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									3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                        SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

              Meeting Report of 3GPP SA3 LI#29
                                    22-24 April 2008

           Management Team:
           Chairman:                 Bernhard Spalt         Nokia Siemens Networks
           Vice Chairman:            Alex Leadbeater        BT
           Meeting Secretary:        Ian Cooper             NTAC

           List of participants:              see annex A
           List of action points:             see annex B

1 Welcome

The Chairman welcomed delegates to Vancouver, and thanked Peter Musgrove and
North American Friends of 3GPP for the meeting arrangements.

2 Apologies
Apologies were received from Peter van der Arend and George Babut.

3 Election of Chairman and Vice Chairman
There were no further nominations for these positions and Bernhard Spalt and Alex
Leadbeater were re-elected for another period of office to the acclaim of the meeting.

4 Approval of Agenda                                        SA3LI08_020r1
This was accepted without change.
The Chair noted that topics may not be handled according to the sequence within the
Agenda for the following reasons:
    CR‟s on one topic for several specifications
    Give delegates the change to update / draft Tdoc‟s for the next day
    Availability of necessary/interested delegates

4.1 Code of Conduct:

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                                 SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

When attending a 3GPP SA3 LI meeting it is expected that each delegate will give the
utmost respect to other delegate‟s personal and company possessions. A delegate must
not attempt to invade other delegate‟s computers or read their papers without explicit
Anyone found violating this trust will be asked to remove himself or herself from the
meeting. The offending person will not be welcomed at future meetings and SA3 LI
will request the company send another delegate.
For your information, a method of protecting your computer from piracy may be
found at:

4.2 IPR Call Reminder
The Chairman reminded delegates of their company's obligations under their SDO's
IPR policies:

The attention of the delegates to the meeting of this Technical Specification Group
was drawn to the fact that 3GPP Individual Members have the obligation under the
IPR Policies of their respective Organizational Partners to inform their respective
Organizational Partners of Essential IPRs they become aware of.

The delegates were asked to take note that they were thereby invited:
-     to investigate whether their organization or any other organization owns IPRs which
      were, or were likely to become Essential in respect of the work of 3GPP.
-     to notify their respective Organizational Partners of all potential IPRs, e.g., for ETSI, by
      means of the IPR Statement and the Licensing declaration forms

There were no IPR calls from meeting delegates.

5 Approval of last meeting report                                           SA3LI08_021

This was agreed.

5.1Review Action Points

    2007        Name                     Action Item                    Status
    AP07-07     Bernhard, Jean T Investigate VCC correlation using call Ongoing-
                and Alex         id and p-charging vectors              proposal is to
                                                                                    use this method
                                                                                    but detail
    AP07-17     Dionisio              SA3LI07_105r2 was missed after the            Closed but
                Zumerle               MCC update. Dionisio Zumerle will             SA3LI08_39
                                                                                    raised here to
                                      handle this                                   make editorial

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                          SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

6 Reports of other bodies which are relevant to SA3-LI

6.1    SA#39 (held 10-13 March 08, Mexico)

Our CR presented for approval at this meeting was agreed, but there was an
implementation problem in 33.107 v. 8.3.0. Dionisio Zumerle was aware of this and
introduced a CR, Tdoc SA3LI_039 to make the necessary correction. This is action
point AP07-17 above. It was agreed that in the future, after the MCC update process,
an email will be sent out by Dionisio to SA3LI members to allow one week for peer

6.2    SA WG3

SA WG3 had been held the previous week in Vancouver and Dionisio Zumerle
introduced an LS forwarded from that meeting which originated at SA#39. The LS,
SA3LI_033, contained a list of features which are to be retained for Release 8 work
and a list of features to be removed, the most notable of which is MBMS. Alex
Leadbeater said that there was no great impact for SA3LI and a reply LS was not
needed. The LS was noted.

