The Government
significantly from legislation produced and speeches          could even float the concept as a way of managing
made by the former Prime Minister, the former Member          former central or local state provision. If a state can
for Sedgefield?                                               ensure our children’s education with car dealers, carpet
                                                              salesmen and other wider commerce, why should it not
   Tom Blenkinsop: The point is that we do not know.          do the same with the democratically elected expression
Because of the pace at which we are dealing with the          of working people, the trade union movement?
Bill, we do not know what some elements of it actually
                                                                 I look forward to the Minister’s response to the
mean. We have no definitive evidence. Members on
                                                              points that I have made.
both sides of the House have gone into some detail, but
have not provided enough specificity for us to discuss it.
                                                              5.57 pm
   Many support staff, unlike teachers, are not paid
during the school holidays. The SSSNB was given cross-           Charlotte Leslie (Bristol North West) (Con): I shall
party support in the Apprenticeships, Skills, Children        try to be brief, as we keep being reminded that time is of
and Learning Act 2009, and has a broad range of school,       the essence. I believe in quality, not length, when it
local authority, religious and employee representation.       comes to debate.
The Bill would effectively transfer workers to the private       I understand the points made by Opposition Members,
sector, unilaterally, without due consultation or             but I think we should recognise that we are discussing
consideration. It has the potential to undermine the          yet another reform of the education system because
previous consensual approach of all parties to the creation   there is a problem. There is a two-tier system. Our
of the SSSNB. That is certainly not an indication of the      schools have gone down the ranks in terms of international
“new politics”.                                               comparison, and the poorest in our society have borne
   However, despite my obvious criticism—and if we            the brunt. We have the biggest gap between private and
are to take the coalition Government at their word—we         state education anywhere in the world. As has already
can agree that there may be merits in widening the            been pointed out today, only 45 of the 80,000 children
educational family beyond the tried and tested mainstream     receiving free school meals have gone to Oxbridge. That
of the LEA. In the past, academies have had a variety         worries Members on this side of the House as well as
of sponsors. Some, to which I have referred, have had a       Opposition Members. Another problem is that those
particular religious conviction. Some have been part of       who have money can buy into a good state school, while
higher education—for instance, Teesside university, which     those who are ideologically opposed to private schools
is committed to becoming a partner in the sponsorship         can spend the equivalent of private school fees by
of Freeborough college, in the East Cleveland part of         moving into the catchment area of a state school, often
my constituency. The NHS is also involved, but most           a faith school.
sponsors have come from commercial business, although
given the coalition’s recent pace and predilection, the         Mr David Lammy (Tottenham) (Lab): The hon. Lady
NHS may join the long list of private enterprises.            said that our schools were performing less well on the
Commercial business sponsors range from Lord Harris,          OECD list. Does she accept that, using the same
of carpet warehouse fame, to companies such as the United     comparison earlier, the Secretary of State did not
Learning Trust, which has links with major public schools,    acknowledge that since the break-up of the Soviet
and firms such as Vodafone, Barclays and Honda (UK).          Union a number of states have entered the system, and
   If representatives of one side of society and commerce     that the Soviet Union had a fairly good education
can be partners in schools, what about those on the           system?
other side? I should be fascinated to hear the Minister’s
reaction to a new concept that I want to float. I simply        Charlotte Leslie: The right hon. Gentleman has made
suggest that the Trades Union Congress, or individual         an interesting point, which I will take on board.
TUC unions, be encouraged to set up a trade union
school or schools. We might also ask representatives of          Kwasi Kwarteng: The Soviet Union dissolved in 1991,
the co-operative movement—an organisation that was            but my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State was
dedicated to mutualism, harmony and fairness centuries        talking about comparisons between 1999 and today.
before Cameron’s “big society”road to Damascus—whether        I just wanted to put that on the record.
they would be interested in being part of a wider
educational family.                                              Charlotte Leslie: My hon. Friend makes a point that I
   The trade unions have a long history of propagation        was not going to make for the sake of making progress
of adult education through institutions such as Ruskin        in my comments, but I thank him very much for that
college in Oxford. The TUC still has its own education        clarification.
department, and individual trade unions, with TUC                Some clarification is required in respect of the Bill as
encouragement and help from local learning and skills         well. There is not some kind of compulsion whereby
councils, have developed successful and widespread union      politicians are driving schools to claim these freedoms.
learning campuses in workplaces where they have               The Bill simply seeks to lift the lid on the ambition,
recognition agreements. The co-operative movement is          desire and passion that already exists, such as in outstanding
historically associated with early socialist Sunday schools   schools whose head teachers have said to me, “Isn’t it
designed to give children a broader view of the world         amazing that if I was at a bad school I’d be able to get
than could be obtained through Victorian churches,            the freedoms I want to run my school, but we are just
and even today it helps to sponsor educational development    doing too well to have them?” The Bill removes that
in parts of the developing world where it sources food        perverse incentive, and it enables parents and—to mention
for consumers.                                                a group that we have not discussed enough in our
67               Academies Bill [Lords]                19 JULY 2010               Academies Bill [Lords]                     68

[Charlotte Leslie]                                                 It is important not to see this Bill in isolation. We
                                                                cannot solve everything through structural reform alone.
debate—teachers to act: it enables parents and ideologically    It is certainly part of the equation, but we need to
driven teachers who want to help the most vulnerable in         remember that there are far more measures in the
our society by starting small schools, along the lines of       coalition manifesto that tackle standards issues—and
the American charter schools, in those communities              standards issues in respect of struggling, weak schools.
that most need them.                                            If we were to see this Bill alone as the sole coalition
   Many of the people who express an interest about             offering on education, some of the concerns expressed
this subject to me are those very teachers. They are the        from Opposition Members might carry more weight,
kinds of teachers who may be involved in Teach First            but it does not stand alone. We also have reforms for
and the Future Leaders programme. They are people               improving discipline in struggling schools, which is one
who desperately want to improve the lot of those children       of the things that makes teaching in such schools so
who are on free school meals in the most deprived parts         very difficult. Also, the pupil premium will send money
of our communities. It deserves a little more recognition       directly to those children who most need it; of course
in this debate that the Bill aims to lift the lid on passion,   there is work to be done on that, but that is what this
belief and desire that already exist to improve education.      House exists to do.
It is not about compulsion; that is not what we on these           One development that I find particularly concerning,
Benches are all about.                                          and scandalous, is that over the past 10 years pupil
   I understand the concern felt on the Opposition              referral units have become repositories for children with
Benches that it is the good schools that will benefit from      special educational needs at the same time as special
academy status. I would share those concerns if very            schools have been closed. I know no one wanted that to
substantial amounts of capital investment were to be            come about, but the House must address that tendency,
going into those very good schools, but that is not the         and I hope the added responsibility on new academies
case. The good news is that there can be improvement            to take care of children with SEN will improve the
without enormous injections of taxpayers’ money—after           situation. I also hope that some of the measures we will
13 years, that obviously comes as very good news to all         be taking forward will look at pupil referral units alongside
Members. That improvement will allow good head teachers         other society and voluntary organisations that can perform
who lead outstanding schools to have the freedom to             that function better.
innovate, and also to offer their innovations to struggling
schools. One aspect of the Bill that I particularly welcome        Shabana Mahmood (Birmingham, Ladywood) (Lab):
is that it will not only encourage but require good             The hon. Lady says the coalition is very concerned to
schools that take on academy status to link up, not with        remove disadvantage within our education system. If
outstanding schools as the shadow Secretary of State            that is the case, why is it that under these proposals the
rather oddly implied, but with the weakest schools that         first schools to become academies will be those that are
most need that help. That point needs reiterating.              already deemed to be outstanding?
   Another aspect of the Bill that should be highlighted           Charlotte Leslie: As I have said, if this involved a
is the fact that, for the first time, academy proprietors       huge capital investment going to those outstanding
and sponsors will be subject to freedom of information          schools, I would not be standing here defending the Bill;
legislation. Freedom of information has, of course,             instead, I would be pretty horrified. The point is, however,
made the past year and a bit extremely rocky for this           that schools that are outstanding have proved their
House, but, all in all, I think it is an extremely good         worth; they know what they are doing and they are
thing and I am extremely pleased that that kind of              doing it well. It is a very easy and simple step to say to
public accountability will apply to academies and free          those head teachers who are doing well that, with
schools so that we have a proper test of whether they           measures of accountability, they should carry on and
are actually doing what we want and expect them to do.          share their best practice. We would like such freedoms
   I was around in the corridors of this House—although         to be extended to all schools, but that has to be done
not as a Member, and nor, alas, in the corridors of             within an accountable structure.
power—when the Education and Inspections Act 2006
was making its progress as a Bill, and I remember that             Bill Esterson: Does the hon. Lady agree that outstanding
when the concept of trust schools was first floated there       schools need help less than schools in lower categories?
was a huge amount of sincere panic on the Labour                If she does, does she think it is right that it is outstanding
Benches that that would open the floodgates and that it         schools that are getting the help, not the schools below
would be the end of the educational world and we                those categories?
would all be going to hell in a handcart because local
authorities would not be able to control schools as they           Charlotte Leslie: I will repeat what I said before—and
had previously. Now, four years on, has the world               also just note that it is interesting and very pleasing
ended? No. Four years on, has trust status enabled              that the hon. Gentleman uses the word “help” in that that
Orchard school in my constituency to link up as a trust         suggests that he agrees with Government Members that
with the Bridge learning campus, which is driving very          granting freedom to schools is in fact helpful. However,
good improvements? Yes it has. Therefore, I say to              I repeat the point that this is not loading resources that
Opposition Members that there was a lot of panic                could go to a school that is struggling onto a school that
about the 2006 Act, and I also suspect that a lot of what       is not struggling. This is lifting the lid on ability, ambition,
is being said now is conjecture and expressions of fear         desire and aspiration that already exists, and enabling
about the liberation of forces that are not Government          that to come out and flow into those schools that most
forces. I hope that alleviates some of the concerns             need it. I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention,
among those on the Opposition Benches.                          however.
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  I shall now conclude, as the House always hears enough           In most cases the academies have so far been very
of talking. A key point comes out of the idea that we           positive, and for a number of reasons: their freedom to
can only have improvement through capital investment            innovate, the positive involvement of their sponsors,
and rebranding. I have heard concerns that there will be        and their focus on good leadership in our schools. I do
an enormous amount of expenditure on rebranding                 not accept the argument of the hon. Member for Southport
those outstanding schools that become academies, but            (Dr Pugh) that it was just about the funding, although
we are not going to do a rebranding exercise and then           that was certainly a factor. There is a big difference
expect that alone to be the change and do nothing else.         between autonomy for schools, which I absolutely support,
There will be no massive investment in a rebranding             and isolation of individual schools. We need to achieve
that does not actually effect change.                           a combination of autonomy and partnership between
  All in all, I welcome the Bill. It is real action—it is not   different schools if we are to produce a high-quality
money spent merely on rebranding—and it liberates the           system, and that is not just about structures.
knowledge of professionals and also the desire of                  My second concern, freedom, was eloquently discussed
professionals to improve children’s lives and opportunities     by my hon. Friend the Member for Huddersfield
that I believe has been stifled for far too long.               (Mr Sheerman). If these freedoms do work—by and
                                                                large, they do—why do we not apply them to all schools?
6.8 pm                                                          I have not heard a convincing argument from the
   Stephen Twigg (Liverpool, West Derby) (Lab/Co-op):           Conservatives and Liberal Democrats as to why this
I am delighted to follow the hon. Member for Bristol            legislation applies first and foremost to schools that are
North West (Charlotte Leslie), who made a constructive          already outstanding, rather than seeking to apply some
and reflective speech.                                          of these freedoms to all schools.
   The starting point when thinking about the Second
                                                                  Mr Gibb: The hon. Gentleman will of course remember
Reading of this Bill is to consider what are the keys to
                                                                that the Secretary of State wrote to all schools inviting
success for schools reform. We must consider the impact
                                                                them to apply for academy status.
of reform on the following: the quality of leadership in
our schools; the standards of teaching and learning in
our schools; and the achievement gaps that we know still           Stephen Twigg: Indeed he did, but my understanding
scar our system both within schools and between schools.        is that there will be a fast track for schools that are
                                                                already outstanding. In responding to me earlier, the
   I want to set out six areas of concern. The first of         Secretary of State rightly said—I will return to this
them echoes a concern raised by the Select Committee            point—that there are many outstanding schools in deprived
Chair, the hon. Member for Beverley and Holderness              communities, but we know that on average, most
(Mr Stuart), who described himself as a “structural             outstanding schools have lower levels of children with
change sceptic”. I agree with him: it is wrong that             free school meals and of children with special educational
structures are so often put first. We on the Labour             needs. I therefore want the Government to consider
Benches sometimes did that when we were in government,          whether it is right to give this fast-track prioritisation to
and I think this Bill repeats the error. I think the key to     outstanding schools.
success in education is the quality of the people involved—
the quality of the head teacher and of the rest of the             The provision in the Bill dealing with schools in
leadership team in a school, the quality of parental            special measures leads me to worry about the schools in
engagement, and, of course, the quality of the learning         the middle. If we have academies that are aimed at the
of the young people themselves.                                 outstanding schools, and academies—the Labour academies
                                                                and those that fit into the second category in the Bill—aimed
   The example of Mossbourne community academy in               at schools in the most challenging circumstances, what
Hackney is rightly often cited. It is a wonderful, brilliant    about the schools in neither of those categories? We
school and a great advertisement for academies. One of          need to consider that issue in more detail in Committee.
the main reasons for its success is its principal, Michael
Wilshaw, who was previously at St Bonaventure’s, a                 My third concern, which has already been set out by
Roman Catholic school in Newham, where he achieved              other Members, is the speed—the haste—with which
a similarly remarkable transformation. I make that              this proposal is being taken forward. In the excellent
point to emphasise that, first and foremost, it is about        debates on the Bill in the other place, Lord Turnbull,
the individuals and the personal skills that they bring,        who chairs Dulwich college, an academy sponsor in
rather than the structures.                                     Kent, made a strong case for that view, and I hope the
                                                                House will bear with me if I quote him:
   In Labour’s academy programme—as others, including
my right hon. Friend the Member for Morley and                     “The granting of academy status should be seen not just as a
Outwood (Ed Balls), have said—our starting point was            reward for past achievement but as an opportunity for future
                                                                improvement. Candidates should not be invited to write a ‘Yes
schools that serve some of the most deprived communities        please, me too’ letter, of which we have had a thousand already;
in our country. I had the privilege to serve as Minister        they should be required to reflect on how they can turn these
for Schools for three years in Tony Blair’s second term,        freedoms to advantage. They should think about their governance
and one of the things I was responsible for was the             structures rather than simply carrying on with existing boards
London challenge, which addressed disadvantage and              that were created in a different regime. The opportunity to bring
the failure of schools in some parts of our capital city.       in new sponsors with new ideas must not be skipped…An aspiring
Academies were absolutely central to strategy that we           academy…needs to think through afresh its ethos, the curriculum
                                                                that it offers, its policies on a huge range of issues…A school
pursued in London. However, it was about not just               cannot do a thorough job of preparing its prospectus in that time,
academies but strengthening school leadership, Teach            let alone get it approved by the department and the as yet
First—the hon. Member for Bristol North West referred           non-existent regulator. We should not be encouraging schools to
to that—and effective networks between schools sharing          skimp on this important work.”—[Official Report, House of
professional best practice.                                     Lords, 7 June 2010; Vol. 719, c. 537.]
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[Stephen Twigg]                                               200 academies. I am concerned that, as my right hon.
                                                              Friend the Member for Morley and Outwood said, this
   I echo those words of Lord Turnbull, and I want to         Bill could massively centralise power over schools in the
illustrate the point further with three examples from my      hands of the Secretary of State. We need to look at a
own constituency. Schools feel that they are being rushed     renewed role for local government in education, but
into a decision without all the information being available   without turning the clock back to the days of local
to them, and this links to the earlier decision to end the    authorities running schools; I do not think anyone is
Building Schools for the Future programme. De La              arguing for that.
Salle is a Catholic boys’ school in Croxteth, in a very          In the other place, Lord Baker made the case for local
deprived part of my constituency. It is an outstanding        authorities taking a lead role on special educational
school, according to Ofsted, and was due to become an         needs. That is important. Local authorities can have a
academy under BSF, so its BSF money is currently              strategic role, as my right hon. Friend the Member for
under review. It wants to know whether it is going to get     Morley and Outwood said, in commissioning places.
its investment.                                               The local behaviour partnerships that are due to come
   Just next door to that school is St John Bosco, a          in this year should go ahead, and local authorities have
Catholic girls’ school that was a sample school under         a key strategic role to play in that regard.
BSF. It, too, is an outstanding school in a deprived             Over-hasty legislation is rarely good legislation. This
community. Its head, whom I saw on Saturday, is wondering     Bill potentially takes the excellent academies programme
whether she should apply for academy status in order to       in the wrong direction. More freedom is a positive
get the money the school was going to get under BSF.          thing, but it should be for all schools—unless there are
   A third example, Holly Lodge school, in West Derby—a       good reasons not to give it—rather than just for the
good, well-respected school with an outstanding curriculum    outstanding schools first. There is a real danger, as
—has lost its BSF funding. Its chair and head of              I said, for schools in the middle, and for those reasons I
governors do not want it to be an academy, but they are       am certainly not persuaded that the Bill meets the tests
nervous that their school may end up at a disadvantage        I set out at the beginning of my speech.
as these proposals go forward.
   All this says to me that the Government should have        6.19 pm
taken a more considered approach to this legislation.            Dan Rogerson (North Cornwall) (LD): It is a pleasure
There is a real danger of harm being done, and I am not       to speak in a debate in which so many excellent
at all clear—hopefully, the Minister can enlighten me in      contributions have been made. A number of hon. Members,
his closing remarks—how the Secretary of State intends        in particular, my hon. Friend the Member for Southport
to prioritise schools that are going to become academies.     (Dr Pugh), have raised the issue of timing. The new
The role that sponsors and partners have played in            coalition Government are beginning a legislative programme
supporting existing academy schools and trust schools         and are seeking to set out their stall and signal to those
has been absolutely crucial, but if many hundreds of          who may well have to take contingent decisions on the
schools become academies straight away, I cannot see          legislation exactly what opportunities may be available
how those effective partnerships can be put in place.         to them. So I understand why the Government were
Therefore, those academies will not be as effective as the    keen to press ahead with this approach, which was part
existing ones have been.                                      of the coalition agreement, and to make it absolutely
   My fourth concern is fairness—fairness in admissions,      clear how it might be developed by means of a Bill.
funding and exclusions. Autonomy, which I support,               The fact that we are considering this Bill on the Floor
must not mean academies avoiding their responsibilities       of the House in seven or eight days is unusual. However,
on key issues such as the local behaviour partnerships        I hope that many of the hon. Members who are in the
and how they treat children with special educational          Chamber will be with us throughout our deliberations
needs.                                                        and that we will have the opportunity to probe on
   That brings me to my fifth, penultimate concern: the       certain issues and end up reassuring the hon. Member
treatment of children with special educational needs          for Liverpool, West Derby (Stephen Twigg) that the Bill
and disabilities. My hon. Friend the Member for North         can achieve its aims. Perhaps we will also be able to
West Durham (Pat Glass) made the case on this issue           convince my hon. Friend the Member for Southport on
very strongly. We know that many SEN children are             the points that he raised with his customary humour
being failed now—not only by academies but by other           and good will.
schools. In Liverpool, many parents of children with             This Bill began its journey in the other place, and I
autism have come to see me in the two and a half              pay tribute to my noble Friends the Baronesses Walmsley,
months since I have been their MP to talk about how           Garden, Sharp and Williams, and to other Lords and
they feel the system is failing them. Some special schools    Baronesses, for the time that they spent on the Bill. The
becoming academies could be a very positive thing for         Government did make changes to it during its progress
the education of SEN children, but we need to ensure          through the other place, and others have succeeded in
that the mainstream schools are also meeting the needs        advancing slightly different views that have also been
of all those children.                                        incorporated in the Bill. That makes it a stronger Bill
   My final concern is one that other Members have            and the process has clarified some of the issues that we
referred to: the role of local government and the balance     are coming to consider. However, as other hon. Members
between the local and the centre. When I was the              have pointed out, some matters still need to be resolved
Minister for Schools, I had to make decisions affecting       to the satisfaction of Members of this House. It is right
academies on quite detailed issues. I often felt rather       that the elected House has its chance to do that and,
uncomfortable that I, a Minister in London, was making        although the timetable is challenging, our considering
decisions about schools across the country on limited         this Bill on the Floor of the House in this way will
information—and that was when there were fewer than           provide us with that opportunity.
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   Interestingly, the concept of academies originated         terms and conditions are and how they are negotiated
from the parties on this side of the House; it came, in       to ensure that, as the hon. Member for Huddersfield
particular, from the Conservative side of the coalition,      (Mr Sheerman) said, what has been gained is built
rather than from the Labour party, which now finds            upon, rather than lost.
itself in opposition. Tellingly, as has been said by some
hon. Members, Labour still had work to do to convince           Vernon Coaker: The normal way in which somebody
its Members that there was a role for academies in the        pursues concerns is by tabling amendments—sometimes
education system. Clearly, as Labour Members have             they are passed. Given the programme motion and the
pointed out, my party’s policy going into the election        way this Bill is set up, has the hon. Gentleman considered
was to revisit the academies issue; we came up with           what would happen if he were successful in having his
“sponsor-managed schools” as a different approach.            concerns allayed by way of amendments being passed?
   Much to my regret and, doubtless, to that of many          As there is no Report stage for this Bill, it would appear
Labour Members, they are not facing a Liberal Democrat        that that would cause a great deal of problems for his
Government across the Chamber, but a coalition                own Whips and those of the coalition Government.
Government. It is important that these issues are debated
in that coalition and that we have the opportunity to            Dan Rogerson: The Minister is an experienced Member
come up with an approach that—we hope—represents              of this House and he will have encountered issues on
some points raised by both manifestos. The Secretary of       which there have been disagreements between both
State has pressed forward with, and has been a great          Houses and things have had to be resolved quickly.
advocate of, the approach in this Bill. I hope that my        Draftspeople have been able to put things together
Liberal Democrat colleagues will have the opportunity         quickly on such occasions and I am sure that if a matter
to put forward our concerns so that we can develop a          had to be revisited, it could be. It may be that the
Bill that reassures everyone.                                 Minister is able to reassure hon. Members on certain
                                                              issues without the need for amendments—we will see as
  Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op): The              our debate progresses and the Bill goes into Committee.
hon. Gentleman will recall that his party’s manifesto            Some hon. Members have raised the concern that the
contained a pledge to invest more money in education,         Bill will force everybody down the academy route, but if
but does he agree that he is now accepting a 25% cut?         that were the case, I would not be able to support it. I
Furthermore, is it not the case that the money that is        have talked to those involved in education in my
being supplied is being directed to the middle-class          constituency, and I have found that some are prepared
areas and is no longer being targeted at those most           to explore this approach. The Secretary of State has
in need? How can he reconcile those things with his           said that many hundreds of schools have expressed an
principles?                                                   interest in this. Some of them may well explore it and
                                                              choose not to go down the academy route, but others
   Dan Rogerson: As has been mentioned, the key proposal      will choose to do so. I am keen to ensure that the Bill
that the Liberal Democrats made during the election           makes that choice available, and not only to those
was for a pupil premium to target money at disadvantaged      professionals. As all good schools do, they will be talking
pupils and those with particular needs—that is in the         to the communities that they represent and educate, and
coalition agreement and will be delivered. As the hon.        with which they work, to ensure that if they move in
Gentleman says, there are cuts to be made to public           this direction, they carry people with them.
services but, at the risk of tiring the House, we have           I am also given confidence by the fact that many local
repeatedly set out why that has to happen. We are where       authorities do good work in supporting the existing
we are, and I am proud that the coalition is still pressing   schools. If there is indeed a level playing field and this
ahead with the pupil premium and will consider taking         Bill is not pushing people in a particular direction—I
money for it from outside the education budget to help        do not believe that that is the Secretary of State’s
particularly disadvantaged pupils.                            intention—many schools will choose to stay in the
   I wish to raise a few issues, some of which have been      current set-up, but they will have the option available to
touched on by other hon. Members. My information              them. Therefore, I can see nothing in the Bill that will
suggests that issues relating to special educational needs    lead to the horror stories that some Labour Members
have concerned some organisations; they are worried           have set out by saying that this is a one-way direction of
about how another generation of academies on this             travel and that all schools will take this approach. Hon.
model would be able to deliver support. The hon.              Members will have different views and their discussions
Member for North West Durham (Pat Glass), who is no           with the schools in their constituencies will lead them to
longer in her place, made an excellent, reasoned and          different conclusions as to whether all the schools in
thoughtful contribution. I might have disagreed with          those constituencies will seek to take advantage of these
some of her conclusions, but she made a great contribution    opportunities straight away. I hope that by extending
to the debate and I hope that the Minister will reflect on    the possibility of academy status to schools that have
those concerns in his wind-up.                                pushed on towards “outstanding” status, we will provide
   Some Labour Members have discussed pay and                 them with an opportunity. This is certainly not compulsory,
conditions for those working in schools, and that issue       and I would not be party to such an approach.
concerns me too. In the past, there was a small number
of academies and so, just as there was choice for parents,       Geraint Davies: Does the hon. Gentleman accept that
those working in the field of education could choose          if all schools became academies, there would not be
whether or not to work in the academy set-up. If more         enough money available? If they did, how would that be
and more schools are going to go down the academy             different from, for example, the comprehensive system
route, we have to revisit the issue of exactly what the       in Wales?
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   Dan Rogerson: I was seeking to point out that an              ago, when the given text for the Conservative Government
option would be available for schools to choose. The             was essentially “privatising the world”. We have already
hon. Gentleman may be saying that people would go                seen their first incursion into attempting to privatise the
down this route only for the money, but I do not think           NHS and it is clear to me that what is being proposed in
that that is the case. I have looked at the amount of            this Bill is the first step in, essentially, privatising education.
money that some local authorities hold back, so I can            If it does not privatise education in the overt monetary
say that this proposal would not be hugely beneficial in         sense, it will certainly revert back to the bad old days of
terms of the services also received for that money.              the 11-plus, of a grammar school system and of secondary
Circumstances differ across the country and schools              schools that were much lower than bog-standard. It
will take the decision based on their own local circumstances,   seems to me that that is what the Government are
but I do not think that schools are financially compelled        working for.
to take this route.
                                                                   For example, my constituency is served by two local
   The other concerns that I want to raise—I believe             authorities—Brent and Camden. Both are looking at a
that they were raised in the other place—are to do with          serious shortfall for available school places not only in
standards and the role that Ofsted plays in the education        secondary schools but in junior schools for a variety of
system. Schools—admittedly those that are outstanding,           reasons, not least the increase in population. Both were
but that does not necessarily mean that all schools              savagely disappointed because their schools were taken
achieve that status—would stay there for ever if it were         out of the Building Schools for the Future programme.
based on the quality of the teaching and leadership. I           No one on the Government Benches has been able to
want to hear a little more from the Minister about how           give me or any of the head teachers, governors, parents
the monitoring of progress and attainment will continue          and pupils in Brent and Camden a reason why their
for schools that go down this route.                             schools have been excised—we have been given no
   Although some hon. Members are concerned about                economic reasons and certainly no educational reasons.
how the flexibility in the curriculum might be interpreted,
the Bill involves a positive step. In the coalition agreement,     These local authorities in my constituency are blessed
both parties had no problem in signing up to the                 with a multiracial, multi-ethnic society, and it is absurd
aspiration to free schools from restrictive curricula. I         for the Government to believe that the kind of freedom
hope that that will allow schools to develop a curriculum        that they argue will automatically be brought about by
that is appropriate to their pupils and to the local             the expansion of the academies programme will help
circumstances in which they find themselves.                     some of the most disadvantaged of our children in
                                                                 some of the most disadvantaged areas.
   I find myself moving on to the subject of free schools,
which is not integral to the academy issue that we have            I thought that we had already established in this
principally been discussing. However, provisions for             country that if we truly wish to ensure that disadvantaged
free schools are in the Bill and the subject will need           areas and disadvantaged children receive the benefits
further scrutiny. I suspect that we will consider those          that we expect for our own children—all of us in this
issues in the Committee of the whole House, and I see            Chamber would not accept for our children what it
that hon. Members will want to discuss that. It is an            seems to me that the Government intend to impose on
important new aspiration that the Secretary of State             other people’s children—we must learn the basic lesson
has set out, which is also in the coalition agreement.           that a school alone cannot do it alone, however much
Fundamentally, I hope, whatever options are available,           money we pour into it, however much we expand it and
to see a level playing field and recognition that although       however much the teachers wish to work there. That is a
these solutions might be appropriate in some parts of            point that no one has raised, which is also reflected in a
the country, in others they will not.                            sense in the NHS: there are certainly very deprived
   The concept of free schools has perhaps been discussed        areas that teachers do not wish to work in. How will we
in the context of some of the larger urban areas, where          persuade them to go into there? By giving them more
parents aspire to have a different model of school               money? Apparently not, because this Government are
available to them. In rural area, such as mine, there            saying that there is absolutely no money anywhere. The
might be a different view. However, if there is a move to        same is true as far as the NHS is concerned—there are
close a small village school, a group of people who are          certain deprived areas in which GPs do not wish to work.
active in that village might want to consider ways in               We cannot simply say to one organ of society that it
which they could resurrect the school and do so efficiently      has to be the sole repository of transforming those
and effectively.                                                 areas of our society that we wish to see transformed. We
   To sum up, I hope that over the next few days we will         already heard a most thoughtful, highly detailed
have the opportunity to look in detail at the issues set         contribution, clearly coming from many years of experience,
out in the Bill and that we can answer some of the fears         about the difficulties experienced in some schools by
that hon. Members have raised.                                   some children with special educational needs. I have
                                                                 seen this for myself within my schools.
6.32 pm
                                                                    Not infrequently, the issues that create behaviour in
  Glenda Jackson (Hampstead and Kilburn) (Lab):                  an individual child in a school have nothing to do with
The House has been blessed this afternoon that so                the curriculum, the teachers or the physical environment
many contributions have emanated from people who                 in which a child finds itself. That child might have to live
have such experience in matters of education, so it is my        in seriously substandard housing in very overcrowded
choice to lower the tone somewhat drastically.                   conditions. If we are saying that we genuinely want to
  I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that the                 ensure that every child in our society should have the
Government’s proposals are ideologically based. This             best of educations, we must look much wider at the
seems to me to be a harking back to almost two decades           external influences that in many instances could make it
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virtually impossible for children to learn, and that is not       Glenda Jackson: I cannot afford the hon. Gentleman
exclusively to do with the issue of special educational        the same compliment that he afforded me regarding
needs.                                                         politeness. It is a pity that he could not listen to me with
   I am deeply cynical—I frankly and freely admit it—about     the attention that I have afforded to his colleagues
what the Government are proposing for education. My            during the debate, because I did not say that I knew
constituency was Hampstead and Highgate and now,               nothing about education. I have completely forgotten
through boundary changes, it is Hampstead and Kilburn,         the point that he was trying to make, but that is probably
and I can remember distinctly what every single state          just as well. If he really wants me to go back into why I
school in my constituency was like in 1992. Every spare        am so suspicious of what the Bill is doing, I shall do so.
moment that every teacher, every governor, every parent        It is first because of the speed with which the Government
and, not infrequently, the pupils had was engaged in           are driving the Bill through the House and, secondly,
trying to raise money. They were attempting to raise           because of the complete lack of consultation on the
funds to buy basics such as paper, pencils and books for       fundamental and major changes inherent in it. There is
the school library. Not in every school, but in the            an illogicality in that regard, because we have heard
majority of schools in my constituency at that time            much from the Government about their absolute
the plaster was kept on the walls by the artwork of the        commitment to localism and about enabling local people
pupils and miles and miles of Sellotape affixed by the         to make local decisions about what affects their local
teachers. Books were unknown as a teaching tool—pupils         communities. That is the absolute bedrock of his party’s
were lucky if they had the copy of the chapter they were       commitment.
looking at that day. If a computer was found in one of
my schools, that was headline news—it was the equivalent         Mr Sheerman: How does my hon. Friend square all
of finding the educational holy grail.                         this with the Prime Minister’s speech yesterday, in which
   Now, the situation in every one of my schools has           he bragged about his commitment to the big society and
been transformed beyond recognition. They have been            inclusion?
physically improved, the quality of teaching has improved,
visitors are tripping over whiteboards and children have          Glenda Jackson: I must be entirely honest with my
computers that they can take home with them. Educational       hon. Friend: I tend to avoid speeches by the Prime
standards were always high because when I was first            Minister. If you have heard one, you have heard them
elected and for many years after that, the local authority     all. The Government are constantly arguing that localism
was a Labour-controlled local authority and, despite           is all and that local people must make the decisions
the savage underfunding of year after year of Conservative     about housing, the erection of wind farms, jobs and
Government, it always prioritised education. The standards     everything else, but on this central and essential issue—the
were always high and the schools have always been              education of all our children—that local dimension is,
oversubscribed, but if we go down the road that is being       apparently, thrown out of the window. There is to be no
advocated by this Conservative Government, I can see—as        consultation with the people who really matter.
others have said tonight—not only a deterioration of
educational standards but a serious breakdown in social           Ben Gummer (Ipswich) (Con): The hon. Lady made
cohesion.                                                      that point to the Minister in his introductory remarks
                                                               and he said that it was up to the headmaster of any
   There is not a single school in my constituency at a        school that wishes for academy status to consult the
junior level where there are fewer than 49 to 53 different     community about it. That is exactly what is happening
languages spoken. I can distinctly remember when I was         in one school in my constituency, which was taken into
first elected going with groups of my colleagues, mostly       an academy as introduced by Labour Members. It is
from London I admit, to argue frantically for section 11       consulting widely and of its own volition—and very
money still to be there to assist in the teaching of English   successfully.
as a second language. There are enormous benefits for
all our children in what we see in our schools. I recently
                                                                  Glenda Jackson: With respect to the hon. Gentleman,
visited a junior school in my constituency in which, because
                                                               if I heard the Secretary of State correctly, and if I
of the influx of people from the European Union and
                                                               remember the changes being made by the Bill, it says
other parts of the world, the children are now learning
                                                               not that they must, but that they should engage with
Portuguese and Somali. When I was that age, I did not
                                                               poorly achieving schools. It is much too broadly drafted
even know that those languages existed. There are huge
                                                               for there to be any real input at all—for a high-achieving
benefits from that, but the divisive process that the
                                                               school to make the widest possible contribution to its
Government are committed to reintroducing will savagely
                                                               local community. I am not saying that high-achieving
attack all that has been achieved not only on an educational
                                                               schools are not doing that already—certainly, academies
level but in the social cohesion that I, as a London MP,
                                                               in some areas do—but what the Government propose
believe is one of the blessings of living in this great
                                                               will set up a barrier that will be driven, as we all know
capital city. The Government’s approach will move us
                                                               because we are all human beings who see it all the time,
back to the terrible days of the 11-plus, of grammar
                                                               by parents. Schools will be in the position of selecting
schools and of children being discounted utterly at the
                                                               not pupils but parents, and those parents will be selecting
age of 11 if they did not pass the 11-plus.
  Andrew Percy: The hon. Lady said that she knew                  The idea that there is an equivalency in education
nothing about education, or very little, and, certainly,       between the voices of parents simply is not true. A
some of the points she has made are interesting, to be         colleague of the hon. Member for Ipswich (Ben Gummer)
polite. I have read the Bill from start to finish and I have   raised an issue that we all know about—people who
not seen anything in it about expanding selection. Can         have enough money to buy themselves into the catchment
she tell me where it says anything about that?                 area of a school they wish their children to attend. In
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[Glenda Jackson]                                                      but despite them. It became the first secondary school
                                                                      in Bradford to gain an outstanding Ofsted categorisation
many instances, that practice excludes the children of                because of the things that I have mentioned—a great
people who were born and raised in the area and whose                 head teacher, a great management team and great teachers.
parents and grandparents were born and raised there.                  Schools also need excellent support services such as
That happens a great deal in my constituency.                         occupational therapy, educational psychology and speech
  Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. I                        The governing body is less important than many
am sorry but the hon. Lady’s time is up.                              governors believe. A terrific governing body with a poor
                                                                      head teacher will not mean that the school is successful
6.45 pm                                                               in terms of achievement. A really good head teacher
                                                                      can get by with a governing body that is not so good—just
   Mr David Ward (Bradford East) (LD): I cannot see                   don’t tell them.
how, when the House is, understandably, trying to rebuild
its reputation for various reasons, it will help its good                Geraint Davies: At the end of last week, I was at a
name to rush through such important legislation without               school that serves a challenged area in Swansea West. It
full consultation. I cannot believe that that will add to             was clear that the school’s relationship with parents,
the general view of the House as a place that is worthy               who often do not have a background of high achievement
to give the deliberation that the Bill deserves.                      over generations, in building self-esteem for children is a
   The Bill is not an emergency measure, but it is leading            key part of breaking out of inter-generational poverty.
to what could be a nasty accident. I believe and support              Does the hon. Gentleman accept that one key issue is
the coalition agreement, which says:                                  targeting resources on schools that serve challenged
   “We will give parents, teachers, charities and local communities   areas, rather than just having a free-for-all where middle-
the chance to set up new schools, as part of our plans to allow       class parents grab what little is left of the cake from the
new providers to enter the state school system in response to         Conservative Government?
parental demand.”
But that does not add to the state school system.                        Mr Ward: Hence the pupil premium. Parental involvement
Whatever the intention is, the outcome will be a                      —my next point—is very important too.
fragmentation and a weakening of the state school                        There is nothing to stop a school having all the things
system.                                                               that I mentioned. It does not have to be a faith school, a
   It has also been said recently that                                maintained school, an academy, a grant-maintained
“more choice for parents is a quintessentially liberal approach.      school or a foundation school. A point not previously
This is an area where the state needs to back off.”                   raised, although I think the hon. Member for Hampstead
However, as we have heard before in the House, liberty                and Kilburn (Glenda Jackson) touched on it, is that
without equality is a name of noble sound but squalid                 everything that I have mentioned will produce a school
meaning. There is a difference between freedom and a                  with high achievement, but not necessarily a school
free-for-all. In a free-for-all, invariably, the least articulate,    with high attainment. There is a difference between
the least organised, the least well represented, the least            the two.
well-off and the least well educated tend to lose out.                   As I said, it is simple to determine what makes a
   It is important always, in whatever we do, to begin                successful school, but it is not always easy. Apart from
with the end in mind. What are we trying to do with our               parental involvement, everything that I have talked
education system? We want, first, to raise the overall                about relates to school level variables—the school and
attainment of the young people who go through the                     what it can actually deliver—but pupil level variables
system and, secondly, to narrow the gap in attainment                 determine attainment in the school. We seem to have
in our system. The first issue is one of productivity and             common agreement about the need for a pupil premium
getting the most that we can out of the system, whereas               to support schools serving deprived communities, but
the second is very much a political issue about narrowing             why not give it a chance in those schools? Is it not
the gap and seeing the importance, not just to young                  premature to look at the structure yet again, before we
people but to the nation as a whole, of doing so.                     have seen what the additional funding can do to raise
   There have been some extremely good contributions                  attainment in those schools?
from knowledgeable people on both sides of the debate,
so there is a danger of my trying to teach people to suck               Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con): Does the
eggs, but let me put the issue in practical terms. There is           hon. Gentleman accept that there are poor schools in
a difference between things that are simple and things                good areas and good schools in poor areas? It is much
that are easy. To achieve well, a school needs a great                more than the relationship that he has talked about.
head teacher, a great management team and great teachers.
Then there are other things that help but that are less                  Mr Ward: Without doubt there are exceptions to the
crucial, such as adequate resources. What resources are               rule, and we need to learn best practice wherever it
adequate will differ from school to school depending on               resides, but powerful opposing forces work against all
the community that the school serves. Some schools will               schools being in the educational utopia that is described
need more—hence the pupil premium.                                    by the ingredients for high achievement. Bradford has
   A school’s buildings are quite important but not as                200 schools—special, primary and secondary. We shall
crucial as some people think. One of my schools, Carlton              not get 200 great head teachers; it will not happen.
Bolling college, where I am a governor—one of the                        Another force working against that utopia is how
schools for which the BSF proposals have been frozen—                 schools are judged. In most cases, they are judged on
became an outstanding school not because of its buildings             attainment, and although we often pay lip service to
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contextual value added, that is not how schools are                 The final thing that I am worried about has more to
actually evaluated. Because of the system, schools are           do with free schools: within a year, the British National
in competition. They do not like being in competition,           party will have a group of parents applying to set up
but they are in competition over who is recruited to             a school.
which school.
   How can we bring about change in struggling schools?          6.58 pm
Only with very great difficulty. Some of the measures               Tristram Hunt (Stoke-on-Trent Central) (Lab): It is a
are impatient, but it requires hard slog in struggling           great pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Bradford
schools to put in place the ingredients required to turn         East (Mr Ward). No doubt we shall be seeing him later.
them around. How much simpler to set up a new school
                                                                    I want to make a rather basic intervention. Amidst all
with all the ingredients in place, including the great new
                                                                 the language of funding models, burdens of bureaucracy,
head teacher. But where will the great new head teachers
                                                                 accountability and pupil premiums, I thought that it
come from? They will come from other schools, where
                                                                 would be germane to raise the question of what children
they may have been needed because those schools served
                                                                 might learn under these new school reforms. We are
deprived communities. If a teacher gets the same pay—or
                                                                 being invited to extend the academy model in one form
even, in these new schools, more pay—why on earth
                                                                 or another on the specific rationale that those schools
would they go in every morning to work in a school
                                                                 raise educational attainment, in particular through a
serving a deprived community for less money? Teachers’
                                                                 rapidly improving results framework, with almost double
conditions of service need to change if we are to make
                                                                 the number of A* to C grades at GCSE. At the beginning
the most of the pupil premium, so I welcome that
                                                                 of the Secretary of State’s speech, we heard the litany of
                                                                 schools that are doing so well, and in The Daily Telegraph
   More important than anything else in terms of                 on Friday, the Department for Education repeated the
attainment, resources and how a school is judged, is the         mantra that academies were outstanding. But what are
intake of the school. Why do people want academies?              they outstanding at? How have the results improved so
There must be a reason. It is because they think they            markedly?
will get something new. If it is simply about flexibility in        Although much of the success can be attributed to
the national curriculum, why not give it to all schools?         strong leadership, inspiring teaching, improved facilities
If it is about flexibility in teachers’ conditions of service,   and the new ethos of learning that my hon. Friend the
why not give that to all schools? People want academies—         Member for Liverpool, West Derby (Stephen Twigg)
whether or not they admit it—because by one means or             outlined so well, in some cases improved results are the
another they want to change the intake of the school. If         product of directing students into less demanding
everything was made available for every school, for              examination options that in the end improve no one’s
what reason would they want to set up an academy?                life chances. We are being asked to implement an
                                                                 educational model whose validity is open to question.
  Mr Turner: May I suggest that one other reason                 Indeed, there should have been an element of scepticism
might be to get away from the control of the local               about the academies when they were not subject to
council? That is why people want academies.                      freedom of information legislation. With a degree of
                                                                 ease, some academies were able to disguise some of the
                                                                 data behind their results surge.
   Mr Ward: On local authorities controlling schools,
I do not know where the hon. Gentleman has been for                Andrew Percy: It was not necessarily only academies
the last 20 years. It does not happen now. Money is              that went down that route: all kinds of schools throughout
passported straight to schools. If he has an issue with          the country forced children on to GNVQs and equivalent
support services, he should get his councillors to sort it       qualifications to force up their results. It was not unique
out. The local authority should be providing quality             to academies.
services to schools.
                                                                    Mr Hunt: As the hon. Gentleman will hear later, the
  James Morris (Halesowen and Rowley Regis) (Con):               statistics are rather sharp on the difference between
Has the hon. Gentleman come across no circumstances              academies and the rest of the maintained sector. Moreover,
where the local authority has acted as a barrier to              the academies were unwilling to divulge the difference
innovation in a local school?                                    between academic qualifications and academic equivalent
                                                                 qualifications in vocational subjects.
                                                                    Let us be clear that we are not debating the relative
  Mr Ward: I am reliably informed by my hon. Friend              merits of academic versus vocational education. The
the Member for Colchester (Bob Russell) that it happens          equivalent qualifications sold as vocational are, in fact,
quite frequently in Essex county council.                        rarely so. Many academy pupils are directed towards
  Pointing out where there are failings or errors in the         what might be described as semi-vocational or semi-
system is not to condemn the system but to improve it.           academic subjects that do not provide the rigorous
One of the reasons I find the measure so difficult to            technical training that might lead to an apprenticeship
accept is that it ignores the crucial role of the local          but are simply weaker versions of GCSEs, such as
authority in co-ordination. I have seen no mention of            BTEC science or OCR national certificates in information
the Every Child Matters agenda in the Bill. The role of          and communications technology.
the local authority is crucial in places planning, ensuring
that admissions are fair and supporting, challenging               Elizabeth Truss (South West Norfolk) (Con): Did not
and monitoring schools. If we put those things in place          the Labour Government put in place the Qualifications
we shall be on our way to improving our schools.                 and Curriculum Development Agency, with its dogma
83               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                 84

[Elizabeth Truss]                                             achievement gap in English schools, poorer students are
                                                              disproportionately entered for equivalent qualifications
of equivalence that made those subjects equivalent in         at GCSE level. Academies, which have served lower-income
the first place and give head teachers the incentives to      cohorts to date, have mirrored that scenario, but that is
treat those qualifications equally?                           surely the challenge that academies should take up.
                                                                 We do not want the soft bigotry of low expectations,
  Mr Hunt: Clearly, the hon. Lady has not discovered          with academy league tables benefiting at the expense of
the new politics. This is not about party political point     pupil learning. That two-tier education fails to give
scoring. [Interruption.] As I said at the beginning of my     some of our poorest communities the education that
speech, this is about what children learn in our schools,     they deserve. Sadly, certain academies have accentuated
and Government Members would do well to remember              that trend. As independent schools, they are exempt
that amid their guffawing. Although a BTEC can officially     from the curriculum and, to date, have not had to reveal
be worth two GCSEs, or an OCR national certificate            the details of their results beyond the basic percentage
worth four GCSEs, that equation is not necessarily            of their pupils who pass five-plus GCSEs or the equivalent.
accepted by further or higher education colleges or
other academic institutions, so often the pupil is short-        I refuse to accept that that trend of teaching is
changed even as grade results are inflated.                   inevitable. In my constituency, the Mitchell business
                                                              and enterprise college on the Bentilee estate—for which
   Andrew Percy: I could not agree with the hon. Gentleman    my hon. Friend the Member for Gedling (Vernon Coaker)
more on that point, but it is important that he understand    did so much good work in his time as a Minister and
that, very often, local authorities that controlled schools   where youth unemployment is high and household income
were forcing them down that route. That will not be           low—continues to offer rigorous academic subjects to
allowed to happen if the Bill is passed.                      all its pupils, not least because that is what business
                                                              wants. Genuine vocational training requires a solid
  Mr Hunt: Academies are going down that road to              academic foundation up to the age of 16—a view espoused
raise their league table offering.                            by employers in vocational areas of work. So it is of
                                                              great value that amendments passed in the other place
  Andrew Percy rose—                                          now ensure that academies are subject to freedom of
                                                              information legislation, but there seems little change in
   Mr Hunt: If the hon. Gentleman will wait a moment,         the Bill to ensure that as many academies as possible
the statistics that might quiet him will come.                deliver the broad curriculum that provides a stimulating
                                                              learning environment. In many cases, freedom for academies
   Returning to the academies offer, the important point      has produced a narrowing of the curriculum options.
is that pupils have true options. First, they should have
the choice to pursue academic subjects, even if that is to
the detriment of the school’s results. After all, whose          Ben Gummer: I am fascinated by the hon. Gentleman’s
interests are the schools serving, apart from their pupils?   destruction of the policy proposed by Labour Members
Secondly, pupils should not be misled into thinking that      for so many years. Given his firm disapproval of the
undertaking equivalent qualifications will give them the      independence of academies, I am interested to know
same standing as GCSEs in history, modern languages,          whether he would recommend that the school that he
geography or the hard sciences; they will not.                attended should submit itself to the authority of the
                                                              local authority, as he clearly wishes to pursue that line
   The facts are stark. A series of parliamentary questions
                                                              for other schools?
has shown that academies succeed disproportionately
in equivalent qualifications and that academic subjects
are in steeper decline in academies than in maintained           Mr Hunt: To be honest, I did not quite follow the
schools. Just 17% of pupils in academies take geography       hon. Gentleman’s line. The point that was pursued by
GCSE, compared with 27% in the maintained sector,             Labour Members when we were in government is that
and 21% of pupils in academies take history GCSE,             standards in teaching and academic qualifications matter,
compared with 31% in the maintained sector. Whereas           and if academies produce league table inflation at the
only 26% of academy pupils take a modern language,            cost of the education of their pupils, that is to no one’s
some 44% of maintained pupils do so. A similar story          benefit. The worry is that, with greater freedoms, there
could be told for English literature, where one learns        is a narrowing of curriculum options, which is what the
the rudiments of grammar, and for physics, chemistry          statistics have proved.
and biology.                                                     I have no ideological opposition to academies. In
                                                              many situations, they are refreshing, innovative and
   Gavin Barwell (Croydon Central) (Con): The hon.            provide the aspirational step change in low-income
Gentleman is making a good point about the importance         communities that can transform the life chances of
of studying academic subjects in our schools. However,        many young people. I am proud of the Labour
in the figures that he quotes, were academies compared        Government’s achievements in that regard, but we need
with other equivalent schools, with similar catchment         greater transparency. What we need in the Bill is an
areas, or with the whole maintained sector?                   understanding that there can be no more equivalence at
                                                              the cost of academic rigour, as that is to the cost of the
  Mr Hunt: That is a very good question. It has taken         educational life chances of our young people. That is
me so long to get the information out of the Department       what we are dealing with. We want a tailoring of the
for Education that it relates only to the whole maintained    curriculum in many cases, so that teachers have control,
sector. Our next stage is to pursue those questions           and can teach to the needs of young people and pursue
locally. Of course, as the hon. Gentleman indicates,          vocational and academic topics, but we need clarity,
the data are influenced by the fact that, given the           accountability and transparency about these issues.
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   This is about more than league tables and data sets; it         7.13 pm
is about studying and learning skills and—dare I say                   Liz Kendall (Leicester West) (Lab): The Academies
it?—enjoyment. Too many schools and academies are                  Bill raises many issues, but I want to focus my comments
denying that to some of the most disadvantaged                     on three key questions: will the Bill help pupils and
communities in the country by not allowing the full                schools with the greatest needs, will it improve outcomes
academic curriculum. We must not make economic                     in education, and does it represent the best use of
deprivation a licence for intellectual deprivation.                taxpayers’ money?
                                                                       The Government say that their Bill is a continuation
7.9 pm                                                             or fulfilment of the previous Government’s approach,
                                                                   but there is a fundamental and crucial difference that
   Gordon Henderson (Sittingbourne and Sheppey) (Con):             many hon. Members have cited. Labour’s academy
I am in a somewhat difficult position. I support the               policy gave extra help and support to struggling schools
general thrust of the Academies Bill, but when I came              in deprived areas, and sought to break the link between
to this debate I had a couple of specific concerns that            social and economic disadvantage and low achievement
would have prevented me from giving the Government                 and aspiration, which still damage the lives of too many
unqualified support. However, I am delighted to say                children, including in my constituency. However, this
that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State reassured         Government are offering academy status to schools that
me on at least one of those concerns when he confirmed             are already rated outstanding.
that schools in a federation can apply for academy status              The Centre for Economic Performance at the London
even if one of the schools has been judged outstanding             School of Economics recently analysed the 1,560 schools
and the other has not. His confirmation will be welcomed           that have expressed an interest in becoming academies.
by the Westlands school in my constituency, which is in            It found that those schools had very different characteristics
exactly that position.                                             from the 203 existing academies. Pupils in the schools
   I still have a second concern, which relates to the financing   that have expressed an interest in becoming academies
of academies. I oppose most parts of the Opposition                are less likely to be eligible for free school meals, to have
amendment that we are debating, but there is one that              special educational needs, and to come from an ethnic
rings alarm bells in my mind, and that is the suggestion           minority, and are more likely to get five good GCSEs.
that the academies programme will                                  For example, around 30% of pupils in academies are
“be funded by scrapping existing school building programmes”.
                                                                   eligible for free school meals, compared with only 9% of
                                                                   pupils in schools that have expressed an interest in
I hope that Ministers can reassure me that that is not             becoming an academy and are rated outstanding. Just
the case. That reassurance is important to children and            under 28% of pupils in academies have special educational
parents on the Isle of Sheppey, which already has an               needs but do not have a statement, compared with
academy, but only in name.                                         around 14% of pupils in schools that have expressed an
   That academy was set up as part of Kent county                  interest and are rated outstanding. That evidence led
council’s reorganisation of education on the island; last          the Centre for Economic Performance to conclude that
year, there was a change from a three-tier to a two-tier           “the new coalition government’s policy on Academy Schools is
system. There was considerable opposition to that change.          not, like the previous government’s policy, targeted on schools
However, opponents, of whom I was one, were mollified              with more disadvantaged pupils. The serious worry that follows is
somewhat by the promise of a £55-million academy.                  that this will exacerbate already existing educational inequalities.”
Our academy opened last September, but without one                    On the radio this morning, the Secretary of State said
single new brick being laid. Instead, it opened in the             that every new academy will help a school that is
ramshackle buildings that previously belonged to Minster           struggling, but the Government’s own impact assessment
college and Cheyne middle school, which are two miles              of the Bill estimates that only a third of new academies
apart. Those buildings are simply not fit for purpose.             are likely to help weaker schools. It also estimates that
Last year, the heating trunking in Minster college collapsed       the cost of providing help to a struggling school will be
and fell between two rows of desks, injuring a number              around £50,000 for each new academy. First, £50,000 is
of children. If that trunking had fallen a foot further            very little money to help a genuinely challenged school.
either way, we could have had a major tragedy on our               Secondly, it is not clear whether the Government will
hands. That cannot be allowed to happen again.                     provide that extra money to help struggling schools, or
                                                                   whether the new academies will have to find the money
   Our academy is now the only secondary school on                 from their own budgets.
Sheppey. With almost 2,500 pupils, it is one of the
largest schools in the whole country, and without new                 Many schools offer help and support to other schools
buildings the academy will not succeed. The Isle of                in their area, but I question whether new academies will
Sheppey academy is part of the review that my right                voluntarily give their own money to help a struggling
hon. Friend the Secretary of State is undertaking. I very          school, especially when we are likely to face cuts of 10%
much fear that the country’s dire financial position will          to 20% in the education budget. I hope that the Minister
mean that we will not receive the funding needed, and              of State, Department for Education, the hon. Member
that the reorganisation of education on the island will            for Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (Mr Gibb), in his
be botched, leading to another generation of children              concluding comments, will say whether every new academy
being educationally disadvantaged, as the last generation          will be required to help a struggling school, as the
was. I know that the Secretary of State is aware of the            Secretary of State implied. If so, will the Government
unique circumstances facing Sheppey, and I know that               provide the extra funding that the help will genuinely cost?
he is sympathetic, but I very much hope he can reassure               Government Members will, I am sure, argue that the
me that the funds intended for its new buildings will not          pupil premium will play a key role in helping children in
be diverted to help to fund the new academies programme.           disadvantaged areas. I welcome the pupil premium, and
87                 Academies Bill [Lords]                    19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                   88

