BBC
Ouch Podcast 12: February 2007
Ouch Podcast 12: February 2007 Valentine’s Transcript
http://www.bbc.co.uk/ouch/
Presented by Mat Fraser and Liz Carr
[Music]
MAT: Mmmmm.
LIZ: Hello.
MAT: Hi there. It‟s the February Podcast.
LIZ: And you know what that means. It‟s the month of Valentine‟s.
MAT: A lot of love.
LIZ: Stop rubbing your nipples. What‟s on this month‟s Podcast?
MAT: Coming up.
LIZ: It‟s just fantastic you can reach them, to be honest.
MAT: Well, they‟re very long and pointy, like little leather toggles, Liz. Anyway,
coming up on this month‟s Podcast, should you admit to being disabled?
Hmmm, on a dating website, a very interesting question.
LIZ: Hmmm hmm.
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MAT: Our own Rob Crossan will be checking out what responses you get when you
do, if any. He‟ll be with us soon.
LIZ: Now, sticking with all things love, later we‟re going to be joined by a sex
worker…
MAT: Huh!
LIZ: …who specialises in disabled people.
MAT: Huh-huh.
LIZ: Plus the almost legendary Tuppy Owens from the Outsiders Club on the
phone.
MAT: Hmmm. And what‟s up with you then, cripple, hmmm? Our Vegetable,
Vegetable, Vegetable quiz returns, and we‟re told it might be a long one, Mrs.
LIZ: Ha, ha. And take a quick listen to this.
[Music]
LIZ: That‟s rock band Freeslave with their song Fire Burns Inside, and we‟ve got
two of them in the studio with us right now. Hello, lads, let‟s get a quick
name check from you.
HAYDEN: Hello, I‟m Hayden.
AARON: Hi, I‟m Aaron.
LIZ: They‟re going to be performing for us live and unplugged a little later. And
also going to be doing your version of the Ouch! theme tune!
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MAT: Ha, ha.
HAYDEN: Yes, we‟ve spent all of three and a half minutes writing a brand new version
and we can‟t wait to premier it for you.
MAT: Oh, this is so exciting. It could start a whole trend.
LIZ: I can‟t wait.
MAT: Couldn‟t it?
LIZ: Yes.
MAT: Well, I guess we‟ll hear from you guys later then, brilliant. Now, Liz.
LIZ: Yes, Mathew.
MAT: As is customary, for the introduction to our loving website Podcast.
LIZ: Huh-huh.
MAT: What have you been up to for the last month?
LIZ: Well, I do have to give a bit of a name check.
MAT: Alright then.
LIZ: I‟m quite excited about this. Just after the last Podcast.
MAT: Yes.
LIZ: I was doing a gig.
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MAT: Yes.
LIZ: A comedy gig.
MAT: Hmmm hmm.
LIZ: Right? And there in the audience were a couple of wheelies. Well, a couple
of disabled people; one a wheelie. And, of course, you have to make contact,
and the compare came up to me and he said, “We‟ve got some people in the
audience over from America to see you.”
MAT: Wow! Fans?
LIZ: Well, you know, I‟m not saying that, but anyway, fans of the Podcast, yes. I
think they were Emma and Jason from somewhere beginning with M in the
USA. And we had a chat and they had come to see the gig. They were in the
town for the weekend, how jet set‟s that?
MAT: Wow!
LIZ: And they‟d looked on the website and they‟d found that I had a show, but
they‟re huge fans of the Podcast, so thank you for supporting us. What else
have I been doing, der, der, der, did a thing on You and Yours, a bit of a brief
thing on misability, which was fascinating.
MAT: Oh, yeah.
LIZ: Do you remember last month?
MAT: And how did they take it on You and Yours?
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LIZ: Well, this time I spoke to the guy from the company who had bought the rights
to the misability disabled beauty contest.
MAT: Hmmm hmm.
LIZ: And he tried to deny that it was just for money, but that‟s pretty much what
it‟s going to be. But they kept saying, “No, no, there wouldn‟t be a swimsuit
section in that if we did it.” Hmmm, I think they‟re probably lying there,
Mathew.
MAT: Yeah. (Sighs)
LIZ: Hmmm, come on, what have you been doing? Is it something – no, I have
something else, but it‟s something we share, and I‟d like to talk about that in a
minute.
MAT: Okay. Okay.
LIZ: So, have you been doing anything that‟s not to do with Elvis this month?
MAT: (Laughs) Yes, I have been doing things…
LIZ: Good.
MAT: …that are not to do with Elvis.
LIZ: Hoorah.
MAT: Funnily enough, I went to see the Orchid Exhibition at Kew Gardens.
LIZ: Great, okay.
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MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: Shall we move on?
MAT: No, we won‟t move on, Liz, because when I was in a little garden centre.
LIZ: Yes.
MAT: I was looking, you know, like you inevitably do, you go through the gift shop
when you go to any of these places, and I was looking at some of the
gardening equipment. And I was looking at the rakes, the forks, and the hoes,
and things like that. And I came upon this piece of equipment.
LIZ: Right.
MAT: Would you like to audio describe it? It‟s a hoe.
LIZ: It is a hoe.
MAT: It‟s called a circular hoe, and it‟s a handle. What else is it, Liz?
LIZ: It‟s a wooden handle.
MAT: Hmmm hmm.
LIZ: With a long bit of metal, about four inches long, and at the end there‟s a
circular metal circle.
MAT: Yeah, about one and a half inches in diameter.
LIZ: Yeah.
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MAT: Wouldn‟t you say?
LIZ: Yeah. It‟s the size of a, you know, you could probably get a banana or
something bigger in there, I would guess.
MAT: That‟s right.
LIZ: Yeah.
MAT: And as a short termed individual in the month of love.
LIZ: Yeah, hmmm hmm.
MAT: I just thought, you know, it‟s all very well for people to, you know, have
lovers and…
LIZ: Have a sex worker.
MAT: And have a sex worker, pay for sex, for you don‟t need that short armed chaps,
if you‟ve got your own hoe, that‟s what I‟m saying!
LIZ: Ho, ho, ho.
MAT: Green Giant.
LIZ: Green Giant (laughs).
MAT: (Laughs) And boy it will be if you use this too much, I can tell you.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: Dear oh dear.
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LIZ: That‟s great.
MAT: Other than that, Liz, I‟ve not been doing a lot. I‟ve just been, you know,
importing some French antique oak furniture into my house.
LIZ: Great.
MAT: Playing the piano.
LIZ: (Sighs)
MAT: And going shopping.
LIZ: Oh, that sounds quite good.
MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: We did this show together this week, listeners.
MAT: Oh, it was fantastic. We had a brilliant time.
LIZ: Hello everyone at the NUS Disabled Students, whatever you‟re called.
MAT: Hooray!
LIZ: Up in the fantastic Blackpool. When we saw, probably, the funniest thing I
have ever seen in my life. It was after the conference and the entertainment
when the disco came on. So, not only did they then play the Hokey Cokey,
which was quite fascinating.
MAT: Yeah, it was.
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LIZ: Then there was a conga line.
MAT: (Sings) Dah, dah, dah, dah, dud, dud, dud, dud, dud, dah.
LIZ: (Sings) Dah, dah, dah, dah, dud, dud, dud, dud, dud, dah.
MAT: Ladies and Gentlemen, we were a little bit, how can I put this, the worst for
wear by this point, weren‟t we?
LIZ: Perhaps. We were now hiding when we heard the conga music.
MAT: But there it came the line, the crippled conga, if you like, being led by a man
with cerebral palsy who was walking his wheelchair forward, hmmm hmm.
Then we had, I think a couple of visually impaired people. Then a couple of
wobblers behind that. And then…
LIZ: There was about, can I just say, there was about 20 people in this conga line.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: But after the first round there started to be a little break in the line. Now,
leading the break in the middle of the conga line was a blind man.
MAT: With a very long stick. Ladies and Gentleman, visualise this. Imagine a non-
disabled person pretending to do a blind person walking in a hurry with stick,
that‟s what they looked like, isn‟t it?
LIZ: (Laughs) They were.
MAT: It completely looked like that.
LIZ: With the person behind them trying to guide them.
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MAT: And steer them through all the tables and chairs of the restaurant, which is
where we were.
LIZ: So, that they would join up with the rest of the line, followed by three
wheelies right at the back trying to hold on.
MAT: And when they were going around the corner there was kind of a whiplash
effect there, wasn‟t there?
LIZ: It was fun. You probably had to be there. Hey-ho. And, you know, fame.
This is how sad this country has become about celebrity, isn‟t it?
MAT: Oh, you‟re not going to believe this!
LIZ: This is ridiculous.
MAT: (Laughs)
LIZ: Ridiculous. Some of us, (clears throat) yeah, us too.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: Have been asked to be involved in Celebrity Beyond Boundaries.
MAT: Now, I know what you‟re thinking, they need eight contestants.
LIZ: Ah ha.
MAT: And there are only, what, three disabled celebrities that I can think of.
LIZ: When they‟re asking us, that‟s bad.
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MAT: It‟s pretty bad, isn‟t it?
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: They were going, “Yeah, Blunkett‟s onboard”. Hmmm hmm. And I‟m
thinking, yeah, right he is.
LIZ: Stephen Hawking.
MAT: Stephen Hawking, yeah.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: Alison Lapper.
LIZ: That we‟d like to see.
MAT: Oh, I think we‟d all like to picture Alison Lapper hiking through the
Nicaraguan jungle.
LIZ: I‟d like to see her rolling down a sand dune (laughs).
