Quality Assurance in Software

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					Business901                             Podcast Transcription
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 Quality Assurance in Software
  Guest was Murali Krishna, Chemuturi Chief Consultant

Related Podcast:

    Quality Assurance in Software

                          Software Quality Assurance Podcast
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Murali Chemuturi, an information technology and software development subject matter
expert, hands-on programmer, author, consultant and trainer. This podcast centered on
Software Quality Assurance and what Murali considers best practice. I found his position
quite different than the Agile and Kanban Software people I typically interview. I think
most people in the IT field will find it interesting.

                         In 2001, he formed his own IT consulting and software
                         development firm known as Chemuturi Consultants. Chemuturi
                         Consultants help software development organizations achieve
                         their quality and value objectives. The firm provides training in
                         several software engineering and project management topics
                         such as Software Estimation, Test Effort Estimation, Function
                         Point Analysis, and Software Project Management, to name a
                         few. His firm also offers a number of products to aid project
managers and software development professionals such as PMPal, a software project
management tool; and EstimatorPal, FPAPal & UCPPal, a set of software estimation tools.

J. Ross Publishing has recently published three books authored by Murali Chemuturi:

       o   Mastering Software Quality Assurance: Best Practices, Tools and Techniques for
           Software Developers
       o   Mastering Software Project Management: Best Practices, Tools and Techniques
       o   Software Estimation Best Practices, Tools & Techniques: A Complete Guide for
           Software Project Estimators

                                 Software Quality Assurance Podcast
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Joe Dager: Hello, everyone. This is Joe Dager, the host of the Business901 Podcast. With
me today is Murali Chemuturi, who is an information-technology and Software
development subject-matter expert, hands-on programmer, author, consultant, and
trainer. Murali, I'd like to welcome you to the podcast.
Murali Chemuturi: Thank you very much for having me on the podcast. I am Murali
Chemuturi. My qualifications are in industrial engineering and then a postgraduate diploma
in computer methods and programming and master's in business administration, besides a
diploma in electrical engineering.
The first 15 years of my career has been in manufacturing. And for the past 25 years, I
have been in software development, handling various assignments, such as software
development, data processing, training, operations. I have also been in professional
organizations such as Tata Consultancy Services, Satyam Computers, Metamor Global
Solutions. And for the past nine years, I have been offering my services as a freelance
consultant in and around my place of residence, India. Of course, I have also executed
consultancy assignments in USA, also.
In addition to consultancy assignments, I have developed software products, mainly for the
software-development industry and then for manufacturing industry, and the construction
industry, too, where I had the functional expertise. For the software-development industry,
I developed two tools. One is Estimator Pal. That aids software project estimators in
arriving at the estimates for the projects.
Second, the tool is called PMPal, Project Manager's Pal. It aids the organization as well as
the software project manager in efficiently managing the information. For the software
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project manager, it starts at estimation; the entire EstimatorPal project is embedded in
PMPal. Then it goes on to manage the work using the Work Breakdown Structure module.
It also allows him to manage the changes, effectively change management, through
Change Manager. It also helps software project managers in defect tracking and defect
resolution management. From all this information, the organization can obtain a host of
software metrics, in effort metrics, schedule metrics, defect metrics, change metrics, and
so on.
For the manufacturing industry, I developed MRPPal. That assists the organizations in
materials requirements planning, inventory control, purchasing, warehouse management,
and a host of reports that help them to properly plan production in the shops.
These are the products I sell. I have clients in Singapore, in India, and in USA. I also offer
training in software engineering, especially software estimation, software project
management, software quality assurance, requirements management. When I have spare
time, I have retained, number of papers which are available as white papers from my own
site chemuturi.com and from a number of other sites. I have also written three books and
contributed chapters to another two books edited by somebody else.
Joe: They've been written kind of recently. I mean you've come out with three books
pretty quickly here.
Murali: While did they came out quickly, that is one book in 2009 and two books in 2010.
I have been writing them for a number of years. Let us say from 2006 onwards, was easy
for me. That's how you know first book I completed in 2009, March and started completing
the other two books in 2009, April. The first book titled 'Software Estimation, Best
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Practices, Tools and Techniques’; a complete guide for Software Product Estimators came
in August 2009.
These two other books I completed in 2009, itself by the end of 2009. These two books
came out in 2010, one in July, and one in September. One book is titled, 'Mastering
Software Quality Assurance, Best Practices, Tools and Techniques for Software
Developers'. And the other book, 'Mastering Software Project Management, Best Practices,
Tools and Techniques.'
This last book about project software project management, I have co-authored with
Thomas M. Cagley Jr. of David Consulting.
Joe: The books did not strike me that they were meant for the casual reader. Who was
your particular audience?
Murali: You are right. These are all for software development industry and are not for the
beginning first level programmer. A programmer with one or two years’ experience may
not be able to appreciate the content of these books.
The project leader, project manager and the senior management, they are going to
benefit, and they are going to enjoy and they're going to appreciate the content of this
book. As you said, yes, this has a niche audience, only in software industry from the
middle level and upwards. You are right.

