Pacific Northwest Coordination Group Steering Committee (PNWCG SC)
16 December 2009 @ Northwest Coordination Center (NWCC)
Meeting notes final version
Attendees: Ken Snell, R6 USFS, Carl Gossard, BLM-SORO, Travis Medema, ODF (for Paul Bell); Jim
Walker, OR Fire Marshal with John Ingrao’s (Oregon Fire Chiefs) proxy; Mike Matlick, WA Fire Marshals;
Joe Shramek, WA DNR; Cory Winnie, BIA; Tod Johnson, NPS; Pat Kelly-Executive Director/Facilitator; Jan
Mathis, BLM-SORO, notetaker; Presenters: Sarah Robertson, Chair, OWT; Bill Lafferty, ODF (filling in for
Jim Wolf); Dick Gormley, Chair, TWT.
Leader’s Intent Ken
Let’s efficiently work through our agenda today.
Finalize Agenda Pat
(Handout #1 – PNWCG SC Meeting Agenda, Dec 16, 2009 v.3, 1 p)
Finalize November notes Jan
(Handout #2 – PNWCG SC November Draft Meeting Notes v.2, 6 pp)
Jan will make a couple of corrections, finalize notes and post to library/website.
Verify 2010 SC Meeting Dates Pat
(Handout #3 – 2009 Work Team Restructure Summary of Work to date, Updated Nov. 25, 2009, v5, 4 pp)
Jan 20, 2010
Feb 17 + Feb 18 to be SC/WT Meeting
NMAC/GMAC fall meeting update Ken
There were two meetings, one with the other GMAC’s and one with NMAC and the GMAC’s.
Our geographic area took two issues to the meeting: 1) The future of Wildland Fire Management Teams and,
2) The VIPR issue.
Here are some highlights (summary from GACGAC Meeting notes Dec 1, 2009; Boise, ID)
NMAC – Support Redbook format for GA and National Mobe Guides.
PNWCG SC Meeting December 16, 2009 pg 1
NMAC/NWCG – Support a national assessment of changing standard crew weights for large
transport mobilizations. A proposal has been made to IOSWT.
NWCG – VIPR – new AQM tool being used by the FS. Helps the agency create contracts and
agreements for firefighting resources. The VIPR program needs to be adjusted to include crew
performance as part of the Best Value calculations, benefits all agencies.
NMAC – Clearly define governance for NMAC vs NICC to Coordinating Groups and Coordinators.
NMAC – recommend and support formalizing the Coordinators Group, charter with formal NMAC
rep, GAC rep.
NMAC – reporting – what is the national expectation for reporting fires being managed for multiple
NMAC-NWCG – Need a national strategy for IMTs. Need goals and objectives, define numbers,
agency composition, address the role, responsibilities, expectations for use of NIMO and increase
interagency coordination. Consider removing IMT typing.
GACC to GACC IA Air Tanker Issue: Option A – In support of a National Strategy for all National
Resources – we need to look at all the pieces vs. a piece meal approach. Option B – In support the
development of a National Air Tanker Strategy, we are using rules from the early 90’s with less AT.
Other topics discussed:
o Incident Business practices
o AD and rehired annuitant authority
o Issues relating to incidents which merge, join complexes and split from complexes related to WFDSS.
This has been recognized and it’s being worked on.
(Incident Business person is working on, Sara Fisher, Chair of the NWCG Incident Business Practices
o I-Suite will be web-based in the near future. Probably will see that in spring of 2011.
o A number of geographic areas have noted the expanded use of Type 3 organizations.
o The Southeast Geo area is also doing e-applications for IMTs.
o This area would like to pilot and develop protocols for aerial and ground extraction of firefighters
from remote areas. We haven’t heard from NMAC yet if we’ll be allowed to do this.
Put as a future agenda topic: Develop a draw-down process on resources for fires we’re
managing for resource benefit
Work Teams / Council restructure Mike
Discussed restructure of Fire Prevention / Communications / Fire Investigations Working Team. Incoming
Chair Esther Hernandez has arranged for a meeting to take place on January 5, 2010.