MAT: She could be the bridging thing for when the others go over – she could just…
LIZ: (Laughs) Stop – needless to say.
MAT: Alison‟s a good personal friend of mine, and I didn‟t mean that.
LIZ: They‟ve obviously not listened to the Podcast, as they do still think we maybe
interested, but alas, no, you will not be sing us on Celebrity Beyond
Boundaries, but there you go.
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MAT: Only „cause they wouldn‟t pay enough.
LIZ: (Laughs) What, payment, payment, isn‟t it enough of an honour! So, that‟s it
really. Yeah, that‟s what I‟ve been up to this month, and it‟s been quite a
good month.
MAT: Oh, I just would like to say one other thing, though. This is the Valentine‟s
Special.
LIZ: Yeah.
MAT: And I just want to say to Patu, my wife, 14 years ago I fell in love with you
and I love you more than is imaginable now. And without you my life would
be devoid of meaning. I‟m crying already!
LIZ: Can I tell you about the Valentine‟s card that I‟ve just bought for somebody?
MAT: (Pretends to cry) Yes.
LIZ: Well, actually, I didn‟t. I bought it for the Podcast and then forgot it, but what
it is, it‟s a mainstream card just bought in an average card shop and it says, “I
love you so much that every time I see you I dribble.”
MAT: Oh, wow!
LIZ: Isn‟t that great!
MAT: Was that by Scope?
LIZ: That‟s what I‟m thinking.
(Jingle: “The Ouch Podcast!”)
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MAT: So, as usual, we‟ve had lots of feedback with emails, and what have you, and
I‟d just thought we‟d read a few out. And here‟s one from Janice in Touson,
USA. “I just thought you might like to hear my version of Twister. After
several drinks with a friend we came up with Gimp Twister. I‟m in an electric
wheelchair due to muscular dystrophy and felt there HAD to be a way of the
floppier of us might be able to play. So, for each participant you will need one
or two gimp wranglers basically to place and hold the participants bodies in
spot. I thought too, to make it really interesting, each participant should be in
costume like in Mexican wrestling, masks and all. With nicknames too.”
(Laughs)
LIZ: You see, we so should have done that in our Christmas Podcast.
MAT: Absolutely.
LIZ: Following on, yeah, if you‟ve got any other ways you‟ve played Twister or
invested games like that, do let us know.
MAT: I dread to think what my wrestling nickname would be.
LIZ: And we‟ve got one from Roger, re the Ashley X debate. Last month we
talking about the case in America where parents of a disabled young woman
have decided to opt for very controversial treatment where she was given
hormones and had a hysterectomy, etc, to keep her smaller and easier to look
after at home.
MAT: And it included in having her nipples removed.
LIZ: Well, her breast buds, I think, it was called.
MAT: Hmmm, okay.
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LIZ: Yeah. So, we were talking about that, so somebody has written in. “I agree
wholeheartedly with the fact that it‟s a dangerous thin edge of the wedge. Not
so thin, actually. And that we should take people for what they are, rather than
what you want them to be. Liz did seem to feel that she liked her disability
and she wouldn‟t want to be normal. I see a fair bit of this on dyslexic groups,
now having a positive spin is one thing, but there is a tendency, in some, to go
and look into the gift idea that it gives you an ability way beyond a positive
outlook into wishful thinking. A disability doesn‟t give one anything except
extra problems. This doesn‟t mean it can‟t be entertaining and fun at times,
but inability and brokenness it is.” From Roger.
MAT: I‟m sorry Roger, I‟m coming out of that. I‟m sorry everybody. I feel whole
and complete, Roger.
LIZ: You‟re not broken.
MAT: I might have been born with a body that looks broken and incomplete, but I
feel whole and complete, and I‟m sorry that you don‟t, Roger. That‟s your
problem and not mine.
LIZ: Isn‟t there an Elvis song about that? (Sings) Treat me… (hums).
MAT: Wooden Doll.
LIZ: That‟s the one.
MAT: Yes.
LIZ: Okay.
MAT: Well, the last time I saw an Elvis impersonator doing it he was singing it to a
girl with Downs Syndrome.
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LIZ: (Sing) I don‟t have a broken body!
MAT: Anyway, Chris Rodwell, though, has not has not had a go at us exactly, but
has basically said, “Oddly, just hearing some of what I feel”…
LIZ: No, it‟s very interesting this. I like it, read it out.
MAT: Yeah, I mean basically he‟s saying “I‟m not so keen on Mat and Liz
editorialising about Ashley X. Emotionally I agree with them, but that‟s not
what I look to the BBC to do.” He goes on to say basically because we both
didn‟t agree with the Ashley X.
LIZ: Hmmm hmm.
MAT: And we were both of the same opinion, that it was unconvincing and Ouch!
could have explored that and said something really useful, rather than just
having a rant. Now, all I‟ll say is, Chris, that if you looked at 100% of the rest
of the media on this, and there was an awful lot.
LIZ: Hmmm.
MAT: From the Guardian to the Telegraph to the television, to everybody, not one of
them espoused the ideas that we were saying. No one came from the
viewpoint that we did. And nobody argued with them about what they were
saying.
LIZ: I think the important thing here is, I mean I think, Chris, thank you for writing
in, „cause it really is important.
MAT: Hmmm, really.
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LIZ: In that, you know, we didn‟t complain and we didn‟t actually deny the fact
that we were having a rant. We were both and are both very passionate about
the subject, as are a lot of people who listen to the Podcast and who write on
the message board. So, we were not apologising for the fact that it was one
sided. We‟re not journalists who are putting two sides of a debate, actually.
MAT: Yeah, I mean we did say it was unbalanced at the time, and we were aware of
it.
LIZ: Yeah.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: And I think many times we‟re redressing the balance of the fact that nobody is
talking about our issues.
MAT: I have to say, I think that‟s what we‟re meant to be doing at the Podcast is
providing that alternative opinion.
LIZ: Yeah, yeah.
MAT: An interesting one here form Christine Mildenhall from Worthing in West
Sussex, probably going through to the Valentine‟s theme, “Have you thought a
bit about doing assistance dogs, like canine partners?”
LIZ: That sounds a bit perverted.
MAT: Woof!
LIZ: Canine Partners! I know it can be bad getting a dating partner, but…
MAT: Yeah, I don‟t know of that website.
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LIZ: …I‟m not sure that‟s an option I‟d like. Well, I can‟t get a boyfriend, but I‟d
like a dog instead! Hmmm, now let‟s not…
MAT: Hold on a sec, that‟s not the sort of assistance we‟re talking about, Liz.
LIZ: No, I‟m not going there!
MAT: You‟re not? Okay.
LIZ: No, I‟m not going there.
MAT: Is it an opening?
LIZ: I know what you want me to talk about.
MAT: Alright, fair enough.
LIZ: (Laughs) Let‟s move on to the question. Anyway, thanks everyone for
sending in your feedback. Whatever you think, we do like to hear about it.
We do read them.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: Do send it to ouch@bbc.co.uk.
MAT: Hmmm, I, for one, love it when people take us to task over things.
LIZ: Hmmm.
MAT: You know, it‟s nice to be, you know, praised for stuff, but it‟s also nice to be
argued with.
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LIZ: Some questionnaires.
MAT: Great!
LIZ: Oh, I love these. We said we‟d be back with them, thank you, you‟ve been
sending in your thoughts and your answers to the questionnaires.
MAT: Do they remember the questions? Shall I throw a few of them out?
LIZ: Go on.
MAT: Yeah? Things like, what would you like to see on a future Podcast? What‟s
your favourite Podcast moment? What do you like most about being disabled?
What do you like least? Being disabled you must be very brave, what‟s the
bravest thing you‟ve done? What‟s the worst name you‟ve ever been called?
If the Podcast team were to start an all disabled rock group, what would they
be called? Etc, etc.
LIZ: What you do, you just go onto the site and you can fill it in on there, and it‟s
going to be up there for a while. So, if you like the sound of it, go and fill one
in.
MAT: We‟ve got some great ones here, haven‟t we?
LIZ: I love it. One of the things that is coming a lot, favourite Podcast moment is
the Cripply Piggly.
MAT: I know.
LIZ: A big one, isn‟t it?
MAT: Yeah, absolutely.
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LIZ: Absolutely.
MAT: They should remarket that to a more crippy audience.
LIZ: (Laughs) Yes.
MAT: They‟d sell loads. They‟d be able to empty that warehouse in Poland. I‟ve
got some lovely stuff here.
LIZ: Go on then.
MAT: But I love this one, going back to the Blunkett, do you remember we had the
work experience girl, Ruth, was it?
LIZ: Yes, Ruth.
MAT: Yeah, now I must admit I agree with this person, Caitlin Lynch from
Linchville. “You could have sworn he was hitting on poor little Ruth.” Could
you, well, I blooming well agree.
LIZ: Oh, yes.
MAT: Yeah. She‟s now working for Five Live, apparently, isn‟t she?
LIZ: No. She was on Five Live once (laughs).
MAT: Oh, I was going to say, maybe, you know, he had a little word with Five Live.
(accent) It would be quite a good idea if you gave that girl a job. What else
have we got?
LIZ: I like this, being disabled and all, you must be very brave, what‟s the bravest
thing you‟ve done? Well, Beth went to the dentist, yeah, she did, and he was
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trying to find something wrong with her, because obviously she‟s wrong in
body, but he couldn‟t. And she says, “I‟m really surprised what he didn‟t say,
is “Don‟t worry about being blind, at least you‟ve got nice teeth.””
MAT: Oh, God, how many times have we been told we‟ve got nice teeth and nice
eyes. Turtle strikes again!