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Joe: When we talk about software quality assurance, I mean, that's really one of your real
specialties. What do you see that has changed in recent years that your books have
included that may not be found someplace else?
Murali: You know, Joe, what I have written is not from, others thinking, others research,
but I have been a practitioner. I have put practice into it. I have put the practical aspects
into it. When you look at any of my books, you can implement it straight. You can use it as
a process for the organization. I have given number of templates. I have given a number
of formats. I have given number of processes.
I have given number of techniques. For example, when you're going to software
estimation, the people talk about daffy estimation and the analogy based estimation, and
there's no written formal document anywhere on the web or in any other software
estimation book. You find them in my book. I have completely covered the entire subject,
not just one part or two parts. I have defined everything before I expanded on it.
For example, software estimation: The definition of software estimation you will not find
anywhere else, except in my book. The definition of quality also, determining quality also,
for the first time, I have defined it comprehensively. You may say, yes, the definitions do
exist. Juran has defined it as "quality is fitness for use." And this has two critical terms:
fitness and use. Unless we define fitness and use, this quality definition is not complete.
Now, when you look at the definition, there are two people who are going to interpret this
fitness and use: one, the producer himself; second, the user himself. When the user buys
an automobile, his expectation about usage is "100, 000 miles, I don't have to do any

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repair." But is that the expectation of the automobile manufacturer about use? Maybe, we
do not know.
Now, many products are like this. Somebody says, "Fitness for use. Yes, this can be driven
500 miles without problem." But the user may think, "I need to drive this 1, 000 miles
without stopping." So, that is one definition.

The other definition of quality is by ISO. ISO define this as a degree, the degree to which
the requirements can be fulfilled. The ISO says the degree and the term quality can be
associated with other terms, adjectives like poor quality, good quality, and excellent
quality. Now, when you talk of quality in standalone manner, when you say, "General
Motors' Chevrolet car is a quality car" we don't use "good-quality car" or "poor-quality car."
When we say quality, we assume that it is a good-quality car. Quality alone, when you use,
it's not bad quality or anything. You don't associate any other term with quality to indicate
good quality.
Now, these definitions definitely are said with a purpose. But we need a better definition,
and the definition has to be from the provider. The provider has to define, and it should be
acceptable to the user. There is no standard that says, "The software will fulfill this. When
you deliver the software, it will be bug-free." Even this is an expectation. When you buy
software from the market, you get a CD and user manual. Every consumer expects that it
is bug-free. But is there a standard that specifies that the software must be bug-free?
None and then, we are seeing, day in and day out, software being released with bugs, and
every day patches are released to rectify the bugs.