[Liz Kendall]                                                         contributions of other Members has been a key factor
                                                                      in improving standards in existing academies and trust
I will support it—if it provides resources over and above             schools.
the extra money that schools already get for deprivation                 There are also very real concerns that the Bill could
under the existing funding formula; if it focuses on                  have a negative impact on educational outcomes for
genuinely disadvantaged children; and, crucially, if it is            specific groups of children. My hon. Friend the Member
funded without cutting help and support from other                    for North West Durham (Pat Glass) highlighted concerns
programmes that help vulnerable groups. But as yet we                 about children with special educational needs, and the
have no details about how the pupil premium will                      Government’s equalities impact assessment sets out clear
work—which pupils it will benefit, how much will be                   evidence that such children in existing academies are
provided, or where the funds will come from.                          not improving as quickly as those in other schools and
   The final point that I want to make about whether                  may end up doing worse in some situations.
the Bill will support schools that need help most relates
                                                                         There are also concerns that children with special
to those schools that are neither outstanding nor in
                                                                      educational needs in schools that do not become academies
special measures, but in the middle—a point made by
                                                                      could be affected by the Bill. Like existing academies,
my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, West Derby
                                                                      new academies will receive all their per-pupil funding
(Stephen Twigg). There are a substantial number of
                                                                      and their share of funding for local authority-provided
schools in that category, many of which still need to
                                                                      services, such as SEN provision, and that could create a
improve, but the Bill offers them nothing. Labour’s
                                                                      shortfall in funding for the remaining local authority-
national challenge programme supports a range of schools
                                                                      maintained schools, which are more likely to need special
and challenges them to improve or face intervention,
                                                                      educational needs services. I very much welcome the
including the possibility of being converted into an
                                                                      Government’s review of special educational needs, but
academy or a national challenge trust school.
                                                                      the Bill is likely to have been passed before the review
   A number of schools in my constituency became                      has reported, so I ask the Minister to consider the
national challenge trust schools on 1 June this year, and             legislation’s impact on other schools and groups of
as part of the process they were promised additional                  children.
funding—for example to employ extra teachers to provide
                                                                         I turn to the evidence on free schools, because some
more one-to-one tuition, to support existing teachers in
                                                                      Members have said that the Bill paves the way for them.
getting new skills, and to work with parents such as
                                                                      There has been a huge debate about what the evidence
those with English as a second language. However, the
                                                                      shows, particularly the evidence from Sweden, and the
schools in my constituency have still not received the
                                                                      highly respected Institute of Education, which the Secretary
money they were promised. As a result, at least one of
                                                                      of State cited in his speech, recently assessed the data
the schools, Babington college, had to cancel its plans
                                                                      from that country. It found that more free schools were
to appoint extra teachers in time for the new term in
                                                                      established in urban, affluent and gentrified areas; that
September. I ask the Minister: will national challenge
                                                                      the biggest beneficiaries were children from already
trust schools such as Babington in my constituency get
                                                                      highly educated families; and that the impact on less
the extra resources that they have been promised, and if
                                                                      well educated and migrant families was “close to zero”.
so, when?
                                                                      Even where Swedish free schools appear to have had a
   Let me move on to the second, and arguably most                    moderately positive impact on the academic performance
important, issue that I want to address.                              of better-off children at 15 to 16 years old, the IOE
                                                                      finds that those advantages do not persist by the time
   Andrew Bridgen (North West Leicestershire) (Con):                  children take their high school exit tests aged 18 or 19.
Does the hon. Lady think it is fair that in her constituency          They are also no more likely to participate in higher
in Leicester, education is valued at £600 a year more per             education than those who are schooled in areas without
pupil than in my constituency, despite the fact that I                free schools.
have areas of severe deprivation in mine? Surely she will                We need to consider all sorts of other issues, such as
welcome the pupil premium, as it will rectify the problem.            community cohesion, which my hon. Friend the Member
                                                                      for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman) cited. That is a key
  Liz Kendall: I want all children to have the funding                issue in a constituency as diverse as mine, but I must
that is appropriate to their needs. In my constituency,               move on to my third and final question, about whether
we have very challenging areas, and we want and need                  the Bill represents the best use of taxpayers’ money.
support. I want it for the hon. Gentleman’s constituents,                The impact assessment states that the cost of
too.                                                                  implementation will be £462 million over four years,
  On the radio this morning, the Secretary of State said              and the Government say that much of that money is not
that the Bill will                                                    additional funding, because they will simply transfer to
“transform the educational achievements of pupils in this country.”   new academy schools the money that would have gone
                                                                      to local authorities. However, there will be additional
However, the impact assessment states:
                                                                      start-up costs of £68 million as well as the money that
  “While there will still be benefits to new academies…these          new academies will spend if they support weaker schools.
benefits are likely to be much lower given that they”—
                                                                        I agree that we need to achieve the best value for
the new schools—                                                      taxpayers’ money. I therefore hope that the Minister
“will have less scope for improvement than existing Academies,        will explain in his closing statement how spending additional
and will receive less start-up funding.”                              money on schools that have more advantaged pupils
The Bill also removes the requirement for new academies               and are already doing well, and on a policy that is of
to have a sponsor or a partner, which we know from the                questionable benefit in terms of improving educational
89                  Academies Bill [Lords]                      19 JULY 2010               Academies Bill [Lords]                     90

outcomes and could lead to worse outcomes for children                   academy and then, further down the line, introducing
with the greatest needs, provides value for taxpayers’                   selection. He glossed over that point so that he could go
money.                                                                   over the old dividing lines as he sees them.
   I also ask why Liberal Democrat MPs support a Bill                       The right hon. Gentleman spent a lot of time on
that experts predict will exacerbate inequalities, worsen                capital spending and Building Schools for the Future.
local accountability and usher in a free market in education.            He has been going on about it for two weeks, and, like
Those Members are risking a great deal, on issues that I                 the attack dog that he is, he kept on going on about it
know they hold dear, for very little proof of what they                  today. However, the choice that we face is not about
will gain in return. For those reasons, I shall oppose                   whether we need shiny buildings for people to learn in,
the Bill.                                                                but about whether the education that we provide for
                                                                         kids is good enough for them in terms of attainment, so
7.24 pm                                                                  that they have confidence in their futures. That is what
                                                                         the Opposition has been lacking.
   Mr Sam Gyimah (East Surrey) (Con): I thank the                           The issue is about good teaching, discipline, educational
hon. Member for Leicester West (Liz Kendall) for her                     attainment and, above all, confidence. The skills that we
thoughtful remarks, but she has already fallen into the                  give kids must provide them with a chance, a hope, so
trap that Tony Blair, the former Prime Minister and                      that when they leave school, they know that they will be
Labour party leader, identified on 24 October 2005,                      able to pursue the path that they choose. The hon.
when he said that                                                        Member for Stoke-on-Trent Central (Tristram Hunt)
“the system will finally be opened up to real parent power… Parts        said that the issue is not about databases or datasets,
of the left will say we are privatising public services and giving too
much to the middle class… both criticisms are wrong and simply
                                                                         and I agree. It is about having the right ethos and
a version of the old ‘levelling down’ mentality that kept us in          educational standards and allowing the professionals to
opposition for so long.”                                                 determine them.
Having listened to the right hon. Member for Morley                         My hon. Friend the Member for Beverley and Holderness
and Outwood (Ed Balls), I am afraid to say that he                       (Mr Stuart) and the hon. Member for Liverpool, West
demonstrated the sort of leadership that he would offer                  Derby (Stephen Twigg) said that we should veer away
Opposition Members if they voted him in as leader of                     from changing structures because the issue is about
their party. He would take them to the left and be                       enabling individuals to flourish. However, individuals
totally off the pace on the important debates and issues                 operate within a structure, and the enterprising head
in this country.                                                         teachers who want to control budgets, decide how they
                                                                         pay their teachers, determine their curriculum and engage
   It was particularly mean-spirited of the right hon.                   with their students differently cannot do so under the
Gentleman to cast doubt on our motives for reforming                     current structure. That is why we need a fundamental
the education system. He said that Labour wanted the                     change in our structures. A parent today who really
best for all but we wanted a two-tier system. Unfortunately,             wants to change something in their school has no
as my hon. Friend the Member for Bristol North West                      chance of doing so by writing to the local authority.
(Charlotte Leslie) reminded us, we already have a two-tier               Under the new structure they will have a better chance,
system, which one accesses either by paying for it or by                 because they can exercise quasi-commercial pressure on
moving to the right area. If we look at all educational                  the school, and that is a good thing.
attainment, we find that after 13 years of Labour promising                 We also need leadership, and for teachers to know
education, education, education, that two-tier system is                 that the buck stops with them, not with the county
entrenched. What is terrible is that, if one gets into it,               council or with Government policy, to deliver the right
one has no way of getting out, and that is why we want                   education for the students in their school. If they fail to
to create a system that opens up opportunity for all.                    do that somewhere further down the line, they will find
   The Opposition say that, because we will fast-track                   that parents vote with their feet. That is right to encourage
some schools that have done very well, that will                         higher attainment and standards to be driven through
unfortunately be at the expense of other schools. First,                 our education system, and to arrest the decline that the
however, every school will be able to apply to become an                 Secretary of State identified.
academy; and, secondly, those that do apply will have to                    Having said all that, I will be the first to acknowledge
include in their application how they will help schools                  that the proposed system is not perfect. It is not prescriptive,
doing less well than themselves. So it is totally specious               and there is no getting away from the fact that for it
to keep harping on that, because some schools are                        work, we need to ensure that a lot of the vested interests
going to be fast-tracked, we care only about those                       work with us, whether it is local authorities, civil servants,
schools.                                                                 unions or teachers. A number of teachers liked the
   The right hon. Gentleman also said that the Bill is                   grant-maintained system but then found it abolished in
deeply divisive and undermines social cohesion. Now I                    1998 after a new Government came in, so they are
do not know about other Members, but I do not think                      nervous. We need to do everything we can to give them
that uniformity is the same as social cohesion. I do not                 confidence that the freedoms that we seek to give them
know whether he wants schools that are uniformly bad                     this time are real, and will allow teachers, head teachers
or uniformly good, but I know what Government Members                    and parents who have a vision to implement that vision
are striving for. No one can say that the current system                 and ensure that we have higher educational attainment.
delivers the educational attainment that our country                     That is what education should be about—not shiny new
needs, and, although the right hon. Gentleman talked                     buildings, not some argument that we are going to
about the Bill being deeply divisive, he did not address                 punish the poor, but ensuring that we get better attainment.
the fact that schools will not be able to change their                   That is what I got from my education, and what I think
admissions procedures once they become academies. So                     we all got, and it is what we have to drive through our
there is no chance of a school applying to become an                     system.
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7.31 pm                                                           Gavin Barwell: The hon. Lady is repeating the line
                                                               that the shadow Secretary of State started with, which
   Shabana Mahmood (Birmingham, Ladywood) (Lab):               is that the Bill is a perversion of Labour’s academy
I am grateful, Madam Deputy Speaker, for the opportunity       policy. However, the then Prime Minister Tony Blair
to add my voice to this important debate about the             said on 24 October 2005:
future of our education system. Good education, available
                                                                  “We want every school to be able quickly and easily to become
to all, is the foundation stone of our society, which is
                                                               a self-governing independent…school.”
why it arouses such passion in all parts of the House, as
we have heard in all today’s speeches.                         How is that inconsistent with the Bill?
   The Bill is intended to change the education system           Shabana Mahmood: Tony Blair is no longer the leader
as we know it, and has been presented in a manner that         of my party, and I was elected in May 2010. Although I
has deliberately prevented wide debate, discussion and         agree with much of what he did when he was Prime
consultation. Rather than leading to greater social justice,   Minister and leader of our great party, I do not agree
it will deliver only social segregation. For those reasons,    with all of what he said and did. That was not the point
I oppose it.                                                   that I was making, however, which was about the Bill
   The first problem is the way in which the debate has        and the fact that it focuses on pre-approving outstanding
come before the House. I am a new Member and still             schools. That gives away what it is all about—creating a
learning the ways and methods of the House, but it was         two-tier system.
with alarm and shock that I found that the only other
legislation that had been passed through the House               Gavin Barwell rose—
with such speed and lack of debate was anti-terror
legislation, which is understandable, and the Dangerous           Shabana Mahmood: I wish to make some progress.
Dogs Act 1991, which is hardly an example that we                 In any case, the fact that so many schools are currently
should all seek to follow. I have to ask whether that is       outstanding shows that excellence is alive and well in
what the so-called new politics is all about—employing         the maintained system and that there is no need to move
such speed and lack of debate to bring about legislation       towards the free schools model.
that will fundamentally alter the way in which education,
that most enabling of public services, is delivered. The          One of the freedoms that the Bill promises new
Bill should be given proper scrutiny and there should be       academies and free schools is freedom from local authority
a proper opportunity for widespread consultation with          control. I have to ask where is the evidence that a system
the general public, parents and stakeholders.                  that is entirely independent, with schools free to do as
                                                               they please, is more effective than what we have at the
   I suggest that the reason why the Bill has come before      moment. Under Labour, academies were successful because
us in this way is that the coalition Government know           disadvantaged schools were given the opportunity for a
that it will not hold up to scrutiny, which is why they        fresh start and a clear focus, with a dedicated commitment
will not allow it. They know that they have used the           to making them better. In many ways they were more
previous Labour Government’s academies programme               Government-controlled, rather than being free.
as a way to sell their version of academies, which are
something entirely different—so different that they should        Furthermore, I thought that the new politics was all
not be called the same thing. The Labour academies             about engaging with the public and including them in
programme was about social justice, whereas the Bill is        the decisions that are made, especially at local level.
about the free market.                                         Well, many people see education as one of their major
                                                               public services, and they would expect to be able to
   The focus of our programme was to target areas of           monitor, control and hold to account that service through
disadvantage and inequality, to seek to ensure that all        their elected local authority. To break that link through
pupils, regardless of their socio-economic background,         the apparatus of the state is profoundly undemocratic
had access to high-quality education. The Bill has no          and should be rejected.
such focus, as shown by the fact that under the current
policy, schools that are considered outstanding by Ofsted         New academies and free schools are also promised
are to be pre-approved. Grammar schools will also be           freedom from the national curriculum. I agree entirely
allowed to become academies, something expressly               with the right hon. Member for Yeovil (Mr Laws), who
prevented by the Labour Government. That can lead              stated on “Newsnight” on 10 March this year that that
only to social segregation, not social justice.                was one of the “dottiest” aspects of Tory education
                                                               policy. If only such frankness about it were to be found
   The Government would have us all believe that they          now on his party’s Benches. On the same programme,
are progressives now, and that the Liberal Democrat            the Secretary of State said about the national curriculum:
partners in the coalition have an influence in government         “I think it is important that we have a piece of infrastructure in
that is bringing a progressive dimension to their collective   the public realm which people can admire and which they can use
policies. I ask the Lib Dems to examine the Bill, recognise    as a benchmark but which we can depart from where appropriate”.
that it allows for an expansion of selection and ask           That shows a fundamental misunderstanding. The national
themselves what on earth is progressive about that.            curriculum determines what our children learn to equip
   It is perverse also that a school that is already deemed    them—each and every one, bar none—to make their
outstanding will get a chance to become better. Surely         way in the world and especially the world of work. It is
that move by the Secretary of State, more than anything        about passing on knowledge from one generation to
else, gives away his true motive for the Bill. If it were      another, which is an important part of the make-up of
about driving up standards and improving the quality           our society. To allow some schools to opt out and
of education that our children receive, he would have          determine what our kids learn according to the whims
made express mention of those matters in the Bill and          of a particular head teacher or governing body is,
would not have pre-approved already outstanding schools.       indeed, dotty.
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  Mr Gyimah: That happens already—it is private schools,          Elizabeth Truss: I care about pupils in the schools
and people pay for them. What is wrong with allowing            and whether they achieve what they need to and should
teachers to decide what is best for the kids in their school,   achieve. They have been let down by 13 years of failed
and why cannot people in the state sector have that?            policies. I shall outline exactly why they have been let
                                                                down, why teachers are not empowered to teach in the
   Shabana Mahmood: Because it is important for the             way they see fit and why the teaching profession has
state sector to set out the way in which we believe our         been denigrated.
children should be taught. There should be a minimum
standard and a minimum curriculum so that children                 Shabana Mahmood: Does the hon. Lady accept that
all get the same level and type of education, no matter         there is a difference between having a policy, wanting to
what background they are from or what their social              get it on the statute book as quickly as possible and
class is. That must not have an impact on what they             feeling passionately about it—and I have no doubt that
learn at school.                                                she feels passionately about it—and bypassing proper
   I am also deeply concerned that the duty to consult          scrutiny in a Bill Committee and giving people outside
on the part of those wishing to set up an academy or a          and in the House time to scrutinise it fully and ascertain
free school is extremely weak. There was not one at all         its impact?
to begin with, but the one that has been inserted since
the debate in the House of Lords is still too flexible and         Elizabeth Truss: I thought that what was happening
therefore weak. There must be a full and meaningful             today and later this week was scrutiny—though not
consultation on the initial application with parents,           very much, looking at the Opposition Benches.
teachers, children, other staff, the local authority and
others. Schools are the heart of local communities. The            Whatever some Labour Members have said, the Bill
inadequate provisions for consultation will sever that          is a continuation of one of the previous Labour
link and must be tightened up.                                  Government’s successful policies, which allowed a few
                                                                schools to become academies. We have therefore seen
   I conclude by drawing the attention of the House to a        such a policy work. However, the vast majority of the
recent Ipsos MORI poll, which showed that 95% of                money that the previous Government spent was not
people wanted a good local school under the control of          spent wisely. The money for academies was the small
the local authority. There is no need to spend millions         proportion that was spent wisely, but we experienced a
of pounds on creating an entirely new structure when a          huge increase in centralisation and bureaucracy under
good regime for schools exists and has delivered rising         the previous Government. A vast array of quangos was
standards year on year, especially where that new structure     set up—for example, the Qualifications and Curriculum
will lead to greater social segregation.                        Development Agency; Ofqual; the British Educational
   What makes a difference to standards is the quality of       Communications and Technology Agency; Partnerships
teaching in a school. I was lucky enough to have some           for Schools, and Every Child Matters. A whole series of
fantastic teachers, and I am convinced that whatever            strategies and interventions took place.
educational successes I have enjoyed were down to their
hard work and encouragement. Changing a school’s                  Shabana Mahmood: Will the hon. Lady give way?
structural status does not mean that one has waved
a magic wand and that teaching and learning will
automatically improve. Instead, as a result of the Bill,           Elizabeth Truss: No, I want to continue with my
we will move to a two-tier system, and systemic unfairness      point, and I have already given way to the hon. Lady.
will be built into our education provision. We will all be         Every strategy dictated to teachers what they should
worse off for it.                                               do. That took away decision making from the teaching
                                                                profession and teachers’ ability to lead the class in the
7.40 pm                                                         way they saw fit. The curriculum became increasingly
                                                                prescriptive, with bodies such as the QCDA and Ofqual
   Elizabeth Truss (South West Norfolk) (Con): The
                                                                devising examinations that were more modulised and
hon. Member for Birmingham, Ladywood (Shabana
                                                                standardised. Instead of encouraging every child to
Mahmood) mentioned speed and several other hon.
                                                                learn and develop a love of a subject and educating
Members referred to impatience. Yes, we are impatient
                                                                each child’s mind, teachers were encouraged to teach to
because we have had 13 years of failed education policies,
                                                                test. Labour Members proclaim results as improvements,
which have not delivered for the poorest in our society.
                                                                but much of that was to do with the fact that, as the
Education spending per pupil doubled from 1997 to
                                                                hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent Central (Tristram Hunt)
2009, yet the trajectory of improvement in GCSE results
                                                                said, teachers were rewarded on results.
has not changed since the mid-1990s. According to the
international league tables of the OECD’s Programme
for International Student Assessment—PISA—we still                 Guy Opperman (Hexham) (Con): Does my hon. Friend
have a massive difference between the top and bottom            agree that Labour Members have gone—[HON. MEMBERS:
achievers.                                                      “They’ve gone.”] Indeed, they have gone—there are but
                                                                five left. Does my hon. Friend agree that they have gone
   Lisa Nandy (Wigan) (Lab): Does the hon. Lady accept          from being anti-Tory in 1997 to a Blairite conversion,
that one of the reasons why so many Labour Members              which they now disdain, to all talking Balls?
feel strongly about the speed with which the Bill is going
through is, as my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham,          Elizabeth Truss: My hon. Friend makes a good point.
Ladywood (Shabana Mahmood) said, that schools are               However, the Opposition seem confused. One Labour
the heart of communities and, unless they are consulted,        Member has argued for more academic qualifications
the heart will be ripped out of them and children will be       while others have said that the qualifications that the
let down in the process?                                        Labour Government introduced were fantastic. They
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[Elizabeth Truss]                                             more professional autonomy for them and a greater
                                                              respect and esteem for the profession, which would be
cannot agree. They have not come up with a consistent         helpful for the unions in the long term.
approach to our proposed legislation. The principle of           I urge Ministers not to heed the calls to slow down—I
autonomy has been heavily road tested and proved              am sure that they will not—because we have waited
successful in the small minority of schools in which it       long enough for academy schools that serve not just a
has been implemented. The previous Government should          few people. I applaud existing academies, but the children
have set up more academies, but instead, they competed        in our country who do not go to them have waited long
in all the centralising tendencies, on which the previous     enough for a good education. The Opposition are
Education Secretary was particularly keen.                    complacent about our education. We are not succeeding;
   The teaching unions have also been involved in             we are failing internationally. There is a huge gap between
centralising the system. In 2003, there were agreements       the attainment of top students and low-achieving students.
between the teaching unions and the Government about          The Conservatives’ motivation is to close that gap, and
how teachers operate in the classroom, how their lessons      I urge the Government to carry on.
are covered, what preparation and assessment work
they do. There are such practices in no other job. There
                                                              7.51 pm
has been a vast increase in teaching assistants and cover
supervisors. That is not to say that I am against those          Lisa Nandy (Wigan) (Lab): I thank the hon. Member
people, but decisions should be up to head teachers and       for South West Norfolk (Elizabeth Truss). She certainly
not governed by a weight of a paperwork from Whitehall.       enlivened the debate, but I could not disagree with her
   There was glimmer of light—several hon. Members            more. I should like to put on record my opposition both
on these Benches have referred to the former Prime            to the Bill and the speed with which it is being rushed
Minister, Mr Tony Blair—with the academies programme.         through the House, which we have discussed.
Yet the academies were a trickle rather than a flood. We         The Bill aims to break up the local authority family,
had only 200 schools out of a total of 3,000 that could       leaving schools free to go it alone in competition with
have become academies. In 2007, when the right hon.           one another. As many of my hon. Friends have said, the
Member for Morley and Outwood (Ed Balls) took over            Bill is entirely different from the academies legislation
as Secretary of State for Education, rather than openly       that Labour introduced. Some of us had reservations
oppose the academies programme, he made it increasingly       about those measures, but some of us were strongly
difficult for schools to become academies and restricted      supportive of them. The Bill contains no requirement
the arrangements for, for example, the curriculum. Those      for schools to consult their local authority before they
arrangements were made much tighter.                          choose to convert to academy status. For that reason,
                                                              I share the view of the many teachers, governors and
   Mr Ward: As I tried to say in my speech, if the            parents from my constituency who have lobbied me and
freedoms—staffing, curriculum, release from all the           who believe that the absence of that requirement will
paperwork and so on—are so useful, why do we not              lead to chaos.
extend them to every maintained school? Why is structure         For that as much as anything else, the Bill warrants
important? The main improvements that took place              further consideration by the House. I remind Government
through the national challenge did not require a change       Members that the Bill is about children out in the real
in structure. An individual interim executive board in a      world, in places such as Wigan, and the opportunities
school that is in special measures turns a school round       that they will be given or denied as a result. The Bill
without a change in structure. Why are hon. Members           deserves more scrutiny than the Government are prepared
so obsessed with structure?                                   to give it. I am angry on behalf of those children that
                                                              that is being denied.
   Elizabeth Truss: I think the answer is that there are so
many national regulations. I am concerned about that            Mr Gyimah: Will the hon. Lady give way?
rather than local authorities, which have often been put
under pressure by the national Government. For example,         Lisa Nandy: I think we have heard enough from the
I referred to the 2003 terms and conditions agreement         hon. Gentleman.
between the teaching unions and the Government. Schools         We heard a great deal from those on the Treasury
need the ability to make decisions, to have agreements        Bench about the supposed benefits of the Bill, but the
between teachers and head teachers and to make their          question the Government ought to ask themselves is
own work force arrangements. I would like more schools        not, “What are the benefits?” but, “Who will lose out as
to take up the opportunity offered—it is the way forward.     a result of this legislation?” I can answer that last
I think that it empowers teachers, who often enjoy their      question, but only in part because of the lack of scrutiny
jobs more. I have visited several academies, and teachers’    that they are prepared to give the Bill. I can tell the
excitement, engagement and motivation are visible.            Government and the House that primarily, children in
   The opportunity provided by the fact that we will          schools that are not academies will lose out. The pool of
have more schools than the 200-odd we have at the             funding that local authorities have to meet central costs
moment will attract more people into the profession.          will be reduced. That is not in doubt, but we do not yet
Interestingly, someone asked whether the teaching unions      know how many schools will convert to academy status,
could become involved in academies. Rather than being         and therefore how dramatic that shortfall in funding
a roadblock to reform, it would be helpful if the teaching    will be.
unions supported academies. That would bring huge               We heard very powerfully from my hon. Friend the
benefits to teachers. We would probably see better rewards    Member for North West Durham (Pat Glass) about the
for teachers in the long term, and we would certainly see     impact of the Bill on children with special educational
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needs. I cannot believe that Members of this House are            Mr Graham Stuart: The hon. Lady makes a powerful
prepared to walk through the Division Lobby to vote            case. None the less, in the past 13 years, we have seen the
for this Bill knowing the impact that it will have on          gap between rich and poor, and the lead that independent
some of the most vulnerable children in this society.          schools have over state schools, widen. Labour policies
Government Members fail to understand that freedom             failed in 13 years in government. I know she will be a
for one group of children can represent a loss of freedom      very thoughtful and good member of my Committee,
for others. I have not heard that recognised by Government     but what positive prescriptions can we use to make up
Members, and I would like to.                                  for the failures of the past 13 years?

   Gavin Barwell: Is the hon. Lady aware that academies           Lisa Nandy: I do not in any sense accept the hon.
receive none of the council funding for SEN administration,    Gentleman’s point, distinguished though he is as the
assessment or co-ordination?                                   newly elected Chair of the Education Committee. I
                                                               certainly do not hope to upset him at this juncture,
  Lisa Nandy: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his               having just been elected to that Committee. I worked for
remarks, but they do not change at all the point I was         the past five years with some of the most disadvantaged
making or that many of my hon. Friends have made.              children in this country at the Children’s Society, and
                                                               I can tell him that the Bill will not help at all; it will
   The principle behind the Bill is what most concerns         hinder. I do not accept his characterisation of how the
me. It takes no account of the impact on other schools.        education system has worked for those children in the
Competition cannot be the right approach when it               past 13 years. I hope he is satisfied with that, because I
creates winners and losers among children. I am not            have given my word to my constituents that I will raise
prepared to see children in Wigan lose out as a result of      their concerns in the House, because they cannot get a
the Bill. My question to those who are prepared to             hearing directly with the Minister.
support the measure is this: which children would they
like to lose out as a result? Ministers say that academies        It is therefore important for those schools that might
will be required to work with another school, but how          opt for academy status to understand what they and the
will that help the latter compensate for the loss of           children they represent might lose. I have looked closely
funding that the Bill represents? Funding is not the only      at the proposals—such as they are—and it is clear that
thing that enables schools to succeed—on that I think          the Education Secretary is replacing democratic local
we all agree—but it is important and it can be a lifeline.     control with direct control of new academies. That is
                                                               not devolution of power, but centralisation, and we
   A range of critics have lined up to agree with me and       have heard what that could mean for local schools.
other hon. Members. They have pointed out that for all
the schools that are enabled to do well by the Bill, and          The role of the New Schools Network has been
that will have more money and greater independence,            touched on only very briefly so far in the debate. The
life will be made more difficult for other schools. Children   NSN has been given the contract to advise schools on
in schools that are not rated outstanding tend to be the       becoming academies. I have asked a number of questions
most disadvantaged. That is clear from the statistics          of the Education Secretary about the NSN, and it
provided to me by the Department for Education just a          merits further attention. It was established in December
few weeks ago, which show that children in outstanding         2009 and appears to be run by former advisers to him.
primary and secondary schools are significantly less           It was recently awarded a £500,000 contract, but I
likely than children in schools with other ratings to be       cannot get clarity on how that came to be awarded. It is
in receipt of free school meals.                               incredibly important that we understand how that happened
                                                               and the role of the NSN, because that goes to the heart
   My concern is for the children in my constituency           of whether people can have confidence in the system
who have lost their child trust funds in the past few          that he proposes and the underlying motives behind it.
weeks. They will now not come into contact with children
from less deprived backgrounds, because Sure Start                I also wish to sound another note of caution for
eligibility is to be tightened. They could lose the chance     schools that may be considering opting for academy
to go to university under forthcoming proposals, and           status. The Department has offered £25,000 to schools
they are now asked to fend for themselves in a competitive     for start-up costs, but acknowledges that they will be
system in which they will have very little chance of           more than that, and that schools are expected to contribute.
breaking through. Surely that deserves more scrutiny           As a school governor, I am aware that those costs can be
from the House and outside.                                    enormous. The NUT says that it knows of schools that
   If, as we have heard, the point is to hand power back       converted to trust status and had to spend more than
to schools, why not ask those who make schools what            £75,000 to do so. It is no wonder that in the many
they are? Unison points out that there has been no             briefings that I was sent before this debate so many
consultation with those affected—whether parents, teachers,    concerns were expressed by such a diverse range of
children or the wider community. If the aim is to trust        groups. It is also why this Bill merits further consideration
professionals on the front line, where is the consultation     in this House and outside before it becomes law.
with them? Our outstanding school in Wigan—Rose                  I do not believe, on the basis of what has been
Bridge high school—has agreed to consult parents and           produced so far, that the measures in the Bill will do
staff as a condition of any decision it might make,            anything other than create greater social segregation, in
because Rose Bridge is a responsible school that cares         which those who can afford to may do better, but will
about the wider school community and children throughout       do so under the state system with subsidy from the state.
the borough, and that understands that the public service      I am appalled by that prospect and I have given my
ethos of working together for the benefit of all children      word to the parents, staff, governors and children in
is what underpins the strength of our education system.        Wigan that I will oppose it all the way.
99               Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010               Academies Bill [Lords]                   100

8.1 pm                                                         share of what the council is spending on central services.
   Gavin Barwell (Croydon Central) (Con): The main             In actual fact, two main factors drive improvement. In
issue before us in the Bill is whether we should have          relation to the academies set up by the previous
more independent state schools. I wish to consider the         Government, in which under-performing schools were
international evidence, the national evidence and a local      taken over, what made the difference was the change in
example from my constituency.                                  perception of that school in the local community, the
                                                               chance for a fresh start and the bringing in of new
   Internationally, the charter schools in New York have       management. However, head teachers in my constituency
narrowed the rich-poor achievement gap by 86% in               tell me that freedoms are also part of it, not so much
maths and 66% in English, thus addressing the point made       freedom from the council—the only freedom from the
by the hon. Member for Wigan (Lisa Nandy) about                council is having the chance to spend money that it
who would benefit from these reforms. In particular, the       spends on the school’s behalf—but freedom from central
Harlem children’s zone charters have completely closed         Government control on pay and conditions, curriculum,
the black-white achievement gap at both elementary             term dates and lesson length.
and middle school level. My constituency in south London
has a very diverse population and I am very conscious             I have given examples of what my local council is
of how many black boys have been let down by our               doing, but sadly not all councils are as progressive as
education system in the past. I accept that the proposals      the Conservative administration in Croydon. One crucial
are not a panacea and that there are counter-examples,         element of the Bill, therefore, is the removal of the
but the evidence from New York is very encouraging.            monopoly on setting up new schools from local authorities.
                                                               In our country, thousands of parents are told every year
   At national level, a study by PricewaterhouseCoopers        that the inn is full—that the schools they want to send
found that the average annual increase in GCSE five            their children to do not have any places, and they must
A*-C passes was twice as quick in academies as in              either send them to a school they do not want to send
equivalent schools in the maintained sector.                   them to or educate them at home. That is unacceptable.
   In my constituency, I have the example of Ashburton            The shadow Secretary of State quoted Professor
school. The previous Labour administration of Croydon          David Wood’s findings about a potential new school in
council rebuilt the school, but that had failed to solve       Kirklees. Professor Wood said that a new school would
the problem of low performance. I give credit to the
                                                               “have a negative impact on other schools in the area in the form
previous Government for providing the funding to rebuild       of surplus places”.
the school. The Conservative administration that took
                                                               I find it incredible that the shadow Secretary of State
over the council in 2006 decided to close the school and
                                                               does not seem to understand that unless the system has
replace it with a new academy. My Labour opponent at
                                                               some surplus places, there is no choice for parents. It is
the general election opposed that decision, calling
                                                               inevitable that some parents will have to send their children
Ashburton “a good community school”, despite the
                                                               to a school that they do not want to send them to.
facts that fewer than 13% of pupils achieved five A*-C
passes including English and maths, that hardly any               Labour Members seem to think that the Government
local parents chose to send their children to the school       are talking about giving these freedoms only to outstanding
and that the behaviour of the children on their way to         schools. In fact, the Bill is about allowing all schools to
and from school was a massive issue in the local community.    apply for academy status. Outstanding schools will not
                                                               require a sponsor, so they can be fast-tracked, but all
   The new Oasis academy, Shirley Park, opened in
                                                               schools will have that freedom. Will the Minister give
September. Under the inspirational leadership of its
                                                               some idea of the timescale for other schools? In my
head, Glen Denham, there is already a marked difference
                                                               area, Coloma convent, Archbishop Tenison’s and Wolsey
in the attitudes of the local community towards pupils
                                                               infant school are all outstanding and have expressed an
at the school. Last year, 94 parents chose that school as
                                                               interest. Other schools, such as Shirley high and St Mary’s,
their first preference, but this year it was 142. We wait to
                                                               are not rated outstanding, but have also expressed interest.
see this summer what the GCSE results will show, but
the most powerful case for the school is made by talking         Mr Gibb: I may be able to help my hon. Friend by
to the pupils. I guess all Members visit schools in their      saying that the fast-track process is to enable schools to
constituencies, and one of the most positive signs is          be ready to open as academies from this September, but
when the head teacher allows you to go around the              other schools can open beyond that in November, January,
school with pupils and no staff present. I heard from          April or September next year. The fast track is just
the pupils themselves what they think of the school.           about this September.
They told me clearly that, under the previous regime,
there were no boundaries, that discipline was incredibly         Gavin Barwell: That is a helpful clarification and
poor and that it was impossible to learn. Now they have        answers some of the points that have been made by
clear boundaries, supportive teachers and the school           Labour Members suggesting a bias in favour of outstanding
has been transformed.                                          schools.
   Selsdon high school in my constituency is to become           The shadow Secretary of State tried to give the
an academy in September. It was caught up in the               impression that the entire system of state education was
Building Schools for the Future announcement, because          being ripped up. If he really believed that, it is strange
it was due to get funding for a rebuild, but it is one of      that we have not seen more Labour Members in the
those schools that Ministers are now considering. I            Chamber during this debate. He tried to claim that the
shall not say any more because I have spoken to the            Bill was a perversion of the Labour party’s approach to
Minister and he is aware of the issues at stake.               academies. In an earlier intervention, I cited remarks by
   Why do academies make a difference? The presumption         Tony Blair on 24 October 2005, when he said:
by some hon. Members is that the issue is money, but              “We want every school to be able quickly and easily to become
the principle is solely that academies should get their        a self-governing independent…school”.
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What the Government are doing may be a departure                I believe that there is an issue in relation to the impact
from what the previous Secretary of State was doing,            on local councils. May we have more clarity on what
but it certainly is not a departure from what the Labour        areas of council spending will not be devolved down to
Government under Tony Blair was planning to do.                 academies?
Indeed, the Government are fulfilling the promise that             The Secretary of State spoke earlier about the role of
he made.                                                        local authorities. My own council often finds itself
   The shadow Secretary of State’s main objection was           defending schools that are not performing particularly
that the proposals would create a two-tier system, but          well. I would much rather that local authorities were the
some of my hon. Friends have already made the point             champion of parents in their area and stood up for
that that is what we have at the moment. Some schools           higher standards, rather than making the case for schools
are academies and some are not. If parents have the             that were underperforming.
money to move into the catchment area of a good school,            On consultation, we do not want a bureaucratic
their children will get a good education. If parents are        arrangement that is going to slow the process down.
locked into a particular area by lack of money, they            Like my hon. Friend the Member for South West Norfolk
have to put up with the school in that area. There              (Elizabeth Truss), I am keen to see progress made
is huge so-called social segregation in our schools. One        quickly. However, it is important to have consultation,
school has just 4.2% of families on income-related              and not just with parents in the school in question. When
benefits, but at the other end of the spectrum there are        we try to change things in schools, we often find that the
schools with nearly 70% of families on income-related           existing parents might have one view, while parents in
benefits.                                                       the community around the school who are unhappy
   The shadow Secretary of State claimed that the Bill          with the school might have a completely different one.
would widen the gap—that somehow allowing outstanding,             The Bill places before us this fundamental question:
good and satisfactory schools to get better is a bad            what is the best way to raise standards in our schools?
thing. That is the classic Labour argument of trying to         I particularly admired the comments of the hon. Member
hold the good down in order to narrow the gap. Surely           for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman), the former Chairman
what we should do is try to get everybody to improve.           of the Select Committee. In complete contrast to the
The Secretary of State confirmed that these schools will        shadow Secretary of State’s political speech, he recognised
partner with a good school, and that is an important            that Members on both sides of the House have a
element. I would not want a free-for-all. I want to see         passion for driving up education standards, and that we
schools collaborating and working together. Even when           simply disagree about the best way to do it. That is a
it comes to outstanding or good schools, there are too          reasonable disagreement that should be aired and debated
many parents who do not have confidence in those                in the Chamber, and we should not imply that some
schools and choose to move out of the area or to the            people simply do not care about the issue.
independent sector, and we want those schools to improve.          The fundamental question is what is the best way to
We want parents to have confidence in their local schools,      raise school standards. The previous Government believed
but they can have concerns even about some of the               that the best way was by driving standards from the top
schools that we class as good or outstanding. The               down. Indeed, in the debate in the other place, Opposition
Government’s policy on the pupil premium should give            Members were clear that the improvements made by
schools an incentive to take pupils from disadvantaged          academies were the result of their getting all the Government
backgrounds.                                                    attention. They almost suggested that it was the Department
   My final point in response to Labour Members is              for Education that was responsible for those improvements.
that they seem to lack confidence in the teachers and              Our belief is that the best way to drive up standards is
parents of children from deprived areas. In my experience,      to allow a choice of schools. There should be some
the vast majority of teachers are motivated by the desire       surplus places to allow people to choose, and we must
to help the least well-off kids. Rather than hearing a lot      give schools freedom so that they can differentiate and
of publicity about parents setting up these new free            offer parents different things. Different children might
schools, I hope that we will see teacher groups going           well benefit from different styles of education. We should
into some of my most deprived communities and using             empower parents in that way and give them that choice.
this legislation to drive up standards in those areas.          That bottom-up approach is the way to drive up standards,
   Ben Gummer: On free schools, is it not the case that         not the top-down approach of the previous Government.
Sweden has a couple of thousand people in the independent       It is with great pleasure that I speak in favour of the
sector, while here the figure for children in the independent   Bill, which I believe will make a profound difference to
sector is a rather shameful 7%? Surely a good result of         parents and children across our country.
the free school policy would be to bring that number
                                                                8.13 pm
down and bring more people back into the state sector.
                                                                   Mr David Lammy (Tottenham) (Lab): It is a pleasure
  Gavin Barwell: I agree with my hon. Friend.                   to follow my London colleague, the hon. Member for
  I should like to address a couple of questions to the         Croydon Central (Gavin Barwell), who has some very
Minister. First, the hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent             strong schools in his constituency. I am also pleased to
Central (Tristram Hunt), who has now left the Chamber,          follow my hon. Friend the Member for Wigan (Lisa
made some good points about the importance of academic          Nandy), who made an excellent speech.
qualifications, although they were rather at odds with             I hope that Members on both sides of the House
the record of the Labour Government. I understand               agree that the street in which one was born should not
that the Government have now accepted an amendment              determine one’s educational achievement. Success is
in the Lords to ensure that academies are counted as            always at the heart of educational discussion in the
public bodies under freedom of information legislation.         House and, for most communities, success has five
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[Mr David Lammy]                                                  That is hugely important, as these are the very same
                                                               families who, as we think back to the 1980s, had parents
ingredients. One is of course education. The second is         or older brothers and sisters streamed off to do the CSE
employment, as a result, I hope, of that education. The        exam—one in which they could not achieve their best in
third is a culture of aspiration. The fourth is parenting,     the way others doing GCSE O-levels could. That left its
and, for those without parents or who have problematic         mark—one that we have often attempted to correct
parents, there will be youth workers in loco parentis and      with our emphasis on basic skills, numeracy, literacy,
others in the voluntary sector in the community coming         unionlearn, and the community response to education
alongside. The fifth is community. I hope that, when we        as well. It is not just about structure; it is absolutely
think about the role of local education authorities in         about standards.
the debate tonight, we will acknowledge that all those            Standards were at the heart of our drive on academies,
ingredients can come together to make a difference.            concentrating our efforts. There were 188 of them, many
This is not just about the schools but about the youth         of them failing schools in the most deprived areas, and
services provided alongside the school that the local          we were giving them a fresh start, renewing them with
authority is in charge of delivering. It is not just about     new buildings. Yes, we gave the new leadership of those
the status or structure of a school, or whether it is an       schools the freedom to innovate. It was, I think, the
academy or not, but about how we reach into communities,       emphasis on standards that saw the advances made.
lift aspiration and ensure that all young people can           Academies were, of course, largely based in inner-city
achieve their dreams.                                          areas. A large proportion of them—27%—served black
   Against that backdrop, the fact that just 14% of the        and ethnic minority communities. There was real innovation
young people in my constituency were getting five good         in the system.
GCSEs when we came to power in 1997 can only be
                                                                  My concern is the hostility from the Government side
described as despairing, decaying and, to some extent,
                                                               to local education authorities. I ask why they are so
the road to doom. That meant that 86% were getting
                                                               hostile to our means of pooling resources, bringing
fewer than that. We were sending more young people to
                                                               them alongside schools, giving them specialist advice,
prison than to university, and that was replicated in
                                                               helping them organise admissions and so forth. Local
some of the most deprived constituencies in the country.
                                                               education authorities were set up in 1902 by the
We should reflect deeply on that when we talk about the
                                                               Conservatives, and they have served us well. The Bill that
importance of education to life outcomes.
                                                               we are voting on tonight will pave the way the break-up
   The nature of our debates on education over the             of local authorities over time.
years reveals a preoccupation with structure. For my
party, following the Butler Act in 1944, much of that             What will we now say to the schools left behind as
preoccupation consisted of our deep hostility to grammar       schools scramble to get academy status? Let us not
schools and our desire for a comprehensive system in           pretend that this is not about money. The Department
which all young people would be of equal worth, and            for Education website shows that this is about money
would have comprehensive access to quality education           because it helps schools model how much more of it
across the country. Some Conservative Members—perhaps          they would make. And why primary schools? What
because of their proximity to independent schools—seem         evidence is there that primary schools, particularly single-
to suggest that the state system should be freed and           form entry primary schools, are even equipped to take
given the ability to innovate, to replicate the arrangements   on this extra load?
in the independent sector. References have been made              On that basis, we challenge this new system, which
to the changes that we have made in governing bodies,          will disperse the efforts and advances made by academies,
as well as to grant-maintained status and direct control.      and we question much that has been said. I am very
That is all about structure.                                   concerned about the equality impact assessment of the
   The great achievement of the Labour Government              new scheme. We are already seeing in the academies that
over the past 13 years was—yes, of course—to make              girls are not making advances, that ethnic minorities
some changes to the structure and to introduce academies,      are not—
but particularly to have an eye on quality and standards,
and to get into the classroom, and to be alongside               Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order.
teachers and head teachers in driving up quality. One
Conservative Member disparaged classroom assistants,
but they serve to provide two or three adults in a             8.23 pm
classroom to help to drive up those standards. Excellence
in schools was about developing pedagogy, particularly            Mr Dominic Raab (Esher and Walton) (Con): It is
to drive up standards for those who had been consistently      fair to say that we all agree on the need to drive up
left behind. Over the years, we have debated the challenges    standards in our schools because education is a vital
that exist for white, disaffected communities and, as the      public good in its own right; because it is critical for
hon. Member for Croydon Central pointed out, for black         Britain to compete in the global economy; and because
boys, in order to drive those standards up. We were            it is the key to social mobility—the linchpin of a fair
engaged in those schools, and the figure of 14% in my          society.
constituency that I mentioned earlier is today 66%.               This Bill is unusual in that it builds on innovation in
That is what we have achieved. It means that when I            schools policy that dates back 25 years at least—from
served as the Minister for Higher Education, I served in       the ground-breaking city technology colleges introduced
a constituency where we had seen not just a small rise in      under the Conservative Administration through to Tony
young people going to university, but one of almost            Blair’s academy reforms. It would be remiss not to pay
100% in constituents going to university, and in young         tribute to the contributions made from all sides of the
people making their way to apprenticeships.                    House to our starting point today.
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   On the Government side, however, we are restless to           Chamber to ensure that it reflects an objective assessment
go further because the drive for higher standards hit a          of real need. The Education Secretary will know from
roadblock under the last Government, which left 40% of           the “Hidden Surrey” report that Surrey—yes, leafy
primary school pupils falling short of basic standards           Surrey—has seven wards with double the national average
in reading, writing, maths and science; half the children        level of child poverty. It was neglected by the last
on free school meals leaving primary school without              Government’s arbitrary deprivation indices. That is just
basic English and maths; and half of all pupils unable           one example of the politicisation of local funding.
to achieve five good GCSEs.                                      There are many more in other parts of the country, and
   No one can reasonably suggest that no progress has            I hope that Ministers will address them.
been made in recent years, but neither can anyone                   Clause 5, and the arrangements that accompany the
seriously claim to be satisfied when between 2000 and            Bill, deal with a further issue, that of accountability. No
2006—the Education Secretary has already made the                school can become an academy without consultation
point, but it is worth repeating—15-year-olds in this            and a resolution by the governors. The idea that parasitic
country fell down the OECD international rankings:               sponsors can sideline all the parents and all the teachers
from eighth to 24th in maths, from seventh to 17th in            is an over-peddled myth. The truth is that the real risk
reading, and with a similar decline in science.                  to our schools and the real threat to our children come
   This Bill seeks to resuscitate the drive for excellence       not from putting parents, teachers and community groups
in our schools. It is based on certain core convictions,         in charge of our children’s schooling, but from the
such as the belief that pluralism and competition are            overweening, over-regulating, overbearing intrusions of
a powerful motor to drive up standards. In 2009, as              an increasingly arbitrary and arrogant state bureaucracy
already mentioned, academies saw GCSE results increase           built up by the last Government.
at double the national average rate. We also have a belief          In their March report, Policy Exchange and the New
in innovation—yes, trial and error—because we think it           Schools Network convincingly argued the case for less
must overcome the dogma that demands that no school              state interference, highlighting in particular the warping
may thrive unless all schools always progress at precisely       effect of Ofsted’s non-educational priorities. Nothing
the same speed, which is a recipe for stagnation in              better illustrates the perverse political correctness in the
standards of teaching. Ofsted’s last annual report illustrates   higher echelons of the current educational bureaucracy
the point: of 30 academies, 17—more than half—were               than the suggestion by the outgoing chair of Ofsted
outstanding or good, while only five were inadequate.            that every school needs a useless teacher, so that children
We want to boost standards in the five, not hold back            can learn how to tolerate incompetence and “play”
the 17.                                                          authority. Nothing better illustrates the arrogance of
                                                                 state authority than the rules that forced a school in
   This Bill delivers on these principles by giving schools      Dulwich to report Oliver and Gillian Schonrock to
the freedom to innovate: freedom to set staff pay, to            social services because they wanted their children to
reward high performers and to attract the best talent;           cycle a one-mile route to school—a route that they
freedom to tailor the curriculum and the length of the           deem safe, and a routine that they believe will instil a
school day to the teaching needs of children, not Whitehall      much stronger sense of personal responsibility in their
targets; and the freedom to attract sponsors who, as the         children.
National Audit Office found last year, can bring high-quality
expertise and experience and build partnerships between             This nonsense has gone on for far too long. We must
schools and business. As the Sutton Trust report in 2008         free our children, teachers and parents from the suffocating
highlighted, the freedom given to academies has                  straitjacket of state control. The Bill is just the first
                                                                 legislative step in the right direction. I hope that modernisers
“led to instances of visionary leadership”.
                                                                 in all parties in the House will come together to clear
   The Bill addresses, head on, legitimate concerns about        away the vested interests blocking change, take this
the impact on children most in need. The pupil premium           once-in-a-generation opportunity to deliver the reform
for disadvantaged children will ensure that we invest            agenda that stalled under the last Government, and
most where it is needed most. I recognise other legitimate       secure the reforms that can drive educational excellence
concerns that have been raised—for example, about the            and benefit all our schools throughout the country.
standards of maths and English in some academies,
given their level and degree of specialisation. We must          8.31 pm
ensure that all children get to grips with basic numeracy
and literacy—the gateway to any further learning.                   Yasmin Qureshi (Bolton South East) (Lab): When I
                                                                 was selected as the parliamentary candidate for my
   We must also ensure that the implementation                   constituency, the editor of the Manchester Evening News
arrangements learn the lessons from the cost overruns            described me as a dyed-in-the-wool socialist. He was
previously associated with the building of some of the           being complimentary, and I took it as a compliment.
previous academies. So, too, we must build on the positive       That is my starting point.
findings by PricewaterhouseCoopers and the Sutton                   I believe in education that is free for everyone. I do
Trust—that flexible collaboration between academies,             not believe in selection criteria. I do not believe in a
local authorities, schools and universities helps to drive       system that says, “You can come in, but you cannot.” I
performance. Such collaboration, along with the pupil            do not believe in a system that says, “If you have a
premium, should address another concern—that academies           certain level of education or qualification, such as particular
might lead to a two-tier system of education.                    skills in maths or English, you can come to our school,
   I also draw attention to existing anomalies in relation       but otherwise—sorry, we don’t want you.” I believe that
to funding for our schools. I hope the Secretary of State        all schools should take kids of all abilities, because that
will review the schools funding formula to make it more          is the only way to bring about real levelling and equality
transparent and I hope we can all agree across the               in society.
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[Yasmin Qureshi]                                                 We are trying to save money in that way, yet at the
                                                              same time we are saying, “No, it’s fine if you want to
   People here sometimes talk of the golden age of            become exclusive schools and exclude people because
grammar schools, and reminisce about how brilliant            you want to maintain your so-called high standards; we
those schools were. Let me give an example of someone         are not interested in that.” Therefore, those schools
who would have been completely lost if the grammar            have the freedom to do that. That is not fair, and I think
school system had been all that we had. In Watford,           all Members on both sides of the House should be
where I grew up, we had some very good comprehensive          concerned about this elitist attitude—the attitude that
schools thanks to a Labour Government. Only one               says, “We must have these excellent schools which only
grammar school was left. If selection criteria had been       a few excellent people can attend.”
applied, I would have been shunted off to one of the             Let me give an example to explain why we need
old-fashioned sink schools where no one had a chance          mixed-ability schools. A junior school in Kilburn was
to go to university, and pupils were expected to leave        considered to be not so well performing, but then a lot
school at 15 or 16 and work as a shop assistant or in a       of middle-class professional people started sending their
factory. There were no real expectations of them. That        children to that school, and years down the road it was
did not happen to me, however. I went to a comprehensive      found that the performance of the school had gone up.
school; I took my A-levels, went to university and            That is what happens such when parents become involved
qualified as a barrister. I can honestly say that if we had   in ordinary schools—in what might be considered sink
not had comprehensive schools I would have been thrown        schools or less well-performing schools. When parents
on the scrapheap, notwithstanding all those golden            from different backgrounds are involved in schools,
reminiscences about grammar schools.                          standards rise even though there are mixed-ability children.
   Let us get real. Why should we have selection at all?         The issue of standards is what this debate should
Given that all these schools are state schools, paid for      always be about. We all talk about wanting to look after
by the taxpayers—you, me and everyone else—why                our children, yet all we hear about is exclusivity; all we
should they be able to act in such a way? People should       hear is, “We want better schools to get better.” There is
be able to send their children to schools that are as near    no mention in the Bill that there should perhaps be
as possible to their homes, with good equipment, good         some kind of admissions criteria that allow, let us say,
teachers and good resources, and they should all be           50% of children in these schools to come from ordinary
good schools. Members may think that that is utopia,          schools—those that are not performing so well. The Bill
but it may be something we can work towards. Many             does not say that, and everybody knows that when we
schools have improved since Labour came to office in          have a selective system the brightest children get taken
1997. The Labour Government put real money into               on and that cycle continues.
helping schools. They enabled existing schools to be
refurbished and new schools to be built, and provided            Paul Uppal (Wolverhampton South West) (Con): The
schools with classroom assistants and extra teachers.         hon. Lady is making a passionate speech, as did the
   A Conservative Member said that our record of              right hon. Member for Tottenham (Mr Lammy), who
educational achievement had worsened. That is not             spoke very personally, and the hon. Member for Wigan
true. According to all the statistics throughout the          (Lisa Nandy). There are no doubts about the passion
country, more people now leave school with five GCSEs,        and the validity of the emotion in their speeches. It is
and higher grades than in 1997. That is a record of           important that I make the point that I myself went to a
which a former Labour Government can be proud, and            state school. I did allude to that. When I was in primary
I find it annoying when Members seem to forget the real       school, I was in a remedial class because the assumption
educational advances that were made under that                was that I could not speak English, but the important
Government.                                                   point I want to make is—
   When my party introduced academies, I was one of
those who was not very happy about it, as I preferred            Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. The
that all schools be looked after by the state and the local   hon. Gentleman must ask a question. His intervention
education authority. I was convinced by that move,            is not a chance to make a speech.
however, when it became clear that the less well-performing
schools were going to have the chance to get some extra         Paul Uppal: Thank you for your guidance, Mr Deputy
funding so they could improve their educational level.        Speaker, and I will do so. I want to make a point about
For that reason alone, I was willing to support that          the selection issue, which the hon. Lady raised. Why do
academies measure. I want to make it clear, however,          we go on about selection? Selection in this modern day,
that my Labour Government spent a lot of money on             when our children are competing with graduates from
education.                                                    India and China, is linked to the importance of the
  This Academies Bill is ideologically driven. The best-      pursuit of excellence and aspiration. That is absolutely
performing schools will not even have to bother to do         crucial if we are to succeed, and—
anything; they can just go through the process and get
academy status. We are told that we do not have enough          Mr Deputy Speaker: Order. I call Yasmin Qureshi.
money to build schools. Schools in my constituency
that were going to be refurbished and rebuilt have had           Yasmin Qureshi: Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker.
those plans cancelled because, they are told, there is no     The hon. Gentleman says that I was talking about
money for them, even though those cancellations will cost     selection. If the teachers are teaching well and the
my council about £9 million, yet most of the schools          pupils are responding well, children of all abilities can
that will become academies will have to go through a          be taught in one school. There will obviously be some
process that will cost them money.                            children who do very well academically, while others
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may not do quite so well. However, children who are                        Mr Raab: I wonder whether the hon. Lady has had
perhaps academically poor initially will have a chance                   an opportunity to read clause 5, which makes clear the
to catch up. Because they are in a good school with                      consultation provisions that she is, I think, hoping for.
children of mixed abilities, they will have a chance to get
better.                                                                     Yasmin Qureshi: The Bill does not say, however, that
                                                                         50% of the children coming into such a school must
  Bill Esterson: There is a lot evidence to show that                    consist of children of all abilities. We will still have
areas that still have selection actually have poorer standards           academies and schools selecting according to ability,
and results than those with a completely comprehensive                   and my point is that we should not.
system. I wonder whether that makes the point that my                       It might be a controversial idea and an unpalatable
hon. Friend is trying to make.                                           one to many people in the House, but it is not that
                                                                         strange: why should children from all backgrounds not
                                                                         go to the same school? Why can we not have mixed-ability
   Yasmin Qureshi: I thank my hon. Friend for that                       classes? The record across the country shows that schools
helpful intervention. Yes, that is what I am saying, and                 containing children with a mix of ability and with
I have seen it across the country.                                       different social backgrounds do better, and that schools
   Perhaps such a view is unfashionable in this day and                  that are not performing so well start to do better in
age, when everything is about selection and performance,                 these circumstances because everyone is working for
but we are forgetting the ordinary children from ordinary                things together. Instead everybody wants to create these
families. Do they not have the right to be with “the very                excellent schools, which have “pushy parents”—I am
bright child”in a school that provides excellent educational             sure that my saying that will be held against me—who
facilities? Why cannot the poor child from Farnworth                     obviously want the best for their children. That is fine
or from the Newbury estate in my constituency go to a                    and I understand that they want the best for their
school attended by children from Chorley New road, a                     children, but why does everybody forget about the
posh part of the constituency? We need everybody to be                   other—
together. Children from less well-off backgrounds, whose
home lives might make it difficult for them to perform                     Mr Deputy Speaker: Order. I call Robert Buckland.
well academically, need to be in schools where they can
get help and where everyone’s standards are raised.                      8.45 pm
I know that this is an old-fashioned way of thinking—
perhaps it is not—and is not the conventional thinking                       Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): I yield
now, but I find it surprising that everybody is sleepwalking             to nobody in my admiration for the hon. Member for
into and justifying this system of selection.                            Bolton South East (Yasmin Qureshi) and for the passion
                                                                         with which she makes her argument. I think her argument,
                                                                         if it was based on an analysis of the Bill, was that clause
   Julian Smith (Skipton and Ripon) (Con): Does the                      6 should be removed and that no existing schools that
hon. Lady understand that the coalition Government                       select according to ability should be allowed to become
are not proposing to expand selection, as the Bill makes                 academies. She made a passionate speech, but it was
clear? I have three excellent selective schools in my                    based on the fundamental misconception that the Bill
constituency—the hon. Lady is now not listening to me.                   is, in some way, all about enshrining selection as the way
Does she propose that these schools be disbanded and                     forward and selection on ability as the lodestar for
all the fantastic opportunities that are there for those                 academies. That is wrong and it is a fundamental misreading
children be lost?                                                        of clause 6, which refers to “pre-existing” selective
                                                                         schools being allowed to apply to become academies.
   Yasmin Qureshi: Clause 6(4) of the Bill states:                       Therefore, with the greatest respect to the hon. Lady,
                                                                         I say that she misses the point.
   “For this purpose a school is a ‘selective school’ if its admission
arrangements make provision for selection of pupils by ability,              I welcome the Bill in general. I particularly welcome
and…its admission arrangements are permitted to do so by                 the amendments accepted by the Government in the
section 100 of SSFA 1998”.                                               other place and those resulting from debate there, especially
What is that? It is selection.                                           the ones relating to the provision for children and young
                                                                         people who have special educational needs. I should
                                                                         declare my interest as a parent of a child with SEN. The
  Julian Smith: If the hon. Lady looks at the clause in                  amendments in the other place were the result of considered
more detail, she will see that there is no chance of                     debate and of contributions by Members in that place
expanding selection. The point is that there are some                    from all parties and none. The amendments were an
good selective schools, which are being allowed to continue,             important part of the process by which the Bill has
but the Government are not expanding selection.                          matured as a result of debate, so it would be wrong to
                                                                         say that the Bill comes to the Floor of this House
   Yasmin Qureshi: The Bill enables the very good school                 without having had any thought, consideration or detailed
to fast-track into becoming an academy, and it does not                  debate, or indeed any consideration by the Government.
say that there has to be proper consultation with the                    I am glad to say that they have listened to the quality of
local authority or with the people in the community                      that debate and taken appropriate action.
who use the school. If it is not a question of the very                      That has been particularly important in respect of
good schools wanting to become more selective, why                       clause 1, because I was concerned by the original provision
would they want to go for an academy system? We are                      that was drafted on special needs, which described how
told that the Government are not putting any further                     children with varying needs would be catered for. That
money into the academies—                                                has now gone and the current provisions incorporate
111              Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                  112

[Mr Robert Buckland]                                              Mr Buckland: First and foremost, I think that the
                                                               governing body must always have that responsibility.
part 4 of the 1996 Act, which fully satisfies those of us      We already have examples of previous practice in foundation
who were concerned about a lack of parity in the               schools, which were the creation of the previous Labour
funding for children with SEN at maintained schools            Government in the School Standards and Framework
and those at academies. That important amendment               Act 1998. The hon. Gentleman will probably agree that
solves that problem.                                           there have been a number of cases where governing
   The other good news was the amendment made to               bodies, for whatever reason, have not had the wherewithal
clause 2 to incorporate subsections (5) and (6), which         to respond to a parental complaint about a lack of
make it obligatory for local authorities to set aside an       provision. It has been very difficult for parents to know
amount of money to spend on services for academy               precisely where to go to get that help. The answer must
pupils with “low incidence” SEN. In other words, the           be clear, and I am confident that in the course of the
provisions create a class of expenditure in the non-schools    debate in Committee we can address that issue.
education budget for local incidence SEN. That is very            What about children who do not have full statements
important when one is considering the provision of             but who are perhaps under the provisions of school
resources and places. I am thinking, for example, of units     action or school action plus? Their position is somewhat
for children and young people with a range of particular       more difficult because they do not enjoy the advantage
needs.                                                         of statutory protection or statutory force when it comes
                                                               to the implementation of their school plan. When a
                                                               school is breaching the SEN code of practice in relation
  Tom Blenkinsop: On resources and the payment of
                                                               to those children, where will those parents go for redress?
salaries in supporting SEN students, how is the coalition
                                                               The governing body, as I said in response to the intervention
proposing that we deal with the supply and salaries of
                                                               made by the hon. Member for Dunfermline and West
tutors of, and special needs advisers on, language therapy
                                                               Fife (Thomas Docherty) a moment ago, would be the
when primary care trusts are being proposed for closure?
                                                               first port of call but, again, I would welcome some
                                                               clarity on that point. The basis of accountability comes
   Mr Buckland: The hon. Gentleman makes an important          in the form of the contract that will exist between
point. My belief is that the pooling of resources will         academies and the LEA, but, as I have said, that point
still occur in LEAs, and it is my belief that commissioning    needs some clarification.
GPs will want to take a similar approach when it comes            Further clarity is required should there be a dispute
to the local provision of speech and language therapies.       over the admission of a child with SEN or a child on
That subject is very close to my heart—I know that it is       school action or school action plus. The new model
close to the hon. Gentleman’s, too—and I shall be              funding agreement for admissions to academies is clear
watching very carefully to ensure that we do not throw         and I welcome it, but I would go further and suggest
the baby out with the bath water when it comes to the          that we will need some more detail on the time frame
important provision and support that speech and language       within which admission disputes between parents and
therapists provide to children with special educational        schools should be resolved.
   The nub of it is that as a result of the amendments,           Paul Farrelly (Newcastle-under-Lyme) (Lab): If more
many of the concerns held by those of us who are               and more schools are to be encouraged to opt out of
interested in the provision for special educational needs      local education authority control, would it be his preference
have been allayed. However, one or two matters remain          that in due course they should eventually gain control
to be addressed, particularly the ongoing duty on local        of their own admissions procedures?
authorities to provide a statement of special educational
needs, wherever a child goes to school and whatever              Mr Buckland: As I have said, I think that the principle
type of school they go to, and to adhere to the requirements   of selection has not been part of the argument when it
of that statement. Sometimes, unfortunately, problems          comes to academies. It is not about selection and that is
arise. All Members will have had parents come to them          why I made my earlier observations about the hon.
with such problems—I certainly have, both in my capacity       Member for Bolton South East. This is all about excellence,
as a Member of this House and as a school governor in          and the Bill strikes the right balance on admissions and
a former life.                                                 the criteria for admissions procedures.
   As I have said, a problem can arise when a school
does not, for whatever reason, follow the requirements           Owen Smith (Pontypridd) (Lab): I know that the hon.
of a statement of special educational needs. We all            Gentleman is very interested in this subject and that it is
know that there is a statutory requirement to do so, but       very close to his heart. Is he not at all worried that the
how do we enforce that requirement? What will happen           greater degree of autonomy that academies will exercise
in an academy? Will the local authority require the            means it will inevitably make it much easier for selection,
academy to live up to the provision set out in the             whether overt or covert, to take place? That might well
statement? Questions on those important details still          have a detrimental effect on the education of precisely
need to be answered.                                           the children he is worried about.

