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					From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 07:56:51 2004
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:14:57 -0500 (EST)
From: Wayne Edelen <wayne@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Court Dismisses Suit

http://www.wisinfo.com/postcrescent/news/archive/local_15427121.shtml

-- Wayne - http://www.blueblackbusa.org/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 08:00:22 2004
Subject: RE: Court Dismisses Suit
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:00:04 -0500
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "Wayne Edelen" <wayne@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Thanks for the morning wake up call; at first glance I thought this was
another Janklow update...

;-)

Robert


-----Original Message-----
From: Wayne Edelen [mailto:wayne@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 8:15 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Court Dismisses Suit


http://www.wisinfo.com/postcrescent/news/archive/local_15427121.shtml

-- Wayne - http://www.blueblackbusa.org/


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 08:00:51 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:00:31 EST
Subject: Re: inexpensive source for brake rotors? differences in
materials?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 3/31/2004 2:03:24 PM Eastern Standard Time,
pattonme@XXXXXX writes:

> Anybody see a problem with this?

Rust.
When Honda used a cast iron rotor in the first year of the 250
interceptor
(VTR250) they covered it up (looked more like a drum then a disk) so the
rust
would not show.
And considering the importance of brakes around here I would be _awfully_
cautious if I were you. At the very least the brakes will be different,
better
maybe, worse maybe. And a failure, I do not even want to consider.


New "bumper sticker" on the ST1100.

"Eat right, stay fit,
 DIE ANYWAY!"

John Walters (Long John)
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Up near DC

Honda ST1100X Pan European
BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles
Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 08:16:47 2004
Subject: RE: inexpensive source for brake rotors? differences in
materials?
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:16:35 -0500
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: <PenguinBiker@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I remember reading about metal failures to some brands of cast-iron
rotors, but it seems to be a rare (albeit catastrophic) occurance.
However, there are quite a few comments about warping and rusting
[sample: http://gstwin.com/racers_corner.htm]. The Dodge Tomahawk
concept bike uses cast-iron rotors on the rear wheel(s), though.

Robert


-----Original Message-----
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX [mailto:PenguinBiker@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 8:01 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: inexpensive source for brake rotors? differences in
materials?


Rust.
When Honda used a cast iron rotor in the first year of the 250
interceptor
(VTR250) they covered it up (looked more like a drum then a disk) so the
rust
would not show.
And considering the importance of brakes around here I would be _awfully_
cautious if I were you. At the very least the brakes will be different,
better
maybe, worse maybe. And a failure, I do not even want to consider.
New "bumper sticker" on the ST1100.

"Eat right, stay fit,
 DIE ANYWAY!"

John Walters (Long John)
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Up near DC

Honda ST1100X Pan European
BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles
Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 08:32:44 2004
From: "Dave Yates" <Dave@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Court Dismisses Suit
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:32:10 -0500
X-ELNK-Trace:
956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec794b12691f6a8b32cd04b413417
809466c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c

Wayne showed us:

> http://www.wisinfo.com/postcrescent/news/archive/local_15427121.shtml

[Dave]   So... "Classic advertising puffery" is completely ok.   POS, or
not a
POS.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 08:32:56 2004
Reply-To: "Jon Strang" <jmstrang@XXXXXX>
From: "Jon Strang" <jmstrang@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: brake rotor failure (was Re: inexpensive source for brake
rotors? differences in materials?)
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:31:10 -0500

Gee, those are three words that ought not be used next to each other.
Which
is the better of the two possible scenarios: the rotor breaks and the
brakes
just go away, or the rotor breaks and jam-locks the wheel. ugh...neither
sounds good to me.

Maybe you want consider sticking with moto-specific products.

--jon

----- Original Message -----
<deleted posts re: brake rotors>
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 11:25:18 2004
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 11:25:05 -0500 (EST)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: More taxes?

So what's this rumor that effective Oct 1 property taxes for individuals
owning more than one vehicle are going up 150% and that all vehicles have
to be titled and registered?

Dan


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr   1 11:28:48 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 2004 11:28:23 -0500
Subject: Re: More taxes?

What state?

dan wrote:

> So what's this rumor that effective Oct 1 property taxes for
individuals
> owning more than one vehicle are going up 150% and that all vehicles
have
> to be titled and registered?
>
> Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 11:33:58 2004
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:33:48 -0800 (PST)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: More taxes?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

April Fools, right?

Glenn
--- dan <dan@XXXXXX> wrote:
> So what's this rumor that effective Oct 1 property
> taxes for individuals
> owning more than one vehicle are going up 150% and
> that all vehicles have
> to be titled and registered?
>
> Dan
>
>


__________________________________
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http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 11:39:04 2004
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 08:38:52 -0800 (PST)
From: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: More taxes?
To: dan <dan@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

An April Fools joke? At least, that's what I saw
elsewhere on another board (dcsportbikes .net or .com)
- where did you hear it? What backup did they cite,
and where have you looked for more information?

Brian

--- dan <dan@XXXXXX> wrote:
> So what's this rumor that effective Oct 1 property
> taxes for individuals
> owning more than one vehicle are going up 150% and
> that all vehicles have
> to be titled and registered?
>
> Dan
>
>


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 12:04:35 2004
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 09:04:30 -0800 (PST)
From: Nun Yobizness <acelasmella@XXXXXX>
Subject: More DC cameras
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Williams, Ramsey Announce New Automated Enforcement
Schemes

April 1 (Washington Times)

DC Mayor Anthony Williams joined forces today with
Police Chief Charles Ramsey to announce a new round of
automated enforcement beyond the existing radar and
red light camera schemes. Williams and Ramsey were
vague on specifics, but they hinted that as of Oct 1,
start of the fiscal year, city police will be watching
remotely for all sorts of illegal activity.

Indeed, a little-noticed line item in the city's FY05
budget, says "revenue-other-automated enforcement."
The total for this item is $500 million. The same
budget document, under expenditures, cites a $100
million appropriation for "automated enforcement
rebates." The Budget Office says DC residents can
apply any fines they pay as a credit against their
income taxes.

The range of the new enforcement activities could
include fines for loud exhausts, citations for
four-wheel drive vehicles exceeding legal bumper
height, fines for motorcyclists wearing inadequate
safety gear and fines for jaywalkers. Another scheme
would install cameras and microphones outside popular
nightclubs, in order to fine patrons using
obscenities. Public obscene language is a Class C
misdemeanor in the District.

"The sky's the limit, really," said one DC official,
speaking on condition of anonymity. "Technology is
truly amazing these days, and if we're going to have
Big Brother and Homeland Security snooping around, at
least we can use Big Brother, in an innovative way, to
fill city coffers."

Asked for comment,   a DC transportation official
stated, "it's high   time suburbanites pulled their
weight. They clog    up our roads and Congress won't let
us tax them, so we   have to get in our licks where we
can using existing   laws on the books."

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr   1 13:58:35 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: More taxes?
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 13:41:49 -0500

> What state?

Apathy

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr   1 14:06:07 2004
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 2004 14:05:58 -0500
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: More taxes?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

In a message dated 4/1/2004 1:41:49 PM Eastern Standard Time,
mjordan812@XXXXXX writes:
>
>
> > What state?
>
> Apathy

Unconsciousness?   ;-)

Scooter (dazed and confused)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 15:28:12 2004
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 2004 15:27:49 -0500
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: brake rotor failure (was Re: inexpensive source for brake
rotors?
 differences in materials?)

Just as an FYI ... GP bikes (all of ours) use cast iron rotors.

The only failure I have ever seen was on a vintage TZ750 (Yes, 750) at
Summit point ... and it was just a crack.

- Roach


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 15:36:59 2004
Subject: RE: brake rotor failure (was Re: inexpensive source for
brakerotors?differences in materials?)
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 15:36:43 -0500
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "Brian Roach" <roach@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I thought the cautionary comments had more to do with having iron rotors
made up by a machine shop, rather than sourcing them from a motorcycle
vendor. Might indeed be functionally the same item, but I would have
concerns about running highly stressed components manufactured by a firm
with no previous moto brake experience (my assumption, that last bit).

Robert


-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Roach [mailto:roach@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 3:28 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: brake rotor failure (was Re: inexpensive source for
brakerotors?differences in materials?)


Just as an FYI ... GP bikes (all of ours) use cast iron rotors.

The only failure I have ever seen was on a vintage TZ750 (Yes, 750) at
Summit point ... and it was just a crack.

- Roach



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 21:31:05 2004
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 21:28:55 -0500
Subject: Brake rotors-my experience
From: Bob McKeithen <bmckeithen@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

My bike came stock with some real purty, shiney, stainless steel brake
rotors. They very quickly warped and were replaced under warranty. This
went on and on-- getting them replaced about every 8000 miles . At one
point I even conned the warranty folks into popping for a set EBC
stainless steel rotors and EBC pads . That set-up lasted about 10
thousand miles. Finally I bought and paid for a set of good thick
ductile iron rotors. That was about 50 thousand miles ago and they are
still going strong.
However, as some one said, they will rust. In fact, on a day like today
surface rust will appear after about two hours of parking the bike
outside. No sweat, goes away in a few feet of riding. With pads made
for iron the brake feel is much better and stopping power is great.
Don't know if they make them for your bike, but check out Red Racing in
Italy.

Bob

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 1 23:43:40 2004
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 2004 22:43:40 -0600
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, thomasajordan@XXXXXX, mike@XXXXXX
From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
Subject: This would be one hella-cool motorcycle...

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/31march04_aprilia_rsv450.htm

http://www.sport-touring.net/iB_html/uploads/post-1-37956-apri.jpg

4-stroke. . .   a street legal version in the US would be nice....

- Sean Jordan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 07:16:29 2004
From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 07:15:57 -0500

Does this look suspicious to anyone besides myself? Any suggestions as
to how I can trace it down a bit more?
Thanks,
Dan
-----Original Message-----
From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 4:52 AM
To: Danny Thompson
Subject: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1


Dear Seller,

Thanks for reaching back to me,Am interested in buying the [Bike] . Am
not in the state am located in Denvonport in Australia,I would wish to
dicuss this transaction on phone but the network hear is not
ok/condusive for me to give you call about the transaction,I could like
you to still be reaching me via-email as times goes on..I have my own
personal shipping agent who will handle the shippment of the Bike.I will
like to know if a Certified Cheque will work out for the payment of the
Bike.since am not in the state,If it will work out for the payment,I
will contact my Client who have a US[bankAccount] to forward the payment
of the Bike to you,Snice am far away from the Country,And also the last
price you are willing to sale[5500 is my price i hope it work or you can
still less it more] it.If so we can processed.By sending your mailing
details,Example:- [ 1 ] Your resident address
[ 2 ] Phone number
[ 3 ] Your full name,which will be written on the Cheque for the payment
of the Boat.Looking forward to hear from you soonext.GodBless Best
regards. Smith... [Buyer].----- Original Message -----
From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 09:31:49 -0500
To: "'runner smith'" <runnerman007@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1

> Mr. Smith,
> Yes the bike is still for sale. It is as you saw in the pictures. It
> now has just over 4000 miles on it (less than 4100). I will change the

>   oil and filter once more before it is sold. As for payment terms, I
>   would like either cash, cashiers check, or money order. I will let it
>   go for $5750. Let me know how you want to proceed. I have one other
>   person I hear from today. Thanks,
>   Danny
>
>   -----Original Message-----
>   From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
>   Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 9:15 AM
>   To: danthompson@XXXXXX
>   Subject: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
>
>   Dear Seller,
>   Am interested in buying your Bike,which the advert was placed on net,
>   I would like to make enquiry about it and if you still have it for
>   sale.If yes,kindly get back to me with the present condition,I have
>   view the Jpg pic;s of the Bike which is ok.Your payment terms,final
>   price you're willing to sell it.Looking forward to hear from you
>   soonest. Best of Regards. Smith..,
>
>
>
>   --
>   _______________________________________________
>   Outgun.com free e-mail @ www.outgun.com
>   Check out our Premium services - POP3 downloading, e-mail forwarding,
>   and 25MB mailboxes!
>
>   Powered by Outblaze

---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.647 / Virus Database: 414 - Release Date: 3/29/2004


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 07:23:42 2004
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 04:23:34 -0800 (PST)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
To: Danny Thompson <danthompson@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

foreign buyer? certified cheque? form letter? bike referred
to as a boat?

what would you possibly be worried about?   ;)

why trace?   run.

--- Danny Thompson <danthompson@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Does this look suspicious to anyone besides myself? Any
> suggestions as
> to how I can trace it down a bit more?
> Thanks,
> Dan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 4:52 AM
> To: Danny Thompson
> Subject: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
>
> Dear Seller,
>
> Thanks for reaching back to me,Am interested in buying
> the [Bike] . Am
> not in the state am located in Denvonport in Australia,I
> would wish to
> dicuss this transaction on phone but the network hear is
> not
> ok/condusive for me to give you call about the
>   transaction,I could like
>   you to still be reaching me via-email as times goes on..I
>   have my own
>   personal shipping agent who will handle the shippment of
>   the Bike.I will
>   like to know if a Certified Cheque will work out for the
>   payment of the
>   Bike.since am not in the state,If it will work out for
>   the payment,I
>   will contact my Client who have a US[bankAccount] to
>   forward the payment
>   of the Bike to you,Snice am far away from the Country,And
>   also the last
>   price you are willing to sale[5500 is my price i hope it
>   work or you can
>   still less it more] it.If so we can processed.By sending
>   your mailing
>   details,Example:- [ 1 ] Your resident address
>   [ 2 ] Phone number
>   [ 3 ] Your full name,which will be written on the Cheque
>   for the payment
>   of the Boat.Looking forward to hear from you
>   soonext.GodBless Best
>   regards. Smith... [Buyer].----- Original Message -----
>   From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
>   Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 09:31:49 -0500
>   To: "'runner smith'" <runnerman007@XXXXXX>
>   Subject: RE: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
>   > Mr. Smith,
>   > Yes the bike is still for sale. It is as you saw in the
>   pictures. It
>   > now has just over 4000 miles on it (less than 4100). I
>   will change the
>
>   > oil and filter once more before it is sold. As for
>   payment terms, I
>   > would like either cash, cashiers check, or money order.
>   I will let it
>   > go for $5750. Let me know how you want to proceed. I
>   have one other
>   > person I hear from today. Thanks,
>   > Danny
>   >
>   > -----Original Message-----
>   > From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
>   > Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 9:15 AM
>   > To: danthompson@XXXXXX
>   > Subject: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>   >
>   >
>   > Dear Seller,
>   > Am interested in buying your Bike,which the advert was
>   placed on net,
>   > I would like to make enquiry about it and if you still
>   have it for
>   > sale.If yes,kindly get back to me with the present
>   condition,I have
>   > view the Jpg pic;s of the Bike which is ok.Your payment
>   terms,final
>   > price you're willing to sell it.Looking forward to hear
>   from you
>   > soonest. Best of Regards. Smith..,


=====
Thomas H. Gimer <tgimer@XXXXXX>
MURPHY & GIMER, LLC
7940A Wisconsin Avenue
Bethesda, MD 20814
301 913-0060 ext. 11; 301 913-5415 (fax)
http://www.murphygimer.com

**This material is being sent by a law firm and is intended only for the
addressee. Various legal protections including the attorney-client
privilege can apply to this material and no consent is given to its being
read or used by anyone other than the intended recipient. Any other use
is unlawful.

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 07:58:48 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 07:58:34 -0500
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Yep. This is a scam that's been running on the net for a while. You'll
get the nice certified check and cash/deposit it, send bike and then the
bank will call you up in a couple days saying the certified check is a
fake and you just lost your bike. Also, I would hope that someone from
Oz would be able to speak/write a whole lot better than that. The fact
that he doesn't want to give you a phone number to talk in person is also
a good tipoff. If you had a phone number, the police could trace it and
bust his butt. Blow this guy off. Especially with a name like Runner
Smith.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/2/2004 7:15:57 AM Eastern Standard Time,
danthompson@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Does this look suspicious to anyone besides myself? Any suggestions as
> to how I can trace it down a bit more?
> Thanks,
> Dan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 4:52 AM
> To: Danny Thompson
> Subject: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
>
> Dear Seller,
>
> Thanks for reaching back to me,Am interested in buying the [Bike] . Am
> not in the state am located in Denvonport in Australia,I would wish to
> dicuss this transaction on phone but the network hear is not
> ok/condusive for me to give you call about the transaction,I could like
> you to still be reaching me via-email as times goes on..I have my own
> personal shipping agent who will handle the shippment of the Bike.I
will
> like to know if a Certified Cheque will work out for the payment of the
> Bike.since am not in the state,If it will work out for the payment,I
> will contact my Client who have a US[bankAccount] to forward the
payment
> of the Bike to you,Snice am far away from the Country,And also the last
> price you are willing to sale[5500 is my price i hope it work or you
can
> still less it more] it.If so we can processed.By sending your mailing
> details,Example:- [ 1 ] Your resident address
> [ 2 ] Phone number
> [ 3 ] Your full name,which will be written on the Cheque for the
payment
> of the Boat.Looking forward to hear from you soonext.GodBless Best
> regards. Smith... [Buyer].----- Original Message -----
> From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 09:31:49 -0500
> To: "'runner smith'" <runnerman007@XXXXXX>
> Subject: RE: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
> > Mr. Smith,
> > Yes the bike is still for sale. It is as you saw in the pictures. It
> > now has just over 4000 miles on it (less than 4100). I will change
the
>
> > oil and filter once more before it is sold. As for payment terms, I
> > would like either cash, cashiers check, or money order. I will let it
> > go for $5750. Let me know how you want to proceed. I have one other
> > person I hear from today. Thanks,
> > Danny
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
> > Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 9:15 AM
>   >   To: danthompson@XXXXXX
>   >   Subject: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>   >
>   >
>   >   Dear Seller,
>   >   Am interested in buying your Bike,which the advert was placed on net,
>   >   I would like to make enquiry about it and if you still have it for
>   >   sale.If yes,kindly get back to me with the present condition,I have
>   >   view the Jpg pic;s of the Bike which is ok.Your payment terms,final
>   >   price you're willing to sell it.Looking forward to hear from you
>   >   soonest. Best of Regards. Smith..,
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >   --
>   >   _______________________________________________
>   >   Outgun.com free e-mail @ www.outgun.com
>   >   Check out our Premium services - POP3 downloading, e-mail forwarding,
>   >   and 25MB mailboxes!
>   >
>   >   Powered by Outblaze
>
>   ---
>   Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>   Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>   Version: 6.0.647 / Virus Database: 414 - Release Date:
>   3/29/2004

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 08:06:03 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 8:05:56 -0500


>
>   From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/02 Fri AM 07:23:34 EST
>   To: Danny Thompson <danthompson@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>   Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
>   foreign buyer? certified cheque? form letter? bike referred
>   to as a boat?
>
>   what would you possibly be worried about?   ;)
>
>   why trace?   run.
>

yup..

If he wants to just get rid of the bike, leave it on the street with the
keys in the ignition. It's faster and doesn't involved international
shipping. Either way, he'll end up with no money and no bike. The money
orders/cashiers checques are bogus but you won't know that until the bike
has already been shipped and the check is discovered by the bank to be a
fraud.

The *only* way I'd do this is if *all* of the money was sent to a *valid*
third party escrow company who would hold the money until the bike is
shipped.

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 09:04:04 2004
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 09:03:53 -0500 (EST)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1

Why not have him send the check anyway and waste his time/money to send
it. Would make a cool souvenir.

Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 09:20:20 2004
Subject: RE: brake rotor failure (was Re: inexpensive source
forbrakerotors?differences in materials?)
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 09:13:59 -0500
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "matthew patton" <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Cc: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Hey, if you have access to a machine shop that makes custom brake rotors
for bikes, I'd be interested in talking to them! Especially if they can
make custom rotors for older bikes... Rotors for the VF750F run 146.00 a
side, and these aren't even OEM.

Is this the Fredericksburg Machine Shop you'd mentioned in an earlier
post?

-----Original Message-----
From: matthew patton [mailto:pattonme@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 7:15 PM
To: Verde, Robert
Subject: RE: brake rotor failure (was Re: inexpensive source
forbrakerotors?differences in materials?)



> manufactured by a firm with no previous moto brake experience (my
> assumption, that last bit).

that was where you committed the fatal blunder.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 09:21:31 2004
Subject: RE: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 09:15:22 -0500
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "dan" <dan@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I second Dan's suggestion; *after* you get the check, let the buyer know
that you will hold it until the funds clear... Potential for much
hilarity.

Robert


-----Original Message-----
From: dan [mailto:dan@XXXXXX]
Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 9:04 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1


Why not have him send the check anyway and waste his time/money to send
it. Would make a cool souvenir.

Dan


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 09:22:02 2004
From: (Andrew Culpepper) biga@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 09:22:00 -0500

Is he buying a bike or a boat? :-)

Andrew

On Fri, 2 Apr 2004 07:15:57 -0500
  "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Does this look suspicious to anyone besides myself? Any suggestions
> as
> to how I can trace it down a bit more?
> Thanks,
> Dan
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 09:25:33 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 09:25:25 -0500
From: Skip Smith <Skip@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1

They do make cool souvenirs. I've got three on my wall right now,
totalling 20 some thousand dollars. Makes a great conversation piece.

dan wrote:
>
> Why not have him send the check anyway and waste his time/money to send
> it. Would make a cool souvenir.
>
> Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 11:35:18 2004
Subject: Ride in
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 02 Apr 2004 11:31:54 -0500

Loads of fun on the way in this morning.