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Joe: So can software be developed bug-free? Aren't you always going to run into
problems out there with different circumstances that maybe you were not aware of?
Murali: The software developers have to make it bug-free. It is implicit. Not explicit,
implicit. When we develop software, we have to deliver bug-free code, but we always
maintain a metric called defect density or delivered defect density. Size divided by the
number of defects we delivered.
Now, how do we know there are defects, and if you know there are defects, why did you
deliver? This is a question naturally asked. The defects are found out in the field when the
end users start using the software, they get the problems, and these problems are
reported, and these problems, if the software is custom developed, either in-house or by a
third party vendor, it will be fixed during the software maintenance period, warranty
Warranty period is normally short, three months to six months, not more than that
normally, and then the maintenance starts, and all the bugs that get fixed become part of
maintenance. So, most of the software maintenance is bug fixing.
For example, you know, an organization of the capability of Microsoft released an operating
system. Within three months, a service pack is required to fix the defects. Windows XP
unless second Service Pack SP2 has been released, it was full of problems. Windows Vista
Service Pack one had to be released almost immediately.
If an organization, which is committed to quality so much and which has the financial
capability and manpower capability, they have the best of the people in the world working
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for them, releases with bugs, what about the other developers sitting in either India or
USA or Singapore or Ireland or Israel to be able to comprehensively remove all the bugs?
The probability is not very high, right?
Joe: Is this something that someone from outside the business can really evaluate or
understand how to define quality in the software market on what to purchase? I mean,
how is that defined from maybe not from a consumer, but even from another IT
Department buying software? How can he know that he is buying a quality product?
Murali: You have asked a very wonderful question that should have been asked by many
people and many platforms.
When we develop software, somebody gives us an order for software development, we
develop the software, and at the end of it, we conduct what is called as user acceptance
testing. And during the user acceptance testing, the time is short and the software is large,
the testing takes a lot of time, so therefore the positive testing is carried out, that means,
we show to him that whatever he specified as requirements are all taken care of and they
are all working as they should be working.
Actually now when we go into the testing aspect, testing is one part of software quality
assurance. There are 22 types of tests that can be carried out in addition to four standard
tests that we carry out. The four standard tests that are always carried out are unit testing,
integration testing, system testing and the user acceptance testing.
Unit testing is carried out for each of the units developed, each program, each screen, each
report, each unit. Then second, integration testing, when these units, programs are
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integrated into a module or a product, we carry out the integrated testing so that the
module as together is working well. It is passing control from one program to the other
program or one unit to the other properly.
The equation the coupling is properly done. System testing is carried out on various
systems the product is supposed to work. For example supposing I release a word
processing package like MS-Word. I tested not only on the development system that I have
tested, but also on other operating systems for example if I develop it on Windows 2000 I
have to test it on Windows 98, Windows 2000, Windows Millennium, Windows CE, Windows
XP, Windows Vista and Windows 7.
Also from 1.8 MB ram to one gigabit of ram that it is working or not on these things and all
processors Pentium and Pentium Mobile, Pentium MMS, Pentium Dual Core Pentium and
AMD Athlon, AMD Processor all those processors also I had to check. I have to check with
various types of memory that is provided on the hardware that is system testing.
User acceptance testing is to convince the user that the software is as, that the software
confirms to his specifications. Now internal testing that is carried out not user acceptance
testing. The main objective of internal testing is to uncover all the defects that may be
lacking inside the software.

There are two types of testing, positive testing, negative testing positive testing we carry
out to prove it works, negative testing we carry out to see that it fails. In this various types
of testing are there 22 types of testing, load testings, structural testing, parallel testings,
stress testing, concurrency testing, end to end testing, so on and so forth.

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Unfortunately the accepted fact is because so many tests are possible and each test takes
time and the time of testing is may in some cases be more than the development time all
test and all thoroughly is not carried out, and the software industry and the customers of
software in the development industry accept the 100% testing is not possible.
What is the quality of a product developed by outsourcing the development to some other
party? There is no metric to measure the code or the quality of the product delivered by an
offshore or onshore software development company.
In my book I have proposed one metric to measure the quality of a product, developed by
an outsourced vendor. Did I answer the question Joe?
Joe: Yes, I think so I think you got the most of. However, when I go to that there is kind
of an expectation that - that's all done, and should I feel comfortable when as an IT person
that all that has already been done on the product. That I am not the guinea pig.
Murali: You know you can't be confident but all is done. You can't be confident that all is
done. When you say inspection, inspection means an independent specialist inspector. He
doesn't produce, he doesn't manufacture. He sits with a vernier caliper, screw gauge or
whatever instrument that is required to carry out inspection. His job is only to do
When you would say testing, the testing is done by an independent tester, not by the
production person himself. In software development, I regret to say that quality assurance
need not be independent.