   Thomas Docherty (Dunfermline and West Fife) (Lab):             Mr Buckland: No, I am not worried, because I see
The hon. Gentleman clearly has a great passion for this        nothing in the Bill to give me cause for suspicion or
subject. Will he outline for the benefit of the House          concern about selection by the back or front door. I
who he thinks should be responsible for ensuring that          reject the Labour party’s suggestion that this is some
statements are adhered to?                                     sort of ideological drive by the Government. It is not
113              Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]                     114

about ideology. I am probably one of the least ideological     to helping the strongest at the expense of the majority
members of my party and I would not stand here and             of other schools—expense for the many to the benefit
support some ideological fancy. This is all about excellence   of the few. Hardly progressive politics.
and driving up standards. It is all about trusting schools,      It is almost unprecedented to rush through such major
teachers and professionals to get on with the job that we      public service reform, with just a few weeks between
rightly pay them to do so well.                                publication of the Bill and its passage into the statute
                                                               book. Such methods are commonly used only to pass
  Bill Esterson: Will the hon. Gentleman give way?             emergency terrorism legislation. Parliament will have
                                                               no real chance to scrutinise the detail of the proposals.
    Mr Buckland: I will not take any more interventions
as my time is fast running out. Let me make some brief            Stephen Pound: In the short time my hon. Friend has
points about the governance of foundation schools. The         been in the House he has won a reputation for having a
Bill is rightly silent as to the form and style of governing   forensic mind. In keeping with the point he has just
bodies for academies, but I would welcome some discussion      made, may I draw his attention to clause 10(1)? It
of the nature of school governance in modern schools.          contains an utterly extraordinary statement, but I am
It is a demanding task for volunteer governors to undertake.   sure my hon. Friend can enlighten the House as to its
Many of them work very hard to monitor the work of             true meaning:
the schools that they are involved with and to scrutinise         “Before entering into Academy arrangements with the Secretary
the work of head teachers and the senior leadership            of State in relation to an additional school, a person must consult
team, but I wonder whether the current model of governing      such persons as the person thinks appropriate.”
bodies and periodic committee meetings works as well           That strikes me as meaning having a chat with the
as it could. Perhaps we should consider having a more          caretaker at best and chaos at worst. What does my
strategic structure with a small number of governors           hon. Friend think?
working on a day-to-day basis with the head teacher
and SLT, and a much wider pool of talent being involved           Bill Esterson: I am grateful to my hon. Friend. As always,
in a range of tasks within the school. That could involve      he hits the nail bang on the head. I interpreted those
as many members of the community as possible, whether          words as providing the opportunity to have a conversation
they are parents or interested local persons. There is         with oneself, which would certainly fit the Bill. We are
work to be done on the quality and nature of school            talking about inadequate legislation and my hon. Friend
governance in relation to academy, maintained and              has identified one of the best examples of that lack of
other schools.                                                 adequacy.
    In supporting the Bill and commending its Second              It is a pity that the hon. Member for Southport
Reading, I hope that I have in some way contributed to         (Dr Pugh) has left the Chamber, because the head
a very sensitive and important area of this debate—the         teacher of Churchtown primary school in Southport
needs of the children who do not enjoy the advantages          said that the consultation was a shambles. He, like head
that others enjoy and who deserve, as the Prime Minister       teachers from Sefton, recently attended some of the
said in response to a question that I asked him two            consultation meetings held by the Government. The
weeks ago, all the love and support we can give.               feedback was that there was no information, no one was
                                                               able to answer their questions and there was no opportunity
8.58 pm                                                        to find out what the whole academy and free school
                                                               programme was about. It does not inspire confidence
   Bill Esterson (Sefton Central) (Lab): The hon. Member       when head teachers make such observations.
for South Swindon (Mr Buckland) talked about the                  Parents’ groups and private companies will be able to
children who do not enjoy the advantages that others           open new schools with funding from the taxpayer, even
enjoy, but surely the legislation that the Government          where there are already sufficient places. They will take
propose does precisely the opposite of what he claims.         pupils from existing schools, where funding will be cut
Surely, the future of our children and their education is      and education will suffer for the majority left behind.
too important to be the subject of rushed, poorly              New buildings will be created for many free schools by
considered and flawed legislation, but that is what is on      using the money saved by cancelling new buildings for
offer from the Tory-Lib Dem coalition. It is clear from        existing schools. In Sefton Central that means Chesterfield
the comments of hon. Members, including those of the           high school and Crosby high school, which is a special
hon. Gentleman about the so-called consultation process,       school due to be co-located with Chesterfield high
that there are fundamental flaws. What is consultative         school. It was an opportunity to integrate the pupils of
about a governing body being able to make a decision           a special school with pupils at a mainstream school and
without talking to parents or the wider community?             was welcomed and supported by parents, teachers and
How is that proper consultation, democracy or anything         pupils. That opportunity has been taken away.
other than the kind of top-down approach that Members
on the Government Benches have criticised the previous            Jonathan Reynolds (Stalybridge and Hyde) (Lab/Co-op):
Government for?                                                My hon. Friend mentioned that two schools were to be
   The Bill is being rushed, and rushed legislation has        co-located to produce a better educational facility for
led to many mistakes in the past. In this case, any            the pupils of both schools. There is a similar situation in
mistakes will be paid for by the many vulnerable children      several areas in my constituency. Local authorities may
in this country whose life chances I fear will suffer. The     have been relying on a capital receipt from the sale of
Bill helps outstanding schools, which, by definition, are      one site but that site could now be made available for a
already doing well and are in the least need of extra          free school, so does my hon. Friend share my concern
support. The Bill diverts the Labour Government’s              that that would throw into doubt the entire reorganisation
academies scheme from improving the weakest schools            of education in my constituency, and perhaps in his?
115             Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                    116

   Bill Esterson: My hon. Friend makes an excellent             Three academies are being built: Strood academy
point. In Sefton, we could have the same problem.            opened last September, and the Chatham and Gillingham
Money that would have been available to the authority        academies open this September. In all three, the buildings
for capital projects for other schools and for educational   are not fit for purpose. Strood and Chatham academies
purposes will now not be available. One of the major         will open on two sites each, as they each replace two
weaknesses of the Bill is that a bribe is being offered to   previous schools. All three academies serve deprived
the schools that go first. A bribe to outstanding schools    areas that need significant financial support. If their
that need that opportunity least will mean less money        funding is withdrawn in favour of outstanding schools,
left behind, both capital and revenue funding, for schools   as in the Government’s proposal, it will be one of the
that do not have the opportunity because they are not        best examples—or worst examples, depending on someone’s
outstanding.                                                 viewpoint—of how the Bill will sacrifice those who are
                                                             most in need of help in favour of those who need it
  Mr Stewart Jackson (Peterborough) (Con): Will the          least. I am glad that the hon. Member for Gillingham
hon. Gentleman give way?                                     and Rainham (Rehman Chishti) is now in the Chamber
                                                             to hear about the disgraceful way that the Government
   Bill Esterson: I have already given way twice.            are failing his constituents.
   Over £1 million has been committed in Sefton in            Rehman Chishti (Gillingham and Rainham) (Con):
progressing its Building Schools for the Future projects     Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
and £161 million nationally—money that can not now
be recovered and hardly the way to cut the deficit. Free       Bill Esterson: I will not get any more time if I give
schools will be funded in other ways. With cuts in the       way, so I am not going to.
area-based grant, the Nurture Base in Sefton will close,
                                                               Meanwhile, as Barnet Tory council made savage cuts
although it provides 10 places for children aged between
                                                             to schools and the rest of the public sector, its members
four and seven, so that they can receive the support that
                                                             voted for a £20,000 a year increase in the allowances for
children with behavioural difficulties need to return to
                                                             Tory cabinet members. They declared that poverty was
mainstream school. That is part of a £2.5 million cut in
                                                             an emotive word and that all people needed was aspiration.
Sefton that will allow outstanding schools to become
                                                             Barnet is the “easycouncil”—the no-frills council—except
academies. There is no provision in the legislation for
                                                             when it comes to its Tory cabinet members.
behavioural support of the kind available in Sefton, but
that is now being cut.
                                                               Rehman Chishti: Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
   Another way in which the academies and free schools
are being funded is from the primary capital programme,        Bill Esterson: No, I am not giving way.
which is under review and clearly headed for a cut.            By cutting the Building Schools for the Future and
                                                             the primary capital programmes and the area-based
  Mr Stewart Jackson: Will the hon. Gentleman give           grants, the Tories are saying, “If you come from a
way?                                                         deprived area or from a struggling school, we’re not
                                                             going to support you. We will only support those schools
   Bill Esterson: No, I am not giving way.                   that need it least.” Jack Stopforth of Liverpool chamber
   Aintree Davenhill primary school has had its first        commerce commented:
phase built, but the second phase has been halted.              “It’s all very well to talk about short-term savings for the
Many of the children at that school face the prospect of     public purse, but the long-term implications for the education
continuing their education in second world war sheds,        base of our children and the future skills base and the effect on
                                                             the private sector supply chain is profound.”
freezing in the winter and baking hot in the summer.
The school faces uncertainty at best and continued           When people in that sort of position make such comments,
appalling conditions at worst. Why? To pay for the           it is time that Government Members considered the damage
political dogma of the governing parties is the answer.      that the legislation will do. They should reconsider it.

 Andrew Stephenson (Pendle) (Con): Will the hon.               9.9 pm
Gentleman give way?
                                                                Stephen Lloyd (Eastbourne) (LD): I have had the
                                                             privilege and pleasure of sitting here for a good number
  Bill Esterson: No, I am not giving way.                    of hours listening to the arguments of Members on
  I was concerned to hear that the review of previously      both sides of the Chamber. One speech in particular
agreed projects extends to the previous Government’s         struck home—that of the right hon. Member for Tottenham
academy programme. In the Medway towns, three                (Mr Lammy); I am sorry that he has left the Chamber.
academies were approved by the former Secretary of           He made a moving, passionate speech about education
State, with the support of the former School Standards       in his constituency. I wrote down a particular line; I
Minister and his predecessors. They had to make up for       think he said that when Labour came to government,
the failings of Tory-run Medway council, where the           13% or 16% of his constituents went to university, and a
children’s services department had failed to address the     higher number went to prison, which I thought was a
long-term problems of underperforming schools, largely       telling tale.
caused by the 11-plus and the selective system there,
which contributes in no small measure to the fact that         Stephen Pound: On a point of information, the reason
the secondary modern schools have high numbers of            my right hon. Friend the Member for Tottenham
children with special educational needs that are not         (Mr Lammy) is not in his place is that today is his
resourced properly.                                          birthday, and his presence was required elsewhere.
117              Academies Bill [Lords]                 19 JULY 2010               Academies Bill [Lords]                   118

   Stephen Lloyd: I thank the hon. Gentleman; I appreciate         Tom Blenkinsop: Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
that information. In that case, I am particularly glad
that I complimented the right hon. Member for Tottenham             Stephen Lloyd: No, I shall not. I have almost finished.
on his speech, which I thought was strong.                          The pupil premium is directly targeted at those
   I should also like to compliment the Labour party.            disadvantaged students who need it most, and I am
Any fair-minded person would accept that in the past             absolutely delighted that the coalition Government are
13 years, considerable investment went into education,           committed to delivering it. I look forward to reading
and there were improvements to schools in my constituency,       that commitment when I see the detail of the Bill, and
for which I am grateful. That, in a sense, is the positive       I am absolutely confident that, for the youngsters
side to what happened over the past 13 years under the           from Shinewater school and for others from similarly
Labour party. I am disappointed that a lot of what I             disadvantaged backgrounds in my constituency, the
have heard today from Labour Members is indignation              pupil premium will make a considerable difference and
about the coalition Government’s plans on academies.             give them a real opportunity. I look forward to seeing
To be perfectly frank, at the election, it was clear from        the detail of the Bill.
the Conservative manifesto what the plan was. Given
the coalition Government’s position, there cannot be             9.15 pm
any surprise at the idea that they will deliver what they
promised, so I am a little puzzled.                                Owen Smith (Pontypridd) (Lab): As a Welsh Member,
                                                                 I beg the House’s indulgence in contributing to this
                                                                 debate. I have three children, and they, like all children
   Paul Farrelly: Before the hon. Gentleman gets to the          in Wales, will be insulated from some of the more
substance of his speech, I point out that I voted against        malign effects of this Bill by virtue of our rather more
plenty of Labour programme motions in the past two               progressive coalition.
Parliaments when I thought that Bills needed more
consideration. Funnily enough, I always found the No               Yasmin Qureshi: We’ll move to Wales.
Lobby heaving with Liberal Democrats. Does he agree
that any Liberal Democrats who tonight vote for the                 Owen Smith: That might be a good idea.
programme motion have, in very short order, given up
                                                                    I wanted to speak tonight because the Bill is such an
on the basic principles of proper scrutiny, and have in
                                                                 important piece of legislation. It is one of the real key,
effect become mere nodding dogs on the Tory bandwagon?
                                                                 signature pieces of legislation from this rather less
                                                                 progressive coalition Government at Westminster, and
   Stephen Lloyd: No, I do not agree at all. In a sense,         I feel that all Members, wherever they hail from, should
the hon. Gentleman’s intervention backs up my point              address these issues.
about what I see as the flipside of the Labour party. On
                                                                    It has been interesting to watch Government Members
the one hand, it brought about a lot of good things in
                                                                 throughout today’s debate, because on the faces of
education when it was in government. On the flipside,
                                                                 some there has been surprise at the volume of opposition
there also came a lot of nonsensical things. It was an
                                                                 from Labour Members and at the passion that we have
absolute disgrace that six months before the general election,
                                                                 brought to the debate. That is because we feel that there
the former Secretary of State went around promising
                                                                 are fundamental issues at hand, including not just the
that billions of pounds, or certainly a multimillion-pound
                                                                 way in which the Bill is being railroaded through with
sum, would be spent on schools, when he knew that the
                                                                 unseemly haste, but its content, and I shall address two
money was not in the kitty.
                                                                 levels of that concern.
   I particularly want to talk about the coalition                  First, we are concerned about the legislation’s immediate
Government’s commitment to a pupil premium. Last                 and practical impact. Our abiding concern is about the
week, I had the privilege of attending a year 6 production       type of autonomy, the free-for-all, for academy schools,
at Shinewater school in my constituency. It serves an            which will be cut free—“liberated”, I gather, is the
area with a large number of disadvantaged families and           phrase du jour from Government Members.
students. Despite that, the school has tremendous esprit
de corps. I believe that it has been told that it has got an        Mr Graham Stuart: Having been the chairman of the
“outstanding” from Ofsted. The school is a perfect               board of governors at a grant-maintained primary school
example of what will happen with the pupil premium,              in the 1990s, I feel all the same arguments coming back
to which I know that the Secretary of State is committed.        from the Labour party. Is it not the case that the boot is
It will result in further tens of thousands of pounds            on the other foot—that Labour Members’ opposition
being invested in schools such as Shinewater. That is the        to the Bill is deeply ideological, as it was to grant-maintained
sort of money that will make the difference for people           schools and to the autonomy and power of parents?
and youngsters in my constituency—the difference that            Essentially, the Labour party has never trusted, and
the right hon. Member for Tottenham described so                 does not today trust, people with the education of their
powerfully when talking about his constituency.                  own children.
   I received a commitment from the Secretary of State
for Education three weeks or so ago. He said that he                Owen Smith: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his
was absolutely committed to putting £2.3 billion or              intervention and completely agree. This is a very familiar
£2.5 billion into the pupil premium. I look forward to           and, indeed, old debate, because from Government
the coalition Government and the Secretary of State              Members we have heard the warmed-up arguments of
delivering on that promise; I am confident that he will. I       Thatcherism: effectively, the privatisation by stealth of
am very aware that education is the silver bullet. Education     our schools and education, and, coming up later in the
is the route out of poverty, and that is why so many of          year no doubt, a wholesale attack on welfare. The
us feel so passionately about the matter.                        debate is familiar and ideological, and the hon. Gentleman
119              Academies Bill [Lords]               19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]                       120

[Owen Smith]                                                      Owen Smith: Absolutely, and one point that I will
                                                               come to is that the evidence on the free schools system
is absolutely right: my opposition is ideological, too,        in Sweden and the charter schools in the US has been
because I sincerely believe that we need local authorities—    presented extremely partially. That evidence is not as
the state, in its benign form—to offer some control over       uncontested, and the findings are not as clear, as has
our schools, so that we have equitable provision as            been suggested. I shall give examples in a moment that
opposed to the free-for-all that Government Members            show serious problems emerging.
clearly think would be of benefit.                                Privatisation is not set out in the Bill, and the Government
                                                               are not bringing it in through straightforward measures,
   Paul Farrelly: On my hon. Friend’s point about politics     but it is writ large through every clause and the intention
and practicalities, is it his understanding that, in Wales     is very clear. Liberty from the dead hand of bureaucracy,
as well as in England, the Liberal Democrats’ policy is        which is how the Bill is being presented, is merely a
to support local education authorities, not to contribute      catchphrase, nothing more, designed to shield the
to their dismantling and demise?                               Government’s true ideological concerns.
   Owen Smith: There is a deep irony in that. On the              I shall move briefly, if I may, to Sweden—[Interruption.]
contortions that the Liberal Democrats are having to           Well, I will not move to Sweden—I am actually staying
perform between Wales and Westminster, I understand            in Wales, it is a lovely place—but I shall discuss it
that they are actively considering what they would do          briefly. There have been relatively few studies in Sweden
in the unlikely event of their winning greater power in        and the US of how the free schools and charter schools
Wales—as in, thinking about whether they could afford          have worked, but most of them have been rehashed
to be in coalition in London with the Tories and in            assiduously by the outriders of the Tory party in the
Wales with the Labour party. Seemingly, their opportunism      think-tanks as part of their cheerleading for the free
knows no bounds.                                               schools system. In truth, the results of those studies are
                                                               far less clear than they present them as being. For
   However, as I said, we have two levels of deep concern.     example, one study that coalition Members have cited is
The first is immediate and practical, including the question   by Böhlmark and Lindahl, but they stated that the
of whether that greater degree of autonomy—that laissez-       studies conducted in Sweden had shown that free schools
faire attitude to education as well as to economics—will       had increased social segregation. In fact, they stated
result in a worse outcome for all our children, with few       that division had occurred in almost every area of the
children being cared for as fully as they should be. The       country where the system was observed. More importantly,
hon. Member for South Swindon (Mr Buckland) eloquently         Sweden has not soared up the PISA rankings for the
raised some of his concerns about special educational          international benchmarking of education. If anything,
needs, and I, too, have a child with such needs, so I am       it has faltered and fallen back as the free schools system
very worried about this legislation and whether free           has been introduced.
academies, free from local control, will be able to provide
that care adequately.                                             I turn briefly to the US where, again, the evidence is
                                                               nowhere near as clear as it has been presented. The case
  Stephen Pound: On the subject of the excellent               of the charter schools is not as straightforward as the
contribution of the hon. Member for South Swindon              Secretary of State, who I see has re-entered the Chamber,
(Mr Buckland), does my hon. Friend recall the hon.             has said. He cited in his speech the Rockoff and Hoxby
Gentleman saying that he felt a great citizens’ army of        report—almost the only wholly positive report that I
governors would sweep in to support the system? School         can find on charter schools. Even it raises some serious
governors are wholly unpaid and perform that duty in           questions. Its conclusion states:
their own time, and I speak as the husband of the chair           “All three studies find that students who enroll in charter
of governors at Cardinal Wiseman high school, who is           schools experience a drop in achievement relative to similar
                                                               students in public schools. This drop in achievement is restricted
out five nights a week—usually of her own choice. Does         to the first few years of the charter schools’ existence”.
he agree that as for practicalities, what we have is no
more than the warm words that led to the cold classrooms       However, it is appreciable. That underlines that we are
of the last Conservative Administration?                       considering an experiment, which is not being widely
                                                               consulted upon. We should be wary of experimenting
   Owen Smith: I can but agree, wholeheartedly.                with our children’s future.
   I have already touched on our second, perhaps more            I shall conclude with a quote from another US academic,
profound concern, which is about the longer-term               Diane Ravitch, an educationalist who has been an adviser
philosophical underpinnings of the Bill. We see similarities   to successive US Presidents, including George W. Bush.
between what is being proposed in respect of education         She initially believed that charter schools were a good
and in the health White Paper, and what we will no             idea, but changed her mind after seeing them in action.
doubt see in respect of the welfare reforms later this         She now says that
year. In dread phrases throughout the Bill and that            “public education itself is at risk. On the current course… we will
White Paper, there are hints of what is proposed. There        see thousands of public schools turned over to private entrepreneurs…
                                                               an explosion of privatization… Some articles extol unproven
is a clear indication that the proposal for the concept of     ideas and lack any fairness or balance.”
free schools is warmed-over privatisation.
                                                               She goes on to say that there is
  Yasmin Qureshi: Is my hon. Friend aware that the free        “a lot of research showing that charter schools don’t do any
academy idea came from Sweden, where it has been               better… than regular public schools.”
found to lead to inequality and the dumbing-down of              Hon. Members opposite should look hard at the
children’s qualifications? That was said by the Swedish        evidence and not simply listen to Front Benchers. They
equivalent of the head of Ofsted two months ago.               should be worried about such wholesale experimentation’s
121                Academies Bill [Lords]                      19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                  122

being visited on our children with unseemly haste. The                     Without question, the Bill takes things forward. There
Bill is a dangerous measure, which may have a seriously                 is great scope and need for this change, and I urge the
detrimental impact on the education of all our children.                House to consider it favourably.
I shall not support it tonight.
                                                                        9.31 pm
9.26 pm
   Guy Opperman (Hexham) (Con): I have spent a large                       Vernon Coaker (Gedling) (Lab): This has been an
portion of my time as a special educational needs                       interesting debate to which many Members on both
barrister representing local authorities throughout the                 sides of the House contributed. The number of Members
country. I also represented, with great interest, the right             who wanted to speak shows clearly the importance of
hon. Member for Morley and Outwood (Ed Balls) in                        the Bill, and there are clear divisions of principle between
his previous incarnation as Secretary of State for Children,            Government and Opposition Members. I am happy to
Schools and Families.                                                   be called a dinosaur or labelled old-fashioned simply
   I want to speak on behalf of the people of                           because I want to defend this country’s comprehensive
Northumberland, which is one of the most rural parts                    system to ensure that there is excellence for all, that
of the country. It has the biggest catchment area in                    every single school has the resources that it deserves,
England—Haydon Bridge high school has a catchment                       and that we do not pit one school or one community
area roughly the size of the M25. The school looks on                   against another.
the proposals with interest, but needs some reassurances                   Many hon. Members spoke of the rush to take this
that matters that affect rural schools, particularly transport,         legislation through. Interestingly, the hon. Member for
will be addressed.                                                      Hexham (Guy Opperman) suggested that we perhaps
   Northumberland broadly welcomes the Bill. I met all                  need to look at one or two aspects, and many Government
four head teachers in the local area on Friday and discussed            Members said that we should consider amendments to
the proposals with them. They required assurances,                      improve the Bill. On cue, the hon. Member for Beverley
some of which were tackled today. I am sure that more                   and Holderness (Mr Stuart), the Chair of the Education
will be addressed later this evening and during the rest                Committee, has come into the Chamber—he too thinks
of the week. I also note that, in the debate in the House               that the Bill is being rushed through. However, he
of Lords, which went on for seven days, considerable                    understands that, should the House of Commons choose
analysis and change took place as part of the Bill’s                    to amend any clause, schedule or subsection, it would
development. It has not been set in stone, without any                  cause the Leader of the House, who is in the Chamber,
change—it has developed.                                                great difficulty. As he, I and everybody in the House
                                                                        knows, there is no Report stage, and the Bill could go
   The Bill follows on from Lord Baker’s work in the
                                                                        straight from Committee to Third Reading. That works
Education Reform Act 1988, through the Learning and
                                                                        on the presumption that there will be no amendment in
Skills Act 2000 and the 2005 White Paper under the
                                                                        Committee and that business will be finished by a
Labour Government. To address much of the problem
                                                                        certain time. We know not only that there is no Report,
with today’s debate, we must go back to Tony Blair’s
                                                                        but that if an amendment is made in Committee, the
words in 2005. I have sat here for some five hours,
                                                                        Bill must to go back to the House of Lords, which
listening to the debate, which has been fascinating, and
                                                                        would be a problem.
I remind hon. Members of Tony Blair’s comments:
   “We need to make it easier for every school to acquire the drive        The Secretary of State’s Bill may be radical—his view
and essential freedoms of Academies… We want every school to            is that it is a flagship Bill and a really important piece of
be able quickly and easily to become a self-governing independent       educational reform—but he should not rush it through
state school… All schools”—                                             the House in an unprecedented way. Such procedure is
I emphasise “all”—                                                      usually reserved for anti-terror measures or legislation
“will be able to have Academy style freedoms… No one will be            of an extreme emergency. The Bill is about the future of
able to veto parents starting new schools or new providers coming       education. As was witnessed in numerous speeches by
in, simply on the basis that there are local surplus places. The role   Members on both sides of the House, there are big
of the LEA will change fundamentally.”                                  issues of principle to be debated, and they deserve
The position in 2005, subject to some slight delay in the               proper consideration. We should have the opportunity
past few years, has now moved on. In 2010, we are                       to table amendments and the Government should have
effectively taking forward the developments that started                the opportunity to choose whether to accept them.
in the 1980s.                                                              My hon. Friends the Members for North West Durham
                                                                        (Pat Glass), for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland
   Mr Buckland: Does my hon. Friend agree that the                      (Tom Blenkinsop), for Sefton Central (Bill Esterson)
debate and discussion in the other place yielded fruit                  and for Pontypridd (Owen Smith) laid out their concerns
in the form of important provisions for children with                   about the rush. Indeed, the hon. Member for Southport
special educational needs, particularly the guarantee                   (Dr Pugh) said that he too was concerned. The Chair of
that the funding formula will be no different for children              the Select Committee pointed out the difficulty with the
in maintained schools from that for children in academies?              way in which the Bill is being handled.
  Guy Opperman: I accept my hon. Friend’s point that                       Several concerns were raised by hon. Members on
the SEN argument developed as time moved on from                        both sides. My hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool,
the starkness of the conversation that took place in                    West Derby (Stephen Twigg) talked about structures
the House of Lords on 7 June, 23 June and 26 June. The                  being placed above the quality of teachers. The lack of
development in the Bill’s special educational needs                     consultation and the supersession of the role of local
provisions will improve the situation in academies in                   authorities was mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member
respect of children’s individual capabilities.                          for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman) and my right hon.
123              Academies Bill [Lords]                19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]                    124

[Vernon Coaker]                                                 We believed that if a school was already judged outstanding,
                                                                it was clearly succeeding within the existing framework
Friend the Member for Tottenham (Mr Lammy). The                 and could only be damaged by centralised, ideologically
need for greater fairness for children was mentioned by         driven policy experiments. We believed in local
my hon. Friends the Members for Wigan (Lisa Nandy)              accountability, not unwieldy powers for a Secretary of
and for North West Durham. The problem of the Bill              State far removed from the realities of local circumstances.
creating a two-tier education system and the way in             We believed in local co-operation and mutual support,
which it will undermine social justice were mentioned           not isolation, competition and division. We believed in
by my hon. Friends the Members for Hampstead and                fair funding and fair admissions, not the introduction
Kilburn (Glenda Jackson), for Birmingham, Ladywood              of unfair advantages and resources to be exploited at
(Shabana Mahmood) and for Bolton South East (Yasmin             the expense of those already most vulnerable within the
Qureshi).                                                       education system. We believed in evidence over ideology.
                                                                We believed in listening to educationalists, teachers,
   Mr Gibb: This Bill has 20 clauses, to be debated in          head teachers and other professionals who understand
Committee over three days. That is between six and              better than anyone what does and does not work on the
seven clauses a day. Compare that with the Apprenticeships,     ground.
Skills, Children and Learning Bill with which the hon.
Gentleman was involved, where we debated 42 clauses                Bob Russell: I recognise the powerful case that the
in each day in Committee.                                       hon. Gentleman makes, but does he accept that in a
                                                                constituency such as mine this Bill could be the great
   Vernon Coaker: The hon. Gentleman needs to explain           escape from Conservative-controlled Essex county council?
why it will be impossible to amend the Bill, why it will
have no Report stage, and—if it is not impossible to               Vernon Coaker: I wish the hon. Gentleman luck with
amend the Bill—whether he would welcome amendments.             Essex county council. He and I have worked long and
Some of his Back Benchers have serious concerns about           hard to try to free Colchester from various people on
the Bill, but if he accepted amendments, we would have          the council. But I will not go there, Mr Speaker. I have
to have a Report stage and the Bill would have to go            been to Colchester three times. Perhaps the Schools
back to the House of Lords.                                     Minister will now take up that task with great relish.
   My hon. Friend the Member for Leicester West (Liz               It should be obvious that when a Government do not
Kendall) mentioned the differences in the profiles of           listen, when they do not bother to consult and when
the new academies as opposed to those of existing               they rush through legislation grounded not in evidence
academies. That set out for us clearly the difference           or experience but in ideology, they will get things badly
between the academies programme as pursued by my                wrong. In this instance, that will result in the undermining
right hon. Friend the Member for Morley and Outwood             of our education system in a way that could damage the
and the previous Government in which academies were             educational prospects of a generation. Whatever their
designed to tackle social disadvantage and educational          motive, a coalition Government who have declared an
underperformance in some of our poorest communities             interest in helping those who are disadvantaged in the
and the schools that have applied for academy status            education system are championing a model of schooling
under this Government, which have lower proportions             from other countries about which serious questions are
of children with special needs and are in much more             now being asked.
socially advantaged areas.
                                                                   According to recent studies, charter schools and free
   To be fair to Government Members, we heard some              schools in the US and Sweden have led to a deterioration
good contributions, which were not all supportive of            in overall standards, to a greater differentiation in attainment
the Government. The hon. Member for North Cornwall              between the haves and the have-nots and to a decrease
(Dan Rogerson) seemed to suggest that amendments                in racial and socio-economic integration. Just last month,
were needed, but was unsure about how he could achieve          the Swedish Education Minister warned the UK against
them. I suggest that the Minister of State consider that        adopting the free school model, stating:
                                                                   “We have actually seen a fall in the quality of Swedish schools
   I thought that the speech by the hon. Member for             since the free schools were introduced…The free schools are
Bradford East (Mr Ward) was excellent. He explained             generally attended by children of better educated and wealthy
why the Academies Bill is unnecessary and will in fact          families, making things even more difficult for children attending
undermine the education system. I very much agreed              ordinary schools in poor areas.”
with him. My hon. Friend the Member for Bolton                  Stanford university published the first national assessment
South East, whom I cannot see her in her place, also            of charter schools in America and found that 37% delivered
made some good points about special needs.                      learning results that were significantly worse than those
   We all thought that the speech by the hon. Member            that the students would have realised had they remained
for South Swindon (Mr Buckland) about the need to               in traditional public schools, and that nearly half the
ensure that the Bill in no way disadvantages those with         results were no different. That evidence was ignored by
special needs was an important contribution and we all          this Government.
learnt from his comments. Other hon. Members also                  It is ironic that a party that professes to champion
made important contributions.                                   localism will now fatally undermine the ability of our
   Apart from the name, this Government’s academies             most local layer of democratically elected government—
policy could not be further removed from the values             namely, the local authority—to plan for and support
and goals that underpinned the introduction of academies        fair and excellent schooling in its area. “What could be
under Labour. We believed in practical, targeted intervention   more democratic than giving power to parents?”, ask
to help struggling schools, not a free-market free-for-all.     the Government, but in the context of the Bill, that
125                 Academies Bill [Lords]                      19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]                      126

claim is deeply disingenuous. Parents are not mentioned                     This has been an interesting and constructive debate,
in it once. Around the country, parents are rightly up in                covering a wide range of educational issues. The Academies
arms that governing bodies may seek to convert their                     Bill is not simply about the nuts and bolts of the
children’s schools into academies without so much as                     conversion process for maintained schools to become
speaking to them. In a MORI poll this year, 95% of parents               academies or for groups of teachers or parents to establish
and the general public opposed external organisations                    new free schools. It is about changing the deeply
such as private companies and charities running schools,                 unsatisfactory and, for many parents, highly distressing
and 96% opposed the creation of so-called free schools.                  situation where schools in an area are not of the standard
Parents know what is best for their children.                            and quality they want for their children.
   Sadly, the Liberal Democrats have yet again                              This year in England, nearly one in five parents saw
demonstrated their elastic convictions when it comes to                  their child denied their first choice of secondary school,
notions of fairness and justice, redefining them at every                and in some boroughs the situation was much worse,
turn to accommodate their desire to be at the top table.                 with nearly half of parents failing to get a place for
                                                                         their child in their preferred school. These figures do
  Stephen Lloyd: Will the right hon. Gentleman give                      not take account of the fact that many parents have
way?                                                                     already ruled out applying to the school they really
                                                                         want because they live too far away and know they
                                                                         would not stand a chance.
  Vernon Coaker: No, I do not have much time.
                                                                            Sometimes this is discussed, particularly by Labour
  In June 2010, the Liberal Democrat Education                           Members and left-leaning commentators, as if it were
Association said:                                                        just a matter of middle-class angst. This is simply not
   “Liberal Democrat Party members call upon their MPs and               the case. As the former Labour Cabinet Minister Alan
Peers to vote against the Academies Bill. The present Bill did not       Milburn said in a recent speech to the National Education
form part of the published coalition agreement. The Bill is              Trust:
wasteful of resources at a time when public expenditure is under
extreme pressure, and does not meet the coalition’s aim for a               “It is sometimes argued that parents in the most disadvantaged
fairer society.”                                                         areas are less aspirational for their children than those in better
                                                                         off areas. The figures on school appeals repudiate such assumptions,
We shall see how many Liberal Democrat MPs and                           with a large number of parents in disadvantaged parts of the
Peers follow that advice tonight.                                        country using the appeals system to try to get their children out of
                                                                         poorly performing schools and into better ones.”
  It was not so long ago that the hon. Member for
Brent Central (Sarah Teather), now a Minister in the                        The problem is that there are simply not enough good
Government, described the free schools policy as a                       schools. Some parents can work their way around the
“shambles”. I should like to remind her that she also                    problem, as my hon. Friend the Member for East Surrey
said:                                                                    (Mr Gyimah) pointed out. The wealthy can move their
   “Unless you give local authorities that power to plan, it is just a
                                                                         children to a private school and the socially mobile can
gimmick. Giving schools a fancy title—be it ‘free school’ or             move into the catchment area of a high-performing
‘academy’—and allowing disparate groups of parents, charities            state school—I cannot and will not say how many
or other organisations to run or ‘sponsor’ them will not magically       left-wing journalists I know who have used both methods
transform them.”                                                         for themselves—but for the vast majority of parents
I wonder what has transformed her attitude and opinion.                  who care just as deeply about the education of their
                                                                         children, there is often no choice and they learn to
   The Bill will visit huge injustice upon those children                suppress their worries and put up with what is on offer.
and young people who most need our help, and it will                     This Bill seeks to change that.
cause confusion, worry and division for children and
parents everywhere. By elevating market mores above                         Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab): I agree 100% with
the core principles of co-operation, accountability,                     the Minister that parents in deprived communities care
democracy and equality, it will turn our education                       just as deeply about their children’s future as do those in
system into a dismal experiment in educational Darwinism.                other areas, but given that he is saying that the problem
It will be the survival of the fittest and the demise of the             is that there are not enough good schools, would it not
rest. The consequences could be calamitous for tens of                   be better to focus his policy on making poorer schools
thousands of children and take decades to reverse.                       better rather than creating an educational elite?
   Education—[Interruption.] Conservative Members
should calm down; they will like the next bit even better.                  Mr Gibb: That is precisely what this Bill and this
Education is a public good, not a private commodity.                     Government’s policy are all about. It is part of a
The common good is served not when parents and                           comprehensive approach to driving up standards. This
children engage with schools as consumers pursuing                       Government are determined to raise academic standards
relative advantage, but when they act as citizens and                    in all our schools, as the hon. Gentleman says. We will
partners who understand their crucial role as co-creators                do it by improving the teaching of reading so that we no
of learning and educational success. For these reasons,                  longer have the appalling situation whereby after seven
we strongly oppose this Bill and we urge all right-thinking              years of primary education, one in five 11-year-olds still
hon. Members to do the same.                                             struggles with reading. We will do it by improving
                                                                         standards of behaviour in schools, which is why we are
9.46 pm                                                                  strengthening and clarifying teachers’ powers to search
                                                                         for and confiscate items such as mobile phones and
  The Minister of State, Department for Education                        iPods, as well as alcohol, drugs and weapons. It is why
(Mr Nick Gibb): That was somewhat overstated, if I may                   we are removing the statutory requirement for 24 hours’
say so.                                                                  notice of detentions and giving teachers protection
127                Academies Bill [Lords]                   19 JULY 2010              Academies Bill [Lords]                  128

[Mr Gibb]                                                            required by the funding agreement to be at the heart of
                                                                     their communities. Many Opposition Members raised
from false accusations. It is also why we intend to                  the issue of social and community cohesion. Academies
restore rigour to our public examinations and qualifications         are required to be at the heart of their communities,
and restore the national curriculum to a slimmed-down                sharing facilities with other schools and the wider
core of the knowledge and concepts we expect every                   community.
child to know, built around subject disciplines and                     The hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr Sheerman)
based on the experience of the best-performing education             asked why we were starting with outstanding schools. In
systems in the world.                                                fact, all schools have been invited to apply for academy
   Central to our drive, however, is liberating professionals        status, not just outstanding schools. Outstanding schools
to drive improvement across the system. We want all                  will be fast-tracked because of their outstanding leadership,
our schools to be run by professionals rather than by                but we are continuing to tackle the worst-performing
bureaucrats or by bureaucratic diktat. We want good                  schools by converting them to sponsor-supported
schools to flourish, with the autonomy and independence              academies. All outstanding schools will be expected to
that academy status brings. I am thinking of schools                 help a weaker school to raise standards.
such as Mossbourne academy in Hackney, where half
the pupils qualify for free school meals but where                     Bill Esterson: Will the Minister give way?
86% achieve five or more GCSEs at grades A* to C
including English and maths, and Harris City academy                    Mr Gibb: I will not, because there is very little time
in Crystal Palace, where 82% achieve five or more                    left.
GCSEs at grades A* to C including English and maths.
Harris City academy was the first school to be awarded                  The hon. Member for Huddersfield also raised the
a perfect Ofsted score under the new inspection regime,              issue of free schools and faith schools, as did the hon.
and it now attracts about 2,000 applicants for its 180 annual        Member for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland
places. Those schools are delivering what parents want               (Tom Blenkinsop). Although existing faith schools will
for their children, and the Bill will deliver hundreds               retain their faith designation on conversion to academies,
more such schools.                                                   new faith schools will be able to select only 50% of their
                                                                     intake on the basis of faith.
   Opposition Members have raised concerns about the
impact that the new free schools will have on neighbouring              I am grateful to my hon. Friend the Member for
schools. Of course the Secretary of State will take those            Altrincham and Sale West (Mr Brady) for his support
issues into account when assessing the validity of a new             for the Bill, largely because many of the policies in it were
free school. However, Lord Adonis said in another                    built on his work as shadow schools Minister in days of
place:                                                               yore. He has visited a KIPP—Knowledge Is Power
   “The idea that parents should not be able to access new or
                                                                     programme—school in Washington DC, which he described
additional school places in areas where the schools are not          as “one of the most exciting schools I have ever visited.”
providing good quality places simply because the provision of        He said, “I want these schools in this country”—as do
those places will cause detriment to other schools fundamentally     we all.
ignores the interests of parents and their right to have a decent       The hon. Member for North West Durham (Pat Glass)
quality school to send their children to. If there is not such a
decent quality school and someone is prepared to do something
                                                                     is concerned about children with special educational
substantive about it, they should be applauded”.—[Official Report,   needs in academies, but academies take a significantly
House of Lords, 21 June 2010; Vol. 719, c. 1264.]                    higher proportion of children with SEN, and the evidence
   My hon. Friend the Member for Beverley and Holderness             suggests they are less likely to exclude. I refer her to
(Mr Stuart) made the important point that the Bill                   clause 1(7) of the Bill, which strengthens the position of
builds on the academy legislation of the last Government.            children with SEN and imposes on new academies all
However, the new model agreement gives greater protection            the obligations on admissions and exclusions that apply
to children with special educational needs by mirroring              to maintained schools.
all the requirements that apply to maintained schools.                  The hon. Member for Southport (Dr Pugh) raised
That was not the position in the funding agreement                   some concerns about the Bill and I would remind him
signed by the Secretary of State in the last Government.             that charter schools in New York have dramatically
   My hon. Friend also raised the important issue of                 closed the gap between the poorest and those from
exclusions, which, he said, were running at twice the                neighbouring wealthy boroughs—by 86% in maths and
national average rate in existing academies. Many early              66% in English. A third of academies in this country
academies that were established in very challenging                  with GCSE results in 2008 and 2009 have achieved a
areas and inherited very challenging pupils did need to              15% increase in results compared with the results of
exclude some children to bring about good behaviour                  their predecessor schools.
and a new ethos, but as they became established, exclusion              My hon. Friend the Member for Bristol North West
rates tended to fall. Many open academies have exclusion             (Charlotte Leslie) is passionate about education, and
rates that are no higher than those in the rest of the               she made an excellent and thoughtful speech highlighting
local authority that they serve. Academies are required              the enormous and widening attainment gap in this
to participate in their local fair access protocols. The             country. She is right to welcome the expectation that
truth is that they have a higher proportion of children              outstanding schools opting for academy status will help
with SEN, and tend to exclude such children proportionately          weaker schools.
less.                                                                   My hon. Friend the Member for South West Norfolk
   Academies are subject to the same admission                       (Elizabeth Truss) brings to the House all her experience
requirements as maintained schools. They must comply                 of, and passion for, education. She pointed out how
with admissions law and the admissions code, and are                 millions of children have been let down by 13 years of
129                Academies Bill [Lords]                    19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]               130

failed education policies. She also pointed to millions of            Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben            Hanson, rh Mr David
pounds being wasted and consumed by quangos, strategies               Brennan, Kevin                 Harman, rh Ms Harriet
and initiatives that dictated a prescriptive approach to              Brown, Lyn                     Harris, Mr Tom
teaching that demoralised the profession and forced                   Brown, rh Mr Nicholas          Havard, Mr Dai
                                                                      Brown, Mr Russell              Healey, rh John
teachers to teach to the test and to fit the system. She is
                                                                      Bryant, Chris                  Hendrick, Mark
right to say that the new freedoms, and our plans to                  Buck, Ms Karen                 Hepburn, Mr Stephen
sweep away many of the bureaucratic burdens that are                  Burden, Richard                Heyes, David
piled on to teachers and schools, will help to rejuvenate             Byrne, rh Mr Liam              Hillier, Meg
the teaching profession. This is a Government who                     Campbell, Mr Alan              Hilling, Julie
trust the professionalism of teachers. She is also right to           Campbell, Mr Ronnie            Hodge, rh Margaret
point out that there are extensive concerns about standards.          Clark, Katy                    Hood, Mr Jim
   We are not prepared to continue with the system we                 Clwyd, rh Ann                  Hopkins, Kelvin
inherited. We are a Government in a hurry. Head teachers              Coaker, Vernon                 Howarth, rh Mr George
                                                                      Coffey, Ann                    Hunt, Tristram
are in a hurry. Every year and every month that passes
                                                                      Cooper, Rosie                  Illsley, Mr Eric
by is a month or a year of a child’s education. It is a
                                                                      Cooper, rh Yvette              Irranca-Davies, Huw
disgrace that, in 2008, of the 80,000 young people                    Corbyn, Jeremy                 Jackson, Glenda
qualifying for free school meals just 45 got into Oxbridge.           Crausby, Mr David              James, Mrs Siân C.
It is wrong that 42% of those qualifying for free school              Creasy, Stella                 Jamieson, Cathy
meals failed to achieve a single GCSE above a grade D.                Cruddas, Jon                   Johnson, rh Alan
It is unacceptable that just one quarter of GCSE students             Cryer, John                    Johnson, Diana R.
achieve five or more GCSEs, including in English,                     Cunningham, Alex               Jones, Graham
maths, science and a foreign language. The coalition                  Cunningham, Mr Jim             Jones, Helen
agreement says:                                                       Curran, Margaret               Jones, Mr Kevan
  “We will promote the reform of schools in order to ensure that                                     Jones, Susan Elan
                                                                      Danczuk, Simon
new providers can enter the state school system in response to                                       Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald
                                                                      Darling, rh Mr Alistair
parental demand”.                                                                                    Keeley, Barbara
                                                                      David, Mr Wayne
                                                                                                     Keen, Alan
This Bill delivers on that agreement.                                 Davidson, Mr Ian
                                                                                                     Kendall, Liz
   Despite some of the rhetoric from Opposition Members               Davies, Geraint                Khan, rh Sadiq
today, support for the Bill’s proposals goes wider than               De Piero, Gloria               Lammy, rh Mr David
the coalition partners in this Government. There is, in               Denham, rh Mr John             Lavery, Ian
fact, a broad progressive consensus that includes my                  Dobbin, Jim                    Lazarowicz, Mark
                                                                      Dobson, rh Frank               Leslie, Chris
right hon. and hon. Friends on the Government Benches
                                                                      Docherty, Thomas               Lewis, Mr Ivan
and that extends to the liberal wing of the Labour
                                                                      Donohoe, Mr Brian H.           Lloyd, Tony
party. In 2005 Tony Blair said:
                                                                      Doran, Mr Frank                Long, Naomi
   “We need to make it easier for every school to acquire the drive   Dowd, Jim                      Love, Mr Andrew
and essential freedoms of academies…We want every school to
                                                                      Doyle, Gemma                   Lucas, Ian
be able quickly and easily to become a self-governing independent
                                                                      Dromey, Jack                   MacShane, rh Mr Denis
state school…All schools will be able to have academy style
freedoms.”                                                            Dugher, Michael                Mactaggart, Fiona
                                                                      Durkan, Mark                   Mahmood, Shabana
This Bill delivers on the former Prime Minister’s aspiration.                                        Mann, John
                                                                      Eagle, Ms Angela
The coalition even extends to the Democratic party in                 Eagle, Maria                   Marsden, Mr Gordon
the United States.                                                    Elliott, Julie                 McCabe, Steve
   The Bill will deliver more excellent schools in the                                               McCann, Mr Michael
                                                                      Ellman, Mrs Louise
most deprived parts of our country. So far, more than                                                McCarthy, Kerry
                                                                      Engel, Natascha
1,900 schools have expressed an interest in academy                                                  McClymont, Gregg
                                                                      Esterson, Bill
                                                                                                     McDonagh, Siobhain
status. The Government are determined to raise standards              Evans, Chris
                                                                                                     McDonnell, John
and the Bill is part of that strategy. I commend the Bill             Farrelly, Paul                 McFadden, rh Mr Pat
to the House.                                                         Fitzpatrick, Jim               McGovern, Alison
   Question put, That the amendment be made.                          Flello, Robert                 McGovern, Jim
                                                                      Flint, rh Caroline             McGuire, rh Mrs Anne
  The House divided: Ayes 234, Noes 333.                              Flynn, Paul                    McKechin, Ann
Division No. 29]                                       [9.59 pm       Fovargue, Yvonne               McKinnell, Catherine
                                                                      Francis, Dr Hywel              Meacher, rh Mr Michael
                              AYES                                    Gapes, Mike                    Meale, Mr Alan
Abbott, Ms Diane                   Bayley, Hugh                       Gardiner, Barry                Mearns, Ian
Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob               Beckett, rh Margaret               Gilmore, Sheila                Michael, rh Alun
                                   Begg, Miss Anne                    Glass, Pat                     Miliband, rh David
Alexander, rh Mr Douglas
                                   Bell, Sir Stuart                   Glindon, Mrs Mary              Miliband, rh Edward
Alexander, Heidi
                                   Benn, rh Hilary                    Godsiff, Mr Roger              Miller, Andrew
Ali, Rushanara
                                   Benton, Mr Joe                     Goggins, rh Paul               Mitchell, Austin
Allen, Mr Graham
                                   Berger, Luciana                    Goodman, Helen                 Moon, Mrs Madeleine
Anderson, Mr David
                                   Betts, Mr Clive                    Greatrex, Tom                  Morden, Jessica
Austin, Ian                        Blackman-Woods, Roberta            Green, Kate                    Morrice, Graeme
Bailey, Mr Adrian                  Blears, rh Hazel                   Greenwood, Lilian              Morris, Grahame M.
Bain, Mr William                   Blenkinsop, Tom                    Griffith, Nia                  Mudie, Mr George
Balls, rh Ed                       Blomfield, Paul                     Hain, rh Mr Peter              Munn, Meg
Barron, rh Mr Kevin                Blunkett, rh Mr David              Hamilton, Mr Fabian            Murphy, rh Mr Jim
131              Academies Bill [Lords]                 19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                  132

Murphy, rh Paul              Smith, Angela (Penistone and      Crabb, Stephen                Harris, Rebecca
Murray, Ian                    Stocksbridge)                   Crockart, Mike                Hart, Simon
Nandy, Lisa                  Smith, Nick                       Crouch, Tracey                Harvey, Nick
Nash, Pamela                 Smith, Owen                       Davey, Mr Edward              Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan
O’Donnell, Fiona             Soulsby, Sir Peter                Davies, David T. C.           Hayes, Mr John
Onwurah, Chi                 Spellar, rh Mr John                  (Monmouth)                 Heald, Mr Oliver
Osborne, Sandra              Straw, rh Mr Jack                 Davies, Glyn                  Heath, Mr David
Owen, Albert                 Stringer, Graham                  Davies, Philip                Heaton-Harris, Chris
Pearce, Teresa               Stuart, Ms Gisela                 Davis, rh Mr David            Hemming, John
Perkins, Toby                Tami, Mark                        de Bois, Nick                 Henderson, Gordon
Phillipson, Bridget          Thomas, Mr Gareth                                               Hendry, Charles
                                                               Dinenage, Caroline
Pound, Stephen               Thornberry, Emily                                               Herbert, rh Nick
                                                               Djanogly, Mr Jonathan
Qureshi, Yasmin              Timms, rh Stephen                                               Hinds, Damian
                                                               Dodds, rh Mr Nigel
Raynsford, rh Mr Nick        Trickett, Jon                                                   Hoban, Mr Mark
                                                               Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M.
Reed, Mr Jamie               Turner, Karl                                                    Hollingbery, George
Reeves, Rachel               Twigg, Derek                      Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen        Hollobone, Mr Philip
Reynolds, Emma               Twigg, Stephen                    Dorries, Nadine               Holloway, Mr Adam
Reynolds, Jonathan           Umunna, Mr Chuka                  Doyle-Price, Jackie           Hopkins, Kris
Riordan, Mrs Linda           Vaz, rh Keith                     Duddridge, James              Horwood, Martin
Robertson, John              Vaz, Valerie                      Duncan, rh Mr Alan            Howarth, Mr Gerald
Robinson, Mr Geoffrey        Walley, Joan                      Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain      Howell, John
Rotheram, Steve              Watts, Mr Dave                    Dunne, Mr Philip              Hughes, Simon
Roy, Mr Frank                Whitehead, Dr Alan                Ellis, Michael                Huppert, Dr Julian
Roy, Lindsay                 Wicks, rh Malcolm                 Ellison, Jane                 Hurd, Mr Nick
Ruane, Chris                 Williamson, Chris                 Ellwood, Mr Tobias            Jackson, Mr Stewart
Ruddock, rh Joan             Wilson, Phil                      Elphicke, Charlie             James, Margot
Sarwar, Anas                 Winnick, Mr David                                               Javid, Sajid
                                                               Eustice, George
Seabeck, Alison              Winterton, rh Ms Rosie                                          Jenkin, Mr Bernard
                                                               Evans, Graham
Sharma, Mr Virendra          Woodcock, John                                                  Johnson, Gareth
Sheerman, Mr Barry                                             Evans, Jonathan               Johnson, Joseph
                             Woolas, Mr Phil                   Evennett, Mr David
Sheridan, Jim                                                                                Jones, Andrew
                             Wright, David
Shuker, Gavin                                                  Fabricant, Michael            Jones, Mr David
                             Wright, Mr Iain
Singh, Mr Marsha                                               Fallon, Michael               Jones, Mr Marcus
Skinner, Mr Dennis           Tellers for the Ayes:             Featherstone, Lynne           Kawczynski, Daniel
Slaughter, Mr Andy              Mary Creagh and                Field, Mr Mark                Kelly, Chris
Smith, rh Mr Andrew             Mrs Sharon Hodgson             Foster, Mr Don                Kirby, Simon
                                                               Francois, rh Mr Mark          Knight, rh Mr Greg
                                                                                             Kwarteng, Kwasi
                         NOES                                  Freeman, George
                                                                                             Laing, Mrs Eleanor
Adams, Nigel                 Brady, Mr Graham                  Freer, Mike                   Lamb, Norman
Afriyie, Adam                Brake, Tom                        Fullbrook, Lorraine           Lancaster, Mark
Aldous, Peter                Bray, Angie                       Fuller, Richard               Lansley, rh Mr Andrew
Alexander, rh Danny          Bridgen, Andrew                   Garnier, Mr Edward            Latham, Pauline
Amess, Mr David              Brine, Mr Steve                   Garnier, Mark                 Laws, rh Mr David
Andrew, Stuart               Brokenshire, James                Gauke, Mr David               Leadsom, Andrea
Arbuthnot, rh Mr James       Brooke, Annette                                                 Lee, Jessica
                                                               George, Andrew
Bacon, Mr Richard            Bruce, Fiona                                                    Lee, Dr Phillip
                                                               Gibb, Mr Nick
Bagshawe, Ms Louise          Bruce, rh Malcolm                                               Leech, Mr John
                             Buckland, Mr Robert               Gilbert, Stephen
Baker, Norman                                                                                Lefroy, Jeremy
                             Burley, Mr Aidan                  Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl
Baker, Steve                                                                                 Leigh, Mr Edward
                             Burns, Conor                      Glen, John                    Leslie, Charlotte
Baldry, Tony
                             Burns, Mr Simon                   Goldsmith, Zac                Letwin, rh Mr Oliver
Baldwin, Harriett            Burrowes, Mr David                Goodwill, Mr Robert           Lewis, Brandon
Barclay, Stephen             Burstow, Mr Paul                  Gove, rh Michael              Lewis, Dr Julian
Barker, Gregory              Burt, Alistair                    Graham, Richard               Liddell-Grainger, Mr Ian
Baron, Mr John               Burt, Lorely                      Grant, Mrs Helen              Lidington, Mr David
Barwell, Gavin               Byles, Dan                        Grayling, rh Chris            Lilley, rh Mr Peter
Bebb, Guto                   Cable, rh Vince
                                                               Green, Damian                 Lloyd, Stephen
Beith, rh Sir Alan           Cairns, Alun                                                    Lopresti, Jack
Benyon, Richard                                                Greening, Justine
                             Campbell, rh Sir Menzies                                        Lord, Jonathan
Beresford, Sir Paul                                            Grieve, rh Mr Dominic
                             Carmichael, Mr Alistair                                         Loughton, Tim
Berry, Jake                                                    Griffiths, Andrew
                             Carmichael, Neil                                                Luff, Peter
Bingham, Andrew                                                Gummer, Ben
                             Cash, Mr William                                                Macleod, Mary
Binley, Mr Brian             Chishti, Rehman                   Gyimah, Mr Sam
                                                                                             Main, Mrs Anne
Birtwistle, Gordon           Clappison, Mr James               Halfon, Robert                Maude, rh Mr Francis
Blackman, Bob                Clark, rh Greg                    Hames, Duncan                 May, rh Mrs Theresa
Blackwood, Nicola            Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth             Hammond, Stephen              Maynard, Paul
Blunt, Mr Crispin            Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey           Hancock, Matthew              McCartney, Jason
Boles, Nick                  Coffey, Dr Thérèse                Hancock, Mr Mike              McCartney, Karl
Bone, Mr Peter               Collins, Damian                   Hands, Greg                   McCrea, Dr William
Bottomley, Peter             Colvile, Oliver                   Harper, Mr Mark               McIntosh, Miss Anne
Bradley, Karen               Cox, Mr Geoffrey                  Harrington, Richard           McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick
133              Academies Bill [Lords]              19 JULY 2010            Academies Bill [Lords]                  134