Berthold Wilhelm had been present at SA3 WG3 and said that the main aim of the
group is to finalise Release 8 specifications. There will be further meetings at the end
of September and in November to achieve this.

6.3    ETSI TC LI
Alex Leadbeater reported that there had been a rapporteur‟s meeting in Mainz for the
Retained Data Handover Interface (RDHI) WI. This had been very constructive and
many outstanding issues resolved. At some point the document will need to be
reviewed by SA3 LI but not at this juncture.

6.4    WTSC-LI

Peter Musgrove reported that this group would be meeting week commencing 28
April in Miami. Topics to be discussed include PoC for which the FBI have some
contributions, Canadian location update requirements and the fixing of some issues in
LAES for VoIP. Of particular interest to SA3 LI will be proposals on how to address
US specific issues which are deltas to 33.106, 33.107 and 33.108. He further reported
on joint discussions with the PTSC group regarding VoIP mapping tables for WiMAX
LAES VoIP. A further joint topic is LI for NGN both fixed and mobile.

6.5    TISPAN WG 7

Alex Leadbeater said that a colleague from BT attended the last meeting where there
was a concern over the approach SA3 LI is proposing for Common IMS. This concern
is reflected in LS SA3LI08_022 from TISPAN.

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                            SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

6.6    PTSC LAES and WiMAX

Ron Ryan reported that ATIS PTSC currently has five active projects:

1. Supplement-A to ATIS-1000013.2007 LAES for Internet Access and
Services (IAS): IAS provides LI support for IP broadband data internet access (e.g.,
DSL, WiFi, WiMAX, Cable). The supplement addresses corrections, clarifications,
and enhancements. The projection is the supplement will be completed and ready for
balloting at the end of April ‟08.

2. Supplement-B to ATIS-1000678.2007 LAES for VoIP (678): 678 provides a
„mapped‟ (SIP-to-025) LI solution for VoIP. The supplement will address corrections,
clarifications, and enhancements. Work has just begun. The projection is the
supplement will be completed and ready for ballot at the end of July ‟08.

3. LAES for Advanced Conferencing Services (ACS): ACS addresses LI
support for network based advanced conferencing services such as arranging for
„meet-me‟ conferences. The work is maturing. The scope is limited to subject initiated
conferences. The projection is the Technical Report will be completed and ready for
ballot at the end of August ‟08.

4. ATIS-1000013.2007 IAS Implementation Guide (IAS-G): IAS-G is a new
project to provide implementation guidelines for IAS. This Technical Report is
planned for completion and ballot ready at the end of October ‟08.

5. LAES for Next Generation Networks (NGN): The work on NGN is
progressing slowly. Architecture issues have been resolved. The current view seems
to be that existing LI capabilities (e.g., LI capabilities for broadband data access [the
IAS standard] and VoIP [the 678 standard]) are adequate with only a need to
investigate Voice Call Continuity (VCC). This Technical Report is planned for
completion and ballot ready at the end of August ‟08.

Ron also provided this update on WiMAX LI: the North American WiMAX
broadband data access LI capabilities are being based on the ATIS-1000013.2007
IAS. Liaisons and information are being exchanged between WiMAX and ATIS.
WiMAX is seeking copyright permission for use of the ATIS material. Mobility
aspects of WiMAX, such as roaming, are being handled in WiMAX.

6.7    TIA TR-45.6 LIG

Ron Ryan reported that this group currently has two active projects:

1. cdma2000 WLAN Interworking (WLAN-I): WLAN-I provides support for
lawful intercept of broadband data via a wireless LAN access into a cdma2000
network. The proposed standard is in ballot. The ballot comments are expected to be
addressed by June ‟08. Unless the three No votes can be resolved, another ballot is
likely. If another ballot is required the earliest projected date for publication is 3Q08.

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                      SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

2. J-STD-025-0B cdma2000 Packet Data Study: A study of the impact of the
DoJ deficiency petition to the FCC on the cdma2000 Packet Data solution in J-STD-
025-B. The study has not begun and will likely start after addressing the WLAN-I
ballot comments.