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Many people believe strongly and argue strongly that at unit testing stage, independent
testing is not required. It can be done by the programmer who has written the program
himself. Self-certification is adequate.
When the person who has written program certifies that the program has built-in quality
and it is OK, I am slightly hesitant to say software development is having good quality and
that the consumers can rest assure that all the quality assurance has been diligently
carried out.
Joe: I think it's hard for someone to see their own mistakes. I mean from a practical
standpoint that's a very difficult process to assure quality, is it not?
Murali: I agree with you and I argue at number of places and platforms and with people
that testing must be by independent team.
You know one thing, the inspection also, that is the verification, in software parlance we
call it walk through, code walk through. I write the program, it is to be walked through by
somebody else. That means every line of the code, they will read and understand and see
if it is OK or not.
It is normally carried out within the same project team. That means if you and I are both
developers in a team, I walk through your program. Your program is walked through by
somebody else whose program I may walk through, within the team itself. A third party, a
specialist party hardly ever walks through the program. Integration testing may be carried
out within the project team itself, by the project leader.

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Joe: Are you saying that it is difficult to assure quality or build in quality such as in pair
Murali: Pair programming also, there are two people writing the programs. These two
people may be blind to the same aspect. Unless a third party inspects, can we assure

I'll give you an extreme example to make the concept clear. Supposing a ship is built by a
shipyard. Will you put it out to sea unless a third party organization like Lloyds Shipping
Register or DNV comes and certifies that yes this is seaworthy.
If the same company which built the ship says yes this ship is seaworthy, will you put that
ship out to sea and sit in it? Obviously no, no ship is ever put out to sea unless outside the
company, another company comes and certifies it.
Will you sit in the airplane if the Boeing itself says my plane is having good quality, unless
a third party says? Will the Federal Aviation Authority give permission to such planes or
such ships?
But then how does software be allowed to get away like that? Now these ships, these
planes do have software.
Joe: So are you saying that you think that there should be an independent body that
assures quality in software?
Murali: I am arguing for an independent quality assurance department within the
software development organization, it may surprise you as a manufacturing man, but
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many software development companies do not have a full-fledged quality assurance
Let us start off independent body later, does the company have an independent quality
assurance department. I have seen practically in quite a few organizations, they do not
have a software quality assurance department, and where there is a software quality
assurance department they do not participate in the project development.
But they concentrate and focus on coordinating with the certification agencies like CMMI,
RISO. Process quality rather that product quality.
Total quality management says don't do inspection don't carry out quality assurance
activities, built it into the process, it works in manufacturing because when you built it into
the process and the machines are programmed that way quality is assured but software is
completely developed by human beings, and wherever there are human beings it is human
to err.
I am arguing in my book and I made a strong argument that there must be a full pledged
robust software quality assurance department in every software development organization.
Joe: There is lot of talk about MVP and releasing early and failing often and we hear that
in Agile development and Scrum but you're saying that you are probably not a fan of that
type of development. You are advocating a buffer between the customer and the developer
or someone that can assure in quality.

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Murali: Exactly, you develop whatever way you want. You manufacture whether you
manufacture any ordinary low cost manual lathe machine, or we put it on a CNC lathe
machine. What I am interested is in what I get. You don't care how it is manufactured you
care what you get.
So whether you Agile or whether you do waterfall or whether you do whatever. The quality
assurance is common to all, can we neglect a quality assurance testing inspections and all
necessary activities to ensure that quality is built in, because we are doing agile.
Joe: I understand what you are saying but does that go against some of the Lean, the
Deming quality insurance things that they advocated. You quoted Juran but does it go
against what they are saying or do you think it coincides...
Murali: Juran, Deming and Cosby made those statements against manufacturing in the
manufacturing environment. In the manufacturing environment you manufacture bulk
quantities. You are making four thousand cars a day. Now each car, you test one prototype
against everything, you don't have to test every car for crashing, you crash one car and
rectify it and put it into the process the process is semi-automatic or fully automatic in
some cases.
In semi-automatic fully automatic cases what is the point in testing every activity but you
test, you inspect certain crucial activities. Supposing you run the car comes off the
assembly line and they drive it for five miles. Anything that that car has a problem will
come out. We test it, drive it on test track. Take it and put it in the showroom. But that is a
ten minute, fifteen minute test, but whereas software, you use Vista for three months you
may not know, there is a defect. When that comes, you get the defect.
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When manufacturing is there your car you found to be defective. You take it to the
showroom and say, "I have a manufacturing defect. Replace my car or rectify it." They will
rectify it and replace. You brought a CD in a computer shop. You found a defect. Can you
go back to that shop and say, "This software has a defect, rectify the defect and give me?"
Those statements are very valid. When you are manufacturing 1,000 boards, is the man
testing every board? It is going on an automatic, semi-automatic machine. You test one
and it comes out all right.
Manufacturing is like cooking food. You do not have to test every particle whether it is
cooked or not. You test one and you know whether it is cooked or not.
Software is not like that. Software is made of discreet set of statements some 10,000
lines- 15,000 lines. So by testing one line can we be assured that all other lines are good?
Joe: Probably not.
Murali: That is what I am saying. Software needs a different paradigm. Software
qualification needs a different paradigm. Even in manufacturing, the drawings, the bill of
materials, and the process plan. We are talking of mass manufacturing, but let us take a
ship or an airplane. What is the time spent in designing the airplane and writing the
process plans, preparing the drawings and selecting material, et cetera and actual
manufacture? The design, process planning, production engineering and methods tooling
may take equal time or more time than manufacturing itself. I told you I worked in a
manufacturing environment.

