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									                                                                       eQuaLified Management Council
                                                                                          JUNE 2012
                                                                            UNCONFIRMED MINUTES

                                       UNCONFIRMED MINUTES
                                           JUNE 28, 2012
                                          ESTREL HOTEL
                                         BERLIN, GERMANY

These minutes are not final until confirmed by the eQuaLified Management Council/Industry Round
Table in writing or by vote at a subsequent meeting. Information herein does not constitute a
communication or recommendation from the eQuaLified Management Council/Industry Round
Table and shall not be considered as such by any agency.



1.1    Call to Order

       The eQuaLified Management Council (eQMC) was called to order at 1:00 p.m., 28-JUN-12.
       Reminder was given that standard rules regarding avoidance of conflict of interest apply.
       Introductions were made and the agenda was reviewed.

       Industry Participants Present

       NAME                       COMPANY NAME
       Richard     Blyth          Rolls-Royce plc
       Mike        Brandt         Alcoa
       Christian   Buck           SAFRAN Group                  Vice-Chairperson
       Jeff        Conrad         Cessna Aircraft Co.
       Richard     Freeman        TWI
       John        Haddock        BAE Systems
       Eric        Jacklin        F. M. Callahan & Son
       Bob         Koukol         Honeywell Aerospace
       Jeff        Lott           The Boeing Co.
       Dave        Michaud        Fountain Plating
       Colby       Nicks          Bell Helicoptor
       Mark        Rechtsteiner   GE Aviation
       Richard     Rowe           Honeywell Aerospace
       Laurie      Strom          Honeywell Aerospace           Chairperson
       Angelina    Mendoza        Goodrich Corp.
       Cheng       Sheng          COMAC

       PRI Staff Present

        Hannah         Godfrey
        Liu            Le
        Joanna         Leigh

       Laurie Strom opened the meeting with introductions and a brief overview of the intent of the

                                                                        eQuaLified Management Council
                                                                                           JUNE 2012
                                                                             UNCONFIRMED MINUTES

      The minutes from the February 2012 meeting in San Diego were approved as written. All RAIL
      Items were reviewed as detailed on the attached.

        RAIL eQMC Mtg
      Agenda Berlin- 28JUN12.xlsx

3.0   eQuaLified PROGRAM UPDATE

         eQMC program
      status 28JUN12.pptx

      Hannah Godfrey reviewed the current program status, noting that Richard Rowe is leading the BoK
      Panel and that Michael Brandt is leading the Examinations Panel.

      An update on the procedural documentation was also provided:

              PD6100 – A structure is currently being created (deadline: 31 August 2012)
              PD6200 – It is anticipated that a draft will be sent out for comment and ballot to the
                        Examinations Panel in July 2012

      With regard to the technical boards for Heat Treating and Chemical Processing, a request was
      made by PRI for participants to nominate their technical staff to engage with this activity. The goal
      is to transition the Heat Treating and Chemical Processing examinations to be fully industry-
      managed by the end of 2012.

      Although Welding and Coatings were suggested as the next special processes to be transitioned to
      Industry-Managed, a request was made to PRI to conduct a brief survey. The survey should
      include descriptions of the prioritization ranking criteria. Examples of criteria noted:
            Personnel changeover
            Industry availability (lack of other available methods)
            (Perceived) risk of component failure
            Level of qualification required (Operator, Planner, Owner)

      There should also be opportunity for free-text comments, as well as sub-elements (e.g. for welding,
      there should be the chance for survey respondents to indicate the particular welding process
      required – fusion welding, resistance welding, etc)

      ACTION ITEM: Hannah Godfrey to issue a survey before the Pittsburgh meeting and add this as
      an item on the agenda in Pittsburgh so the eQMC can review and discuss the survey results (DUE
      DATE: 31-AUG-12)

      During the discussion regarding the creation of the BoK structure it was decided that completing
      the top three criteria (Category / Family / Scope) should be the goal for Chemical Processing and
      Heat Treat for 2012. The size of the task was acknowledged but the intent is to complete this in