McPartland, Stephen          Simmonds, Mark                   The House divided: Ayes 326, Noes 236.
McVey, Esther                Skidmore, Chris
                                                            Division No. 30]                         [10.13 pm
Menzies, Mark                Smith, Miss Chloe
Mercer, Patrick              Smith, Henry
Metcalfe, Stephen            Smith, Julian
Miller, Maria                Smith, Sir Robert              Adams, Nigel                  Crouch, Tracey
Mills, Nigel                 Soames, Nicholas               Afriyie, Adam                 Davey, Mr Edward
Milton, Anne                 Soubry, Anna                   Aldous, Peter                 Davies, David T. C.
Moore, rh Michael            Spelman, rh Mrs Caroline       Alexander, rh Danny              (Monmouth)
Mordaunt, Penny              Spencer, Mr Mark               Amess, Mr David               Davies, Glyn
Morgan, Nicky                Stanley, rh Sir John           Andrew, Stuart                Davies, Philip
Morris, Anne Marie           Stephenson, Andrew             Arbuthnot, rh Mr James        Davis, rh Mr David
Morris, David                Stevenson, John                Bacon, Mr Richard             de Bois, Nick
Morris, James                Stewart, Bob                   Bagshawe, Ms Louise           Dinenage, Caroline
Mosley, Stephen              Stewart, Iain                  Baker, Norman                 Djanogly, Mr Jonathan
Mowat, David                 Stewart, Rory                  Baker, Steve                  Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen
Mundell, rh David            Streeter, Mr Gary              Baldry, Tony                  Dorries, Nadine
Munt, Tessa                  Stride, Mel                    Baldwin, Harriett             Doyle-Price, Jackie
Murray, Sheryll              Stuart, Mr Graham              Barclay, Stephen              Duddridge, James
Murrison, Dr Andrew          Stunell, Andrew                Barker, Gregory               Duncan, rh Mr Alan
Neill, Robert                Sturdy, Julian                 Baron, Mr John                Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain
Newmark, Mr Brooks           Swales, Ian                    Barwell, Gavin                Ellis, Michael
Newton, Sarah                Swayne, Mr Desmond             Bebb, Guto                    Ellison, Jane
Nokes, Caroline              Swinson, Jo                    Beith, rh Sir Alan            Ellwood, Mr Tobias
Norman, Jesse                Swire, Mr Hugo                 Benyon, Richard               Elphicke, Charlie
Nuttall, Mr David            Syms, Mr Robert                Beresford, Sir Paul           Eustice, George
Offord, Mr Matthew           Tapsell, Sir Peter             Berry, Jake                   Evans, Graham
Ollerenshaw, Eric            Teather, Sarah                 Bingham, Andrew               Evans, Jonathan
Opperman, Guy                Thurso, John                   Binley, Mr Brian              Evennett, Mr David
Ottaway, Richard             Timpson, Mr Edward             Birtwistle, Gordon            Fabricant, Michael
Paice, Mr James              Tomlinson, Justin              Blackman, Bob                 Fallon, Michael
Parish, Neil                 Tredinnick, David              Blackwood, Nicola             Featherstone, Lynne
Patel, Priti                 Truss, Elizabeth               Blunt, Mr Crispin             Field, Mr Mark
Paterson, rh Mr Owen         Turner, Mr Andrew              Boles, Nick                   Foster, Mr Don
Pawsey, Mark                 Tyrie, Mr Andrew               Bone, Mr Peter                Francois, rh Mr Mark
Penning, Mike                Uppal, Paul                    Bottomley, Peter              Freeman, George
Penrose, John                Vaizey, Mr Edward              Bradley, Karen                Freer, Mike
Percy, Andrew                Vara, Mr Shailesh              Brady, Mr Graham              Fullbrook, Lorraine
Perry, Claire                                               Brake, Tom                    Fuller, Richard
                             Vickers, Martin
Phillips, Stephen                                           Bray, Angie                   Garnier, Mr Edward
                             Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa
Pickles, rh Mr Eric                                         Bridgen, Andrew               Garnier, Mark
                             Walker, Mr Charles
Pincher, Christopher                                        Brine, Mr Steve               Gauke, Mr David
                             Walker, Mr Robin
Poulter, Dr Daniel                                          Brokenshire, James            George, Andrew
                             Wallace, Mr Ben                Brooke, Annette               Gibb, Mr Nick
Prisk, Mr Mark
Pritchard, Mark              Ward, Mr David                 Bruce, Fiona                  Gilbert, Stephen
Raab, Mr Dominic             Watkinson, Angela              Bruce, rh Malcolm             Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl
Randall, rh Mr John          Weatherley, Mike               Buckland, Mr Robert           Glen, John
Reckless, Mark               Webb, Steve                    Burley, Mr Aidan              Goldsmith, Zac
Redwood, rh Mr John          Wharton, James                 Burns, Conor                  Goodwill, Mr Robert
Rees-Mogg, Jacob             Wheeler, Heather               Burns, Mr Simon               Gove, rh Michael
Reevell, Simon               White, Chris                   Burrowes, Mr David            Graham, Richard
Reid, Mr Alan                Whittaker, Craig               Burstow, Mr Paul              Grant, Mrs Helen
Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm      Whittingdale, Mr John          Burt, Alistair                Gray, Mr James
Robertson, Mr Laurence       Willetts, rh Mr David          Burt, Lorely                  Grayling, rh Chris
Rogerson, Dan                Williams, Stephen              Byles, Dan                    Green, Damian
Rosindell, Andrew            Williamson, Gavin              Cable, rh Vince               Greening, Justine
Rudd, Amber                  Wilson, Mr Rob                 Cairns, Alun                  Grieve, rh Mr Dominic
Russell, Bob                 Wollaston, Dr Sarah            Campbell, rh Sir Menzies      Griffiths, Andrew
Rutley, David                Wright, Jeremy                 Carmichael, Mr Alistair       Gummer, Ben
Sanders, Mr Adrian           Wright, Simon                  Carmichael, Neil              Gyimah, Mr Sam
Sandys, Laura                Yeo, Mr Tim                    Cash, Mr William              Halfon, Robert
Scott, Mr Lee                                               Chishti, Rehman               Hames, Duncan
                             Young, rh Sir George
Selous, Andrew                                              Clappison, Mr James           Hammond, Stephen
                             Zahawi, Nadhim
Shapps, rh Grant                                            Clark, rh Greg                Hancock, Matthew
Sharma, Alok                 Tellers for the Noes:          Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth         Hands, Greg
Shelbrooke, Alec               Bill Wiggin and              Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey       Harper, Mr Mark
Shepherd, Mr Richard           Mark Hunter                  Coffey, Dr Thérèse            Harrington, Richard
                                                            Collins, Damian               Harris, Rebecca
  Question accordingly negatived.                           Colvile, Oliver               Hart, Simon
                                                            Cox, Mr Geoffrey              Harvey, Nick
  Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 62(2)),        Crabb, Stephen                Hayes, Mr John
That the Bill be now read a Second time.                    Crockart, Mike                Heald, Mr Oliver
135               Academies Bill [Lords]             19 JULY 2010           Academies Bill [Lords]                  136

Heath, Mr David               Milton, Anne                  Stevenson, John              Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa
Heaton-Harris, Chris          Moore, rh Michael             Stewart, Bob                 Walker, Mr Charles
Hemming, John                 Mordaunt, Penny               Stewart, Iain                Walker, Mr Robin
Henderson, Gordon             Morgan, Nicky                 Stewart, Rory                Wallace, Mr Ben
Hendry, Charles               Morris, Anne Marie            Streeter, Mr Gary            Watkinson, Angela
Herbert, rh Nick              Morris, David                 Stride, Mel                  Weatherley, Mike
Hinds, Damian                 Morris, James                 Stuart, Mr Graham            Webb, Steve
Hoban, Mr Mark                Mosley, Stephen               Stunell, Andrew              Wharton, James
Hollingbery, George           Mowat, David                  Sturdy, Julian               Wheeler, Heather
Hollobone, Mr Philip          Mundell, rh David             Swayne, Mr Desmond           White, Chris
Holloway, Mr Adam             Munt, Tessa                   Swinson, Jo                  Whittaker, Craig
Hopkins, Kris                 Murray, Sheryll               Swire, Mr Hugo               Whittingdale, Mr John
Horwood, Martin               Murrison, Dr Andrew           Syms, Mr Robert              Wiggin, Bill
Howarth, Mr Gerald            Neill, Robert                 Tapsell, Sir Peter           Willetts, rh Mr David
Howell, John                  Newmark, Mr Brooks            Teather, Sarah               Williams, Stephen
Hughes, Simon                 Newton, Sarah                 Thurso, John                 Williamson, Gavin
Huppert, Dr Julian            Nokes, Caroline               Timpson, Mr Edward           Wilson, Mr Rob
Hurd, Mr Nick                 Norman, Jesse                 Tomlinson, Justin            Wollaston, Dr Sarah
Jackson, Mr Stewart           Nuttall, Mr David             Tredinnick, David            Wright, Jeremy
James, Margot                 Offord, Mr Matthew            Truss, Elizabeth             Wright, Simon
Javid, Sajid                  Ollerenshaw, Eric             Turner, Mr Andrew            Yeo, Mr Tim
Jenkin, Mr Bernard            Opperman, Guy                 Tyrie, Mr Andrew             Young, rh Sir George
Johnson, Gareth               Ottaway, Richard              Uppal, Paul                  Zahawi, Nadhim
Johnson, Joseph               Paice, Mr James               Vaizey, Mr Edward            Tellers for the Ayes:
Jones, Andrew                 Parish, Neil                  Vara, Mr Shailesh                 Mr Philip Dunne and
Jones, Mr David               Patel, Priti                  Vickers, Martin                   Mark Hunter
Jones, Mr Marcus              Paterson, rh Mr Owen
Kawczynski, Daniel            Pawsey, Mark
Kelly, Chris                  Penning, Mike                                            NOES
Kirby, Simon                  Penrose, John                 Abbott, Ms Diane             Crausby, Mr David
Knight, rh Mr Greg            Percy, Andrew                 Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob         Creasy, Stella
Kwarteng, Kwasi               Perry, Claire                 Alexander, rh Mr Douglas     Cruddas, Jon
Laing, Mrs Eleanor            Phillips, Stephen             Alexander, Heidi             Cryer, John
Lamb, Norman                  Pickles, rh Mr Eric           Ali, Rushanara               Cunningham, Alex
Lancaster, Mark               Pincher, Christopher          Allen, Mr Graham             Cunningham, Mr Jim
Lansley, rh Mr Andrew         Poulter, Dr Daniel            Anderson, Mr David           Curran, Margaret
Latham, Pauline               Prisk, Mr Mark                Austin, Ian                  Danczuk, Simon
Laws, rh Mr David             Pritchard, Mark               Bailey, Mr Adrian            Darling, rh Mr Alistair
Leadsom, Andrea               Raab, Mr Dominic              Bain, Mr William             David, Mr Wayne
Lee, Jessica                  Randall, rh Mr John           Balls, rh Ed                 Davies, Geraint
Lee, Dr Phillip               Reckless, Mark                Barron, rh Mr Kevin          De Piero, Gloria
Leech, Mr John                Redwood, rh Mr John           Bayley, Hugh                 Denham, rh Mr John
Lefroy, Jeremy                Rees-Mogg, Jacob              Beckett, rh Margaret         Dobbin, Jim
Leigh, Mr Edward              Reevell, Simon                Begg, Miss Anne              Dobson, rh Frank
Leslie, Charlotte             Reid, Mr Alan                 Bell, Sir Stuart             Docherty, Thomas
Letwin, rh Mr Oliver          Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm       Benn, rh Hilary              Dodds, rh Mr Nigel
Lewis, Brandon                Robertson, Mr Laurence        Benton, Mr Joe               Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M.
Lewis, Dr Julian              Rogerson, Dan                 Berger, Luciana              Donohoe, Mr Brian H.
Liddell-Grainger, Mr Ian      Rosindell, Andrew             Betts, Mr Clive              Doran, Mr Frank
Lidington, Mr David           Rudd, Amber                   Blackman-Woods, Roberta      Dowd, Jim
Lilley, rh Mr Peter           Russell, Bob                  Blears, rh Hazel             Doyle, Gemma
Lloyd, Stephen                Rutley, David                 Blenkinsop, Tom              Dromey, Jack
Lopresti, Jack                Sanders, Mr Adrian            Blomfield, Paul               Dugher, Michael
Lord, Jonathan                Sandys, Laura                 Blunkett, rh Mr David        Durkan, Mark
Loughton, Tim                 Scott, Mr Lee                 Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben          Eagle, Ms Angela
Luff, Peter                   Selous, Andrew                Brennan, Kevin               Eagle, Maria
Macleod, Mary                 Shapps, rh Grant              Brown, Lyn                   Elliott, Julie
Main, Mrs Anne                Sharma, Alok                  Brown, rh Mr Nicholas        Ellman, Mrs Louise
Maude, rh Mr Francis          Shelbrooke, Alec              Brown, Mr Russell            Engel, Natascha
May, rh Mrs Theresa           Shepherd, Mr Richard          Bryant, Chris                Esterson, Bill
Maynard, Paul                 Simmonds, Mark                Buck, Ms Karen               Evans, Chris
McCartney, Jason              Skidmore, Chris               Burden, Richard              Fitzpatrick, Jim
McCartney, Karl               Smith, Miss Chloe             Byrne, rh Mr Liam            Flello, Robert
McIntosh, Miss Anne           Smith, Henry                  Campbell, Mr Alan            Flint, rh Caroline
McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick     Smith, Julian                 Campbell, Mr Ronnie          Flynn, Paul
McPartland, Stephen           Smith, Sir Robert             Clark, Katy                  Fovargue, Yvonne
McVey, Esther                 Soames, Nicholas              Clwyd, rh Ann                Francis, Dr Hywel
Menzies, Mark                 Soubry, Anna                  Coaker, Vernon               Gapes, Mike
Mercer, Patrick               Spelman, rh Mrs Caroline      Coffey, Ann                  Gardiner, Barry
Metcalfe, Stephen             Spencer, Mr Mark              Cooper, Rosie                Gilmore, Sheila
Miller, Maria                 Stanley, rh Sir John          Cooper, rh Yvette            Glass, Pat
Mills, Nigel                  Stephenson, Andrew            Corbyn, Jeremy               Glindon, Mrs Mary
137              Academies Bill [Lords]             19 JULY 2010                Academies Bill [Lords]                         138

Godsiff, Mr Roger            Miliband, rh David             Wilson, Phil                         Wright, David
Goggins, rh Paul             Miliband, rh Edward            Winnick, Mr David                    Wright, Mr Iain
Goodman, Helen               Miller, Andrew                 Winterton, rh Ms Rosie               Tellers for the Noes:
Greatrex, Tom                Mitchell, Austin               Woodcock, John                         Mary Creagh and
Green, Kate                  Moon, Mrs Madeleine            Woolas, Mr Phil                        Mrs Sharon Hodgson
Greenwood, Lilian            Morden, Jessica
Griffith, Nia                Morrice, Graeme
Hain, rh Mr Peter            Morris, Grahame M.                Question accordingly agreed to.
Hamilton, Mr Fabian          Mudie, Mr George                  Bill read a Second time.
Hancock, Mr Mike             Munn, Meg
Hanson, rh Mr David          Murphy, rh Mr Jim
Harman, rh Ms Harriet        Murphy, rh Paul
Harris, Mr Tom               Murray, Ian                      ACADEMIES BILL [LORDS] (PROGRAMME)
Havard, Mr Dai               Nandy, Lisa                      Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing
Healey, rh John              Nash, Pamela                   Order No. 83A(7)),
Hendrick, Mark               O’Donnell, Fiona
                                                               That the following provisions shall apply to the Academies Bill
Hepburn, Mr Stephen          Onwurah, Chi
Heyes, David                 Osborne, Sandra
Hillier, Meg                 Owen, Albert                                              Committal
Hilling, Julie               Pearce, Teresa                    1. The Bill shall be committed to a Committee of the whole
Hodge, rh Margaret           Perkins, Toby                  House.
Hood, Mr Jim                 Phillipson, Bridget                                       Proceedings
Hopkins, Kelvin              Pound, Stephen
                                                               2. Proceedings in Committee, any proceedings on consideration
Howarth, rh Mr George        Qureshi, Yasmin
                                                            and proceedings on Third Reading shall be completed in three
Hunt, Tristram               Raynsford, rh Mr Nick          days.
Illsley, Mr Eric             Reed, Mr Jamie
Irranca-Davies, Huw          Reeves, Rachel                    3. Proceedings in Committee shall be taken on each of those
Jackson, Glenda              Reynolds, Emma
                                                            days as shown in the first column of the following Table and in
                                                            the order so shown.
James, Mrs Siân C.           Reynolds, Jonathan
Jamieson, Cathy              Riordan, Mrs Linda                4. Proceedings shall (so far as not previously concluded) be
Johnson, rh Alan             Robertson, John                brought to a conclusion at the times specified in the second
Johnson, Diana R.            Robinson, Mr Geoffrey          column of the Table.
Jones, Graham                Rotheram, Steve                                               TABLE
Jones, Helen                 Roy, Mr Frank                                                            Time for conclusion of
Jones, Mr Kevan              Roy, Lindsay                             Proceedings                         proceedings
Jones, Susan Elan            Ruane, Chris
Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald       Ruddock, rh Joan                           First day
Keeley, Barbara              Sarwar, Anas                   Clauses 1, 6, 9 and 10, new          Three hours after the moment
Keen, Alan                   Seabeck, Alison                Clauses relating to Clauses 1,       of interruption.
Kendall, Liz                 Sharma, Mr Virendra            6, 9 or 10, new Schedules relating
Khan, rh Sadiq               Sheerman, Mr Barry             to Clauses 1, 6, 9 or 10.
Lammy, rh Mr David           Sheridan, Jim                             Second day
Lavery, Ian                  Shuker, Gavin
                                                            Clauses 2, 7, 8 and 11 to 13,        One hour after the moment of
Lazarowicz, Mark             Singh, Mr Marsha
                                                            Schedule 1, Clause 14, Schedule      interruption.
Leslie, Chris                Skinner, Mr Dennis             2, Clause 15, new Clauses relating
Lewis, Mr Ivan               Slaughter, Mr Andy             to Clauses 2, 7 or 8 or any of
Lloyd, Tony                  Smith, rh Mr Andrew            Clauses 11 to 15 or Schedule 1
Long, Naomi                  Smith, Angela (Penistone and   or 2, new Schedules relating to
Love, Mr Andrew                Stocksbridge)                Clauses 2, 7 or 8 or any of
Lucas, Ian                   Smith, Nick                    Clauses 11 to 15 or Schedule 1
MacShane, rh Mr Denis        Smith, Owen                    or 2.
Mactaggart, Fiona            Soulsby, Sir Peter                         Third day
Mahmood, Shabana             Spellar, rh Mr John
                                                            Clauses 3 to 5, Clauses 16 to        One hour before the moment
Mann, John                   Straw, rh Mr Jack
                                                            20, new Clauses relating to any      of interruption.
Marsden, Mr Gordon           Stringer, Graham
                                                            of Clauses 3 to 5 or 16 to 20,
McCabe, Steve                Stuart, Ms Gisela
                                                            new Schedules relating to any
McCann, Mr Michael           Tami, Mark                     of Clauses 3 to 5 or 16 to 20,
McCarthy, Kerry              Thomas, Mr Gareth              remaining proceedings on the
McClymont, Gregg             Thornberry, Emily              Bill.
McCrea, Dr William           Timms, rh Stephen
McDonagh, Siobhain           Trickett, Jon
McDonnell, John              Turner, Karl                     5. Any proceedings on consideration and proceedings on Third
                                                            Reading shall (so far as not previously concluded) be brought to a
McFadden, rh Mr Pat          Twigg, Derek
                                                            conclusion at the moment of interruption on the third day.
McGovern, Alison             Twigg, Stephen
McGovern, Jim                Umunna, Mr Chuka                                    Programming Committee
McGuire, rh Mrs Anne         Vaz, rh Keith                    6. Standing Order No. 83B (Programming committees) shall
McKechin, Ann                Vaz, Valerie                   not apply to proceedings in Committee, any proceedings on
McKinnell, Catherine         Walley, Joan                   consideration or proceedings on Third Reading.
Meacher, rh Mr Michael       Watts, Mr Dave                                          Other proceedings
Meale, Mr Alan               Whitehead, Dr Alan                7. Any other proceedings on the Bill (including any proceedings
Mearns, Ian                  Wicks, rh Malcolm              on consideration of any message from the Lords) may be programmed.
Michael, rh Alun             Williamson, Chris              —(Mr Vara.)
139              Academies Bill [Lords]                  19 JULY 2010             Academies Bill [Lords]                 140

  The House divided: Ayes 322, Noes 238.                        Heath, Mr David               Morgan, Nicky
                                                                Heaton-Harris, Chris          Morris, Anne Marie
Division No. 31]                         [10.27 pm
                                                                Hemming, John                 Morris, David
                                                                Henderson, Gordon             Morris, James
                           AYES                                 Hendry, Charles               Mosley, Stephen
Adams, Nigel                  Davey, Mr Edward                  Herbert, rh Nick              Mowat, David
Afriyie, Adam                 Davies, David T. C.               Hinds, Damian                 Mundell, rh David
Aldous, Peter                    (Monmouth)                     Hoban, Mr Mark                Munt, Tessa
Alexander, rh Danny           Davies, Glyn                      Hollingbery, George           Murray, Sheryll
Amess, Mr David               Davies, Philip                    Holloway, Mr Adam             Murrison, Dr Andrew
Andrew, Stuart                Davis, rh Mr David                Hopkins, Kris                 Neill, Robert
Arbuthnot, rh Mr James        de Bois, Nick                     Horwood, Martin               Newmark, Mr Brooks
Bacon, Mr Richard             Dinenage, Caroline                Howarth, Mr Gerald            Newton, Sarah
Bagshawe, Ms Louise           Djanogly, Mr Jonathan             Howell, John                  Nokes, Caroline
Baker, Norman                 Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen            Hughes, Simon                 Norman, Jesse
Baker, Steve                  Dorries, Nadine                   Huppert, Dr Julian            Nuttall, Mr David
Baldry, Tony                  Doyle-Price, Jackie               Hurd, Mr Nick                 Offord, Mr Matthew
Baldwin, Harriett             Duddridge, James                  Jackson, Mr Stewart           Ollerenshaw, Eric
Barclay, Stephen              Duncan, rh Mr Alan                James, Margot                 Opperman, Guy
Barker, Gregory               Duncan Smith, rh Mr Iain          Javid, Sajid                  Ottaway, Richard
Baron, Mr John                Dunne, Mr Philip                  Jenkin, Mr Bernard            Paice, Mr James
Barwell, Gavin                Ellis, Michael                    Johnson, Gareth               Parish, Neil
Bebb, Guto                    Ellison, Jane                     Johnson, Joseph               Patel, Priti
Beith, rh Sir Alan            Ellwood, Mr Tobias                Jones, Andrew                 Paterson, rh Mr Owen
Benyon, Richard               Elphicke, Charlie                 Jones, Mr David               Pawsey, Mark
Beresford, Sir Paul           Eustice, George                   Jones, Mr Marcus              Penning, Mike
Berry, Jake                   Evans, Graham                     Kawczynski, Daniel            Penrose, John
Bingham, Andrew               Evans, Jonathan                   Kelly, Chris                  Percy, Andrew
Binley, Mr Brian              Evennett, Mr David                Kirby, Simon                  Perry, Claire
Birtwistle, Gordon            Fabricant, Michael                Knight, rh Mr Greg            Phillips, Stephen
Blackman, Bob                 Fallon, Michael                   Kwarteng, Kwasi               Pickles, rh Mr Eric
Blackwood, Nicola             Featherstone, Lynne               Laing, Mrs Eleanor            Pincher, Christopher
Blunt, Mr Crispin             Field, Mr Mark                    Lamb, Norman                  Poulter, Dr Daniel
Boles, Nick                   Foster, Mr Don                    Lancaster, Mark               Prisk, Mr Mark
Bone, Mr Peter                Francois, rh Mr Mark              Lansley, rh Mr Andrew         Pritchard, Mark
Bottomley, Peter              Freeman, George                   Latham, Pauline               Raab, Mr Dominic
Bradley, Karen                Freer, Mike                       Leadsom, Andrea               Randall, rh Mr John
Brady, Mr Graham              Fullbrook, Lorraine               Lee, Jessica                  Reckless, Mark
Brake, Tom                    Fuller, Richard                   Lee, Dr Phillip               Redwood, rh Mr John
Bray, Angie                   Garnier, Mr Edward                Lefroy, Jeremy                Rees-Mogg, Jacob
Bridgen, Andrew               Garnier, Mark                     Leigh, Mr Edward              Reevell, Simon
Brine, Mr Steve               Gauke, Mr David                   Leslie, Charlotte             Reid, Mr Alan
Brokenshire, James            George, Andrew                    Letwin, rh Mr Oliver          Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm
Bruce, Fiona                  Gibb, Mr Nick                     Lewis, Brandon                Robertson, Mr Laurence
Bruce, rh Malcolm             Gilbert, Stephen                  Lewis, Dr Julian              Rogerson, Dan
Buckland, Mr Robert           Gillan, rh Mrs Cheryl             Liddell-Grainger, Mr Ian      Rosindell, Andrew
Burley, Mr Aidan              Glen, John                        Lidington, Mr David           Rudd, Amber
Burns, Conor                  Goldsmith, Zac                    Lilley, rh Mr Peter           Russell, Bob
Burns, Mr Simon               Goodwill, Mr Robert               Lloyd, Stephen                Rutley, David
Burrowes, Mr David            Gove, rh Michael                  Lopresti, Jack                Sanders, Mr Adrian
Burstow, Mr Paul              Graham, Richard                   Lord, Jonathan                Sandys, Laura
Burt, Alistair                Grant, Mrs Helen                  Loughton, Tim                 Scott, Mr Lee
Burt, Lorely                  Gray, Mr James                    Luff, Peter                   Selous, Andrew
Byles, Dan                    Grayling, rh Chris                Macleod, Mary                 Shapps, rh Grant
Cable, rh Vince               Green, Damian                     Main, Mrs Anne                Sharma, Alok
Cairns, Alun                  Greening, Justine                 Maude, rh Mr Francis          Shelbrooke, Alec
Campbell, rh Sir Menzies      Grieve, rh Mr Dominic             May, rh Mrs Theresa           Simmonds, Mark
Carmichael, Mr Alistair       Griffiths, Andrew                 Maynard, Paul                 Skidmore, Chris
Carmichael, Neil              Gummer, Ben                       McCartney, Jason              Smith, Miss Chloe
Cash, Mr William              Gyimah, Mr Sam                    McCartney, Karl               Smith, Henry
Chishti, Rehman               Halfon, Robert                    McIntosh, Miss Anne           Smith, Julian
Clappison, Mr James           Hames, Duncan                     McLoughlin, rh Mr Patrick     Smith, Sir Robert
Clark, rh Greg                Hammond, Stephen                  McPartland, Stephen           Soames, Nicholas
Clarke, rh Mr Kenneth         Hancock, Matthew                  McVey, Esther                 Soubry, Anna
Clifton-Brown, Geoffrey       Hands, Greg                       Menzies, Mark                 Spelman, rh Mrs Caroline
Coffey, Dr Thérèse            Harper, Mr Mark                   Mercer, Patrick               Spencer, Mr Mark
Collins, Damian               Harrington, Richard               Metcalfe, Stephen             Stanley, rh Sir John
Colvile, Oliver               Harris, Rebecca                   Miller, Maria                 Stephenson, Andrew
Cox, Mr Geoffrey              Hart, Simon                       Mills, Nigel                  Stevenson, John
Crabb, Stephen                Harvey, Nick                      Milton, Anne                  Stewart, Bob
Crockart, Mike                Hayes, Mr John                    Moore, rh Michael             Stewart, Iain
Crouch, Tracey                Heald, Mr Oliver                  Mordaunt, Penny               Stewart, Rory
141                Academies Bill [Lords]              19 JULY 2010            Academies Bill [Lords]               142

Streeter, Mr Gary              Walker, Mr Charles             Goodman, Helen               Miliband, rh David
Stride, Mel                    Walker, Mr Robin               Greatrex, Tom                Miliband, rh Edward
Stuart, Mr Graham              Wallace, Mr Ben                Green, Kate                  Miller, Andrew
Stunell, Andrew                Watkinson, Angela              Greenwood, Lilian            Mitchell, Austin
Sturdy, Julian                 Weatherley, Mike               Griffith, Nia                Moon, Mrs Madeleine
Swales, Ian                    Webb, Steve                    Hain, rh Mr Peter            Morden, Jessica
Swayne, Mr Desmond             Wharton, James                 Hamilton, Mr Fabian          Morrice, Graeme
Swinson, Jo                    Wheeler, Heather               Hancock, Mr Mike             Morris, Grahame M.
Swire, Mr Hugo                 White, Chris                   Hanson, rh Mr David          Mudie, Mr George
Syms, Mr Robert                Whittaker, Craig               Harman, rh Ms Harriet        Munn, Meg
Tapsell, Sir Peter             Whittingdale, Mr John          Harris, Mr Tom               Murphy, rh Mr Jim
Teather, Sarah                 Willetts, rh Mr David          Havard, Mr Dai               Murphy, rh Paul
Thurso, John                   Williams, Stephen              Healey, rh John              Murray, Ian
Timpson, Mr Edward             Williamson, Gavin              Hendrick, Mark               Nandy, Lisa
Tomlinson, Justin              Wilson, Mr Rob                 Hepburn, Mr Stephen          Nash, Pamela
Tredinnick, David              Wollaston, Dr Sarah            Heyes, David                 O’Donnell, Fiona
Truss, Elizabeth               Wright, Jeremy                 Hillier, Meg                 Onwurah, Chi
Turner, Mr Andrew              Wright, Simon                  Hilling, Julie               Osborne, Sandra
Tyrie, Mr Andrew               Yeo, Mr Tim                    Hodge, rh Margaret           Owen, Albert
Uppal, Paul                    Young, rh Sir George           Hollobone, Mr Philip         Pearce, Teresa
Vaizey, Mr Edward              Zahawi, Nadhim                 Hood, Mr Jim                 Perkins, Toby
Vara, Mr Shailesh                                             Hopkins, Kelvin              Phillipson, Bridget
                               Tellers for the Ayes:
Vickers, Martin                   Bill Wiggin and             Howarth, rh Mr George        Pound, Stephen
Villiers, rh Mrs Theresa          Mark Hunter                 Hunt, Tristram               Qureshi, Yasmin
                                                              Illsley, Mr Eric             Raynsford, rh Mr Nick
                                                              Irranca-Davies, Huw          Reed, Mr Jamie
                           NOES                               Jackson, Glenda              Reeves, Rachel
Abbott, Ms Diane               Cruddas, Jon                   James, Mrs Siân C.           Reynolds, Emma
Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob           Cryer, John                    Jamieson, Cathy              Reynolds, Jonathan
Alexander, rh Mr Douglas       Cunningham, Alex               Johnson, rh Alan             Riordan, Mrs Linda
Alexander, Heidi               Cunningham, Mr Jim             Johnson, Diana R.            Robertson, John
Ali, Rushanara                 Curran, Margaret               Jones, Graham                Robinson, Mr Geoffrey
Allen, Mr Graham               Danczuk, Simon                 Jones, Helen                 Rotheram, Steve
Anderson, Mr David             Darling, rh Mr Alistair        Jones, Mr Kevan              Roy, Mr Frank
Austin, Ian                    David, Mr Wayne                Jones, Susan Elan            Roy, Lindsay
Bailey, Mr Adrian              Davidson, Mr Ian               Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald       Ruane, Chris
Bain, Mr William               Davies, Geraint                Keeley, Barbara              Ruddock, rh Joan
Balls, rh Ed                   De Piero, Gloria               Keen, Alan                   Sarwar, Anas
Barron, rh Mr Kevin            Denham, rh Mr John             Kendall, Liz                 Seabeck, Alison
Bayley, Hugh                   Dobbin, Jim                    Khan, rh Sadiq               Sharma, Mr Virendra
Beckett, rh Margaret           Dobson, rh Frank               Lammy, rh Mr David           Sheerman, Mr Barry
Begg, Miss Anne                Docherty, Thomas               Lavery, Ian                  Sheridan, Jim
Bell, Sir Stuart               Dodds, rh Mr Nigel             Lazarowicz, Mark             Shuker, Gavin
Benn, rh Hilary                Donaldson, rh Mr Jeffrey M.    Leslie, Chris                Singh, Mr Marsha
Benton, Mr Joe                 Donohoe, Mr Brian H.           Lewis, Mr Ivan               Skinner, Mr Dennis
Berger, Luciana                Doran, Mr Frank                Lloyd, Tony                  Slaughter, Mr Andy
Betts, Mr Clive                Dowd, Jim                      Long, Naomi                  Smith, rh Mr Andrew
Blackman-Woods, Roberta        Doyle, Gemma                                                Smith, Angela (Penistone and
                                                              Love, Mr Andrew
Blears, rh Hazel               Dromey, Jack                                                  Stocksbridge)
                                                              Lucas, Ian
Blenkinsop, Tom                Dugher, Michael                                             Smith, Nick
                                                              MacShane, rh Mr Denis
Blomfield, Paul                 Durkan, Mark                                                Smith, Owen
                                                              Mactaggart, Fiona
Blunkett, rh Mr David          Eagle, Ms Angela                                            Soulsby, Sir Peter
                                                              Mahmood, Shabana             Spellar, rh Mr John
Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben            Eagle, Maria
Brennan, Kevin                 Elliott, Julie                 Mann, John                   Straw, rh Mr Jack
Brown, Lyn                     Ellman, Mrs Louise             Marsden, Mr Gordon           Stringer, Graham
Brown, rh Mr Nicholas          Engel, Natascha                McCabe, Steve                Stuart, Ms Gisela
Brown, Mr Russell              Esterson, Bill                 McCann, Mr Michael           Tami, Mark
Bryant, Chris                  Evans, Chris                   McCarthy, Kerry              Thomas, Mr Gareth
Buck, Ms Karen                 Farrelly, Paul                 McClymont, Gregg             Thornberry, Emily
Burden, Richard                Fitzpatrick, Jim               McCrea, Dr William           Timms, rh Stephen
Byrne, rh Mr Liam              Flello, Robert                 McDonagh, Siobhain           Trickett, Jon
Campbell, Mr Alan              Flint, rh Caroline             McDonnell, John              Turner, Karl
Campbell, Mr Ronnie            Flynn, Paul                    McFadden, rh Mr Pat          Twigg, Derek
Clark, Katy                    Fovargue, Yvonne               McGovern, Alison             Twigg, Stephen
Clwyd, rh Ann                  Francis, Dr Hywel              McGovern, Jim                Umunna, Mr Chuka
Coaker, Vernon                 Gapes, Mike                    McGuire, rh Mrs Anne         Vaz, Valerie
Coffey, Ann                    Gardiner, Barry                McKechin, Ann                Walley, Joan
Cooper, Rosie                  Gilmore, Sheila                McKinnell, Catherine         Watts, Mr Dave
Cooper, rh Yvette              Glass, Pat                     Meacher, rh Mr Michael       Whitehead, Dr Alan
Corbyn, Jeremy                 Glindon, Mrs Mary              Meale, Mr Alan               Wicks, rh Malcolm
Crausby, Mr David              Godsiff, Mr Roger              Mearns, Ian                  Williamson, Chris
Creasy, Stella                 Goggins, rh Paul               Michael, rh Alun             Wilson, Phil
143               Academies Bill [Lords]                    19 JULY 2010                                                           144

Winnick, Mr David                 Wright, Mr Iain                                REGULATORY REFORM
Winterton, rh Ms Rosie
                                                                       Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing
Woodcock, John                    Tellers for the Noes:
Woolas, Mr Phil                     Mary Creagh and                  Order No. 18(1)),
Wright, David                       Mrs Sharon Hodgson                 That the draft Legislative Reform (Licensing) (Interim Authority
                                                                     Notices etc.) Order 2010, which was laid before this House on
                                                                     10 March 2010, in the previous Parliament, be approved.—
  Question accordingly agreed to.                                    (Mr Vara.)
  Committee tomorrow.                                                  Question agreed to.

                                                                         LIAISON COMMITTEE (MEMBERSHIP)
      ACADEMIES BILL [LORDS] (MONEY)                                   Ordered,
  Queen’s recommendation signified.                                     That with effect for the current Parliament, notwithstanding
                                                                     Standing Order No. 121 (Nomination of select committees), the
  Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing                  chair for the time being of each of the following select committees
Order No. 52(1)(a)),                                                 (including from the date of his or her election a chair elected
   That, for the purposes of any Act resulting from the Academies    under Standing Order No. 122B) shall be a member of the
Bill [Lords], it is expedient to authorise—                          Liaison Committee:
   (1) the payment out of money provided by Parliament of—              Administration,
   (a) any expenditure incurred under or by virtue of the Act by        Backbench Business,
the Secretary of State, and                                             Business, Innovation and Skills,
   (b) any increase attributable to the Act in the sums payable         Communities and Local Government,
under or by virtue of any other Act out of money so provided,           Culture, Media and Sport,
   (2) the payment of sums into the Consolidated Fund.—
(Mr Vara.)                                                              Education,
                                                                        Energy and Climate Change,
  Question agreed to.
                                                                        Environmental Audit,
                                                                        Environment, Food and Rural Affairs,
                                                                        European Scrutiny,
              Business without Debate
                                                                        Finance and Services,
                                                                        Foreign Affairs,
               ESTIMATES, 2010-11                                       Home Affairs,
  Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing                     Joint Committee on Human Rights (the chair being a Member
                                                                        of this House),
Order No. 55),
                                                                        International Development,
  That, for the year ending with 31 March 2011—
   (1) further resources, not exceeding £277,712,252,000, be
   authorised for use for defence and civil services as set out in      Northern Ireland Affairs,
   HC 128, HC 133, HC 134, HC 149, HC 229 and HC 269,                   Political and Constitutional Reform,
   (2) a further sum, not exceeding £255,954,633,000, be granted        Procedure,
   to Her Majesty out of the Consolidated Fund to meet the              Public Accounts,
   costs of defence and civil services as so set out, and               Public Administration,
   (3) limits as set out in HC 128, HC 133, HC 134, HC 229 and          Regulatory Reform,
   HC 269 be set on appropriations in aid. —(Mr Vara.)
                                                                        Science and Technology,
  Question agreed to.                                                   Scottish Affairs,
  Ordered, That a Bill be brought in upon the foregoing                 Selection,
Resolution;                                                             Standards and Privileges,
  That the Chairman of Ways and Means, Mr Chancellor                    Statutory Instruments,
of the Exchequer, Danny Alexander, Mr Mark Hoban,                       Transport,
Mr David Gauke and Justine Greening bring in the Bill.                  Treasury,
                                                                        Welsh Affairs, and
                                                                        Work and Pensions.—(Mr Vara.)
   Presentation and First Reading
   Mark Hoban accordingly presented a Bill to authorise                USE OF THE CHAMBER (UNITED KINGDOM
the use of resources for the service of the year ending                          YOUTH PARLIAMENT)
with 31 March 2011 and to apply certain sums out of                    Motion made,
the Consolidated Fund to the service of the year ending                 That this House welcomes the work of the United Kingdom
with 31 March 2011; to appropriate the supply authorised             Youth Parliament in providing young people with an opportunity
in this Session of Parliament for the service of the year            to engage with the political process; notes that the House agreed
ending with 31 March 2011; and to repeal certain                     on 16 March 2009 to allow the Youth Parliament to meet once in
Consolidated Fund and Appropriation Acts.                            the Chamber; recalls that this meeting took place on 30 October
                                                                     2009; and accordingly resolves that the UK Youth Parliament
   Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time                should be allowed to meet once a year in the Chamber of this
tomorrow, and to be printed (Bill 2).                                House for the duration of this Parliament.—(Mr Vara.)
145               Business without Debate                 19 JULY 2010                                                              146

  Hon. Members: Object.                                                      Coalfields Regeneration Trust
                                                                               (Wentworth and Dearne)
             DELEGATED LEGISLATION                                   Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House
  Ordered,                                                         do now adjourn.—(Mr Vara.)
   That the Motion in the name of Sir George Young relating to
the Electoral Commission shall be treated as if it related to an   10.45 pm
instrument subject to the provisions of Standing Order No. 118
(Delegated Legislation Committees) in respect of which notice of      John Healey (Wentworth and Dearne) (Lab): I welcome
a motion has been given that the instrument be approved.—          the opportunity to debate the work of the Coalfield
(Mr Vara.)                                                         Regeneration Trust in my constituency in South Yorkshire.
                                                                   I am proud to say that it has its headquarters in the
  Mr Speaker: Before I call the right hon. Member for              Wentworth and Dearne constituency, which I am privileged
Wentworth and Dearne (John Healey), I appeal to                    to represent, and it works throughout England, Wales
Members who are leaving the Chamber to do so quickly               and Scotland. I welcome the Under-Secretary of State
and quietly, thereby treating the right hon. Gentleman             for Communities and Local Government, the hon. Member
with the same courtesy and consideration with which                for Hazel Grove (Andrew Stunell) to the Front Bench;
they would wish to be treated.                                     he is certainly the hardest working in the ministerial
                                                                   team, picking up the widest possible range of debates
                                                                   and other business on behalf of colleagues in the
                                                                   Department. In his constituency on the south-east fringes
                                                                   of Manchester, the last of the pits, in and around
                                                                   Poynton, was closed some 70 years ago.
                                                                      It is therefore a useful opportunity for me to underline
                                                                   for the Under-Secretary and his ministerial colleagues
                                                                   the impact of the wholesale closure of the coal industry
                                                                   in a very short time in the 1980s and 1990s and the
                                                                   importance of the review that the Department is currently
                                                                   conducting about the work of the Coalfield Regeneration
                                                                   Trust and the coalfield regeneration programme, led, of
                                                                   course, by Michael Clapham. Parliament is much the
                                                                   poorer for not having Michael Clapham in the House.
                                                                   He was a very strong voice, not only for Barnsley, but
                                                                   for the coalfields, health and safety and workers in all
                                                                   industries in this country.
                                                                      The timing of my debate is deliberate. I would like the
                                                                   Minister and his ministerial colleagues to understand
                                                                   that there has been good progress, not least through the
                                                                   trust, in the regeneration of our coalfields, but that
                                                                   there is still a lot of work to do. I would also like him to
                                                                   understand that there is strong support in the House, in
                                                                   local government and in the communities in the former
                                                                   coalfields for the work of the trust and of the regeneration
                                                                   programme. The decisions that he and his colleagues
                                                                   make on the review that Michael Clapham produces
                                                                   will be a test of the Government and of whether they
                                                                   can claim to be a Government for the whole country.
                                                                      I am proud that a Labour Government set up the
                                                                   Coalfield Regeneration Trust in 1999, following the report
                                                                   of the Coalfields Task Force, which noted the coalfield
                                                                   areas of Wales, Scotland and England as having
                                                                   “a unique combination of concentrated joblessness, physical isolation,
                                                                   poor infrastructure and severe health problems”
                                                                   in 1998, at the start of the regeneration programme.
                                                                   After more than 15 years in many cases, many of our
                                                                   coalfield communities were still reeling from the
                                                                   unprecedented devastation and deliberate destruction
                                                                   of the coal industry at that time.
                                                                      Of the 130 pits that were operating in 1981, 124 closed.
                                                                   More than 190,000 of the 200,000 jobs in the coal
                                                                   industry in 1981 went. In the Yorkshire coalfields, some
                                                                   67,000 jobs were lost—more than one in four of all the
                                                                   male jobs in the coalfield region. In my constituency,
                                                                   there are four wards, in which in 1981, between two
                                                                   fifths and two thirds in one case of men aged over 16
                                                                   were employed in coal mining. That was the extent of
                                                                   the importance of the industry to our areas at the time.
147           Coalfields Regeneration Trust             19 JULY 2010            Coalfields Regeneration Trust                  148
               (Wentworth and Dearne)                                            (Wentworth and Dearne)
[John Healey]                                                    with the British Canoe Union. A new form of activity
                                                                 and use for the coalfield area has therefore been created.
There was unparalleled and unique reliance on a single              In fact, since the trust began, it has created 119 new
industry, not only for jobs, but for housing, social and         community facilities, and refurbished and improved
welfare support, often for sports and recreation facilities      more than 2,000. It has helped more than 17,000 people
and sometimes for the financial and retail services for          in our communities to find work and more than 115,000
the community.                                                   to get skills and training for the future. It has worked on
   I am proud that the Labour Government set up the              child care places, social enterprises, community transport,
Coalfield Regeneration Trust and that its headquarters           and debt and financial advice, and it has helped nearly
has been in my constituency for the past eight years, on         10,000 people to become new volunteers in projects
the site of the old Manvers colliery, which had the first        within their communities. It is special and it works in
shaft sunk in 1870 and was closed by the previous Tory           special ways, because it recognises the special challenges
Government in 1988. When that was closed, its 285-acre           in the coalfields.
site became part of the largest derelict areas in western
Europe, and one of the biggest regeneration challenges             Mr David Anderson (Blaydon) (Lab): I am speaking
this country has faced. Now, I am happy to say, it has           as a former miner and as the chair of the all-party
been overtaken by new jobs, businesses and housing.              coalfield communities group. We recognise and welcome
   The trust has played an important part in that                the trust’s work. However, the Audit Commission, in its
regeneration since it was set up, supporting groups and          2008 report, praised the physical and economic regeneration,
activities in the constituency with more than £3 million.        but made the point that in former mining areas throughout
It supported the widest possible range of work, from             the country, there were still high levels of worklessness,
the Dearne Valley college to the Rawmarsh St Joseph’s            low skills and poor health.
football club and the Montgomery hall needlework
group in Wath. Across the country, the trust has distributed
grants of around £190 million. I pay tribute to the work            John Healey: Indeed, and my hon. Friend chairs the
of the chief executive, Janet Bibby, and her small team          all-party coalfields group very ably and plays an important
of staff, and in particular to the trustees—dedicated            role. He is right, and the National Audit Office recognised
men and women—who are chaired by Peter McNestry.                 that progress had been made. Some of the gap with the
They have committed their work to backing the trust              rest of the country in jobs and skills has been closed,
and have served the coalfields so well.                          but a big challenge remains ahead. That is why the work
   The trust is an independent charity and limited company.      of the trust and the wider programme is necessary for
It supports our communities through grants, but it also          the future.
supports them by linking up in a more long-term and                 The trust works in unusual ways that are especially
strategic way with other agencies. It operates in England,       suited to our coalfield communities. It helps groups to
Wales and Scotland. Simply put, the trust reaches people         develop ideas in order to bid for support. It ensures that
and parts of our communities that public agencies                the support that it can give goes beyond the grant of
simply cannot reach. It helps to rebuild the community           money and assistance. Most importantly, the trust backs
and strengthen the spirit of the old pit villages, as well       projects that increase opportunities for local people to
as providing the physical regeneration of the other              get involved. That is why more than 250,000 young
programmes.                                                      people, in the projects that the trust has supported over
   The trust is special because it understands the unique        the years, have become involved and part of the activities
culture and character of the coalfields, because it is           that the trust has supported. That is why nearly 10,000
trusted by the communities, and because it reaches back          people have volunteered as part of the projects.
with families and through generations, sharing their                The trust is backed by local authorities in the coalfield
history, but also helping them to shape their future. In         communities, a network that is ably led by Ian Watts,
my constituency, the trust gave an important grant to            the leader of Bolsover council. It is backed by public
Cortonwood Miners Welfare club. Cortonwood, of course,           agencies that often use the trust to deliver programmes
was the pit where the miners strike started in March             better than they can themselves, as the £3 million jobs,
1984. The grant enabled what was still a well-used               skills and training programme run by the trust in the
building to become a one-stop shop for services and,             east midlands demonstrates.
more importantly, the future hub of the community. It
supported the Cortonwood Comeback Centre, a group                   Most importantly, the trust is backed by independent
of women who originally formed as part of Women                  evaluators. In 2007, the Department for Communities
Against Pit Closures during the strike. They kept going,         and Local Government commissioned a review of the
took over the Methodist church with the help of the              trust’s work, which said that it
trust, and ran a support group for the community and             “has made an important contribution to the transformation of
attracted other volunteers.                                      the coalfields. Initially the Trust was…a responsive, opportunistic
                                                                 regeneration grant donor…over time the Trust has taken on more
   The trust has helped the South Yorkshire credit union,        of a strategic role, supporting larger schemes…including the
which is based in Goldthorpe in my constituency, and             targeted multi-agency work…developing stronger links”—
run a programme of debt support as part of a programme
across the coalfields. That now helps more than 5,000            with the wider coalfield regeneration programme—
people in the light of the recession, and managed nearly         “and other delivery partners such as at Shirebrook or through its
£38 million of debt. Otherwise, those people would               work on the impressive Breathing Space Centre in Rotherham.”
have been sunk.                                                  The NAO has said something similar and that the
   Of course, one of the latest grants—small but nevertheless    trust’s family employment initiatives produce work and
important—was used to set up a boat house on the lake            jobs at a better rate and for more people—and at less
that occupies part of the old Manvers pit site, in conjunction   cost to the Treasury.
149             Coalfields Regeneration Trust                  19 JULY 2010             Coalfields Regeneration Trust                    150
                 (Wentworth and Dearne)                                                  (Wentworth and Dearne)
  As my hon. Friend said, there has been progress, but                  11.1 pm
there are still problems. The 2009 report by the NAO
said:                                                                      The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for
                                                                        Communities and Local Government (Andrew Stunell): I
  “The gap with the rest of the country has narrowed, but many          congratulate the right hon. Member for Wentworth and
coalfields remain among the most deprived areas in England.”
                                                                        Dearne (John Healey) on securing this debate. I also
A range of problems remain, related to those communities’               congratulate the hon. Members for Blaydon (Mr Anderson)
former dependence on coal mining and described in one                   and for Ogmore (Huw Irranca-Davies) on their
of the reports as                                                       contributions. The right hon. Gentleman made some
“unique challenges in the coalfields with inner city type deprivation   important points, and I shall do my best to reply to
coupled with rural isolation.”                                          them. I certainly take his point that I am something of a
                                                                        utility player in the team, and I do not think the fact
That is why the CRT is needed now as much as it was in                  that I used to have a coal mine 70 years ago really
1999. It is needed in the coalfield areas that are still                qualifies me to speak as an expert on these matters.
struggling and those that were hit harder in recession
and will find it harder to grow again in recovery.                         The right hon. Gentleman set out the history of mining,
                                                                        as well as describing its woeful end in his constituency
   There is one other reason why the work of the trust                  and the legacy that that left behind. I fully acknowledge
should recommend itself to the Minister’s Tory ministerial              many of his points. Regenerating the English coalfields
colleagues. The Prime Minister today spoke of the big                   has been a huge challenge over the past 30 years. There
society. It is not new, but it is important. It is important            is no doubt that the speed and extent of the pit closures
that it complements, not substitutes, public services and               resulted in significant economic and social damage, as
investment. The Prime Minister criticised Government                    well as creating some real environmental challenges.
as top-down and top-heavy. The trust has always worked
from the bottom up, in with and for the coalfield                          The right hon. Gentleman described the steps that
communities. It supports the big society actions, but it                the previous Government took to set up the national
supports the men, women and young people in the                         coalfields programme, which last year had a £50 million
small pit villages in our country.                                      capital programme funded by my Department and the
                                                                        Homes and Communities Agency. He also mentioned
                                                                        the creation of the enterprise fund, which last year was
   Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab): My right hon.                     managing a £30 million revolving loan fund, two thirds
Friend makes a very powerful speech on behalf of the                    of which came from the Department, while one third
CRT. In my area the trust has delivered 83 young people                 came from the private sector.
into jobs through the work that it has done in collaboration
                                                                           The subject that the right hon. Gentleman dwelt on
with the future jobs fund, and is planning to help
                                                                        most was the Coalfields Regeneration Trust, which last
another 150—funding pending. Does he agree that that
                                                                        year had an £11 million revenue budget and a £6.65 million
shows that it is organisations such as the CRT that have
                                                                        capital fund, both from my Department. It is based in
the real knowledge of the coalfields that the Government
                                                                        his constituency and is perhaps one of those symbolic
should tap into?
                                                                        landmark organisations, as far as he and his constituents
                                                                        are concerned. It is right to recognise some of the real
   John Healey: My hon. Friend has a lot of experience                  achievements that those programmes have delivered
in this area, and he is absolutely right to say that the                over the years. He outlined a number of them, and I am
trust combines running jobs programmes with providing                   happy to endorse what he said. I have been provided
skills, health care and child care and all sorts of other               with a list, which also includes the family employment
support that recognises and tackles the often complex                   initiative, the debt response programme and the sports
barriers that prevent people in our villages from getting               legacy. There is a long list of projects that have been
into the kind of work that they need.                                   delivered and of which he is rightly proud on behalf of
                                                                        his Administration.
  The Prime Minister said today:
  “The rule of this government should be this: If it unleashes
                                                                           The right hon. Gentleman failed to detail some of the
community engagement—we should do it.”                                  shortcomings that were highlighted in the National
                                                                        Audit Office report that was published in December
The Coalfields Regeneration Trust does just that. It                    2009, and again in the Public Accounts Committee
unleashes the potential, the energy and the commitment                  report of March 2010. It is only right that I should
of individuals and communities in the old coalfield                     quote from some of the PAC’s conclusions. Conclusion
areas, and the Government should back the trust for the                 1 states:
future. If they do so, they will show that, despite our
deep doubts, they are a Tory-led Government unlike the                     “Thirteen years after the start of the schemes, the Department—
Tory Government of the 1980s and 1990s, and that they                   the Department for Communities and Local Government—
will not turn their back on the coalfields, as the previous             “still lacks clarity as to how its initiatives can best revitalise the
Tory Government did.                                                    local communities in which it is investing.”
  I hope that the Minister will be able, in advance of                  Conclusion 2 was:
the important review that Michael Clapham will produce,
                                                                           “The Department has failed to lead coalfield regeneration
to give us his full commitment to that review on behalf                 across Government.”
of the Government, as well as a clear commitment to
the publication of its report, and a strong commitment                  Conclusion 3 was:
to seeing the trust and the regeneration programmes                        “The Department has not sufficiently coordinated its three
continuing in our coalfields throughout this Parliament                 strands of coalfield regeneration and funding for improving local
and beyond.                                                             coordination is at risk.
151             Coalfields Regeneration Trust                  19 JULY 2010           Coalfields Regeneration Trust             152
                 (Wentworth and Dearne)                                                (Wentworth and Dearne)
[Andrew Stunell]                                                        be a major role for local authorities, but we are clear
                                                                        about the fact that there must also be a joined-up
Conclusion 4 was:                                                       approach, with all partners—including the local
   “The Department has failed to develop a robust assessment of         communities themselves—working together. The right
the direct impact of its initiatives, including proof that the money    hon. Gentleman mentioned the Prime Minister’s statement
spent has created jobs that would not have been created anyway.         today. We are certainly committed to a bottom-up
To demonstrate that its plans merit continued funding, the Department   community-focused approach.
should establish the success of its initiatives using direct measures
such as the occupancy rates on sites and the number of jobs filled         The Government remain supportive of action to
by members of coalfield communities as a direct result of the           meet the continuing need for land-based remediation,
initiatives.”                                                           remain strongly supportive of community-led regeneration
I could go on, but that would not be a sensible use of                  projects and are committed to helping communities to
my time, so let me finish by citing conclusion 7, which                 come together to tackle local problems and support
states:                                                                 local enterprises, especially in vulnerable areas such as
   “The Department did not act quickly enough to support
                                                                        the former coalfields. Those three strands were in the
enterprise in coalfield areas. By the time the £50 million Coalfield    initial programme, and we intend to make progress with
Enterprise Fund to support businesses was proposed in 1998, the         all of them. We must ensure that all possible ways of
employment, skills and confidence in many coalfield areas had           securing maximum efficiencies are considered, particularly
been lost. An urgent response was needed but the Department             in the current climate. As the right hon. Gentleman
took until 2004 to develop and launch a £10 million fund. And           knows—and as the whole House knows—the spending
the Department took until 2009 to identify a mixture of public          review will be extremely difficult, and hard choices will
and private funding to reach the £50 million mark.”                     need to be made. Whatever the outcome, we can at least
What that says is that, good as the programme has been                  ensure that we get value for money from the resources
in parts, there is a serious need for more to be done to                going into the coalfields communities.
make it fully effective. The criticism was sharp. We have
                                                                           The right hon. Gentleman is an old hand who has
inherited a series of failings, but we are determined to
                                                                        stood at this Dispatch Box fending people off, and he
find ways to put things right. I want to reassure the
                                                                        will appreciate that I cannot make any promises ahead
right hon. Gentleman on this point: we have no plans to
                                                                        of the comprehensive spending review; but I will say
dismantle the programme.
                                                                        that I have heard his messages, and I hope he has heard
   We published our response to the PAC report on                       mine. The spending review will be difficult, but we
15 July and did our best to address the points raised in                recognise the important work of the Coalfields Regeneration
the Committee’s earlier report. We focused on reassessing               Trust in helping to improve coalfield communities, and
the immediate and long-term needs of coalfield areas                    we are absolutely determined to ensure that every penny
and on ways of achieving the best value for money. We                   spent gives full value for money not just to the taxpayer,
are focusing on the co-ordination of coalfields regeneration            but to the communities that it is designed to help.
across and within Government, which the PAC charged
our predecessors with having failed to do. We are working                  Question put and agreed to.
hard to make sure that the need to demonstrate the
benefits of specific funding for coalfield areas is shown
and followed.                                                           11.12 pm
   As the right hon. Gentleman said. our former colleague,                House adjourned.
Michael Clapham, is chairing the review of coalfields
regeneration. My right hon. Friend the Minister for
Housing has already met him, and I echo the right hon.
Gentleman’s praise for Mr Clapham’s tireless support
for miners, the mining industry and the victims of                                            CORRECTION
industrial diseases in general. I am sure that he will be
an admirable and effective chair of the review.
   The review will help the Government to take decisions                  Official Report, 15 July 2010: In column 1105, under
on the direction of future interventions in former mining               “Bill presented” the text should read:
constituencies, both for the remainder of the current                     “Mr Francis Maude, supported by the Prime Minister,
spending period and also into the next comprehensive                    the Deputy Prime Minister, Mr Chancellor Exchequer,
spending review period. The consultation period closed                  Secretary Theresa May, Secretary Liam Fox, Mr Secretary
on 30 June, and I understand work has begun on                          Iain Duncan Smith, Mr Secretary Lansley and Nick
drafting the report. The Minister for Housing and I                     Hurd, presented a Bill to make provision for and in
look forward to receiving Michael Clapham’s report at                   connection with limiting the value of the benefits which
the end of August. To confirm what the right hon.                       may be provided under so much of any scheme under
Gentleman asked me about, publication of that report                    section 1 of the Superannuation Act 1972 as provides
will be well timed for fitting in with the Government’s                 by virtue of section 2(2) of that Act for benefits to be
current spending review, which the House will know is                   provided by way of compensation to or in respect of
planned to be announced on 20 October. I confirm that                   persons who suffer loss of office or employment.
publication of the report is certainly in our minds.                      Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time on
   The review is intended to look at the way in which the               Monday 19 July; and to be printed (Bill 58) with explanatory
current programmes are delivered. We expect there to                    notes (Bill 58-EN.)
1WS          Written Ministerial Statements           19 JULY 2010          Written Ministerial Statements              2WS

          Written Ministerial                                     As part of the Department’s contribution to reducing
                                                               the overall national budget deficit, it was agreed that the
                                                               Olympic Delivery Authority’s (ODA) budget would be
                   Statements                                  reduced by £27 million. Therefore the overall funding
                                                               package for the games now stands at £9.298 billion,
                                                               instead of £9.325 billion as announced in March 2007.
                  Monday 19 July 2010                             The London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic games
                                                               remain on time and within budget. The ODA’s anticipated
                                                               final cost (AFC) has decreased by £6 million, which as
                      TREASURY                                 of 30 June was £7.261 billion compared to £7.267 billion
                                                               at the end of the previous quarter (31 March 2010).
 Public Expenditure Provisional Outturn White Paper            Savings have also been made in the quarter in areas
                                                               including transport, logistics and landscaping.
   The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Danny Alexander):         The majority of contingency remains unreleased and
The Treasury will publish the 2009-10 Public Expenditure       the ODA continue to make strong progress in preparing
Provisional Outturn White Paper on Monday 26 July.             the venues and infrastructure in the Olympic park, with
   The White Paper is an annual report to Parliament           over 70 per cent. of the programme to the 2012 games
on the provisional outturn for public expenditure. It          now completed. The Olympic stadium is structurally
focuses on spending within departmental expenditure            complete and work is ongoing on the field of play and
limits (DEL) and annually managed expenditure (AME),           installing the seats. The structures and roofs of the
and includes information on individual supply estimates,       Aquatics Centre and Velodrome are complete and in
and administration costs and near-cash limits.                 place. The handball arena, basketball arena, international
   The outturn figures are described as provisional because,   broadcast centre and main press centre have been erected.
in some cases, they will be revised when Departments           On the Olympic village, three-quarters of the floors in
publish their final accounts.                                  the blocks across the 11 residential plots as well as more
                                                               than half of the bridges and underpasses are structurally
   A copy of the White Paper will be deposited in the          complete. During the International Olympic Committee’s
Libraries of both Houses and will be accessible on the         (IOC) visit in July to view the progress of London 2012,
Treasury website.                                              the IOC president said:
                                                                  “The progress that has been made on the stadium, and in the
      BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS                          Olympic park in general, is truly impressive and I congratulate
                                                               the entire London 2012 team on their work”.