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My company was making control panels, control systems for atomic reactors. Now each
reactor is different. Each panel is different. Each desk is different. From one atomic plant to
another atomic plant and one panel to the other panel, everything had to be engineered
and we had equal number of people in production shops and designing engineering.
Sometimes the designing engineering took more time, process planning, and production
engineering, and tooling, than actual manufacturing itself. In a project environment
software is always projects, there is no mass production. Writing the same line hundred
times never happens. You write hundred lines one time.
The manufacturing paradigms really do not work here. We need to understand us. When
you say threading; BA threading, BS threading, UNC threading, metric threading, those
standards do have diagram. They have depth. They have everything that might be there, is
required. When you say automobile shaft for driving the wheels, how much it should be
forged and how to heat treat it and what should be the strength, everything is there. So
once you set the heat treatment process, you test one prototype and see for that and then
all others go through the same process. The whole heat treatment processes, automated
to remove the stresses that have built in because of the forging of the shaft.
Now that is not there, the mass manufacture is not there. So it takes time in design and
manufacturing and standardization. Well, software industry is 60 years old and
manufacturing industry is about 150, 200 years old. Perhaps that is one thing but by 60
years the manufacturing industry started having standards. Standards, bodies, the
manufacturers have come together and formed associations. Then the consumer safety has
been affected.
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The governments have stepped in and formed their own standards bodies and released
standards insisting that, "Yes, your products must be adhering and conforming to this
standard." Every electrical product has a standard. It should have one mega-ohm of
resistance so that it doesn't give shock to the consumer. This kind of industry associations
have not been there. IEEE has done very good amount of work but those standards still fall
short of the granularity of the standards of manufacturing or construction.

Now in construction you have a society CSI, Construction Specifications Institute. Everyone
who is constructing follows those specifications and NC is there, NEMA is there. Electrical
industry, anybody manufacturing anything electrical will go to NEMA standards and those
associations have formed.
In software development industry I do not see any software development industry
association. OK, SPINS are there Software Prices Improvement Networks these are
voluntary association of individuals interested in process improvement.
Software Project Managers Network SPMM these are again associations of voluntary
individuals software project managers who would like to share their knowledge and
improve each other. None of these have released any standards, so software development
industry needs to tighten its belts in software quality assurance.

Here I want to quote one figure that was available back in 1991 there was lotus
development corporation which was later on acquired by IBM, when they had a flagship
product called Lotus 123, which is spreadsheet database and data combined package like
MS-Excel today and they released version three release three from release two.