LIZ: That‟s it. Or hair!
MAT: I love Turtle. What‟s annoyed you the most recently? “Leo Sayer.” Fair
enough, a little weird, but fine, okay. I love this one. Impairment I‟ve got,
knees. Impairment I‟d like, “I‟d keep knees, there‟s worst things.”
LIZ: Impairment I‟ve got, disability shop swap. “I have spinal muscular atrophy,
what I‟d like, genitalis elphantis.”
MAT: I think we can guess what that one is!
LIZ: (Laughs) Thank you Mark Wormsley.
MAT: Disability swap shop impairment I‟d like, “Webbed fingers. I always thought
that those would be pretty awesome, especially in formal settings when you
need to shake hands with somebody. I‟m pretty sure there is surgery to take
out the webbings, but…” (laughs)
LIZ: And there‟s obviously a theme here. Impairment I‟ve got ADD, Impairment
I‟d like, “Something so huge I have to use a wheelbarrow.” That‟s nice, thank
you for that.
MAT: Or Roberto McCormick from Oregon in the USA, impairment I‟ve got, partial
sight. “In the US it‟s called legally blind, which I used to think that meant my
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parents had a licence for me somewhere, you know, like it was possibly to be
illegally blind.”
LIZ: (Laughs) Something that you didn‟t know, “Vietnam has some of the
strongest disability laws in the world, just a shame none of them are
implemented. Somewhere in China there is a factory, this is great, that makes
plastic windup sushi, I know, I‟ve seen it!”
MAT: Ah, I don‟t even understand that one.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: Impairment I‟d like, “Eye amputation, possible ocular cancer?”
LIZ: What?
MAT: “It would be the ultimate party trick to take out your eye!” Okay, and one
we‟ve got here from Mark Henderson near Bristol. Impairment I‟ve got,
profoundly deaf. Impairment I‟d like, “Married life.”
LIZ: I think I probably have the best one here.
MAT: Okay. Let‟s make this the last one.
LIZ: In terms of if we were to be a disabled rock group or pop band.
MAT: Oh, it‟s alright, I love this.
LIZ: Yeah, what should we be called?
MAT: Dunno.
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LIZ: Ill en ruse, this is fantastic, “Limping biscuit.”
MAT: Ohhhhh.
LIZ: Huh-huh.
MAT: I think that‟s the best one yet.
LIZ: I think that‟s the winner so far.
MAT: That‟s fantastic.
LIZ: So, remember, get in touch via the website, contact us on at ouch@bbc.co.uk
and fill in the questionnaire.
MAT: Or for anybody with mild Tourette‟s Syndrome, that‟s bbc.co.uk flip/ouch!
(Jingle: “The Ouch Podcast!”)
LAWRENCE: Leave a message for us on 020 8752 5444.
MAT: Sorry, to sandwich with so much testosterone, Liz.
LIZ: Hmmm hmm.
MAT: But who‟s on the other side of you over there?
LIZ: I think it‟s Mr Testosterone himself, Rob Crossan. Hello.
ROB: The testosterone is literally weeping out of me.
LIZ: Oh, delightful, delightful. What have you been up to this month, Rob?
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ROB: Well, I decided, with it being the month of love, romance and what not, to get
myself involved in the world of online dating.
MAT: Ooh.
ROB: And so I thought I‟d let you know how I‟ve got on so far.
LIZ: Was it successful?
ROB: Would you be interested to find out?
MAT: Absolutely. I can‟t wait to hear all the gooey details.
ROB: Yes, well, I was never really sure whether admit my disability or not, but I
thought, what with the fact that, quite frankly, I don‟t really care anymore, I
decided to just go full throttle. So, I went on to Dating Direct, which is one of
Britain‟s most popular dating sites.
LIZ: And is this a mainstream site?
ROB: This is a mainstream dating site, yeah.
LIZ: Right, okay.
ROB: Every day losers, yeah, and Sole Mates, which is in the Guardian as well. So,
I went on both of those and I wrote the following little quip, along with a
photo. “Watery eyed albino seeks large gins and absolutely no sympathy
whatsoever from women who aren‟t too bothered about the fact that, to me,
you probably just look like a shapely, yet smudgy blob in the middle
distance.”
LIZ: (Laughs)
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ROB: “You must be prepared to put up with my walking into doors, abusing people
with 20/20 vision and never getting a suntan?”
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: (Laughs)
ROB: So, I put that on, on Monday, and it‟s now Thursday, and from Dating Direct,
four women added me to their favourites, but I only had one message from a
girl called Helen in East London.
LIZ: Ah.
ROB: Who wants me to go and move to the countryside with her.
MAT: Wow?
ROB: Oh, she was a bit minging.
LIZ: And you‟re eyesight‟s not that bad then.
ROB: Pardon?
LIZ: Your eyesight‟s not that bad then?
ROB: Oh, the screen magnification software‟s excellent.
LIZ: (Laughs)
ROB: Now I know why I had it installed. The Guardian Sole Mates, on the other
hand, within about an hour I got a message from a woman who went under the
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name of Good Mousekeeping. Who told me, “What with my colouring and
yours, we must never be allowed to breed.”
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: (Laughs)
ROB: And she also said, “I had a very, very lovely albino rabbit once, are you as
lovely as that?
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: She sound quite good actually. Quite game.
ROB: Yeah, her photo was quite nice and again, it was a little bit smudgy though,
and she said she was 40, but fear she may well have been on the wrong side of
50.
LIZ: (Laughs)
ROB: So, I was a bit disappointed with the results of that, so I decided, basically, to
take it to the next level. Now, I don‟t know how many of you are aware of a
website called Craigslist? Any of you who knows anyone of a slightly seedy
nature…
MAT: I think I‟ve heard of it.
ROB: …and I‟m looking at one other person, and it‟s not Liz, in the studio. And
yeah, you‟re very aware of Craigslist then?
MAT: I‟ve heard of it.
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ROB: Would you be able to describe it?
MAT: To be honest, no, I wouldn‟t. I honestly wouldn‟t.
ROB: Okay, well, essentially…
LIZ: What is it?
ROB: It‟s a worldwide site for jobs, all sorts of things.
LIZ: Right.
ROB: But it also has a dating section, and it‟s got the usual, guys looking for girls,
girls looking for guys, but it also has a section called, Casual Encounters.
MAT: Oh, yeah.
ROB: Where you can literally be as crude and blunt as you want. And you can
essentially say, “I‟m in central London, I‟m very horny, can you come and
meet me on Regent Street in an hour?”, or whatever.
MAT: Blimey.
ROB: And obviously it attracts delightfully (laughs) delightfully well rounded
human beings. So, I decided to go on this, but I thought being bloke with
albinism it wasn‟t really working out, and I only got two replies in four days.
So, I decided to go on as a deaf woman instead. And so, I put a little posting
on saying, “Deaf bird with perfect body seeks man who knows when to shut
up.”
LIZ: (Laughs)
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ROB: “Conversation skills important, but not as important as kissing technique.”
And you would not believe how many responses I got.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: Blimey.
ROB: Within a day. I put this on yesterday.
MAT: Yeah.
ROB: And when I left the house this morning I‟d had 233 responses.
LIZ: (Gasps)
MAT: Oh, my, blimey.
ROB: And I wish I could read as many of them out to you as possible but, frankly,
after about the firs 100 I had to give up, because some of them were so
disgusting. I think it was actually making me feel slightly queasy.
MAT: Were they just, sort of, too raunchy for broadcast?
ROB: A lot of them are too raunchy for broadcast.
MAT: Or are they a bit disablist?
ROB: But I‟m going to read out a couple of my particular favourites, if that‟s
alright?
MAT: Hmmm, can‟t wait!
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LIZ: Yeah, „cause I‟m really interested, do they go with the deaf thing? Do you
know what I mean?
ROB: They loved it.
LIZ: Really?
ROB: They loved it. They absolutely loved it.
LIZ: So, that was a bit of a lure for people?
ROB: Hmmm. Hmmm. Absolutely.
LIZ: Ohhhhh.
ROB: Well, let me read you some of the responses.
MAT: Yeah, sitting back and listening.
ROB: Okay, well, Martin says, “I don‟t live in London, but I‟ll be there in 2012 for
Senior Kissing Olympics, see you there.”
MAT: What?
ROB: So, he‟s obviously got a way with words!
LIZ: (Laughs)
ROB: Pete says, “I‟m a half deaf guy, so I don‟t really want a completely deaf girl,
but can I get a pic of your perfect body anyway?”
LIZ: (Laughs)
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MAT: (Laughs)
ROB: Nathan says, “I can‟t sign, but if”, ooh, err, I‟ll start that again, Nathan says, “I
can‟t sign, but if I was horny for you, you‟d see an obvious sign in my
trousers!”
MAT: Oh, he should be on Blind Date.
LIZ: (Laughs)
ROB: Absolutely. That‟s pure Blind Date, isn‟t it? Jeff, rather bizarrely says, “I
don‟t know sign language, but we can always circumvent that by going salsa
dancing.”
MAT: Ah.
ROB: Toby says, “I‟ve got no sign language, but they‟ll be plenty of language if you
want to meet me.”
LIZ: Argh!
MAT: Ah.
ROB: Andrew says, “Do you find it difficult to meet men in more conventional
situations. I‟d hate the idea that men could be shallow enough not to
appreciate you for who you are.”
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: Ahhhhh!
ROB: I‟m not buying that for a second, Andrew.
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MAT: No.