While going through Springfield I found that they had ground down two
short bits of the road. The first one wasn't all that bad. The second
one, just as you're straightening up past the new overpass, has a lovely
high lip on it. When I hit it, it made a nice hard thump. The GSXR
seemed not to have taken any damage so I kept going. For some reason, as
I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that my
ignition key has gone missing. I looked over the bike hoping to find the
key hung up on the fairing or in some crack but no such luck. I looped
around and headed home, no easy way to turn off the bike.

Need to find me a locksmith, or I'll get Tim (the guy I bought the bike
from) to simply make another one. Fricking pain in the butt.

I saw several bikes on the way home though and was able to wave at a
couple.

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 12:24:03 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Ride in
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:12:34 -0500

Carl, do you ride the GSXR more than the Harley?   Any reason if so?

>From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Ride in
>Date: 02 Apr 2004 11:31:54 -0500
>
>While going through Springfield I found that they had ground down two
>short bits of the road. The first one wasn't all that bad. The second
>one, just as you're straightening up past the new overpass, has a lovely
>high lip on it. When I hit it, it made a nice hard thump. The GSXR
>seemed not to have taken any damage so I kept going. For some reason, as
>I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that my
>ignition key has gone missing. I looked over the bike hoping to find the
>key hung up on the fairing or in some crack but no such luck. I looped
>around and headed home, no easy way to turn off the bike.
>Need to find me a locksmith, or I'll get Tim (the guy I bought the bike
>from) to simply make another one. Fricking pain in the butt.

_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar )B– get it now!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 12:33:41 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: New Aerostitch
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 12:31:22 -0500

A bit late, but...

http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/newsandupdates/stichaf04/

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 12:37:59 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:32:05 -0500
To: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1

Very. They guy claims to be in Australia, but he writes like a non-
English
speaker (maybe he's an immigrant?). He also seems to think you are
selling
a boat at one point (maybe a typo?). He isn't following *all* of the
details of some of the overseas bank scams...such as asking for your bank
account info so he can deposit the money for you...but it still sounds
very
fishy. Maybe it's just a way to get names and addresses of bike owners
for
sale to a mailing list company?

I really doubt that he really wants to buy and ship a bike halfway around
the world though. It's possible, but less likely than that he's up to
something.

-- Mike B.

At 07:15 AM 4/2/04 -0500, Danny Thompson wrote:
>Does this look suspicious to anyone besides myself? Any suggestions as
>to how I can trace it down a bit more?
>Thanks,
>Dan
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
>Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 4:52 AM
>To: Danny Thompson
>Subject: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
>
>Dear Seller,
>
>Thanks for reaching back to me,Am interested in buying the [Bike] . Am
>not in the state am located in Denvonport in Australia,I would wish to
>dicuss this transaction on phone but the network hear is not
>ok/condusive for me to give you call about the transaction,I could like
>you to still be reaching me via-email as times goes on..I have my own
>personal shipping agent who will handle the shippment of the Bike.I will
>like to know if a Certified Cheque will work out for the payment of the
>Bike.since am not in the state,If it will work out for the payment,I
>will contact my Client who have a US[bankAccount] to forward the payment
>of the Bike to you,Snice am far away from the Country,And also the last
>price you are willing to sale[5500 is my price i hope it work or you can
>still less it more] it.If so we can processed.By sending your mailing
>details,Example:- [ 1 ] Your resident address
>[ 2 ] Phone number
>[ 3 ] Your full name,which will be written on the Cheque for the payment
>of the Boat.Looking forward to hear from you soonext.GodBless Best
>regards. Smith... [Buyer].----- Original Message -----
>From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
>Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 09:31:49 -0500
>To: "'runner smith'" <runnerman007@XXXXXX>
>Subject: RE: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
>> Mr. Smith,
>> Yes the bike is still for sale. It is as you saw in the pictures. It
>> now has just over 4000 miles on it (less than 4100). I will change the
>
>> oil and filter once more before it is sold. As for payment terms, I
>> would like either cash, cashiers check, or money order. I will let it
>> go for $5750. Let me know how you want to proceed. I have one other
>> person I hear from today. Thanks,
>> Danny
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
>> Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 9:15 AM
>> To: danthompson@XXXXXX
>> Subject: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>>
>>
>> Dear Seller,
>> Am interested in buying your Bike,which the advert was placed on net,
>> I would like to make enquiry about it and if you still have it for
>> sale.If yes,kindly get back to me with the present condition,I have
>> view the Jpg pic;s of the Bike which is ok.Your payment terms,final
>> price you're willing to sell it.Looking forward to hear from you
>> soonest. Best of Regards. Smith..,
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> _______________________________________________
>> Outgun.com free e-mail @ www.outgun.com
>> Check out our Premium services - POP3 downloading, e-mail forwarding,
>> and 25MB mailboxes!
>>
>> Powered by Outblaze
>
>---
>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>Version: 6.0.647 / Virus Database: 414 - Release Date: 3/29/2004
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 12:38:07 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:37:47 -0500
To: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ride in

At 11:31 AM 4/2/04 -0500, Carl Schelin wrote:

>seemed not to have taken any damage so I kept going. For some reason, as
>I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that my
>ignition key has gone missing.

I have a new appreciation for Harley's design. My key is always in my
zippered pocket while riding, and I can shut the bike down with the
START/RUN switch on the handlebar...as well as turn off the ignition
without a key. All I need a key for is to make it a little harder to
steal
the bike. So long as the ignition isn't locked up, I can use the bike
perfectly normally in all ways without a key at all. (I know you know
this, but others may or may not, and any time Harley is better than an
import, I'm going to mention it! :-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr    2 12:39:28 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:39:15 -0500
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ride in
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

OK, how do you lose an ignition key while the bike is running and moving?
Someone please explain this to me as I thought you had to turn it to the
Off position before you could remove it?
Scooter (2 or 3 spare keys for EVERYTHING :-))

In a message dated 4/2/2004 11:31:54 AM Eastern Standard Time,
cschelin@XXXXXX writes:


> Loads of fun on the way in this morning.

<snip>

> For some reason, as
> I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that my
> ignition key has gone missing. I looked over the bike hoping to find
the
> key hung up on the fairing or in some crack but no such luck. I looped
> around and headed home, no easy way to turn off the bike.

<snip>

> Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 12:49:58 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:49:48 -0500
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: New Aerostitch
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Very nice.   I personally like the "bling, bling" aspect mentioned at the
bottom.

Speaking of bling, bling, I have bought a couple pairs of gloves from
Icon in the past and was checking out their website today to see what
they had new to offer. This is NOT a joke. Check out their site at
www.rideicon.com. Click on Products and then Gloves. I have a pair of
the Timax (white), Holligan (white/red) and Super-duty (black) but am
thinking about getting a pair of the Bling gloves. What do you guys
think? ;-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/2/2004 12:31:22 PM Eastern Standard Time,
mjordan812@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> A bit late, but...
>
> http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/newsandupdates/stichaf04/
>
> Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 12:52:31 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:51:29 -0500
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: Danny Thompson <danthompson@XXXXXX>,
   DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1

take this guys check, hang it on the wall, and then fuck with him
heartily
knowing that he has --zero-- recourse against you, and is trying to scam
you.
One of my favorite tactics is to get the check, deny recieving it, then
admit to
cashing it and spending all the money, and trying to get them to send me
another. I've only gotten it to work once, but damn, it was sweet.

I also give them my office number as my contact number. whenthe call
comes in,
I confrence call then in with a friend who interjects random words into
the
conversation.

so, you're going to send me a check
<chickenhead> tomorrow...   and when I get it
<yesterday> I'll cash it...



it's also GREAT fun when they're trying to give you their phone number
for you
to call them back...

ok, so the number is 44<four> 33 blah blah
"no... it's 44 33 blah blah"
ok. 4 433<four> blah
"no, no, no!"

I'ma prolly burn in hell for having so much fun at these guy;s expense.
:~)

--skip

Danny Thompson wrote:
>
> Does this look suspicious to anyone besides myself? Any suggestions as
> to how I can trace it down a bit more?
> Thanks,
> Dan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 4:52 AM
> To: Danny Thompson
> Subject: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
> Dear Seller,
>
> Thanks for reaching back to me,Am interested in buying the [Bike] . Am
> not in the state am located in Denvonport in Australia,I would wish to
> dicuss this transaction on phone but the network hear is not
> ok/condusive for me to give you call about the transaction,I could like
> you to still be reaching me via-email as times goes on..I have my own
> personal shipping agent who will handle the shippment of the Bike.I
will
> like to know if a Certified Cheque will work out for the payment of the
> Bike.since am not in the state,If it will work out for the payment,I
> will contact my Client who have a US[bankAccount] to forward the
payment
> of the Bike to you,Snice am far away from the Country,And also the last
> price you are willing to sale[5500 is my price i hope it work or you
can
> still less it more] it.If so we can processed.By sending your mailing
> details,Example:- [ 1 ] Your resident address
> [ 2 ] Phone number
> [ 3 ] Your full name,which will be written on the Cheque for the
payment
> of the Boat.Looking forward to hear from you soonext.GodBless Best
> regards. Smith... [Buyer].----- Original Message -----
> From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
> Date: Thu, 1 Apr 2004 09:31:49 -0500
> To: "'runner smith'" <runnerman007@XXXXXX>
> Subject: RE: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
>
> > Mr. Smith,
> > Yes the bike is still for sale. It is as you saw in the pictures. It
> > now has just over 4000 miles on it (less than 4100). I will change
the
>
> > oil and filter once more before it is sold. As for payment terms, I
> > would like either cash, cashiers check, or money order. I will let it
> > go for $5750. Let me know how you want to proceed. I have one other
> > person I hear from today. Thanks,
> > Danny
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: runner smith [mailto:runnerman007@XXXXXX]
> > Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2004 9:15 AM
> > To: danthompson@XXXXXX
> > Subject: INTERESTED BUYER :2002 Yamaha FZ1
> >
> >
> > Dear Seller,
> > Am interested in buying your Bike,which the advert was placed on net,
> > I would like to make enquiry about it and if you still have it for
> > sale.If yes,kindly get back to me with the present condition,I have
> > view the Jpg pic;s of the Bike which is ok.Your payment terms,final
> > price you're willing to sell it.Looking forward to hear from you
> > soonest. Best of Regards. Smith..,
> >
>   >
>   >
>   >   --
>   >   _______________________________________________
>   >   Outgun.com free e-mail @ www.outgun.com
>   >   Check out our Premium services - POP3 downloading, e-mail forwarding,
>   >   and 25MB mailboxes!
>   >
>   >   Powered by Outblaze
>
>   ---
>   Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>   Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>   Version: 6.0.647 / Virus Database: 414 - Release Date: 3/29/2004
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 12:55:07 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:54:56 -0500
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: FW: payment and address:2002 Yamaha FZ1
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

The scam is making you think it's going overseas. If you sell it to him,
he will have a "friend" in the states pick it up to ship to him.
Probably won't make it out of the country. Or at least, not to Oz.
Also, getting your name and address only gives them info to possibly
steal your bike. I'd blow this guy off and tell him you know it's a scam
and that you're turning him in to the FCC or something. :-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/2/2004 12:32:05 PM Eastern Standard Time,
omni@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Very. They guy claims to be in Australia, but he writes like a non-
English
> speaker (maybe he's an immigrant?). He also seems to think you are
selling
> a boat at one point (maybe a typo?). He isn't following *all* of the
> details of some of the overseas bank scams...such as asking for your
bank
> account info so he can deposit the money for you...but it still sounds
very
> fishy. Maybe it's just a way to get names and addresses of bike owners
for
> sale to a mailing list company?
>
> I really doubt that he really wants to buy and ship a bike halfway
around
> the world though. It's possible, but less likely than that he's up to
> something.
>
>   -- Mike B.
>
>   At 07:15 AM 4/2/04 -0500, Danny Thompson wrote:
>   >Does this look suspicious to anyone besides myself? Any suggestions as
>   >to how I can trace it down a bit more?
>   >Thanks,
>   >Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr     2 13:32:18 2004
Subject: RE: Ride in
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 02 Apr 2004 13:28:56 -0500

On Fri, 2004-04-02 at 12:12, rich hall wrote:
> Carl, do you ride the GSXR more than the Harley?    Any reason if so?
>

I'd have to say that I ride the Harley more than the GSXR. Currently the
main reason was that the Harley was in the shop (all of September). The
next one would be my girth. I can dress warmer for riding on the Harley
than on the Suzuki. If I have too much gear on, extremities start to
lose bloodflow :-) Since it's mostly been winter riding, I've been on
the Harley. Another one would be carrying capacity. The Harley doesn't
have saddlebags so I have to cinch something to it before I can go
anywhere. The Gixxer has a tailbag. For a quick trip to the store, I can
throw my gloves into the 'trunk' and go in. Same with putting stuff into
the 'trunk'. I'll ride the Suzuki more often in the rain than the
Harley, comfort level mainly. When sitting up, the wind blows the rain
and wind up into the opening of my face shield so I'm constantly lifting
and lowering the shield even with the fog city thing. When on the
Suzuki, the wind mainly blows top to bottom with a tiny bit of updraft.
This lets me keep the shield cracked without getting face fulls of
water. Since I don't use a windshield on the Harley, the fairing on the
Suzuki keeps more of the water off of me. For general nice-day driving
though I'd have to say it could be either one. The Harley lets me enjoy
the day. The weather, the road, the sights, the smells, the day. The
Suzuki lets me unwind and enjoy the road. I can task my abilities and be
competitive with myself. A nice clear road is a joy.

The Harley lets me cruuuuissssse.

The Suzuki lets me -=>fly.

I commented to Fish in private e-mail that once I get the chopper built,
I may sell the Harley (depends on stability ;-) and the GSXR replacing
them with a nice dual-sport or sport-touring bike more appropriate for
Colorado riding with my honey. I'll still have two bikes. That's just
speculating though. I may never get to that point.

Carl

> >From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
> >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> >Subject: Ride in
> >Date: 02 Apr 2004 11:31:54 -0500
> >
> >While going through Springfield I found that they had ground down two
> >short bits of the road. The first one wasn't all that bad. The second
> >one, just as you're straightening up past the new overpass, has a
lovely
> >high lip on it. When I hit it, it made a nice hard thump. The GSXR
> >seemed not to have taken any damage so I kept going. For some reason,
as
> >I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that
my
> >ignition key has gone missing. I looked over the bike hoping to find
the
> >key hung up on the fairing or in some crack but no such luck. I looped
> >around and headed home, no easy way to turn off the bike.
> >Need to find me a locksmith, or I'll get Tim (the guy I bought the
bike
> >from) to simply make another one. Fricking pain in the butt.
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar get it now!
> http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 13:33:38 2004
Subject: Re: Ride in
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 02 Apr 2004 13:30:15 -0500

On Fri, 2004-04-02 at 12:37, Mike Bartman wrote:
> At 11:31 AM 4/2/04 -0500, Carl Schelin wrote:
>
> >seemed not to have taken any damage so I kept going. For some reason,
as
> >I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that
my
> >ignition key has gone missing.
>
> I have a new appreciation for Harley's design. My key is always in my
> zippered pocket while riding, and I can shut the bike down with the
> START/RUN switch on the handlebar...as well as turn off the ignition
> without a key. All I need a key for is to make it a little harder to
steal
> the bike. So long as the ignition isn't locked up, I can use the bike
> perfectly normally in all ways without a key at all. (I know you know
> this, but others may or may not, and any time Harley is better than an
> import, I'm going to mention it! :-)

Normally I have the suzuki key in my pocket too but with the rain and
that I put gas in this morning, I didn't put it back into my pocket. The
first thing I did when I didn't see it was check my pocket but I was
sure I had left it in the ignitian.

>
> -- Mike B.
>

Carl


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr       2 13:37:45 2004
Subject: Re: Ride in
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 02 Apr 2004 13:34:20 -0500

On Fri, 2004-04-02 at 12:39, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> OK, how do you lose an ignition key while the bike is running and
moving?
> Someone please explain this to me as I thought you had to turn it to
the
> Off position before you could remove it?

One of the notches on the key is the one that keeps it locked in the
ignition. The guy I got the bike from had lost the original keys and
rekeyed all three locks. When he created the key, he didn't create that
lock notch. It wasn't a suzuki key. It looked like an Olds key that he
just cut the correct notches into.

>
> Scooter (2 or 3 spare keys for EVERYTHING :-))
>

I have a spare house key in my wallet (bad place considering my address
is there) and I used to have a spare car key, when I had a car. I only
had the one Suzuki key which is why I normally have it in my pocket.

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr       2 14:15:14 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 14:15:02 -0500
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ride in
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Ah-ha.   I see said the blind man.    8-)

Scooter (no longer blind, thanks to Lasik ;-))

In a message dated 4/2/2004 1:34:20 PM Eastern Standard Time,
cschelin@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> On Fri, 2004-04-02 at 12:39, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> > OK, how do you lose an ignition key while the bike is running and
moving?
> > Someone please explain this to me as I thought you had to turn it to
the
> > Off position before you could remove it?
>
> One of the notches on the key is the one that keeps it locked in the
> ignition. The guy I got the bike from had lost the original keys and
> rekeyed all three locks. When he created the key, he didn't create that
> lock notch. It wasn't a suzuki key. It looked like an Olds key that he
> just cut the correct notches into.
>
> >
> > Scooter (2 or 3 spare keys for EVERYTHING :-))
> >
>
> I have a spare house key in my wallet (bad place considering my address
> is there) and I used to have a spare car key, when I had a car. I only
> had the one Suzuki key which is why I normally have it in
> my pocket.
>
> Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 14:54:32 2004
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 11:54:23 -0800 (PST)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: Moto Travel Website: Ghost Town
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Hello DC Cycles. I have been off the list for a while
but this has motivated me to join back up and share
with you.

I just spent 20 minutes going through this website.   I
can promise you, none of us has ever gone on rides
like this.

http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/

Mark

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 15:00:56 2004
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 12:00:53 -0800 (PST)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Moto Travel Website: Ghost Town
To: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>,
   DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
You're late, it was posted earlier this week.

Glenn

--- Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Hello DC Cycles. I have been off the list for a
> while
> but this has motivated me to join back up and share
> with you.
>
> I just spent 20 minutes going through this website.
> I
> can promise you, none of us has ever gone on rides
> like this.
>
> http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/
>
> Mark
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
>


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 15:01:46 2004
From: "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: "Carl Schelin" <cschelin@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ride in
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 15:02:01 -0500

----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl Schelin" <cschelin@XXXXXX>
  For some reason, as
> I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that my
> ignition key has gone missing. I looked over the bike hoping to find
the
> key hung up on the fairing or in some crack but no such luck. I looped
> around and headed home, no easy way to turn off the bike.
>

To stop: hit kill switch.   Pull fuses for lights to keep battery from
running down. DAMHIK.

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 15:03:03 2004
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 12:02:58 -0800 (PST)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Moto Travel Website: Ghost Town
To: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

As I said, have not been on the list.

cheers


--- Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX> wrote:
> You're late, it was posted earlier this week.
>
> Glenn
>
> --- Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX> wrote:
> > Hello DC Cycles. I have been off the list for a
> > while
> > but this has motivated me to join back up and
> share
> > with you.
> >
> > I just spent 20 minutes going through this
> website.
> > I
> > can promise you, none of us has ever gone on rides
> > like this.
> >
> > http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/
> >
> > Mark
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
> > http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
> >
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
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http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 15:05:09 2004
From: "Perry Coleman" <perrycoleman@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: New Aerostitch
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 14:53:52 -0500

Lordy! ;^)

(And how much do those puppies cost?)

Perry

>From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Re: New Aerostitch
>Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 12:49:48 -0500
>
>Very nice. I personally like the "bling, bling" aspect mentioned at the
>bottom.
>
>Speaking of bling, bling, I have bought a couple pairs of gloves from
Icon
>in the past and was checking out their website today to see what they
had
>new to offer. This is NOT a joke. Check out their site at
>www.rideicon.com. Click on Products and then Gloves. I have a pair of
the
>Timax (white), Holligan (white/red) and Super-duty (black) but am
thinking
>about getting a pair of the Bling gloves. What do you guys think? ;-)
>
>Scooter
>
>In a message dated 4/2/2004 12:31:22 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>mjordan812@XXXXXX writes:
>
> >
> >
> > A bit late, but...
> >
> > http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/newsandupdates/stichaf04/
> >
> > Michael J.
>

_________________________________________________________________
Tax headache? MSN Money provides relief with tax tips, tools, IRS forms
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 15:16:11 2004
Subject: Re: Ride in
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 02 Apr 2004 15:12:49 -0500

On Fri, 2004-04-02 at 15:02, Paul Wilson wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Carl Schelin" <cschelin@XXXXXX>
> For some reason, as
> > I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and discovered that
my
> > ignition key has gone missing. I looked over the bike hoping to find
the
> > key hung up on the fairing or in some crack but no such luck. I
looped
> > around and headed home, no easy way to turn off the bike.
> >
>
> To stop: hit kill switch. Pull fuses for lights to keep battery from
> running down. DAMHIK.

Had I had my screwdrivers with me, I would have popped the tail off and
just unscrewed the battery terminals (third lock isn't in place so the
tail can just be popped off). Hindsight and all that :-)

> Paul in DC
> 95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org
>
>

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 15:16:44 2004
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 15:17:27 -0500
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Erick Singley <es87m@XXXXXX>
Subject: TN /helmet law

Some might be interested in this balanced article
http://www.tennessean.com/government/archives/04/04/49319313.shtml
...
"Arriving back in Tennessee, Shaub had to put his helmet back on. But
that might not be the case for long, as the state Senate yesterday
passed a bill loosening helmet restrictions by a 24-8 vote. The bill
heads to the House.