                      Public Bodies                               The London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic games
                                                               are continuing to help businesses and people through
                                                               the difficult economic times. More than 1,000 companies
  The Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and          have won direct contracts from the ODA worth more
Skills (Vince Cable): I would like to inform the House         than £5 billion and, as of June 2010, approximately
that an additional four of the public bodies for which         10,000 people were working on the Olympic park and
my Department is responsible are to be abolished. The          village.
Strategic Advisory Board for Intellectual Property Policy         I would like to commend this report to the Members
(SABIP), SITPRO (Simplifying International Trade)              of both Houses and thank them for their continued
and the Waste Electrical and Electronic Equipment              interest in and support for the London 2012 games.
Advisory Body (WAB) will all close in the next year.
The British Shipbuilders Corporation will be abolished            Copies of the quarterly report July 2010 are available
next summer.                                                   at: and will be deposited in the
                                                               Libraries of both Houses.
  The functions carried out by these organisations will
be passed to the Department for Business Innovation
and Skills.
  This reflects the Government’s commitment to reducing                                DEFENCE
the number and cost of quangos and builds on the
13 abolitions, mergers or termination in BIS funding I
have already announced.                                                            Military Low Flying

          CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT                                The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence
                                                               (Mr Andrew Robathan): The amount of low flying
                                                               training carried out in the UK Low Flying System
         Government Olympic Executive Report
                                                               (UKLFS) during the training year 1 April 2009 to
                                                               31 March 2010 was the minimum required for aircrew
  The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Culture,      to reach and maintain their ability to fly at low level. A
Olympics, Media and Sport (Hugh Robertson): I am               total of 57,520 hours of low flying training were conducted
publishing today the Government Olympic Executive’s            across all low flying areas. In comparative terms, there
quarterly report—“London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic           was an increase of 5,632 hours, or approximately 11%
Games Quarterly Report July 2010”. This report explains        on the previous training year due to operational pre-
the latest budget position as at 30 June 2010, and             deployment training for both fixed and rotary-wing
outlines some of the many wider economic and social            aircraft, and the continuing introduction of Typhoon
benefits to the UK.                                            into service. The amount of operational low flying
3WS          Written Ministerial Statements           19 JULY 2010          Written Ministerial Statements                 4WS

(between 250 feet and 100 feet) by fixed wing aircraft         use to judge the overall performance of the NHS. The
was 309 hours, accounting for 0.5% of all low flying           framework will also provide a mechanism by which the
activity.                                                      Secretary of State for Health can hold the proposed
   I have today placed in the Library of the House             NHS Commissioning Board to account for the outcomes
documents providing a detailed account of the low              it is securing for patients through its role in allocating
flying training that has taken place in the UK Low             resources and overseeing the commissioning process
Flying System for the training year 1 April 2009 to            that, in future, will be led locally by general practitioner
31 March 2010.                                                 consortia.
   This year, information about how military low flying           The consultation document puts forward proposals
is conducted is contained in a main document with the          for a framework structured around five broad outcome
annual statistics in a separate appendix. The format in        domains and seeks views on this structure, the core
which the statistics are presented is the same as the          principles that should underpin the development of the
previous year to enable comparison. In future years,           framework as well as the more specific outcome measures
only the statistical appendix will be produced unless          that should be included under each domain. The proposed
there are major changes to the UKLFS.                          outcome domains are:
   Additional copies are available on request from the             Domain 1: Preventing people from dying prematurely.
following address:                                                 Domain 2: Enhancing the quality of life for people with
                                                                   long-term conditions.
    Air Staff
                                                                   Domain 3: Helping people to recover from episodes of ill
    Complaints and Enquiries Unit
                                                                   health or following injury.
    Ministry of Defence
                                                                   Domain 4: Ensuring people have a positive experience of
    Level 5 Zone H                                                 care.
    Main Building                                                  Domain 5: Treating and caring for people in a safe environment
    Whitehall                                                      and protecting them from avoidable harm.
    London SW1A 2HB                                              The consultation period will close on 11 October
   Alternatively it can be viewed on the MOD’s web site:       2010.

                                                                               HOME DEPARTMENT

            NHS White Paper Consultation                                         Ministerial Correction

   The Secretary of State for Health (Mr Andrew Lansley):         The Minister for Police (Nick Herbert): I regret to
Today I am publishing the first of five supporting             inform the House that there was an inaccuracy in the
documents to the NHS White Paper, “Equity and                  answer I gave to parliamentary question 4900 of 5 July
Excellence: Liberating the NHS”, which was published           2010, Official Report, column 80W about pre-charge
on 12 July. “Transparency in outcomes: a framework             detention.
for the NHS”, has been placed in the Library and                  The response, in my name, indicated that since July
copies are available to hon. Members from the Vote             2006, no individuals have been held for the full 28 days
office. The document is also available electronically at:      pre-charge detention period. The response added that                                two individuals were arrested under section 41 TACT
   The publication of this document marks the start of         2000 and subsequently charged and convicted of terrorism
a full public consultation on the development of an            related offences on the 27 to 28 day of detention following
NHS outcomes framework and fulfils a key commitment            their arrest in a counter terrorist operation led by
made in the White Paper to develop this in partnership         Greater Manchester police.
with patients, the public and all those working or with           My right hon. Friend the Home Secretary noted in
an interest in the NHS.                                        the debate on Prevention and Suppression of Terrorism
   The White Paper set out the coalition Government’s          on 14 July 2010, Official Report, column 1019 that
ambition for the NHS to provide among the best outcomes        erroneous information was provided in the response.
in the world, delivered by empowered and engaged               She also advised the House at that time of the correct
healthcare professionals liberated from central control        figures.
and political interference.                                       I can confirm that eleven individuals have been detained
   “Transparency in outcomes: a framework for the              for 14 days or longer. Six individuals have been detained
NHS” puts forward proposals for a framework that is            for 27 to 28 days, of whom three were subsequently
designed to refocus the efforts and accountabilities running   charged and three released. Of the three who were
throughout the NHS on improving the health outcomes            charged, two were convicted and the case of one was
achieved for patients.                                         not proceeded with.
   The NHS outcomes framework will include a focused              I can also confirm that the number of individuals
set of national outcomes goals and supporting measures         who had been arrested as a result of an operation by
which patients, the public and Parliament will be able to      Greater Manchester police was in fact one.
5WS           Written Ministerial Statements         19 JULY 2010          Written Ministerial Statements           6WS

                        TRANSPORT                             and Economic and Financial Affairs Council (ECOFIN).
                                                              For the UK, I agreed on the need for a close relationship
                                                              between EPSCO and ECOFIN but stated that this
                   Ministerial Correction                     could be achieved through greater co-ordination, and
                                                              need not require changes to formal mechanisms. I also
                                                              underlined that job creation would not be possible
  The Minister of State, Department for Transport (Mrs        without a thriving business sector.
Theresa Villiers): I regret to inform the House that there
was an inaccuracy in the answer I gave to parliamentary          There were discussions on how the EU could help
question 4042 on 7 July 2010, Official Report, column         member states deal with the consequences of ageing on
265W, about what new rolling stock orders have been           the labour market. The Commission emphasised the
placed for each rail franchise since 2007. The table was      need for policies which allowed older people to stay
incomplete and omitted the order, placed in April 2009        active on the labour market for longer. Member states
by National Express East Anglia, for 120 new EMU              agreed that demographic change was a real challenge
vehicles. The full table is reproduced below.                 and that action was needed in response. Several also
                                                              highlighted that the increased demand for care services
Franchise                 Order date        Type   Vehicles   could provide job opportunities in many member states.
Southern                    May-07      EMU             48       Member states were also invited to consider how
London Midland              Aug-07      EMU            148    European Union level policies could foster green jobs
London Midland              Dec-07      DMU             69    and prepare the labour market to tackle climate change.
Chiltern Railway             Jan-08     DMU              8
                                                              The Commission commented that there had been some
Southern                    Mar-08      EMU             44
                                                              debate on what green jobs actually were and that this
                                                              term still held slightly different meanings in different
Virgin West Coast           Sep-08      EMU            106
                                                              member states. Those who intervened agreed that action
National Express East       Apr-09      EMU            120
                                                              on tackling climate change presented job opportunities,
                                                              but that all relevant stakeholders, the Commission and
                                                              sectoral Councils needed to work together in order to
                                                              make any real progress.
                WORK AND PENSIONS                                On pensions and social inclusion in the context of an
                                                              economic crisis, member states were asked to consider a
 EU Employment and Social Policy Ministers Meeting            common EU framework for adequate minimum incomes.
                                                              This was met with opposition from many member
                                                              states. For the UK, I agreed that while minimum income
   The Minister of State, Department for Work and             policies should be considered, this had to be at national
Pensions (Chris Grayling): The informal meeting of            and not European level.
Employment and Social Policy Ministers took place on             The presidency invited ideas on how the Social Protection
8 to 9 July 2010 in Brussels, Belgium. I represented the      Committee (SPC) and the Open Method of Co-ordination
United Kingdom.                                               (OMC), (the sharing of best practices), could help to
   The priority for this informal meeting was the new         design and implement guidance for the framework of
Europe 2020 strategy, focusing on the main objectives,        pension schemes in the future. The Commission introduced
as well as the implementation of the new strategy.            their recently published Green Paper on pensions, which
Ministers were given the opportunity to highlight the         considered how best to ensure sustainable, adequate
importance of the social dimension and employment in          and safe pension schemes across the European Union.
EU 2020, through four workshop sessions focusing on           This was met with mixed views from some member
employment on the first day and social affairs on the         states including the UK who all argued that the case for
second.                                                       strengthened European level pension policy co-ordination
   The presidency underlined the importance of both           was weak but that improved indicators, reporting and
competitiveness and social cohesion in the European           information sharing could be helpful.
employment strategy within Europe 2020. Its ambition             There were discussions on how, within Europe 2020,
was for the Employment and Social Policy Council              the OMC could be reinforced and the role of EPSCO
(EPSCO) to have greater influence. This would require         strengthened. Many member states stressed that Social
changing working practices and methods but would              Affairs Ministers would need to ensure that EPSCO
provide Europe with a greater ability to co-ordinate and      continued to play a role in discussions. Some commented
steer European economies. Most member states agreed           that an increased focus on budgetary issues risked forcing
on the need for a closer relationship between EPSCO           out the debate on social protection and social inclusion.
1W                        Written Answers                           19 JULY 2010                           Written Answers                                     2W

            Written Answers to                                                Equipment
                                                                                                             In service equipment

                                                                              name          Description                                                    Approval

                        Questions                                             Wheelbarrow   Currently the largest of the current EOD
                                                                                            robot fleet and used in the UK and
                                                                                                                                                          Due to the
                                                                                                                                                   length of service
                                                                                            Afghanistan. It is a well proven Remote                   of this system
                                                                                            Control Vehicle, deploying from a vehicle               the information
                     Monday 19 July 2010                                                    by either radio control of Fibre Optic link.           is not held in the
                                                                                            It entered service in 1972 and achieved its                  appropriate
                                                                                            current Mark 8B configuration in 1995.                           format.

                                                                              Talisman      Provides a Route Proving and Clearance                  £120 million. Of
                                                                              (UOR)         capability and has been in use on current                which less than
                             DEFENCE                                                        operations since April 2010. There are two             £14 million is for
                                                                                            unmanned equipments within Talisman,                         the remote
                                                                                            the Talon Combat Engineer Remote Control                      controlled
                                                                                            Vehicle (RCV) and the T-Hawk Micro Air                   elements of the
                          Aircraft Carriers                                                 Vehicle (MAV).                                              programme.

   Dr Julian Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for                         Dragon        A lightweight, man-portable Remote                           £19 million
Defence to how much expenditure on the future                                 Runner        Controlled Vehicle weighing approximately
                                                                              (UOR)         20 kg. Dragon Runner provides the helicopter
aircraft carriers his Department is contractually                                           and foot mounted EOD operator with a
committed.                                      [9145]                                      remote capability to approach and, depending
                                                                                            on the type, render safe an IED.
  Peter Luff: The contract placed with the Aircraft                                                    Equipment under development:
Carrier Alliance in 2008 was for the manufacture of two                       Equipment
Queen Elizabeth class aircraft carriers. That contractual                     name          Description                                                    Approval
commitment has not changed and our current estimate
                                                                              Watchkeeper   The British Army’s new UAS providing                     £1,027 million
of total project cost is £5.2 billion.                                                      persistent, all weather, day and night, real
                                                                                            time battlefield surveillance. It will progressively
                                                                                            replace the HERMES 450 during 2011.
                       Defence Equipment
                                                                              Panama        A vehicle mounted IED detection capability.                  £48 million
   Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for
Defence what unmanned defence equipment is (a) in
use, (b) in development and (c) under consideration                           Terrier       An armoured earthmoving vehicle that has               £386 million. Of
                                                                                            a remote control capability for the surface             which less than
for future use; and what the cost to the public purse                                       clearance of mines. A total of 60 vehicles             £5 million is for
was of each type of equipment programme on the                                              are to be purchased of which 13 will be                     the remote
latest date for which figures are available.     [8253]                                     capable of being operated by remote control.                 controlled

   Peter Luff: The Ministry of Defence has many different
types of unmanned defence equipment in use, in                                CUTLASS       The next generation of large EOD remote                      £80 million
                                                                                            controlled vehicle. CUTLASS will deliver a
development and under consideration for future use.                                         high mobility six wheeled robot with a state
   Owing to the variety and number of types of equipment                                    of the art manipulator arm.
only the major air and land systems have been included                                                 Equipment under consideration
in the following table, although in the maritime domain                       Equipment
the Royal Navy uses civil derived unmanned underwater                         name          Description                                                    Approval
vehicles for tasks such as mine countermeasure operations.                    Future        Joint MOD-industry funded technical                        £169 million
The table provides the name, description and latest                           UCAS/         demonstrator programmes such as MANTIS
financial approval of the various equipments.                                 UAS           and TARANIS to help inform future UAV/
                                                                                            UCAS planning and acquisition decisions
                           In service equipment                                             to meet emerging MOD capability
Equipment                                                                                   requirements.
name        Description                                           Approval

Desert      A small hand launched Unmanned Air                  £36 million                                Defence: Exports
Hawk        System (UAS) that provides an ‘over the
(UOR)       hill’ view for commanders on the ground
            allowing patrols to look ahead and scout
            for enemy activity.                                                 Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                              Defence what steps he is taking to improve the (a)
HERMES      Currently the Theatre Tactical UAS in              £181 million
                                                                              competitiveness and (b) penetration of defence
450 (UOR)   Afghanistan. It can carry a variety of different                  exports.                                       [9356]
            surveillance packages, which it uses to provide
            high quality imagery for use by brigade
            and battlegroup commanders.                                         Mr Gerald Howarth: This Government aim to increase
                                                                              Britain’s defence exports. The United Kingdom Trade
Reaper      A strategic medium altitude armed Remotely         £250 million   and Investment Defence and Security Organisation (UKTI
(UOR)       Piloted Air System. Its primary mission is                        DSO) is responsible for promoting British defence industry
            to contribute to the intelligence, surveillance                   overseas under the Secretary of State for Business
            and reconnaissance (ISR) mission in
            Afghanistan.                                                      Innovation and Skills. The interests of the Ministry of
                                                                              Defence are recognised under a service level agreement
                                                                              with UKTI.
3W                     Written Answers                       19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                      4W

   This Government have publicly stated that we wish to               series of test firings. The trials were conducted over a
re-energise Government support to defence exports.                    range of scenarios of steadily increasing complexity,
This is because exports help to secure high skilled                   culminating in a salvo firing against a high speed and
British defence manufacturing jobs and to reduce the                  manoeuvring, sea skimming target.
unit costs of Ministry of Defence acquisition projects
through increased production runs.                                      Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
   We also recognise defence exports make an important                Defence on what date he expects the new Type 45
contribution to achieving wider defence diplomacy                     destroyers to be delivered to the Royal Navy; and if he
objectives.                                                           will make a statement.                            [8854]
   My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for
Defence (Dr Fox) and I are looking at a number of ways                  Peter Luff: Under the current programme, the in-service
we can achieve this. Ensuring British defence equipment               date for HMS Daring, the first in the class of Type 45
remains competitive is essential to achieving a greater               Destroyers, is expected to be declared later this summer.
share of the defence market. We have established our                    The planned in-service dates for the remaining five
five criteria against which future equipment programmes               Type 45s are listed in the following table:
will be assessed, as set out in the speech my hon. Friend
the Minister for Defence Equipment, Support and                                                               Planned in-service date
Technology (Peter Luff) gave at Dynamic Vehicle
                                                                      Dauntless                                                 2011
Demonstration (DVD) on 23 June 2010 which is freely
                                                                      Diamond                                                   2011
available at:
                                                                      Dragon                                                    2012
                                                                      Defender                                                  2013
   Technology.htm                                                     Duncan                                                    2014
   This Government recognise that Government support can be
an extremely important factor in making British industry successful
overseas. It is our intention to work to achieve greater support to
exports while maximising the benefits and value for money to the
taxpayer.                                                                             NORTHERN IRELAND

                       Defence: Reviews                                           Bloody Sunday Tribunal of Inquiry

  Sheila Gilmore: To ask the Secretary of State for                     Mr Gregory Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State
Defence what timetable he has set for publication of                  for Northern Ireland how many copies of the report of
the (a) value for money review of the Trident                         the Saville Inquiry have been printed in (a) full and
replacement programme and (b) the report of the                       (b) summary; and at what cost to the public purse in
Strategic Defence and Security Review.          [8106]                each such case.                                  [9509]

   Dr Fox: The Ministry of Defence’s work on the                         Mr Paterson: 285 copies of the ‘Report of the Bloody
value-for-money study should be completed at the end                  Sunday Inquiry’ (HC29, 5,200 pages) and 2,200 copies
of this month. The findings will go to the Cabinet                    of the ‘Principal Conclusions and Overall Assessment
Office, and will then be considered by the National                   of the Bloody Sunday Inquiry’ (HC30, 60 pages) were
Security Council. The council’s conclusions will inform               printed. These copies were printed to facilitate advance
the strategic defence and security review and the                     sight of the report and provide interested parties with
comprehensive spending review, which will be published                copies; to provide the required number of copies to
in the autumn.                                                        Parliament and The Stationery Office for publishing
                                                                      purposes; and for provision within Government, to the
                     Type 45 Destroyers
                                                                      Northern Ireland Assembly, and to the Irish Government.
                                                                         The total cost of printing, including costs related to
  Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for                 DVD production and the security measures put in place
Defence what his assessment is of the effectiveness of                to protect the integrity of the report prior to publication,
the Sea Viper missile system in protecting air, land and              was £194,652. It is not possible to separate out the
sea forces.                                         [8837]
                                                                      individual printing costs of the full report and the
                                                                      summary document.
   Peter Luff: The principal anti-air missile system
(PAAMS), known as Sea Viper by the Royal Navy, is
the primary weapons system of the Type 45 destroyer.                                 Departmental Civil Servants
With this capability, the Type 45s will be able to engage
a large number of targets simultaneously and defend                     Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
aircraft carriers or groups of ships, such as amphibious              Northern Ireland how many employees of his
landing forces, against current and future threats from               Department attended Civil Service Live in (a) 2008,
the air. This includes stealthy, highly manoeuvrable                  (b) 2009 and (c) 2010; and what estimate he has made
missiles approaching in salvoes, simultaneously and                   of the (i) employee working hours taken up by and (ii)
from several directions.                                              cost to his Department of such attendance in each such
   The missile system is undergoing a rigorous test and               year.                                             [9056]
integration programme to ensure that all aspects of the
system have been thoroughly trialled before it enters                   Mr Paterson: The Department does not hold central
service. In June 2010, PAAMS successfully completed a                 records on attendance at Civil Service Live.
5W                  Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                     6W

                 Departmental Lighting                                                Fly-tipping

  Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for                Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
Northern Ireland how much (a) his Department and              Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps her
(b) its agencies and non-departmental public bodies           Department is taking to reduce the incidence of
spent on light bulbs in each year since 1997. [7633]          fly-tipping.                                     [8793]

   Mr Paterson: On 12 April 2010 the Northern Ireland            Richard Benyon: DEFRA is working closely with the
Office transferred responsibility for policing and justice    Environment Agency, Keep Britain Tidy, local authorities,
to the Northern Ireland Assembly. Comparable figures          landowners and other members of the National Fly-tipping
for the Department as it is now configured are not            Prevention Group to better understand the causes of
available.                                                    fly-tipping, and the best approach to reducing incidences
                                                              of fly-tipping at a local level.
   Since 12 April the Department has incurred no cost
in this area.                                                    DEFRA works with organisations such as Keep Britain
                                                              Tidy to support local authorities with training, guidance
   The NIO has no agencies. It has one non-departmental       and advice on their fly-tipping prevention strategies.
public body which has incurred no cost since 12 April.        DEFRA also funds the Flycapture system which records
           Departmental Official Hospitality                  information on fly-tipping incidents dealt with by local
                                                              authorities as well as enforcement action taken, allowing
                                                              DEFRA and local authorities to assess the scale of the
  Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for             problem and prioritise action.
Northern Ireland how much (a) his Department and
(b) its agencies and non-departmental public bodies              We will be considering how best to target our future
spent on hospitality in each year since 1997. [7451]
                                                              activity on fly-tipping as part of the recently announced
                                                              review of waste policies.
   Mr Paterson: On 12 April 2010 the Northern Ireland                              Food: Standards
Office (NIO) transferred responsibility for policing and
justice to the Northern Ireland Assembly. Comparable            Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for
figures for the Department as it is now configured are        Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps her
not available.                                                Department is taking to (a) stimulate the rural
   Since 12 April the Department has spent £234 on            economy, (b) reduce food miles and (c) improve
hospitality.                                                  nutritional standards.                       [7231]
   The NIO has no agencies. It has one non-departmental           Richard Benyon: The recession has affected rural and
public body which has incurred no cost on hospitality         urban areas alike, and DEFRA is working to ensure
since 12 April.                                               that rural needs and interests are fairly addressed in all
                                                              relevant Government economic programmes. In particular,
                                                              DEFRA is working closely with BIS and DCMS to
                                                              ensure that the benefits of broadband are fully available
                                                              to rural people, communities and businesses.
                Common Fisheries Policy                           DEFRA works closely with all parts of the food industry
                                                              supply chain to encourage environmental sustainability
   Peter Aldous: To ask the Secretary of State for            best practice, including the movement of all types of
Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what her policy           food. A number of trade associations are working with
is on the future of the common fisheries policy; and if       their members to achieve sustainability targets, for example,
she will bring forward proposals to (a) give local            to reduce their overall carbon footprint.
residents more influence over the future of their fishing         Nutritional standards are primarily the responsibility
industries and (b) end fish discards.                [9330]   of the Department of Health. The Government believe
                                                              it is for individuals to take responsibility for their health,
   Richard Benyon: The UK will press for radical reform       including healthy eating. What the Government can do
of the common fisheries policy (CFP). There must be           is put in place ways to make this easier and support
more regionalised decision-making; genuine integration        people, such as the fruit and vegetables task force.
of fisheries with other marine policies; longer-term          DEFRA launched this task force in October 2009 to
management planning; greater flexibility and certainty        identify the barriers to increasing domestic production
in the system; and a mechanism to ease the transition to      and consumption of fruit and vegetables in England. It
a sustainable and profitable future. In particular we         brings together growers, processors, wholesalers, major
want to see decision making decentralised, and simplified,    retailers, representatives of street market, the School
to give more responsibility for implementation to member      Food Trust, the Food Standards Agency, research and
states, for example where they are working together           development professionals, people involved in public
regionally.                                                   procurement and respected academics.
   The wasteful practice of discarding fish must be                       Genetically Modified Organisms
brought to an end. Reform should give fishermen more
control, incentives and responsibility for managing fish        Mr Meacher: To ask the Secretary of State for
stocks and helping to reduce discards. Reform also            Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what
gives the UK an opportunity to deploy evidence on how         expenditure her Department has incurred in relation to
switching from landing based quotas to catch quotas           each genetically-modified crop test site it has funded in
can reduce discards.                                          each year since 1997.                               [8029]
7W                   Written Answers                    19 JULY 2010                    Written Answers                     8W

   Mr Paice: DEFRA was the main funder of the                      document in its Integrated Pollution Prevention and
ecological research that was undertaken as part of the             Control guidance a representative sampling and testing
farm scale evaluation trials of GM herbicide-tolerant              protocol for incinerator bottom ash as part of its Best
crops from 1999 to 2003. The total cost of this project            Available Techniques.                             [8894]
was approximately £5.9 million, of which DEFRA paid
£5.36 million. The remaining funding was provided by                  Richard Benyon: Permits for incinerators already have
the Scottish Executive. Costs incurred are not available           a condition that requires sampling and testing of incinerator
for individual trial sites, of which there were approximately      bottom ash to satisfy the requirements of the waste
260 in total.                                                      incineration directive. This must be carried out
   In addition, DEFRA has contributed to a research                representatively and using techniques conforming to an
project on the control of potato cyst nematodes under a            ash sampling protocol issued by the Environment Agency
Government Partnership Award programme. This project               in 2001.
has been carried out by the University of Leeds, funded               In light of developments in techniques, the Environment
mainly by the Biotechnology and Biological Sciences                Agency is currently updating its protocol for ash sampling.
Research Council, and has included research trials of              This is expected to be completed by the end of 2010.
GM potatoes in 2008 and 2009 as well as laboratory                                  Rural Payments Agency
based work. DEFRA’s contribution to the overall project
cost of £414,000 was £69,000. Specific cost figures just
for the field trial component of the project are not                 Tim Farron: To ask the Secretary of State for
readily available.                                                 Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much the
                                                                   Rural Payments Agency spent on (a) advertising, (b)
              Incinerators: Health Hazards                         public relations, (c) consultants, (d) bonuses, (e)
                                                                   entertainment and (f) overtime in each of the last five
  Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for               years.                                           [4877]
Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the
answer of 22 June 2010, Official Report, column 125W,                 Mr Paice: The amounts spent by the Rural Payments
on incinerators: health hazards, if she will request that          Agency (RPA) on advertising, public relations, consultants/
the Environment Agency publish its own protocol for                contractors, bonuses, entertainment and overtime in
the representative sampling and testing of incinerator             each of the last five years are shown in the following
bottom ash for H14 Ecotoxicity in circumstances in                 table.
which the Environmental Services Association is                       In respect of advertising and public relations the
unable to complete a protocol to the satisfaction of the           RPA Communications Directorate, responsible for dealing
Environment Agency.                                 [8851]         with advertising and public relations, was established as
                                                                   a separate entity in November 2006. Unfortunately the
  Richard Benyon: The Environment Agency has no                    data required to provide information for the 2006-07
plans to produce a protocol specifically for assessing             financial year and earlier years are not held in a form
H14 ecotoxicity of incinerator bottom ash (IBA).                   that is easily accessible. As the extraction and collation
Representative sampling of IBA is already required in              of these data would require a considerable amount of
order to satisfy the waste incineration directive.                 work and incur an unacceptable cost an answer cannot
                                                                   be provided.
  Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for                  The figures shown for advertising relate to space paid
Environment, Food and Rural Affairs if she will make               for in print/online media to raise awareness of existing
the undertaking of representative sampling and testing             and new RPA managed schemes, regulatory changes
protocol for H14 ecotoxicity of incinerator bottom ash             and application deadlines, as well as recruitment activity
a condition for the granting of environmental permits              during the 2007-08, 2008-09 and 2009-10 financial years.
for waste incinerators.                           [8893]
                                                                      The figures shown for public relations encompass
                                                                   external public relations activity to raise awareness of
   Richard Benyon: The Environment Agency does not                 RPA managed schemes, direct costs in media relations
intend to make this a permit condition. Assessment of              and agricultural shows during the 2007-08, 2008-09 and
incinerator bottom ash to determine whether it is hazardous        2009-10 financial years.
(including h14 ecotoxicity testing) is a requirement of
the hazardous waste regulations, which apply directly to              With effect from 2007-08 RPA does not employ
all producers of hazardous waste. There is no need to              consultants. From then all external resources employed
repeat the requirement within a permit application.                to provide expert opinion, including holding interim
                                                                   position, are recognised and accounted for as contractors.
  Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for                  Entertainment figures relate to refreshments for meetings.
Environment, Food and Rural Affairs if she will direct                The bonus amounts include payments made to senior
the Environment Agency to (a) adopt and (b)                        civil servants in RPA.

                                                        Consultants and
Financial                           Public relations    contractor staff                        Entertainment        Overtime (£
year             Advertising (£)                 (£)   costs (£ million)   Bonuses (£000)                 (£)           million)

2005-06                     n/a                 n/a                29.5               252           81,292.58          3,865,888
2006-07                     n/a                 n/a                27.9               302          104,924.90          3,899,571
2007-08                 101,943            150,678                 23.4               452           95,021.01          3,312,792
9W                        Written Answers                       19 JULY 2010                    Written Answers                    10W

                                                                Consultants and
Financial                                 Public relations      contractor staff                        Entertainment         Overtime (£
year                  Advertising (£)                  (£)     costs (£ million)    Bonuses (£000)                (£)            million)

2008-09                      111,749               90,830                  23.2               559           93,518.21           3,116,143
2009-10                      164,903               94,014                  25.0               513           49,734.98           2,521,496
n/a = not available

                               WALES                                                         Departmental Speeches

                           Cabinet: Wales                                    Angela Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales
                                                                           which (a) (i) civil servants and (ii) special advisers in
  Mr David: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales                        her Department and (b) other individuals are
what discussions she has had with ministerial                              employed to write speeches for each Minister in her
colleagues on holding a future Cabinet meeting in                          Department.                                         [7308]
Wales.                                         [7009]
                                                                             Mr David Jones: No individuals are employed specifically
  Mrs Gillan: The Prime Minister and Deputy Prime                          to write speeches for Wales Office Ministers. However,
Minister have committed to continuing the practice of                      policy officials and one special adviser contribute to the
holding Cabinet meetings outside London, and I have                        drafting of speeches as part of their normal duties.
requested a future Cabinet is held in Wales.                                                 Electoral Commission

                       Departmental Billing                                  Ian Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if
                                                                           she will place in the Library a copy of the letter to her
  Mr Anderson: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales                     of 26 May 2010 from the Chair of the Electoral
what information her Department holds on the time                          Commission.                                         [9116]
taken by contractors employed by it to pay the invoices
of their sub-contractors under prompt payment                                Mrs Gillan: The letter referred to is already available
arrangements; and if she will make a statement. [9247]                     on the Wales Office website at:
   Mr David Jones: Nil.                                                    following a recent Freedom of Information request.
                                                                           Some information has been withheld as it relates to
                 Departmental Official Cars                                ongoing policy development.
                                                                                          Private Sector: Job Creation
  Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales
what estimate her Department has made of its                                 Owen Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales
expenditure on travel undertaken in an official capacity                   what proportion of private sector jobs forecast to be
by each Minister in her Department in (i) May 2010                         created in the next five years she expects to be based in
and (ii) June 2010.                                [8234]                  each employment sector in Wales.                    [8248]

  Mr David Jones: In May and June of this year the                            Mr David Jones: The Office for Budget Responsibility
Wales Office spent £16,723 on the Government Car                           has published top-level UK predictions based on macro-
Service. This covers the car charges for both myself and                   economic data and at present there are no sub-national
my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State.                               figures available.
  Train travel charges are as follows:                                        We are committed to encouraging growth in all parts
                                                                           of the private sector so that those left unemployed by
                                                                     £     the recession in Wales are provided with worthwhile,
                                    May 2010                 June 2010     sustainable jobs.
Secretary of State                      433.50                  657.60        We welcome the Welsh Assembly Government’s
Parliamentary                           143.50                  250.20     Economic Renewal Programme and look forward to
Under-Secretary of                                                         working with them to create a strong recovery in Wales,
State                                                                      particularly in the six key sectors that they have identified.

   All train travel in the Wales Office is now standard                                      Public Finance: Wales
                                                                             Owen Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales
             Departmental Official Hospitality                             what estimate she has made of the effect on the number
                                                                           of jobs in Wales of public spending reductions in the
                                                                           next five years.                                  [8247]
  Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales
how much her Department spent on hospitality for                              Mr David Jones: All parts of the United Kingdom
events hosted by each Minister in her Department in                        have to play their part in reducing the deficit we have
(a) May and (b) June 2010.                      [10121]                    inherited but until the comprehensive spending review
                                                                           is completed, the precise effect on Wales of future
   Mr David Jones: Nil.                                                    spending reductions cannot be known.
11W                 Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                Written Answers                      12W

  We remain committed to working with the Welsh                 John Penrose: At present the Government have no
Assembly Government to preserve front-line services          plans to reduce the limit of four gaming machine for
and to protect public sector jobs wherever possible.         licensed betting premises. All licensed gambling operators
                                                             are subject to a range of controls through the Gambling
            Referendum: Secretary of State                   Act 2005, which include access to gaming machines,
                                                             limits on stake and prize and the number of machines
  Ian Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if      that can be offered.
she will place in the Library a copy of her                     All operators must comply with the Gambling
Department’s paper entitled Referendum: Role of the          Commission’s Licence Conditions and Code of Practice,
Secretary of State.                              [9115]      which include specific provisions in relation to underage
                                                             and problem gambling, access, staff training and self
  Mrs Gillan: The paper referred to is already available     exclusion. In addition all gaming machines licensed in
on the Wales Office website:                                 gambling premises must comply with the Commission’s                                     gaming machine technical standards and gaming machine
following a recent Freedom of Information request.           testing strategy.
Some information has been withheld as it relates to             The Government are aware of concerns regarding
ongoing policy development.                                  higher stake, higher prize gaming machines and levels
                                                             of problem gambling in Great Britain. In the last two
                 Referendum: Timeline                        years the Commission has undertaken research into a
                                                             range of issues associated with these types of machines
  Ian Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales if      and published several independent reports. These are
she will place in the Library a copy of her                  available on the Commission’s website:
Department’s document entitled Timeline: How the      __consultations/
commitment to take forward a referendum has been               research/research_programme/gaming_machines_research_
implemented.                                     [9234]        progr.aspx
                                                               Building on the Commission’s work, the Responsible
  Mrs Gillan: The document referred to is already            Gambling Strategy Board is taking forward a research
available on the Wales Office website at:                    programme on higher stake higher prize gaming machines                                     as one of its initial priorities and is expected to publish
following a recent Freedom of Information request.           further details of that programme later this year.

                                                                               Departmental Internet

                                                                Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                             Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport (1) how much his
                      Betting Shops
                                                             Department spent on maintaining its Twitter feed in
                                                             the last 12 months;                                [8784]
   Richard Fuller: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                (2) how much his Department spent on maintaining
Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport if he will make an
                                                             its YouTube channel in the last 12 months;         [8785]
estimate of the (a) number of licensed betting shops
and (b) population per betting shop in each ward in             (3) what recent estimate he has made of the number
each decile of the index of multiple deprivation in          of full-time equivalent staff in his Department engaged
England.                                        [8134]       in maintaining social media and networking sites; and
                                                             what estimate he has made of the cost of employing
   John Penrose: The total number of licensed betting        such people in the last 12 months;                 [8798]
shops in England, as at 31 March 2009 was 8,862. These          (4) how much his Department spent on maintaining
data are published in the Gambling Commission’s industry     its Flickr channel in the last 12 months.          [8803]
statistics for 2008-09 and can be downloaded on their
                                                               John Penrose: This Department does not have any          full-time staff committed to maintaining social media
                                                             and networking sites.
  Data regarding population per betting shop in each           In addition, we have incurred no costs maintaining
ward is not held centrally in this Department.               the social networks listed. The sites are supported as
                                                             part of normal communications work with no more
           Betting Shops: Gaming Machines                    than 10% of a fulltime employees’ time spent on this
  Richard Fuller: To ask the Secretary of State for
Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport (1) if he will bring                     Departmental Official Cars
forward proposals to limit the right of betting shops to
operate slot machines on their premises;            [8133]      Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture,
  (2) if he will undertake a study to assess the effects     Olympics, Media and Sport what estimate his Department
on the level of gambling addiction of permitting             has made of its expenditure on travel undertaken in an
betting shops to operate slot machines on their              official capacity by each Minister in his Department in
premises.                                          [8135]    (i) May 2010 and (ii) June 2010.                   [8237]
13W                     Written Answers                19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  14W

  John Penrose: The total amount spent by the Department        of Youth Theatres, the National Student Drama Festival,
during May 2010 and June 2010 on all domestic and               Company of Angels and Burnley Youth Theatre.
foreign travel by Ministers in their official capacity is set      The Arts Council also manages educational projects
out in the table:                                               which engage young people in the arts, including theatre.
                                                                   The ‘Artsmark’ programme encourages schools to
Minister                          Month             spend (£)   increase the range, quantity and type of arts that are
                                                                provided to children. Currently 18.6% of schools hold
Secretary of State for Culture,   May 2010             245.07   an Artsmark award.
Olympics, Media and Sport
                                  June 2010          2,614.05
                                                                   ‘Arts Award’ is a national qualification which supports
                                                                young people to develop as artists and arts leaders.
                                                                Young people can work towards Arts Awards within,
Ministerial Team                  May 2010             485.38   outside, and beyond school and college. Since its launch
                                  June 2010          2,133.76   in 2005, 28,797 young people have achieved Arts Awards.

  Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture,
Olympics, Media and Sport what his estimate is of the
mileage travelled by each Minister in his Department in            Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
a Government car in (a) May and (b) June 2010.                  Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many public
                                                                libraries there were in each year since 1997.    [8802]

  John Penrose: I refer the hon. Member to the answer             Mr Vaizey: The number of public libraries there were
given to him by my hon. Friend the Parliamentary                each year since 1997 can be seen in the table:
Under-Secretary of State for Transport on 13 July 2010,                                Libraries open
Official Report, column 624W.                                                                                      Number

                                                                1997-98                                              3,689
           Digital Broadcasting: Northern Ireland
                                                                1998-99                                              3,654
                                                                1999-2000                                            3,633
   Mr Gregory Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State           2000-01                                              3,627
for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport when he                  2001-02                                              3,619
expects digital switchover to take place in Northern            2002-03                                              3,601
Ireland.                                        [9508]
                                                                2003-04                                              3,604
                                                                2004-05                                              3,570
  Mr Vaizey: It is planned that digital switchover in
                                                                2005-06                                              3,573
Northern Ireland will take place in the second half
                                                                2006-07                                              3,580
of 2012.
                                                                2007-08                                              3,565
                                                                2008-09                                              3,542
                   Digital Broadcasting: Radio
                                                                  Data showing the number of public library service
  Anna Soubry: To ask the Secretary of State for                points in England are published by the Chartered Institute
Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what assessment              of Public Finance and Accountancy (CIPFA) in their
he has made of the implications for his Department’s            annual Public Library Statistics. Copies of the CIPFA
policy on digital radio switchover of the sound quality         Public Library Statistics are available in the House
provided by the current DAB digital radio standard              Libraries.
compared to that provided by the FM signal.       [9159]
   Mr Vaizey: The Government have no current plans to
make an assessment of the sound quality of digital                Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
radio, provided by Digital Audio Broadcasting (DAB),            Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many times a
compared to analogue radio provided on the FM band.             Minister from his Department has visited the (a)
However, we note that independent research conducted            British Museum, (b) Natural History Museum and
in 2009 suggested that around 75% of digital radio              (c) Science Museum in the last 12 months.       [8787]
listeners consider the sound quality on DAB to be as
good as, if not better than, FM.                                   Mr Vaizey: Since the current Administration’s tenure,
                                                                I have visited the British Museum on two occasions. My
                     Drama: Young People                        hon. Friend the Minister for Tourism and Heritage has
                                                                attended one event hosted there. These visits were in an
  Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for           official capacity.
Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what steps is his
Department is taking to increase levels of participation                            National Lottery
among young people in (a) drama and (b) acting.
                                                       [8778]     Mr Bradshaw: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport whether he
  Mr Vaizey: The Arts Council’s regular funding supports        proposes to restrict the Big Lottery Fund to the
organisations that work to increase the participation of        provision of funding to community and voluntary
young people in theatre, such as the National Association       groups only.                               [9478]
15W                  Written Answers                    19 JULY 2010                     Written Answers                         16W

  John Penrose: We are taking steps to focus the Big                Hugh Robertson: The information requested is as
Lottery Fund’s funding towards the voluntary and                 follows:
community sector and will shortly be consulting on               (a) In order for the Olympic Delivery Authority (ODA) to
proposals for this.                                              achieve or exceed specific time and cost-based targets incentive
                                                                 payments are made to its delivery partner CLM for the achievement
            Olympic Games 2012: Contracts                        of key performance indicators for the delivery of programme
                                                                 milestones and cost targets. The amounts payable to CLM over
   Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for               the last year in respect of performance will be disclosed in the
Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport (1) what Olympic              upcoming ODA’s Annual Report and Accounts 2009-10, a copy
construction contracts of what monetary value have               of which will be available in the House Library, while amounts for
been awarded to companies based (a) in Scotland, (b)             previous years are available in the Annual Reports and Accounts
                                                                 from the relevant year.
in Wales, (c) in Northern Ireland, (d) in England and
(e) outside the UK;                              [8680]          (b) The ODA incentivises contractors on the Olympic Park to
                                                                 deliver on time and on budget. Incentive payments have therefore
   (2) what recent estimate the Olympic Delivery                 been included as part of the contracting process. Payments for the
Authority has made of the number of new contracts                last six months consist of the following:
remaining to be let in respect of the London 2012
Olympics; and what estimate has been made of the                 Company                 Project                    Amount (£ million)
monetary value of those contracts.               [8681]
                                                                 Carillion               IBC/MPC                                  2.556
  Hugh Robertson: The aggregate value of contracts               Lend Lease              Olympic Village                          6.857
directly awarded by the ODA to businesses as at July             Balfour Beatty          Aquatics                                 0.587
2010 is as follows:                                              ISG                     VeloDrome                                0.117
(a) Scotland: £22,200,816
(b) Wales: £573,678                                                         Olympic Games 2012: West Midlands
(c) Northern Ireland: £17,094,646
(d) England: £5,073,551,658
(e) Outside the UK: £12,039,243.
                                                                   Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture,
                                                                 Olympics, Media and Sport what London 2012
   The location of each business is determined by its            Olympics cultural legacy projects are planned for the
registered address. These figures represent the sums that        (a) West Midlands and (b) Black Country.           [8220]
the ODA has committed up to the 14 July 2010. These
values represent the sums that the ODA has spent to
date, rather than the end contract value, as the end                Hugh Robertson: The Cultural Olympiad comprises
contract value in many cases will not yet be known.              cultural events in the run-up to the London 2012 Olympic
                                                                 games and Paralympic games. These events aim to leave
   The figures given only account for the contracts              a cultural legacy and include major national projects,
awarded to the top tier of contractors (tier one contractors).   annual open weekends and individual projects that have
The figures do not include the values of contracts               been awarded the Inspire Mark.
further down the supply chain, in tiers two, three and so
on, which are awarded by the tier one contractors rather            As elsewhere in the UK, Cultural Olympiad events
than by the ODA. The ODA estimates that the total                will bring communities in the West Midlands together,
value of supply chain contracts to the regions runs into         allowing local people to access activities they may never
millions of pounds, but these are not public procurements        have experienced before leading to a broader interest
and so the full value of contracts won across the UK is          and participation in cultural pursuits that will extend
not captured by the figures provided. The ODA estimates          beyond 2012.
that overall up to 50,000 contracts will be generated               In the West Midlands 25 cultural projects have been
throughout its supply chains. Examples of businesses             awarded the Inspire Mark. These have included a mass
from across the UK that are supplying the ODA’s                  dance event at Himley Park, Dudley. The West Midlands
contractors is available in the business section of the          has secured £2.2 million from the Legacy Trust to
London 2012 website under the heading ODA Suppliers,             programmes in the region, bringing people together for
where you will be able to find suppliers listed by venue         community activities of all kinds. Dance projects in the
and sector:                                                      region, such as Boys Dancing, StreetCheer and Bollywood                             Steps have been funded by the Legacy Trust.
  The ODA estimates that it has approximately 140                   Open Weekend 2010 will take place over 23-25 July.
remaining contracts to let, covering remaining requirements      So far, 44 cultural and sports events have been registered
on the Olympic Park, transport, and ODA corporate                in West Midlands overall.
requirements. The estimated value of the remaining                  Some of the Cultural Olympiad Major National
contracts is approximately £275 million. The remainder           Projects include a regional component:
of the ODA’s budget is allocated to transport projects
being delivered with other partners, security and ODA               “Artists Taking the Lead” features cutting edge art works in
                                                                 each region. In the West Midlands this work is Godiva Awakes by
operational costs.                                               Imagineer Productions, the recreation of Lady Godiva as a
                                                                 10 metre high puppet which will journey from Coventry to
                Olympic Games 2012: Pay
                                                                    “Stories of the World” is a UK wide series of exhibitions
  Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                 featuring collections reinterpreted by young people, local communities,
Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what bonuses                  historians, artists and other fresh voices. In the West Midlands the
have been paid to (a) consultants and (b) contractors            exhibition is Style Africa, exploring the fabrics of Africa and
working on the Olympic Park construction project in              based around Birmingham Museum and Art Gallery’s West
the last six months.                            [8679]           African textiles and dress collection.
17W                  Written Answers                    19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  18W

  A further major national project, to be launched to                      British Airways: Industrial Disputes
coincide with Open Weekend 2010, is Discovering Places
which will encourage people to learn about and engage              Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport
with the UK’s built, natural and historic environments.          what recent discussions he has had with (a) BA and
These include events to celebrate the Black Country’s            (b) Unite on the current industrial dispute at BA.
chain making tradition (Making Links) and the lives of                                                                [4985]
the people of the area (History in the Headstones).
                                                                   Mrs Villiers: The Secretary of State held separate
                                                                 meetings to discuss the dispute with the chief executive
                      TRANSPORT                                  of British Airways and with the Joint General Secretary
                Aviation: Greater London                         of Unite on 17 May and has subsequently had a number
                                                                 of informal follow-up discussions by telephone and at
  Rehman Chishti: To ask the Secretary of State for              meetings convened for other purposes. He has consistently
Transport whether he has taken steps to examine the              urged both parties to settle their differences as quickly
feasibility of establishing an airport in the Thames             as possible, in the interest of the travelling public.
Estuary.                                        [8811]

   Mrs Villiers [holding answer 15 July 2010]: The                          Buckshaw Village Railway Station
Department for Transport has not made any recent
assessment of the merits of a new airport in the Thames            Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for
Estuary. This is not an option the Government are                Transport when Buckshaw Village railway station will
considering.                                                     be operational; and if he will make a statement. [7841]
   Our priority is to make efficient use of existing airport
infrastructure in the south-east, which is why I am chairing       Mrs Villiers: A revised planning application has been
the taskforce announced by my right hon. Friend the              submitted for the station. If this is successful, contracts
Secretary of State in his written ministerial statement          could be awarded for construction in August 2010.
on 15 June 2010, Official Report, column 48WS, to                  Network Rail estimates that the new station could be
improve operations at the major south-east airports.             operational in autumn 2011.

                    Aviation: Volcanoes                                                  Crossrail
   Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport            Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport
what progress has been made on discussions at EU                 how many Crossrail services per hour will operate at
level on proposals for compensating airlines for costs           peak times in both directions between Whitechapel and
incurred as a result of volcanic ash.             [4986]
                                                                 Paddington when the line is complete.            [6575]
   Mrs Villiers: At the EU Transport Council held in
Luxembourg on 24 June, member states discussed the                 Mrs Villiers: The Crossrail programme provides for
range of initiatives undertaken in response to the air           24 trains per hour in each direction during peak hours
traffic disruptions taken as a result of the volcanic ash        over the central section on completion of project.
cloud in April. At the meeting, the European Commission
confirmed that no member state had made a formal                                    Crossrail: Finance
request for state aid clearance for financial assistance to
airlines or other companies affected by the disruptions,           Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport
nor had any draft proposals been presented to the                whether he has made an assessment of the likely effects
Commission. In a written report to the meeting, the              on the timetable for the Crossrail project of planned
Commission also said that no EU funding was available            expenditure savings in his Department.            [8113]
for this purpose. The Secretary of State for Transport
made a written statement to Parliament on the outcome              Mrs Villiers: The Government support Crossrail, which
of the Council meeting on 1 July 2010, Official Report,          will bring substantial benefits to London and the UK.
columns 50-52WS.                                                 No decisions have been taken to change the schedule of
                                                                 the project.
            Birmingham International Airport
                                                                    Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport
  Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for                  whether he expects savings under each budget heading
Transport (1) what estimate he has made of the number            to be made in relation to the Crossrail project; and if he
of jobs that are likely to be created by the planned             will make a statement.                              [8114]
expansion of Birmingham International Airport; [8271]
  (2) what recent representations he has received from              Mrs Villiers: The Government support Crossrail, which
(a) local businesses and (b) local authorities on plans          will bring substantial benefits to London and the UK.
for the expansion of Birmingham International                    No decisions have been taken to change the scope of the
Airport.                                          [8272]         project.
   Mrs Villiers: The Secretary of State for Transport has           Crossrail Ltd continue to explore and pursue
not made any estimate of the number of jobs that are             opportunities for reducing costs through value engineering
likely to be created by the planned expansion of                 and value management, as well as pursuing rigorous
Birmingham International Airport, nor has he received            risk management and good procurement practice. This
any representations from local businesses or local authorities   work has not yet been completed and so total potential
on the plans for the expansion of the airport.                   savings have yet to be fully quantified.
19W                     Written Answers                         19 JULY 2010                        Written Answers                         20W

                  Crossrail: Railway Stations                               Crossrail Canary Wharf station on 15 June 2010. Previous
                                                                            changes to the design of the station were discussed at
  Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport                      the meeting but no decisions were taken to alter the
whether new Crossrail stations will be constructed at                       design and features as a result.
(a) Paddington, (b) Bond Street, (c) Tottenham                                                      Cycling: Children
Court Road, (d) Farringdon, (e) Liverpool Street, (f)
Whitechapel and (g) Woolwich; and what recent                                 Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for
discussions he has had with contractors and designers                       Transport how many children aged (a) 11 years and
over changes in design of each of those stations. [6573]                    under, (b) 15 years and under and (c) 16 years and
                                                                            under (i) received serious head injuries and (ii) died as a
   Mrs Villiers: The planned Crossrail route includes                       result of accidents involving bicycles in (A) 2009 and
construction of stations at all of these locations. Station                 (B) the first quarter of 2010.                        [9685]
design discussions are continuing between Crossrail
Ltd, their designers, and relevant stakeholders. The                           Mike Penning: The Department for Transport collates
Secretary of State has not had discussions with contractors                 information on the number of people killed, seriously
or designers but would expect to receive regular reports                    injured or slightly injured in reported personal injury
from Crossrail Ltd as design options are firmed up.                         road accidents. However, information on the nature of
                                                                            the injury is not collected by the Department, but is
   Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport                     available from the national health service information
what recent discussions he has had with the Canary                          centre.
Wharf Group on changes in design of the proposed                               The latest year for which data are available is 2009.
Isle of Dogs/Canary Wharf Crossrail station; and what                       2010 road accident and casualty figures will be published
alterations to the design and features of the station                       in summer 2011.
have been made as a result.                       [6574]                       The number of casualties, in the age groups 0-11,
                                                                            0-15 and 0-16, killed or seriously injured in reported
 Mrs Villiers: The Secretary of State met with Canary                       personal injury road accidents involving at least one
Wharf Group and visited the construction site of the                        pedal cycle in 2009 is shown in the following table.

    Reported casualties in personal injury road accidents involving at least one pedal cycle, by road user type and casualty age-group: GB 2009
                                                   Pedal cyclist                                                Other road users1
                                                        Seriously                                                       Seriously
Age of Casualty                        Killed              injured                KSI1                 Killed             injured              KSI2

0-11 years old                            5                 173                   178                   1                    5                   6
0-15 years old                           14                 444                   458                   1                    9                  10
0-16 years old                           16                 489                   505                   1                   10                  11
  Includes pedestrians and occupants of vehicles other than pedal cycles.
  Killed or seriously injured.