ROB: And my particular favourites is from a guy who remained nameless, but he
says, “Can you lip read? I‟m from Ecuador, but will fly to meet you this
weekend. However, should I take precautions against bird flu?”
MAT: Oh, what?
LIZ: (Laughs)
ROB: I don‟t understand and, frankly, I‟m slightly scared.
LIZ: Aren‟t you tempted to meet him?
ROB: Am I?
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: (Laughs)
ROB: Well, it could be a little bit awkward!
MAT: (Laughs)
LIZ: But wouldn‟t it be great?
ROB: Can you drag me up!
MAT: Put glue in your ears and put a skirt on.
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ROB: Yeah, well, it has been done before! So, what I essentially thought I‟d do after
that, the Casual Encounter thing was getting a little bit too racy for my
humble, innocent mind.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: Of course.
ROB: So, I‟ve decided to do a little challenge over the course of the Podcast. I‟ve
logged into the Gumtree, which is another website which has more standard
dating guys wanting girls and girls wanting guys, etc. And I‟ve signed in as a
wheelchair using girl, and as a girl with depression. So I‟m going to logon
now and I‟m going to see, over the course of the Podcast, who gets the most
responses from horny, desperate singletons everywhere.
LIZ: Hoorah!
MAT: Well, I‟d say good luck, no, I‟ll say, good luck!
ROB: Thank you.
LIZ: Don‟t you think it‟s quite depressing?
MAT: On one level, potentially, yeah.
LIZ: Yeah.
MAT: It‟s a bit depressing that women get so many responses and men get so few.
ROB: Hmmm, 233 in an hour.
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LIZ: „Cause I‟m thinking, Rob, you know, if you had done this legitimately and you
really did want a date, you know.
ROB: Hmmm hmm.
LIZ: You‟ve gone for a couple of sites, Dating Direct, and the other ones, Soul
Mates, and you‟ve not got much of a response, have you?
ROB: I was hoping we could, sort of, bypass that.
LIZ: Yeah.
MAT: And it‟s a terrible shame, listeners.
LIZ: It‟s a bit sad.
MAT: Because from where we‟re sitting…
ROB: He‟s not bad!
MAT: …he‟s the tastiest thing in the BBC Broadcasting House.
ROB: (Laughs)
MAT: So, listen, Rob, we‟ll see you later.
ROB: Okay.
MAT: I can‟t wait to – I‟m slightly fearful of the results.
LIZ: Yes, I‟m scared.
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MAT: But we‟ll talk to you later, yeah?
ROB: Okay, bye.
LIZ: See you later.
MAT: Bye.
ADAM: Hello, my name‟s Adam Hills, and as the first officially famous person on this
show, I‟ve just been told that I‟m more famous than David Blunkett. Oh, yes.
I‟d like to let you know that even when I‟m not on the show, I choose to the
Ouch! Podcast. Cop that, Blunkett!
(Jingle: “The Ouch Podcast!”)
MAT: Sex!
LIZ: Some of us get it.
MAT: Some of us have problems accessing it. Now, on the line we have two people
who can explore this a little more and hopefully, gives us some useful
information.
LIZ: So, we‟d like to welcome Tuppy Owens, who runs the Outsiders Club, more
on that in a minute. And Kim, who is a sex worker, who has disabled clients.
We need to go to Kim first, „cause you‟ve got a client coming up soon, I
know. So, Kim, can you explain for us and the listeners what actually is a sex
worker?
KIM: Basically, a sex worker is it‟s a range of work than can be involved with being
a girlfriend, a counsellor, also being a lover, a friend, and a hope giver. And
also, not being judgemental.
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LIZ: Okay. And we‟ve, you know, wanted you on the programme really, because
you have a number of disabled clients, is that right?
KIM: Yes, I do, indeed, yes.
LIZ: How did you get into that and why?
KIM: What, into – what, seeing disabled clients?
LIZ: Yeah, how did that happen?
MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: Did they just contact you and you thought, yeah, why not?
KIM: Well, actually, it was word by mouth. I have of the able bodied clients, and it
was one of those actually who‟s got a friend who was disabled in a wheelchair
and they were just talking one day about his experience with myself. And
made the disabled client very envious and how much he wanted to see a sex
worker, and never could really get up enough courage to phone a sex worker.
And so he decided, through this other client of mine, to contact me, and so he
did, and luckily I‟ve got a lift that comes down into my flat.
MAT: Good.
KIM: And so, I‟ve got disability access.
LIZ: Excellent.
MAT: That‟s very good.
LIZ: (Laughs)
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MAT: And was that because of the disability?
KIM: And I‟m not really like what a sex worker would be. I‟m more like your girl
next door. So, I don‟t have all the full makeup. I‟m very natural.
MAT: We want to just come to a couple of points, and I‟ll call it the dribble factor, if
you like.
KIM: Okay.
MAT: For want of a better expression. Some clients obviously are going to, you
know, not have control over some of their bodily functions, and what have
you. And I know that you‟ve got ways of dealing with this, and perhaps you‟d
like to tell us about it quickly and succinctly.
KIM: Basically, what, colostomy bags, and things like that.?
MAT: I guess. I guess. Anything like that really?
KIM: Well, basically, I don‟t kind of draw the attention to it, as such.
MAT: No.
KIM: We don‟t talk about it.
MAT: No.
KIM: And normally if anything happens, you know, I‟m very discrete, and it‟s not
discussed, and I try to make sure their time with me is more of, you know,
sexual fantasy than more reality.
MAT: Sure.
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KIM: So, I don‟t kind of go down that line into, you know, discussing what they‟ve
got wrong.
MAT: Sure.
KIM: Or anything that‟s embarrassing to them.
LIZ: Sure.
MAT: Fair enough.
LIZ: Have many people come to people because they‟ve not had sex before? Are
you the first experience, for a lot of people?
KIM: Some people who‟ve been disabled from birth, yes, I am. And because of that
I just find it very inspirational for me.
LIZ: I think a lot of our listeners will be thinking, this is really interesting, you
know, this might be something that I‟m interested in.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: But, you know, not exactly sure what you‟re saying and what you could
provide. So, without being too explicit, I think we would like to know. What
is it that, you know, a lot of disabled clients want and get from you?
KIM: Basically, they want full sex.
LIZ: Yeah.
MAT: Huh-huh.
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KIM: And I give it to them.
MAT: Now, with so-called surrogacy, which, as far as I know, and I‟m not that au
fait with it, but as far as I know, it involves a kind of bit of, well, I suppose,
TLC, for want of a better phrase. Do you provide that as well?
KIM: I do, indeed, yes, a lot of that.
MAT: So, kissing and cuddling, and feeling warm and nice? As well as, you know,
the raunchy stuff.
KIM: Yes, „cause the clients want a kind of a girlfriend experience. They don‟t want
someone that‟s cold and calculating.
MAT: Yeah.
KIM: And trying to get somebody through the door and out of the door as quick as
possible. I know a lot of escorts do that, but I certainly don‟t.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: Some people might think, ooh, disabled people, you know, using a sex worker,
it‟s not a nice way and it‟s not the ideal way to have a sexual experience, what
would you say to, you know, people who think that?
KIM: No, I think it‟s one of the best ways to have a sexual experience. Like I said
before…
LIZ: Because?
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KIM: …most people that go with someone for the very first time, you‟re normally
about 17 or 18, and it‟s very disappointing. If you speak to most people
they‟ve been very disappointed with their first sexual experience they had.
MAT: I‟ll go along with that.
KIM: And you learn by that. And so everyone that comes to see me who are virgins
will basically have the most sexual experience of the lives.
LIZ: And do you insist on, you know, when we were researching this, do you insist
that there‟s a, you know, that your clients come and that they‟re, for example,
that they‟re clean, or that kind of thing? Do you have any rules before you‟ll
see someone?
KIM: There is, actually. I‟m pretty insistent on the fact that either a shower or bath
before they come.
LIZ: Hmmm hmm.
KIM: Or if they‟re disabled I will assist them, and that‟s part of their time with me.
LIZ: So, that could be part of the experience?
KIM: Oh, yes, a lot of them like that. I mean they do have carers, so some people do
know about this, and they do have friends and carers that come.
MAT: Ah ha.
KIM: And we kind of put them in the bath, but the carers don‟t obviously stay.
LIZ: Okay.
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KIM: But all in all, I really make sure that it‟s very pleasurable.
LIZ: So, you make that part of it rather than, “Right, you must turn up and have”…
KIM: No.
LIZ: …“this done, this done, this done and that done?”
MAT: Hair brushed!
KIM: It‟s not cold, nothing like that at all.
MAT: No. And do you find – and just one last question, in terms of your disabled
clients versus your non-disabled clients, do you notice any particularly
profound difference between the two, other than the obvious, that some are
disabled and some of them aren‟t?
KIM: Basically, there isn‟t a huge amount of difference, I have to say.
MAT: Hmmm hmm.
KIM: They do seem to be more grateful for what you give them, I think, just more so
than the able bodied clients.
MAT: That‟s interesting.
KIM: So, they‟re all kind of, you know, very grateful and some of them are quite
emotional over the fact of what you‟ve just given them.
MAT: Yeah.
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KIM: And their experience. So, there is that side. I‟ve just noticed that side a bit
more.
MAT: Sure, sure.
KIM: But really, you know, they‟re just the same as able bodied, but just probably in
a wheelchair, and that‟s all there is to it. You know, they‟re incredibly
intelligent. They‟re not different from anyone that‟s able bodied.
LIZ: So, wanting the same things, yeah. Well, Kim, we‟re going to say goodbye
because I know you‟re off and busy now.
KIM: Yes, unfortunately.