The proposal would make helmets optional for those 25 and older,
under certain conditions."
...
"Several local bikers said they wouldn't ride without a helmet but
stopped short of saying the state should require them to wear one.

''It's dangerous out there, and I have a close call almost every
day,'' said Andy Hughes, a biker for 10 years who works at Boswell's
Harley-Davidson on Fesslers Lane. ''I wear a helmet regardless of
what the helmet law is, but I think everyone ought to have the
freedom of choice.''"
...

Erick <- who stupidly cracked his oil pan by turning the stuck bolt
the wrong way - too far - to try to break it free.     [getting the
aluminum welded sometime in the next week or so]
74' CB-750

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 15:38:27 2004
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 12:38:15 -0800 (PST)
From: Leon Begeman <mriderleon@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ride in
To: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

That's why my commuter bikes don't use ignition keys
anymore.

If anyone would like their Kawasaki hot-wired, I'll be
happy to prepare the little pigtail for a reasonable
price. And yes, I can accomodate for the anti-theft
ignition switch.

Leon.


--- Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Loads of fun on the way in this morning.
>
> as
> I went over the 14th street bridge I looked down and
> discovered that my
> ignition key has gone missing.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 16:51:18 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 16:48:23 -0500
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: New Aerostitch

At 12:49 PM 4/2/04 -0500, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>offer. This is NOT a joke. Check out their site at www.rideicon.com.

Very slow-loading site. They should ditch the animation stuff and just
put
up text and pictures...at least until everyone has a T1 going to their
house. Took like 30 seconds to get to the first screen, and I've got a
144K DSL line.

>Holligan (white/red) and Super-duty (black) but am thinking about
getting
a pair of the Bling gloves. What do you guys think? ;-)
I think you'll look good in them, once you get the cape and spandex
riding
suit to go with them! When does the new "Scooterman" comic book go on
sale? :-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 17:00:37 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 17:00:30 -0500
To: "Perry Coleman" <perrycoleman@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: New Aerostitch

$250....but only $200 for the shorty version!

I think they look best in black...but you'd need boots to match! :-O

-- Mike B.

At 02:53 PM 4/2/04 -0500, Perry Coleman wrote:
>Lordy! ;^)
>
>(And how much do those puppies cost?)
>
>Perry
>
>>From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
>>Timax (white), Holligan (white/red) and Super-duty (black) but am
thinking
>>about getting a pair of the Bling gloves. What do you guys think?      ;-)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 17:00:40 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 16:55:26 -0500
To: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>,
   Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Moto Travel Website: Ghost Town

That was late too...I saw it several weeks ago, and exchanged a few
messages with the lady. She's a good photographer.

-- Mike B.

At 12:00 PM 4/2/04 -0800, Glenn Dysart wrote:
>You're late, it was posted earlier this week.
>
>Glenn
>
>--- Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX> wrote:

>> http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 17:17:58 2004
Subject: Re: Moto Travel Website: Ghost Town
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 02 Apr 2004 17:14:36 -0500

Yea, I posted it in the beginning of March. Still a good site and
welcome back Mark.

Carl

On Fri, 2004-04-02 at 16:55, Mike Bartman wrote:
> That was late too...I saw it several weeks ago, and exchanged a few
> messages with the lady. She's a good photographer.
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> At 12:00 PM 4/2/04 -0800, Glenn Dysart wrote:
> >You're late, it was posted earlier this week.
> >
> >Glenn
> >
> >--- Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX> wrote:
>
> >> http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 18:50:41 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Fun With Tools - was:RE: TN /helmet law
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 18:50:33 -0500

> who stupidly cracked his oil pan by turning the stuck
> bolt the wrong way - too far - to try to break it free.

I fondly remember the day that I learned about left hand threads (was
about
15 at the time).

I had just finished chiseling off the clutch retaining bolt on my old
('34)
Harley when my stepfather came up and said "That's a left hand thread."

Said I, "whuzzat?"

And so I learned that "Right tight, left loose" was not an absolute.

Michael J.
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 20:49:39 2004
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 20:49:25 EST
Subject: testing
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

This is a test to see if AOhelL will send as plain text.

Scooter (2000 r/w/b YZF R6)
AFRA #17

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 20:55:22 2004
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 20:55:08 EST
Subject: Re: New Aerostitch
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/2/2004 8:36:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, ScooterFZR
writes:
In a message dated 4/2/2004 4:51:26 PM Eastern Standard Time,
omni@XXXXXX writes:
At 12:49 PM 4/2/04 -0500, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>offer. This is NOT a joke. Check out their site at www.rideicon.com.

>Very slow-loading site. They should ditch the animation stuff and just
put
>up text and pictures...at least until everyone has a T1 going to their
>house. Took like 30 seconds to get to the first screen, and I've got a
>144K DSL line.

>Holligan (white/red) and Super-duty (black) but am thinking about
getting
>a pair of the Bling gloves. What do you guys think? ;-)

>I think you'll look good in them, once you get the cape and spandex
riding
>suit to go with them! When does the new "Scooterman" comic book go on
>sale? :-)

>-- Mike B.

They do have a non-flash/low bandwith link on the home page. What do you
think, the black or blue? I think black since I've got a r/w/b bike.
LOL
"Scooterman", hmmmm......sounds interesting. ;-)

Scooter (2000 r/w/b YZF R6)

Now that I've got this AOhelL sending as Plain Text figured out, here is
my
previous e-mail.

Scooter (2000 r/w/b YZF R6)
AFRA #17

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   2 20:56:17 2004
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 20:56:06 EST
Subject: Re: New Aerostitch
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/2/2004 5:00:55 PM Eastern Standard Time,
omni@XXXXXX writes:
>$250....but only $200 for the shorty version!

>I think they look best in black...but you'd need boots to match! :-O

>-- Mike B.

I'll recommend them to the company.   LOL

Scooter (2000 r/w/b YZF R6)
AFRA #17

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 21:04:24 2004
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 21:04:13 EST
Subject: Sending to the list from AOhelL
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Harry (and anyone else),

After a little chat with an AOL Techie, here's how to send a message from
the
AOhelL software to the list. I know this works for Version 9.0 but, I'm
not
sure about any lower versions. Open a new mail message and then right-
click
in the message body. Select Compose as Plain Text and viola, sending a
message
as plaint text to the list with no bounce back. :-)

Scooter (2000 r/w/b YZF R6)
AFRA #17

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 2 22:40:14 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 22:40:15 -0500
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: testing

At 08:49 PM 4/2/04 EST, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>This is a test to see if AOhelL will send as plain text.
>
>Scooter (2000 r/w/b YZF R6)
>AFRA #17
Apparently, yes!   See:

From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 2004 20:49:25 EST
Subject: testing
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr    2 23:09:16 2004
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 23:08:59 -0500
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Akira's bike

http://www.itmedia.co.jp/lifestyle/articles/0404/02/news040.html

I'm not a fan of anime, but those of you that are will recognize Akira's
bike. Site is in Japanese.


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr    3 11:02:59 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 11:02:49 EST
Subject: Re: Ride in
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/2/2004 1:34:15 PM Eastern Standard Time,
cschelin@XXXXXX writes:

> I looked down and discovered that my
> > >ignition key has gone missing.

I have been carrying a spare key in my key case with all my other keys
since
my first bike (60s.) It has bailed my ass out more then once.
John.
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 3 11:07:51 2004
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 08:07:42 -0800 (PST)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Speedwerks is Awesome! (a trip report w/ new rotors, tires, and
crabs)
To: pattonme@XXXXXX

*Massive*^2 props to Speedwerks of Dover, DE (www.speedwerks.com)! They
got me some EBC MD4008's (race version) overnight for $330 which is $10
below the best price available that I could find for the STREET
version!! And Steve even took pity on me and changed my tire and for
free (a Maxxis SuperMaxx which I was carrying on the back) and I put
the rotors on using the shop's electric impact wrench. That tool works!
I'm thinking I should have saved the money and gotten all electrical
tools instead of an air-driven setup. Because they be no air at the
track. All this on a Friday night (got there 5pm instead of 4:30
because of the miserable weather and Bay Bridge mayhem).

Steve also showed me how to mount the wheel correctly for once. The
factory service manual is typically short on details. The correct way
is to snug the axle up (about 45ft/lb instead of the rediculous 72),
install calipers, spin wheel and settle brakes a couple times, (he also
normally bounces the front-end a couple times), THEN and only then
tighten the pinches. the last time I did it (and I've had the wheel off
a bunch of times recently with my fork experiments) I couldn't get it
to spin freely after several attempts. As a result a week's worth of
riding about destroyed one of the inner pads on the left side. He took
one look at the pad and said, "Matt, you don't know how to mount a
wheel correctly, do you? We see this all the time on SV's and such that
have sliding 2-pin brakes." I have now been educated by a pro! I wish
there were some way I could 'hover' out of the way for a week or two
(or frankly a month) and just watch him and the mechanics go about
their jobs. If I watch Brian Roach though "I'll never learn anything.
Because he never comes to the shop and is always on the 'puter." Just a
little good-natured ribbing from Steve, there. But in their defense the
 Roaches are racing down at Jenning GP this weekend. I also learned how
to use the the Harbor Freight manual tire changer correctly (or any
manual changer really) since it too came with no directions.

The EBC race rotors are steel so they'll rust but I don't give a fig
about that even though I ride in the rain all the time. A few seconds
and that'll come right off. The 'street' version doesn't have the same
feature. A big plus for the race version is that I can get replacements
and just swap the surface out instead of the whole assembly. Both
street and race come with 5mm rotors.

I need a new chain pretty soon (30k miles on the stock one) and he had
one on the shelf but he basically wouldn't sell it to me because it
wasn't good enough quality. Get an "EK MVX-series" he said. "That one
there's - an EK-SROZ - for street riders. but you ride too much for it
to last. Buy the best chain you can afford."
The picture shows the pad sweep of the ZR-7 brake pads because that's
the calipers I have on at the moment (not for long). The rotors are
absolutely identical except that Kawi indeed didn't bother to machine
that extra 5mm. So for those shopping rotors, buy what the manufacturer
specs for the 1993+ ZX6e/ZZR600 and write Kawi some more hate-mail er,
constructive feedback for being short-sighted. They have no business
cheapin' out like this on the forks and the brakes when they got the
parts so readily available IMO. The ZZR600 MSRP's a scant $500 more but
it has all kinds of expensive tupperware to boot and a 'fancy' and
reasonably modern engine to my air-cooled 2 valve KZ750 mill from the
early 80's!! It's the same non-logic over there in the Yamaha camp with
the FZ6 and YZF6R.

It's a long 110mi from Arlington to Dover each way in the cold and wet
but the Gerbings saved my hide yet again. Had one driver neatly pull
out into my lane from a stop into 70mph traffic on US50. A megaphone
would have been nice.

Stopped at Holly's Inn and Restaurant for some food there on US50 west
(I think) of the Bridge. I've never had such good crab-cakes. Most I've
had have been filler with a little crab thrown in as an excuse. These
were solid crab with just enough filler to keep it from falling
completely apart. I had more crab in one cake than I had eating a dozen
or more steamed crabs and didn't go thru any trauma trying to get at
the meat. Each cake was 4" diameter and 2" thick. And the crab soup was
great, too. Maybe I've simply not been eating crab cakes at the right
places...

Off to find myself some pads and a chain and a massage. My back still
hurts for some reason. Must be the damp.

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 3 12:12:35 2004
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 09:12:17 -0800 (PST)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: looking for a RAM ball-only
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

anyone got a local source for a RAMMount ball with just a little stub
of a bolt? Or does everyone just use cyclegadgets.com?

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 3 12:35:45 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: "'matthew patton'" <pattonme@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: looking for a RAM ball-only
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 12:35:38 -0500

> anyone got a local source for a RAMMount ball with just a
> little stub of a bolt? Or does everyone just use cyclegadgets.com?

Cyclegadgets...

RAM makes a ball with a short 1/4" x 20 threaded stud sticking out.

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 3 16:34:02 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Could use some truck/trailer help...
Date: Sat, 03 Apr 2004 16:22:00 -0500

Well, my time finally came, I guess.

Went down on Rt. 80 near Urbana because of some mud in the road. I'm
only
banged up a bit but the bike is a little scraped down on the left side.

Does anybody have a truck/trailer that I could use to help get it home?
The
bike is in Urbana and I live in Germantown.

Thanks.   I'll write up a longer version later.

Rob
'98 VFR800

_________________________________________________________________
Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar )B– FREE!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 3 16:36:59 2004
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 13:36:56 -0800 (PST)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Could use some truck/trailer help...
To: Rob Keiser <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
Cc: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Sorry Rob.   Glad you are ok.

No truck or trailer here....


--- Rob Keiser <robkeiser@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Well, my time finally came, I guess.
>
> Went down on Rt. 80 near Urbana because of some mud
> in the road. I'm only
> banged up a bit but the bike is a little scraped
> down on the left side.
>
> Does anybody have a truck/trailer that I could use
> to help get it home? The
> bike is in Urbana and I live in Germantown.
>
> Thanks. I'll write up a longer version later.
>
> Rob
> '98 VFR800
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 3 17:03:41 2004
Date: Sat, 03 Apr 2004 16:57:25 -0500
From: Chuck and Karen Pena <cvkgpena@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: cvkgpena@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: FZR 600 for sale - track bike with lights

My 1993 FZR600 Benetton Formula One-inspired DIY painted track bike with
lights is up for sale. $2200 OBO. Somebody make me an offer I can't
refuse. Please, take my wife ... er ... bike. %^) But seriously, this
is a great first track bike.

By modern 600 standards, the motor is "weak," putting out only 75 hp.
But that also means it's harder to get in too far over your head and
into big trouble. That said, it's plenty fast. I've seen 140mph
indicated on the speedo. D&D full race exhaust. Jetted (last year).
Slight flat spot at ~5000 rpm but pulls smoothly and strongly all the
way to the rev limit. Even though it may not be scary fast in a
straight line, my FZR can corner with the best of them. I was able to
leave a lot of guys on newer, more powerful, and expensive bikes
(including a few Ducs and Aprilias) behind me on the track at Summit.
Fox Twin Clicker rear shock. Race Tech'ed front end (springs and
emulators). Beefy, custom front fork brace. It's at home in the
corners, either on the street or on the track. An "easy" bike to learn
the fine art of knee dragging. Sticky BT-56SS tires with plenty of
tread life left in them. Other stuff: New sprockets and chain last
year. Running 14T up front and 46T in back and using an RK 520 chain.
The gearing is -1 in the front and +1 in the back from stock. It
sacrifices some top speed for more pull/drive in the corners and
probably a little quicker acceleration. I figure the actual top speed
with this gearing is something like 135mph. Frame and bar end sliders.
  Steel braided front brake lines (I can't remember about the rear). HH
front brake pads. UNI air filter (and I have filter oil). Will include
Airtech front numberplate for track duty. BTW, the headlights have
clear stoneguards so they don't need to be taped for the track. Smoke
windscreen (I think it's LP, but I honestly can't remember). Already
minimally safety-wired for track use: rear axle cotter pin, oil filter,
and oil filler cap. BTW, I'm using Mobil One 5W-50 automobile oil.

FULL DISCLOSURE: I'm the second owner. Bought it on eBay from a guy in
CO. It's been down at least once. I lowsided on the left side 2
seasons ago at Summit Point. I repaired the bodywork myself, which
means it's OK but not perfect. I'm pretty sure the previous owner
lowsided once too (probably at the track). The left fairing had been
repaired with some sort of plastic weld when I bought it (which I had to
repair again -- less elegantly -- after my minor adventure at Summit).
Speaking of bodywork, the tailpiece is an Airtech TZ250 tailpiece, which
gives the bike a completely different GP-ish look. It also means that I
had to do a DIY DOT-legal brake/tail light. Tailpiece got banged up in
my lowside at Summit, but I repaired it. Finally, a couple of small
cracks in the upper but they've all been patched up. These are not 100%
perfect professional repairs (hey, it's really a track bike!) Frame was
painted flat-black by the previous owner, as was the bodywork. All
sorts of pics and words at
http://www.geocities.com/the_penas/chux_gsxr.htm. I have all the
paperwork that the original owner gave me when I bought it, as well as
for any shop work I've had done.

One final note: my FZR will pass inspection in VA because VA law doesn't
require turn signals and I don't have any. I can't vouch for it passing
in either DC or MD. And if you need/want turn signals, that's
completely up to you. Also, it doesn't have a rear license plate light
(which it's technically supposed to have) but I've never been hassled
about it.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 3 18:24:53 2004
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2004 18:42:42 -0500 (EST)
From: Wayne Edelen <wayne@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Could use some truck/trailer help...
On Sat, 3 Apr 2004, Rob Keiser wrote:

> Well, my time finally came, I guess.
>
> Went down on Rt. 80 near Urbana because of some mud in the road. I'm
only
> banged up a bit but the bike is a little scraped down on the left side.
>
> Does anybody have a truck/trailer that I could use to help get it home?
The
> bike is in Urbana and I live in Germantown.
>
> Thanks. I'll write up a longer version later.
>
> Rob
> '98 VFR800

Rob, drop me a line.    I live in Ijamsville (right off Ijamsville Rd) and
can help you out.

-- Wayne

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 4 00:46:52 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Could use some truck/trailer help...
Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2004 00:46:41 -0500

Just wanted to say a big Thanks to all the offers for help. The bike is
resting comfortably in the garage until the insurance company decides
what
they'd like to do next. I'm in no rush.

My membership to HRCA had initially slipped my mind, and after calling
them,
they stepped up and got me in touch with Kenny at Independent MC
Transport.

Long story short....(since I'm kinda tired)....riding Westbound on Rt. 80
from 75 in some traffic. Came over the crest of a small hill and ran
into a
thick line of mud/rocks that was lying in the middle of the lane from a
truck coming out of a construction site. When trying to get on the dry
part
of the lane, the bike slid out from under me. Low side left.

SUV behind moved over to miss me and tagged the bike (from what he said)
doing minimal damage to it. Bike is (needless to say) a little rough,
but
fixable.

No major damage here.    Right hand a little tingly and left knee swollen.
The gear really saved me a lot of pain.   No question.   But I'm sure I'll
be
sore tomorrow.

The people in that area couldn't have been nicer and probably had 911
dialed
before I stopped sliding.

Can go into more detail if people are interested, but right now, I'm
tired.
Time for bed.

Thanks again, everyone. As much as this list can really annoy the crap
out
of me sometimes, it is a community that looks after their own. I
appreciate that very much.

'night.

Rob
'98 VFR800

_________________________________________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 4 09:32:34 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Sun, 4 Apr 2004 09:32:17 EDT
Subject: Re: Speedwerks is Awesome! (a trip report w/ new rotors, tires,
and crabs)
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/3/2004 12:08:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
pattonme@XXXXXX writes:

> I put
> the rotors on using the shop's electric impact wrench. That tool
works!

NEVER! Never, never, never use an impact wrench to install rotors! They
should be torqued using a good torque wrench to the manufacturers
specifications.
Over tightening (easy to do) can weaken the bolts, under tightening can
result
in failure due to loosening.

>   I'm thinking I should have saved the money and gotten all electrical
>   tools instead of an air-driven setup. Because they be no air at the
>   track.

FYI:   DeWalt now has rechargeable (cordless) impact drivers, I am lusting
after one myself. Should be perfect at a track.

>   have sliding 2-pin brakes.

Did you lube the pins? If the pins do not move freely your brakes will
not
work properly and will wear quickly.



New "bumper sticker" on the ST1100.

"Eat right, stay fit,
 DIE ANYWAY!"

John Walters (Long John)
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Up near DC

Honda ST1100X Pan European
BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles
Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr   5 06:14:35 2004
Subject: Morning Ride
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 05 Apr 2004 06:11:02 -0400

Of course you don't need to be reminded about flying debris on the ride
in (for the folks who bike in). I narrowly avoided a flying cardboard
box that was swooping in on an attack run in Springfield. And watch out
for roving gangs of orange construction barrels.

Seriously though, the chain link fence that's blocking the scaffolding
between 14th and 12th on Independence has been blown into the next
travel lane. As it gets light, you'll see it but it's almost invisible
in the dark. Hopefully the construction guys will put it back before it
gets too busy.

Ride safe.

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 10:11:29 2004
Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 10:11:21 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Front wheel mounting, was Re: Speedwerks is Awesome! (a trip
report
 w/ new rotors, tires, and crabs)
-----Original Message-----
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>

Steve also showed me how to mount the wheel correctly for once. The
factory service manual is typically short on details. The correct way
is to snug the axle up (about 45ft/lb instead of the rediculous 72),
install calipers, spin wheel and settle brakes a couple times, (he also
normally bounces the front-end a couple times), THEN and only then
tighten the pinches. .....

-------------------

Hmm, I could swear that's the exact opposite of the Honda Service
Manual's procedure for the VFR. Snug the axle hand-tight, install
calipers, get the front end settled (bounce the front end if you want),
then tighten the pinch bolts.   The final step is to torque the axle bolt
to spec.

Honda provides a .7 mm feeler gauge in the factory tool kit to check for
proper rotor clearance.

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 10:42:02 2004
Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2004 10:40:44 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Speedwerks is Awesome! (a trip report w/ new rotors, tires,
and
 crabs)



PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote:
>
> In a message dated 4/3/2004 12:08:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> pattonme@XXXXXX writes:
>
> > I put
> > the rotors on using the shop's electric impact wrench. That tool
works!
>
> NEVER! Never, never, never use an impact wrench to install rotors! They
> should be torqued using a good torque wrench to the manufacturers
specifications.
> Over tightening (easy to do) can weaken the bolts, under tightening can
result
> in failure due to loosening.