                   Departmental Marketing                                   bilaterally and at the Transport Council on 24 June. The
                                                                            UK supports Regulation 261/2004, which has protected
  Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for                           passengers’ interests and raised airlines’ standards of
Transport how much his (a) Department and its                               service. However, it has changed radically and unexpectedly
predecessors and (b) its agencies and non-departmental                      as a result of a European Court of Justice ruling last
public bodies spent on logo design in each year since                       November in relation to flight delays, to the possible
1997.                                            [7481]                     detriment of both passengers and industry. Given that
                                                                            the Commission is already looking at the regulation, as
   Norman Baker: The Department for Transport spent                         part of the work following the volcanic ash crisis, the
£16,795 on its corporate identity when it was formed                        UK is asking them to include this issue within the scope
following machinery of government changes in 2002-03.                       of the review.
The logo has not changed since. Costs for other years,
agencies and non-departmental public bodies could be                           Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport
provided only at disproportionate cost.                                     pursuant to the written ministerial statement of 1 July
                                                                            2010, Official Report, columns 50-2WS, on the EU
EU Transport, Telecommunications and Energy Council                         Transport Council, what representations he has (a)
                                                                            received and (b) sought from (i) consumer groups, (ii)
  Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport                      air passenger groups and (iii) airlines prior to or
pursuant to the written ministerial statement of 1 July                     following his request to the European Commission for
2010, Official Report, columns 50-2WS, on the EU                            review of EU Regulation 261/2004 on passenger rights;
Transport Council, what discussions he has had with                         and if he will make a statement.                  [7521]
his EU counterparts on his request for a review of EU
Regulation 261/2004 on passenger rights; and if he will                       Mrs Villiers: The European Commission announced
make a statement.                                 [7520]                    in May that, following the volcanic ash crisis, it was
                                                                            looking again at EU Regulation 261/2004. The UK
  Mrs Villiers: My right hon. Friend has had preliminary                    supports Regulation 261/2004, which has protected
discussions with some of his EU counterparts both                           passengers’ interests and raised airlines’ standards of
21W                   Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                     22W

service. However, as part of the Commission’s review             this funding was spent on improvement schemes at
process, the UK has asked that it also look at one               Southeastern stations in 2007-08, 2008-09 and 2009-10
specific aspect of the regulation, relating to flight delays,    respectively.
which changed radically as a result of a European
Court of Justice ruling last November. The Government
have received several representations from airlines about                   London-Birmingham Railway Line
the effects of this ruling, which could bring detriment to
customers as well as high costs for industry. The                  Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State
Commission’s review will be of interest to passengers            for Transport (1) what representations he has received
and airlines alike.                                              on the proposed high speed rail link between London
                                                                 and Birmingham;                                  [4284]
                      London Airports                              (2) what representations he has received on the
                                                                 proposed high speed rail link between London and
   Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport          Birmingham from residents or organisations in
(1) what assessment he has made of the case for                  Coventry.                                        [4285]
additional airport capacity in south east England;
                                                        [4972]      Mr Philip Hammond [holding answer 28 June 2010]:
  (2) what assessment he has made of the merits of               The Department for Transport has received representations
proposals for a new airport in the Thames Estuary.               from a range of interested parties, including; business
                                                        [4974]   groups, those affected by High Speed 2 Limited’s
                                                                 recommended line of route, local and regional government,
   Mrs Villiers: Our priority is to get the most out of          and environmental groups. None of the representations
existing airport infrastructure in the south-east, which         received was from residents or organisations in Coventry.
is why I shall be chairing the taskforce announced by
my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State in his
written ministerial statement on 15 June 2010, Official                              Network Rail: Pay
Record, column 48WS, to improve operations at the
major south-east airports.                                          Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport
   The Department for Transport has not made any                 if he will publish each item of correspondence between
recent assessment of the merits of a new airport in the          his Department and Network Rail on executive pay at
Thames Estuary. This is not an option the Government             Network Rail since his appointment.               [4984]
are considering.
                                                                   Mrs Villiers: The Secretary of State for Transport
      London and South Eastern Railway: Finance                  wrote to Rick Haythornthwaite, chairman of Network
                                                                 Rail, on 28 May, emphasising the need for restraint on
  Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for                 executive pay. This letter can be found online at:
Transport how much public funding has been allocated     
to Southeastern Railway since it took over the Kent              and a copy has been placed in the Library of the House.
Integrated Franchise.                          [6352]
                                                                   As the Special Member of Network Rail, the Secretary
                                                                 of State also receives a number of letters from Network
  Mrs Villiers: The Department for Transport publishes           Rail’s directors, which are sent to all members. Since the
subsidy details for Southeastern (The Integrated Kent            formation of the current Government, there have been
Franchise) on its website, which can be found at:                two such letters which have referred to executive bonuses.            Copies of these letters have been placed in the House                  Library.
  The Office of Rail Regulation publishes actual subsidy
payments in its ‘National Rail Trends’ document (table                                    Railways
6.2c), which is available on its website at:
                                                                   Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for
for the current version, and                                     Transport what recent research his Department has                undertaken into the effects of level of use of the rail
for versions back to 2005-06.                                    network on non-rail users.                       [6889]

  Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for                    Mrs Villiers: The Department for Transport has analysed
Transport how much funding has been granted to                   the benefits of rail use to non-rail users using the
Southeastern Railway under the National Station                  National Transport Model—by estimating the external
Improvement Programme in each of the last three                  costs to society avoided, including congestion, accidents
years for which figures are available.      [6353]               and emissions, if car users switch to rail. The estimates
                                                                 this analysis produced led to the publication of guidance
  Mrs Villiers: The Local Delivery Group responsible             for those carrying out economic appraisals of rail schemes:
for the Southeastern portfolio of stations was allocated         “TAG unit 3.13.2: Guidance on Rail Appraisal: External
£14.3 million of the first £100 million of funding from          Costs of Car Use”. This guidance unit is available at:
the National Stations Improvement Programme. Network     
Rail advises that £960,859, £5,365,053 and £602,271 of             unit3.13.2.php#022
23W                 Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                Written Answers                 24W

                     Railways: Bury                           by Skills for Logistics in 2008, which estimated that the
                                                              freight and logistics sector as a whole is worth around
  Graham Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for             £74.5 billion to the economy.
Transport what recent progress he has made on the
Bury to Rawtenstall rail extension project.  [9161]
                                                                                Transport: Forecasts

  Mrs Villiers: The Bury to Rawtenstall rail extension           Mr Leech: To ask the Secretary of State for
project is being promoted by Rossendale borough council       Transport (1) what progress he has made on his plans
in partnership with Lancashire county council, Bury           to revise the New Approach to Transport Appraisal;
council, Rochdale metropolitan borough council and            and what the (a) terms of reference and (b) timetable
Greater Manchester Passenger Transport Executive              are for that review;                            [6999]
(GMPTE). GMPTE has commissioned a study from                     (2) whether transport schemes approved for
Atkins to look at public transport on the A56-M66             progression during the Comprehensive Spending
corridor between Bury and East Lancashire which includes      Review will be reappraised using the revised New
the reinstatement of commuter services between Rawtenstall    Approach to Transport Appraisal before they receive
and Manchester as an option. This study is due to be          final approval.                                 [7000]
completed in October 2010.
                                                                 Norman Baker: During the Spending Review decision-
                 Railways: East Anglia
                                                              making will be informed by updated carbon values and
                                                              a Treasury methodology being used by all departments
   Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for             to assess value for money in a consistent way. We intend
Transport pursuant to the written ministerial statement       to introduce reformed decision-making procedures for
of 17 June 2010, Official Report, column 58WS, on             new projects as soon as possible after the Spending
transport: rail franchising, (1) when he expects the          Review. At that point, projects seeking final approval
competition process for the Greater Anglia franchise to       will be expected to adhere to the new procedures.
(a) open and (b) close;                            [8903]
   (2) when he expects the new Greater Anglia franchise                                Wales
to be operational.                                 [8904]
                                                                 Jonathan Edwards: To ask the Secretary of State for
   Mrs Villiers: The Department for Transport is currently    Transport if he will make an assessment of the likely
in the process of reviewing rail franchising policy. To       effects on Wales of his Department’s planned spending
enable the Greater Anglia franchise to reflect the changes    reductions.                                      [8986]
that may arise from the review of this policy, the
competitions that started in January this year have been        Mr Philip Hammond: As part of the spending review
cancelled. It is expected that the new competition process    I will be reviewing the regional impacts of all spending
will be advertised by the end of this year. There is no set   decisions made by my Department, in line with Her
period between issuing such an advert and franchise           Majesty’s Treasury guidance. However, as transport is a
commencement, however typically invitations to tender         devolved function, the impact of any reductions in
have been issued around a year before the franchise           spending in Wales as a result of Barnett consequentials
start date.                                                   will be determined by the Welsh Assembly Government.
                     Railways: Fares
                                                                             HOME DEPARTMENT
   Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport
if he will bring forward measures to hypothecate                                     Detainees
annual increases in rail fares above the level of the
retail price index plus one per cent. for capital                Chris Leslie: To ask the Secretary of State for the
investment in rail or in new rolling stock and other          Home Department pursuant to the oral statement of 6
investment purposes; and if he will make a statement.         July 2010, Official Report, columns 175-78, on the
                                                     [6576]   treatment of detainees, from which departmental
                                                              budget any sums paid in compensation to those
   Mrs Villiers: The Government are committed to fairness     bringing civil cases against the Crown involving the
on rail fares. We hope to be able to keep the current         treatment of detainees will be drawn.            [8335]
formula for the cap on regulated fares, but we need to
                                                                Nick Herbert [holding answer 13 July 2010]: Formal
wait until further work has been done on the spending
                                                              mediation has not yet begun and at this stage we do not
settlement before making a final decision on the fare
                                                              know what the outcome will be. It would therefore be
formula for next year.
                                                              inappropriate to comment any further on the details of
                    Railways: Freight                         any potential payments.
                                                                               Crime: Anti-Semitism
  Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for
Transport what recent estimate he has made of the                Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for the
contribution of levels of use of rail freight to the          Home Department if she will commission a report
economy.                                        [6890]        from the Commissioner of Police for the Metropolis on
                                                              the number and location of anti-Semitic incidents in
 Mrs Villiers: No recent assessment has been made.            London since December 2008; and if she will make a
However, the economic value of rail freight was considered    statement.                                     [8576]
25W                  Written Answers                     19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                     26W

   James Brokenshire: The Home Office is committed to               a £69 million reduction to the budget of the UK Border
tackling all hate crime. Data on anti-Semitic hate crime            Agency;
is collected by the Metropolitan police and provided to             a further £13 million reduction to the Identity and Passport
the Association of Chief Police Officers National                   Service budget;
Community Tension Team to ensure that current threats               a £13 million reduction to the Home Office corporate services
are closely monitored. We have no plans to commission               budget; and a
a separate report from the Metropolitan Commissioner                £14 million reduction to the security and counter-terrorism
on this issue.                                                      budget.
                                                                     Within these headline numbers the Department is targeting
                Departmental Marketing
                                                                  its overheads, consultancy and lower value spend.
                                                                     The remaining £11 million savings will be managed
  Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for the
                                                                  through the usual in-year budget management processes
Home Department how much her (a) Department and
                                                                  within the Department.
(b) its agencies and non-departmental public bodies
spent on logo design in each year since 1997.   [7486]
                                                                     Mr Iain Wright: To ask the Secretary of State for the
                                                                  Home Department pursuant to the written ministerial
  Nick Herbert: The information is not available and
                                                                  statement of 5 July 2010, Official Report, columns
could be obtained only at disproportionate cost. Spend
                                                                  1-2WS, on spending control, under what budget
incurred for logo design is not always itemised and
                                                                  headings the £55 million of savings allocated to her
invoiced separately on the Cabinet Office Resource
                                                                  Department will be made; and what savings will be
Accounting System. Therefore, to determine conclusively
                                                                  made in respect of each police authority area.     [7211]
the Department’s spend on logo development would
require an analysis of every transaction undertaken
                                                                    Nick Herbert [holding answer 12 July 2010]: The
during the period in question and would mean manually
                                                                  Treasury have confirmed that the Home Office should
checking thousands of individual invoices.
                                                                  expect to receive half of the £110 million of capital end
               Departmental Official Cars                         year flexibility upon which its capital plans for 2010-11
                                                                  were based. This means that reductions of around
  Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for the              £55 million will need to be made in-year. This will be
Home Department how much her Department has                       achieved by bearing down on costs across a range of
spent on the Government Car Service since the                     Home Office programmes and projects. There are no
Government took office.                        [7969]             cuts planned to police capital funding.
                                                                                    Departmental Training
  Nick Herbert: Since the new coalition Government
came into effect on 11 May 2010, the Home Office has
                                                                    Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
spent £22,027 on the Government Car Service.
                                                                  the Home Department how much (a) her Department
            Departmental Public Expenditure                       and (b) its agencies and non-departmental public bodies
                                                                  spent on employee away days in each year since 1997.
   Mr Blunkett: To ask the Secretary of State for the
Home Department pursuant to the written ministerial
statement of 26 May 2010, Official Report, columns                  Nick Herbert: The Home Office accounting system
2-3WS, on savings (2010-11), under what budgetary                 does not separately identify expenditure on staff away
headings the £367 million of savings allocated to her             days. The relevant expenditure is compartmentalised
Department will be made.                         [6830]           within separate accounting codes and would therefore
                                                                  require an investigation of every separate claim for the
  Nick Herbert: The Home Office and Government                    period in question. To provide the requested detail
Equalities Office contributed £367 million in 2010-11 to          would incur disproportionate cost.
the £6 billion in-year cross-Government savings announced           All expenditure on away days is incurred in accordance
by the Chancellor on 26 May 2010.                                 with the principles of Managing Public Money and the
  Police funding for 2010-11 was reduced by a total of            Treasury handbook on Regularity and Propriety.
£135 million, of which £125 million was comprised of
reductions to the core police grant and police capital              Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for the
grant, as set out in the written ministerial statement laid       Home Department how much her (a) Department and
before the House on 27 May 2010, Official Report,                 (b) its agencies and non-departmental public bodies
columns 12-16WS. A further £10 million reduction was              spent on employee training in each year since 1997.
made from policing counter-terrorism grants.                                                                               [7652]

  Some £82 million of the savings were made from the                Nick Herbert: The information requested is not held
Department’s agencies and arm’s length bodies, as well            centrally and would be available only at disproportionate
as the Government Equalities Office. I refer the right            cost.
hon. Member to the answer given to the right hon.
Member for Kingston upon Hull West and Hessle (Alan                                        Detainees
Johnson) on 29 June 2010, Official Report, columns
508-09W.                                                             Chris Leslie: To ask the Secretary of State for the
  A further £139 million is accounted for by:                     Home Department pursuant to the oral statement of
  a £30 million reduction to the Home Office crime and policing   6 July 2010, Official Report, columns 175-78, on the
  budget, including some grants;                                  treatment of detainees, if she will make it her policy to
27W                    Written Answers                        19 JULY 2010                    Written Answers                        28W

require that requests under the Freedom of                             to new psychoactive substances. No figures are available in relation
Information Act 2000 for disclosure of compensation                    to the cost to the Department. An impact assessment (IA) laid
paid in resolving outstanding civil cases are not                      with the draft Order established that it was not possible at that
                                                                       time to estimate the costs associated with law change. The IA is
declined on grounds of statutory exemption.   [8336]
                                                                       available at:
   Nick Herbert [holding answer 13 July 2010]: Mediation        
is a confidential process and the question of whether                     regulatory-impact-assessments/
any elements are made public is for agreement by both
parties. I can however confirm that the exemptions                                                 Firearms
provided for in the Freedom of Information Act would
have to be considered before any response could be                        Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
given.                                                                 the Home Department how many guns have been
                                                                       seized by the police in each year since 1997.    [8824]
   Chris Leslie: To ask the Secretary of State for the
Home Department (1) pursuant to the oral statement                       James Brokenshire: These data are not collected centrally.
of 6 July 2010, Official Report, columns 175-78, on the
treatment of detainees, if she will disclose to (a) the                                 Offences Against Children
Intelligence and Security Committee, (b) the National
Audit Office and (c) the independent reviewer of                         Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Secretary of State for
terrorism legislation details of the compensation to be                the Home Department to what extent the police has
paid in resolution of any civil cases involving the                    used the European Criminal Records Information
treatment of detainees;                                [8333]          system in (a) locating and (b) bringing charges against
   (2) if she will make it her policy to publish figures for           British citizens who have committed sexual crimes
(a) the number of mediated civil cases where                           against children overseas.                        [9009]
compensation is paid and (b) the total amount of
compensation so paid.                                  [8334]             Lynne Featherstone: The European Criminal Records
                                                                       Information System (ECRIS) is a secure computerised
  Nick Herbert [holding answer 13 July 2010]: Formal                   exchange system, using a standardised format so that
mediation has not yet begun and at this stage we do not                individual member states are able to exchange criminal
know what the outcome will be. The Prime Minister has                  conviction information in a uniform, electronic and
said that where appropriate financial compensation will                easily computer translatable way. It is due to be implemented
be awarded. However, mediation is a confidential process               by all member states in April 2012. As the information
and the question of whether any elements are made                      exchanged through ECRIS will only be existing criminal
public is for agreement by both parties. It would be                   convictions it will not be possible to use it to locate and
inappropriate to comment further at this stage.                        bring charges against British citizens who have committed
                                                                       sexual crimes against children overseas.
                            EC Law
                                                                          The United Kingdom already receives criminal conviction
                                                                       notifications from the majority of EU countries. An
  Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for the                 offender will be placed on the Violent and Sexual Offenders
Home Department what estimate she has made of the                      Register (VISOR) if the offence abroad is one that
cost to her Department of the statutory obligations on                 would have resulted in him being placed on VISOR if it
it provided for in legislation introduced as a                         had occurred in the UK. There are currently 499 offenders
consequence of obligations arising from EU legislation                 on VISOR as a result of offences committed abroad.
in the most recent 12 months for which figures are
available.                                        [6334]                        Offences Against Children: Prosecutions

   James Brokenshire: Over the last 12 months (July                       Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Secretary of State for
2009 to June 2010), the Home Office has introduced a                   the Home Department how many (a) prosecutions
small number of domestic legislative measures (primary                 were brought and (b) convictions there were under
and secondary) implementing in whole or in part statutory              section 72 of the Sexual Offences Act 2003 for sexual
obligations arising from EU legislation.                               crimes committed against children outside the UK in
   Eight of these have resulted in minimal costs to the                each year since the Act came into force; and whether
Home Office beyond those integral to the planning,                     her Department has made an assessment of the length
drafting and production of these measures for which                    of the sentences given in relation to the maximum
figures are not available. Of the remaining two measures:              available sentence.                                [8563]
   The Immigration (Biometric Registration) (Amendment No.2)
Regulations 2009 enables the UK to move towards complying                 James Brokenshire [holding answer 15 July 2010]:
with EC Regulation 380/2008, which concerns the format of              The Court Proceedings Database held by the Ministry
residence permits issued to third country nationals and specifically   of Justice contains information on defendants proceeded
enabled the UK to roll out biometric residence cards to migrants       against, found guilty and sentenced for criminal offences
extending their stay under tier 2 of the PBS (skilled workers). As a
proportion of the overall start-up costs for Biometric Residence
                                                                       in England and Wales. Other than where specified in a
Permits, £2.6 million was apportioned to the rollout of cards to       statute, statistical information available centrally does
these migrants. The average annual maintenance cost is £2.1 million    not include the circumstances of each case and does not
which is recovered through application fees.                           identify where the offence was committed. Therefore it
   On 23 December 2009, benzylpiperazine was brought under             is not possible to separately identify those defendants
control of the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971 as a Class C drug              proceeded against who committed the offence while
pursuant to European Council Decision 2005/387/JHA in relation         abroad.
29W                   Written Answers                        19 JULY 2010                         Written Answers                     30W

  No internal assessment of sentencing under the Sexual                    Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
Offences Act 2003 has been made. However, the Sentencing                the Home Department how many (a) illegally-held
Guidelines Council published definitive guideline on                    and (b) air weapons were seized by police in each year
sentencing under the Sexual Offences Act 2003 on                        since 1997.                                      [8827]
30 April 2007 that addresses appropriate levels of sentencing
in relation to the maximum sentences. I will place a                          James Brokenshire: These data are not collected centrally.
copy of these guidelines in the Library.                                                         Pakistan: Torture

                     Offensive Weapons                                    Valerie Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for the
                                                                        Home Department how much (a) her Department and
  Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for                   (b) the government of Pakistan has spent on the
the Home Department how many people stopped by                          protection of General Musharraf provided by her
the police on suspicion of carrying a knife were                        Department while in the United Kingdom in the most
subsequently (a) charged and (b) convicted in each of                   recent period for which figures are available; and if she
the last five years.                            [8792]                  will make a statement.                              [7018]

  James Brokenshire: The information requested is not                     Nick Herbert: The Home Office does not comment
held centrally.                                                         on the protective security arrangements and their related
  Data on the number of persons stopped and searched,                   costs of any individuals or groups. The hon. Member
and resultant arrests for offensive weapons under section               will appreciate that disclosure of such information could
1 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act (PACE) and                    compromise the integrity of those arrangements and
under section 60 of the Criminal Justice and Public                     the security of those involved.
Order Act 1994 do not separately identify searches for                                                   Police
  Information on the number of stop searches and                          Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
resultant arrests for offensive weapons can be found in                 the Home Department how many police warrant cards
tables 2a and 2b of the Home Office Statistical Bulletin,               have been recorded as (a) lost and (b) stolen in each
‘Police Powers and Procedures, England and Wales                        year since 1997.                                 [8797]
2008/09’. Copies of the bulletin are available in the
Library of the House.                                                     Nick Herbert: The information requested is not collected
  These data do not link to any subsequent outcome                      centrally.
therefore it is not possible to identify the number of                                            Police: Dismissal
convictions for possession of a knife in public arising
directly from these stop and search procedures.                           Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for the
                                                                        Home Department how many police officers were
   Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for                  dismissed from each police force between 1997 and
the Home Department how many knives have been                           2010.                                             [8887]
seized by the police in each year since 1997.    [8808]
                                                                           Nick Herbert: The available data are provided in the
  James Brokenshire: The requested data are not held                    following table. Data are only available for 2002-03 to
centrally.                                                              2008-09.

                           Police officer dismissals by police force (full-time equivalent)1, 2002-03 to 2008-092
                                                                                                                        Full-time equivalent
Force name                     2002-033          2003-04           2004-05           2005-06          2006-07       2007-08         2008-09

Avon and Somerset                      1                3                 5                4                 1            1               3
Bedfordshire                           2                0                 4                0                 5            1               3
Cambridgeshire                         4                2                 4                2                 1            4               0
Cheshire                               2                0                 2                3                 4            3               2
Cleveland                              5                3                 4                3                 0            2               3
Cumbria                                2                1                 0                2                 0            1               1
Derbyshire                             4                3                 0                3                 5            4               4
Devon and Cornwall                     7                3                 3                0                 4            2               2
Dorset                                 2                1                 3                3                 3            2               2
Durham                                 0                1                 1                1                 0            1               2
Essex                                n/a                3                 2                9                 5            1               4
Gloucestershire                      n/a                2                 0                2                 2            0               1
Greater Manchester                     3               11                 5               21                 6            8               7
Hampshire                              3                6                 5                6                 1            5               4
Hertfordshire                          3                4                 2                2                 2            4               5
Humberside                             1                3                 0                4                 2            2               2
Kent                                   0                1                 0                3                 1            4               2
Lancashire                             6                5                 2                3                 6            8               6
Leicestershire                         0                1                 1                3                 2            7               2
31W                     Written Answers                         19 JULY 2010                         Written Answers                     32W

                              Police officer dismissals by police force (full-time equivalent)1, 2002-03 to 2008-092
                                                                                                                           Full-time equivalent
Force name                        2002-033          2003-04           2004-05           2005-06          2006-07       2007-08         2008-09

Lincolnshire                                0                1              0                0              3                0                0
London, City of                             1                0              1                0              1                2                0
Merseyside                                  3                7              9              10               1              13               10
Metropolitan Police                        19               22             32              28             31               23               19
Norfolk                                     1                1              2                1              1                1                5
Northamptonshire                            0                2              0                1              3                2                4
Northumbria                                 3                6              2                2              8                9                4
North Yorkshire                             0                3              0                2              0                2                2
Nottinghamshire                             1                1              1                1              2                2                1
South Yorkshire                             3                1              0                4              0                0                1
Staffordshire                               1                6              3                2              6                8                1
Suffolk                                     1                2              3                4              2                2                2
Surrey                                      0                7              2                5            10                 5                4
Sussex                                      0                6              2                5              5                1                2
Thames Valley                               4                1              1                8              5                4                8
Warwickshire                                1                2              2                2              0                1                1
West Mercia                                 0                4              2                4              1                0                1
West Midlands                              11                4             18                8            26               16                 8
West Yorkshire                              6                6              2                5              3                8                6
Wiltshire                                   3                0              1                0              1                0                0
Dyfed-Powys                                 1                1              1                3              0                3                3
Gwent                                       1                0              2                3              1                6                2
North Wales                                 0                0              1                3              1                0                0
South Wales                                 3                4              3                3              1                2                2
Total                                     108              140            133             178            161              170              141
n/a = Data not available
  Full-time equivalent figures that have been rounded to the nearest whole number. Because of rounding, there may be an apparent
discrepancy between totals and the sums of the constituent items. Data have not previously been published in this format therefore totals may
not match totals found in the published data.
  Financial year runs 1 April to 31 March inclusive. Comparable data are not available prior to 2002-03.
  Excludes quarters 1, 2 and 3, as data are not available.

                         Police: Finance                                     Nick Herbert: There are no current plans for the
                                                                           Home Office to collect data or figures on the number of
  Andrew Gwynne: To ask the Secretary of State for the                     negligent discharges from authorised police firearms
Home Department what proportion of funding for the                         officers in England and Wales. This information may be
employment of police officers in 2010-11 is provided by                    obtained directly from individual chief officers.
(a) central Government and (b) local authorities.                                                    Police: Manpower

                                                                             Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for the
  Nick Herbert: In 2010-11, central Government funding
                                                                           Home Department how many police officers were
to the police service in England and Wales is around
                                                                           employed (a) in total and (b) in each police authority
£9.6 billion. A further £3.2 billion is raised through the
                                                                           area (i) on the latest date for which figures are available
police precept component of council tax and police
                                                                           and (ii) in each of the last 13 years; and what estimate
forces also generate a smaller amount of income for
                                                                           she has made of the likely number of police officers in
themselves, for example by charging event organisers
                                                                           each such area in each of the next four years.        [8849]
for policing.
                        Police: Firearms                                     Nick Herbert [holding answer 15 July 2010]: The
                                                                           available data are provided in the following tables.
   Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for the                     The estimate of the likely number of police officers
Home Department if she will take steps to collate                          and police officers in each of the next four years is not
figures on the annual number of negligent discharges                       available centrally. These decisions are made by the
from police firearms in England and Wales.         [8816]                  Chief Constable and the Police Authority.

                             Police officer strength1 (FTE)2 by police force as at 31 March 1997 to 31 March 2009
                                                                                31 March each year
Police force                         1997             1998              1999              2000             20013          2002            2003

Avon and Somerset                    2,989            2,976             2,999            2,934             2,960         3,096           3,149
Bedfordshire                         1,094            1,079             1,041            1,028             1,036         1,069           1,106
Cambridgeshire                       1,302            1,291             1,274            1,237             1,296         1,362           1,384
33W                   Written Answers                       19 JULY 2010                          Written Answers            34W

                          Police officer strength1 (FTE)2 by police force as at 31 March 1997 to 31 March 2009
                                                                           31 March each year
Police force                       1997             1998             1999            2000            20013           2002     2003

Cheshire                         2,046             2,042             2,071          2,011              2,002       2,059      2,119
Cleveland                        1,459             1,483             1,416          1,404              1,407       1,461      1,582
Cumbria                          1,144             1,164             1,126          1,084              1,048       1,100      1,140
Derbyshire                       1,791             1,772             1,759          1,777              1,823       1,848      2,003
Devon and Cornwall               2,865             2,962             2,887          2,841              2,934       3,053      3,202
Dorset                           1,284             1,310             1,279          1,306              1,354       1,381      1,416
Durham                           1,461             1,515             1,568          1,558              1,595       1,614      1,651
Essex                            2,961             2,928             2,891          2,806              2,887       2,946      2,989
Gloucestershire                  1,133             1,104             1,104          1,114              1,173       1,183      1,227
Greater Manchester               6,922             6,949             6,810          6,795              6,909       7,217      7,343
Hampshire                        3,452             3,490             3,473          3,419              3,435       3,480      3,668
Hertfordshire                    1,759             1,740             1,724          1,767              1,922       1,825      1,957
Humberside                       2,045             2,021             1,974          1,932              1,917       2,058      2,105
Kent                             3,260             3,251             3,201          3,204              3,319       3,355      3,487
Lancashire                       3,247             3,257             3,245          3,179              3,255       3,304      3,339
Leicestershire                   1,949             1,983             1,993          1,993              2,033       2,100      2,114
Lincolnshire                     1,196             1,191             1,140          1,115              1,202       1,198      1,221
London, City of                    859               825               778            732                703         764        808
Merseyside                       4,230             4,216             4,211          4,085              4,081       4,125      4,099
Metropolitan Police             26,677            26,094            26,073         25,485             24,878      26,223     27,984
Norfolk                          1,432             1,430             1,381          1,381              1,420       1,468      1,499
Northamptonshire                 1,177             1,169             1,137          1,117              1,157       1,214      1,210
Northumbria                      3,677             3,769             3,840          3,788              3,857       3,929      3,943
North Yorkshire                  1,338             1,367             1,337          1,283              1,305       1,417      1,444
Nottinghamshire                  2,323             2,323             2,225          2,204              2,212       2,330      2,411
South Yorkshire                  3,159             3,182             3,168          3,163              3,197       3,199      3,183
Staffordshire                    2,211             2,292             2,238          2,170              2,129       2,133      2,202
Suffolk                          1,180             1,186             1,190          1,145              1,133       1,203      1,253
Surrey                           1,620             1,608             1,662          1,785              2,066       1,992      1,906
Sussex                           3,085             2,996             2,847          2,822              2,855       2,893      2,989
Thames Valley                    3,695             3,776             3,748          3,740              3,703       3,762      3,833
Warwickshire                       926               924               908            900                926         969        997
West Mercia                      2,040             2,010             2,025          1,887              1,951       2,018      2,256
West Midlands                    7,113             7,156             7,321          7,194              7,423       7,681      7,751
West Yorkshire                   5,209             5,155             4,982          4,822              4,815       4,889      5,029
Wiltshire                        1,154             1,156             1,151          1,118              1,120       1,157      1,158
Dyfed-Powys                      1,005             1,002             1,026          1,040              1,055       1,132      1,149
Gwent                            1,243             1,233             1,247          1,264              1,274       1,333      1,341
North Wales                      1,369             1,396             1,391          1,403              1,444       1,506      1,539
South Wales                      2,976             2,986             2,981          2,926              3,100       3,222      3,239
Total England and Wales        125,051           124,756           123,841        121,956            123,313     127,267    131,426

                                                                             31 March each year
Police force                             2004              2005                2006                2007             2008      2009

Avon and Somerset                        3,401             3,384               3,389               3,375         3,339        3,303
Bedfordshire                             1,181             1,215               1,198               1,185         1,174        1,219
Cambridgeshire                           1,400             1,402               1,430               1,381         1,358        1,414
Cheshire                                 2,177             2,186               2,174               2,192         2,124        2,123
Cleveland                                1,687             1,676               1,677               1,713         1,663        1,756
Cumbria                                  1,222             1,232               1,230               1,244         1,228        1,257
Derbyshire                               2,070             2,070               2,046               2,023         2,076        2,119
Devon and Cornwall                       3,283             3,369               3,493               3,476         3,486        3,518
Dorset                                   1,433             1,450               1,485               1,492         1,482        1,463
Durham                                   1,685             1,718               1,699               1,683         1,605        1,566
Essex                                    3,098             3,190               3,279               3,297         3,346        3,454
Gloucestershire                          1,284             1,291               1,289               1,303         1,338        1,370
Greater Manchester                       8,042             8,041               7,959               7,887         7,931        8,124
Hampshire                                3,706             3,725               3,707               3,796         3,807        3,700
Hertfordshire                            2,086             2,104               2,126               2,159         2,137        2,117
Humberside                               2,213             2,230               2,224               2,227         2,216        2,078
35W                     Written Answers                         19 JULY 2010                         Written Answers                       36W

                                                                                31 March each year
Police force                                2004               2005                2006               2007               2008                2009

Kent                                         3,576              3,586              3,599               3,664             3,644               3,716
Lancashire                                   3,550              3,551              3,583               3,566             3,609               3,653
Leicestershire                               2,277              2,283              2,250               2,225             2,212               2,338
Lincolnshire                                 1,228              1,221              1,213               1,221             1,178               1,204
London, City of                                853                876                869                 854               817                 804
Merseyside                                   4,122              4,317              4,269               4,413             4,449               4,462
Metropolitan Police                         29,735             30,710             30,536             30,710             31,014              32,121
Norfolk                                      1,510              1,544              1,557               1,565             1,526               1,644
Northamptonshire                             1,239              1,267              1,317               1,281             1,264               1,301
Northumbria                                  4,040              4,048              3,983               3,917             3,928               4,028
North Yorkshire                              1,529              1,543              1,636               1,654             1,560               1,435
Nottinghamshire                              2,484              2,502              2,477               2,410             2,334               2,380
South Yorkshire                              3,279              3,265              3,255               3,254             3,172               3,017
Staffordshire                                2,266              2,280              2,272               2,288             2,229               2,189
Suffolk                                      1,304              1,313              1,300               1,342             1,308               1,280
Surrey                                       1,913              1,915              1,922               1,914             1,904               1,824
Sussex                                       3,039              3,044              3,092               3,077             3,032               3,163
Thames Valley                                4,034              4,114              4,229               4,197             4,112               4,251
Warwickshire                                 1,008              1,011              1,032               1,059             1,017                 975
West Mercia                                  2,355              2,367              2,351               2,400             2,433               2,436
West Midlands                                7,887              8,056              8,097               8,173             8,315               8,559
West Yorkshire                               5,275              5,631              5,644               5,655             5,744               5,787
Wiltshire                                    1,217              1,222              1,219               1,204             1,202               1,212
Dyfed-Powys                                  1,160              1,174              1,182               1,177             1,181               1,176
Gwent                                        1,372              1,438              1,467               1,493             1,474               1,432
North Wales                                  1,603              1,652              1,617               1,591             1,566               1,578
South Wales                                  3,279              3,281              3,263               3,297             3,194               3,103
Total England and Wales                   137,105             139,495            139,633            140,032            139,728             141,647
  This table contains full-time equivalent figures that have been rounded to the nearest whole number. Because of rounding, there may be an
apparent discrepancy between totals and the sums of the constituent items
  Prior to 2002-03, figures excluded officers on career breaks or maternity/paternity leave. Therefore for comparative purposes, all figures
shown exclude officers on career breaks or maternity/paternity leave.
  Boundary changes on 1 April 2000 transferred some resources from the Metropolitan Police to Essex, Hertfordshire and Surrey police forces.

                    Public Spending Control                                Sexual Offences Act 2003 came into force. The following
                                                                           table provides a yearly breakdown:
  Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home                                           Sexual Offences Act Orders
Department pursuant to the written ministerial statement                                                         Number of foreign travel orders
of 5 July 2010, Official Report, columns 1-2WS, on                                                                               (FO) granted
public spending control, under which budgetary headings                    2004-05                                                              1
she expects her Department to make savings of £55                          2005-06                                                              1
million in the fiscal year 2010-11.                 [7517]
                                                                           2006-07                                                              3
                                                                           2007-08                                                              1
   Nick Herbert: The Treasury have confirmed that the                      2008-09                                                             12
Home Office should expect to receive half of the £110
million of capital end year flexibility upon which its
capital plans for 2010-11 were based. This means that
reductions of around £55 million will need to be made
in-year. This will be achieved by bearing down on costs                      COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT
across a range of Home Office programmes and projects.
                                                                                           Electoral Register: Expenditure
               Sexual Offences: Travel Restrictions
                                                                             Chris Ruane: To ask             the Secretary of State for
  Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Secretary of State for                    Communities and Local             Government how much was
the Home Department how many foreign travel orders                         spent per head by each            local authority on electoral
have been issued under section 114 of the Sexual                           registration in the latest        period for which figures are
Offences Act 2003 since the Act came into force. [8564]                    available.                                                      [9196]

  James Brokenshire [holding answer 15 July 2010]:                           Robert Neill: I have today placed in the Library of the
According to the latest data published by the Multi                        House a table that gives, for each local authority in
Agency Public Protection Arrangement (MAPPA) there                         England, the net current expenditure per head reported
have been 18 foreign travel orders issued since the                        on registration of electors in 2008-09.
37W                  Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  38W

               Housing: Carbon Emissions                        which other schemes can be progressed with the aim of
                                                                maximising affordable housing and achieving best value
  Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for            for money. The objective is to give interested parties
Communities and Local Government whether he plans               clarity as quickly as possible.
to change the requirement that all new homes are zero
carbon by 2016.                                 [8622]                           Housing: Regeneration

  Grant Shapps: I have long endorsed the concept of               Steve Rotheram: To ask the Secretary of State for
zero carbon new homes from 2016. I recognise the                Communities and Local Government what decisions
importance for the industry to have a clear definition as       he has taken on the future of Housing Market Renewal
soon as possible and we are currently working on this.          Initiative funding in Liverpool, Walton constituency;
                  Housing: Construction                         and if he will make a statement.                [9288]

  Mr Bain: To ask the Secretary of State for                       Grant Shapps: Future plans for programmes such as
Communities and Local Government what steps he                  Housing Market Renewal will be set out by the Government
plans to take to encourage an increase in the level of          after the spending review later in the year.
housebuilding.                                   [8650]
                                                                 Local Government Services: Voluntary Organisations
   Andrew Stunell: The Government are committed to
increasing housing supply from current levels.                    Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for
   The previous Government’s model of top-down housing          Communities and Local Government what future role
targets failed to deliver: in 2009 just 118,000 completions     he envisages for the voluntary sector in (a) supporting
were achieved, the lowest level of house building in            local communities in accessing public services and (b)
England since the Second World War. On 6 July we                the provision and development of local services. [9680]
revoked regional spatial strategies and regional housing
targets and passed power back to local communities.                Robert Neill: The voluntary and community sector
Instead of going against the grain of local opinion and         has an important role to play in helping people to create
creating opposition to imposed new housing, we will             the Big Society in their neighbourhood, where local
increase housing supply by introducing powerful fiscal          people feel empowered to bring about the changes they
incentives so that communities benefit directly from            know their communities need and they come together
housing growth. We are confident that our approach to           to change the things they care about.
housing, which rebalances power from central government            The Government will continue to give new powers to
to local authorities and local people, and combines this        neighbourhoods, including greater control over their
with powerful incentives for local authorities, will deliver    finances and new rights to take over state-run services,
the housing that communities want and need. We will             and will work with the community-led voluntary sector
set out further details on the timetable for introducing        to identify and remove unnecessary regulation and barriers
incentives in due course.                                       which hinder its work.
  John Healey: To ask the Secretary of State for                            Local Government: Shrewsbury
Communities and Local Government with reference to
the Homes and Communities Agency (HCA) briefing
note on Impact of HM Treasury announcement on                     Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for
HCA spending dated 25 May 2010, when he expects                 Communities and Local Government if he will meet
the HCA to announce its decision on the allocation of           representatives of Shrewsbury Town Council to discuss
remaining uncommitted funding for (a) the National              (a) the devolution of additional powers and
Affordable Housing programme, (b) Kickstart Round               responsibilities from Shropshire Unitary Authority and
2 and (c) Local Authority New Build programme.                  (b) means of improving value for money of local
                                                                authority services.                               [9339]

   Grant Shapps: The coalition Government remain strongly          Robert Neill: The Coalition’s programme for government
committed to reducing the United Kingdom’s budget               sets out a radical localist vision where powers are passed
deficit and the announcement by the Chief Secretary on          not merely to councils but down further to communities,
5 July confirmed that the Department has agreed to a            neighbourhoods and individuals. In any place it is for
£220 million reduction in its claim for end year flexibility    the councils democratically accountable to local people
this year. Given public sector borrowing in 2010-11 was         to decide what arrangements for devolving powers is
forecast to hit £167 billion such levels of spending on         most suitable for their area.
‘borrowed money’ was unsustainable—contributing to                 I will, of course, be happy to meet the hon. Gentlemen
the forecast £1.4 trillion of public debt by 2014. However,     and representatives of his Town Council.
the Government remain committed to the provision of
affordable housing and have been able to secure £1.25 billion             Mortgages: Government Assistance
of the previous Administration’s £1.5 billion Housing
Pledge.                                                            John Healey: To ask the Secretary of State for
   This will enable the Homes and Communities Agency            Communities and Local Government what estimate his
(HCA) to meet all existing contractual commitments              Department has made of the number of people who
and will be able to progress some programmes that have          have renegotiated the terms of their mortgage in the
been paused while the funding position was under                last 12 months (a) following receipt of government-
review. The HCA’s regional offices will be assessing            funded help and advice and (b) in total.       [9612]
39W                 Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  40W

   Grant Shapps: Communities and Local Government              Robert Neill: In considering the proposed changes to
does not hold information on the number of people            the planning rules for houses in multiple occupation we
who have renegotiated mortgage terms with their lender       approached a number of representative bodies for their
as a result of Government help and advice. However, at       comments. These included the Local Government
least 110,000 households have received advice on mortgage    Association, and the Planning Officer Society.
problems through the Citizens Advice Bureau or their           We did not invite individual local authorities to comment.
local authority in the last year. Latest data shows that     However, any comments made by individual authorities
20,254 households approached their local authority for       will of course be taken into account.
advice in relation to the Mortgage Rescue Scheme by
the end of March 2010.
                                                               Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for
   In the interests of transparency, on 20 July I am         Communities and Local Government what criteria
publishing a report commissioned by the previous             were used to determine participants in his
Government yet never published. The Professor Muellbauer     Department’s targeted consultation on the changing of
report “Modelling and Forecasting UK Mortgage Arrears        planning rules for houses in multiple occupation.
and Possessions” indicates that in a worst case scenario                                                           [9719]
there could be 175,000 repossessions by 2012. However
the coalition Government are committed to ensuring
that interest rates remain low for as long as possible.         Robert Neill: Following the statement by the Minister
This will be achieved by tackling the £155 billion deficit   for Housing and Local Government, to the House on
which will help enable homeowners to stay in their own       17 June 2010 we have been engaged with discussions
homes and avoid repossession through ongoing lower           with key partners about our proposals in relation to the
interest rates. The Government believe this measure will     planning rules for HMOs.
prevent repossessions better than any other individual          Those invited to participate were chosen on the basis
scheme.                                                      of the interests they represented with the aim of covering
   An evaluation of the Mortgage Rescue and Homeowners       all viewpoints identified in the earlier consultation.
Support schemes will be published shortly. I have reviewed
the repossession schemes offered by Communities and                             Non-domestic Rates
Local Government, to ensure that they provide the best
support for homeowners and value for money for the              Mr Blunkett: To ask the Secretary of State for
taxpayer. I can confirm that the Mortgage Rescue and         Communities and Local Government pursuant to the
Homeowners Mortgage Support schemes remain available         answer of 29 June 2010, Official Report, column 529W,
as a last resort to homeowners facing the threat of          on non-domestic rates, and with reference to the
repossession. The Homeowners Mortgage Support scheme         Budget Red Book 2010 page 27, section 1.67, when the
will end, as planned, at the end of the financial year. I    Government intends to bring forward legislation to
will be considering the longer term role for the Mortgage    provide for a temporary increase in small business rate
Rescue scheme as part of the Spending Review.                relief; when guidance will be made available; and if he
                                                             will make a statement.                            [9306]
            Multiple Occupation: Licensing
                                                                Robert Neill: The 22 June Budget announced the
   Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for        Government’s intention to cancel certain backdated
Communities and Local Government if he will                  business rates and increase the level of small business
consider the merits of local development orders in           rate relief for one year, from October 2010. I refer the
place of alternative Article 4 directions to provide         right hon. Member to the answer I gave him on 15 July
flexibility in the regulation of houses of multiple          2010, Official Report, column 908W, on backdated business
occupation.                                     [9717]       rates bills. In respect of small business rate relief, the
                                                             necessary statutory instruments were laid before Parliament
   Robert Neill: The Minister for Housing and Local          on the 28 June. They are the Non-Domestic Rating
Government outlined our proposed approach to the             (Small Business Rate Relief) (Amendment) (England)
treatment of houses in multiple occupation within the        Order (SI 2010/1655), and the Non-Domestic (Collection
planning system on 17 June 2010.                             and Enforcement) (Local Lists) (England) (Amendment)
                                                             (No.2) Regulations (SI 2010/1656). Local authorities
   We are currently considering a number of matters
                                                             are responsible for the administration of this measure.
that have been raised in relation to those proposals. The
                                                             My officials will work closely with them on implementation.
question of whether LDOs or Article 4 directions are
the most suitable tool for managing HMOs on a targeted
basis is part of that consideration.                                        Non-domestic Rates: Ports
   Notwithstanding, as mentioned in the Budget 2010
(HC61) we intend to promote the greater use of local           Austin Mitchell: To ask the Secretary of State for
development orders where appropriate as part of a shift      Communities and Local Government how much was
to a more locally driven planning regime.                    received from port companies under the previous
                                                             Government’s eight-year payment scheme for back-
  Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for         dated business rate demands.                   [9157]
Communities and Local Government for what reasons
Oxford city council was not invited to contribute to the       Robert Neill: The information collected by the
targeted consultation on the changing of planning            Department on business rates does not allow port
rules for houses in multiple occupation.          [9718]     companies to be separately identified.
41W                 Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                Written Answers                  42W

                           Peat                                 Robert Neill: I refer the hon. Member to the written
                                                              ministerial statement made on 15 July 2010, Official
   Barbara Keeley: To ask the Secretary of State for          Report, columns 37-40WS.
Communities and Local Government if he will take
steps to ensure that his Department’s Minerals                                 RENEW North Staffs
Planning Guidance on peat extraction takes account of
the Government’s policies on climate change and                 Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for
international commitments on biodiversity.      [9036]        Communities and Local Government what (a) land
                                                              and (b) other capital assets have been acquired (i) by
   Robert Neill: In the coalition agreement the Government    RENEW North Staffs and (ii) by others using
stated that they will publish and present to Parliament a     RENEW North Staffs funding each year since
simple and consolidated national planning framework           RENEW North Staffs was established; and how much
covering all forms of development. We will make an            has been spent in each case.                     [6603]
announcement on how we propose to take forward the
national planning framework and the implications for             Robert Neill: For each year the property acquisition
specific areas of planning policy.                            and land acquisition by RENEW and its partners is as
  Barbara Keeley: To ask the Secretary of State for
Communities and Local Government if he will issue                          Property    Stoke city
guidance to Natural England on its procedures for                          RENEW          council      RSL     Land (ha)
dealing with applications for peat extraction. [9037]
                                                              2003-04             1           64          0           2.1
                                                              2004-05             0          217          0         0.171
   Robert Neill: The Department has no plans to issue
guidance to Natural England on its procedure for dealing      2005-06             0          345         18           0.4
with applications for peat extraction. Section 54 of the      2006-07             1          287         12          1.26
Planning and Compulsory Purchase Act 2004 introduced          2007-08             0          362        104             0
for most statutory consultees, a duty to respond to           2008-09             0          361         91             0
consultation and a requirement for those statutory            2009-10             3          216         67             0
consultees to produce an annual report on their performance
in responding to consultation.                                  The cost of the individual acquisitions is not readily
                                                              available in the format requested.
           Public Houses: Property Transfer
                                                                Robert Flello: To ask the Secretary of State for
  Greg Mulholland: To ask the Secretary of State for          Communities and Local Government how much
Communities and Local Government pursuant to the              funding has been received by RENEW North Staffs in
answer of 29 June 2010, Official Report, column 531W,         each year since it was established.           [6629]
on public houses, how many communities the Asset
Transfer Unit has assisted to take ownership or                 Robert Neill: RENEW North Staffordshire has received
management of their local public house to date; and if        funding as follows:
he will make a statement.                        [9471]
   Andrew Stunell: The Asset Transfer Unit has so far
assisted one community specifically on taking over their      2003-04                                           5,435,978
local public house, but its knowledge and ability to          2004-05                                           7,001,039
provide tailored support (from external partners or           2005-06                                          19,299,999
through consultancy services) ensures that it is in a         2006-07                                          29,000,000
position to respond to other similar enquiries should it      2007-08                                          38,410,000
be approached.                                                2008-09                                          39,960,000
   The Government’s commitment to introduce powers            2009-10                                          37,956,000
to help communities save local facilities threatened with     Total                                           177,063,016
closure, which could include public houses of importance
to particular communities, is set out in ‘The Coalition:                 Rented Housing: Empty Property
our programme for government’. Options for achieving
this objective most effectively are under consideration,
and we will be discussing this further with all those with      Greg Mulholland: To ask the Secretary of State for
an interest across the sectors.                               Communities and Local Government what estimate he
                                                              has made of the number of vacant properties in the (a)
 Regional Planning and Development: West Midlands             social and (b) private rented sector in (i) Leeds and (ii)
                                                              Leeds North West.                                   [9551]
  Richard Burden: To ask the Secretary of State for
Communities and Local Government pursuant to the                 Andrew Stunell: Information is not collected by
answer of 21 June 2010, Official Report, column 26W,          constituency.
on regional planning and development; West                       The Housing Strategy Statistical Appendix (HSSA)
Midlands, whether the Government responses to the             collects information from local authorities on the number
(a) Second and (b) Third Report for the West                  of vacant dwellings within each local authority area as
Midlands Regional Select Committee of Session                 at 1 April. Information is not collected on the number
2009-10 will be made before the summer recess. [9360]         of vacant dwellings in the private rented sector.
43W                  Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  44W

   The Regulatory Statistical Return (RSR) is collected                         Departmental Location
by the Tenant Services Authority (TSA) and collects
information on vacant dwellings from registered social            Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice
landlords as at 31 March. However, the number of               (1) whether he plans to relocate (a) civil servants and
vacant dwellings recorded includes general needs dwellings     (b) Government bodies for which his Department is
only.                                                          responsible (i) out of London and (ii) to the West
   A table showing the number of vacant dwellings              Midlands; and if he will make a statement;         [8297]
owned by local authorities and Registered Social Landlords        (2) whether he plans to relocate (a) civil servants
in each local authority area as at 1 April 2009 and 31         and (b) Government bodies for which his Department
March 2009 respectively has been placed in the Library         is responsible (i) out of London and (ii) to the West
of the House.                                                  Midlands; and if he will make a statement.         [8421]
                   Repossession Orders
                                                                 Mr Kenneth Clarke: In the March 2010 Budget, the
                                                               Ministry of Justice was tasked with relocating 1,000
  John Healey: To ask the Secretary of State for               posts out of London with 500 posts expected to move
Communities and Local Government (1) what his                  outside the south-east of England. No final decisions
Department’s most recent estimate is of the number of          have yet been taken about the destination of any moves
repossessions in (a) 2010, (b) 2011 and (c) 2012;              or the number of posts to be relocated to specific
                                                               locations. The location of public sector activity and
  (2) what his Department’s estimate of the number of          plans for the Government’s estate will be considered
repossessions in (a) 2010, (b) 2011 and (c) 2012 was           alongside other public spending issues over the course
immediately prior to 6 May 2010.                [9643]         of the spending review.
   Grant Shapps: In the interests of transparency, on 20                     Departmental Official Cars
July I am publishing a report commissioned by the
previous Government yet never published on “Modelling
and Forecasting UK Mortgage Arrears and Possession”.             Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice
This report presents the findings of research that the         what his estimate is of the mileage travelled by each
National Housing and Planning Advice Unit commissioned         Minister in his Department in a Government car in (a)
from Professor John Muellbauer and Dr Janine Aron.             May and (b) June 2010.                            [8327]
The project developed a model aimed at improving our
understanding of the drivers of mortgage arrears and              Mr Blunt: I refer the hon. Member to the answer
possessions and to predict how arrears and possessions         given by my hon. Friend the Parliamentary Under-Secretary
may move over the next few years in different economic         of State for Transport (Mike Penning) on 13 July 2010,
scenarios.                                                     Official Report, column 624W.
   The report indicates that in a worst case scenario
there could be 175,000 repossessions by 2012. However                             Magistrates Courts
the coalition Government are committed to ensuring
that interest rates remain low for as long as possible.          Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for
This will be achieved by tackling the £155 billion deficit     Justice for what reason he proposes to merge Lambeth
which will help enable homeowners to stay in their own         and Southwark local justice area with Croydon and
homes and avoid repossession through ongoing lower             Sutton local justice area; and what consideration he
interest rates. The Government believe this measure will       has given to merging the former local justice area with
prevent repossessions better than any other individual         one geographically nearer.                        [8484]
   In addition, the Council for Mortgage Lenders forecast         Mr Djanogly: The rationale behind the proposed
for repossessions in 2010 remains at 53,000 but maybe          local justice area (LJA) mergers in London is set out on
lower.                                                         page nine of consultation paper HMCS CP 12/10.
                                                                  Although the potential reduction to the HMCS estate
                                                               provides a compelling reason for proposed LJA changes,
                                                               there is a wider context that relates to the need for
                     Courts: Closures                          HMCS to continue to be able to deliver an efficient
                                                               magistrates courts service in London to a good standard,
   Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for            at a lower cost.
Justice pursuant to the answer of 6 July 2010, Official           The LJA amalgamations being consulted upon are
Report, column 162W, on courts: closures, for what             not however just borne out of immediate necessity.
reason the target for actual court utilisation has been        HMCS has also considered the longer-term and believes
set at 80 per cent.; and what the target for planned           that the proposed nine LJA structure creates a strong
court utilisation is.                              [8486]
                                                               and flexible operational foundation upon which likely
   Mr Djanogly: A national utilisation rate of 80%             future estates and business strategies can be built.
allows sufficient capacity to accommodate fluctuations            In formulating the London LJA proposals, HMCS
in work load as well as capacity for courtroom time that       had regard to such issues as the wider estates strategy,
is unable to be used due to ineffective trials etc. while      the capacity within the courts in the area, the likely size
ensuring that the court estate is well utilised. There is no   of combined benches, transport links, projected workloads
target for planned court utilisation.                          and existing/historic operational connections.
45W                        Written Answers                              19 JULY 2010                             Written Answers                              46W

   Alternative amalgamations were considered. However                                (a) England and Wales, (b) England and (c) the West
it was concluded that the proposed South London LJA                                  Midlands in each year since 2000; and if he will make a
represented the optimal operational fit (when viewed                                 statement.                                        [8424]
across London as a whole), creating an LJA of a similar
size to others with reasonable transportation links between
the component boroughs. Account was also taken of
existing operational connections—the three existing LJAs,                               Mr Djanogly: The number of court proceedings processed
for example, have already established one judicial leadership                        in the magistrates courts in England and Wales, England,
group where the judiciary come together to make decisions                            and the West Midlands Local Criminal Justice Board
for the benefit of the three LJAs as a whole.                                        area, from 2007 to 2009, are given in the table. Statistics
                                                                                     are not available prior to 2007 on a comparable basis.
  Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice
how many cases were processed in magistrates courts in

                                         Completed court proceedings in the magistrates courts, England and Wales, 2007-09
                                                                      Total number of completed
                                                                            criminal proceedings        Total number of completed         Total number of completed
                                 Area                                       (including breaches)         non-criminal proceedings                  court proceedings

2007                             England and Wales                                     1,890,000                           870,000                         2,760,000
                                 England                                               1,766,000                           814,000                         2,581,000
                                 West midlands                                           133,000                             66,000                          199,000

2008                             England and Wales                                     2,031,000                           977,000                         3,008,000
                                 England                                               1,909,000                           917,000                         2,826,000
                                 West midlands                                            94,000                             47,000                          141,000

2009 (provisional)               England and Wales                                     1,909,000                           981,000                         2,890,000
                                 England                                               1,826,000                           933,000                         2,759,000
                                 West midlands                                           107,000                             66,000                          173,000
1. All figures are given to the nearest thousand.
2. Prior to 2007, data were collected from different administrative systems and are not directly comparable with those given in the table. For this reason, the table
shows the figures from 2007 only.
Completed Proceedings, HM Courts Service Performance Database (‘OPT’)

                     Magistrates Courts: Bradford                                    Court; and what estimate has been made of the number
                                                                                     of courtrooms such work will require.           [8483]
  Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice
pursuant to the answer of 6 July 2010, Official Report,                                 Mr Djanogly: The international jurisdiction work
column 165W, on magistrates courts: Bradford, what                                   referred to in my previous answer primarily comprises
the planned courtroom utilisation rate was in (a) Bradford                           hearings under the Extradition Act 2003.
and (b) Bingley magistrates court in the latest period                                  Part I of the Act deals with requests to extradite
for which figure are available; what the reasons were for                            foreign nationals brought to court following arrest under
not meeting that rate; and what estimate he has made of                              a European Arrest Warrant (EAW). Part II of the Act
the number of hours spent on trials which were classified                            deals with requests instigated by states not signatories
as ineffective which contributed to the under-utilisation                            to the treaty adopting Part I EAW proceedings. Workload
of each court in that period.                        [8487]
                                                                                     under both parts of the Act has been increasing significantly
                                                                                     over recent years and is set to continue to do so.
  Mr Djanogly: HM Courts Service does not have
planned court utilisation rates. For the financial year                                 A number of options for expansion at Camberwell
2009-10 the utilisation rate for Bradford was 64%. The                               Green have been developed, one of which includes an
reason that Bradford and Bingley (with an utilisation                                additional two courtrooms that would be used specifically
rate of 70%) did not reach a higher utilisation rate was                             to accommodate the increase in such applications.
due to an over supply of courtrooms as compared to
the work load.                                                                                     Magistrates Courts: Greater London
  HM Courts Service does not record the amount of
time spent on ineffective trials.                                                       Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice
                                                                                     pursuant to the answer of 6 July 2010, Official Report,
             Magistrates Courts: Greater London                                      column 167W, on magistrates courts: Central London,
                                                                                     what estimate HM Courts Service has made of the
  Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice                           likely sale price of Tower Bridge Magistrates Court;
pursuant to the answer of 6 July 2010, Official Report,                              whether any expressions of interest in purchasing the
column 167W, on magistrates’ courts: Greater London,                                 property have been received; and whether the property
what international jurisdiction work HM Courts Service                               is on the Statutory List of Buildings of Special Architectural
proposes to be heard at Camberwell Green Magistrates’                                or Historic Interest.                                   [8480]
47W                    Written Answers                         19 JULY 2010                     Written Answers                        48W

   Mr Djanogly: The last recorded valuation undertaken                  Total number of immediate custodial sentences of less than 12 months
in April 2009 estimates the potential sale value of the                 and suspended sentences for summary non-motoring offences, 2007-08
entire Tower Bridge site to be in excess of £4 million.                                                            Suspended       Immediate
                                                                                                                      sentence        custody
   HMCS is not aware of, nor has any recorded indication
of, receiving any expressions of interest in purchasing                 Kerb-crawling                                       25            43
the magistrates court.                                                  Offence by prostitutes                               3             0
   The property has grade 2 listed status.                              Public health offences                               2             0
                                                                        Railway offences                                     4            13
                       Prison Sentences                                 Motor vehicle licences                               0             1
                                                                        Stage carriage and public service                    1             0
                                                                        vehicles offences
  Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                        Sexual offenders—miscellaneous                       0             2
Justice pursuant to the answer of 6 July 2010, Official
                                                                        Begging                                              0             9
Report, columns 170-71W, on prison sentences, how
                                                                        Found in enclosed premises, possessing               6            60
many (a) immediate custodial sentences and (b)                          picklocks
suspended sentences were given for each category of                     Wild Birds Protection Acts                           1             1
summary non-motoring offences in each of the last two
                                                                        Video Recordings Act 1984                            0             1
years.                                           [8485]
                                                                        Drug offences                                        3            47
                                                                        Offences against Immigration Act 1971                3            53
   Mr Blunt: The requested information is provided in
                                                                        Other summary offences (excluding                  399           964
the following table.                                                    motoring)
   The most recent two years for which data are available               Total (summary excluding motoring)               7,266        13,275
is 2007-08. Data for 2009 will become available when
“Sentencing Statistics 2009” is published later in the
                                                                        Assault on a constable                           1,018         1,778
Total number of immediate custodial sentences of less than 12 months
                                                                        Common assault, etc.                             4,413         6,698
and suspended sentences for summary non-motoring offences, 2007-08
                                                                        Betting, Gaming and Lotteries                        4             8
                                           Suspended       Immediate
                                              sentence        custody   Brothel keeping                                     11            20
                                                                        Cruelty to animals                                  65            71
2007                                                                    Offences in relation to dogs                         6            10
Adulteration of food, drugs, etc.                    0             1    Education Acts                                      58            28
Assault on a constable                           1,157         1,927    Firearms Act 1968 and other firearms                30            32
Common assault, etc.                             3,991         6,161    acts
Betting, Gaming and Lotteries                        1             1    Fishery laws                                         0             2
Brothel keeping                                      5            10    Offences against public order                      637         1,382
Cruelty to animals                                  50            52    Interference with motor vehicle                     67           298
Offences in relation to dogs                        11            14    Stealing and unauthorised taking of a              117           691
Education Acts                                      63            22    conveyance
Financial offences                                   1             0    Aggravated vehicle taking—criminal                 163           350
                                                                        damage of £5,000 or under
Firearms Act 1968 and other firearms                45            51
acts                                                                    Impersonation, false or misleading                   0             1
                                                                        statements, failing to give information
Fishery laws                                         1             0
Nuisances, other than those caused by                0             1    Drunkenness, with aggravation                        7             6
vehicles                                                                Other offences against intoxicating                  1             3
Offences against public order                      646         1,220    liquor laws
Interference with motor vehicle                     51           326    Criminal damage, £5,000 or less, and               425         1,253
                                                                        malicious damage
Stealing and unauthorised taking of a              171           753
conveyance                                                              Social security offences                           133            31
Aggravated vehicle taking—criminal                 137           373    Offences under Army 1955 or Armed                    0             1
damage of £5,000 or under                                               Forces Act 1966
Indecent exposure                                    0             1    Disorderly behaviour                                 1             5
Drunkenness, simple                                  0             3    Other offences against certain local                 3             2
Drunkenness, with aggravation                        5             6    regulations
Other offences against intoxicating                  1             0    Kerb-crawling                                       20            42
liquor laws                                                             Public health offences                               1             0
Criminal damage, £5,000 or less, and               388         1,110    Railway offences                                     1            11
malicious damage                                                        Stage carriage and public service                    1             4
Social security offences                            90            38    vehicles offences
Offences under Army 1955 or Armed                    0             1    Sexual offenders—miscellaneous                       0             1
Forces Act 1966
                                                                        Unlawful possession                                  0             1
Reserve Forces Acts 1980 and 1996 (so                0             1
                                                                        Begging                                              0             1
far as they concern the naval and marine
forces)                                                                 Found in enclosed premises, possessing              11            55
Air Force Act 1955                                   1             0    picklocks
Disorderly behaviour                                 0             6    Wild Birds Protection Acts                           1             0
Other offences against certain local                 4             3    Video Recordings Act 1984                            0             2
regulations                                                             Drug offences                                        7            47
49W                      Written Answers                          19 JULY 2010                   Written Answers                       50W