LIZ: Have fun. Have that‟s the…
MAT: You can‟t really stay on the line while you‟re at work!
KIM: (Laughs)
LIZ: As much as that would have been an interesting interview. So, on that note
we‟d like to thank you and go over, Tuppy, are you with us?
TUPPY: I am.
LIZ: Now, I must explain to listeners that you are on the phone, a mobile, on a
train, is that right?
TUPPY: That‟s right, but we‟ve just left the station, so I think we‟ll be alright for a bit.
LIZ: Okay, but if we cut out.
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MAT: Obviously, some of the answers you may have to give us during this interview
may cause some of the heads in the carriage to swivel somewhat, but I bet
you‟re used to that?
TUPPY: (Laughs)
LIZ: (Laughs) No, Tuppy, what we want to do is, I want to ask you about
Outsiders. I know that you run the Outsiders, but our listeners won‟t know
what that is? Can you tell us what the Outsiders is and why you set it up?
TUPPY: Okay, well, it‟s a self-help group for socially and physically disabled people to
gain confidence and find partners. And I set it up because I met some disabled
people who needed a bit of help, taking out to parties and introducing to
people because they weren‟t meeting enough people. And I found that
experience incredibly satisfying, in that it was good fun for me, and it
definitely changed their lives.
LIZ: And when did you set it up? How long have you been going now?
TUPPY: 27 years.
LIZ: Oh, my goodness!
MAT: Wow!
LIZ: Okay. And well, I‟m quite interested, then, do you think things have changed,
in terms of over those years from disabled peoples‟ own expectations of sex,
and also the publics?
TUPPY: Yes. Well, things have changed enormously, because obviously when we
started off it was at the end of the Hippy era. And where people were quite
sexually adventurous and so disabled were accepted really as partners.
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LIZ: So, we were part of that fun, in a way?
TUPPY: So, things have got much worse in a way, because basically now everybody
looks to find a partner who is going to impress their friends and their parents
and has got to be good looking and rich, and non-disabled. So, I think a lot of
disabled people have now come to the conclusion they‟d be better off with a
disabled partner, rather than getting into that world of good looks and money
as being important.
MAT: So, at Outsiders meetings then, what kind of thing could a first timer, at an
Outsiders Club, expect to experience?
LIZ: What might happen?
MAT: Yeah.
TUPPY: Well, we always have lunches, and they‟re always in lovely places and people
get together and chitchat and they get introduced to each other. And we eat
together, which is always lovely, and sometimes we have workshops that help
people become more confident actually really.
MAT: So, confidence building workshops within the meetings then?
TUPPY: Yeah, yeah.
MAT: Okay. Fine.
LIZ: And do a lot of people…
TUPPY: And we have a laugh and people sometimes get off together, and sometimes
people come to meet at the lunch when they‟ve been writing to each other, or
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phoning each other, because they feel it‟s a safe environment for them to, sort
of, have their first meeting.
MAT: Sure. I imagine that‟s a very important part, is it, the safe environment part?
TUPPY: Yes, yeah.
MAT: Sure, sure.
LIZ: So, there‟s a lot of meeting, and there might be some dating, yeah?
TUPPY: Yes, well, we don‟t, sort of, monitor everything, so the whole club‟s working
as a, sort of, network all over the country without us knowing what‟s going on
half the time. And sometimes we get these letters saying, “I‟ve met someone
and I want to end my membership.” And you think, well, couldn‟t you tell us
who it is then? But sometimes they‟re quite secretive, or they might even send
us a letter about how marvellous it is together, but they won‟t tell us who they
are.
MAT: And people are coming to Outsiders then for all sorts of things, but amongst
which is looking for love? The classic looking for love. Now, what if, how
can I put this, people are a little bit more urgent than that and actually they‟re
looking for sex?
TUPPY: Okay, well, quite separately to the Outsiders, I‟ve started a website called TLC
for disabled men and women to find responsible sex workers. So, it offers
advice on the website, so if there‟s no sex worker near you, you can find out
how to access one through your local paper. Because a lot of sex workers
meet disabled people and it‟s just a matter of finding one locally.
LIZ: Yeah. Fantastic.
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TUPPY: So, it‟s tlc-trust.org.uk.
LIZ: Brilliant.
TUPPY: And the new site‟s that‟s going to be accessible to blind people will be going
up in the next couple of weeks.
LIZ: Excellent.
MAT: Excellent. That will be very good news for our listeners, many of whom have
visual impairments and may well be gagging for it. Thank you. Take care.
LIZ: Good to speak to you, Tuppy, bye, bye.
TUPPY: Bye, bye.
(Jingle: “The Ouch Podcast!”)
LAWRENCE: Now, it‟s time for Vegetable, Vegetable, or Vegetable.
LIZ: Okay, okay, okay, we hear you and we‟ve tried new quizzes, but you want
your Vegetable, Vegetable, or Vegetable back.
MAT: Hey!
LIZ: If you look on the web it‟s the main thing that people are mentioning about the
Podcast.
MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: So, it‟s back for good now. We have a caller on the line. Yes, she‟s in
Melbourne, Australia. Hello, Alana.
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ALANA: Hell, Liz. Hello, Mat.
MAT: Ohhhhh. Are you a listener to the Podcast, Alana?
ALANA: Oh, yes, I am.
MAT: Ohhhhh, wow! Now, we have to be very careful not to give away what‟s up
with you, or we win by default.
ALANA: That‟s right.
LIZ: But we do want to know a little bit about you, so what do you do?
ALANA: Well, I live with my partner. I‟m on a disability pension.
LIZ: Ah ha.
ALANA: And to keep my brain happy I design and develop websites for various non-
profits, and bands, and record labels, and stuff.
LIZ: Huh-huh.
MAT: Wow!
LIZ: Excellent.
ALANA: And I like to play with cats and nerd out a lot.
LIZ: Very neat.
MAT: Nerd out, oh, is that an Australian phrase, nerding out?
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ALANA: Hmmm, I don‟t think so. I think it‟s probably just a nerd term.
LIZ: And is it beautiful and hot there? Is it beautiful weather? Is it lovely.
MAT: It‟s quarter to one in the morning, Liz.
LIZ: Well, you know, generally.
ALANA: It‟s been pretty nice. It‟s not snowing.
LIZ: No.
ALANA: It‟s been quite humid.
LIZ: Thank you for rubbing that in! Come on, Matt, it‟s time for the rules.
MAT: Sorry, I was just thinking about rubbing things in. Right, here we go, to be
read very fast, it says. Vegetable, Vegetable, or Vegetable is a clever
disability interpretation of the parlour game Animal, Vegetable, or Mineral.
And in the game the two hosts of the Ouch! Podcast have 60 seconds to guess
what is wrong with the disabled caller on the line, by asking a series of
fiendishly intelligent questions. The caller must answer only YES or no. It is
both classic and therapeutic.
LIZ: To take part in this intrusive and unpleasant game the rules clearly state you
have to be disabled. Alana, are you disabled?
ALANA: Yes, I am.
LIZ: You are, oh, great!
ALANA: (Laughs)
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MAT: Okay, fantastic. Slightly differently this month, did you notice I said 60
second, instead of the normal 90?
ALANA: I did.
MAT: Remember to only yes or no, and the 60 seconds starts now!
LIZ: Alana, have you got your arms?
ALANA: Yes.
LIZ: Can you walk?
ALANA: Sometimes.
MAT: Alana, have you ever paid for sex?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Are you incontinent?
ALANA: No.
MAT: Do you love someone?
ALANA: Yes.
MAT: Ahhhhh.
LIZ: Alana, are you a Joey?
ALANA: I don‟t think so.
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MAT: (Laughs) It‟s not a rabbit! Alana, have you ever put anything in your pouch?
ALANA: Oh, yes.
LIZ: Alana, are you half woman, half kangaroo?
MAT: (Laughs)
ALANA: No.
MAT: Alana, is your name Alana?
ALANA: Yes.
LIZ: Do you have a neurological condition?
ALANA: Yes.
LIZ: Oh, do you? Is it MS?
ALANA: No.
MAT: Are you a thalidomide?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Muscular dystrophy?
MAT: A dwarf?
LIZ: You‟re not a CP‟er are you?
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ALANA: No.
LIZ: Blinky?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: She sometimes can walk?
MAT: Have you got muscular dystrophy?
ALANA: No.
MAT: Ohhhhh.
LIZ: Okay.
MAT: Alright, chill out! Are you alright?
ALANA: Are you okay?
MAT: Oh, I was going to say.
LIZ: I‟m a bit scared now.
MAT: I thought you were going to have a bit of an eppy there.
LIZ: Okay, it‟s time for you to tell us what‟s wrong with you and put us out of our
misery, Alana?
ALANA: Okay, well, I have arthritis.
(Silence)
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LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: (Laughs)
ALANA: Okay.
MAT: We‟re not laughing at you, we‟re laughing with you.
LIZ: Okay, you have arthritis (laughs)
ALANA: However.
LIZ: Yes, yes, what‟s the but?
MAT: However?
ALANA: However.
MAT: Hmmm.
ALANA: I have another couple of disabilities that I want you try and guess.
LIZ: Arghhhhh, great!
MAT: Okay.
ALANA: Okay?
MAT: So, what, we‟re going to play the quiz again?
LIZ: Okay, you‟ve got arthritis, but other things?
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ALANA: Ah ha.
LIZ: Okay, well, I‟m thinking, dyslexia?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Do you have ADD? Like Mathew?
ALANA: No. (Laughs)
MAT: Are you an Elvis fan?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Do you live upside down?