Not to mention that uneven torque is the single largest cause of warped
rotors...

I've seen it done ( and done it myself) just putting on a wheel.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 11:59:44 2004
Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2004 11:53:21 -0400
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: looking for a RAM ball-only

At 09:12 AM 4/3/04 -0800, matthew patton wrote:
>anyone got a local source for a RAMMount ball with just a little stub
>of a bolt? Or does everyone just use cyclegadgets.com?

I got mine from cycoactive...GRAHEX is what they call what you are
looking
for I think:

http://www.cycoactive.com/gps/gallery/parts.html   (item "V").

It's not local, but they shipped quickly. If you want a much nicer bar
clamp than the one RAM sells, check out item W...very nice clamp that
works
well with the GRAHEX ball...been using it for my GPS all winter.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 13:23:51 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, SV650_BALT_DC@XXXXXX
Subject: OT: Roommates needed in Ballston
Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2004 13:11:44 -0400

I need 2 roommates for a 3 bedroom condo.   One old roommates bought and
the
other is leaving the area after living there for about 6 and 4 years
each.
I've been there 2 years. Lease starts June 1st. Looking for someone to
rent for a year ideally, no pets, no smoking inside. I'm a 28 yr old
professional.

1 block from Ballston Metro stop
3 bedroom 2 bath condo
basement level
large patio
fireplace
full size washer & dryer in unit
storage closet
cable modem
1 parking spot, 6 resident spots shared w/ about 12 cars

$740 master bedroom, own bath, 2 closets
$660 large bedroom, share bath

$35 credit check
$666.66 security deposit

_________________________________________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 13:28:21 2004
Subject: RE: Roommates needed in Ballston
Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 13:28:09 -0400
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

So what's the operating theory here; anyone who would agree to a security
deposit like this must be the right fit? ;-)

You might also consider crosslisting on the craigslist.org site, sounds
ideal for a student.

Robert


-----Original Message-----
From: rich hall [mailto:richallmc@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 1:12 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX; SV650_BALT_DC@XXXXXX
Subject: OT: Roommates needed in Ballston


<snip>

$666.66 security deposit

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 13:37:35 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: OT: RE: Roommates needed in Ballston
Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2004 13:37:27 -0400

1/3 of the rent, just happens to come out to that.
Somehow this is a little more personal than Craiglist. It'll probably be
on
there shortly. Being 28 and a few years removed from school, I'd rather
have someone closer to that.

>From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
>To: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: RE: Roommates needed in Ballston
>Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 13:28:09 -0400
>
>So what's the operating theory here; anyone who would agree to a
security
>deposit like this must be the right fit? ;-)
>You might also consider crosslisting on the craigslist.org site, sounds
>ideal for a student.

>-----Original Message-----
>From: rich hall [mailto:richallmc@XXXXXX]
>Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 1:12 PM
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX; SV650_BALT_DC@XXXXXX
>Subject: OT: Roommates needed in Ballston
>
>$666.66 security deposit
>

_________________________________________________________________
Persistent heartburn? Check out Digestive Health & Wellness for
information
and advice. http://gerd.msn.com/default.asp

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 13:44:39 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: looking for a RAM ball-only
Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 13:44:32 -0400

http://www.cycoactive.com/gps/gallery/parts.html

Item "C" is what you were looking for

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 15:39:08 2004
Subject: Doing it yourself or the help of others
Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 15:41:46 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>




After dropping my helmet and scratching an already scratched up shield,
I decided to go ahead and replace my shield and "upgrade" by buying a
fog city insert. I allowed the sales clerk to help me with installing
it and while he did a great job aligning it much better than I did. His
fingerprints are plastered between the shield and the insert. I suppose
it would be stupid to pry the insert off right now and wipe down the
inside of the shield.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 15:54:39 2004
Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 12:54:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Leon Begeman <mriderleon@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Doing it yourself or the help of others
To: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

It would be even worse to try to do it after the tape
gets dried out.

Leon.
--- Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX> wrote:
> His
> fingerprints are plastered between the shield and
> the insert. I suppose
> it would be stupid to pry the insert off right now
> and wipe down the
> inside of the shield.
>


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 16:04:39 2004
Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2004 16:04:55 -0400
To: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Doing it yourself or the help of others

At 03:41 PM 4/5/04 -0400, Julian Halton wrote:
>
>After dropping my helmet and scratching an already scratched up shield,
>I decided to go ahead and replace my shield and "upgrade" by buying a
>fog city insert.

Depending on what you dropped your helmet on, and how far it fell, you
might want to consider a new helmet, or at least getting it checked out
by
the manufacturer. It doesn't take much of a drop onto something like
concrete to cause compression in the shock absorbing material, and/or
cracks in the shell that will seriously impair its ability to do its job
if
you ever need it. You don't have to be in the helmet when it is dropped
for such damage to happen. DOT testing doesn't cover double impacts to
the
same location (SNELL's does though...but they have lower standards for
the
second impact than for the first I believe).
If you are an "I only wear it to avoid the tickets" sort of   person, fine,
but if you wear a helmet because you actually consider your   brain to be
one
of your favorite organs, you might want to consider getting   the helmet
checked out. Visible damage doesn't have to be present for    the helmet to
have been compromised...or so I've read.

I hear Arai will inspect a helmet for something like $10 after a fall,
plus
postage. Don't know if this has to be a "crash fall" or if a "dropped
it"
fall counts. I'd at least contact the manufacturer and see if you have
cause for concern. Unless you dropped it onto a sandpaper-covered
feather
mattress or something.

No idea about the reinstall on the Fog City...the green plastic strip
sun-visor I installed on mine came off and went back on just fine the
next
day though. It was installed like a decal...water and a little soap.
After the first ride with it I realized I needed to trim it a bit more,
so
I pulled it off, cut it down a smidge, and used the same method to
reinstall it. That was back in October, and it's still doing fine. IF
the
Fog City goes on in a similar way, it might work too, but I've never
tried
it or even owned a Fog City.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 16:12:03 2004
Subject: RE: Doing it yourself or the help of others
Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 16:14:42 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Mike Bartman" <omni@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I thought about the drop but the helmet landed on   its faceplate..
Basically I hung the strap off the piece under my   rear seat. The gizmo
that allows me to clip the helmet to the side did   not hold and so the
helmet dropped about a foot onto the ground. The    fog city instructions
say not to peel it off and readjust.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Bartman [mailto:omni@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 4:05 PM
To: Julian Halton; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Doing it yourself or the help of others

At 03:41 PM 4/5/04 -0400, Julian Halton wrote:
>
>After dropping my helmet and scratching an already scratched up shield,

>I decided to go ahead and replace my shield and "upgrade" by buying a
>fog city insert.

Depending on what you dropped your helmet on, and how far it fell, you
might want to consider a new helmet, or at least getting it checked out
by the manufacturer. It doesn't take much of a drop onto something like
concrete to cause compression in the shock absorbing material, and/or
cracks in the shell that will seriously impair its ability to do its job
if you ever need it. You don't have to be in the helmet when it is
dropped for such damage to happen. DOT testing doesn't cover double
impacts to the same location (SNELL's does though...but they have lower
standards for the second impact than for the first I believe).

If you are an "I only wear it to avoid the tickets" sort of person,
fine, but if you wear a helmet because you actually consider your brain
to be one of your favorite organs, you might want to consider getting
the helmet checked out. Visible damage doesn't have to be present for
the helmet to have been compromised...or so I've read.

I hear Arai will inspect a helmet for something like $10 after a fall,
plus postage. Don't know if this has to be a "crash fall" or if a
"dropped it"
fall counts. I'd at least contact the manufacturer and see if you have
cause for concern. Unless you dropped it onto a sandpaper-covered
feather mattress or something.

No idea about the reinstall on the Fog City...the green plastic strip
sun-visor I installed on mine came off and went back on just fine the
next day though. It was installed like a decal...water and a little
soap.
After the first ride with it I realized I needed to trim it a bit more,
so I pulled it off, cut it down a smidge, and used the same method to
reinstall it. That was back in October, and it's still doing fine. IF
the Fog City goes on in a similar way, it might work too, but I've never
tried it or even owned a Fog City.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes is better.



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr   5 16:53:52 2004
Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2004 16:54:09 -0400
To: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Doing it yourself or the help of others

Sounds like it's unlikely it got damaged then.

If Fog City says not to, I wouldn't...at least not without expecting to
have to buy a new one if they are right. Next time, whoever installs it
should wear white gloves... ;-)

-- Mike B.

At 04:14 PM 4/5/04 -0400, Julian Halton wrote:
>I thought about the drop but the helmet landed on its faceplate..
>Basically I hung the strap off the piece under my rear seat. The gizmo
>that allows me to clip the helmet to the side did not hold and so the
>helmet dropped about a foot onto the ground. The fog city instructions
>say not to peel it off and readjust.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Mike Bartman [mailto:omni@XXXXXX]
>At 03:41 PM 4/5/04 -0400, Julian Halton wrote:
>>
>>After dropping my helmet and scratching an already scratched up shield,
>
>Depending on what you dropped your helmet on, and how far it fell, you
>might want to consider a new helmet, or at least getting it checked out
>by the manufacturer. It doesn't take much of a drop onto something like

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 5 23:59:31 2004
From: "Justin Lemrow" <firblt@XXXXXX>
To: "'Rob Keiser'" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Could use some truck/trailer help...
Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2004 23:59:17 -0400
X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with
any abuse report
X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - host48n.ipowerweb.com
X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - dc-cycles.org
X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [0 0]
X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - lemrow.com

Hey Rob - glad HRCA cam in for you. It would have completely slipped my
mind
too.

I admire your attitude and sentiments towards the community. Well said.
Kudos.

Cheers,
Justin

-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Keiser [mailto:robkeiser@XXXXXX]
Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 12:47 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Could use some truck/trailer help...

Just wanted to say a big Thanks to all the offers for help. The bike is
resting comfortably in the garage until the insurance company decides
what
they'd like to do next. I'm in no rush.

My membership to HRCA had initially slipped my mind, and after calling
them,

they stepped up and got me in touch with Kenny at Independent MC
Transport.

Long story short....(since I'm kinda tired)....riding Westbound on Rt. 80
from 75 in some traffic. Came over the crest of a small hill and ran
into a

thick line of mud/rocks that was lying in the middle of the lane from a
truck coming out of a construction site. When trying to get on the dry
part

of the lane, the bike slid out from under me.   Low side left.

SUV behind moved over to miss me and tagged the bike (from what he said)
doing minimal damage to it. Bike is (needless to say) a little rough,
but
fixable.

No major damage here. Right hand a little tingly and left knee swollen.
The gear really saved me a lot of pain. No question. But I'm sure I'll
be
sore tomorrow.

The people in that area couldn't have been nicer and probably had 911
dialed

before I stopped sliding.

Can go into more detail if people are interested, but right now, I'm
tired.

Time for bed.

Thanks again, everyone. As much as this list can really annoy the crap
out
of me sometimes, it is a community that looks after their own. I
appreciate that very much.

'night.

Rob
'98 VFR800
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 6 06:04:33 2004
Subject: Re: Doing it yourself or the help of others
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 06 Apr 2004 06:01:08 -0400

On Mon, 2004-04-05 at 15:41, Julian Halton wrote:
>
>
>
> After dropping my helmet and scratching an already scratched up shield,
> I decided to go ahead and replace my shield and "upgrade" by buying a
> fog city insert. I allowed the sales clerk to help me with installing
> it and while he did a great job aligning it much better than I did. His
> fingerprints are plastered between the shield and the insert. I suppose
> it would be stupid to pry the insert off right now and wipe down the
> inside of the shield.
>
>

I removed mine last night and the edges were still sticky enough to keep
them together while it sat next to my chair. Given that though, unless
the fingerprints are really annoying, I probably wouldn't do it.

On the fog city inner shield. Since you had the salesman do it, I'll
assume you haven't had one before. I think it was Tom who said it, but
basically you need to be careful cleaning it. It's a much softer plastic
than the shield and scratches will show up. At the beginning I was using
tissue to clean it. I changed to my bandana after a couple of weeks but
even being careful it was so scratched up that I felt the difference
between the scratches obscuring my view and a little fog were enough to
remove it.

The double vision at night was the most fun though ;-)

Have fun.

Carl


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 6 06:09:31 2004
Subject: Re: Doing it yourself or the help of others
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 06 Apr 2004 06:06:09 -0400

On Mon, 2004-04-05 at 15:54, Leon Begeman wrote:
> It would be even worse to try to do it after the tape
> gets dried out.

I think it'd take a long time for it to dry. It looks like the same
stuff I used to use to stick vugraph frames together when I was a
graphic artist. Basically a layer of stick-um.

>
> Leon.

Carl


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 6 10:15:41 2004
From: "Copeland, James" <jcopeland@XXXXXX>
To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: 2000 VFR for sale
Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 10:12:58 -0400

FOR SALE:

2000 VFR

One owner
Yellow color
Givi Windscreen
Heli Bars
New Bridgestone B-020 Front and Rear tires
One year remains on extended warranty
Excellent mechanical condition- I have all service records
Cosmetic condition rated 8/10- normal wear
13K miles
Located in Northern Virginia
Asking $5,850

Please contact: 703-980-2700 or e-mail [james.copeland@XXXXXX] for more
info.




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 6 18:06:34 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Doing it yourself or the help of others
Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2004 18:05:12 -0400

> The double vision at night was the most fun though ;-)
And chemical-free, too!

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 7 10:34:03 2004
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 10:33:54 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: 90 minutes for a piece of tin (DMV)

Talk about a disincentive to buy a new bike.....

Out of the house at 6. Ride to inspection station. No line; get waved
to an inspection bay. Two wheels, yup it's a bike, lights work, horn
works. It takes longer for the the machine to spit out the sticker than
the entire inspection. Must go inside to get the appropriate rubber
stamps.

Eat, do the morning ablutions.

Out the door at 7:55. Ride to C St. NW DMV office. There are *always*
cages parked in the MC-only spots in front of the DMV. I squeeze in next
to the scofflaws. Wait in line for the metal detector. Wait in line
outside the office. It's supposed to open at 8:15. 8:20 comes; line
still not moving. Line begins moving. Wait in line at the information
desk. Get a number. Number gets called in about 7 minutes.

Lady says she can't/won't do motorcycles. Why? Dunno, prolly 'cuz it's
extra work or something. She disappears, then emerges from the cube-
scape behind the counter to annouce she's pawning me off on another
clerk. OK, things are finally happening.

Much scribbling of various notations on my application form. Much
surfing of the NADA website to come up with book value for the bike.
Yes, KLR, not KLX. What, there's no KLR? Hmmm. KL650A10? OK, close
enough. That's right, it's the same NADA site you and I can access on
the web. That goes pretty smoothly until the clerk says she doesn't have
any "April" month stickers. She ambles away, not to re-appear for 10
minutes. tick, tock, tick, tock....    Waiting for the ink to dry or
something? I'm starting to think it would be better just to transfer the
VF's mangled old plate to the KLR. She comes back with the stickers APR
and 05. $170.80 changes hands, the KLR is now legally registered.

Then I try to turn in the old plate from the VF. No can do, since I'm
due a refund apparently. They need my original receipt. WTF? What if I
don't care about the refund; just take it and give me a receipt. Nope.
Go to window #12, she says. But you'll still need the original receipt
from the registration renewal. Receipt (if it hasn't been tossed) is at
home. No plate turn-in today....or ever, maybe. I just don't want any
nastiness to ensue if they do a random check and the plate comes up as
belonging to an uninsured bike that's no longer mine.

I hit the street at 9:35.   Ninety minutes for one piece of tin.
Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR (with new DC plate)

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 7 18:19:42 2004
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 17:19:55 -0500
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, mjordan812@XXXXXX,
   thomasajordan@XXXXXX
From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
Subject: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...


<http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/video.pl?url=/media/2004/04/06/video6
10577.wmv&sid=202>http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/...577.wmv&sid=202


Damn!

- Sean Jordan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 7 18:33:59 2004
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 15:33:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: dcpatti <dcpatti@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: 90 minutes for a piece of tin (DMV)
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

>    No plate turn-in today....or
>   ever, maybe. I just don't want any nastiness to
>   ensue if they do a random check and the plate comes
>   up as belonging to an uninsured bike that's no
>   longer mine.

You can turn them in at the 3rd District Police
Station. Probably all police stations. The cop that
you give them to will give you a little form that
shows what day you turned them in and who accepted
them. No fuss, no muss.

Cheers,

Patti

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 7 19:42:08 2004
From: "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: "dcpatti" <dcpatti@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: 90 minutes for a piece of tin (DMV)
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 19:42:09 -0400

----- Original Message -----
From: "dcpatti" <dcpatti@XXXXXX>


>   >    No plate turn-in today....or
>   >   ever, maybe. I just don't want any nastiness to
>   >   ensue if they do a random check and the plate comes
>   >   up as belonging to an uninsured bike that's no
>   >   longer mine.
>
>   You can turn them in at the 3rd District Police
>   Station. Probably all police stations.

I know this was true, once upon a time, but apparently no more. You must
return them directly to DMV. Non-DMV drop boxes have been discontinued.

http://dmv.dc.gov/about/020104.shtm

Friday, January 30, 2004

DC DMV Increases Consumer Protections

With a focus on consumer protection, DC DMV will discontinue the use of
all
neighborhood drop boxes and will place shredding machines at all driver
license transaction windows.

The drop boxes, located in all seven Metropolitan Police District
Headquarters', the Reeves Center, 65 K Street, and 301 C Street, will be
sealed until they can be removed from each site. Discontinuing the
program
prevents incidents of customers saying they've surrendered tags and DMV
having no record of receiving tags. "Because we are unable to offer a
receipt immediately for a drop box transaction, it is in the best
interest
of the customer if we remove the boxes," said DMV Director Anne Witt.

Additionally, table size shredding machines will be placed at service
windows so that all surrendered driver's licenses are shredded in the
presence of each customer. "The increase in identity theft has people
changing their license numbers from the once required social security
number
to a computer generated number; it is our duty to protect that
information,"
added Witt.

DMV is currently reviewing the possibility of relocating some of the drop
boxes inside service centers where receipts can be issued immediately.


Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 7 19:58:27 2004
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 16:58:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Todd Withrow <mtwithrow@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: 90 minutes for a piece of tin (DMV)
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX


--- Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Talk about a disincentive to buy a new bike.....


> Paul in DC
> 95 VFR - 96 KLR650
>


Talk about a disincentive to live in DC.

=====
AIM: Inf DS

http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow

-----------------------------------------------------------
Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to
childproof the world.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 7 21:01:16 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX,
   mjordan812@XXXXXX, thomasajordan@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 21:01:48 -0400

And in DC the police are not allowed to chase fleeing criminals. I bet
if
they all got owned like that spanish guy did crime would probably go down
:)

rob


On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 17:19:55 -0500, Sean Jordan wrote
>
<http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/video.pl?url=/media/2004/04/06/video6
10577.wmv&sid=202>http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/...577.wmv&sid=202
>
> Damn!
>
> - Sean Jordan


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 08:46:29 2004
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 08:46:23 -0400
From: "Chris Norloff" <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...

Wow.

Probably not a good idea to take hostages and make threats in a country
that's just had terrorist attacks.

Chris

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 17:19:55 -0500

>
><http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/video.pl?url=/media/2004/04/06/video
610577.wmv&sid=202>http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/...577.wmv&sid=202
>
>
>Damn!
>
>- Sean Jordan
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 11:22:40 2004
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 11:22:19 -0400
From: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
To: cnorloff@XXXXXX
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...

Chris Norloff wrote:

> Wow.
>
> Probably not a good idea to take hostages and make threats in a country
that's just had terrorist attacks.
>
> Chris

Part of me wants to cheer the police for this, but
the motorcyclist in me just cringes... :-/

--
Mandatory Second Line (Chatty Moron Trademark)

Dale Horstman - horkster@XXXXXX '98 Concours - BugSlayer
Dale City, Virginia, USA, Earth      '99 Concours - Grape Nehi
CM #001 NRA IBA COG                  '82 GS850G - Neat old bike

The Mason Dixon 20-20 Endurance Rally: The Games People Play
Come join us in 2004:   http://www.masondixon20-20.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 11:29:31 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 11:29:19 -0400


>
> From: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/08 Thu AM 11:22:19 EDT
> To: cnorloff@XXXXXX
> CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
>
> Chris Norloff wrote:
>
> > Wow.
> >
> > Probably not a good idea to take hostages and make threats in a
country that's just had terrorist attacks.
> >
> > Chris
>
> Part of me wants to cheer the police for this, but
> the motorcyclist in me just cringes... :-/
>
> --

...what surprised me was that in the video, the guy did that double flip
and then started to stand up like he was ready to run. Me, I would of
just laid there groaning. 8-P

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 11:36:52 2004
From: "Perry Coleman" <perrycoleman@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 11:25:08 -0400

This is clearly a case where he would have been better served with a
large
SUV - like a Hummer. Or, maybe a Bradley... ;^)

Perry


>From: "Chris Norloff" <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
>Reply-To: <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
>To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: RE: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
>Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 08:46:23 -0400
>
>Wow.
>
>Probably not a good idea to take hostages and make threats in a country
>that's just had terrorist attacks.
>
>Chris
>
>---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
>From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
>Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 17:19:55 -0500
>
> >
>
><http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/video.pl?url=/media/2004/04/06/video
610577.wmv&sid=202>http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/...577.wmv&sid=202
> >
> >
> >Damn!
> >
> >- Sean Jordan
> >
> >
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar )B– FREE!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 11:56:48 2004
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 11:56:36 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Probably figured he could outrun them better on a bike. But, if I were
the cops, I would have only put about half a gallon of gas in the tank
and then let him go. ;-)
Scooter

In a message dated 4/8/2004 11:25:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
perrycoleman@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> This is clearly a case where he would have been better served with a
large
> SUV - like a Hummer. Or, maybe a Bradley... ;^)
>
> Perry
>
>
> >From: "Chris Norloff" <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
> >Reply-To: <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
> >To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> >Subject: RE: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
> >Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 08:46:23 -0400
> >
> >Wow.
> >
> >Probably not a good idea to take hostages and make threats in a
country
> >that's just had terrorist attacks.
> >
> >Chris
> >
> >---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
> >From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
> >Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 17:19:55 -0500
> >
> > >
> >
><http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/video.pl?url=/media/2004/04/06/video
610577.wmv&sid=202>http://video.cgi.cbsnews.com/video/...577.wmv&sid=202
> > >
> > >
> > >Damn!
> > >
> > >- Sean Jordan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 12:31:52 2004
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 12:31:49 -0400
From: "Chris Norloff" <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...