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At the time they released the figures in the journals they spent $7 million developing the
product and $8 million doing quality assurance. Lotus 123 did really work now such figures
are not available to quote from resent times, but that is the amount of quality assurance
any project environment in ship manufacturing every welding that is carried out is tested.
Tested for seepage of water regular leaks any bubbles, they conduct a very rigorous
welding test on ships. They conduct test on each of the bolt tightened they will try with a
screwdriver so that kind of inspection and quality assurance discipline has not come in
software development industry and that is what I addressed in my book.
I was trying to wake up software development industry, wake up tighten your belts
otherwise someday something is going to happen. You know one thing I have mentioned
certain disasters also in my book. Landed at a speed of 170 knots, 195 miles per hour that
is 20 knots or 23 miles per hour faster than the standard speed. The pilot had to steer the
plane off the runway as it was reaching the end. The left wing hit an embankment and a
fire broke out, spreading to the passenger compartment. As a result, the co-pilot and one
passenger died. One of the reasons was software.
Gulf War 1991 - '92, somewhere like that, the original Desert Storm, patriot missiles in
Gulf Wars Operation Desert Storm caused an accident. The battery from which the missiles
were fired was in operation for 100 hours, during which time the system's internal clock
drifted by one-third of a second. This resulted in a patriot missile missing the scud missile,
and it missed by 600 meters because a scud missile was not intercepted and hit the US
Army barracks killing 28 soldiers.

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In 1999, the mission to launch the Polar Lander to Mars failed as the software identified
vibrations in the vehicle's legs during touchdown and shut off the engines 40 meters about
to 135 feet from the surface. As a result, the Polar Lander was lost.
And Y2K problem is well known. I don't have to refer to it. And, you know, this Unix Linux
software computers, there is a 2038 problem waiting to happen. In 2038, the clock will be
reset and everything will be treated as 20th century.
So thus, there are software problems, and unless the software industry wakes up, I think
the disasters are going to happen. In the meanwhile, what the software industry, especially
in products is doing is, release a new version, latest version before somebody asks, "Fix
these defects."
Now, Microsoft releases Visual Basic. Visual Basic was released from 1994, and in 1996 or
so, basic versions four was there. In 2000 or 2001, six has come. 2003, .Net has come.
2005, another version of .Net has come. 2008, another version of .Net has come. In 2010,
another version of .Net has come. How many days does it take to master a language as
large as Visual Basic? It takes more than two years.
By the time you master, a new version is coming, so before you find out all the defects, all
the bugs, a new version is released, as better, more productive, more stronger, more
robust, more bug free, more this, more that.
Joe: That's where I struggle with is software. Once I start making it productive for me,
there seems to be a new version. I need to upgrade or it is going to be incompatible.

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Seems like I never get to master what I am attempting because it is not like I am on it
24/7 OK. I only use it few hours a week. It takes me a certain amount of time to master.
Murali: We are from software development industry. We don't master before a new
version is released, so how can we expect ordinary people to master that. In construction
and manufacturing has not been internalized in software. Suppose if Toyota steering had
one trouble, steering and in some cases not all cases, the amount of bad publicity Toyota
had was enormous, it's only steering and only in certain cases at certain speeds it has
misbehaved and it has called back all the cars and repaired it.
The same amount of Windows Vista also received bad publicity. How many Windows Vista
customers were given a free new improved CD? Patches were given, you download and
install them and it will work well.
Now this is a product, I am talking of a consumer product, Windows is a consumer product
but what about the software developed for custom - customers, I was party to - I
witnessed one incident I was not party I was not in the development team, a stock
exchange has computerized its operations before that they were doing manual trading and
they wanted to do it through computer trading.
The first order they placed was a sell order and the computer has bought the stock.
Joe: What comes to my mind is you go to the new versions and then you get new
versions and all of a sudden nobody is supporting the older version. You have to update or
you have change...

                                Software Quality Assurance Podcast
                                      Copyright Business901
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Implementing Lean Marketing Systems
Murali: That is another malady of software companies and the new version takes more
space more ram needs more hardware resources giving almost the same functionality at a
little more functionality. Windows has the problem of viruses and this viruses problem had
been there for the last 15 years. In these 15 years at least five new versions of operating
system have come, why this was not tackled by now I am sure Microsoft has the best
brains. They can brainstorm. They can come out with the ideas they know much better
than I know or you know or anybody knows they have a collective wisdom. I respect Bill
Gates he is a great man, great man he has been my hero.
Why are they not still doing it? Why are we still required to buy from other anti-virus
vendors? Why can't they make the operating system un-penetrable by these kinds of
viruses. Programs worms I understand if I put a floppy but if I put a floppy and do not
copy how can it automatically be allowed to copy?
If I am not doing something how can it ...if I connect to the Internet viruses just fly in. You
cannot without any anti-virus software for 10 minutes your computer is hacked by some
virus, without us doing anything how can programs come and occupy our disk?
Do we have that Involvement, I can tell you with confidence Joe that majority of the
software development organizations do not have specialized software testing team I am
not talking about quality assurance totally, I am just talking of testing team. A quality
assurance department champions quality and takes ownership of quality by verifications,
inspections and writing processes and standards which will eliminate the defect.
Joe: Is there something you'd like to add in this podcast that I haven't asked you?

