Growing A Donkey

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					                 Growing A Donkey
     An American Hoist & Derrick - 3-Spool Donkey
                      In 1:20.3
                                       Rick Marty
                                   Bella Vista, CA. USA

Web Site:
Forum: Model Making
Topic Title: Growing a Donkey (update) +1+2+3+4+ FINALLY DONE
MLS User ID: R.W. Marty
Posted: 04 Dec 2004: 20:40:40
Trying to grow a donkey from ON3 (1:48) to FN3 (1:20.3)is turning into an interesting
project. As some of you may know, and some of you others may not care, there are no
Donkey Engines available in 1:20 (Ozark makes some in 1:24) but they are a little on the
small side.

I had, packed away, a CHB kit of an "American Hoist & Derrick" 3 spool donkey from my
ON3 modeling days. So I drug it out and started measuring and cutting styrene. I knew in
my mind that there was a big difference between the two scales but seeing them side by
side is kind of a shock.

Sorry about the poor quality of the picts, but I think you can see the differences I'm talking
Here is the (prototype??) off it's sled and small parts broken off from ratteling around in a
packing box for 10 years.

Here is the start of the (Model?) basic boiler and skid. Is that a hellava size difference or

Here is a close-up shot showing the ash pan doors and the start of the firebox door.
Thanks for your time.
Edited by - R.W. Marty on 18 Mar 2005 16:13:45

Posted: 05 Dec 2004: 23:06:54
Hi all,
No new pictures. Didn't get much chance to work on it today but did get the firebox door

(Comment: Andy Knies (MLS User ID: Bubba) - Rick, wow! That is a staggering difference
in size. How are you doing the conical shapes in styrene? Guys like you, Fletch, and a few
others really amaze me with what you do with styrene!)
Bubba, The cones are laid out and rolled up and glued from 1mm styrene sheet. The layout
is pretty simple just an elevation of the cone and frustum. Then a stretch-out using radial
line development gives you the pattern to cut out. I just lay it out right on the styrene
sheet. But working this small your points have to be pretty accurate so the finish is smooth.
Thanks for your interest.

Posted: 01 Jan 2005: 18:26:17
Boy time flies.
I can't believe it has been almost a month since I started this project. It's to bad that real
life has to interfere so much with playing trains.

It took quite a while to find some of the gears but I finally located some in an RC car store
that would work for the Bull Gears and found some buttons at Joanne’s Fabrics that made
up nicely for the crank discs.
Anyway here are a couple of pictures showing my slow progress.

An overall view of the parts completed so far. Showing the winding drums , crank discs, and
the boiler and sled.
A close-up of the boiler base showing the finished firebox door, mounting brackets and the
blow down valve.

This shows the main drum and its mounting brackets as well as the crankshaft and pinion
This view shows the main drum and mounts sitting in position on the sled as well as the trip
drum and the straw drum (all three are the same on this machine). Also a good view of the
(button) crank discs.

(Comment: Andy Knies (MLS User ID: Bubba) - I wonder if in the end of this project we
can get a picture of the 1:20.3 donkey next to a ruler. Then we can get someone with the
Ozark kit to do the same. I'm interested to see even what the difference is from 1:24 to
1:20. And yes, I understand that donkeys were made in so many different sizes that Ozark's
model is certainly realistic for 1:20 to 1:24 and beyond. Just chalk it up to curiosity )
Bubba, A friend has a Ozark Donkey he built up, I'll borrow it one day and get some
comparison pictures when I get a little farther along.

(Comment: Don Gauge - Looks great so far. I am certain it will turn out great. Ozark does
make a single spool hoist engine that could work as a small donkey. It used to be the MM-
901. This is what I used to build my pole hoist.)
Don, Didn't mean to badmouth Ozark's Donkeys but in 1:20 they are awfully small
machines, if your doing 1880's---1900 they are fine but for later years you need bigger
machines (more power! Scotty          )

Thanks for your time.

Posted: 08 Jan 2005: 19:42:08
Got a little more work done. It would probably go a lot faster if I didn't have to do most of it
twice       .

Here I have the cylinders mounted temp. so I can mount the crank and valve linkage. This
machine uses a slide valve so it's a little simpler than some. The sled is mounted to a block
so it is easier to handle.
This view shows the crank and valve linkage mostly finished, still have to add bolts, rivets,
and other dodah's.