The following is a list of possible attendees:
FS – Jeree Mills, Tom Knappenberger
BIA – Len Diaz
DNR – Sandy Williams
ODF – Steve Wilson, Jeff Bonebrake, Rod Nichols
BLM – Lauren Maloney
FWS – Kelly Cardoza
WA OSFM – Esther Hernandez
NPS – Vacant
KOG (Keep Oregon Green) – Mary Ellen Holly (Ad Hoc Member)
PNWCG SC Meeting December 16, 2009 pg 2
FPA Advisory Council Tod
Charter now reads as an advisory council. They will keep the PNWCG SC informed and educated on what’s
Ken signed charter. Jan will create a pdf file and work with Jim Edmonds to post to PNWCG
This completes the work of transitioning the FPA group to an Advisory Council.
Proposed Safety and Health WT Ken
(Handout #4 – Draft Charter Safety and Health Working Team, PNW Wildfire Coordinating Group, 2 pp)
Ken introduced the concept of a PNWCG Safety and Health Working Team based on the documents sent to
the members prior to the meeting.
Discussed 3 taskings that the team could work on:
1) Develop recommendations to help PNWCG agencies improve the use of seat belts.
2) Extracting injured firefighters via ground transport.
3) Improve our safety culture.
All the members support the concept.
Plan to get charter finalized at the February meeting.
Ken will act as the founding liaison.
January agenda items, final edits to charter, proposed membership, proposed initial taskings.
Strategic Plan / Program of Work Pat
Discussion on developing a maintenance plan.
SC review SP & POW.
Initial update of POW for 2010 / 2011.
Look to future.
No Word Smithing
Share at the SC/WT session in Feb, get action and reaction from the WTs. Top 3 questions:
1) Does SP address each teams area?
2) Does existing POW align with the SP?
3) Content of 2010 / 2011 POW?
At the Feb meeting:
Validate strategic plan
Make additional recommendations for strategy
Develop refresh cycle process
PNWCG SC Meeting December 16, 2009 pg 3
Task Order 0905-03, IMT oversight Sarah
(Handout #5 – Task Order 0905-03 Type 2 IMT Oversight efficiencies, 2 pp)
The Operations Working Team completed the Task Order on January 21, 2010. The OWT initiated a joint
region-wide announcement for both Type 1 teams, as well as a region-wide announcement for the four
Oregon Area teams. A new on-line application process (ICAPS) was developed by Dale Guenther, and all
applicant applications are accessed online by ICs. The application process seemed to facilitate the
opportunity for individuals to apply to all teams and positions of interest.
The Operations Working Team met with the Type I ICs in November to review Command and General Staff
selections. The OWT also met with the Oregon Area team ICs to review selections and to facilitate the
sharing of applicants between teams with shortages and those teams having a surplus of applicants.
Overall, the process went well, with communication improved among the ICs. There is a genuine
commitment to help provide resources for teams with shortages. Dale Guenther initiated a review
questionnaire for all users of ICAPS to ensure that improvements are made to software and on-line
TO 0905-03 Type 2 IMT Oversight efficiencies has been accomplished and closed out.
Need to have some discussion on whether we want to have one sitting geo-board for all Oregon
teams? If so, a couple things to finesse would be ORCA, making sure that all the geo-boards feel
The ICAPS system is a fairly robust system and can get some very specific data, such as: pull
reports, ask questions about the makeup of the team, do a comparison of retirees and agency people.
Plan to send out a user survey to everyone who used ICAPS, so we can get feedback and to make the
system better next year.
Predictive Services Proposal Ken
(Handout #6 – National Significant Wildland Fire Potential, Sept to Nov 2009, 2 pp)
Reviewed 2 maps for feedback, which is preferred? Discussion and agreement on Seasonal Example “A”
Pat to write a note to Tom Wordell with the feedback.
West Wide Wildfire Risk Assessment (WWA) Bill Lafferty
(Handout #7 – West Wide Wildfire Risk Assessment Project Overview, 3 pp)
Presented overview of the project. The goal is to produce a wildfire risk assessment of all lands across west.
(all 17 western states & selected Pacific Islands)
There are a lot of applications and use for this product. Deliverables:
A comprehensive wildfire database will be developed reflecting current conditions.
Assessment will utilize the GIS database and leverage existing proven risk models to derive measures
of wildfire threat, fire effects, wildfire risk and communities-at-risk.