I wouldn't be surprised if the police thought he'd stop. It's not like
the police car raced out and hit him. The police car drove in front of
him and he hit it.

We deal with car drivers like that all the time here!
Chris

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 11:22:19 -0400

>Chris Norloff wrote:
>
>> Wow.
>>
>> Probably not a good idea to take hostages and make threats in a
country that's just had terrorist attacks.
>>
>> Chris
>
>Part of me wants to cheer the police for this, but
>the motorcyclist in me just cringes... :-/
>
>--
>Mandatory Second Line (Chatty Moron Trademark)
>
>Dale Horstman - horkster@XXXXXX '98 Concours - BugSlayer
>Dale City, Virginia, USA, Earth      '99 Concours - Grape Nehi
>CM #001 NRA IBA COG                  '82 GS850G - Neat old bike
>
>The Mason Dixon 20-20 Endurance Rally: The Games People Play
>Come join us in 2004:   http://www.masondixon20-20.org
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 12:38:17 2004
From: "Jim McGonigle" <jmcgonigle@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 12:37:56 -0400


What video were you watching? He was in passing the cross walk before
the
car moved. I doubt that anyone on this list would of missed that car
unless
they *really* expected that to happen.

I like it.   Talk about a deterrent from being a dumbass....

-Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Norloff [mailto:cnorloff@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2004 12:32 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: How Spanish police catch motorcycle riding criminals...
I wouldn't be surprised if the police thought he'd stop. It's not like
the
police car raced out and hit him. The police car drove in front of him
and
he hit it.

We deal with car drivers like that all the time here!

Chris

---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 11:22:19 -0400

>Chris Norloff wrote:
>
>> Wow.
>>
>> Probably not a good idea to take hostages and make threats in a
country
that's just had terrorist attacks.
>>
>> Chris
>
>Part of me wants to cheer the police for this, but the motorcyclist in
>me just cringes... :-/
>
>--
>Mandatory Second Line (Chatty Moron Trademark)
>
>Dale Horstman - horkster@XXXXXX '98 Concours - BugSlayer
>Dale City, Virginia, USA, Earth      '99 Concours - Grape Nehi
>CM #001 NRA IBA COG                  '82 GS850G - Neat old bike
>
>The Mason Dixon 20-20 Endurance Rally: The Games People Play
>Come join us in 2004:   http://www.masondixon20-20.org
>


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr   8 16:14:31 2004
Subject: MSF Courses
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 16:17:08 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

  Two Questions:
When is the experienced rider course this year?

Is there any way to slot two mature adults into the BRC at Nova
Alexandria?



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr   8 16:31:55 2004
From: Sunil Doshi <sdoshi@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: MSF Courses
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 16:31:46 -0400
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I just signed up for the May 7 class. The whole listing is here:

http://www.nv.cc.va.us/alexandria/moto/AdvancedMotorCourses.htm

Unfortunately, it's almost impossible to understand the new online
registration system for NVCC. After a solid 45 minutes, I got signed
up. And I think I had it easier because I took the regular MSF class
last year (meaning I was in the system already).

If anyone needs some assistance with the system, I can try to help...

On Apr 8, 2004, at 4:17 PM, Julian Halton wrote:

>   Two Questions:
> When is the experienced rider course this year?
>
> Is there any way to slot two mature adults into the BRC at Nova
> Alexandria?
>
>
>
>

sunil

:: proteus / changing your shape for the future
      sunil doshi, senior interface designer
       tel [202.452.6800 x101] [202.452.6866] fax
        http://proteus.com


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 16:34:12 2004
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 16:34:08 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: MSF Courses

It's all on-line now.

Check out
http://nvcc.edu/loudoun/continuing/asp/view.asp?key=Motorcycle+Rider+Trai
ning

(Loudoun in the venue for the ERC; classes are scheduled every two to
three weeks throughout the summer)

http://www.nv.cc.va.us/alexandria/moto/index.htm
BRC at Alex.

Paul in DC

-----Original Message-----
From: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>


  Two Questions:
When is the experienced rider course this year?

Is there any way to slot two mature adults into the BRC at Nova
Alexandria?




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 16:42:18 2004
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 16:41:52 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: MSF Courses

That's what I get for shooting off my mouth without looking at *all* the
materials. ERC - Skills Plus is being offered at Alexandria this year,
but only on Fridays, it would appear. The ERC is offered at Loudoun on
Sundays.


-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Sent: Apr 8, 2004 4:34 PM
To: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: MSF Courses

It's all on-line now.

Check out
http://nvcc.edu/loudoun/continuing/asp/view.asp?key=Motorcycle+Rider+Trai
ning

(Loudoun in the venue for the ERC; classes are scheduled every two to
three weeks throughout the summer)

http://www.nv.cc.va.us/alexandria/moto/index.htm

BRC at Alex.
Paul in DC

-----Original Message-----
From: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>


  Two Questions:
When is the experienced rider course this year?

Is there any way to slot two mature adults into the BRC at Nova
Alexandria?




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 20:14:41 2004
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 20:01:20 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Bruce Brownlee <brownlee_b@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: MSF Courses

I'm teaching ERC Apr 18 at Loudoun. Dont know that I have ever
had a full class, but now that they have registration online, you
should be able to tell.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 21:17:13 2004
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 21:17:01 -0400
From: Dougoates@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: FS: moto duds, great condition, great price
X-AOL-IP: 69.138.253.216

Please accept my apology in advance for posting some motorcycle apparel
for sale on the list. I hope this is not too much of a faux pas seeing
that some folks may benefit from the cheap prices :-). My sport riding
days are over so I am selling a literally new Dainese race suit, and a
BMW cordura touring set. Here are the feckless links to the ebay
listings. Thanks.

Dainese T Age
-------------
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6750&it
em=2471904824

BMW Commuter
------------
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6750&it
em=2471973775

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 23:42:59 2004
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 22:43:17 -0500
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, thomasajordan@XXXXXX, mike@XXXXXX
From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
Subject: I need $70,000

The oval-pistoned wonder. . . man, do I want one.

- Sean Jordan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 23:47:21 2004
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 22:47:40 -0500
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, thomasajordan@XXXXXX, mike@XXXXXX
From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
Subject: I need $70,000 - cliff hanger resolved.

D'oh - forgot to post the link.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=247290
4157&category=6708

- Sean Jordan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 8 23:49:02 2004
Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2004 23:48:54 -0400
From: Skip Smith <Skip@XXXXXX>
To: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, thomasajordan@XXXXXX, mike@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: I need $70,000

???

tell the story, f00!

Sean Jordan wrote:
>
> The oval-pistoned wonder. . . man, do I want one.
>
> - Sean Jordan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 9 08:55:31 2004
From: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>
To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Cc: "'julian@XXXXXX'" <julian@XXXXXX>,
   "'DCBobMcKeithen'"
       <bmckeithen@XXXXXX>
Subject: MSF Courses
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 09:01:21 -0400

Julian Halton queried "When is the experienced rider course this year?"
The Virginia answers are good . . . but . . . You should bug Bob
McKeithen
for when the next ERC is in West (By God) Virginia. They have a really
nice
facility just west of Martinsburg. Plus, after you've scrubbed in your
tires, you can go on a nice ride or just whoop around on the truck
course.

 )B¿Bob?

Wilson Posted:
It's all on-line now.
Check out
http://nvcc.edu/loudoun/continuing/asp/view.asp?key=Motorcycle+Rider+Trai
nin
g
(Loudoun in the venue for the ERC; classes are scheduled every two to
three
weeks throughout the summer)
http://www.nv.cc.va.us/alexandria/moto/index.htm
BRC at Alex.
Paul in DC

Carl (Who didn't ride in today?) in Bethesda

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 9 13:34:07 2004
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2004 13:32:38 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: Todd Withrow <mtwithrow@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: 90 minutes for a piece of tin (DMV)



Todd Withrow wrote:
>
> --- Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX> wrote:
> > Talk about a disincentive to buy a new bike.....
>
> > Paul in DC
> > 95 VFR - 96 KLR650
> >
>
> Talk about a disincentive to live in DC.


as if i needed another...   :~)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   9 15:07:57 2004
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2004 15:07:48 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: MD Helmet Law News
Looks like Maryland is moving towards dropping the helmet law for those
over 21.

http://www.wtopnews.com/index.php?sid=188136&nid=25

I couldn't have said this better :

"We're not against helmets," said Gary "Pappy" Boward, ABATE Maryland
director. "We believe it should be the adult right to choose."

Beautiful riding today.   Little slippery this morning, but perfect at
lunch.


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   9 15:15:28 2004
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2004 15:15:18 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Helmet - Free to a good home
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Or donation to the MSF.   Who did I give one to a year or so ago to take
to the MSF?

Anyway, I bought a Roof Boxer helmet online about 2.5 years ago and it
doesn't quite fit. I used my Shoei RF700 size (Small) to buy it and it
is too large.   It fits like a Medium or Large Shoei. Anyway, I've worn
it 2 or 3 times and it is now taking up space in my closet. It's pretty
cool. It looks like a Russian fighter pilot helmet with flip up chinbar
and I have the dark tinted visor.   And I do mean DARK. First come,
first serve. I'm in DC. You can pick up or I'll be happy to deliver if
the weather is nice. ;-)

Since this list doesn't like attachments, I can't send a pic so, if
anyone wants to see it, shoot me an e-mail. :-)

Scooter

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   9 15:50:48 2004
Subject: RE: MD Helmet Law News
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 15:50:17 -0400
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "Troutman" <mike@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I thought that Maryland used to be a helmet-free state, at least when I
rode through there in the late eighties it sure seemed that way.

Last line of news story; "The measure now heads to the House of
Delegates, where lawmakers say it has little chance of passing before the
session ends Monday."

Robert


-----Original Message-----
From: Troutman [mailto:mike@XXXXXX]
Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 3:08 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: MD Helmet Law News


Looks like Maryland is moving towards dropping the helmet law for those
over 21.

http://www.wtopnews.com/index.php?sid=188136&nid=25

I couldn't have said this better :

"We're not against helmets," said Gary "Pappy" Boward, ABATE Maryland
director. "We believe it should be the adult right to choose."

Beautiful riding today.   Little slippery this morning, but perfect at
lunch.


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 9 16:15:14 2004
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 2004 16:15:02 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Helmet is gone - so far. :-)
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Skip was the first response. If it fits his noggin, its his. Next came
Paul W. then Robert V. Just waiting to hear back from Skip how he wants
to collect it.

Scooter

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 9 17:13:32 2004
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 14:13:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Interesting Key News
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I stopped by the Suzuki dealer and picked up three key blanks so that I
can try to make my own for the GSXR. Tim (the guy I got the bike from)
lost the keys last time and had a locksmith come out and cut him a new
one
based on the gas tank. It didn't fit the ignition so Tim pulled it out
and
filed down a couple of the pins until the key worked.

Since he only had one side cut, it wouldn't quite work if it wasn't
facing
forward when you used it. Same with the gas tank.

Anyway, I was just in the garage getting ready   to make my first run with
my hobby files and my dremel. I tried the tank   and it didn't work but it
was stiff even with the regular key. I figured   that since Tim had made
the
ignition fit the tank, I'd use the ignition to   work on the key. I put it
in and lo and behold, the blank turned off the   bike. It even locked the
wheel.

I still can't get the gas tank opened, but I figure I'd ask the list if
anyone had an idea for a replacement cap. Even a pop up one like Leon has
would work as far as I'm concerned. Aren't all the caps the same size?
Could I get any cap to work or would I have to replace it?

I'll just have to make use of the disc lock more often :-)

Carl

=====
02 Harley FXSTI
95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
76 Honda Chopper (in progress)

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr   9 21:29:00 2004
From: "Thomas Jordan" <thomasajordan@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Interesting Key News
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2004 21:28:57 -0400

These are quite nice. Not much for security though (and a little pricey)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=247247
861
6&category=35586

Then there is always option B (which I have used with great success on a
93
GSXR750.) Drill out the lock cylinder in the gas cap... I think it's
about
1/2" or so.. When you get all the cylinder-bits out, you'll have a couple
metal tabs that you can twist apart with a flat blade screwdriver to open
the cap as often as you'd like. It still latches shut and works
'properly'

-Thomas Jordan
Shade tree mechanic extraordinaire

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 10 20:47:25 2004
From: "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: "DC-CYCLES" <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>
Subject: VFR wrenching & carb synch question
Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2004 20:47:35 -0400

Well, the 60K service is done on the VFR. Actually 48K sorta didn't
happen--mea culpa--nor did 32K. Neither one "fell" at a good time,
usually
in the midst of a long summer trip, so I let it slide. I looked back
through my records and the valves were checked at 20K and 40K. I guess
I've
officially extended the service interval on the valves to 20K miles. :->


All valves in spec. Did the carb synch too. I guess, under my system,
that
means I'm good to go until at least 80K. It's amazing how smooth the V-4
is
when the carbs are synched. BTW, I've always wondered, what makes the
carbs
go out of synch in the first place? If the timing is correct and the
valves
are in spec, what makes the carbs go all wonky? Number three cylinder
was
pulling significantly less vacuum than the other three and #2 was a
little
low. #1 and #4 seem to march in lockstep. The carbs on this bike appear
to
drift quite a bit. The service records indicate I synched the carbs just
last fall.
And, just like every time I work on the bike, I curse the Honda engineer
who
designed the bodywork; musta been the same guy who designed the charging
system connectors. :-/    No matter how proficient I get at removing and
installing it, it's always seems like an unnecessarily complicated PITA.
All those pieces, and those dumbass plastic fasteners. And I've managed
to
lose one of the tank mount rubbers, again, one of the times I've had the
tank off. The perils of working on your front stoop I guess. Sometimes
things fall off and you don't notice, especially non-metallic parts that
don't go "tink" when they hit.

Next up, new tires (Pirelli Diablos) and an oil change before too long.
Still
haven't fixed the rear fairings after that tipover in January. The
lights
work, it's holding together and I really don't care too much what it
looks
like anymore.

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 07:35:12 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: "'Paul Wilson'" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   "'DC-CYCLES'" <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: VFR wrenching & carb synch question
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 07:34:52 -0400

>   All those pieces, and those dumbass plastic fasteners. And
>   I've managed to lose one of the tank mount rubbers, again,
>   one of the times I've had the tank off. The perils of
>   working on your front stoop I guess. Sometimes things fall
>   off and you don't notice, especially non-metallic parts that
>   don't go "tink" when they hit.

Back when I used to do my work in a parking lot, I'd (occasionally) put a
cheap tarp down and roll the bike over it.

Collecting dropped parts consisted of lifting the edges and collecting
the
dropped bits near the centerstand.

Michael J.

P.S. - FWIW - now that I have a garage to do my work in, there are even
more
nooks and crannies for a dropped part to hide in :-(

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 11:35:28 2004
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 11:36:39 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Local Charity Ride, updated info
Cc: jgmedina@XXXXXX


Don't know how many of you have the Biker's Atlas, but there's a local
event listed in there that has changed its date and location. If any of
you were planning to do the Cruz'n for Cancer ride in April, the date has
changed to May, and the location has shifted from the hospital to
Battley's. Here's the latest update:


Event:   Cruz'n for Cancer

Why: To benefit Shady Grove Adventist Hospital Cancer Program

Date: Sunday, May 23, 2004

Time: Check in 8 am to 10 am

Location: Rockville Harley-Davidson/Battley Cycles
   Airpark Road, Gaithersburg, MD

[that's Shady grove Road, basically...I-270 to the Shady Grove   Road
(East)
exit, stay on that road until you get to Battley's, which will   be on your
left a block before you get to the airport. You can also take    I-270 to
I-370 East, to the Shady Grove East exit. Saves a few traffic    lights.]

The Ride:
Scenic route through area countryside. Includes continental breakfast
sponsored by Ortho Biotech, Krispy Kreme and Starbucks and a super picnic
lunch at Seneca Creek State Park, Gaithersburg, MD. Custom tee shirt and
live music are included too.

Cost: $30 per person up to May 17th; $36 per person after May 17th and
on
site. Additional donations more than welcome.

Registration on-line at www.mbrt.net/cruzn/ or in person at Rockville H-
D.
See Bernie Keller for details.

www.mbrt.net/cruzn/ is the Cruz'n for Cancer web site.

Inquiries and/or comments from bikers can be sent to:

    Janet Medina
    (301) 405-6539 or jgmedina@XXXXXX



-- Mike B.
'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 11:54:10 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: 8k mile service
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 11:54:00 -0400
Seal-Send-Time: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 11:54:00 -0400
X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original

Well, I'm coming up on 8k for my 2002 YZF600R. I'm going to have to go
to a stealership for the service because I don't have the tools, room to
work, or know how to do the job myself. (I envy you guys that do)
Anyway, I have a couple questions. What price should I expect to pay
for the service? Also, I know I need a rear tire. How much should I
expect to pay for an OEM brand mounted and everything? I was going to
call the stealership for a quote, but I only know of two shops in the
area (both Coleman) and I figure they have the monopoly anyway. Does
anyone know of any other reliable shops that can do the work? Thanks in
advance folks.


John

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 13:05:43 2004
From: "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: 8k mile service
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 13:05:57 -0400

What all is involved on the 8k service on this bike? It has a lot do
with
the price. If it's just a series of checks, minor adjustments and fluid
replacements, that you can do yourself with a shop manual and minimal
tools.
If you ask nicely, perhaps some lister might step forward to help you.
If
it's more involved, like a valve clearance check, you may want to leave
that
to the "pros."

On the other hand, the horror stories about local shops convinced me to
crack open the shop manuals and do everything myself. I've had some
experience wrenching cages, and that certainly helped, but was by no
means
necessary. I do all my work in the great outdoors, btw, and manage to
keep
two bikes on the road.
Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>


> Well, I'm coming up on 8k for my 2002 YZF600R. I'm going to have to go
> to a stealership for the service because I don't have the tools, room
to
> work, or know how to do the job myself. (I envy you guys that do)
> Anyway, I have a couple questions. What price should I expect to pay
> for the service? Also, I know I need a rear tire. How much should I
> expect to pay for an OEM brand mounted and everything? I was going to
> call the stealership for a quote, but I only know of two shops in the
> area (both Coleman) and I figure they have the monopoly anyway. Does
> anyone know of any other reliable shops that can do the work? Thanks
in
> advance folks.
>
>
> John
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 14:01:14 2004
From: "W.S." <mobacc@XXXXXX>
To: "DC-Cycles" <DC-Cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: April Prep Trivia
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 14:00:51 -0400

B o r r r r i n g.   But perhaps useful to a newbie or two.


. Missed this little maintenance last year and it came back to bite me a
few
days ago -- Locktite-ing the little screws on my driving glasses. Was
fortunately in a store as a lens dropped last week but there have been
awful
past times.
. Replaced the clear shelf paper on the gas tank protecting the finish
from
dangling keys and the magbag. (This idea belongs to Bill Huson - anybody
heard from him lately?)
. Polished and put away my 6- (can't believe 6) year-old National Cycle
Plexifairing III windshield. It remains nightcomfortable-clear and
continues to exceed all duty requirements.
. Decrudded the boot-close right exhaust pipe with Goo-gone, razor blade,
plastic scrubber and metal polish. Have done this several times with no
apparent pipe-nick but the process is scary. *Very* low-angling the
blade
doesn't quite stop the chrome gouging feeling though it's just the crud.
. Resolved once again to be darn careful refueling -- even prechecking
the
handle operation. Once more had a defective? nozzle handle stick open
resulting in gas-all-over and time wasted in lambasting attendant over
fire
hazard (now averaging about once/year).


We're owed a double Spring this year -- remember last?


Bill S. / DC
'99 VN750 > Spa'ed for the year.
Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun.



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 15:01:55 2004
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 15:01:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: 8k mile service

Have no idea what it costs, I do my own work, but it shouldn't be too
much, if I remember correctly its just checks of the major stuff and a
carb sync, plus filter & oil. As the bike is two years old, you may want
to have the brake fluid changed also. As far as tires go, good luck on
finding a BT56 in stock anywhere. Coleman's has a pretty bad rep around
here, never used them before, but their sales people are pretty sleazy
and
they charge more than MSRP on accessories so I don't shop there. I like
Champion in Herndon, they seem like good folks to work with.