ALANA: Not usually.
LIZ: Not usually.
MAT: Are you a convict?
LIZ: (Laughs)
ALANA: I could be, but no.
LIZ: Are you a Home and Away fan?
ALANA: Absolutely not!
LIZ: That‟s a pretty big impairment.
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ALANA: Yeah, I know.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: Well, I can‟t think what it is. Oh, golly, golly, golly.
LIZ: It‟s not Asperger‟s?
MAT: Yes.
ALANA: No.
LIZ: No.
MAT: Paranoid schizophrenic?
ALANA: No. It‟s getting better, come on.
LIZ: Okay, depression? You must have that.
MAT: Bipolar?
ALANA: I‟ve got that, yeah, but that‟s not it.
LIZ: Oh, that‟s not it, so you‟ve actually got four impairments?
ALANA: No, just keep going.
LIZ: Is it a mental health condition?
ALANA: No.
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LIZ: Oh, hell.
MAT: Is it a motor neurone disease?
ALANA: No, it‟s not.
LIZ: Oh, no.
MAT: Oh, not again!
LIZ: NO.
MAT: A midget! You‟re a primordial dwarf? Oh.
ALANA: Hmmm.
LIZ: Okay, Alana, for the second time today (laughs) can you put us out of your
misery. You have arthritis, but what else, Alana, is wrong with you?
ALANA: Liz, I‟ve also got tunnel vision.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: Now, that is a good one.
LIZ: That‟s is great then. You can only see in tunnels?
ALANA: Correct!
MAT: You could be a spy!
ALANA: I could be a what?
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MAT: A spy.
ALANA: I don‟t think I could be. I never thought of that career, that‟s brilliant though.
MAT: Yeah, you see. And is there another one?
LIZ: Come on.
MAT: You may care to overlay?
ALANA: Actually, I want you to go for my big one.
LIZ: No, please don‟t do this.
MAT: Well, look, darling, I‟ve been waiting to hear that all…
LIZ: Oh, my God.
(Laughter)
MAT: Again?
LIZ: Okay, arthritis we‟ve got. You said bipolar.
MAT: Have you got a third leg growing out of your stomach?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Have you got testicles?
ALANA: No.
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MAT: A third breast?
ALANA: I had a third nipple.
LIZ: Wow!
MAT: Hey!
LIZ: But that wasn‟t it.
ALANA: It‟s not it.
MAT: You‟re kind of a freak, aren‟t you, Alana?
LIZ: Excellent! How many heads have you got?
MAT: (Laughs)
ALANA: Just the one.
LIZ: Are you a Siamese twin?
MAT: (Humming)
ALANA: No, I‟m not a Siamese twin.
MAT: Have you got, oh, I dunno, are you welded to your own mother?
ALANA: No.
MAT: Okay. Is your partner really you?
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ALANA: No!
LIZ: Are you wheelchair bound literally?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Are you constipated?
ALANA: No.
MAT: Obese?
LIZ: Are you unable to poo?
ALANA: No.
MAT: Are you incontinent?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Can you not laugh?
ALANA: No.
MAT: Are you unable to have fully satisfying sex?
ALANA: No.
LIZ: Oh, oh, you know.
MAT: Are you a prostitute?
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ALANA: Oh, no.
(Laughter)
MAT: You‟re a duck!
ALANA: That‟s it, I‟m a duck.
LIZ: Okay, so, let‟s see, Alana, so you have arthritis.
MAT: One.
LIZ: You have bipolar.
MAT: Two.
LIZ: Three nipples.
MAT: Four, let‟s face it, that‟s a disability!
LIZ: (Laughs)
ALANA: Shall I tell you my third disability?
MAT: Please, do.
ALANA: It‟s epilepsy.
MAT: Hey!
LIZ: How could we miss that? That is so obvious.
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MAT: You are quite the most impaired person I think any of us have ever spoken to.
LIZ: Fantastic.
ALANA: Thanks so much, Mat.
MAT: Oh, man!
LIZ: What a quality of life you must have (laughs).
ALANA: It‟s shocking and it‟s dreadful (crying).
MAT: Oh, don‟t cry. It‟s okay, baby, we love you.
LIZ: And the more the better.
MAT: And this is our Valentine‟s Special, so if you‟d like to sign off with a love
message to your partner, that would be most appropriate.
ALANA: Alright.
MAT: Any time today.
ALANA: (Laughs) My dear Susie, I love you, and I look forward…
MAT: Sorry, did you…
ALANA: …to you coming home in the morning and seeing you.
MAT: …sorry, woo, woo, woo.
LIZ: (Laughs)
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MAT: Did you say Susie?
ALANA: I said Susie.
MAT: Are you…
LIZ: Ooh, are you one of them?
MAT: …les-bi-an?
LIZ: Hey!
ALANA: I am.
MAT: Oh, that‟s brilliant!
LIZ: Great!
MAT: And all those impairments.
LIZ: Oh, this is fantastic.
MAT: Is one of you, no I can‟t ask that, it‟s okay.
LIZ: Are you both crippled?
MAT: Hey, listen, it‟s beautiful.
ALANA: And guess what?
LIZ: What?
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MAT: What?
ALANA: I‟m not straight.
LIZ: Hey, hey.
MAT: Oh, that‟s beautiful, because we really embrace people of all sexualities on
this programme.
ALANA: (Laughs) Oh, I‟m so glad to hear that.
MAT: Some of them we embrace a little closer than others, but that‟s the way it goes,
so I‟m glad that you and Susie…
LIZ: He‟s full of testosterone sometimes. I can‟t believe you‟ve just said that.
MAT: No, I‟m not. I really respect women relationships.
ALANA: Thank you, Mat. Thank you, Mat.
MAT: And that came out wrong. Girl on girl action! Sorry, I forgot.
ALANA: (Laughs)
MAT: That‟s what it should be called.
LIZ: Stop it. Get out the room. Get out the room while I talk to her.
MAT: I‟m out of the room.
LIZ: You and your manliness!
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MAT: I RESPECT YOU, SUSIE.
LIZ: Right, Alana.
MAT: JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE.
LIZ: Yeah, stop it now. She‟s not in a film. You‟re not going to show me the
downloads.
ALANA: (Laughs)
LIZ: You wouldn‟t believe what goes on behind the scenes. Alana, look, there‟s so
much wrong with you, what do people actually say, and questions do they
actually ask when they find out the list of things that‟s wrong with you?
ALANA: Well, they don‟t really know where to start.
LIZ: (Laughs)
ALANA: Usually they say, “You‟re just so young.” And I just, you know, I mean I‟ve
had lots of these things since I was, you know, five or six, and I‟m 31 now.
LIZ: Fantastic.
ALANA: And the other thing is that I find very interesting with my tunnel vision is that
I use a vision cane.
LIZ: Huh-huh.
ALANA: And people don‟t associate partially sighted people with vision canes.
MAT: Oh, no, you‟ve got to be fully blind, otherwise it‟s illegal, apparently.
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ALANA: Well, look, I‟m not a real blindy.
MAT: Yeah, exactly, like they know.
ALANA: Yeah.
LIZ: And I assume that as you get older you‟re hoping for even more things to go
wrong?
ALANA: Well, you know, if luck‟s on my side.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: How‟s Susie? She‟s not coming down with anything, is she?
LIZ: (Laughs)
ALANA: No, she‟s pretty good, but she‟s a bit blind herself.
LIZ: Excellent.
MAT: Ahhhhh.
ALANA: So, we can‟t be into each other all the time.
MAT: Hey, hey, thank you. Quite enough of that, it‟s the BBC.
LIZ: Oh, that must be funny.
ALANA: (Laughs)
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LIZ: (Laughs) Alana, it‟s been a great pleasure playing Vegetable, Vegetable, or
Vegetable with you three times and still losing.
MAT: You are Queen, and I mean that in every way possible, of the Veg. Worldwide
Queen of the Veg, Alana!
LIZ: Whoa!
ALANA: Thank you very much.
bbc.co.uk/ouch
MAT: Earlier on Rob was telling about the success or lack of success he‟s had with
dating agencies. He‟s gone of (laughs) to what was it again, Liz, sorry?
LIZ: Gumtree.
MAT: Oh, that‟s right, Gumtree, and posing as a wheelchair using woman, was that
right?
LIZ: And a woman with depression to see who does best. So, come on, what
response?
ROB: Well, I have to say yeah, it‟s a landslide, quite frankly.
LIZ: Really?
ROB: Yeah.
LIZ: For?
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ROB: It seems it doesn‟t matter how horny, desperate all single men are out there
are, they just don‟t want the woman with depression, because in the last hour
the wheelchair user has got a staggering 27 responses.
LIZ: Really?
ROB: As opposed to a dismal three for the woman with depression.
LIZ: But would you be interested in passing some of them on?
ROB: Um.
LIZ: (Laughs) Well, you know.
ROB: Do you want to hear some of the messages I‟ve had?
LIZ: Yes, I do, actually. Yeah.
ROB: For the depressed girl?
LIZ: Both, come on.
ROB: Okay, so the depressed girl is called Sally Stays In.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: (Laughs)
ROB: And we‟ve had Darren, who‟s a barman in Putney who wants to “Liven you
up with the prospect of a cocktail” and he says, “There‟s no Rohypnol
involved.”
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MAT: That sounds reassuring.
LIZ: Ohhhhh.
ROB: Yeah, reassuring, yeah.
LIZ: I don‟t think I want one of his cocktails! Ohhhhh.
ROB: Alex says, “All my previous girlfriends have been depressed, so I‟m probably
used to it.