                                                                            eQuaLified Management Council
                                                                                               JUNE 2012
                                                                                 UNCONFIRMED MINUTES

      Hannah Godfrey introduced the open discussion, requesting feedback on the status of industry
      activity relating to personnel development: What are the attendees’ companies doing currently,
      what do they want to improve, and what is the industry need for personnel development?

            eQMC open

      Participant Feedback (names and companies removed):

           Current focus on internal activity and collating information to determine how to proceed.
            Purpose of participation in eQMC is to learn how industry is approaching this collaboratively
             so that expertise and responsibility is shared appropriately and not retained internally.
            A strong interest in eQuaLified, in particular Chemical Processing. Resources have been
             committed accordingly. Etch inspection is a particular concern.
            Operator level is of particular interest. Coatings CNC training in particular needs attention.
            Not convinced of the need for Planner level qualification.
            The engineering shortage is well known. The concern is that welding inspection personnel, for
             example, after training, often leave their companies for more money elsewhere.
            Engineering as a profession also has a bad perception among young people. Work in schools
             is being used to address this but more is needed.
            It was noted that eQuaLified can also help with the perceptual issue as it demonstrates a
             career path to young people. There is training for trade (operators) and training for scientists
             (metallurgists) but there is nothing available for the people in the middle.
           Importance of vertical integration with regard to training - for many commodities, there is
            nothing formalized. It is really only NDT and welding that have structures.
           Some companies carry out informal training internally, but this is not prevalent and that leads
            to inconsistency and concerns about the amount of focus on personnel development. The staff
            is trained at school, college etc but then they join the “real world” and it is very different so this
            is definitely a problem that needs to be addressed.
           There is little done for personnel development at our suppliers.
           Today, there is a lot of emphasis on soft skill training e.g. management skills and we need to
            ensure there is also focus on technical aspects.
           Not aware of any training within our company that addresses the shop floor specifically.
           There is not much training available for composites – possibly because it’s a comparatively
            newer technology.
           There is a lot of Chemical Processing training available, for example through the US National
            Association of Metal Finishers. At our company, all supervisors must attain “master” status.
           Company uses a mixture of external and internal. Cost is obviously a concern, but ongoing
            personnel development is essential as technologies, best practices etc. change and they must
            keep up.
           Mandating the program may be a concern. It would be better to show the benefits in terms of
            resolving audit findings and improving quality.
            Traditionally, there has been no mandate to ensure ongoing personnel development, although
             it appears that the Primes are doing training more than the Suppliers
            The intent is for the Owner to be responsible for flowing the training down throughout the
             organization. However, do smaller companies have the time and resource to do that?
            There is a need to have clear terminology (e.g. methods engineer (UK) v. planner (US))

                                                                         eQuaLified Management Council
                                                                                            JUNE 2012
                                                                              UNCONFIRMED MINUTES

          Local chapters of industry groups previously provided training but membership/attendance is
           down so companies having to supplement on the shop floor with their own training.

         The key is the quality of training and that, in the future, knowing that a supplier was involved
          with a program like eQuaLified would make them feel more confident about the working


      Hannah Godfrey reviewed the subscriber agreements and program cost model.

      Agreements-Program Cost Model.ppt

      A deadline has not been set at this time for participants to sign the subscriber agreement, however
      this is being reconsidered. The draft will be finalized by the end of August 2012 and sent to
      participants for review. The goal is to have some subscribers sign by the end of 2012. The idea is
      now being introduced from an AOP (Annual Operating Plan) perspective.

      ACTION ITEM: Hannah Godfrey to send out the subscriber agreement to all interested parties for
      review (DUE DATE: 31-AUG-12)

      The cost model will have two initial revenue streams (examinations and subscriptions). This will
      grow to three when administration fees from training companies are included. In the future, BoK
      subscriptions would be required, as well. It is anticipated that the examinations will generate most
      of the income.