Dan

On Sun, 11 Apr 2004, John White wrote:

> Well, I'm coming up on 8k for my 2002 YZF600R. I'm going to have to go
> to a stealership for the service because I don't have the tools, room
to
> work, or know how to do the job myself. (I envy you guys that do)
> Anyway, I have a couple questions. What price should I expect to pay
> for the service? Also, I know I need a rear tire. How much should I
> expect to pay for an OEM brand mounted and everything? I was going to
> call the stealership for a quote, but I only know of two shops in the
> area (both Coleman) and I figure they have the monopoly anyway. Does
> anyone know of any other reliable shops that can do the work? Thanks
in
> advance folks.
>
>
> John
>

--

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 19:26:19 2004
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 16:25:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Kozyn <mr_vfr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: VFR wrenching
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

From: "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>

Well, the 60K service is done on the VFR. Actually 48K sorta didn't
happen--mea culpa--nor did 32K. Neither one "fell" at a good time,
usually
in the midst of a long summer trip, so I let it slide. I looked back
through my records and the valves were checked at 20K and 40K. I guess

I've
officially extended the service interval on the valves to 20K miles.
:->

[JK] Hey Paul, why stop there? I did mine at 30K and then again at 55K.
It's a V4 Honda :) No worries...

All valves in spec.

[JK] Nice, most of mine were but I had one that was borderline, decided
I could live w/ it until next time.

BTW, I've always wondered, what makes the
carbs go out of synch in the first place?

[JK] I wonder if it isn't simple vibration? Those little springs don't
seem all that strong... I put a jet-kit in mine over the winter.
Acceleration is surprisingly stronger.

...its always seems like an unnecessarily complicated PITA.
All those pieces, and those dumbass plastic fasteners. And I've
managed to lose one of the tank mount rubbers, again, one of the times
I've had the tank off.

[JK] lol - I've lost at least 3 front tank rubbers and 4 frame mount
rubbers since 1999. I feel your pain :)

Next up, new tires (Pirelli Diablos) and an oil change before too long.

[JK] I'm still running 020s on the VFR, but on my Duc, the Diablos
rock! Definitely the best tires my SS has ever had. I love 'em... about
1200 miles on them now since February.

Still haven't fixed the rear fairings after that tipover in January.

[JK] I happen to have a nice left rear fairing piece if thats what you
need and you ever feel like fixing it. It's in original red.

Just turned 60K on the VFR last week - finally! A ten mile commute
doesnt really rack up the miles, eh.
I notice Mr Bartman's back, I guess I can expect the Digest volume to
increase significantly now ;) I don't think it topped 25K last week(!)

John Kozyn (D-mode)
1995 VFR750F
1999 900SS


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 11 23:36:05 2004
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 23:35:59 -0400
From: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: into WV

did chuck's "into west virginia" ride on saturday
(http://www.dccycles.com/intowestvirginia.htm) and i just wanted to
say how much of a fun ride that is... mountain twisties, washboard
dirt roads, riverside speedways... every best part of the ride kept
getting bettered. super fun. i want to ride that every weekend. (606
'tween 522 and 17 is obscenely fun)

___________________________________________

corey

[journal] www.egoinc.org
[portfolio] www.blanksky.com

Red meat is not bad for you. Fuzzy green meat is bad for you.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 11:00:25 2004
From: "ALTAAN CHOUDHRY" <altaanc@XXXXXX>
To: <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>
Subject: Mechanic
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 11:00:09 -0400

Does anybody know of a good garage or a mechanic in the Reston/Herndon
area?
My van has sprung a leak and needs to be on a ramp to crawl underneath to
see
whats leaking.

Thanks
Altaan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 11:16:30 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: "ALTAAN CHOUDHRY" <altaanc@XXXXXX>, <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Mechanic
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 11:16:21 -0400

Absolute Auto in Herndon. They were listed as one of
the top mechanics in the DC metro area. I've had work
done by them and they're the only ones I'd recommend.
Very reasonable prices and honest.

Cheers,
-aki

>
> From: "ALTAAN CHOUDHRY" <altaanc@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/12 Mon AM 11:00:09 EDT
> To: <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>
> Subject: Mechanic
>
> Does anybody know of a good garage or a mechanic in the Reston/Herndon
area?
> My van has sprung a leak and needs to be on a ramp to crawl underneath
to
> see
> whats leaking.
>
> Thanks
> Altaan
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 13:19:06 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 13:20:25 -0400
To: "W.S." <mobacc@XXXXXX>, "DC-Cycles" <DC-Cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: April Prep Trivia

At 02:00 PM 4/11/04 -0400, W.S. wrote:

>. Resolved once again to be darn careful refueling -- even prechecking
the
>handle operation.

How do you do that? Just pump a little and quit to see that it works?
What if it doesn't? Some of the newer pumps don't have shutoffs on the
pump itself like the old ones did. Will yelling, "I don't have any
money!"
get the operator to kill it? :-)

>Once more had a defective? nozzle handle stick open
>resulting in gas-all-over and time wasted in lambasting attendant over
fire
>hazard (now averaging about once/year).

You need to start going to a better class of fuel station!   I've been
pumping my own gas since the mid 1970s (I worked at an Exxon station the
summer of '74...back then self-service was unheard of ;-), and I've
*never*
had this happen anywhere. Could it be operator error?

>We're owed a double Spring this year -- remember last?

Apparently that means twice as much rain as last year...

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 13:21:50 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 13:23:06 -0400
To: John Kozyn <mr_vfr@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: VFR wrenching

At 04:25 PM 4/11/04 -0700, John Kozyn wrote:

>I notice Mr Bartman's back, I guess I can expect the Digest volume to
>increase significantly now ;) I don't think it topped 25K last week(!)

I never left...but taking cheap shots isn't likely to get me to post long
messages to you. Saying something that's actually interesting might
though. Give it a try.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 13:30:44 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 10:30:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: VFR wrenching
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Note to self: In order to mitigate Yahoo email storage
concerns, be sure to include one or more cheap shots
at Bartman in any/all future posts to dc-cycles

"Bartman's mom dresses him funny."
Chris Weaver

--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> I never left...but taking cheap shots isn't likely
> to get me to post long
> messages to you. Saying something that's actually
> interesting might
> though. Give it a try.
>
> -- Mike B.


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 13:34:18 2004
Subject: Re: April Prep Trivia
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 12 Apr 2004 13:30:57 -0400

On Mon, 2004-04-12 at 13:20, Mike Bartman wrote:
> At 02:00 PM 4/11/04 -0400, W.S. wrote:
>
> >. Resolved once again to be darn careful refueling -- even prechecking
the
> >handle operation.
>
> How do you do that? Just pump a little and quit to see that it works?
> What if it doesn't? Some of the newer pumps don't have shutoffs on the
> pump itself like the old ones did. Will yelling, "I don't have any
money!"
> get the operator to kill it? :-)

Unless it's one I use regularly, and I always try to hit the same pump
each time, I'll watch the opening. When it looks close, I'll stop it and
check.

>
> >Once more had a defective? nozzle handle stick open
> >resulting in gas-all-over and time wasted in lambasting attendant over
fire
> >hazard (now averaging about once/year).
>
> You need to start going to a better class of fuel station! I've been
> pumping my own gas since the mid 1970s (I worked at an Exxon station
the
> summer of '74...back then self-service was unheard of ;-), and I've
*never*
> had this happen anywhere. Could it be operator error?
>
The Exxon where I've been going the past couple of months had one stick
open on me on the pump to the left of the one I normally go to. The
catch spring had broken and caught the handle. After a brief panic I
pushed it into the tank which triggered the auto-shutoff. The one behind
my normal pump has a hand written sign apologizing and warning that the
auto-shutoff doesn't work.

Maybe last year I was at the Shell and didn't make sure the nozzle was
all the way in before triggering the handle. The gas hit the corner of
the lip inside the tank (it's on the Harley's and on newer cars but it's
not on my Suzuki) and sprayed gas back over me and the back of the bike.
I used a handful of paper towels to wipe everything down and went home
to do a quick wash of the bike, shower and change my clothes. I'm much
more careful now :-)

> -- Mike B.

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 14:25:02 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 14:23:21 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
CC: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Mechanic

Sunset Hills Automotive
703-438-7001

Ask for Willard and tell him Skip sent ya.

I've known and worked with Willard for almost 15 years.   He will sell you
everything you need, and nothing you don't.


--skip

ALTAAN CHOUDHRY wrote:
>
> Does anybody know of a good garage or a mechanic in the Reston/Herndon
area?
> My van has sprung a leak and needs to be on a ramp to crawl underneath
to
> see
> whats leaking.
>
> Thanks
> Altaan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 15:42:06 2004
From: "Copeland, James" <james.copeland@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Best Place for a New Ducati?
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 15:40:11 -0400
I'm looking to purchase a new Ducati S4R Monster and am looking for a few
recommendations. I've already considered Ducati Richmond and Coleman.
Coleman has given me a good price $13,000 out the door, but I'm a bit
leery
of completing a deal with them. Ducati Richmond, would not match
Coleman's
price.

Also in my considerations is the fact that I plan to do some custom
modifications to the bike such as a custom paint scheme and a few other
visual effect changes. Other items of consideration include replacing
the
OEM exhaust and ECU mapping and changing the rear sprocket (up two teeth
to
44). I'm not good with a wrench or paint brush, so I'm going to need a
shop
that can help me out.

Overall, I'd to complete a deal with a shop that: 1) I trust, 2) I can
count
on to get the best deal/value possible and 3) will work with me on
customizing my bike.

Note- I'm not limiting myself to purchasing the bike in VA.

Thanks for the insight,

Jim

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 18:32:48 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 18:34:13 -0400
To: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: April Prep Trivia

At 01:30 PM 4/12/04 -0400, Carl Schelin wrote:
>On Mon, 2004-04-12 at 13:20, Mike Bartman wrote:
>> At 02:00 PM 4/11/04 -0400, W.S. wrote:
>>
>> >. Resolved once again to be darn careful refueling -- even
prechecking the
>> >handle operation.
>>
>> How do you do that? Just pump a little and quit to see that it works?
>> What if it doesn't? Some of the newer pumps don't have shutoffs on
the
>> pump itself like the old ones did. Will yelling, "I don't have any
money!"
>> get the operator to kill it? :-)
>
>Unless it's one I use regularly, and I always try to hit the same pump
>each time, I'll watch the opening. When it looks close, I'll stop it and
>check.
Oh! You mean that you've been expecting the automatic shutoff to work?
I
think we've found the problem...

Pump shutoffs work on back pressure. When the pump starts pumping into a
filler neck that's full of gas, there's more pressure involved than
pumping
into an empty filler neck. The increase in pressure causes the pump to
trip the handle and shut off the gas flow. Like the traffic signal coils
in the roadways, these aren't designed for bikes...but for cars and
trucks.

There are even some cars and trucks they wouldn't work on in the early
days. Some had bends in the filler neck so close to the opening that gas
would back up and shut the nozzle off almost instantly, regardless of how
full the tank was. Some would do this unless you held the nozzle just
right. Some cars had openings so large that they wouldn't hold the
nozzle
well, and would let it fall out and spray gas everywhere...Corvettes for
instance (please don't ask how I know this...).

Bikes don't have filler necks. They usually have a restrictor, that
keeps
you from inserting a regular fuel pump nozzle into a tank intended for
unleaded (not all that important anymore really...but it was vital back
in
the 70s when most stations had both kinds), but this is not always a
sealed
tube (isn't on my Harley), and it isn't very long either (under an inch
on
my bike). Won't have any effect on pump shutoff.

There's a slight delay in the auto shutoff too. At the rate some pumps
run, it can pump a fair bit of gas between the pressure sensor tripping
and
the flow actually stopping. It's not an amount that a car's tank would
notice, but if you are nearing full on a moto tank, it might be enough to
put it over the limit.

If you stick the nozzle far enough into the tank, the tank itself will
eventually do the trick, as the gas level rises above the end of the
nozzle
far enough to let the nozzle generate the backpressure, but at this point
you probably aren't much more than half full. You have to lift the
nozzle
and "blip" the lever to add enough gas to get up to full...you can't
expect
the auto-shutoff to work in that case of course. On my bike, once the
fuel
level gets up to the bottom of the restriction device, it's full, so I
quit
pumping.
I not only wouldn't trust the auto-shutoff on a bike, I certainly
wouldn't
want to let the weight of the nozzle and hose hang on my tank filler lip.
Wear, paint chipping and even broken welds and tank distortion are
possible. I insert it carefully, hold it carefully, pump carefully, let
it
finish dripping, then turn it upwards as I remove it to keep drips off my
tank paint/wax. Works for me...never had a spill when filling a bike.

>The Exxon where I've been going the past couple of months had one stick
>open on me on the pump to the left of the one I normally go to. The
>catch spring had broken and caught the handle. After a brief panic I
>pushed it into the tank which triggered the auto-shutoff. The one behind
>my normal pump has a hand written sign apologizing and warning that the
>auto-shutoff doesn't work.

Yeah, that's defective equipment alright! Good job handling it. They
should have shut that one off and tagged it until they could get it
fixed.

>Maybe last year I was at the Shell and didn't make sure the nozzle was
>all the way in before triggering the handle. The gas hit the corner of
>the lip inside the tank (it's on the Harley's and on newer cars but it's
>not on my Suzuki) and sprayed gas back over me and the back of the bike.

That's that "restrictor" I was referring to. Regular gas nozzles were
larger in diameter than the unleaded ones, so they wouldn't fit through
the
opening. History is fun, huh? ;-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 18:36:48 2004
From: "Gary Foreman" <lists@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Summit Point Weekend?
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 18:39:09 -0400

Hope the weather holds out!

God it's been a long winter!

Gary Foreman


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 18:39:49 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 18:41:14 -0400
To: "Copeland, James" <james.copeland@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Best Place for a New Ducati?

At 03:40 PM 4/12/04 -0400, Copeland, James wrote:
>I'm looking to purchase a new Ducati S4R Monster and am looking for a
few
>recommendations. I've already considered Ducati Richmond and Coleman.
>Coleman has given me a good price $13,000 out the door, but I'm a bit
leery
>of completing a deal with them. Ducati Richmond, would not match
Coleman's
>price.

Battley's (Gaithersburg) sells Ducati...though I doubt they will be low
on
the price scale (they also sell Harley and BMW). Might be worth asking
anyway.

>Also in my considerations is the fact that I plan to do some custom
>modifications to the bike such as a custom paint scheme and a few other
>visual effect changes. Other items of consideration include replacing
the
>OEM exhaust and ECU mapping and changing the rear sprocket (up two teeth
to
>44). I'm not good with a wrench or paint brush, so I'm going to need a
shop
>that can help me out.

Battley's can do parts changes...though one of the list's more unpleasant
folks has had some poor experiences there and will probably pipe up about
here with the details. From what he said, I'd have been pretty upset
about
it myself.

MDO, which is about two blocks from Battley's, rents shop space and tools
(from lifts to screwdrivers)...and can provide assistance if you want to
do
the work yourself, or do it for you if you don't. I know they work on
Harleys and customs based on Harley parts...I don't know if they do
Ducati
or other imports...might be worth asking though. They've been there for
several decades, so they are doing something right.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 18:57:44 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 18:57:23 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Gary Foreman <lists@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Summit Point Weekend?

Gary Foreman wrote:

>Hope the weather holds out!
>
>God it's been a long winter!
>
>Gary Foreman
>
>

I agree! Roach and I will be there spectating, so I hope the weather is
nice...sounds like it's going to be, but we'll see.

Laura

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 19:23:50 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 16:23:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: April Prep Trivia
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX


--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 01:30 PM 4/12/04 -0400, Carl Schelin wrote:
> >On Mon, 2004-04-12 at 13:20, Mike Bartman wrote:
> >> At 02:00 PM 4/11/04 -0400, W.S. wrote:
> >>
> >> >. Resolved once again to be darn careful refueling -- even
> prechecking the
> >> >handle operation.
> >>
> >> How do you do that? Just pump a little and quit to see that it
> works?
> >> What if it doesn't? Some of the newer pumps don't have shutoffs on
> the
> >> pump itself like the old ones did. Will yelling, "I don't have any
> money!"
> >> get the operator to kill it? :-)
> >
> >Unless it's one I use regularly, and I always try to hit the same pump
> >each time, I'll watch the opening. When it looks close, I'll stop it
> and
> >check.
>
> Oh! You mean that you've been expecting the automatic shutoff to work?
> I
> think we've found the problem...
*snip*

Actually it does work on my regular pump. I put the nozzle down so that
the lower air holes are just at the restrictor line. When it shuts off,
the level is about a half inch below the restrictor. That's why I watch
on
unfamiliar pumps. I still put the nozzle in about the right amount/bottom
of the air holes. It seems to be successful in almost every instance.
Since I've experienced the problem with the stuck nozzle, I'm aware of
what to do if it gets stuck again :-)

> I not only wouldn't trust the auto-shutoff on a bike, I certainly
> wouldn't
> want to let the weight of the nozzle and hose hang on my tank filler
> lip.
> Wear, paint chipping and even broken welds and tank distortion are
> possible. I insert it carefully, hold it carefully, pump carefully,
let
> it
> finish dripping, then turn it upwards as I remove it to keep drips off
> my
> tank paint/wax. Works for me...never had a spill when filling a bike.
>

Wrong impression there. I don't let the nozzle rest on the tank, no
matter
which bike. Too many opportunities for uncontrollable problems. I
_always_
hold it. I hold it about half the time when filling Rita's car.

> History is fun, huh? ;-)

I knew what it was for, I just didn't know what it was called. Thanks for
the lesson though, teach ;-)

>
> -- Mike B.
>

Carl

=====
02 Harley FXSTI
95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
76 Honda Chopper (in progress)

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 12 21:15:49 2004
Date: Mon, 12 Apr 2004 21:04:53 -0400
From: Chuck and Karen Pena <cvkgpena@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: cvkgpena@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Track bike w/lights FOR SALE CHEAP

Also listed in the NESBA classifieds. If anyone has any other
suggestions for where else I can list this, I'd appreciate knowing.
Also, feel free to post/forward. Just make sure to provide my return
contact info: the_penas@XXXXXX. Many, many thanx!

Chuck

My 1993 FZR600 Benetton Formula One-inspired DIY painted track bike with
lights is up for sale. Have knocked the price down to $2000 OBO.
Somebody make me an offer I can't refuse. Please, take my wife ... er
... bike. %^) But seriously, this is a great first track bike.

By modern 600 standards, the motor is "weak," putting out only 75 hp.
But that also means it's harder to get in too far over your head and
into big trouble. That said, it's plenty fast. I've seen 140mph
indicated on the speedo. D&D full race exhaust. Jetted (last year).
Slight flat spot at ~5000 rpm but pulls smoothly and strongly all the
way to the rev limit. Even though it may not be scary fast in a
straight line, my FZR can corner with the best of them. I was able to
leave a lot of guys on newer, more powerful, and expensive bikes
(including a few Ducs and Aprilias) behind me on the track at Summit.
Fox Twin Clicker rear shock. Raised rear ride height. Race Tech'ed
front end (springs and emulators). Beefy, custom front fork brace.
It's at home in the corners, either on the street or on the track. An
"easy" bike to learn the fine art of knee dragging. Sticky BT-56SS
tires with plenty of tread life left in them. Other stuff: New
sprockets and chain last year. Running 14T up front and 46T in back and
using an RK 520 chain. The gearing is -1 in the front and +1 in the back
from stock. It sacrifices some top speed for more pull/drive in the
corners and probably a little quicker acceleration. I figure the actual
top speed with this gearing is something like 135mph. Frame and bar end
sliders. Steel braided front brake lines (I can't remember about the
rear). HH front brake pads. UNI air filter (and I have filter oil).
Will include Airtech front numberplate for track duty. BTW, the
headlights have clear stoneguards so they don't need to be taped for the
track. Smoke windscreen (I think it's LP, but I honestly can't
remember). Already minimally safety-wired for track use: rear axle
cotter pin, oil filter, and oil filler cap. BTW, I'm using Mobil One
5W-50 automobile oil.

FULL DISCLOSURE: I'm the second owner. Bought it on eBay from a guy in
CO. It's been down at least once. I lowsided on the left side 2
seasons ago at Summit Point. I repaired the bodywork myself, which
means it's OK but not perfect. I'm pretty sure the previous owner
lowsided once too (probably at the track). The left fairing had been
repaired with some sort of plastic weld when I bought it (which I had to
repair again -- less elegantly -- after my minor adventure at Summit).
Speaking of bodywork, the tailpiece is an Airtech TZ250 tailpiece, which
gives the bike a completely different GP-ish look. It also means that I
had to do a DIY DOT-legal brake/tail light. Tailpiece got banged up in
my lowside at Summit, but I repaired it. Finally, a couple of small
cracks in the upper but they've all been patched up. These are not 100%
perfect professional repairs (hey, it's really a track bike!) Frame was
painted flat-black by the previous owner, as was the bodywork. All
sorts of pics and words at
http://www.geocities.com/the_penas/chux_gsxr.htm. I have all the
paperwork that the original owner gave me when I bought it, as well as
for any shop work I've had done.

One final note: my FZR will pass inspection in VA because VA law doesn't
require turn signals and I don't have any. I can't vouch for it passing
in either DC or MD. And if you need/want turn signals, that's
completely up to you. Also, it doesn't have a rear license plate light
(which it's technically supposed to have) but I've never been hassled
about it.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 07:14:12 2004
From: "W.S." <mobacc@XXXXXX>
To: "DC-Cycles" <DC-Cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: April Prep Trivia
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 07:13:51 -0400

Just for the record:

-- autofill has never been an option for me, whatever the vehicle:
Sophisticated, abused gear with high loss risk if there is any mismatch
among environment, vehicle, me, pump.