Final Report – a summary of the risk assessment methods and findings will be developed including
state and regional statistics.
Technology transfer – a key element of the WWA project and outputs will be delivered with detailed
information in a form ready to use by project partners.
PNWCG SC Meeting December 16, 2009 pg 4
Opted for a user fee for access, however, can purchase a license from Sanborn (more expensive)
The assessment will be just a snapshot, but could be repeatable down the road.
Should be able to utilize this assessment at any scale.
There’s concern out there about having too many assessments out there and which one is right.
For more information, visit the WWA project website at www.westwideriskassessemnt.com
Questions may be directed to Jim Wolf, WWA Project Manager at firstname.lastname@example.org
Federal liaisons will handle the flow of information to the agencies (from handout):
USFS – Patti Koppenol
BLM – Krista Gollnick
BIA – Dennis Dupuis
NPS – Sue Husari
FWS – Pam Ensley
SC/WT/Advisory Council meeting Pat
(Handout #8 – Task Order 0901-01, Planning and logistics support for the Steering Committee-WorkTeam
Workshop, 2 pp)
What objectives does the SC want to meet at the workshop?
1. Get feedback on the top 3 questions on the POW / SP from WTs
1) Does SP address each teams area?
2) Does existing POW align with the SP?
3) Content of 2010 / 2011 POW?
2. Update on team progress
3. WTs ideas / SC ideas
4. What support do the teams need?
5. Building relationship with SC and WT.
6. Issue scan at multiple levels. (POW / SC / Bottlenecks)
7. Overall vision /view of SC strategy and expectations
A. Brainstorming based upon Big “T” accomplishment.
Expectations of SC.
POW / SP (see pt. 1)
9. Eliminate report outs
10. View from the 30K level
Dick & Pat will take this information and bring back a proposal in January.
PNWCG SC Meeting December 16, 2009 pg 5
Update TO 0907-04 TWT, Training MOU’s Carl / Dick
(Handout #9 – Task Order 0907-04 MOU’s with FCA’s, 1 p)
Propose to de-couple record verification from training MOUs, so we can focus more on the people giving the
training and not so much time dealing with record verification.
Record verification should be tied to the crew agreement.
The current process is making very difficult for the TWT to monitor training.
Proposal that Training MOUs go under TWT from ODF.
SC in agreement that record verification be separated from training MOU. Carl will discuss
with Bob Young & IBPWT. Subject to an agreed to implementation plan.
The records verification process should look the same between Engine Tender Agreement and Crew
Propose existing tasking remain as worded with extension of the completion date.
Carl & Dick to generate a document reflecting the work of the Task Order 0907-04, items 1, 2
& 3 to be ready for review at the Jan 20, 2010 meeting. This will leave item 4 for the SC to
WA – No Man’s Land Mike / Joe
Legislators are working on a couple of issues: one is dealing with no man’s land and the second is regarding
contracting which involves impending legislation to mobilize using contractors first. This could create
problems. Will have more to report in January.
Jan to work with Jim Edmonds to get Strategic Plan, Operating Plan and the FPA charter
posted to the PNWCG website.
Rx - Look for opportunities to complete a topic in 1 or 2 meetings.
Rx – Emphasize completed staff work.
Handout #1 – PNWCG SC Meeting Agenda, Dec 16, 2009 v.3, 1p
Handout #2 – PNWCG SC November Draft Meeting Notes v.2, 6 pp
Handout #3 – 2009 Work Team Restructure Summary of Work to date, Updated Nov. 25, 2009, v5, 4 pp
Handout #4 – Draft Charter Safety and Health Working Team, PNW Wildfire Coordinating Group, 2 pp
Handout #5 – Task Order 0905-03 Type 2 IMT Oversight efficiencies, 2 pp
Handout #6 – National Significant Wildland Fire Potential, Sept to Nov 2009, 2 pp
Handout #7 – West Wide Wildfire Risk Assessment Project Overview, 3 pp
Handout #8 – Task Order 0901-01, Planning and logistics support for the SC-WT Workshop, 2 pp
Handout #9 – Task Order 0907-04 MOU’s with FCA’s, 1 p
PNWCG SC Meeting December 16, 2009 pg 6