LIZ: (Laughs) Oh, poor Alex.
ROB: That says a lot about your dating techniques, Alex. And Darren replied again.
Saying, “I am genuine. Let me try and brighten your day. Let‟s go to
Richmond park and see deer if you don‟t like cocktails.”
LIZ: (Laughs)
ROB: What is wrong with people? And yes, the landslide victory for wheelie Kate,
we‟ve had Maffie says, “I‟m ready to be with you, but not push you, in
exchange for free beers.”
LIZ: (Laughs)
ROB: And Paul says, “I‟ll come with you on a date, but only if I can hitch a lift
home.”
LIZ: Ahhhhh.
ROB: John says…
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LIZ: Are there any about L plates? Go on.
ROB: There‟s none about L plates.
LIZ: Women drivers?
ROB: No, nothing at all.
LIZ: Oh, wow!
ROB: Nothing at all. That was a bit too end of the pier show, isn‟t it, these days. I
know that‟s your routine.
MAT: (Laughs)
ROB: But John, who said he‟s very considerate, he goes, “There‟s no steps in a bar
called Barracuda on Aldgate. Meet me there at Friday at 7.00”, and he left his
mobile number. And finally, Ewan, who said, “I‟m happy to have a drink with
you Wheelie Kate, the wheelchair can come too.” Kind of essential, but it‟s a
nice thought.
MAT: Yeah, wow!
ROB: So 27/3 was the final result.
MAT: And what dating website was that one?
ROB: This was on the Gumtree.
MAT: The Gumtree.
LIZ: I‟m really surprised by that.
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MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: That it‟s got such a good response.
MAT: As she said as she was writing down the URLs of the Gumtree.
LIZ: The Barracuda at 7 o‟clock, it‟s fine.
ROB: Did you want the mobile?
LIZ: Yeah, that‟s fine.
MAT: Watch out for the old sharp teeth!
LIZ: What? It was the Barracuda.
MAT: Aren‟t they the ones with teeth?
ROB: They‟re the ones with enormous fangs.
LIZ: Ohhhhh.
MAT: Oh, right, I thought they were weird fish with teeth.
ROB: They are.
LIZ: Well, no, but so from that, you know, do you think it‟s worth – so do you
declare when you on these sites then, do you think?
ROB: Only if you‟re a woman.
LIZ: Yeah.
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ROB: It‟s completely pointless if you‟re a bloke.
LIZ: Yeah.
ROB: Because the fact is, it doesn‟t matter whether you‟ve got a disability or not,
dating sites are besieged by desperate, single, ugly men.
LIZ: Hmmm.
ROB: And women will happily look through them, but they won‟t actually respond.
They‟ll wait to be posted, I think.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: Actually, I think Mat‟s right.
MAT: (Sighs) Oh, dear, so any desperate, lonely, ugly men out there, shame!
LIZ: Well, Rob, thank you very much. So, you‟ll be home on your own this
weekend, will you.
ROB: Remember, guys, if you fancy going out with a guy who‟s going to have a
very, very cheap sex change in the next four hours, Barracuda Bar, Aldgate
7.00 pm and I‟ll be there.
LIZ: (Laughs)
MAT: (Laughs)
ROB: And I‟d like a gin and tonic.
(Jingle: “The Ouch Podcast!”)
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LIZ: Okay then, Mat, come on.
MAT: What?
LIZ: I‟m really interested, your first date?
MAT: Oh, my God.
LIZ: (Laughs) Can you remember that far back?
MAT: Well, yeah, I can. When I was seven, and I think this is beyond – it‟s before
first date land.
LIZ: Okay.
MAT: I got my first Valentine‟s card, and that was the first time ever I, sort of, you
know, I bothered to think how nicely looking the hair on the girl that I quite
liked was. And just little beginnings of appreciation of those objects of your
affection. Cut forward to when I was 13.
LIZ: Right.
MAT: I was a late developer, so I was a very young 13, and I was at an all boy‟s
school. And one of my gang, and there was about seven of us, and I was the
only disabled boy in the school, listeners, had organised with his sister a group
blind date with seven girls from his sister‟s school who were going to come to
this room.
LIZ: Ah ha.
MAT: In the school after hours in the, sort of, like common room, and we were all
going to “get off” with each other, was the promise, right? So, Mr Naïve turns
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up and it was amazing, because what happened was, it was kind of like when
you‟re left as the last person for the football team. As people, sort of, sussed
each other very quickly, it became very apparent to me that one of the girls –
that it was becoming very apparent to one of the girls that I was the one she
was going to be lumbered with. She was going to get lumbered with the
disabled kid. And I happened to be looking at her at the moment when she
realised, and I saw the change in the look in her eye.
LIZ: Ohhhhh.
MAT: And it was like, yep, welcome to the rest of your life, pal. And it was a very
cold and horrible moment. And what was worse was that she went through
with it. But she felt awkward and embarrassed and difficult.
LIZ: Hmmm hmm.
MAT: And so it was…
LIZ: And you felt?
MAT: Ohhhhh. Well, I‟m sensitive bloke and I pick up on stuff like that, and I
always have done. So, I felt actually mortified for her, yeah? I didn‟t even
bring my feelings into it. Later down the line, and it was only a couple of
years later when I was 15, I changed schools and it was kind of like the
opposite. There was girl, Susie, and she was the sexiest girl in the school. She
was called the school slag, yeah, she‟d done snogging and everything, and had
boobs. And all that. She walked straight up to me and went, “There‟s a
school disco on Friday; I‟d like you to take me.”
LIZ: Wow!
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MAT: And at first I thought the Headmaster‟s had a word with her, or something,
“Be nice to the crippled boy, will you?” But actually, later on that Saturday,
she proved that that was not the case.
LIZ: Oh, really?
MAT: And I was one of the first boys in my class to lose my virginity as a result.
LIZ: (Laughs) Okay.
MAT: So, it started off horrible, and ended up nice. What about you, Liz? What
about your first date?
LIZ: Ohhhhh, well, it was all pretty awful, actually, you know, really. Because I
actually did have such a negative perspective about myself. So, I remember
growing up and I thought, well, the only men that are ever going out with me
will be doctors.
MAT: How old were you? Nine, or something?
LIZ: I was still in my teens, you know, really.
MAT: Okay.
LIZ: And I went to an all girls school, I should say that.
MAT: Right, right, yeah.
LIZ: Because I had gone to a mixed girl as a child and had got so teased by the boys
that was put into a girls‟ school because that was much easier.
MAT: Really?
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LIZ: Yeah, absolutely. Boys were evil.
MAT: Wow! Okay.
LIZ: So, you know, so that was it kind of thing. And I did, and I just thought, oh,
you know, no man‟s ever want to go out with me, you know, and I can
understand that. Oh, it was awful. So, at school, nothing. Absolutely
nothing, because it was, you know, being taken to and from school by my
mum, a whole group of girls, and some of them had dates. I was also kind of
with, and they were a great group of girls, but a lot of them were the, sort of,
the real swats and nerds, yeah?
MAT: Okay.
LIZ: And had very protective parents.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: So, they weren‟t particularly getting it on anyway.
MAT: No, sure.
LIZ: Yeah, and so that was, sort of, school. So, university was the biggie for me.
MAT: Oh, okay.
LIZ: Yeah, and true to my belief about it‟s going to be a doctor or somebody in the
caring profession, yeah, my first was a CSV, a Community Service Volunteer.
MAT: Ohhhhh.
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LIZ: A lot of disabled students, when they go away, you know, they have
assistance.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: And this guy particularly, I just loved this guy, absolutely…
MAT: What, do you mean in love?
LIZ: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, any excuse. He wasn‟t my CSV, he was
somebody else‟s, you know, so, we kind of, you know, that was it, and I told
him how I felt. And, you know, he was a little embarrassed, but it‟s like, you
know, well, let‟s try, and this is great. So, we did, and, you know, and it was
nice. It was great, actually, it was great, as first dates can be and first loves
can be.
MAT: Let‟s face it, it‟s not that great.
LIZ: But not that great. And then the next term he ended up going out with my
CSV. So, that was a little depressing, because when somebody else‟s “carer”
goes out with yours, it was like, oh, my God. So, not good.
MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: Actually.
MAT: Not good, but I imagine something that resonates with quite a lot of listeners.
LIZ: I would think, yeah. „Cause, you know, when you‟re at university and you‟ve
got these, you know, youngish women assisting women you if you need that,
and you‟ve got helpers, you know, and you‟re with them, that‟s really hard,
the attention that you get and the attention that they‟re getting.
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MAT: The carer and the cared for.
LIZ: Yeah.
MAT: And all that kind of weird psychological subconscious stuff going on.
LIZ: Plus your own stuff about how you feel.
MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: So, you know, if you‟re very much quite passive and quite in the back seat
because you‟re not feeling that, you know, that great about yourself, or don‟t
think you‟re that sexy. So, I don‟t know, I think then, you know, when I left
unit and all that and I met guys, I mean really that‟s when things started to
kick off and things were so much better. And I mean now, and I do think, and
maybe it‟s a cliché, but things have got so much better and relationships have
just got great. And sex has got much better as you get older, I think. You
must think that, old man?
MAT: Well, as a man who‟s recently reached 45 it does get better. A little bit more
infrequent, but it gets better.
LIZ: But have you – okay, I was really interested about this, and stuff that Rob was
saying, okay.
MAT: Yeah. I think it‟s – I‟m a bit appalled by it, to be honest.
LIZ: In what way? Internet dating, or the response?