-- The offending pump handles have had bum springs/catch levers, holding
open the filler squeeze [nomenclature?]. The prophylactic action -
eyeball
and fiddle with spring/catch, possibly change pumps. Simple.

Bill S. / DC
'99 VN750 > Spilled gas makes me itch.
Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun.


Mike Bartman wrote:

At 01:30 PM 4/12/04 -0400, Carl Schelin wrote:
>On Mon, 2004-04-12 at 13:20, Mike Bartman wrote:
>> At 02:00 PM 4/11/04 -0400, W.S. wrote:
>>
>> >. Resolved once again to be darn careful refueling -- even
>> >prechecking the handle operation.
>>
>> How do you do that? Just pump a little and quit to see that it works?
>> What if it doesn't? Some of the newer pumps don't have shutoffs on
>> the pump itself like the old ones did. Will yelling, "I don't have
any
money!"
>> get the operator to kill it? :-)
>
>Unless it's one I use regularly, and I always try to hit the same pump
>each time, I'll watch the opening. When it looks close, I'll stop it
>and check.

Oh! You mean that you've been expecting the automatic shutoff to work?
I
think we've found the problem...

Pump shutoffs work on back pressure. When the pump starts pumping into a
filler neck that's full of gas, there's more pressure involved than
pumping
into an empty filler neck. The increase in pressure causes the pump to
trip
the handle and shut off the gas flow. Like the traffic signal coils in
the
roadways, these aren't designed for bikes...but for cars and trucks.

There are even some cars and trucks they wouldn't work on in the early
days.
Some had bends in the filler neck so close to the opening that gas would
back up and shut the nozzle off almost instantly, regardless of how full
the
tank was. Some would do this unless you held the nozzle just right.
Some
cars had openings so large that they wouldn't hold the nozzle well, and
would let it fall out and spray gas everywhere...Corvettes for instance
(please don't ask how I know this...).

Bikes don't have filler necks. They usually have a restrictor, that
keeps
you from inserting a regular fuel pump nozzle into a tank intended for
unleaded (not all that important anymore really...but it was vital back
in
the 70s when most stations had both kinds), but this is not always a
sealed
tube (isn't on my Harley), and it isn't very long either (under an inch
on
my bike). Won't have any effect on pump shutoff.

There's a slight delay in the auto shutoff too. At the rate some pumps
run,
it can pump a fair bit of gas between the pressure sensor tripping and
the
flow actually stopping. It's not an amount that a car's tank would
notice,
but if you are nearing full on a moto tank, it might be enough to put it
over the limit.

If you stick the nozzle far enough into the tank, the tank itself will
eventually do the trick, as the gas level rises above the end of the
nozzle
far enough to let the nozzle generate the backpressure, but at this point
you probably aren't much more than half full. You have to lift the
nozzle
and "blip" the lever to add enough gas to get up to full...you can't
expect
the auto-shutoff to work in that case of course. On my bike, once the
fuel
level gets up to the bottom of the restriction device, it's full, so I
quit
pumping.

I not only wouldn't trust the auto-shutoff on a bike, I certainly
wouldn't
want to let the weight of the nozzle and hose hang on my tank filler lip.
Wear, paint chipping and even broken welds and tank distortion are
possible.
I insert it carefully, hold it carefully, pump carefully, let it finish
dripping, then turn it upwards as I remove it to keep drips off my tank
paint/wax. Works for me...never had a spill when filling a bike.

>The Exxon where I've been going the past couple of months had one stick
>open on me on the pump to the left of the one I normally go to. The
>catch spring had broken and caught the handle. After a brief panic I
>pushed it into the tank which triggered the auto-shutoff. The one
>behind my normal pump has a hand written sign apologizing and warning
>that the auto-shutoff doesn't work.

Yeah, that's defective equipment alright! Good job handling it. They
should have shut that one off and tagged it until they could get it
fixed.

>Maybe last year I was at the Shell and didn't make sure the nozzle was
>all the way in before triggering the handle. The gas hit the corner of
>the lip inside the tank (it's on the Harley's and on newer cars but
>it's not on my Suzuki) and sprayed gas back over me and the back of the
bike.

That's that "restrictor" I was referring to. Regular gas nozzles were
larger in diameter than the unleaded ones, so they wouldn't fit through
the
opening. History is fun, huh? ;-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 07:46:52 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 04:46:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Best Place for a New Ducati?
To: "Copeland, James" <james.copeland@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

all of the aftermarket work you want done, except the
painting, can be finished by yourself in 15 minutes tops.
to my knowledge no local ducati dealers do custom paintwork
in house, so imo this should not be a factor in your
dealership choice.

have you tried speed's cycle in elkridge, md? i've heard
good things about this shop. what about the winchester
dealer? give 'em a call.

otherwise, if coleman is your lowest price, buy from
coleman. just because you buy there doesn't mean you have
to have your warranty service performed there.
interestingly, even if you purchase at a shop other than
coleman, the bike may still come from coleman. they seem
to have their hands in everything.



--- "Copeland, James" <james.copeland@XXXXXX> wrote:
> I'm looking to purchase a new Ducati S4R Monster and am
> looking for a few
> recommendations. I've already considered Ducati Richmond
> and Coleman.
> Coleman has given me a good price $13,000 out the door,
> but I'm a bit leery
> of completing a deal with them. Ducati Richmond, would
> not match Coleman's
> price.
>
> Also in my considerations is the fact that I plan to do
> some custom
> modifications to the bike such as a custom paint scheme
> and a few other
> visual effect changes. Other items of consideration
> include replacing the
> OEM exhaust and ECU mapping and changing the rear
> sprocket (up two teeth to
> 44). I'm not good with a wrench or paint brush, so I'm
> going to need a shop
> that can help me out.
>
> Overall, I'd to complete a deal with a shop that: 1) I
> trust, 2) I can count
> on to get the best deal/value possible and 3) will work
> with me on
> customizing my bike.
>
> Note- I'm not limiting myself to purchasing the bike in
> VA.
>
> Thanks for the insight,
>
> Jim
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 08:00:18 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 05:00:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: VFR wrenching
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>, John Kozyn <mr_vfr@XXXXXX>,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 04:25 PM 4/11/04 -0700, John Kozyn wrote:
>
> >I notice Mr Bartman's back, I guess I can expect the
> Digest volume to
> >increase significantly now ;) I don't think it topped
> 25K last week(!)
>
> I never left...but taking cheap shots isn't likely to get
> me to post long
> messages to you. Saying something that's actually
> interesting might
> though. Give it a try.

you conveniently snipped the "interesting" part of his
post.

i you never left, what happened, mike?   broken finger?
carpel tunnel?


--
tg




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 09:01:14 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 06:01:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ryan Santoso <santosor2001@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Best Place for a New Ducati?
To: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>, "Copeland, James"
<james.copeland@XXXXXX>,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX


Koups in Harrisburg, Pa (bout 2 hours from the DC
area) typically offer great deals on Ducatis. I
personally think they are a great "mom and pop" type
of dealership.

But, would you consider buying used? I've purchased
5(and sold) ducatis in the past few years and never
have i bought new. Right now, there are so many used
ducatis on the market and the bikes have taken a
beating on the prices.

Ryan


--- Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX> wrote:
> all of the aftermarket work you want done, except
> the
> painting, can be finished by yourself in 15 minutes
> tops.
> to my knowledge no local ducati dealers do custom
> paintwork
> in house, so imo this should not be a factor in your
> dealership choice.
>
> have you tried speed's cycle in elkridge, md? i've
> heard
> good things about this shop. what about the
> winchester
> dealer? give 'em a call.
>
> otherwise, if coleman is your lowest price, buy from
> coleman. just because you buy there doesn't mean
> you have
> to have your warranty service performed there.
> interestingly, even if you purchase at a shop other
> than
> coleman, the bike may still come from coleman. they
> seem
> to have their hands in everything.
>
>
>
> --- "Copeland, James" <james.copeland@XXXXXX> wrote:
> > I'm looking to purchase a new Ducati S4R Monster
> and am
>   > looking for a few
>   > recommendations. I've already considered Ducati
>   Richmond
>   > and Coleman.
>   > Coleman has given me a good price $13,000 out the
>   door,
>   > but I'm a bit leery
>   > of completing a deal with them. Ducati Richmond,
>   would
>   > not match Coleman's
>   > price.
>   >
>   > Also in my considerations is the fact that I plan
>   to do
>   > some custom
>   > modifications to the bike such as a custom paint
>   scheme
>   > and a few other
>   > visual effect changes. Other items of
>   consideration
>   > include replacing the
>   > OEM exhaust and ECU mapping and changing the rear
>   > sprocket (up two teeth to
>   > 44). I'm not good with a wrench or paint brush,
>   so I'm
>   > going to need a shop
>   > that can help me out.
>   >
>   > Overall, I'd to complete a deal with a shop that:
>   1) I
>   > trust, 2) I can count
>   > on to get the best deal/value possible and 3) will
>   work
>   > with me on
>   > customizing my bike.
>   >
>   > Note- I'm not limiting myself to purchasing the
>   bike in
>   > VA.
>   >
>   > Thanks for the insight,
>   >
>   > Jim
>   >
>
>
>
>
>
>   __________________________________
>   Do you Yahoo!?
>   Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
>   http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 09:49:38 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 06:49:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: VFR wrenching
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

> --- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
 > At 04:25 PM 4/11/04 -0700, John Kozyn wrote:
 >
 > >I notice Mr Bartman's back, I guess I can expect the
 > Digest volume to
 > >increase significantly now ;) I don't think it topped
 > 25K last week(!)
 >
 > I never left...but taking cheap shots isn't likely to get
 > me to post long
 > messages to you. Saying something that's actually
 > interesting might
 > though. Give it a try.

"Cheap shot"? Hardly. It's not just this post, either. What's happened to
you in
the last few months, Mike? Have you developed hypersensitivity or is this
just
arrogance surfacing?

-- Larry




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 10:28:24 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 10:28:14 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: The rainy season, was Re: VFR wrenching
-----Original Message-----
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>

> --- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
 > At 04:25 PM 4/11/04 -0700, John Kozyn wrote:
 >
 > >I notice Mr Bartman's back, I guess I can expect the
 > Digest volume to
 > >increase significantly now ;) I don't think it topped
 > 25K last week(!)
 >
 > I never left...but taking cheap shots isn't likely to get
 > me to post long
 > messages to you. Saying something that's actually
 > interesting might
 > though. Give it a try.

"Cheap shot"? Hardly. It's not just this post, either. What's happened to
you in
the last few months, Mike? Have you developed hypersensitivity or is this
just
arrogance surfacing?

-- Larry

------------------------

Yeah, but what I really want to know is what this thread has to do with
"VFR wrenching."

Anyhoo, anyone tried out any good rain gear lately, now that the monsoons
are upon us. ;-)

Paul in DC, stayin' dry in the Sidi Te-por boots, Motoport Ultra II with
Gore-tex linings, and Aerostich overmittens.

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 10:50:22 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 10:50:15 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: The rainy season

At 10:28 AM 4/13/2004, Paul Wilson wrote:
>Paul in DC, stayin' dry in the Sidi Te-por boots, Motoport Ultra II with
>Gore-tex linings, and Aerostich overmittens.

I'm staying 100% dry.

In my truck.
I never mind riding home in the rain unless high winds are associated.
But
I won't ride in if it is raining in the morning. My boots saturate by
the
time I get in, and invariably my shirt collar gets wet. Not appropriate
for work.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 10:52:43 2004
Subject: Re: The rainy season...
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 13 Apr 2004 10:49:22 -0400

On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 10:28, Paul Wilson wrote:

> Yeah, but what I really want to know is what this thread has to do with
> "VFR wrenching."
>
> Anyhoo, anyone tried out any good rain gear lately, now that the
monsoons
> are upon us. ;-)
>

My setup:

TourMaster Rain Suit with stirrups and velcro closures.
Joe Rocket Jacket.
Totes.
Two shopping bags of your choice.
Bandana.
Fog City Shield.
Harley Rainproof Gloves.

Complaints:

Both the Tourmaster pants and the Joe Rocket pants needs to have
protection at the lower leg for brushes against hot pipes. Both my pants
have red duct tape covering holes. The JR pants have a tear from
catching on the right peg on the sportbike.

The JR jacket has a rain liner that's almost useless against the rain.
It has a neck snap and no snaps around the wrist. If it's going to rain,
I wear the tourmaster under the JR and tighten down the velcro.

The Gloves have a liner that doesn't breathe at all. As a result, I have
wet hands no matter if rain gets in or sweat doesn't get out.

Compliments:

The Tourmaster gear keeps me very dry. With velcro neck and wrist
closures, I get no trickles down my back/front and nothing up my wrist.
The stirrups that go under the boots keep the legs down.

The Wal*Mart bags seem to maintain integrity longer than the other bags.
They're also a little larger so they come all the way up to the top of
the boot.

> Paul in DC, stayin' dry in the Sidi Te-por boots, Motoport Ultra II
with
> Gore-tex linings, and Aerostich overmittens.

I got home yesterday at about 5:30. After stripping off my gear, only
the soles of my boots had a wet sheen to them. I was a little chilly,
especially in the hands.

>
> Paul in DC
> 95 VFR - 96 KLR650
>

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 11:38:51 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: cschelin@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: The rainy season...
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 11:38:42 -0400

I just don't ride in the rain.   Too much trouble.


>From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Re: The rainy season...
>Date: 13 Apr 2004 10:49:22 -0400
>
>On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 10:28, Paul Wilson wrote:
>
> > Yeah, but what I really want to know is what this thread has to do
with
> > "VFR wrenching."
> >
> > Anyhoo, anyone tried out any good rain gear lately, now that the
>monsoons
> > are upon us. ;-)
> >
>
>My setup:
>
>TourMaster Rain Suit with stirrups and velcro closures.
>Joe Rocket Jacket.
>Totes.
>Two shopping bags of your choice.
>Bandana.
>Fog City Shield.
>Harley Rainproof Gloves.
>
>Complaints:
>
>Both the Tourmaster pants and the Joe Rocket pants needs to have
>protection at the lower leg for brushes against hot pipes. Both my pants
>have red duct tape covering holes. The JR pants have a tear from
>catching on the right peg on the sportbike.
>
>The JR jacket has a rain liner that's almost useless against the rain.
>It has a neck snap and no snaps around the wrist. If it's going to rain,
>I wear the tourmaster under the JR and tighten down the velcro.
>
>The Gloves have a liner that doesn't breathe at all. As a result, I have
>wet hands no matter if rain gets in or sweat doesn't get out.
>
>Compliments:
>
>The Tourmaster gear keeps me very dry. With velcro neck and wrist
>closures, I get no trickles down my back/front and nothing up my wrist.
>The stirrups that go under the boots keep the legs down.
>
>The Wal*Mart bags seem to maintain integrity longer than the other bags.
>They're also a little larger so they come all the way up to the top of
>the boot.
>
> > Paul in DC, stayin' dry in the Sidi Te-por boots, Motoport Ultra II
with
> > Gore-tex linings, and Aerostich overmittens.
>
>I got home yesterday at about 5:30. After stripping off my gear, only
>the soles of my boots had a wet sheen to them. I was a little chilly,
>especially in the hands.
>
> >
> > Paul in DC
> > 95 VFR - 96 KLR650
> >
>
>Carl
>
_________________________________________________________________
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available.
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us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 11:52:27 2004
Subject: Re: The rainy season...
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 13 Apr 2004 11:49:02 -0400

On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 11:38, John White wrote:
> I just don't ride in the rain. Too much trouble.
>

I figure that since I like to do distance riding from time to time,
knowing what gear I need and how it works together will let me continue
to ride no matter what the weather is. When you're on vacation and have
to get somewhere, you don't always have the luxury of waiting out a rain
storm.

I have issues with the gloves, lower leg protection and possibly boots
so the next time I'm looking for gear, I'll have a checklist so I get
the right stuff.

If you don't do any distance riding, then what gear to have probably
won't make much difference to you. Of course, if you're out doing
twisties and it rains, it'd be nice to have a set of Tourmasters rolled
up in your bag so you can stay dry :-) If you're out looking for boots,
you might consider waterproof Sidi or Harley (depending on your style)
boots to keep you from having to use totes and plastic shopping bags to
keep your boots dry and your feet warm :-) Or you can just hang out with
the rest of the guys under the overpass :-)

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 12:14:21 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 12:14:16 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: The rainy season...

-----Original Message-----
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
Sent: Apr 13, 2004 11:49 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: The rainy season...

On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 11:38, John White wrote:
> I just don't ride in the rain. Too much trouble.
>
I figure that since I like to do distance riding from time to time,
knowing what gear I need and how it works together will let me continue
to ride no matter what the weather is. When you're on vacation and have
to get somewhere, you don't always have the luxury of waiting out a rain
storm.

----------------

I'll tell you what riding in the rain (or other adverse weather)
regularly does for me: it's actually fun. Yep, that's right folks, pick
those jaws up off the keyboards. Besides, I'd be one frustrated pup in
this climate if I only rode on nice sunny, warm but not hot, weekend
days. I might get out, oh I don't know, maybe three or four times a
year. :)

Riding in the rain and a variety of weather conditions also takes away
lots of worries. If you're on a multi-day trip, and the weather's crappy
one day, it's not going to ruin your whole trip if you're accustomed to
it and come equipped for it. With enough experience, I know I can handle
just about anything Mother Nature throws at me, except for snow and ice.
Like I said, it takes away a lot of worries. YMMV.




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 12:47:31 2004
Subject: Re: The rainy season...
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 13 Apr 2004 12:44:06 -0400

On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 12:14, Paul Wilson wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
> Sent: Apr 13, 2004 11:49 AM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: The rainy season...
>
> On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 11:38, John White wrote:
> > I just don't ride in the rain. Too much trouble.
> >
>
> I figure that since I like to do distance riding from time to time,
> knowing what gear I need and how it works together will let me continue
> to ride no matter what the weather is. When you're on vacation and have
> to get somewhere, you don't always have the luxury of waiting out a
rain
> storm.
>
> ----------------
>
> I'll tell you what riding in the rain (or other adverse weather)
regularly
> does for me: it's actually fun. Yep, that's right folks, pick those
jaws
> up off the keyboards. Besides, I'd be one frustrated pup in this
climate
> if I only rode on nice sunny, warm but not hot, weekend days. I might
get
> out, oh I don't know, maybe three or four times a year. :)

I guess I missed adding that. Oh yea it's fun. Funny at times too, from
the looks I get from some drivers :-)

> Paul in DC
> 95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 13:04:39 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: cschelin@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: The rainy season...
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 13:04:31 -0400

Let me clarify. I think riding in the rain would be fun at times as
well,
but I don't have the skills/confidence yet to ride in the rain. I
started
riding in October 03'. Also, I don't have my license yet (have a
permit).
The thought of the wet ground scares me right now. I guess I'll
eventually
have to venture out into the wetness, especially in the D.C. area. I
just
need to log some more road time (and get my license) to boost my
confidence
I guess. Oh, and a rain suit wouldn't hurt either : )

I'm taking the MSF course in July, so we'll see how it goes. In the
meantime I keep riding with my mentors and I'm getting more skilled and
confident handling the bike as time goes on.



>From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Re: The rainy season...
>Date: 13 Apr 2004 12:44:06 -0400
>
>On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 12:14, Paul Wilson wrote:
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
> > Sent: Apr 13, 2004 11:49 AM
> > To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > Subject: Re: The rainy season...
> >
> > On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 11:38, John White wrote:
> > > I just don't ride in the rain. Too much trouble.
> > >
> >
> > I figure that since I like to do distance riding from time to time,
> > knowing what gear I need and how it works together will let me
continue
> > to ride no matter what the weather is. When you're on vacation and
have
> > to get somewhere, you don't always have the luxury of waiting out a
rain
> > storm.
> >
> > ----------------
> >
> > I'll tell you what riding in the rain (or other adverse weather)
>regularly
> > does for me: it's actually fun. Yep, that's right folks, pick those
>jaws
> > up off the keyboards. Besides, I'd be one frustrated pup in this
>climate
> > if I only rode on nice sunny, warm but not hot, weekend days. I
might
>get
> > out, oh I don't know, maybe three or four times a year. :)
>
>I guess I missed adding that. Oh yea it's fun. Funny at times too, from
>the looks I get from some drivers :-)
>
> > Paul in DC
> > 95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org
>
>Carl
>

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfee )B®
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 13:09:23 2004
Subject: RE: The rainy season...
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 13:09:09 -0400
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "Carl Schelin" <cschelin@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Having moved here from Portland, Oregon, where we get (on average) 222
cloudy days a year (but only 136 rainy days ;->), I am a bit bemused at
local attitudes towards riding in wet weather. A day spent riding is
always preferable to a day spent driving, unless we're talking snow and
ice on the road, and snow chains on the cage.

I will admit that I do get tired of draping my gear around my cubicle to
dry; despite the fact that I stay dry inside it, the First Gear jacket
and pants sure seem to soak up a lot of water. My company makes no
allowances for coat closets or mud rooms suited for wet clothing, so it
looks like a rummage sale around my desk when I ride on wet days.

I also haven't broken down and bought specifically waterproof gloves for
riding, the Held gloves with a good application of Nik-Wax stay pretty
dry, but the treatment has to be updated periodically.