Total number of immediate custodial sentences of less than 12 months          Mr Djanogly: The first-tier tribunal (social security
and suspended sentences for summary non-motoring offences, 2007-08          and child support) administers disability living allowance
                                           Suspended       Immediate        (DLA) appeals. The Tribunals Service is only able to
                                              sentence        custody
                                                                            provide figures from 2006-07. Prior to this, the Appeals
Offences against Immigration Act 1971                    6             40   Service, an agency of the Department for Work and
Other summary offences (excluding                      489         1,212    Pensions (DWP) was responsible for the appeals system.
motoring)                                                                   The DWP is unable to provide any data.
Total (summary excluding motoring)                   7,696        14,086      The cost of DLA appeals is shown in the following
Notes:                                                                      table:
1. These figures have been drawn from administrative data systems.
2. Although care is taken when processing and analysing the returns,
the detail collected is subject to the inaccuracies inherent in any large
scale recording system.                                                                     Costs of tribunal where   Costs of tribunal where
3. These data have been taken from the Ministry of Justice Court                               an award was made      an award was not made
Proceedings database. These data are presented on the principal
offence basis. Where an offender has been sentenced for more than           2009-10                      5,275,402                 9,603,787
one offence the principal offence is the one for which the heaviest         2008-09                      6,410,165                13,167,617
sentence was imposed. Where the same sentence has been imposed              2007-08                      7,657,723                12,831,279
for two or more offences the principal offence is the one for which         2006-07                      9,122,863                13,297,159
the statutory maximum is most severe.
4. Excludes data for Cardiff magistrates court for April, July, and
August 2008.
Justice Statistics—Analytical Services, Ministry of Justice.
                                                                                              PRIME MINISTER
                Prison Service: Ex-servicemen
                                                                                              Israel: Official Visits
  John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for
Justice (1) what protocols have been agreed between the                        Mr Amess: To ask the Prime Minister when he next
Prison Service and the Ministry of Defence on the                           plans to visit the state of Israel; and if he will make a
identification of service personnel in prisons since                        statement.                                          [8570]
1998;                                             [8127]
  (2) if Ministers in his Department will meet                                The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the
practitioners in the criminal justice system who                            answer I gave on 3 June 2010, Official Report, column
specialise in work with ex-service personnel to discuss                     99W.
the matter of ex-service personnel in prison.     [8128]
                                                                                      National Security Council: Meetings
  Mr Blunt: Prisoners are routinely asked for details of
their employment history as part of the prison induction                      Keith Vaz: To ask the Prime Minister (1) if he will
process. Prison assessment procedures have been revised                     place in the Library a copy of the agenda for the most
to include more specific questions to identify offenders                    recent meeting of the National Security Council; [9172]
who have served in the armed forces.
                                                                              (2) who attended the most recent meeting of the
  We continue to work closely with the Ministry of                          National Security Council.                        [9173]
Defence, voluntary and community sector organisations
and across Government to raise awareness among ex-service                     The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Member to the
personnel of the help and support available to them and                     press briefing given by my official spokesman on 26 May
their families while they serve their sentence and prepare                  2010. A copy of the transcript is available on the No. 10
for release.                                                                website at:
  A data processing agreement was formed in 2009 for                
the specific purpose of sharing and processing personal                       aftemoon-press-briefing-from-26-may-2010-51027
data from MOD and MoJ records in order to establish
the number of prisoners in England and Wales who
                                                                                               Official Hospitality
have formerly served in one of the UK armed forces.
This is estimated to be approximately 3% of the prison
population.                                                                    Pete Wishart: To ask the Prime Minister which
  The Ministry of Justice is also represented on the Ex                     guests have been invited to (a) Chequers, (b)
Service Offenders Working Group, which is chaired by                        Chevening House and (c) Dorneywood in each of the
the MOD.                                                                    last 12 months.                             [8429]

  Ministers will meet practitioners who specialise in                          The Prime Minister: A list of guests who have received
this work in the course of their duties.                                    official hospitality at Chequers is published on an annual
                                                                            basis and is available in the Library of the House.
           Tribunals: Disability Living Allowance                           Information for the financial year 2009-10 will be published
                                                                            in the usual way. The use of Chevening is a matter for
   Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for                        the Deputy Prime Minister, the Secretary of State for
Justice what the annual cost to the public purse of                         Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs and the trustees
tribunals for disability living allowance awards was                        who manage the estate. The use of Dorneywood is a
where an award was (a) made and (b) not made was in                         matter for the Chancellor of the Exchequer and the
each of the last five years.                    [9227]                      trustees who manage the estate.
51W                 Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  52W

                     Overseas Trade                                      Parliamentary Broadcasting Unit

  Nicholas Soames: To ask the Prime Minister whether
he intends to appoint a Minister with responsibility for        Mr Andrew Turner: To ask the hon. Member for
promoting British trade and industry abroad.       [9576]
                                                              Middlesbrough, representing the House of Commons
                                                              Commission what recent representations he has
                                                              received on the level of charges levied by the Board of
   The Prime Minister: I have made clear my views on          the Parliamentary Broadcasting Unit; and if the
the importance of increasing trade and investment to          Commission will review the effect of such charges on
secure a strong and sustained economic recovery. The          the ability of (a) Isle of Wight Radio and (b) other
Business Minister (Mr Prisk) has already been involved        small independent broadcasters’ to use short clips of
in promoting trade with countries in Asia and in developing   parliamentary business in news reports.           [8998]
relationships with investors and will be further supported
across Government.
                                                                 Sir Stuart Bell: No representations have been received.
                                                              Television coverage during the first 14 days is licensed
                                                              and distributed by PARBUL; television coverage after
      HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION                             14 days and all audio coverage is licensed and distributed
                                                              by the Parliamentary Recording Unit. The licensing
                      Food: Waste                             portion of the charge to broadcasters for the provision
                                                              of television coverage of parliamentary proceedings
                                                              after 14 days has now been ended, leaving only the
  Mrs Main: To ask the hon. Member for                        duplicating charge. This will give independent broadcasters
Middlesbrough, representing the House of Commons              easier access to parliamentary proceedings. Audio-only
Commission what recent estimate the House of                  content for broadcast radio use within the 14 day period
Commons Commission has made of the monetary                   will be treated in the same way.
value of the food not consumed from the House of
Commons in the last 12 months.              [7125]
                                                                              Poultry: Animal Welfare
  Sir Stuart Bell: The cost of food waste for the latest
period for which records are available, from April 2009
to March 2010, is estimated to be some £70,000, or              Luciana Berger: To ask the hon. Member for
approximately 4% of food cost. This is within industry        Middlesbrough, representing the House of Commons
norms.                                                        Commission whether any farms from which eggs are
                                                              sourced for the House’s catering outlets practise
             House of Commons: Buildings                      beak-trimming.                              [8974]

  Mr Knight: To ask the hon. Member for                         Sir Stuart Bell: All fresh eggs are sourced from British
Middlesbrough, representing the House of Commons              higher-welfare standard flocks assured under the RSPCA’s
Commission for what reasons the railings in New               Freedom Food scheme and the BEIC British Lion code
Palace Yard were painted during a period when the             of practice, where beak-trimming is carried out in
House was sitting; and for what reasons such work was         accordance with a code of best practice. Pasteurised egg
not scheduled to be carried out during the summer             products come from Belgium and are sourced from
recess.                                          [9093]       farms where beak trimming is carried out under the
                                                              German regulatory KAT scheme, which is an equivalent
  Sir Stuart Bell: The railings in New Palace Yard were       European scheme for high standards of welfare in animal
originally planned to be painted during the summer            husbandry.
recess, but this non-disruptive work has been brought
forward in view of the shortened time now available.
Other maintenance tasks in the area, which would                                       Security
disrupt business, will take place over the recess.

              House of Commons: Parking                         Mr Amess: To ask the hon. Member for
                                                              Middlesbrough, representing the House of Commons
                                                              Commission pursuant to the answer of 5 July 2010,
  Mr Knight: To ask the hon. Member for                       Official Report, column 1W, on departmental security,
Middlesbrough, representing the House of Commons              whether staff of Government departments who hold
Commission when the refurbishment of the ventilation          parliamentary passes may use each of the souvenir
system for the underground car park is scheduled to           shops on the House of Commons portion of the
(a) begin and (b) be completed.                [9095]
                                                              parliamentary estate; and if he will make a statement.
  Sir Stuart Bell: This programme is due to start in
early 2012 and is scheduled for completion in late 2013.
The programme requires a detailed survey, design and            Sir Stuart Bell: Staff of Government Departments
procurement processes before commencement. The                who hold parliamentary passes have access to each of
programme will be managed to ensure minimum impact            the souvenir shops on the House of Commons portion
on the users.                                                 of the parliamentary estate.
53W                       Written Answers                         19 JULY 2010                       Written Answers                          54W

                                                                                                                                           Cost (£)
                   Departmental Conferences                                                      NFA1           SFO2           CPS3           Tsol4

                                                                            2000-01                  —        175,465                —         88,800
   Robert Halfon: To ask the Attorney-General what                          2001-02                  —        212,298                —        183,000
estimate he has made of the expenditure of the Law                          2002-03                  —        225,010                —        197,000
Officers’ Departments on (a) organisation of and (b)                        2003-04                  —        191,879       4,820,000         246,000
attendance at conferences in each year since 1997.                          2004-05                  —        224,121       4,520,000         191,000
                                                                  [6124]    2005-06                  —        200,629       4,940,000         228,000
                                                                            2006-07                  —        189,715       5,090,000         279,000
  The Solicitor-General: The information requested is                       2007-08                  —        160,226       5,486,000         294,000
contained in the following table.                                           2008-09               4,925       216,445       5,849,000         385,000
                                                                            2009-10              44,714       160,052       5,552,000         293,000
                                                                      £     1
                                                                              The travel cost for 2009-10 reflects the full year impact of NFA
             Tsol, AGO           Serious       National          Crown      operations as it has grown in size and developed its programme of
Financial           and           Fraud           Fraud     Prosecution     work. The data cover all reported travel costs including flights, rail,
year         HMCPSI1             Office2      Authority3       Service4     car travel (mileage).
                                                                              The data include all costs for rail travel, air, car hire, mileage and
1997-98                  —          5,973              —               —
1998-99              8,029         10,517              —               —    3
                                                                              The figures provided from 05-06 include travel costs for the Revenue
1999-                6,622         13,596              —               —    and Customs Prosecution Service (RCPO) who merged with the CPS
2000                                                                        on 1 January 2010. The data are taken from the Financial Management
2000-01             41,355         24,525              —               —    System and are available only from 2003-04 onwards, data for earlier
                                                                            years could be obtained only at a disproportionate cost. The figures
2001-02             12,068         55,260              —               —
                                                                            include road, rail and air travel, and also charges for car hire. The
2002-03             12,468         45,181              —               —    2009-10 totals are subject to audit.
2003-04             19,505         19,170              —       1,262,298      Figures cover the amount spent by the Treasury Solicitor’s Department,
2004-05             21,958         78,800              —         983,860    Attorney-General’s Office and HM Crown Prosecution Service
                                                                            Inspectorate. The data prior to 1998-99 are not retained on the
2005-06             11,992         42,295              —       1,259,419
                                                                            Department’s accounting system, and could be obtained only at a
2006-07             16,953         79,675              —       1,287,949    disproportionate cost. HM Crown Prosecution Service Inspectorate
2007-08             16,463         28,628              —       1,096,130    was not included within the Department until mid-2001. The data
2008-09             22,667         36,977          3,826       1,110,876    cover all reported travel costs including flights, rail and car travel.
2009-10             12,721         26,956         80,360         905,259                          Terrorism: Detainees
  It is not possible to provide separate information for the costs of (a)
organising and (b) attending conferences, or information for earlier          Mr Raab: To ask the Attorney-General how many
years, without incurring disproportionate cost. The figures include
the costs of training events such as mandatory professional training        times the Crown Prosecution Service charged terrorist
for lawyers employed by the Department.                                     suspects under the threshold test in the Code for Crown
   The costs for the organisation of conferences are covered in the         Prosecutors in (a) 2007, (b) 2008 and (c) 2009; and
overall costs shown above and not recorded separately, an exact             how many times it has done so in 2010 to date. [8666]
breakdown could be determined only at a disproportionate cost.
  The NFA was established in 2008. In 2009-10, a series of events
including Regional Summits, Action Fraud presentations and NFA                 The Solicitor-General: According to their records, the
staff conferences (at external venues) were held by the NFA. The            Crown Prosecution Service used the threshold test to
Regional Summits, a series of one day events, were held in Newcastle,       charge 14 terrorist suspects in 2007, six terrorist suspects
Manchester and London (July 2009) and Brighton, Bristol, Birmingham         in 2008 and one terrorist suspect in 2009. No suspects
and Cardiff (December 2009). Figures are based on organisational            have been charged using the threshold test in 2010 to
and attendance costs. Providing additional information, such as travel
and subsistence, would be at a disproportionate cost.                       date.
  Information is only recorded centrally on the costs of organising the
main conferences that took place outside CPS buildings attended by
civil servants, figures for attendance costs and all information before
2003-04 could be determined only at a disproportionate cost. Figures           FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE
from 2006-07 also include expenditure by the Revenue and Customs
Prosecution Office (RCPO), which merged with the CPS on 1 January                                 Alexander Litvinenko
                       Departmental Travel                                    Mike Gapes: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                            Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether he has
   Graham Evans: To ask the Attorney-General how                            had recent discussions with the government of the
much (a) the Law Officers’ Departments and (b) their                        Russian Federation on the death of Alexander
agency spent on travel for their employees in each year                     Litvinenko.                                  [8775]
since 1997.                                       [7417]
                                                                              Mr Jeremy Browne: I refer the hon. Member to my
  The Solicitor-General: The information requested is                       answer to the right hon. Member for Rotherham (Mr
detailed in the following table.                                            MacShane) of 12 July 2010, Official Report, column
                                                               Cost (£)
                     NFA1           SFO2           CPS3           Tsol4       Mike Gapes: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                            Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what his policy is
1997-98                 —         130,393              —             —      on the (a) investigation of the death of Alexander
1998-99                 —         111,467              —         74,000     Litvinenko and (b) extradition of Andrei Lugovoi;
1999-2000               —         139,876              —         68,000     and if he will make a statement.             [8776]
55W                  Written Answers                    19 JULY 2010               Written Answers                  56W

  Mr Jeremy Browne: Following the investigation into                           Chevening Scholarships
the death of Alexander Litvinenko, the Crown Prosecution
Service on 22 May 2007 announced that it had found               David Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for
there is a case for Andrei Lugovoy to answer. He               Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many
therefore remains liable for prosecution in the UK for         candidates for Chevening scholarships in 2010-11 have
the murder of Mr Litvinenko.                                   not yet been informed of the outcome of their
                                                               application.                                     [9005]
       British Nationals Abroad: Sexual Offences
                                                                 Mr Hague: The Chevening scholarships scheme is
  Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Secretary of State for        managed through our posts around the world and so
Foreign    and     Commonwealth        Affairs    what         this information is not held centrally and is available
arrangements are in place between the Government               only at disproportionate cost. The situation is fluid. For
and foreign governments to share information on sex            example, some candidates who had applied for a Chevening
offenders who are British citizens.               [9693]       partnership scholarship may now be offered an award
                                                               funded fully by the partner and the university. Some
   Mr Jeremy Browne: UK law enforcement shares properly        candidates may be offered an award if other candidates
risk-assessed information with international law enforcement   are unable to accept theirs. Posts have been keeping
agencies through Interpol, when there is a lawful need         candidates as well informed as possible and expect all
to do so. This is considered on a case by base basis. The      applicants to have confirmation in the next few weeks.
responsibility for the Government’s work to tackle child                       Colombia: Trade Unions
sex crimes lies with the Child Exploitation and Online
Protection Centre, an arm of the Serious Organised
Crime Agency.                                                    Mr Iain Wright: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                               Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent steps
   Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Secretary of State for       his Department has taken to assist trade unions in
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what the role is of           Colombia.                                     [8263]
British embassies and consulates in the investigation
and arrest of British citizens in cases of alleged                Mr Jeremy Browne: The safety of trade unionists in
offences of child sexual abuse committed overseas; and         Colombia remains of great concern to us. Our embassy
if he will make a statement.                       [9695]      in Colombia continues to visit those who are under
                                                               threat and we make representations to the Colombian
   Mr Jeremy Browne: UK law enforcement in some                authorities in cases of violence or intimidation against
cases does have a presence overseas. The responsibility        trade unionists. We are also working with the UN on a
for the Government’s work to tackle child sex crimes           research initiative to help improve trade union human
lies with the Child Exploitation and Online Protection         rights protection and the development of positive labour
Centre—an arm of the Special Organised Crime Agency.           relations.
   British embassies and consulates have a consular role                      Guatemala: Human Rights
after the arrest of a British national. Full details of the
assistance we offer are available at:                            Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for      Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what steps his
  things-go-wrong/arrest                                       Department plans to take to ensure fulfilment of the
                                                               provisions of the UN resolution A/HRC/14/L.19 on
                          Burma                                enforced or involuntary disappearances, with
                                                               particular reference to Guatemala.             [7808]
  Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent                      Mr Jeremy Browne: The UK fully supports the need
discussions he has had with his overseas counterparts          to protect all people from enforced disappearance and
on the state of democracy in Burma.             [8832]         welcomes the adoption of the UN resolution, which
                                                               was co-sponsored by Guatemala.
   Mr Jeremy Browne: I raised Burma with Association              Human rights is a key priority for our embassy in
of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) Ministers at the            Guatemala City. We strongly support the work of the
EU-ASEAN ministerial meeting on 26 May 2010, at                International Commission Against Impunity in Guatemala,
which the Burmese Foreign Minister was present. I              which works to assist Guatemala investigate violent
made clear that there was no prospect of planned               criminal organisations believed to be responsible for
elections being free and fair while Aung San Suu Kyi           widespread crime and paralysis of the country’s judicial
and more than 2100 other political prisoners remained          system. The UK has funded a number of projects in this
in detention, and many opposition and ethnic groups            area, including with the Guatemalan Forensic Anthropology
were excluded from meaningful participation in the             Foundation, which brings forensic science to the task of
process. Burma was on the agenda of the G8 Summit              identifying the remains of people who disappeared
attended by my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister on         during the internal armed conflict.
27 June 2010, and the Summit Communiqué underlined
G8 leaders’ concern at the lack of progress towards                                   Hezbollah
democracy in Burma. The Government will continue to
raise Burma with international partners, and the issue           Andrew Gwynne: To ask the Secretary of State for
will be high on the agenda during my forthcoming visit         Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent
to south east Asia.                                            assessment he has made of the effectiveness of his
57W                  Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  58W

Department’s policy of         exploring contacts with                                  Kashmir
Hezbollah.                                             [8590]

                                                                  Andrew Stephenson: To ask the Secretary of State for
  Alistair Burt: Our embassy in Beirut held very limited        Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what steps his
contacts with Hezbollah politicians before May 2010.            Department is taking to support a bilateral solution to
We will be reviewing this issue, along with our wider           the situation in Kashmir.                         [9348]
Lebanon policy, in a careful and considered manner.
                                                                   Alistair Burt: We welcome the positive steps being
                      Horn of Africa                            taken by Pakistan and India to build trust and confidence
                                                                between their countries. The long standing position of
   Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for            the UK is that it is for India and Pakistan to find a
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs if he will convene             lasting resolution to the situation in Kashmir, one which
a summit in London to discuss the security situation in         takes into account the wishes of the Kashmiri people. It
the Horn of Africa.                               [8820]        is not for the UK to prescribe a solution or to mediate
                                                                in finding one.
   Mr Bellingham: The Government are very concerned
by the security situation in the Horn of Africa, particularly     Andrew Stephenson: To ask the Secretary of State for
Somalia. International partners met in May 2010 to              Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent
discuss the situation in Somalia at an international            discussions he has had with the government of (a)
conference in Istanbul. A further conference is due to          India and (b) Pakistan on Kashmir.               [9349]
take place in Spain this autumn. The Government
therefore have no plans to convene a summit in London              Alistair Burt: India and Pakistan are longstanding
at present.                                                     and important friends of the UK. We have many significant
                                                                links to both countries through Indian and Pakistani
                           Israel                               diaspora communities who live in the UK. We welcome
                                                                the positive steps being taken by India and Pakistan to
  Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign           build trust and confidence between both countries.
and Commonwealth Affairs what steps he (a) has                     We regularly discuss Kashmir with both Indian and
taken and (b) plans to take during the next 12 months           Pakistani Government officials and make clear our
at the UN on recognition by the UN of Israel as a               hope that they can make progress on the issue. But the
Jewish state; and if he will make a statement. [R]              long standing position of the UK is that it is for India
                                                       [8690]   and Pakistan to find a lasting resolution to the situation
                                                                in Kashmir, one which takes into account the wishes of
   Alistair Burt: A number of issues related to the             the Kashmiri people. It is not for the UK to prescribe a
Middle East are discussed on a monthly basis at the             solution or to mediate in finding one.
UN. We will continue to push for the full implementation
of UN Security Council Resolution 1860 which calls for            Andrew Stephenson: To ask the Secretary of State for
all the parties and the international community to achieve      Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent
a comprehensive peace based on the vision of a region           assessment he has made of the (a) economic and (b)
where two democratic states, Israel and Palestine, live         political situation in Kashmir.                  [9350]
side by side in peace with secure and recognized borders.
This has consistently been the UK position and the only
long-term solution to the Israeli-Arab conflict.                   Alistair Burt: Kashmir’s uncertain political future
                                                                affects its economic prospects and this impacts upon
                                                                investment and development opportunities on both sides
   Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign
                                                                of the Line of Control.
and Commonwealth Affairs what steps he has taken to
develop relations with the government of Israel since              The Governments of India and Pakistan are making
his appointment; what steps he plans to take on this            efforts to normalise their relations and this includes the
matter in the next six months; and if he will make a            situation in Kashmir. It is for the Governments of India
statement. [R]                                   [8746]         and Pakistan to determine the scope of their dialogue
                                                                but any solution on the issue of Kashmir should take
   Alistair Burt: The UK is in constant touch and dialogue      into account the wishes of the Kashmiri people. The
with the Israeli Government.                                    UK continues to call for an improvement in the human
                                                                rights situation on both sides of the Line of Control
   We remain determined to do everything possible to            and for an end to external support for violence in
work towards a two state solution that achieves a viable        Kashmir. Funding from the UK supports human rights,
and sovereign Palestinian state alongside a secure Israel,      conflict prevention, and peace building efforts on both
with its right to live in peace and security recognised by      sides of the Line of Control.
all its neighbours. The proximity talks that are under
way are more important than ever to help pave the way
towards a comprehensive peace in the region.                                          Kazakhstan
   My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister underlined
our commitment in his conversations with Israeli Prime            Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for
Minister Netanyahu and Palestinian President Abbas,             Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what aims and
and my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary has also         objectives the Government has set for UK foreign
made this clear in the House.                                   policy on Kazakhstan.                           [8895]
59W                  Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                  60W

   Mr Jeremy Browne: We want to strengthen our                    Alistair Burt: The security situation in southern Lebanon
relationship with Kazakhstan. Energy security and supplies,    remains calm but fragile. We remain extremely concerned
together with the corresponding trade and investment           by the recent attacks against UN Interim Force in
opportunities, are particularly important. But there are       Lebanon (UNIFIL) peacekeepers on 29 June, 3 July,
many other areas where we are working to enhance               and 4 July. The UK joined with other Security Council
co-operation. These include the financial and legal sectors,   members in agreeing a press statement which condemned
through language and vocational education links and            such attacks and made clear the need for UNIFIL to be
on nuclear counter-proliferation issues. We will also          afforded the freedom of movement and security necessary
continue to work closely with Kazakhstan on the broader        to fulfil its mandate. Prior to this period however, as the
international agenda. Not least through Kazakhstan’s           UN Secretary General makes clear in his latest report
important role this year as chairman-in-office of the          (13th) on UN Security Council Resolution (UNSCR)
Organisation for Security and Co-operation in Europe           1701, the security situation has been relatively quiet. I
(OSCE). We will continue to encourage and support              represented my concerns to the Lebanese Government
Kazakhstan to meet the human rights and political              during my visit to the region on 13-14 June 2010 and we
standards to which it is committed as a member of              hope for no repeat of this incident in the future.
organisations such as the UN and the OSCE.                        We are aware of reports of Israeli military activity
                                                               along the border with Lebanon as well as repeated
   Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                               violations of Lebanese airspace by Israeli overflights,
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what reports he
                                                               which continue to occur. We call on both Israel and
has received on steps taken by the government of
                                                               Lebanon to comply in full with UNSCR 1701 and to
Kazakhstan to meet its commitment to implement
                                                               work to maintain the existing stability.
reforms in respect of (a) media freedom, (b) religious
freedom, (c) internet law and (d) human rights,
                                                                 Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for
democratisation and legislative reform in the first six
                                                               Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what his most
months of its Chairmanship of the Organisation for
                                                               recent assessment is of the ability of the United
Security and Co-operation in Europe.              [8896]
                                                               Nations Interim Force in Lebanon to carry out its
   Mr Jeremy Browne: We are encouraged that the existing       peacekeeping duties in accordance with UN Security
parliamentary schedule in Kazakhstan includes draft            Council Resolution 1701.                       [9067]
legislation on accessibility to information, strengthening
the role of the Ombudsman and the creation of a                   Alistair Burt: The UN Interim Force in Lebanon
National Preventative Mechanism to oversee public              (UNIFIL) plays a vital and positive role in maintaining
monitoring of places of detention. But there remains           peace and security in southern Lebanon. However it
considerable room for improvement including in respect         faces a number of challenges, underlined by the recent
of freedom of religion, expression, assembly and of the        attacks on 29 June, 3 July, and 4 July against its
media, in particular legislation tightening state control      peacekeepers.
of the internet. There is also scope for improvement in           The UK has joined with other (P5) Security Council
the legislation on elections, political parties and local      members in agreeing a press statement which condemned
government enacted in February 2009. We and international      such attacks and made clear the need for UNIFIL to be
partners will continue to encourage the Kazakh authorities,    afforded freedom of movement and security necessary
both within and outside the framework of the Organisation      for it to fulfil its mandate.
for Security and Co-operation in Europe, to press ahead           I also represented these concerns to the Lebanese
with reforms, many of which they have identified as            Government, during my visit to the region on 13-14
necessary.                                                     June 2010 and we hope for no repeat of this incident in
                                                               the future.
   Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what discussions                          Overseas Students: Scholarships
he has had with his counterparts in the Organisation
for Security and Co-operation in Europe on the                   Mrs Hodgson: To ask the Secretary of State for
upholding of democratic principles by Kazakhstan               Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what estimate he
since his appointment.                            [8897]       has made of the cost to the public purse of British
   Mr Jeremy Browne: The UK consistently makes clear           Embassy bursaries for foreign students to study in the
the importance it attaches to the human dimension of           UK in the last 12 months.                        [2263]
the Organisation for Security and Co-operation (OSCE),
including in respect of the obligations to which Kazakhstan       Mr Jeremy Browne: The Foreign and Commonwealth
has committed itself. I will be discussing these issues        Office (FCO) funded four different award schemes in
during my visit to Almaty for the informal meeting of          financial year 2009-10. The provisional outturn on each
Foreign Ministers of the OSCE on 16-17 July 2010.              is as follows:
                                                                 Chevening scholarships: £18,761,108
           Lebanon: Peacekeeping Operations                      Chevening fellowships: £3,799,951
   Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for            Marshall scholarships: £2,218,151
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent                     Commonwealth scholarships: £1,076,521.
reports he has received on the security situation in             On 29 June my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary
South Lebanon, with particular reference to (a) recent         announced the FCO had reviewed programme spend.
attacks on United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon             The FCO will maintain a substantial programme of
patrols in the region and (b) Israeli military activity        scholarships to bring future decision takers and opinion-
along the Lebanese border.                       [9066]        formers to the UK, while professionalising our current
61W                   Written Answers                    19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                    62W

arrangements and targeting them on a smaller group of                       Palestinians: International Assistance
people. We will cut this year’s programme by £10 million
and seek (resources permitting) to sustain a smaller and            Mr Slaughter: To ask the Secretary of State for
more strategic programme in future years.                         Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs if he will make
                                                                  representations to the Israeli government to pay
                        Palestinians                              compensation for (a) loss of property, (b) damage to
                                                                  property, (c) physical injuries sustained and (d)
                                                                  psychological damage caused to British citizens on
  Andrew Gwynne: To ask the Secretary of State for                board the Gaza Freedom Flotilla and during their
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent                      subsequent detention by Israeli authorities.   [8554]
discussions he has had with (a) his US counterpart,
(b) his Israeli counterpart and (c) the Palestinian                  Alistair Burt: We do not normally pursue any loss or
Authority on measures to strengthen Palestinian                   theft of property either through seeking its return or
Authority security forces in the West Bank.   [8538]              through any legal claim. However, in light of the
                                                                  circumstances of this incident, we have exceptionally
                                                                  tried to assist the British nationals in seeking clarification
   Alistair Burt: Enhancing and strengthening the
                                                                  on, and the return of, their possessions.
Palestinian Authority Security Forces (PASF) continues
to remain a top priority for both the Palestinian Authority          Should those involved wish to recover property that
and the UK Government.                                            had allegedly been stolen, or seek compensation, we
                                                                  would advise the individual, or group, to appoint a local
   We work closely alongside the PASF and provide                 legal representative in Israel. They are best placed to
technical assistance aimed at improving the efficiency            advise them on the appropriate way forward in the
and professionalism of the security sector as a whole             country they are claiming in, or against. To assist them
including the civilian police and emergency services;             we are able to provide a list of English speaking, local
and direct class-room based training for the PASF. In             lawyers based in Israel. We would of course also advise
addition to this the UK has separate activity supporting          them to speak to the providers of their travel insurance.
policing, justice and the rule of law in the Palestinian
                                                                     If any British national has concerns about mistreatment
                                                                  while in detention we are able, with their permission, to
   We also work closely with the United States Security           raise it with the relevant authorities and ask for an
Co-ordinator (USSC) General Dayton. The USSC provides             independent investigation. I raised this with the returnees
advice and guidance to support PASF efforts at reform,            when I met them on 17 June 2010, and asked them to
within the context of the Roadmap and the two-state               write to us with the details of any mistreatment.
                                                                                    Russia: Human Rights
  Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign
                                                                    Mike Gapes: To ask the Secretary of State for
and Commonwealth Affairs what steps he has (a)
                                                                  Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what his most
taken since his appointment and (b) plans to take in
                                                                  recent assessment is of the human rights situation in
the next 12 months at the UN to deter Hezbollah
                                                                  the Russian Federation.                          [8777]
rearmament; and if he will make a statement.    [8688]
                                                                    Mr Jeremy Browne: We remain concerned about the
   Alistair Burt: During my visit to Beirut and Damascus          human rights situation in Russia. While we welcome
from 12-14 July 2010, I pressed the Governments of                the positive agenda set out by President Medvedev and
Syria and Lebanon to stop the re-arming of Hezbollah.             the limited reforms achieved so far, the situation on the
We continue to support the UN Interim Force in Lebanon,           ground has, in many areas, shown little sign of improvement.
and to press for the full implementation of UN Security           Attacks on human rights defenders and journalists, and
Council Resolution 1701 including through using our               ongoing abuses in the North Caucasus region, are of
position on the UN Security Council.                              most serious concern. There is still a low success rate in
                                                                  investigating and prosecuting such crimes, perpetuating
                                                                  a climate of impunity. Democratic space, civil society,
  Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign
                                                                  the media and freedom of assembly are constrained.
and Commonwealth Affairs what recent reports he has
received of stockpiling by Hezbollah of (a) weapons                 The Government will continue to work with Russia
and (b) missiles in South Lebanon; what recent                    on addressing ongoing human rights issues, including
discussions he has had with the government of                     through our bilateral human rights dialogue.
Lebanon on this issue; and if he will make a statement.                             South Africa: Football
                                                                    Gareth Johnson: To ask the Secretary of State for
   Alistair Burt: We are concerned by recent reports of           Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many British
weapons transfers to Hezbollah, including Hezbollah’s             nationals were arrested in South Africa during the
own claims that it possesses significant military capabilities.   period of the 2010 World Cup.                 [9876]
We continue to monitor information from all available
sources, but lack definitive figures. During my recent              Mr Jeremy Browne: As far as we are aware there were
visit to Lebanon I raised the issue with Lebanese PM              12 British nationals arrested in South Africa during the
Hariri and expressed the need that UN Security Council            World Cup. However, there may have been arrests of
Resolution 1701 is implemented in full, and that the              British nationals of which we were not informed, including
issue of Hezbollah disarmament be dealt with as a                 dual nationals.
priority.                                                           None of the arrests were for football related violence.
63W                 Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  64W

               Thailand: Sexual Offences                         Alistair Burt: The murder of WPC Fletcher was a
                                                              terrible crime and her family deserve to know the truth.
  Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Secretary of State for       The Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) has
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what his                     made it clear to the Libyan Government that this issue
Department’s response was to the Thai government’s            remains one of our key objectives.
decision to deport to the UK all known sex offenders             Ministers are and will continue to press the Libyan
who are British citizens.                         [9694]      Government on allowing the Metropolitan police (MPS)
                                                              to return. On 31 May 2010, the Foreign Secretary raised
   Mr Jeremy Browne: We understand that this is not a         the WPC Fletcher case with the Libyan Foreign Minister,
new decision. The Thai authorities are applying existing      Musa Kusa. I also raised the issue with Libyan Europe
legislation more rigorously to prevent criminals convicted    Minister Obidi on 15 July 2010.
of serious offences entering or staying in Thailand.             The FCO will provide all relevant assistance to the
They are targeting all serious criminals, regardless of       MPS, if required, including on applying for visas to
the country they have come from. Thailand’s immigration       travel to Libya when they are permitted to return to
policy and practice is a matter for the Thai authorities.     Libya.

                                                                    INDEPENDENT PARLIAMENTARY
  Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign            STANDARDS AUTHORITY COMMITTEE
and Commonwealth Affairs when he next plans to visit
Yemen.                                           [9170]                        Candidates: Manpower

  Alistair Burt: For security reasons we cannot disclose        Mr Winnick: To ask the hon. Member for
the travel plans of my right hon. Friend the Foreign          Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for
Secretary. I visited Yemen in June and intend to follow       the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
up my visit with a further trip later this year.              how many senior officials of the Independent
                                                              Parliamentary Standards Authority (IPSA) have been
  Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign        Parliamentary candidates; and what posts each of
and Commonwealth Affairs what the outcome was of              those has held in IPSA.                        [9405]
the recent visit to Yemen by the Parliamentary
Under-Secretary of State.                        [9171]         Mr Charles Walker: IPSA does not systematically
                                                              record this information. However, IPSA is aware that
   Alistair Burt: My recent visit to Yemen on 22 to 24        the Compliance Officer, Alan Lockwood, was a
June 2010, was my first trip to the region. I took the        parliamentary candidate in the general election of 2005.
opportunity to reassure my hosts that Yemen is a priority
for the new UK Government. I met President Saleh and                             ICT: Expenditure
a number of his senior ministers. My discussions focussed
on bilateral relations, the Friends of Yemen process and        Mr Jim Murphy: To ask the hon. Member for
economic reform and were productive, friendly and             Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for
encouraging.                                                  the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
   I explained that the UK remains committed to the           what the cost price to the Independent Parliamentary
process of assisting Yemen to tackle the sources of           Standards Authority is of the key fobs used to assist in
instability, chief among these being the decline of Yemen’s   the electronic processing of claims.              [9016]
economy. The UK and others agree that negotiating an
agreement with the International Monetary Fund (IMF)             Mr Charles Walker: The price of the key fob cannot
is vital in addressing the problems facing Yemen’s economy.   be separated from the cost of the security token, as they
I am pleased to learn that Yemen has now agreed to an         are purchased as one integrated device. The current cost
IMF programme, which will go to the IMF board for             to IPSA of the key fob and the integrated security token
approval later this month. It will be important to see a      is £75 plus VAT, inclusive of postage and packaging.
well-managed implementation of the programme, with            Replacement security tokens (where for example they
support from across the international community.              are lost or stolen) will be charged to the MP at cost
                                                              price. IPSA does not make a profit on the security
   I also discussed how the Friends of Yemen process          tokens.
could promote support for Yemen and its people and
how the UK could help take forward the process launched          This is a reduction on the original cost of replacement
at the meeting held in London in January 2010.                tokens, which was £127.58 plus VAT. IPSA has extended
                                                              its IT support contract to absorb the costs of set-up,
                                                              registration and testing, meaning the supplier does not
                     Yvonne Fletcher                          charge IPSA support costs per token when supplying
                                                              replacements. The cost to IPSA and to MPs now just
  Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for        covers the physical device and postage and packaging.
Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what steps he is
taking following his meeting with his Libyan                      Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
counterpart to seek to ensure that Libya grants visas to
Metropolitan Police officers to visit Libya to conclude         Mr Allen: To ask the hon. Member for Broxbourne,
their investigation into the killing of WPC Yvonne            representing the Speaker’s Committee for the
Fletcher.                                         [9072]      Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority what
65W                  Written Answers                      19 JULY 2010                   Written Answers                      66W

recent discussions the Speaker’s Committee for the                   Five Members have supplied the required information for a
Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority has                    travel card application. These cards have been ordered and will
had on the date on which he will first answer Questions              be available for collection imminently.
for oral answer on the committee’s responsibilities; and             Eight Members have not yet provided IPSA with the required
if he will make a statement.                       [9391]            details to order a travel card.
                                                                     Travel cards awaiting collection can be collected from
  Mr Charles Walker: The Speaker’s Committee for the               the IPSA Documentation Centre at 1 Parliament street,
IPSA agreed on 30 June that it would accept written                which is open every day from 9 am to 1 pm and 2 pm to
questions and that it also wished to accept Questions              4 pm, until 31 July 2010.
for oral answer. As the rota for oral questions is the
responsibility of Ministers, the Speaker, in his role as                                      Offices
Chair of the Committee, wrote to the Leader of the
House on 5 July requesting that questions to the hon.                Mr Winnick: To ask the hon. Member for
Member for Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s                  Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for
Committee, be included in the rota for oral questions.             the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
The Committee awaits a reply.                                      on what date the Independent Parliamentary
                Members’ Staff: Contracts                          Standards Authority proposes to close its office
                                                                   premises on the Parliamentary Estate; and what
  Mr Winnick: To ask the hon. Member for                           arrangements the Authority plans to make thereafter
Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for               for hon. Members to meet its staff at its premises.
the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority                                                                             [9003]
what the average time taken between the receipt for
approval of a proposed contract of employment of a                   Mr Charles Walker: The Documentation Centre at 1
member of staff of an hon. Member by the                           Parliament street is due to close on 30 July. After this
Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority and                  point IPSA will aim to provide one-to-one support for
the decision by the Authority on such a contract has               Members as required, for as long as there is a demand
been to date.                                  [9002]              for such a service.

  Mr Charles Walker: IPSA currently responds to requests                                   Publications
for approval of staff contracts within two working days
of receipt.                                                          Richard Burden: To ask the hon. Member for
                Members: Correspondence                            Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for
                                                                   the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
   Richard Burden: To ask the hon. Member for                      whether the rules and procedures of the Independent
Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for               Parliamentary Standards Authority preclude the
the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority                  authority from funding the preparation and
what guidance the Independent Parliamentary                        publication of hard copy reports on its activities other
Standards Authority provides to its staff on when                  than those providing details of how the Authority may
enquiries from hon. Members should be replied to (a)               be contacted.                                      [9499]
in writing and (b) by telephone.                [9469]
                                                                      Mr Charles Walker: IPSA has chosen to publish the
   Mr Charles Walker: IPSA’s staff are provided with its           majority of its information in email and online, as this
policy on this matter, which is that IPSA aims to answer           represents the best value for money for the taxpayer and
all queries which are received on the IPSA Information             is a quick and efficient way of disseminating information.
Line immediately over the telephone. Only where these              Its website contains detailed information for Members
queries are complex, give rise to advice on Members’               to read or print off, including a variety of training
specific circumstances that should be recorded, or give            presentations giving guidance on the online system. All
rise to issues which require further consideration, will           publications can be printed off by Members’ staff if
IPSA request that the query is submitted in writing.               they wish to read these in hard copy. In addition, its
Queries received by email or letter will be answered in            guidance to the scheme, FAQs and MP bulletins are
writing, except in cases which can be more quickly or              available in hard copy from the Documentation Centre
usefully resolved by telephone.                                    and Members’ Centre.
                                                                      IPSA currently intends to publish its statutory annual
                     Members: Travel
                                                                   report in hard copy, and has published all consultations
                                                                   in hard copy form.
  Mr Jim Murphy: To ask the hon. Member for
Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for
the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority                                       Telephone Services
how many hon. Members who have correctly
completed an application to the Independent                          Hugh Bayley: To ask the hon. Member for
Parliamentary Standards Authority for a travel card                Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for
have not received their travel card.           [9015]              the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority if
                                                                   the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
   Mr Charles Walker: The information requested is as              (IPSA) will make its staff available to advise hon.
follows:                                                           Members on the telephone in the evenings and at
  148 Members have not yet collected their travel cards from the   weekends during the same hours that the PICT service
  IPSA Documentation Centre in 1 Parliament street.                helpdesk is open.                             [9619]
67W                  Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                   68W

  Mr Charles Walker: IPSA is currently making a number            Gregory Barker: I am not aware of any specific
of changes to the IPSA Information Line—including               assessment that has been made of the contribution of
the recent installation of a new call handling system—which     the bioliquids sector to employment opportunities in
will enable it to deliver improvements to the level of          the renewable energy sector.
service which is being provided to MPs. At present,
IPSA has no plans to extend the operating hours of the                              Carbon Emissions
IPSA Information Line.
                                                                   Peter Aldous: To ask the Secretary of State for
                    Working Relations                           Energy and Climate Change what estimate he has made
                                                                of the potential financial savings to the public purse
                                                                attributable to steps taken to achieve the 10 per cent.
   Mr Winnick: To ask the hon. Member for
                                                                carbon reduction target for Government departments.
Broxbourne, representing the Speaker’s Committee for
the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
what recent consideration the Chair and Chief                     Gregory Barker: It is not yet possible to provide an
Executive of the Independent Parliamentary Standards            accurate estimate of the financial savings attributable
Authority have given to steps to improve working                the Government’s 10% emissions reduction target given
relations between the Authority and hon. Members.               the variables which will affect the amount and cost of
                                                                energy used by Government over this period, including
                                                                variations in weather and the cost of energy.
   Mr Charles Walker: The Independent Parliamentary
Standards Authority (IPSA) has taken and is taking                 Gregg McClymont: To ask the Secretary of State for
significant steps to work closely with Members in delivering    Energy and Climate Change what discussions he has
the new expenses scheme. In response to consultation            had with the (a) Sustainable Development Commission
responses and feedback from Members IPSA now offers             and (b) other environmental groups on monitoring
one-to-one assistance with the online system, cash flow         progressing towards achieving a 10 per cent. year-on-year
advances of up to £4,000 to help Members with legitimate        reduction in carbon dioxide emissions from the Government
expenses, and a contingency fund to help Members who            estate.                                              [9616]
are unable to keep within their budgets for this financial
year.                                                              Gregory Barker: My officials have corresponded with
   IPSA is also keen to develop further the suggestion of       staff in the Sustainable Development Commission regarding
a liaison group with the Leader of the House and other          the 10% reduction target. The working group established
interested Members. This will help to ensure that IPSA          to ensure the delivery of this emissions target includes
understands the varied working patterns of Members              expert representatives from the fields of sustainability
and that Members are able to access accurate information        and energy efficiency.
on IPSA and the Scheme. IPSA is keen to continue to
develop its relationship with Members and welcomes                 Gregg McClymont: To ask the Secretary of State for
comments and feedback sent to:                                  Energy and Climate Change whether the notional                          reductions in carbon dioxide emissions from the (a)
                                                                outsourcing of Government services and (b) sale of
                                                                Government buildings will be included in the target for
                                                                a 10 per cent. year-on-year reduction in the level of
        ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE                               carbon dioxide emissions from the central government
                                                                estate.                                           [9650]
                                                                   Gregory Barker: The 10% emissions reduction target
                                                                relates to direct emissions from the central Government
  Vernon Coaker: To ask the Secretary of State for              office estate. While outsourcing and rationalisation of
Energy and Climate Change (1) if he will consider steps         the Government estate can and will deliver towards the
to incentivise the production of bioliquids from (a)            10% savings, the ministerial working group established
waste cooking oil and (b) other waste products; [9368]          to ensure the delivery of this emissions target has indicated
  (2) if he will make it his policy not to support the          that is it not acceptable to deliver the savings on the
production of bioliquids from (a) virgin crops and (b)          basis of these alone. The aim is to deliver improvements
other sustainable sources.                        [9369]        in the way Government operates and procures, in order
                                                                to reduce Government’s demand for energy in a sustainable
   Gregory Barker: The renewables obligation supports           manner. The group has therefore agreed that there
the use of a range of biomass, including bioliquids, for        should be a mechanism to ensure that the target can be
the generation of electricity. The renewable energy directive   compared against any overall reduction in estate size or
sets criteria by which the sustainability of bioliquids         outsourcing, and Departments have been asked to provide
must be assessed and we are considering support for             regular data on their estate area and number of employees
bioliquids within this context. We will make further            in addition to their emissions.
announcements on these issues shortly.
                                                                  Gregg McClymont: To ask the Secretary of State for
  Vernon Coaker: To ask the Secretary of State for              Energy and Climate Change whether he intends to use
Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has                carbon offsets as part of his strategy to reduce the level
made of the contribution of the bioliquids sector to            of carbon dioxide emissions from the central
employment opportunities in the renewable energy                Government estate by 10 per cent. year-on-year in the
sector.                                        [9392]           next 12 months.                                     [9651]
69W                Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                   70W

  Gregory Barker: The Government do not intend to           microrenewable energy sources on community buildings;
use carbon offsets in order to meet the 10% emissions       and if he will make a statement.                [7112]
reduction target.
                                                               Gregory Barker: The previous grants programmes for
  Gregg McClymont: To ask the Secretary of State for        the installation of small scale renewable energy technologies
Energy and Climate Change against which baseline            have ended, including the Low Carbon Buildings
year the proposed 10 per cent. reduction in carbon          Programme (which closed to new applicants in May
dioxide emissions from the central Government estate        2010) and have been replaced by the feed-in tariff (FITs)
will be measured.                              [9652]       which is a tariff scheme not a grants scheme.
                                                               The feed-in tariffs (FITs) scheme, which was introduced
  Gregory Barker: The baseline year for the 10%             on 1 April this year, is a financial support scheme for
Government emissions reduction target will be 2009-10.      eligible low carbon electricity technologies aimed at
Officials will look to align that as closely as possible    small-scale installations up to a maximum capacity of 5
with the reporting year for the target which runs from      megawatts (MW). The scheme currently supports new
14 May 2010 to 14 May 2011.                                 anaerobic digestion, hydro, solar photovoltaic and wind
                                                            projects up to that 5 MW limit, by requiring electricity
  Carbon Reduction Commitment Energy Efficiency             suppliers to make payments to generators based on the
               Scheme: Academies                            number of kilowatt hours they generate. The scheme
                                                            will also support the first 30,000 micro combined heat
   Mr Anderson: To ask the Secretary of State for           and power installations with an electrical capacity of 2
Energy and Climate Change how new academy schools           kilowatts or less, as a pilot programme.
will be classified in the carbon reduction energy
efficiency scheme.                           [9224]                           Departmental Aviation

  Gregory Barker: Individual academies will be grouped        Gloria De Piero: To ask the Secretary of State for
with their Children’s Services Authority (formerly termed   Energy and Climate Change what flights he has taken
local education authorities) for CRC participation. This    on official duties since his appointment; and what the
applies equally to new and existing academies, and          purpose was of each such journey.                [8718]
ensures that such publicly funded schools are treated in
the same manner as maintained schools. It also ensures         Gregory Barker: As set out in the Ministerial Code,
that the CRC performance of a local authority is not        Departments will publish, at least quarterly, details of
artificially inflated through the change in a maintained    all travel overseas by Ministers. Information for the first
school’s status to an academy.                              quarter will be published as soon as it is ready.
              Climate Change Convention                        The Secretary of State took a flight to Aberdeen on
                                                            20 May 2010. The purpose of this visit was an introduction
                                                            to the DECC staff based in Aberdeen, attendance at the
  Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for        All Energy Exhibition and a company visit. All ministerial
Energy and Climate Change if he will support a second       travel is undertaken in accordance with the Ministerial
commitment period of the Kyoto Protocol.         [9772]
   Gregory Barker: Although a single treaty under the                        Departmental Buildings
UNFCCC remains our favoured outcome to the
international climate change negotiations, a second
commitment period of the Kyoto protocol under the              Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
right conditions could offer a solution to help move        Energy and Climate Change how much (a) his
forward. We are exploring what the implications of this     Department and (b) its non-departmental public
would be for the UK.                                        bodies spent on office refurbishment in each year since
                                                            its inception.                                    [7357]
                     Cloud Seeding
                                                               Gregory Barker: Department of Energy and Climate
                                                            Change and its non-departmental bodies spend on office
  Fiona Mactaggart: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                            refurbishment was:
Energy and Climate Change what his policy is on the
regulation of cloud seeding; what recent discussions he                                                             £000
has had with ministerial colleagues on cloud seeding;                                        FY2008-09         FY2009-10
and if he will make a statement.                  [8978]
                                                            (a) Department for Energy                 0             1,650
   Gregory Barker: The Department does not have a           and Climate Change
policy on the regulation of cloud seeding, which is a       (b) Non-departmental                    332              302
technique for changing the amount, type or distribution     public bodies
of precipitation. I have not had any discussions with
ministerial colleagues on cloud seeding.                               Departmental Electronic Equipment

              Combined Heat and Power                         Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                            Energy and Climate Change how much (a) his
  Mr Iain Wright: To ask the Secretary of State for         Department and (b) its non-departmental public
Energy and Climate Change what grants his Department        bodies spent on televisions in each year since its
provides to assist community groups to install              inception.                                  [7507]
71W                    Written Answers                19 JULY 2010                   Written Answers                      72W

   Gregory Barker: Department of Energy and Climate                       Departmental Public Expenditure
Change and its non-departmental bodies spend on
televisions was:                                                Mr Blunkett: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                              Energy and Climate Change pursuant to the written
                                                              ministerial statement of 26 May 2010, Official Report,
                               FY 2008-09        FY 2009-10
                                                              columns 2-3WS, on savings (2010-11), under what
(a) Department of                    880              8,400   budgetary headings the £85 million of savings allocated
Energy and Climate                                            to his Department will be made.                   [6827]
(b) Non-departmental                 617              1,808
public bodies
                                                                Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                              Energy and Climate Change from which of his
                                                              Department’s budget headings he plans to make the
                 Departmental Equality                        announced expenditure reductions totalling £85
                                                              million in 2010-11.                            [8596]
  Philip Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for
Energy and Climate Change how much has been spent                Gregory Barker: DECC will make the savings as
by his Department (a) in total and (b) on staffing            follows:
costs on promoting equality and diversity in each of            £4.8 million from administrative costs
the last three years; and how many people are                   £20.2 million from efficiencies across the Department’s delivery
employed by his Department for this purpose.    [5819]          bodies
                                                                £34 million from low carbon technology and business support
   Gregory Barker: The information requested is as              £26 million from other efficiency savings including from support
follows:                                                        for the Regional Development Agencies.
Total costs
   DECC does not record separate spending on promoting                          Departmental Training
equality and diversity. These costs could be obtained
only at disproportionate cost.
Staffing costs                                                  Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                              Energy and Climate Change how much his (a)
   The majority of the work on the promotion aspect of        Department and (b) its non-departmental public
equality and diversity was focused on creating and            bodies spent on training for its employees since its
publicising an interim equality and diversity strategy,       inception.                                     [7649]
establishing a Diversity Advisory Group, and starting
consultation on a Single Equality Scheme.
                                                                Gregory Barker: Department of Energy and Climate
   Individual costs are not available, and obtaining more     Change and its non-departmental bodies spend on training
detailed information could be obtained only at                was:
disproportionate cost.
Staff employed on promoting equality and diversity                                                                        £000
                                                                                                    FY 2008-09      FY 2009-10
   For the period 3 October 2008 (when DECC was
created) to 11 May 2009 there were no staff directly          (a) Department of Energy and                1,553             810
employed on promoting equality and diversity. This            Climate Change
function was included in a wider shared service arrangement   (b) Non-departmental public                 4,804           5,659
with the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills.       bodies

   From 11 May 2009 onwards this work has been
included in a wider policy remit for one member of                                Departmental Travel
staff. Equality and diversity work in total is estimated to
represent 20% of the total work, with promotion
                                                                 Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
representing less than 5%.
                                                              Energy and Climate Change how much his (a)
                                                              Department and (b) its non-departmental public
              Departmental Official Cars                      bodies has spent on travel for its employees in each year
                                                              since its inception.                                [7426]
   Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
and Climate Change what his estimate is of the mileage          Gregory Barker: Department of Energy and Climate
travelled by each Minister in his Department in a             Change and its non-departmental bodies spend on travel
Government car in (a) May and (b) June 2010. [8314]           was:

   Gregory Barker: The Government Car and Despatch
Agency do not collect data relating to the mileage                                              FY2008-09            FY2009-10
travelled by individual Ministers in a Government car.        (a) Department of                       1,291               2,327
   I refer the hon. Member to the answer provided by          Energy and Climate
my right hon. Friend the Parliamentary Under-Secretary
                                                              (b) Non-departmental                    2,617               2,369
of State for Roads and Motoring on 13 July 2010,              public bodies
Official Report, column 624W.
73W                 Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                  74W

                    Energy: Business                             Gregory Barker: The Government announced a refocused
                                                              and extended carbon emissions reduction target (CERT)
   Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for         on 30 June 2010, which is expected to provide benefits
Energy and Climate Change what plans his                      for at least 3.5 million households of all types by the
Department has to provide assistance to small and             end of 2012.
medium-sized enterprises to increase their energy                CERT will pave the way for a new Green Deal for
efficiency.                                     [8543]        households and business that will mark a dramatic
                                                              change in how we deliver improvements in the energy
   Charles Hendry: It is intended that small and medium-      efficiency of properties in the UK. Green Deal finance
sized enterprises (SMEs) will be eligible for the Green       will enable the provision of energy efficiency measures
Deal. The Green Deal will enable financing for energy         with no upfront costs. This has the potential to overcome
efficiency improvements at no up-front cost to the end        the cost barriers that may have prevented many landlords
user, with repayments via Energy Bills. In the Queen’s        taking action in the past.
Speech we committed to legislate in a first session
Energy Bill which should allow for the full Green Deal
to be available in 2012.                                                          Energy: Subsidies
   In the meantime practical and financial support is
available. DECC funds the Carbon Trust to provide               Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
advice for small businesses through a telephone advice        Energy and Climate Change how much (a) his
line, specific web tools and publications. They also          Department and its predecessors and (b) its non-
administer two financial support schemes which SMEs           departmental public bodies spent on subsidies for clean
can use for energy efficient investments: an interest free    coal production in each year since 1997.          [6213]
loan scheme, and the enhanced capital allowance scheme,
which provides businesses that invest in designated energy       Charles Hendry: The Department, its predecessors
efficient equipment with enhanced tax relief.                 and non-departmental public bodies have not provided
                                                              any subsidies for clean coal production. Between 1997
  Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for          and 2010 the Government spent £84.9 million on the
Energy and Climate Change what steps his Department           research and development of carbon abatement
plans to take to assist small and medium-sized enterprises    technologies, including carbon capture and storage (CCS).
to secure finance for low carbon energy projects that
have been granted planning permission.               [8593]
                                                                                     Fuel Poverty
   Gregory Barker: There are a number of ways in
which small and medium-sized enterprises can access
financial support for low carbon energy projects.               Dr Whitehead: To ask the Secretary of State for
   Businesses installing combined heat and power systems      Energy and Climate Change what date he has set for
benefit from climate change levy exemptions and enhanced      the eradication of fuel poverty in England and Wales.
capital allowances to help finance the capital investment
and operating costs. Projects that generate renewable
electricity can secure financial support for generation         Gregory Barker: The Government remain committed
through the renewables obligation and feed-in tariffs.        to doing all that is reasonably practicable to eradicate
                                                              fuel poverty in all households in England by 2016.
   The Carbon Trust currently supplies loans of £3,000
to £100,000 for SMEs across the UK to purchase energy           As fuel poverty is a devolved issue, the Welsh Assembly
efficient equipment. Repayments are linked to energy          Government are responsible for progress against their
bill savings and once the loan is repaid future savings       current target which is to do all that is reasonably
are kept by the business.                                     practicable to eradicate fuel poverty in Wales by 2018.
   The Government are committed to increasing the
amount of renewable heat in the UK; this is a crucial           Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
part of ensuring we meet our renewables targets, cutting      and Climate Change what steps his Department has
carbon and ensuring energy security. We are currently         taken towards the eradication of fuel poverty in 2010;
looking at the renewable heat incentive (RHI) proposals       what steps he plans to take in the first six months of
and look to make an announcement on the future of             2011; and if he will make a statement.           [8588]
the proposed scheme as soon as possible.
   In addition, the Government have committed to                 Gregory Barker: Government recently announced the
encouraging community-owned renewable energy schemes          extension of a more ambitious and targeted Carbon
where local people benefit from the power produced.           Emissions Reduction Target to December 2012, paving
We have also announced plans to set up a green investment     the way for the Green Deal. This extension will require
bank to help the UK meet the low-carbon investment            a significant and urgent increase in home energy insulation.
challenge.                                                    Through the extension we are requiring a greater focus
                                                              on helping low income households than ever before.
            Energy: Private Rented Housing                    This will result in the investment of over £400 million in
                                                              the most vulnerable GB homes.
   Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for            Approximately 175,000 households are expected to
Energy and Climate Change what steps his                      be provided measures which can provide a long-term
Department plans to take to improve energy efficiency         solution to fuel poverty. Many more will receive measures
standards in the private rented property sector. [8594]       which will protect them from falling into fuel poverty.
75W                  Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                  76W

   We have the powers to introduce mandated social             comment, and are assessed to be in accordance with
price support through the Energy Act 2010 and, subject         sustainable development by the host country. Responsibility
to the outcome of the spending review and consultation,        for assessment of sustainable development in the Clean
we intend to introduce the first scheme in 2011.               Development Mechanism (CDM) rests with the host
                                                               country, though projects may be reviewed by the CDM
  Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy           Executive Board for a failure to meet local environmental
and Climate Change what estimate he has made of the            assessment requirements, or for failure to consult
number and proportion of households in (a) Southend            stakeholders.
West constituency, (b) Essex and (c) England and                  The Government play a procedural role in approving
Wales which are in fuel poverty; what recent                   participation in CDM projects. When approving
representations he has received on this issue; and if he       participation in projects, the Government require
will make a statement.                             [8702]      confirmation that any proposed projects meet sustainable
                                                               development criteria as determined by the host countries,
   Gregory Barker: In 2006, the most recent year for           and confirmation that the project design document—
which sub-regional figures are available, there were around    including references to environmental assessment and
2,600 (7.1%) fuel poor households in the Southend              stakeholder comments—is correct before issuing any
West constituency, and 58,600 (8.5%) fuel poor households      letter of approval. We believe enforcement of the system
living in Essex.                                               is primarily a matter for the UN’s Clean Development
   In 2007, there were 2.8 million fuel poor households        Mechanism Executive Board, and the Designated
in England. The latest figure from the Welsh Assembly          Operational Entity—a third party auditor responsible
Government shows a projected figure of around 243,000          for validating the claims made in the Project Design
households in fuel poverty in 2006.                            Document, though false statements made in an application
   The new coalition Government are totally committed          to the Government can result in prosecution.
to helping the fuel poor. We welcome the useful                   Experience with projects in the forestry sector is
recommendations from the Fuel Poverty Advisory Group’s         limited—only 16 have been registered internationally
report and will respond to them fully. We must do more         and to date the Government have provided letters of
to help the most vulnerable to keep their homes warm           approval for four forestry projects in the Clean Development
at an affordable cost but it is clear that the old policies    Mechanism; one each in Chile, Colombia, Moldova
alone are not working effectively. We need to target           and India.
assistance at those most in need, promote energy saving
                                                                  Projects from the forest sector are not valid for
measures and greater competition in the energy market
                                                               compliance within the EU ETS, and other countries
to ensure that falling wholesale energy prices get passed
                                                               (many of which have detailed additional assessment
onto customers. We remain committed to doing all that
                                                               requirements) are the principle purchasers of credits
is reasonably practicable to eradicate fuel poverty in all
                                                               from this sector. The UK Government have not purchased
households in England by 2016.
                                                               credits from this sector.