I'm sure learning a lot building this guy. For one thing this is actually a Hoisting Engine and
they were not generally used on Donkey Sleds for woods work, although it can be, and was.
A hoisting engine was generally used on things like pile drivers, stiff leg derricks, and
loading booms. The "Donkey Engines", once past the early Dolbeer days became highly
specialized machines each with it's own special function.
Well, now to get some of those little fiddly parts built.
Thanks for your time.
Edited by - R.W. Marty on 09 Jan 2005 21:44:40

Posted: 09 Jan 2005: 22:22:17
(Comment: Don Watson (MLS User ID: docwatsonva) - Great progress Rick. Not knowing
the exact details of the prototype, do you intend to fill the remaining holes in the big gears?
And how, if you do?)
Hi Doc, No I intend to leave the holes exposed.

(Comment: Peter Bunce - You have a powerful twin cylinder engine there - are you fitting
another winch drum? The reason I ask is that is why these engines had a couple of cylinders
- then the donkey puncher controlled a couple of ropes/wires instead of the single
cylinder/single rope/wire one.

If you want more information could I suggest the book 'In search of Steam Donkeys' that
will answer everything, my copy is very useful. If you do not have a drawing of these I can
send you one - let me know & it will arrange it.

If you fill the holes on the main gear, cover them with a thin sheet, and add on top of the
cover sheet some stiffening ribs, you should be able to get that with your present bolts, and
it will look good.

Meanwhile you have a nice hefty load developing there - congratulations.)
Peter, This is based loosely on the 30hp American Hoist and Derrick 1914 model. These
engines were built in 1,2,and 3 drum configurations. The second and third drums were
basically a bolt on assembly with their own frames and controls. If you check the first
picture you can see all three drums. Also note that each drum had a winch head or capstan
for hand winding.

I agree the book "In Search of Steam Donkeys" is a great resource and just good reading.
My copy is getting dog-eared already. Unfortunately the couple of shots of AH&D machines
in the book aren't very helpful.

Another good book just out is the Willamette Logging Machinery 1925 catalog reprint by
Oso Publishing. Very good reading, but no AH&D machines.

The original model had flat plate closures on the gear side of the winding drums but after
some consideration I decided to leave the openings as they are for a more mechanical look.
I thought it looked like a factory fix to lighten the casting. Probably wish I had closed them
in when I start painting.

All, Thanks for the encouragement. I'll post pictures when I get a little more completed.

Posted: 10 Jan 2005: 16:46:06
(Comment: Don Gage - Your model looks great. Would you mind shooting an overall photo
with a ruler or scale in the picture just so i can get a grasp of how large it is? I am
considering updating the boiler cylinders and valve gear on my pole hoist and was hoping to
compare the different sizes of the units. Nice work.)
Don, I'll try to get some shots for you tomorrow.
Posted: 17 Jan 2005: 20:39:13
Hi Guy's, back again. Made a little more progress, it's starting to look like an engine instead
of a pile of used parts.

(Comment: Bob Martin (MLS User ID: flatracker) - Rick, that is a beautiful engine, and I
hope you will post more pictures. I am going to build a lumber mill in a bit, and need
something larger than the Ozark donkey engine. Your build has helped me to understand
some of what needs to be done. What type of glue are you using? I've always used MEK,
and hope that will work. Great Job!!      )
Bob, I have used Ambroid's Pro-Weld, Devcon Plastic Epoxy as well as plain old super glue
on this project. Each seems to have it's place.

Anyway, to the update I have added the second drum as well as the brake bands and the
prawl dogs and their levers.

To the pictures!

Of the three levers sticking up, the first on the left is the clynder drain cock lever, the
second and third are the prawl dogs for locking the drums in place. A better view of the
drum prawls is in the second picture. The two rods sticking out from the bottom of the skid
below the first drum are the brake control rods that the foot pedals will attach to.

In this view you can see the brake bands going over the top of the brake drums and down
to their attachment with the brake rods, as well as the prawls on the back side of the bull
gears. The drum shaft's are left long at this time for the attachment of the frictions on the
operators side and the capstan heads on the side you see in this picture.
Again, Thanks for your time and patience.

Posted: 19 Jan 2005: 16:55:47
(Comment: Bob Martin (MLS User ID: flatracker) - Man, I'm glad you know all the names
for the parts. It looks as though you have put a lot of research into this, and it shows in
your work. Just a great looking model, and I'm anxious to see the finished product. How did
you cut out the sections from the button so smooth? All of the pieces look so professionally
done! Very, very nice work!           )
Bob, The buttons as well as many of the other parts are just drilled and filed out. Just drill
the corners with a bit to get the proper radius then drill out the excess with a smaller bit
then whittle and file.