6.8   Other bodies
The WiMAX Forum, which was mentioned by Ron Ryan, has been working on an LI
document. This will soon be ready for review for which a process exists. .
The Chairman reported that he made a presentation on 3GPP at ISS Dubai.

7 Incoming liaisons
SA3LI08_022 Request for joint meeting to develop common IMS interception in 33.107 -

This was discussed in 6.5 above, the report from TISPAN WG 7, and requests a joint
meeting to address TISPAN concerns over the way that SA3 LI is planning to
implement LI for Common IMS.

The LS was noted and considered by the meeting. The Chairman suggested holding a
conference call with TISPAN WG 7 followed by a joint meeting before the next SA3
LI meeting in August. Alex Leadbeater offered to draft a response to the LS which
clarified the approach being taken and proposed two dates – 11 June for the
conference call and 25 August for a joint meeting in Sophia Antipolis. This was
agreed as SA3LI08_043.

SA3LI08_033 LS on Release 8 non-essential SAE features                     SA#39

This was addressed previously in 6.2, the report from SA WG3. There was no need
for a response LS.
SA3LI08_035r1CAT(Customized Alerting Tones) interactions with LI           CT4

Alex Leadbeater summarised the LS from CT4. It requested SA3 LI‟s response to the
need to provide LI for the user programmable alerting messages which will be a
feature of Rel-8. The LEA members of the group confirmed that it would be
requirement for LI but that further time was necessary to study the precise details.
Koen Jaspers and Jean Trakinat agreed to write a LS response which was agreed as

SA3LI08_040 Response LS to CT4 regarding CAT functionality

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                     SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

8 TS 33.106 Rel. 7 and Rel. 8
8.1 Release 7          33.106v7.0.1
No input

8.2 Release 8          33.106v8.0.0
No input

9 TS 33.107 Rel. 7 and Rel. 8
9.1. Release 7         33.107v7.7.0
No input

9.2. Release 8         33.107v8.3.0

SA3LI08_023 CSCF SIP Event Reporting                                   BT Group

Alex Leadbeater presented this Tdoc as a result of Rel-8 changes whereby in certain
scenarios the CSCF may change the original SIP messages. The CR clarifies that the
CSCF must deliver both original and changed messages to LEAs. After comments
from Maurizio Iovieno and Ron Ryan this was agreed at SA3LI08_023r1.
SA3LI08_031 General updates on TS 33.107 to support LI for EPS         Ericsson

Following on from his work in analysing LI for the Enhanced Packet System of Rel-8,
Maurizio Iovieno presented this CR with the general updates needed for TS 33.107. It
also introduced the need for a new chapter X dedicated to LI for EPS, the detail for
which is in the following CR in Tdoc 032. He proposed that the way forward was to
combine the two after taking comments into account. There was broad agreement on
the document. Some wished to accept it and proceed with work on 33.108 but others
asked for more time for consideration before the next meeting. The Chairman
proposed that 031 and 032 be combined into SA3LI08_42 as the outcome from this
meeting with the aim being to agree the CR in Sophia Antipolis in August.

SA3LI08_032 LI for EPS – E-UTRAN access                                Ericsson

Maurizio Iovieno presented this second CR on LI for EPS which provides the detailed
architecture and events for the new chapter X in 33.107. It is based on his Tdoc
SA3LI08_28 which discusses involved nodes and events in LI for EPS.

Alex Leadbeater made some detailed comments and Maurizio agreed to make changes
and to combine this Tdoc with Tdoc 031 into SA3LI_042. There are still some open
issues and this CR will not be presented yet but the document is the agreed position to
take forward to the next meeting.
SA3LI08_038 Updates on TS 33.107 to support “Common IMS”               Ericsson

Maurizio Iovieno presented this CR and explained that he aimed to re-use 33.107 and
remove access dependent elements when specifying Common IMS details. He added

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                        SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

a new chapter X specifically for the Common IMS LI. There was a long discussion on
Figure 1f. Peter Musgrove and Ron Ryan asked about the interface between the IMS
media control node and the IMS media handling node which is standardised but not
for LI purposes. Maurizio said there will be some LI additions. Rao Nagaraja queried
references to MRFC and MRFP as they are not normally involved in IMS calls.