MAT: No, no, not internet dating in this busy world, lots of people need to resort,
you know, they don‟t have the time to put in the time to date, so they need to
find a date via the internet. And that‟s fine, and everybody should have access
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to that, but I just think it‟s appalling that if you say you‟re disabled, if you‟re a
bloke you get nothing.
LIZ: Hmmm hmm.
MAT: And if you‟re disabled, oh, you must be desperate and therefore prepared to
give it out immediately on the first date, which is what I think they assume the
inference is.
LIZ: Yes.
MAT: These 200 men that call up in the 24 hours, etc. I mean, dear oh dear, I‟m
reeling from it really. I can‟t believe that other people are still this stupid.
LIZ: I‟m always shocked, you know, because I think there‟s something almost quite
wonderfully innocent about you (laughs).
MAT: (Laughs) Yeah, maybe you‟re right. Maybe you‟re right.
LIZ: No, there is, „cause, you know, you kind of go, “Oh, I can‟t believe”, and your
sense of shock, because I‟m not surprised, but then I mean I have tried internet
dating and online, and I‟ve tried it on mainstream sites and I‟ve said that I‟m a
disabled person.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: And you will get, you know, you‟ll get the Hippy who goes “I‟m really in to
anything and anyone and I‟m very open minded.”
MAT: But that sounds nice.
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LIZ: Do you know what I mean? Yeah, but then they‟re not really, and usually it
turns out that they‟ve actually got an impairment that they‟re not willing…
MAT: Oh, okay.
LIZ: That‟s been my experience, and it‟s quite funny. But, of course, if somebody
does contact you then, right, either both on the mainstream and the crip dating
sites, if they‟re not disabled, I‟m suspicious. How awful is that?
MAT: What, that they‟re like a fetishist, or something?
LIZ: Yes. And I think, well, what are you doing contacting?
MAT: You think, wey, hang on a minute. What happened to self-respect, Liz?
LIZ: (Laughs) Yeah, but come on, most of the guys, right, particularly on disabled
sites there‟s an awful…
MAT: Contentious opinion coming up, listeners!
LIZ: There‟s an awful lot of non-disabled men on crip sites, crip dating sites, yeah?
MAT: Right.
LIZ: And they do send the most ridiculous emails. And they do, you know, they
want to know if you‟ve got a little bit of plaster of Paris of your body, because
that‟s something that they get off on? On they want to know, you know, it‟s –
I‟m not – yes, of course I‟m not saying that that‟s the majority, or whatever,
but actually an awful lot of, you know, from myself and people that I know
have used such dating, do get that. So, you do get suspicious over the years.
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MAT: I guess – so, what do we need to do? We‟ve got to round this subject off, and
I think I‟ve been left, like, floundering in a sea of what does it all mean? So,
what we can we do, us, as disabled people to make this better?
LIZ: What? Getting partners?
MAT: No, getting the sort of partners that we want. Getting them to see past the
disability, yeah.
LIZ: And it is a bit, you know, catch 22, because I think that I finally got really
confident when I actually got a partner and somebody was in love with me and
I loved them, do you know what I mean?
MAT: Yeah. Well, it does help!
LIZ: It does rather help, doesn‟t it? But, you know, and then I think once that
happens, that‟s really, but, of course, as we‟ve been hearing today and the
things we‟ve talked about, it‟s getting that first experience, isn‟t it?
MAT: It is.
LIZ: Almost that‟s the one you want. You want the experience, so that you don‟t
have to go round saying, “Actually, I‟ve got no experience, or I‟m a virgin, or
whatever, because of all the taboos around that.” So, that‟s the key.
MAT: Hmmm.
LIZ: That‟s, you know.
MAT: I‟m going to throw this one back out to the listeners as an end there.
LIZ: Yeah.
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MAT: You know, if anybody else thinks that they can combat this seemingly weird
situation of not, perhaps, perfection in the dating world, perhaps they‟d like to
suggest it to us so we could talk about it on the next Podcast?
LIZ: Yes. And hear about your conquests. Yeah, why not. That would be
fantastic.
MAT: And, indeed, don‟t forget that‟s at bbc.co.uk/ouch.
LIZ: Oh, yes.
(Jingle: “The Ouch Podcast!”)
LIZ: As promised earlier, we‟ve got two members of rock band Freeslave in the
studio. That‟s Hayden Spencely and Aaron Lewis. Hello again.
HAYDEN: Hello.
AARON: Hi.
MAT: Hi there. Now, we‟re going to hear you perform live for us in a moment, but
first, you‟ve got an opportunity to tell us about yourselves. Now, apparently,
Freeslave started as a church thing, didn‟t it?
HAYDEN: Yes, in the first place about four and a half years ago it came out of the
church, and we‟re Christian people in our band. And yeah, it began that way.
And as time has gone we‟ve, sort of, moved away from doing specifically
church related stuff, and now we play clubs and festivals and pubs, as well as
the odd church here and there.
LIZ: Okay, so you do everything now?
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HAYDEN: We try and become so well spread that we could be butter.
LIZ: Delightful. Mm mm mmm. God, like it. I can‟t believe it‟s not butter, in
actual fact! And do you do stuff about disability.
AARON: We have done some things. We‟ve done liberty festival.
LIZ: Oh, okay.
AARON: With the Mayor of London‟s office, and we‟re getting involved with Attitude
is Everything. But to be honest, we view the band as a band first and
foremost, rather than a vehicle for any agenda, be it political or disability, or
whatever.
LIZ: So, the music‟s what matters?
AARON: Well, if the music‟s rubbish, then nothing else really is relevant at all.
MAT: No, I absolutely agree with you. And I personally can‟t wait to hear your
fantastic rendition of our lovely Podcast theme. Now, just quickly we‟re
going to shout out your LP and EP that are currently available, before asking
you to play for us today. Apparently, your LP is called Songs for the Dying,
and I think that one‟s about disability isn‟t it? And EP, Save My Day, ditto,
yeah. I‟m just joking. So, what are you going to be doing for us today?
HAYDEN: We‟re going to play a song from Songs for the Dying, called Road Less
Travelled. It‟s a love song for my fiancée Kathy in honour of this Valentine‟s
Podcast.
LIZ: Ahhhhh.
MAT: Ahhhhh. Ahhhhh.
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LIZ: Oh, how beautiful‟s that?
MAT: Hayden loves Kathy!
LIZ: Hee, hee, up an accessible tree!
(Laughter)
LIZ: Ah, that‟s nice. Right, let‟s go ahead with then please. So, this is the Road
Less Travelled, by Freeslave.
[Music]
What about me?
What came of all those dreams?
Don‟t I get a say?
Or did I forfeit my right?
On those dark lonely nights.
When fear stole my soul.
Where‟d we go from here?
Do I go alone?
We walked the road, the road less travelled with me.
We walked the road, the road you walked down.
A road you went down for me.
Am I alone?
A man needs a home.
Or have I lost your face?
We walked the road, the road less travelled with me.
We walked the road, the road you walked down for me.
We walked the road, the road less travelled with me.
We walked the road, the road you walked down.
A road you went down for me.
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What about me?
What about me?
What about me?
What about me?
We walked the road, the road less travelled with me.
We walked the road, the road you walked down for me.
We walked the road, the road less travelled with me.
We walked the road, the road you walked down.
A road you ran down.
(Fades)
MAT: Yeah.
(Applause)
MAT: Oh, boy. That was so amazing, Ladies and Gentleman.
LIZ: Fantastic.
MAT: That the rest of the studio team came into the studio to listen to it. Fantastic!
HAYDEN: Thanks very much.
MAT: Well, thank you so much. Now, we understand that the kids at Treloar‟s
School are big fans of you and that track, yeah?
HAYDEN: Yes, I work at Treloar‟s School, in Hampshire.
MAT: Ahhhhh. Are you a teacher?
HAYDEN: No, I‟m a classroom assistant, volunteer.
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Ouch Podcast 12: February 2007
MAT: Oh, nice one.
LIZ: Fantastic. Oh, hello, Treloar, we‟ve spoken to you before. So, you‟re going to
play us out with your interpretation of the Ouch! Podcast Jingle, I hear, guys,
yeah?
HAYDEN: Yes.
AARON: Yeah.
LIZ: Hold fire. We‟ve got to do a bit of housekeeping, Mat, over to you.
MAT: But I must just warn you, I might get emotional, and I might try and join in if
you do the Podcast thing, and I love it so much. And this is the month of love,
Liz, right?
LIZ: It is.
MAT: Anyway, let‟s do the housekeeping. Yeah, so, thanks everyone for listening.
Podcast 12, can you believe we‟ve done 12 already?
LIZ: 12.
MAT: It‟s wonderful. Was produced by Damon Rose. Researcher was Emma
Tracey. Assistant Producer, Lisa Devlin, and all the studio was managed by
Jo Hutton, with special thanks to Rob Crossan. And our band this month
Freeslave. Now, before you start, guys, where can people get that fantastic
music from?
AARON: If you hop on over to myspace.com/freeslave, then you can find out all the
information you‟d ever want to find out by us. Listen to songs, buy CDs and
send us messages, etc.
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LIZ: Fantastic. Well, thank you for joining us.
MAT: Yeah.
LIZ: Until the middle of March, everyone, it‟s goodbye from us, and this is
Freeslave.
[Music]
You‟re so special we made a Podcast for you.
Disabled people can have fun too.
They can do anything we can do.
Say thank you to the BBC.
Dry your eyes and listen in.
To people just like you.
Confined to a website.
The Ouch! Podcast.
(Fades)
MAT: Hey! Oh, we‟ve been reborn.
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