(Comment: W. Charles Ronolder (MLS User ID: wchasr) - I've watched this topic grow
without actually visiting it, until today that is. Very awesome work that shows a love of the
prototype! My I make one suggestion from a former RC car racer/repairer? Take the NYLON
R/C gears off and Dye them a black color because more than likely ANY paint you se will
NOT stick to that stuff for very long. Depending on how you will be weathering them too you
may want to reconsider adding a cover for the holes, etc. too. Just my humble two cents.)
Chas, You know, I was so happy that I finally found some gears that were so close to the
right size and shape I never gave a thought to painting problems with them until you
mentioned it.

You mentioned using dye, any special type? Your right if I can't get them dyed or painted I
may have to cover the outside of the drum.

The third drum is built and installed. Just working on the brake pedals and linkages now.
Will post a couple more pictures in a few days.
Thanks for the input.
Posted: 28 Jan 2005: 17:31:46
Finally able to get a little more done and take a couple of pictures.
The brake rigging is complete including the bands, linkage, and stomp pedals for all three

The frictions are complete and mounted on the ends of the drum shafts.
Oops, I see I forgot to add the grease cups to the tops of them, oh well something to do
later this evening.
Thanks for your time.

Posted: 26 Feb 2005: 20:21:06
I can't believe it has been almost a month since I last updated this thread. But then, I
haven't got all that much done.

Actually all I lack in finishing the engine is the boiler fittings; sight glass, try cocks, pressure
gauge, injector system, hand hole crabs, blower valve, whistle, etc.

Here are a few pictures of the progress.
I have decided to go ahead and put this engine on a donkey sled for use in the woods.

Thanks for your time.
Posted: 18 Mar 2005: 16:11:22
Finally done. Well with the engine itself that is. I still have to build the sled, fairleads, tanks,
figures, and all the rigging. But that's what tomorrow is for.
Here are a few pictures of my efforts.
Thanks for your time.
Posted: 19 Mar 2005: 20:27:03
Well, thank you all for your kind words. I think all of you are prone to exaggerate just a bit,
but it's nice to know that one’s efforts are appreciated by his peers.

That may have sounded stuffy but it was sincere. Besides, I thought that it might sound
better than "Awww Shucks".

(Comment: Jim Francis - Rick That is one terriffic donkey! A work of art and love!
How are you going to rig it?)
Jim, As for rigging, I think I'll just have it on a sled with the 3rd spool(straw drum) feed
through a Bulls eye Fairlead in the head block than use a "Willamette Giant" style double
Fairlead on top of the head block for the mainline and haul-back. Then If I ever "set it out"
all I have to do is run the lines out. Although I do need to change the line size(smaller) on
the haul-back drum.

(Comment: Steve Borges (MLS User ID: pcentral) - I don't really know else can be said!
Truly, a museum quality piece! Can you explain how you weathered it. I like the slightly
aged look of it.)
Steve, Glad you like the paint. For me, being color blind, it is always a challenge. Maybe
that's why I like dull and drab rather than bright shiny colors     I airbrushed the whole
thing (in pieces) with Floquil Grimy Black and let it dry for a week. Than dry-brushed
everything with Polly Scale Rust and used Deco Art Dazzling Metallics "Shimmering Silver".
The silver was "Very dry" brushed on to the black to represent worn places and highlight
bolt heads etc.

The brass was done by using Krylon "Short cuts" brush on paint #SCB-001 Gold Leaf.
Followed by several washes of Alcohol/black leather dye, then just a few drips and splatters
to finish off.

(Comment: Richard Smith - That is one "Super" model. All I can say without repeating
everything that's already been said is that you deserve every word of it! Your trackwork in
the background looks great too.)
Richard, The track work is in pretty rough shape right now. We haven't re-ballasted all that
the winter rains have washed away.

(Comment: Peter Bunce - Very nice work, it looks superb, and thanks for taking the photos
and putting the article together. I like the new covers you have fitted on the gear wheels
looks much better.

I am most impressed with the whole thing, looks magnificent! Do not forget your crew for it
- 2 'fine folks' figures will add immeasurably to it, and will enhance it by giving it a sense of
scale from them.

Never mind our time, your has been used to very good effect indeed.)
Peter, Yes, the new gear covers look better, and I thank you again for suggesting the
change. That's what I like about this forum, all the helpful feedback.

Thanks for your time.

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