The Chairman summarised by saying that it was not possible to agree the CR at this
meeting. He asked the group for contributions to be sent to Maurizio in order for
progress to be made at the next meeting.

SA3LI08_039    Editorial corrections to TS33.107               Dionisio Zumerle

This the correction referred to in 6.1 above and was agreed.

10 TS 33.108 Rel. 7 and Rel. 8
10.1 Release 7         33.108v7.9.0

10.2 Release 8         33.108v8.3.0

SA3LI08_024 MBMS LI 33.108                                                BT Group

Alex Leadbeater presented this Stage 3 CR after his work on MBMS Stage 2. After
discussions in the group it was agreed at SA3LI08_024r2.

11 Continued Discussion and New Business
11.1 Common IMS

SA3LI08_036r1 Interface for COMMON IMS LI Handover      ZTE Corporation

Yu Meng introduced this contribution which was a discussion paper suggesting ways
to address the needs of Common IMS LI in addition to that already covered in
33.107/8. In particular he noted the need to develop a general correlation method to
associate CSCF IRI with bearer CC for different access scenarios. To illustrate likely
changes, he tabled an example CR, Tdoc SA3LI08_41.

There was discussion and some agreement for the proposals. Peter Musgrove said that
companies who have both wireless and wireline access networks will have a single
IMS and would support generic correlation and LI methods. The Chairman noted the
Tdocs but said it was too soon to make a decision and asked for further contributions.
SA3LI08_037 33.107 adding Common IMS details V.2.0 r2     Nokia Siemens Networks

This document, tabled at the previous meeting in Sophia Antipolis, was presented for

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                         SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

11.2    Conference LI functions

SA3LI08_034 Conference Events LI 33.107                                    TPS

Jean Trakinat presented this CR with tracked changes against the previous draft of the
working document. She noted that reporting of Floor Control events is for further

In discussing the CR, Ron Ryan and Peter Musgrove both had issues with the case of
the subject joining an associate‟s conference, Ron from a technical feasibility angle
and Peter from a legality in the US position. Jean agreed to make this case “for further
study” and to create a new chapter for IMS Conference Services in 33.107. The
meeting then agreed SA3LI08_034r2.

11.3    EPS Evolved Packet System

SA3LI08_028 LI for Evolved Packet System (EPS): involved nodes and events v 2.0

This was a revision of Maurizio Iovieno‟s paper from the last meeting because of
changes to TS 23.401 from SA2 and comments received. It, and the following Tdoc
proposing parameters for events formed the basis of the two CRs in 9.2. After
discussion the two CRs were merged into SA3LI08_042 which is the agreed position
at the end of the meeting on LI for EPS.
SA3LI08_029 LI for EPS: proposed parameters for events applicable to GTP based S5/S8
interfaces  Ericsson

The following reference urls were provided for information:

TS 23.401 v 8.1.0 GPRS Enhancements for E-UTRAN access                                 SA 2

TS 23.402 v 8.1.1 Architecture Enhancements for non-3GPP accesses                      SA 2

11.4    Others

SA3LI08_025 Need of new document / WI for SAE / EPS?                       Chairman

In this Tdoc, the Chairman discussed the pros and cons of creating a new document
for EPS LI or adapting the existing 33.107/8. Dionisio Zumerle said that SA wish to
fresh all Rel-8 Stage 2 work at the next plenary in June. Given the time pressure, the
only conclusion is to adapt the existing specifications.
SA3LI08_026 IMS CC Dynamic Triggering (in common IMS?)                     BT Group

Alex Leadbeater presented his proposal to the meeting following on from his related
paper at the previous meeting and an email discussion. His view is that with complex
call scenarios in the future involving multiple service providers, there is a need to

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                        SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

develop a standardised triggering interface within the Common IMS sections of
33.107/8. This would be for Rel-9 at the earliest.