                                  Software Quality Assurance Podcast
                                        Copyright Business901
Business901                                     Podcast Transcription
Implementing Lean Marketing Systems
Murali: On software quality assurance, and the certification models, you know there are
CMMI and ISO certification models are there. Many organizations take these certifications
as a proof of their commitment to quality.
Comprehensively about being shortages or drawbacks in those models and suggested a
new model. My new model I suggested is based on the financial assurance. Every public
limited company has to get its accounts audited by an external body five times a year, for
four quarters and annual accounts.
This is mandatory. Otherwise they will not accept. And the charges are not low. Minimum
$70 they charge per auditor and however managers etc are charged at $200, $300. They
do for minimum of two to four weeks per quarter, and a minimum of one to one half
months at the annual report.
They assure that funds are used properly. And you know one thing, the first thing the
external auditor ensures is that there is an internal auditor in the organization and that
internal auditor has been performing diligently.
Now neither the CMMI, nor the ISO ensure that there is an internal quality control manager
and that he has been performing diligently. So we need to have a new paradigm for
assuring the quality of the products that come out of software. And it should be based on
the financial assurance methodologies of companies, which are listed companies or public
limited incorporated companies which have raised funds from the public.
Without doing that, the public cannot ensure the quality of the software. But the quality
assurance organizations can voluntarily adopt good quality assurance practices learning
                                  Software Quality Assurance Podcast
                                        Copyright Business901
Business901                                    Podcast Transcription
Implementing Lean Marketing Systems
from construction industry and manufacturing industry, implement them and improve
them. Automobile industry would not have improved but for Ralph Nader who took on
automobile industry and made a hue and cry whenever there is something uncovered. We
need a Ralph Nader for software development industry.
Joe: How can someone get a hold of you?

Murali: You search on my name Murali Chemuturi on the web, you will see 30 pages. And
I have my website, chemuturi.com in which my phone number and mail id are there. I will
give the phone number and mail ID. My mail ID is simple, murali@chemuturi.com, and my
phone number for USA is 347-394-3138, and my website chemuturi.com.
I'll be glad to answer any mail and email I receive within 24 hours normally, unless I am
out of town or something like that.
Joe: All right. I would like to thank you very much.
Murali: Thank you Joe. Thank you for having me and allowing me to express my opinions
freely and frankly. Thank you very much.

                                 Software Quality Assurance Podcast
                                       Copyright Business901
Business901                                           Podcast Transcription
Implementing Lean Marketing Systems
                                                                                             Joseph T. Dager
                                                                             Lean Six Sigma Black Belt
                                                                 Ph: 260-438-0411 Fax: 260-818-2022
                                                                         Email: jtdager@business901.com
                                                                Web/Blog: http://www.business901.com
                                                                                     Twitter: @business901
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                          with ingenuity. A brilliant mind that is always a pleasure to work with." James R.

Joe Dager is President of Business901, a progressive company providing direction in areas such as Lean
Marketing, Product Marketing, Product Launches and Re-Launches. As a Lean Six Sigma Black
Belt, Business901 provides and implements marketing, project and performance planning methodologies
in small businesses. The simplicity of a single flexible model will create clarity for your staff and as a result
better execution. My goal is to allow you spend your time on the need versus the plan.

An example of how we may work: Business901 could start with a consulting style utilizing an individual
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                                        Software Quality Assurance Podcast
                                              Copyright Business901

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Description: This is a transcription of a Business901 podcast on Quality Assurance with Murali Krishna, Chemuturi Chief Consultant.