               Fuel Poverty: Staffordshire                               Marine Renewable Deployment Fund

   Christopher Pincher: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                 Jo Swinson: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
Energy and Climate Change how many people resident
                                                               and Climate Change what funds his Department plans
in (a) Staffordshire and (b) Tamworth were classed as
                                                               to allocate to the Wave and Tidal Stream
being in fuel poverty in each year since 2005.      [9678]
                                                               Demonstration Scheme element of the Marine
                                                               Renewable Deployment Fund in (a) 2010, (b) 2011
   Gregory Barker: Fuel poverty is measured at household
                                                               and (c) 2012.                                    [9723]
level rather than at individual level.
   Sub-regional figures are not available for 2005. In
2006, the most recent year for which sub-regional figures        Gregory Barker: The Government are currently
are available, there were around 56,500 fuel poor households   considering options for marine renewable energy funding
living in the county of Staffordshire and around 4,000         as part of the comprehensive spending review.
fuel poor households in the Tamworth constituency.
                                                                         Nuclear Decommissioning Authority
                    Land Use: Forests
                                                                 Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for
  Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for             Energy and Climate Change what recent assessment he
Energy and Climate Change what his policy is on                has made of the Nuclear Decommissioning Authority’s
sustainability criteria for land use, land-use change and      report   Geological    Disposal:  Steps    Towards
forestry projects in the Clean Development                     Implementation.                                [8621]
Mechanism.                                           [8619]
                                                                  Charles Hendry: The Government welcome the Nuclear
  Gregory Barker: The Government are keen to ensure            Decommissioning Authority’s (NDA) report “Geological
that land use, land-use change and forestry projects           Disposal: Steps towards implementation”. We are
meet minimum sustainability and environmental criteria.        committed to the implementation of geological disposal
We support requirements within the Kyoto Framework             for higher activity radioactive waste, through safe and
designed to ensure all projects meet local environmental       secure interim storage and a geological disposal facility
assessment requirements, are subject to stakeholder            siting process based on voluntarism and partnership.
77W                  Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                 78W

   “Geological Disposal: Steps towards implementation”           Projects that could yield over 40 GW are at the
is a positive move forward; it is important that the NDA       “scoping stage” and have not yet submitted applications
set out its work programme and management arrangements         for consent.
to deliver geological disposal, as well as summarising           Time scales for the development of these sites will
the preparatory work undertaken so far.                        depend on a number of factors.
   The technical planning work undertaken by the NDA             The Government believe that offshore wind has an
compliments that ongoing in the wider process where            important role to play in meeting climate change targets
Government are working with the three communities to           and helping achieve energy security.
date that have ‘expressed an interest’ in finding out
more about what hosting a facility might involve. The
option for communities to ‘Express an Interest’ remains                   Renewable Energy: Feed-in Tariffs
open and DECC officials are available to answer questions
or advise any community who wishes to seek further
information.                                                     Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
                                                               and Climate Change what steps his Department is
                                                               taking to develop a public communications programme
                         Oil Rigs                              to encourage participation in his Department’s feed-in
                                                               tariff scheme.                                    [9535]
  Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for
Energy and Climate Change what assessment he made                Gregory Barker: The Department of Energy and
of the effectiveness of the use of acoustic triggers on        Climate Change provides information on feed-in tariffs
offshore rigs in his urgent review of the UK oil and gas       on its website at:
industry.                                          [8597]

  Charles Hendry: Safety issues are not within the             which also contains links to other bodies that are helping
scope of DECC’s review as they do not fall within the          to raise awareness of the scheme. Some of these include
responsibilities of this Department. These are matters         the Energy Savings Trust, the Carbon Trust and Ofgem.
for the HSE.                                                      The scheme has received extensive media coverage as
  The UK’s Oil Spill Prevention and Response Advisory          well as being widely promoted by energy suppliers and
Group (whose membership includes industry, DECC                those industries directly benefitting from the scheme.
and HSE) will however be considering relevant aspects             The scheme has been running since 1 April and we
of well design and control in their work to proactively        are continually collecting data on uptake in order to
identify and address cross industry issues concerning          feed into the review process.
well control and oil spill response on the UKCS. This
will include the effectiveness of blowout preventers and         Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
their triggering mechanisms.                                   and Climate Change what steps his Department is
                                                               taking to ensure that tariffs for renewable heat are
                    Renewable Energy                           completed by April 2011.                          [9537]

  Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for             Gregory Barker: I refer the hon. Member to the
Energy and Climate Change what steps his                       answer I gave my hon. Friend the Member for Sevenoaks
Department plans to take to encourage heavy energy             (Michael Fallon) on 15 June 2010, Official Report,
users in the industrial sector to invest in on-site            columns 367-68W.
renewable energy generation.                   [8592]

   Charles Hendry: There are existing financial incentives                   Renewable Energy: Housing
which aim to encourage on-site renewable electricity
generation including the renewables obligation and the           Mr Iain Wright: To ask the Secretary of State for
feed-in tariff. We are currently looking at these to see if    Energy and Climate Change if he will bring forward
there are ways of making them more effective. These            proposals to reduce the cost to households of installing
schemes are not specific to heavy energy users, but are        renewable sources of energy.                       [7111]
open to the whole industrial sector. We are also considering
how best to support the generation of renewable heat.             Gregory Barker: The feed-in tariff provides financial
                                                               support to encourage the uptake of small-scale, low
  Peter Aldous: To ask the Secretary of State for              carbon electricity generation.
Energy and Climate Change how much renewable
energy is planned to be generated in the UK from                  We are also looking at the renewable heat incentive
offshore wind over each of the next five years. [9329]         (RHI) proposals. Clearly there are benefits to the scheme,
                                                               but we must also consider the impact of the costs,
                                                               particularly given the financial constraints we must
  Charles Hendry: As at 6 July 2010, over a gigawatt           work within and the potential impact that funding
(GW) of offshore wind capacity has been installed. In          options could have on vulnerable people. We will look
addition:                                                      to make an announcement on the future of the proposed
  1.5 GW is under construction;                                scheme as soon as possible. The Government are committed
  the Government have granted consent for a further 2.6GW;     to increasing the amount of renewable heat in the UK,
  and                                                          this is a crucial part of ensuring we meet our renewables
  applications have been submitted for a further 2.3GW.        targets, cutting carbon and ensuring energy security.
79W                 Written Answers                 19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                   80W

  There is further direct support from energy suppliers,                   Warm Front Scheme: Essex
made available as part of meeting their CERT obligation.
Moreover, this support and the other measures we are
taking should bring down the costs of these technologies       Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
through learning and economies of scale.                    and Climate Change how much has been spent on the
                                                            Warm Front programme in (a) Essex and (b)
  Our core Green Deal offer is intended to support the
                                                            Southend-on-Sea in each year since its inception; and
move to more energy efficient homes.
                                                            what recent steps his Department has taken to (i)
  We expect Green Deal providers that insulate homes        encourage take-up of energy efficiency measures and
under the green deal will take the opportunity to offer     (ii) reduce the level of fuel poverty in Southend West
packages under the Green Deal umbrella that include         constituency.                                     [8703]
appropriate microgeneration.

           Renewable Energy: Job Creation                     Gregory Barker: The following table indicates funding
                                                            spent on energy efficiency measures by the Warm Front
                                                            Scheme in (a) Essex and (b) Southend-on-Sea in each
   Vernon Coaker: To ask the Secretary of State for         year since its inception1:
Energy and Climate Change what assessment he has
made of the opportunities for employment arising              The Warm Front Scheme started in 2000 however figures are
from the renewable energy industry.           [9400]
                                                            only available from 2005, which is when Eaga, the Warm Front
                                                            Scheme manager, took full control of the scheme.
  Gregory Barker: Estimates based on Innovas projections
and Labour Force survey data suggest that meeting our                                                                  £
EU 2020 renewable energy target, combined with a                                              Essex      Southend-on-Sea
growing market for renewable energy could contribute
to the creation of up to half a million jobs in the UK      2005-06                    2,000,189.00          1,057,290.72
renewable energy sector by 2020.                            2006-07                    6,182,784.13            960,161.12
                                                            2007-08                    9,468,843.84          1,009,969.25
           Renewable Heat Incentive Scheme                  2008-09                   12,165,333.14          1,123,994.96
                                                            2009-10                   18,863,847.71          1,462,541.32
                                                            Total                     48,680,997.82          5,613,957.37
  Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for
Energy and Climate Change when he expects to
announce his plans for the future of the renewable heat        There are a range of programmes that promote energy
incentive.                                        [8612]    efficiency measures including CESP, CERT and Warm
                                                            Front. We have also announced our intention to introduce
  Gregory Barker: I refer the right hon. Member to the      the Green Deal.
answer I gave on 15 June 2010, Official Report, columns       CESP targets designated low income areas across
367-68W, to my hon. Friend the Member for Sevenoaks         Great Britain with whole house energy efficiency retrofits.
(Michael Fallon).
                                                               We recently announced the extension of the Carbon
                                                            Emissions Reduction Target obligation on energy suppliers.
               River Severn: Tidal Power                    Suppliers will now have to work much harder to lag
                                                            lofts and walls and ensure more homes, especially low
  Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for         income households, receive measures that reduce fuel
Energy and Climate Change what progress has been            bills, improve thermal efficiency and cut carbon emissions.
made on the Severn Barrage Feasibility Study. [8657]
                                                               Warm Front provides heating and energy efficiency
   Charles Hendry: We are currently considering the         measures and advice to vulnerable households. The
recommendations from the Severn Tidal Power Feasibility     following table indicates the total number of households
Study and expect to report our conclusions shortly.         assisted by Warm Front in the Southend West constituency
                                                            in each year since its inception.
                      Tidal Power                                                                          Southend West

   Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy     2005-06                                                  354
and Climate Change what steps his department is             2006-07                                                  502
taking to develop the UK Marine Renewable Strategy,         2007-08                                                  547
with particular reference to funding for wave and tidal     2008-09                                                  665
technologies.                                      [9701]   2009-10                                                  497
                                                            Total                                                  2,565
  Gregory Barker: We are committed to the success of
the wave and tidal industry in the UK and to introducing       In addition, we have announced our intention to put
measures to encourage marine energy technologies. We        in place the legal framework needed for a Green Deal
are currently considering how creating a network of         that will provide energy efficiency improvements to
Marine Energy Parks can work to push the sector             homeowners at no up-front cost, with consumers repaying
forward.                                                    through the savings they make on their energy bills.
  The Government are currently considering options          This will mark a dramatic change in how we deliver
for marine renewable energy funding as part of the          improvements in the energy efficiency of properties in
comprehensive spending review.                              the UK.
81W                   Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                   82W

          Warm Front Scheme: Greater London                         Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000

                                                                    Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
   Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                                 and Climate Change how many officials in his Department
Energy and Climate Change how much has been spent
                                                                 at each pay band have responsibility for the (a) formulation
on the Warm Front programme in (a) Bexleyheath and
                                                                 and (b) implementation of policy on the Warm Homes
Crayford constituency and (b) the London borough of
                                                                 and Energy Conservation Act 2000; what posts in his
Bexley in each year since its inception; and what recent
                                                                 Department and its predecessors each such official has
steps his Department has taken to (i) encourage
                                                                 held; and if he will make a statement.                 [8686]
take-up of energy efficiency measures and (ii) reduce
the level of fuel poverty in Bexleyheath and Crayford               Gregory Barker: The Department has three officials,
constituency in the last three years.              [9402]
                                                                 supported by senior management, working specifically
                                                                 on the Fuel Poverty Strategy and the Warm Homes and
   Gregory Barker: The following table indicates funding         Energy Conservation Act. A further six officials manage
spent on energy efficiency measures by the Warm Front            the delivery of the Warm Front Scheme.
Scheme in (a) Bexleyheath and Crayford constituency                 In addition, other officials work on a range of policies
and (b) the London borough of Bexley in each year                within the Department that impact on fuel poverty,
since its inception1;                                            including domestic energy efficiency, the voluntary
  The Warm Front Scheme started in 2000 however figures are      agreement with energy suppliers, social price support
only available from 2005, which is when Eaga, the Warm Front     and data sharing. The officials have a range of experience
Scheme manager, took full control of the scheme.                 from working both inside and outside Government.

                                                    Spend (£)       Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
                           Bexleyheath and   London borough of   and Climate Change what recent discussions he has
                                  Crayford              Bexley   had with ministerial colleagues on the operation of the
                                                                 Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000; and
2005-06                         130,526.00          499,898.96
                                                                 if he will make a statement.                      [8706]
2006-07                         366,531.83        1,059,696.46
2007-08                         399,561.79        1,031,686.11     Gregory Barker: My right hon. Friend the Secretary
2008-09                         413,674.34        1,175,349.69   of State has regular meetings with ministerial colleagues
2009-10                         280,679.84          964,285.95   on a wide variety of topics.
Total                         1,590,973.80        4,730,917.17
                                                                   Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy
   There are a range of programmes that promote energy           and Climate Change what recent assessment he has
efficiency measures including CESP, CERT and Warm                made of the operation of (a) section 1 and (b) section
Front. We have also announced our intention to introduce         2 of the Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act
the Green Deal. CESP targets designated low income               2000; what recent representations he has received on
areas across Great Britain with whole house energy               the operation of the Act; and whether he plans (i) to
efficiency retrofits.                                            amend and (ii) to repeal this Act.               [8708]

   We recently announced the extension of the Carbon               Gregory Barker: The latest report by my right hon.
Emissions Reduction Target obligation on energy suppliers.       Friend the Secretary of State on the steps taken to
Suppliers will now have to work much harder to lag               implement the fuel poverty strategy required by Section
lofts and walls and ensure more homes, especially low            2 of the Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act
income households, receive measures that reduce fuel             2000 was published in October 2009. A copy of the
bills, improve thermal efficiency and cut carbon emissions.      report can be found on the Department’s website at:
   Warm Front provides heating and energy efficiency   
measures and advice to vulnerable households. The                1_20091021091505_e_@@_UKFuelPovertyStrategy7AnnReport09.pdf
following table indicates the total number of households           We have received representations on the definition of
assisted by Warm Front in the Bexleyheath and Crayford           fuel poverty from three parties.
constituency in the last three years.                              There are no plans at the current time to amend or
                                                                 repeal this Act.
Bexleyheath and Crayford                              Number
                                                                                     Wind Power: Ports
2007-08                                                   316
2008-09                                                   277
                                                                    Edward Miliband: To ask the Secretary of State for
2009-10                                                   225    Energy and Climate Change what plans he has for
Total                                                     818    development of ports to support offshore wind
                                                                 infrastructure.                                 [8756]
   In addition, we have announced our intention to put
in place the legal framework needed for a Green Deal               Gregory Barker: The Government are committed to
that will provide energy efficiency improvements to              the development of UK manufacturing to support the
homeowners at no up-front cost, with consumers repaying          growing offshore wind sector. Funding for offshore
through the savings they make on their energy bills.             wind ports infrastructure has not been selected for
This will mark a dramatic change in how we deliver               suspension or cancellation as part of the recent cost
improvements in the energy efficiency of properties in           cutting exercise, but as with all public spending it is
the UK.                                                          being reviewed in the context of the spending review.
83W                  Written Answers                     19 JULY 2010                    Written Answers                         84W

                         HEALTH                                   Mr Simon Burns: The following table shows the cost
                                                                to the national health service in England of treating
                Alcoholic Drinks: Misuse                        non-elective (unplanned) admissions for shock and
                                                                anaphylaxis in the last five years for which information
                                                                has been collected. Information is not separately available
  Dr Wollaston: To ask the Secretary of State for               for anaphylaxis.
Health whether he has made an estimate of the likely
cost to the NHS of treating alcohol-related health                                                                  Total cost £ million
conditions in (a) 2015 and (b) 2020.           [8879]
                                                                2004-05                                                              1.1
   Anne Milton: No estimate has been made of the cost           2005-06                                                              1.1
to the national health service of treating alcohol-related      2006-07                                                              1.4
health conditions in 2015 and 2020. We plan to publish          2007-08                                                              1.4
a White Paper on public health the autumn, which will           2008-09                                                              1.6
consider how to prevent future increases in ill health          Notes:
from alcohol misuse and associated costs.                       1. Figures taken from schedule 4 (NHS trusts and primary care trusts
                                                                (PCTs) combined) of the national schedules of reference costs for the
                                                                financial years 2004-05 to 2008-09 published at:
   Dr Wollaston: To ask the Secretary of State for    
Health what the cost to the NHS was of treating                 2. Total costs are the number of finished consultant episodes (FCEs)
alcohol-related health conditions in each of the last 10        and the number of excess bed days multiplied by their national
years.                                             [8880]       average unit costs.
                                                                3. Figures are not comparable between years because:
                                                                (a) 2004-04 to 2005-06 costs were collected on Healthcare Resource
   Anne Milton: The information requested can be provided       Group version 3.5 (HRGv3.5) and include HRG code S26 Shock and
only at disproportionate cost. However, in 2003 the             Anaphylaxis.
annual cost of alcohol misuse to the national health            (b) 2006-07 to 2008-09 costs were collected on Healthcare Resource
                                                                Group 4 (HRG4) and include HRGs WA16W Shock and Anaphylaxis
service in England was quantified at £1.4 billion—£1.7          with complications or comorbidities and WA16Y Shock and Anaphylaxis
billion in 2001 prices Cabinet Office (2003), Alcohol           without complications or comorbidities
misuse: how much does it cost? Available at:                    (c) 2004-05 to 2006-07 costs include non-elective in-patients and          observation wards and 2007-08 to 2008-09 costs include non-elective
  alcohol_misuse/background.aspx                                in-patients long and short stay.
                                                                4. The diagnosis codes from the International Classification of Diseases
  A more recent estimate of £2.7 billion per year for           10th revision (ICD-10) classification system which group to these
2006-07 was published in Cost of alcohol harm to the            HRGs are:
NHS, Department of Health, 2007. Available at:                  (a) T63.0 Toxic effect of snake venom
                                                                (b) T63.2 Toxic effect of venom of scorpion    (c) T63.4 Toxic effect of venom of other arthropods
  en/Consultations/Closedconsultations/                         (d) T63.5 Toxic effect of contact with fish
  DH_086412?PageOperation=email                                 (e) T63.6 Toxic effect of contact with other marine animals
                                                                (f) T63.8 Toxic effect of contact with other venomous animals
   Dr Wollaston: To ask the Secretary of State for              (g) T63.9 Toxic effect of contact with unspecified venomous animal
                                                                (h) T75.0 Effects of lightning
Health what recent research he has evaluated on the             (i) T75.4 Effects of electric current
effects on the level of alcohol consumption of (a) price        (j) T78.0 Anaphylactic shock due to adverse food reaction
and (b) availability of alcohol.                   [8881]       (k) T78.2 Anaphylactic shock, unspecified
                                                                (l) T79.4 Traumatic shock
                                                                (m) T80.5 Anaphylactic shock due to serum
   Anne Milton: The Coalition programme for government          (n) T81.1 Shock during or resulting from a procedure NEC
includes a commitment to review alcohol taxation and            (o) T88.2 Shock due to anaesthesia
pricing, to ensure it tackles binge drinking without            (p) T88.6 Anaphylactic shock due adverse effect of correct drug or
unfairly penalising responsible drinkers, pubs, and important   medicament properly administered
local industries. Her Majesty’s Treasury and the Home              Jo Swinson: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
Office will jointly lead the review. It will report in the      how many emergency cases of anaphylaxis were treated
autumn and will take account of recent research.                in NHS hospitals in each of the last five years. [9312]
   The National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence
issued public health guidance, Alcohol-use disorders:             Mr Simon Burns: The following table shows the
preventing the development of hazardous and harmful             number of emergency admissions where the primary
drinking in June. This report, which is available at:           diagnosis was anaphylactic shock, also known as
                                                                anaphylaxis. The number of admissions does not represent
                                                                the number of patients as a patient may have been
was based on a series of effectiveness reviews, which           admitted more than once.
summarise and assess the evidence from research, including
research on the availability of alcohol. This will be                                           Emergency finished admission episodes
considered by the Department over the coming months.
                                                                2004-05                                                      2,759
              Anaphylaxis: Health Services                      2005-06                                                      2,984
                                                                2006-07                                                      3,180
                                                                2007-08                                                      3,299
  Jo Swinson: To ask the Secretary of State for Health          2008-09                                                      3,509
what estimate he has made of the cost to the public             Source:
purse of treating emergency cases of anaphylaxis in             Hospital Episode Statistics, The NHS Information Centre for health
NHS facilities in each of the last five years.   [9311]         and social care
85W                  Written Answers                    19 JULY 2010                   Written Answers                      86W

             Anger Management Treatment                            Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
                                                                 how much funding for the Change4Life programme he
  Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health            expects to be raised from the food industry.     [9023]
how much his Department has spent on anger
management treatment for (a) women and (b) men in                   Anne Milton: How much funding the food industry
each of the last five years.                    [8732]           will contribute to the Change4Life campaign has yet to
                                                                 be discussed with representatives from food companies.
  Mr Burstow: The provision and funding of local                 Discussions will be taking place over the coming months
health services, including anger management, is a matter         to consider how funding arrangements will be developed
for local decision. We do not collect these figures centrally.   from the existing support provided.
                                                                                  Departmental Buildings
              Ashfield Community Hospital
                                                                   John Mann: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
  Gloria De Piero: To ask the Secretary of State for             how many buildings his Department occupies in (a)
Health what plans his Department has for the future of           London and (b) the UK.                          [6853]
Ashfield Community Hospital.                     [8659]
                                                                    Mr Simon Burns: The Department occupies five buildings
  Mr Simon Burns: It is for Nottinghamshire county               in London. It wholly occupies Richmond House, Skipton
primary care trust to improve community services to              House, and Wellington House and partly occupies New
ensure they provide modern, personalised, and responsive         Kings Beam House and Eastbourne Terrace. The
care of a consistently high quality that is equally accessible   Department occupies a total of 16 buildings in the
to all patients.                                                 United Kingdom which includes the London buildings
                                                                 listed above and additionally wholly occupies Hexagon
                     Autism: Children                            House (Exeter), Vantage House (Leeds) and Units 8
                                                                 and 9Hi Tech Village (Newcastle) and partially occupies
   Paul Maynard: To ask the Secretary of State for               Quarry House (Leeds), Premier Buildings (Nelson,
Health if he will take steps to ensure that child and            Lancashire), Premier House (Reading), Castle View
adolescent mental health services are able adequately            House (Runcorn), Hembury House (Exeter), Princes
to meet the needs of children with autism through (a)            Exchange (Leeds), Prospect House (Redditch), and 1
availability of specialist autism support and (b) autism         Whitehall (Leeds) .
training for all staff working in such services.    [8377]          The response includes buildings occupied by staff in
                                                                 NHS Connecting for Health. In addition the Department
   Mr Burstow: Staff working in Child and Adolescent             has a number of staff in located in each on the Government
Mental Health Services (CAMHS) should have the                   Offices of the Regions.
necessary values, competencies, skills, and ongoing training
to enable them to recognise and respond to the identified                            Depressive Illnesses
needs of children, including those with autism. We are
looking at what might need to be done to ensure CAMHS               Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
offer proper support to those with autism spectrum               what percentage of (a) women and (b) men aged (i)
disorders.                                                       under 19, (ii) between 19 and 35 and (iii) over 35 years
                                                                 who were diagnosed with depression were subsequently
               Baby Care Units: Standards                        referred to talking therapies and mutual support
                                                                 groups in each of the last five years.             [8731]
  Mrs Grant: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
how his Department assesses the quality of services                 Mr Burstow: Although the Department does not
provided by maternity units.                    [9518]           collect these statistics centrally, we do have access to the
                                                                 most recent Psychiatric Morbidity Survey (2007) figures.
  Anne Milton: The Care Quality Commission is the                This provides data around the numbers of people with a
independent regulator of health and adult social care in         common mental health disorder (CMD) by age and
England and is therefore responsible for assuring the            gender. It also provides this information by historic
safety and quality of services provided by maternity             intervals. The following tables indicate the relevant data
units.                                                           for the years 1993, 2000 and 2007:
                                                                   Prevalence of CMD in past week in 1993, 2000 and 2007—Men
                 Change4Life Programme                                                                                  Percentage
                                                                                   Aged 16-34         Aged 35-44           All men

  Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for Health           1993                      11.5             12.8             11.9
what factors he took into account on his decision to             2000                      12.3             16.1             14.6
end his Department’s funding for the Change4Life                 2007                      13.8             15.0             13.6
programme.                                       [9019]
                                                                  Prevalence of CMD in past week in 1993, 2000 and 2007—Women
  Anne Milton: The Department will continue to provide                                                                 Percentage
funding for the Change4Life campaign. The amount of                                Aged 16-34         Aged 35-44        All women
taxpayers’ money spent on Change4Life will be scaled             1993                      20.0             19.8             19.1
back to focus on the core business of extending the              2000                      21.2             21.1             20.4
campaign’s reach and effectiveness.
87W                    Written Answers                      19 JULY 2010                     Written Answers                        88W

 Prevalence of CMD in past week in 1993, 2000 and 2007—Women         1
                                                                      Antidepressants have been defined as those products included in
                                                      Percentage     British National Formulary (BNF) chapter 4.3 (antidepressant
                  Aged 16-34         Aged 35-44        All women     drugs).
2007                       22.6             19.5             21.5
                                                                     Prescribing Cost Analysis
   Prevalence of CMD in past week in 1993, 2000 and 2007—All
                                                  All (percentage)                                             Net ingredient cost (£000)

1993                                                         15.5    2005                                                       338,546.7
2000                                                         17.5    2006                                                       291,511.4
2007                                                         17.6    2007                                                       276,107.6
Source:                                                              2008                                                       247,355.1
Adult Psychiatric Morbidity Survey, 2007                             2009                                                       230,062.9
   We do not collect data to indicate the proportion of
these individuals who are subsequently referred to talking             Information on the number and net ingredient cost of
therapies. However, we do know that from October                     antidepressant prescription items dispensed in the
2008 to March 2010 the Improving Access to Psychological             community by primary care trust has been placed in the
Therapies (IAPT) programme received 765,491 referrals.               Library.
If the numbers referred for treatment continue to increase             Information on the gender of people with a current
at the current rate in excess of 1.65 million people will            diagnosis of depression and information on the numbers,
be referred for talking therapies by March 2011. This is             age and gender of people prescribed a medicine and the
in line with the plans to see 900,000 people in the first            condition for which a medicine is prescribed, is not
three years of the programme. In year two, we have                   collected centrally.
launched a further 111 sites and by 2011, we expect all
152 primary care trusts to begin to be implementing an
IAPT service. Information on the number of people                                             Drugs: Misuse
accessing psychological therapy services in primary and
community settings was not collected centrally prior to                 Andrew Griffiths: To ask the Secretary of State for
the IAPT programme.                                                  Health what definition the National Treatment Agency
                                                                     for Substance Misuse uses of the term dependency in
   Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health               its official publications.                       [8751]
what percentage of (a) women and (b) men aged (i)
under 19, (ii) between 19 and 35 and (iii) over 35 years               Anne Milton: The National Treatment Agency for
who are registered with a GP have been treated for                   Substance Misuse uses the World Health Organisation’s
depression by each primary care trust in each of the                 definition of dependency, which is contained in the
last five years.                                   [8736]            International Statistical Classification of Diseases and
                                                                     Related Health Problems (ICD-10):
   Mr Burstow: We do know that as of April 2010
                                                                         “A cluster of behavioural, cognitive, and physiological phenomena
765,000 referrals had been made to Improving Access                  that develop after repeated substance use and that typically
to Psychological Therapies services, with 321,000 people             include a strong desire to take the drug, difficulties in controlling
going on to enter the service. The most recent prevalence            its use, persisting in its use despite harmful consequences, a higher
rates for common mental health disorder as recorded by               priority given to drug use than to other activities and obligations,
the Psychiatric Morbidity Survey in 2007 is 17.6% (of                increased tolerance, and sometimes a physical withdrawal state.”
the adult population aged 16 to 64).                                   This definition is also used in the United Kingdom
   The information requested is not collected centrally.             guidelines on clinical management of drug misuse and
                                                                     dependence and by the National Institute for Health
   Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health               and Clinical Excellence.
(1) how many and what percentage of (a) women and
(b) men aged (i) under 19, (ii) between 19 and 35 and                                  Eating Disorders: Finance
(iii) over 35 years who were diagnosed with depression
were prescribed anti-depressants by each primary care
trust in each of the last five years;              [8737]              Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
   (2) what proportion of people aged (a) under 19,                  how much his Department spent on treatment for
(b) between 19 and 35 and (c) over 35 years who were                 eating disorders with regard to (a) women and (b)
diagnosed with depression were female in the latest                  men in each of the last five years.             [8743]
period for which figures are available;            [8738]
                                                                       Mr Burstow: The commissioning of services, including
   (3) how much each primary care trust spent on                     those to address self-harm is a local issue for primary
anti-depressants for (a) women and (b) men aged (i)                  care trusts and strategic health authorities. We do not
under 19, (ii) between 19 and 35 and (iii) over 35 years             collect this information centrally.
in each of the last five years;                    [8739]
   (4) how much his Department has spent on                                                  Food: Labelling
anti-depressants for (a) women and (b) men in each of
the last five years.                               [8742]
                                                                        Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
   Mr Burstow: Information on the net ingredient cost                what representations he has received (a) for and (b)
of antidepressant prescription items1 dispensed in the               against the inclusion of traffic light warnings on labels
community in England for the period requested is shown               for food and drink since May 2010; and if he will make
in the following table.                                              a statement.                                       [9022]
89W                  Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                     Written Answers                         90W

   Anne Milton: Three letters have been received regarding       Revenue allocations were first made to PCTs in 2003-04.
traffic light labelling on food products. All were in          Prior to 2003-04, revenue allocations were made to
favour of traffic light labelling. No representations have     health authorities (HAs).
been received against the use of traffic light labelling on      A table, setting out allocations per head to HAs from
food products.                                                 2000-01 to 2002-03, and to PCTs from 2003-04 to
                                                               2010-11, has been placed in the Library.
                  General Practitioners
                                                                                      Hospitals: Parking
   Mr Blunkett: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
(1) what estimate he has made of the number of
managerial and administrative staff who will be                   Charlotte Leslie: To ask the Secretary of State for
employed to operate the GP consortia proposed in the           Health how many car parking spaces at NHS hospitals
White Paper proposals for new commissioning; and if            in each region are available for use by (a) managerial
he will make a statement;                          [8996]      staff, (b) members of the public, (c) consultants and
   (2) whether his Department plans to provide funding         (d) other clinical staff.                        [9475]
for capital expenditure to establish the GP consortia
proposed in the White Paper proposals for new                     Mr Simon Burns: The information is not available in
commissioning; and if he will make a statement. [8997]         the format requested.
                                                                  Data on car parking spaces provided by the national
   Mr Simon Burns: The White Paper, “Equity and                health service are collected centrally through the Estates
Excellence: Liberating the NHS”, published on 12 July          Returns Information Collection (ERIC). These data are
2010, sets out our intention to devolve power and              provided on a voluntary basis by NHS foundation
responsibility for commissioning services to local consortia   trusts and will therefore not be complete. The latest
of general practitioner (GP) practices. To support GP          available data for 2008-09 are provided as follows by
consortia in their commissioning decisions, we will also       strategic health authority (SHA):
create an independent NHS Commissioning Board.
   We will shortly issue a document setting out our                                                   Total parking
                                                                                             Total            spaces    Total parking
proposals in more detail. This will provide the basis for                                 disabled     available for           spaces
fuller engagement with primary care professionals, patients    Strategic health           parking          patients/     available for
and the public. It is therefore too early at this stage to     authority                   spaces1          visitors2           staff3
say what this means for the numbers of managerial and
administrative staff employed to operate the GP consortia.     East Midlands                  1,843             18,156         23,917
                                                               East of England                2,096             20,200         29,274
   Thus plans for funding for capital expenditure for GP
                                                               London                         2,279             18,492         29,525
consortia have not yet been made.
                                                               North East                     1,063             13,547         16,485
                Health Services: Children                      North West                     4,082             35,204         48,512
                                                               South Central                  1,564             15,103         22,002
                                                               South East Coast               1,438             11,827         19,952
  Meg Munn: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
                                                               South West                     1,779             18,118         26,982
which organisations will assume the regulatory and
                                                               West Midlands                  2,864             21,396         36,532
policy functions of primary care trusts in respect of
                                                               Yorkshire and                  2,357             22,558         31,430
safeguarding children after the abolition of primary           the Humber
care trusts.                                    [9464]
                                                               The ERIC data definitions used were:
                                                                 Total disabled parking spaces.
  Anne Milton: The White Paper, “Equity and Excellence:        Total number of disabled car parking spaces available within the
Liberating the NHS” sets out our strategy for reforming        organisational grounds for disabled staff and visitors.
the national health service and a timetable of action to         Total parking spaces available for patients/visitors
achieve it. The Health Bill to be introduced in the            Total number of car parking spaces available for use by patients and
                                                               visitors within the organisational grounds, inclusive of relevant
autumn will detail which organisations will assume the         disabled parking spaces.
functions of primary care trusts, including those in           3
                                                                 Total parking spaces available for staff
respect of safeguarding, once they are abolished.              Total number of car parking spaces available for use by staff within
                                                               the organisational grounds, inclusive of relevant disabled parking
                Health Services: Finance                       spaces.
                                                                 The information provided has been supplied by the
  Charlotte Leslie: To ask the Secretary of State for          NHS and has not been amended centrally. The accuracy
Health how much funding his Department allocated               and completeness of the information is the responsibility
per head to acute care in each of the primary care trust       of the provider organisation.
review areas in each year since 2000.              [8683]        The provision of hospital car parking is decided
                                                               locally by individual trusts to best support their services.
  Mr Simon Burns: Revenue allocations cover hospital
and community health services, prescribing (the Drugs                             Kingston Hospital: Finance
Bill) and, since 2006-07, primary medical services. The
Department does not break down primary care trust
(PCT) allocations by policy or by service area. PCTs             Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for
make decisions on investment in health care for their          Health what plans his Department has for the (a)
communities, taking into account both local and national       future and (b) future funding of Kingston Hospital.
priorities.                                                                                                                   [9220]
91W                  Written Answers                  19 JULY 2010                  Written Answers                    92W

   Mr Simon Burns: We are informed by NHS London                        Mental Health Services: Waiting Lists
that there are no plans for significant changes to Kingston
hospital.                                                         Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
   The Department does not allocate funding directly to        what the average waiting times for talking therapies
hospitals. Revenue allocations are made to primary care        were for (a) women and (b) men aged (i) under 19, (ii)
trusts (PCTs), and it is for PCTs to commission services       between 19 and 35 and (iii) over 35 years in each of the
from hospitals and other providers to meet the health          last five years.                                   [8734]
care needs of their local communities, taking account of
national and local priorities.                                    Mr Burstow: A key aim of the Improving Access to
   This Government will devolve power and responsibility       Psychological Therapies (IAPT) programme is to improve
for commissioning services to the health care professionals    access to talking therapy services. This entails reducing
closest to patients: general practitioners and their           levels of unmet need and waiting times for services for
consortiums.                                                   people who do come forward and seek treatment. The
                                                               intention of the IAPT programme is to provide rapid
            Medical Consultants: Sick Leave                    access for assessment and treatment for people with
                                                               diagnosable conditions. While the waiting times standards
   Charlotte Leslie: To ask the Secretary of State for         to be achieved by each service are locally derived (and
Health how many medical consultants were recorded              therefore locally collected), national best practice indicates
as taking stress-related leave in each region in each year     that the end-to-end waiting time from referral to treatment
since 2000.                                          [8682]    commencing should be no more than four weeks.
                                                                                 Mental Health: Death
   Mr Simon Burns: This information is only available
from local national health service organisations. If medical
consultants are on the national pay scale they can be             Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
identified on the Electronic Staff Records System (ESR)        what research has been undertaken to establish the
but there is no standard reporting tool to enable extraction   average age of death for people with severe mental
of national ESR data on sickness absence by reason.            illness in England since publication of the 2006
                                                               Disability Rights Commission report, Closing the Gap.
              Medical Records: Databases                                                                               [8537]

  Dr Wollaston: To ask the Secretary of State for                Mr Burstow: We are unaware of any research which
Health what his most recent estimate is of the cost of         has been undertaken in this field, however we recognise
the summary care records programme.              [6109]
                                                               that this is a serious problem. We expect to address it in
                                                               our future plans for public health.
  Mr Simon Burns: I refer the hon. Member to the                                Mental Health: Patients
written answer I gave the hon. Member for Haltemprice
and Howden (Mr David Davis) on 5 July 2010, Official
                                                                  Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
Report, column 44W.
                                                               what the rates of readmission of mental health
                 Mental Health Services                        in-patients within (a) 30 days and (b) 90 days were in
                                                               each primary care trust in each of the last three years.
  Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health                                                                  [8555]
what percentage of GP consultations held with (a)
                                                                 Mr Burstow: The information requested is not collected.
female and (b) male patients aged (i) under 19, (ii)
between 19 and 35 and (iii) over 35 years were related                     Mental Health: Psychotherapists
to common mental disorders in each of the last five
years.                                           [8730]
                                                                 Mr Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
                                                               what plans there are to extend access to psychological
  Mr Burstow: This is information is not collected             therapies recommended by the National Institute for
centrally.                                                     Health and Clinical Excellence to people with severe
                                                               mental illness who are not eligible for treatment
   Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health         through the Improving Access to Psychological
(1) how much talking therapies have cost each primary          Therapies programme.                             [8553]
care trust in each of the last five years;       [8735]
   (2) how much each primary care trust spent on                  Mr Burstow: The Government set out in the Coalition
cognitive behavioural therapy for (a) women and (b)            agreement, ‘our programme for government’, a commitment
men aged (i) under 19, (ii) between 19 and 35 and (iii)        to ensure greater access to talking therapies to reduce
over 35 years in each of the last five years.    [8740]        long-term costs for the national health service. This is a
                                                               clear public health priority for us and we are currently
  Mr Burstow: At a national level the Government have          working to identify how best to take it forward.
invested significant resources as part of the Improving           Revised National Institute for Health and Clinical
Access to Psychological Therapies programme. This              Excellence (NICE) guidance on schizophrenia was
investment was £33 million in 2008-09, £103 million in         published in March 2009. This outlines the best way to
2009-10 and £173 million in 2010-11. The £173 million          treat and manage adults with schizophrenia in primary
per annum funding will be recurrent following the end          and secondary care. The guidance recommends that
of the current comprehensive spending review period.           treatments such as cognitive behavioural therapy should
  These data are not centrally collected.                      be offered to all people with schizophrenia.
93W                 Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                   94W

   Psychological therapies can be a key element of the           A wide range of services known as intermediate care
treatment of people with severe and enduring mental           are offered to help people recuperate after an in-patient
health conditions, particularly when these conditions         stay with a view to, wherever possible, enabling the
are experienced alongside depression and anxiety disorders.   individual to continue to live independently in the
In these cases, the delivery of cognitive behavioural         community. Where appropriate, some or all of the
therapy and other NICE-compliant therapies is the             intermediate care package may include a time-limited
recommended treatment. Services for these clients is          stay in a care home.
largely provided by psychology departments in specialist         The Community Care (Delayed Discharges, etc.) Act
mental health trusts. The implementation of Improving         2003 placed new duties on the NHS and councils relating
access to Psychological Therapies services for people in      to joint working between health and social care systems
community settings with mild to moderate conditions           and with patients and carers around hospital discharge.
can reduce the number of referrals to specialist mental       Councils were allocated an extra £100 million a year to
health trusts and enable them to focus on providing           defray the cost of reimbursement. To the extent that
services to those with severe and enduring mental illness.    they are able to reduce delays they can retain any cash
   General practitioners or consultant psychiatrists can      “saved” from the £100 million to invest in new services
prescribe any medicine or treatment which they consider       locally.
to be necessary for treating NHS patients, including             We have made no assessment of the effects of delayed
NICE-approved treatments, provided that the local primary     discharges from hospital on local authority and private
care trust or NHS trust agree to supply it on the NHS.        sector elderly care homes.
Clinicians are responsible for deciding on the most
appropriate form of treatment for their patients, and in                    NHS: Employment Agencies
doing so they are expected to take NICE guidance fully
into account. The Department does not become involved           Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
in making clinical decisions.                                 what his policy is on the practice of NHS staff working
                                                              as agency staff in the same hospital in which they are
                    NHS: Discharges                           employed by the NHS.                               [8045]

                                                                Mr Simon Burns: There are no national policies,
   Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Health         which prevent staff from legitimately working for both
(1) what his estimate is of the cost to the NHS of            the national health service and a private agency at the
delayed discharges in each year since 1997;        [8673]     same NHS trust.
   (2) what assessment his Department has made of the           It is for local NHS organisations to plan and deliver a
effect of delayed discharges in the NHS on (a) cost to        workforce appropriate to the needs of their local population,
the NHS, (b) waiting times for operations and (c) the         based on clinical need and sound evidence.
incidence of hospital-acquired infections in the most           The appropriate use of agency staff and effective
recent period for which figures are available; and if he      management of agency costs is a high priority in the
will make a statement.                             [8675]
                                                              NHS, and the Department and NHS Employers will
                                                              shortly be issuing joint guidance to NHS organisations
   Mr Burstow: We have made no estimate of the cost to        on the best practice use of flexible staff.
the national health service of delayed discharges, or the       We will be looking into this matter carefully.
effect these delays have on waiting times for operations
and the incidence of hospital-acquired infections.                           Nutrition: Health Education
   Since 5 January 2004, if social services are solely
responsible for a patient being delayed in hospital, the        Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
local authority is liable to pay the NHS a charge per day     on what conditions food and drinks companies will be
of £100 (£120 in London and certain areas of the South        engaged to provide funding for new programmes on
East) for the delay.                                          food and health.                                 [9018]

   Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Health            Anne Milton: The conditions under which food and
(1) what steps his Department is taking to reduce the         drinks companies will be engaged to provide funding
number of delayed discharges in the NHS;          [8674]      for new programmes on food and health have yet to be
                                                              finalised. Discussions will be taking place over the
   (2) what steps his Department is taking to work with       coming months to consider this issue.
those local authorities which operate care homes for
the elderly to reduce the number of delayed discharges           Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
in the NHS; and if he will make a statement;      [8691]
                                                              (1) whether he has received recent indications of
   (3) what recent assessment his Department has made         interest in funding health education programmes from
of the effects of delayed discharges from hospital on         food and drinks companies;                        [9020]
(a) local authority and (b) private sector elderly care          (2) what recent meetings he has had with
homes in (i) England and (ii) Southend on Sea. [8692]         representatives of food and drink companies to discuss
                                                              health education programmes; and when each such
  Mr Burstow: Since 5 January 2004, if social services        meeting was held.                                 [9021]
are solely responsible for a patient being delayed in
hospital, the local authority is liable to pay the national     Anne Milton: The Secretary of State for Health has
health service a charge per day of £100 (£120 in London       not received any recent indications of interest nor had
and certain areas of the South East) for the delay.           any recent meetings with representatives of food and
95W                  Written Answers                   19 JULY 2010                   Written Answers                      96W

drink companies to discuss health education programmes.                                   Self-harm
We intend to meet with representatives and other partners
in the coming weeks and months to discuss their                    Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
contribution to improving public health.                        if he will assess the merits of a cross-departmental
                                                                Government strategy to reduce the incidence of
                    Obesity: Children                           self-harm, including the provision of (a) training for
                                                                front-line staff and (b) information and education
                                                                services; and if he will make a statement.       [9030]
  Nicky Morgan: To ask the Secretary of State for
Health what his policy is on the role of schools on
                                                                   Mr Burstow: We will be assessing our priorities carefully
engaging parents in discussions on their children’s
                                                                and will announce details on mental health policy, in
weight.                                        [9357]
                                                                due course. Our focus will be on making services patient-led,
                                                                based on the best clinical evidence, responsive to patients’
   Anne Milton: As part of the National Child Measurement       choice and management of their own care, and delivering
Programme (NCMP), primary care trusts (PCTs) are                best ‘health’ outcomes.
currently responsible for weighing and measuring children
                                                                   The national health service will be backed with increased
aged four-five years and 10-11 years, informing parents
                                                                real resources yet we recognise that there are still efficiencies
about their child’s results and providing follow-up advice
                                                                to be made, however, we intend to make sure front-line
and support to parents. Schools do not receive data that
                                                                services in the NHS as a whole are protected from cuts.
would enable them to identify the results for an individual
                                                                   Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
   In March this year, the Department of Health and             if he will discuss with Ministerial colleagues in the
Department for Education issued guidance to schools,            devolved administrations the merits of jointly-agreed
“Healthy Weight, Healthy Lives: National Child                  public health strategy to address self-harm; and if he
Measurement Programme Guidance for Schools 2010/11”.            will make a statement.                           [9086]
This guidance states the purpose of the programme and
what schools can do to support the programme. It also              Mr Burstow: We will be assessing our priorities carefully
provides details of additional material which might be          and will announce details on mental health policy,
helpful for explaining the NCMP to children and parents/        including self-harm, in due course. Our focus will be on
carers.                                                         making services patient-led, based on the best clinical
   The guidance explains that schools may want to use           evidence, responsive to patients’ choice and management
the NCMP as a tool to help engage pupils and parents/           of their own care, and delivering best ‘health’ outcomes.
carers in whole school activities and programmes that              The national health service will be backed with increased
support a healthy weight. A copy of the guidance has            real resources yet we recognise that there are still efficiencies
been placed in the Library.                                     to be made, however, we intend to make sure front-line
   Schools can request feedback on the results of the           services in the NHS as a whole are protected from cuts.
programme for their school from the PCT. However
schools will not receive raw data. This is because small                             Self-harm: Finance
numbers of children in the school mean that school-level
analysis of obesity prevalence is unreliable. There is also        Kate Hoey: To ask the Secretary of State for Health
a risk that individual children may be identified, especially   how much each primary care trust spent to address self
where data is broken down by sex or ethnicity.                  harm with regard to (a) women and (b) men aged (i)
   Schools will usually receive school-level feedback           under 19, (ii) between 19 and 35 and (iii) over 35 years
that shows how prevalence of overweight and obesity             in each of the last five years.                    [8741]
compares with their local or regional average, for example,
whether the prevalence of obesity at the school is higher         Mr Burstow: The commissioning of services, including
than or lower than the local or regional average. This          those to address self-harm is a local issue for primary
approach maintains the confidentiality of individual            care trusts and strategic health authorities. We do not
children’s result.                                              collect this information centrally.

                     Patients’ Rights                                                  Tobacco: Sales

   Andrew Gwynne: To ask the Secretary of State for               Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for
Health what steps he plans to take to increase the              Health what plans he has for the further regulation of
information available to NHS patients to enable them            tobacco vending machines.                         [8975]
to make choices about their treatment programmes.
                                                       [9214]     Anne Milton: Provisions already in place in the Health
                                                                Act 2009 and related regulations will prohibit sales of
  Mr Simon Burns: The White Paper ‘Equity and                   tobacco products from vending machines from 1 October
Excellence: Liberating the NHS’, published on 12 July           2011.
2010, set out the Government’s plans for an information           However, discussions are taking place across Government
revolution in the national health service. The Information      to decide how best to tackle smoking prevalence in the
Strategy, which will be published later this year, will         context of our focus on public health and our priorities,
provide further detail on how the Government plan to            given the challenges facing business competition and
implement the changes set out in the White Paper.               costs.
97W                  Written Answers                19 JULY 2010                 Written Answers                   98W

   Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for            Tim Loughton: Details of the amount spent on televisions
Health what plans he has to remove tobacco displays          in each year since 1997 by the Department for Education,
from the point of sale.                        [8976]        its predecessors and all NDPBs are unable to be provided
                                                             within the requested deadline as this would incur
  Anne Milton: Provisions already in place in the Health     disproportionate costs.
Act 2009 and related regulations will prohibit tobacco          The amount spent on televisions within the Department
displays in large shops from 1 October 2011 and in           for Education and its predecessors within the last three
small shops from 1 October 2013.                             years is £19,912.
  However, discussions are taking place across Government
to decide how best to tackle this issue in the context of                   Departmental Legal Costs
our focus on public health and our priorities, given the
challenges facing business competition and costs.              Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
                                                             Education how much (a) his Department and its
                                                             predecessors and (b) its non-departmental public
                                                             bodies spent on legal advice in each year since 1997.
                      EDUCATION                                                                                    [7571]

                    Academies: Dudley                           Tim Loughton: Legal advice to the Department for
                                                             Education and its predecessors, the Department of
                                                             Children, Schools and Families, the Department for
  Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for              Education and Employment, and the Department for
Education which schools in Dudley have applied for           Education and Skills, is provided primarily by the
academy status; and if he will make a statement. [1512]      Department’s Legal Directorate. The annual cost, rounded
                                                             to the nearest pound, of running Legal Directorate is as
  Mr Gibb: No schools in Dudley have yet applied.            follows. There are no centrally-held figures for any
                                                             financial years before 2004-05. The Legal Directorate
                   Children: Databases                       provided a shared service to the former Department for
                                                             Innovation, Universities and Skills from June 2007 to
   Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for             November 2009.
Education how much his Department spent on first                The figures include this cost.
quarter grant payments to each local authority in the
West Midlands in respect of the ContactPoint database                                                                  £
in June 2010; and if he will make a statement.   [8404]
                                                             2004-05                                           4,112,681
   Tim Loughton: The Department for Education has            2005-06                                           3,950,842
provided grant funding to local authorities and national     2006-07                                           4,341,944
partners to support the local implementation of              2007-08                                           4,850,186
ContactPoint. The following amounts were made in             2008-09                                           4,765,905
grant payments to the 14 children’s services authorities     2009-10                                           4,627,417
in the West Midlands in the first quarter of the 2010-11
financial year.                                                The Department’s NDPBs hold their own information
                                                             on expenditure on legal advice. This information is
                                                        £    being collected and a letter with these details will be
                                                             placed in the House Libraries by the end of July.
Birmingham City Council                          54,887.75
Coventry City Council                            24,005.50                    Departmental Lighting
Dudley Metropolitan Borough Council              23,747.75
Herefordshire County Council                     18,788.00     Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for
Sandwell Metropolitan Borough Council            23,830.00   Education how much (a) his Department and its
Shropshire County Council                        22,727.00   predecessors and (b) its non-departmental public bodies
Solihull Metropolitan Borough Council            20,246.25   spent on light bulbs in each year since 1997.     [7628]
Staffordshire County Council                     41,518.25
Stoke-on-Trent Council                           20,898.50     Tim Loughton: Details of the amounts spent on light
Telford and the Wrekin Council                   19,135.50   bulbs since 1997 by DFE, its predecessors and all
Walsall Metropolitan Borough Council             22,574.25   NDPBs are unable to be provided within the requested
Warwickshire County Council                      31,429.00   deadline as this would incur disproportionate costs.
Wolverhampton City Council                       21,429.25     The DFE head office building in London has retained
Worcestershire County Council                    32,338.75   records of expenditure on light bulbs since 2007. Details
Total                                           377,555.75   of those costs are as follows:

           Departmental Electronic Equipment
                                                             2007                                                2,966.65
  Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for            2008                                                2,016.45
Education how much (a) his Department and its                2009                                                2,446.08
predecessors and (b) its non-departmental public bodies      2010                                               1
spent on televisions in each year since 1997.     [7508]     1
                                                               To date
99W                           Written Answers                             19 JULY 2010                             Written Answers                            100W

                        Departmental Relocation                                           Tim Loughton: The information requested is as follows:
                                                                                          (a) The information requested is not separately identified
  Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for                                        within the Department’s published resource accounts. The requested
Education whether he plans to relocate (a) civil                                       information could be obtained through a detailed analysis of
servants and (b) Government bodies for which his                                       local buying records and contracts with suppliers but this could
                                                                                       be achieved only at disproportionate cost.
Department is responsible (i) out of London and (ii) to
the West Midlands; and if he will make a statement.                                       (b) The Department does not obtain information at that level
                                                                                       of detail from each of our non departmental public bodies. It
                                                                                       could be obtained only at disproportionate cost.
  Tim Loughton: The location of public sector activity
and plans for the Government’s estate will be considered                                                              GCE A-level
alongside other public spending issues over the course
of the spending review.                                                                  Chris Skidmore: To ask the Secretary of State for
                        Departmental Stationery                                        Education how many pupils resident in the (a) bottom
                                                                                       and (b) top 10 per cent. of lower super output areas
  Graham Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for                                      gained three A grades at A-level in 2009.       [5448]
Education how much (a) his Department and its
predecessors and (b) its non-departmental public bodies                                  Mr Gibb: The requested information is available in
spent on stationery in each year since 1997.      [7465]                               the following table.

                     Number of candidates resident1 in the bottom and top 10% of IDACI deciles2 achieving three or more A grades at A-level, 2008/09
                              Resident 16 to 18-year-old candidates1, 3     Number of resident candidates achieving 3       Percentage of resident candidates achieving
                               entered for GCE/Applied GCE A-levels          or more A grades4 at GCE/Applied GCE            3 or more A grades4 at GCE/Applied GCE
IDACI decile                                      and Double Awards                       A-level and Double Awards                         A-level and Double Awards

0-10% (ie most                                                  15,722                                            711                                              4.5
90-100% (ie) least                                              32,355                                           4,339                                            13.4
  Includes pupils resident in England attending LA maintained schools with sixth forms, CTCs and FE sector colleges.
  Income Deprivation Affecting Children Indices 2007. Each SOA in England is given a score which ranks it between 1 and 32,482, 1 being the most deprived.
  Age at the start of the 2008/09 academic year ie 31 August 2008.
  An Applied Double Award at grade AA counts as two grade As, an award at grade AB counts as one.
National Pupil Database (final data)

                                     GCSE                                              (a subset of the Indices of Multiple Deprivation) has
                                                                                       been placed in the House of Commons Library, alongside
  Chris Skidmore: To ask the Secretary of State for                                    a selection of data available on the Department’s In
Education (1) how many pupils in each decile of the                                    Your Area web site. The Department uses IDACI to
index of multiple deprivation eligible for free school                                 analyse pupil attainment in deprived areas and information
meals gained five GCSEs at grades A* to C, including                                   about whether a pupil achieved five or more GCSEs or
English and mathematics in each of the last 10 years;                                  equivalent including English and maths GCSEs has
                                                                                       only been available on the Department’s National Pupil
   (2) what percentage of pupils in (a) the lowest (i) 10                              Database since the 2003/04 academic year. The information
per cent. and (ii) one per cent. and (b) the highest (A)                               has been split into two separate tables as IDACI deciles
10% and (B) one% of lower super output areas gained                                    for the years 2003/04 to 2006/07 are based on the 2004
five GCSEs at grades A* to C, including English and                                    IDACI scores, while IDACI deciles for the years 2007/08
mathematics in 2009;                                [5445]                             to 2008/09 are based on the 2007 IDACI scores. The
   (3) how many pupils in the (a) bottom and (b) top 10                                2007 IDACI scores are updated versions of the 2004
per cent. of lower super output areas gained five GCSEs                                scores, however there were some changes in the scoring
at grades A* to C, including English and mathematics, a                                criteria which means that care should be taken when
science and a modern language in 2009.              [5447]                             comparing the two.
   Mr Gibb: The information available by each decile of
the Income Deprivation Affecting Children Index (IDACI)

Number of pupils resident1 in the bottom and top 10% of IDACI deciles2 and bottom and top 1% of IDACI percentiles2 achieving five o