Terry Jacobson wondered whether passing LI information across networks was
allowed. Peter Musgrove said this was prohibited in the US at the moment. It was
clear such a triggering interface would have to be well secured. It was believed to be
possible in Germany.

Ron Ryan said there might be existing solutions from bodies such as Packetcable and
the IETF which could be used.

The Chairman summed up by inviting contributions to the topic for consideration at
the next meeting.
SA3LI08_027 CC Decryption and Encryption Key Handover                   BT Group

In this Tdoc, Alex Leadbeater advised the meeting that he is planning to raise a work
item in TC LI to report on the standardisation of encrypted media and key handover.
He said that there may be some involvement with SA3 for guidance on mobile
specific issues. The Tdoc was noted.

12 Review meeting output / agreed
The following documents were agreed as CRs:
SA3LI08_023 r1 CSCF SIP Event Reporting                                 BT Group

SA3LI08_39    Editorial Corrections on 33.107                           MCC

SA3LI08_024r2 MBMS LI 33.108                                            BT Group

SA3LI08_034r2 Conference Events LI 33.107                               TPS

The following document is the agreed position at this meeting for LI for EPS
combining SA3LI08_31 and SA3LI08_32 but is not ready to go forward as a CR yet :
SA3LI08_042    LI for EPS                                           Ericsson

The Chairman asked for further input and for work to start on Stage 3 of LI for EPS.

13 Outgoing Liaisons
SA3LI08_040 Response LS to CT4 regarding CAT functionality

SA3LI08_043    LS on Common IMS LI to TISPAN WG4

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                                  SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

14 Meeting dates and venue for next meeting

  Organisation     Meeting Date        Meeting Venue     Sponsor        Notes
     SA#40       2. – 5. Jun. „08     Prague
    SA3#52       23 - 27 Jun „08      Sophia
     SA3 LI 25 Aug 08                 Sophia Antipolis             Joint with TISPAN
  /TISPANWG                                                               WG7
   SA 3 LI#30    26. – 28. Aug. ‟08   Sophia Antipolis
     SA#41       15. – 18. Sep. „08   JP
    SA3#53       13. – 17. Oct.„08
   SA3 LI#31     11. – 13. Nov.‟08    Washington DC
     SA#42       8. – 11. Dec.‟08     Athens

3GPP TSG SA WG3-LI#29                                                             SA3L
Vancouver, Canada, 22-24 Apr. 2008

Annex A       List of participants

                          Name           Role        Organization
                        Cooper, Ian   Attendee       Technical

                        Daly, Brian
                                      Attendee       AT&T

                        Iovieno,                     Telefon AB LM
                        Maurizio                     Ericsson

                                      Attendee       Alcatel-Lucent

                                      Attendee       PIDS

                                      ViceChairman   BT Group Plc

                                                     FED. MINISTRY
                                      Attendee       FOR
                        Walter C.

                        Meng, Yu      Attendee       ZTE Corporation

                                      Attendee       AT&T

                        Nagaraja,                    Nokia Siemens
                        Rao                          Networks

                        Ronald D.     Attendee       Nortel Networks

                                      Attendee       BMWi

                        Spalt,                       Nokia Siemens
                        Bernhard                     Networks

                                      Attendee       BfV

                                      Attendee       TPS

                                      Attendee       BMWi

                                      Attendee       ETSI Secretariat

Annex B       List of actions

  Number       Name                     Action Item          Status
  AP07-07      Bernhard, Jean T Investigate VCC correlation Ongoing-proposal is
               and Alex         using call id and p-charging to use this method
                                                             but detail needed.


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