      Certifications will be valid for five years, meaning that on an annual/monthly basis, the examination
      fee is nominal. The key reasons for this decision are the need for standardization and manageable
      administration. In addition, feedback indicated that a five-year validity would be optimal taking into
      account personnel turnover, advances in technology etc. This has not been finalized but it seems
      reasonable, creating value without excessive burden.

      It was suggested that this topic be revisited during the October 2012 meeting in Pittsburgh, or by
      the individual special process BoK panels if different special processes have different
      requirements. The group should be careful of complexity. There are many criteria that influence
      timeframes and the eQMC should follow the Nadcap example by standardizing where possible to
      create a stronger, cohesive program. Richard Freeman noted that TWI train in other industries
      such as construction and offered to bring information to the Pittsburgh meeting for benchmarking

      ACTION ITEM: Richard Freeman to bring information regarding personnel qualification validity
      timeframes in other industries to the Pittsburgh meeting for benchmarking purposes (DUE DATE:

      ACTION ITEM: Hannah Godfrey to add “Personnel Qualification Timeframe Validity:
      Benchmarking” to the October meeting agenda (DUE DATE: 22-OCT-12)

      It was explained that the cost model information included in the presentation was based on a global
      organization subscribing to two special processes. The concern was raised that for one heat
                                                                      eQuaLified Management Council
                                                                                              JUNE 2012
                                                                              UNCONFIRMED MINUTES
      treatment operator, there are 22 examinations required at a cost of $300 each. It was clarified that
      this was based on the Owner level. The Owner is then intended to train the remainder of staff.
      There could also be “bundling” of exams or “exam on demand” to customize the scope. This will
      make the activity more cost-effective for each company.

      Example: Staff from a company that only works with aluminum would only need to answer
      questions on that topic. If there are staff working with multiple materials etc, the challenge for this
      group would be to create an examination that can assess accurately based on individual needs.
      Exam on demand would be a more flexible model in that context, rather than multiple separate
      examinations, but industry input will be needed to create guidance criteria on examination

      It was noted that eQuaLified is a risk mitigation program, not a risk reduction activity and improving
      operator expertise will reduce rework and associated costs. Internal company rework costs will go


      Due to time constraints, Hannah Godfrey tabled this item for discussion at the next teleconference.

          eQMC exam
      transition model.pptx

      ACTION ITEM: Dina Rigot to schedule two eQMC teleconferences before the Pittsburgh meeting
      and arrange for the BoK and Examination Panels to have teleconferences as well (DUE DATE: 13-

      7.0       NEW BUSINESS

      Question was raised on whether PRI had begun to liaise with external training companies. Hannah
      Godfrey noted that TWI was present at the meeting and that she had begun to liaise with the UK
      Institute of Metal Finishers as well. Hannah explained that setting up the BoK and Examination
      special process groups was the priority and that reaching out to appropriate third parties would
      follow as part of a gradual development.

      Question was raised about the relationship with IAQG, noting concern that PRI is viewed by some
      parties as a sole source and that the IAQG has a reputation the eQMC could leverage.
      Relationship with IAQG recognizes that PRI has access to special process knowledge and is the
      best forum to develop the special process BoKs.

      Question was raised about progress with CACRC, which was interested in composites
      development. Hannah Godfrey confirmed that the relationship would be developed when the
      eQMC focuses on Composites but for now, the priorities are Heat Treating and Chemical

                                                                                      eQuaLified Management Council
                                                                                                         JUNE 2012
                                                                                           UNCONFIRMED MINUTES


           RAIL eQMC Meeting
          June 2012 09Jul12 dlr.xlsx

ADJOURNMENT – 28-JUN-12 – Meeting was adjourned at 3:00 p.m.

Minutes Prepared by:
Joanna Leigh (

                                           ***** For PRI Staff use only: ******

Are procedural/form changes required based on changes/actions approved during this meeting? (select one)

YES*                            NO

*If yes, the following information is required:

Documents requiring revision:           Who is responsible:                                   Due date:


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