Robert

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 13:17:49 2004
Subject: Re: The rainy season...
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 13 Apr 2004 13:14:28 -0400

Ah, see that's different. "Too much trouble" had different implications
to me than 'not enough experience'. Hope I didn't overwhelm you with
info :-)

Good luck and ride safe.

Carl

On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 13:04, John White wrote:
> Let me clarify. I think riding in the rain would be fun at times as
well,
> but I don't have the skills/confidence yet to ride in the rain. I
started
> riding in October 03'. Also, I don't have my license yet (have a
permit).
> The thought of the wet ground scares me right now. I guess I'll
eventually
> have to venture out into the wetness, especially in the D.C. area. I
just
> need to log some more road time (and get my license) to boost my
confidence
> I guess. Oh, and a rain suit wouldn't hurt either : )
>
> I'm taking the MSF course in July, so we'll see how it goes. In the
> meantime I keep riding with my mentors and I'm getting more skilled and
> confident handling the bike as time goes on.
>
>
>
> >From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
> >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> >Subject: Re: The rainy season...
> >Date: 13 Apr 2004 12:44:06 -0400
> >
> >On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 12:14, Paul Wilson wrote:
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
> > > Sent: Apr 13, 2004 11:49 AM
> > > To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > > Subject: Re: The rainy season...
> > >
> > > On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 11:38, John White wrote:
> > > > I just don't ride in the rain. Too much trouble.
> > > >
> > >
> > > I figure that since I like to do distance riding from time to time,
> > > knowing what gear I need and how it works together will let me
continue
> > > to ride no matter what the weather is. When you're on vacation and
have
> > > to get somewhere, you don't always have the luxury of waiting out a
rain
> > > storm.
> > >
> > > ----------------
> > >
> > > I'll tell you what riding in the rain (or other adverse weather)
> >regularly
> > > does for me: it's actually fun. Yep, that's right folks, pick
those
> >jaws
> > > up off the keyboards. Besides, I'd be one frustrated pup in this
> >climate
> > > if I only rode on nice sunny, warm but not hot, weekend days. I
might
> >get
> > > out, oh I don't know, maybe three or four times a year. :)
> >
> >I guess I missed adding that. Oh yea it's fun. Funny at times too,
from
> >the looks I get from some drivers :-)
> >
> > > Paul in DC
> > > 95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org
> >
> >Carl
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfee )B®
> Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 13:25:54 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 13:25:49 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: John White <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, cschelin@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: The rainy season...

-----Original Message-----
From: John White <kokopellian@XXXXXX>

Let me clarify. I think riding in the rain would be fun at times as
well,
but I don't have the skills/confidence yet to ride in the rain. ....

I'm taking the MSF course in July, so we'll see how it goes. In the
meantime I keep riding with my mentors and I'm getting more skilled and
confident handling the bike as time goes on.

-----------------------------
Maybe it'll rain when you take the MSF. :) I like to break 'em in early
when it comes to riding in the rain.
Wet pavement does diminish your traction, but probably not as much as you
think.



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 13:33:50 2004
Subject: RE: The rainy season...
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 13 Apr 2004 13:30:29 -0400

On Tue, 2004-04-13 at 13:09, Verde, Robert wrote:
> Having moved here from Portland, Oregon, where we get (on average) 222
> cloudy days a year (but only 136 rainy days ;->), I am a bit bemused at
> local attitudes towards riding in wet weather. A day spent riding is
> always preferable to a day spent driving, unless we're talking snow and
> ice on the road, and snow chains on the cage.

Agreed. Having lived in Bremerton for a year or so I understand about
angering the rain gods :-)

>
> I will admit that I do get tired of draping my gear around my cubicle
to
> dry; despite the fact that I stay dry inside it, the First Gear jacket
> and pants sure seem to soak up a lot of water. My company makes no
> allowances for coat closets or mud rooms suited for wet clothing, so it
> looks like a rummage sale around my desk when I ride on wet days.

Hah, that mirrors my cube. Fortunately I have enough space to hang up my
gear with a couple of newspapers underneath. When it's time to go home,
most everything is dry. The jacket is still a touch damp though.
When I get in, I make a stop at the bathroom to strip off my gear.
Having puddles of water in the computer room tends to upset some folks,
I don't know why ;-)

>
> I also haven't broken down and bought specifically waterproof gloves
for
> riding, the Held gloves with a good application of Nik-Wax stay pretty
> dry, but the treatment has to be updated periodically.

I got the HD ones when I was heading down to Deal's Gap last year. I
forgot any gloves at all and it was raining when I left so I stopped and
grabbed a pair of gloves marketed as waterproof with gore-tex etc. It
has a liner that clings to damp hands so it's somewhat of a pain to get
on if it or my hands are damp.

>
> Robert
>

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 16:06:51 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 15:57:46 -0400
To: "W.S." <mobacc@XXXXXX>, "DC-Cycles" <DC-Cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: April Prep Trivia

At 07:13 AM 4/13/04 -0400, W.S. wrote:

>-- The offending pump handles have had bum springs/catch levers, holding
>open the filler squeeze [nomenclature?].

Trigger?

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 16:08:47 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 16:10:21 -0400
To: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: The rainy season

At 10:50 AM 4/13/04 -0400, Troutman wrote:
>At 10:28 AM 4/13/2004, Paul Wilson wrote:
>>Paul in DC, stayin' dry in the Sidi Te-por boots, Motoport Ultra II
with
>>Gore-tex linings, and Aerostich overmittens.
>
>I'm staying 100% dry.
>
>In my truck.

I did about 40 miles this morning...to go to a funeral. One of the
longtime HOG members in the local chapter died last Wednesday, and the
funeral was this morning. One of his good friends rode the dearly
departed's bike at the head of a motorcycle escort provided by the MC-
HOGs.

It was raining when we came out of the church for the ride to the
cemetery.
 It rained harder on the way there...and even hailed a bit just for
variety. It went back to raining for the service at the grave, but as
soon
as they said the last words, it stopped.


Other than my gloves being soaked on the outside (dry inside), and my
boots
letting my feet get soaked, I was completely dry, if a bit overly warm.
The H-D rainsuit worked like a charm over all the areas it covered.
Didn't
even leak at the neck...the collar was high enough to meet up under the
full face helmet.

With some boots that don't leak, and helmet with a defroster and
windshield
wipers, riding in the rain wouldn't be bad at all. Traction was
noticeably
lacking a couple of times, particularly at the white stripes at
intersections, but the rear going slightly squirrelly for a second
doesn't
upset me, especially when I'm ready for it. Reminds me of trail riding
on
my old Yamaha XT-550...

Bob won't need a rain suit where he's riding now...

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 16:40:53 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 16:37:36 -0400
To: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, cschelin@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: The rainy season...

At 01:04 PM 4/13/04 -0400, John White wrote:
>Let me clarify. I think riding in the rain would be fun at times as
well,
>but I don't have the skills/confidence yet to ride in the rain. I
started
>riding in October 03'. Also, I don't have my license yet (have a
permit).
>The thought of the wet ground scares me right now.

You're a smart man. Stick with your plan. Safe is better in the long
run...if you want to have a long run. Push your limits gently and you'll
be able to keep pushing them. Run wildly past them and you won't get far
at all.

>I guess I'll eventually
>have to venture out into the wetness, especially in the D.C. area.

My first ride in the rain was the day I picked up my Honda 700 Saber in
'85. I'd been riding a Yamaha XT-550 enduro for a couple of years,
mostly
on road, but off road as much as I could find places to do it, but always
on nice days. It was cloudy when I went to pick up the bike, but dry.
By
the time the paperwork was done, the bike was ready to go, and I was
doing
a few laps around the big parking lot to get used to the feel, the clouds
had turned to sprinkles. By the time I got up on the beltway for the two
exits I needed to go to get home, it was *raining*. It was coming down
hard enough that visibility was down to about half a mile, traffic was
crawling, and the water was half an inch deep on the road everywhere.
Jeans and a ski jacket are really not all that ideal for such
conditions...I was soaked by the time I got home. At least it was a warm
day.

I didn't ride in rain again until today...but this time I had much better
gear! :-)

>I just
>need to log some more road time (and get my license) to boost my
confidence
>I guess. Oh, and a rain suit wouldn't hurt either : )

Log all the time you feel a need for, then log a little more just to be
sure. That's what I've done every time I've gotten a bike (other than
whatever it took to get it home anyway...my first bike I had an
experienced
friend ride home for me, but I've, very carefully, ridden the other two
home myself)...starting with the slow speed parking lot drills from the
"road test". They let you learn the control locations and feel without
having to worry much about getting run over, and they let you learn the
balance of the bike, how fast it stops, and whether it has any bad
habits.
That's all really useful to know when you are out in traffic, potholes,
and
wind gusts.

Once I'm happy with the parking lot, I play in neighborhood streets (25
mph
stuff). That's for shifting practice, turns, stops, signalling, etc.

Then I go play in the parking lot some more. Then the slow streets, then
a
little faster (35-40 limits). Once I'm working the controls and guiding
the bike without having to think about it, I'll try busier streets with
more traffic, the interstate for a short run, etc.. Then longer and
longer
rides on whatever comes up, rush hour, etc., but only when I'm feeling
awake and alert. If you are fuzzy-headed from fatigue (or beer, or
whatever), stay off the bike.

I did things that way when I got the Yamaha, again when I got the Honda,
and again when I got the Harley last fall. I've now got a bit over 2100
miles on the Harley, and I'm starting to feel pretty comfortable with it.
Tracking around curves on a line I meant to follow, handling wind gusts
(max so far was probably around 40-45 mph, with me doing 50), coping with
slippery roads (this morning wasn't the first time), even maintaining
position in a group ride without having to concentrate on it too much.
It
takes time and practice, and pushing too fast isn't smart. How fast is
"too fast" varies from person to person of course.

>I'm taking the MSF course in July, so we'll see how it goes.   In the

I'm signed up for the ERC in May...I'm looking forward to finding out
what
I'm doing right, and, more importantly, what I'm doing wrong! :-)

>meantime I keep riding with my mentors and I'm getting more skilled and
>confident handling the bike as time goes on.

Keep at it, and   stay safe. Best rule when riding with others: Ride your
own ride. They    can do what they like, but you do what you are confident
you can handle,   not what you might feel pressure to try before you are
really sure you   are ready for it.

In flying they have a saying, "There are old pilots, and bold pilots, but
there are no old bold pilots."

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 20:35:34 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 20:33:30 -0400
Subject: Wet Weather gear
From: Bob McKeithen <bmckeithen@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Moto Port two piece rain suit.
Goretex mittens from LL Bean outlet
Aerostich combat touring boots.

But, I still have not solved the problem of summer rain around here
when the temps and humidity is up. Get as wet from the inside as out.

To echo Paul's comment on touring-- Last summer on my trip to Costa
Rica during the rainy season it rained at least part of 30 out of 34
days. But it was hot enough that I just didn't bother to put the rain
gear on. Just let it soak me because it felt so good!

Bob

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 13 22:10:20 2004
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 2004 22:10:02 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Aki Damme <adamme1@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Wet Weather gear

At 08:33 PM 4/13/2004, Bob McKeithen wrote:
>Moto Port two piece rain suit.
>Goretex mittens from LL Bean outlet
>Aerostich combat touring boots.
>
>But, I still have not solved the problem of summer rain
>around here when the temps and humidity is up. Get as wet
>from the inside as out.
>
>To echo Paul's comment on touring-- Last summer on my trip
>to Costa Rica during the rainy season it rained at least
>part of 30 out of 34 days. But it was hot enough that I
>just didn't bother to put the rain gear on. Just let it
>soak me because it felt so good!
>
>Bob


I bought the Kirkland rain suit at Costco for $30.   Damn
good rainsuit and fine for summer rainstorms.

-aki
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 11:15:42 2004
From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Anyone have a "little" extra money laying around.....
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 11:15:07 -0400


You could buy this for me!

Item 2472904157 on ebay. Check it out. Sweet!

Dan

---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.656 / Virus Database: 421 - Release Date: 4/9/2004


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 11:46:22 2004
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 11:46:13 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Anyone have a "little" extra money laying around.....
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Sure Danny-boy.   As soon as I hit the lottery I'll buy it for you.   ;-)

Scooter (I'll take two please)

In a message dated 4/14/2004 11:15:07 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
danthompson@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>
>   You could buy this for me!
>
>   Item 2472904157 on ebay. Check it out. Sweet!
>
>   Dan
>
>   ---
>   Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>   Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>   Version: 6.0.656 / Virus Database: 421 - Release Date:
>   4/9/2004

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 12:08:24 2004
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 09:08:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Lurking <lurking444@XXXXXX>
Subject: riding in the rain, and being a newbie
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Hello Gentlemen, and Ladies ;)

Ahh, reading John White's digest contribution brought back some recent
memories.

At 01:04 PM 4/13/04 -0400, John White wrote:
>Let me clarify. I think riding in the rain would be fun at times as
well,
>but I don't have the skills/confidence yet to ride in the rain. I
started
>riding in October 03'. Also, I don't have my license yet (have a
permit).
>The thought of the wet ground scares me right now.

I took the MSF class in April of '03, bought my first bike ever in May
'03. It's a
'86
Yamaha Radian 600, pretty much a standard by most definitions. It's a
wonderful
bike btw.
Anyway, the day I picked it up it was drizzling. It was my first venture
out on
the
highway on a motorcycle, but MSF had given me a WONDERFUL education in 2
1/2 days.
Got out
on a two lane by-way and the asphalt was pretty darn wet. Going around
my second
corner,
remember, this is my first time on a motorcycle other than the parking
lot at
Loudoun NOVA
and one time when I was at a friends house in Richmond and rode his bike
down a
gravel
driveway and back, I drifted a little wide and the cold rear tire hit the
brand new
solid
yellow lane markers separating my southbound lane from northbound
traffic.

Well, my rear tire begun to slip but I SAVED it! Yes, that's right,
after 2
minutes on a
public road on my "new" bike I saved (albeit a minor) slip. Anyway, my
heart was
pounding,
but I managed to make it one mile to the next intersection where I
stopped at a gas
station. Then I got to learn the intricacies of re-fueling a bike...
another first
ever
(something they don't go over in MSF class).
Anyway, this is my first ride, but I wanted to get home fairly easily
without
getting lost,
as it was still drizzling lightly. Now, I forgot to mention that I
picked up the
bike in
the rural outskirts of Fredrick, MD. At the time, I lived in Reston VA.
Anyway, I
rode
home via 270 - 495 - 66, for my first ride! Yep, I got balls, and now
that I look
back on
it, it really wasn't very wise, but I didn't have any other big scares on
the way
home,
although my heart was pounding faster the whole way than it ever has
skydiving or
on even
the scariest roller coaster.

After about 5-6K miles in the past 12 months, I' much more confident. My
heart
doesn't
feel like it's going to explode when I put my feet on the pegs and loose
touch with
the
ground. I've dropped the bike one, going about 15 mph in a turn and
(being a
newbie)
hitting the rear brake. Talk about a split second drop. One minute my
bike was
under me,
the next is was on it's slide sliding onto the gravel shoulder while I
was still
proceeding
at 15 mph through the air...

Anyway, I've got lots of other newbie stories, but I thought I'd give you
all yet
another
glimpse into the psyche of a new motorcycle rider. I know I'm not expert
rider
after 6K
miles, but I would say I'm mildly experienced... Just waiting for the
next
challenge as I
commute on these sunny spring days on my '86 Yamaha. (well, we've only
had a few
sunny days
this month, but they'll be more, I'm anxiously awaiting them)

I'll go back to lurking ;)
-Kipp.
=====
"If we had no winter, the spring would not be so pleasant: if we did not
sometimes taste of adversity, prosperity would not be so welcome." -Anne
Bradstreet




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 13:11:53 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: danthompson@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Anyone have a "little" extra money laying around.....
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 13:11:41 -0400

Wow, that's incredible.   I've never seen a sportbike that costs so much!


>From: "Danny Thompson" <danthompson@XXXXXX>
>To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: Anyone have a "little" extra money laying around.....
>Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 11:15:07 -0400
>
>
>You could buy this for me!
>
>Item 2472904157 on ebay. Check it out. Sweet!
>
>Dan
>
>---
>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>Version: 6.0.656 / Virus Database: 421 - Release Date: 4/9/2004
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Persistent heartburn? Check out Digestive Health & Wellness for
information
and advice. http://gerd.msn.com/default.asp

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 13:15:01 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: lurking444@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: riding in the rain, and being a newbie
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 13:14:53 -0400

Sounds definitely like what I'm experiencing.   However, I haven't been
down
yet. Well, with the exception of parking my bike once and I forgot to
place
the kickstand down. Oops. That wasn't bad though except for a bruise on
my
leg, the bike was fine.



>From: Lurking <lurking444@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: riding in the rain, and being a newbie
>Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 09:08:14 -0700 (PDT)
>
>Hello Gentlemen, and Ladies ;)
>
>Ahh, reading John White's digest contribution brought back some recent
>memories.
>
>At 01:04 PM 4/13/04 -0400, John White wrote:
> >Let me clarify. I think riding in the rain would be fun at times as
>well,
> >but I don't have the skills/confidence yet to ride in the rain. I
>started
> >riding in October 03'. Also, I don't have my license yet (have a
>permit).
> >The thought of the wet ground scares me right now.
>
>I took the MSF class in April of '03, bought my first bike ever in May
'03.
> It's a
>'86
>Yamaha Radian 600, pretty much a standard by most definitions. It's a
>wonderful
>bike btw.
>Anyway, the day I picked it up it was drizzling. It was my first
venture
>out on
>the
>highway on a motorcycle, but MSF had given me a WONDERFUL education in 2
>1/2 days.
>Got out
>on a two lane by-way and the asphalt was pretty darn wet. Going around
my
>second
>corner,
>remember, this is my first time on a motorcycle other than the parking
lot
>at
>Loudoun NOVA
>and one time when I was at a friends house in Richmond and rode his bike
>down a
>gravel
>driveway and back, I drifted a little wide and the cold rear tire hit
the
>brand new
>solid
>yellow lane markers separating my southbound lane from northbound
traffic.
>
>Well, my rear tire begun to slip but I SAVED it! Yes, that's right,
after
>2
>minutes on a
>public road on my "new" bike I saved (albeit a minor) slip. Anyway, my
>heart was
>pounding,
>but I managed to make it one mile to the next intersection where I
stopped
>at a gas
>station. Then I got to learn the intricacies of re-fueling a bike...
>another first
>ever
>(something they don't go over in MSF class).
>
>Anyway, this is my first ride, but I wanted to get home fairly easily
>without
>getting lost,
>as it was still drizzling lightly. Now, I forgot to mention that I
picked
>up the
>bike in
>the rural outskirts of Fredrick, MD. At the time, I lived in Reston VA.
>Anyway, I
>rode
>home via 270 - 495 - 66, for my first ride! Yep, I got balls, and now
that
>I look
>back on
>it, it really wasn't very wise, but I didn't have any other big scares
on
>the way
>home,
>although my heart was pounding faster the whole way than it ever has
>skydiving or
>on even
>the scariest roller coaster.
>
>After about 5-6K miles in the past 12 months, I' much more confident.
My
>heart
>doesn't
>feel like it's going to explode when I put my feet on the pegs and loose
>touch with
>the
>ground. I've dropped the bike one, going about 15 mph in a turn and
(being
>a
>newbie)
>hitting the rear brake. Talk about a split second drop. One minute my
>bike was
>under me,
>the next is was on it's slide sliding onto the gravel shoulder while I
was
>still
>proceeding
>at 15 mph through the air...
>
>Anyway, I've got lots of other newbie stories, but I thought I'd give
you
>all yet
>another
>glimpse into the psyche of a new motorcycle rider. I know I'm not
expert
>rider
>after 6K
>miles, but I would say I'm mildly experienced... Just waiting for the
next
>challenge as I
>commute on these sunny spring days on my '86 Yamaha. (well, we've only
had
>a few
>sunny days
>this month, but they'll be more, I'm anxiously awaiting them)
>
>I'll go back to lurking ;)
>-Kipp.
>
>=====
>"If we had no winter, the spring would not be so pleasant: if we did not
>sometimes taste of adversity, prosperity would not be so welcome." -Anne
>Bradstreet
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
>http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>

_________________________________________________________________
Limited-time offer: Fast, reliable MSN 9 Dial-up Internet access FREE for
2
months!
http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup&pgmarket=en-
us&ST=1/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 18:36:36 2004
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 18:36:21 -0400
From: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
To: Concours Owners Group <cog@XXXXXX>,
   DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Fw: Saving the Best For Last- Shameless Plug

 From Rick Miller, RallyMaster for the
Mason Dixon 20-20. There is not much
time left if you want to ride.

Horkster
======================================

This is a shameless plug for the Mason Dixon 20-20
rally.

Bummed that there is no ButtLite?
Depressed your entry didn't get selected for the IBR
draw?
Got the itch to go riding, somewhere, anywhere?
Want a good chance to meet Leon Begeman and his
legendary IBR Ninja 250 somewhere in the mid-atlantic?
(it'll be worth a lot of points too)
Why not ride in the MD2020.

If you are on the fence about entering, it's time to
count your chickens or get off the pot. Tomorrow,
April 15- Tax Day, is the registration deadline for
the 5th annual MD2020. All entries must be postmarked
or entered online by midnight tomorrow, EDT. Due to
production commitments, the deadline can not be
extended.

What will this year bring? purchasing handbaskets for
the ride to Hell? taking pictures of Uranus? buying
cigars at the Conch Republic Tobacco Company? Will
the winning route actually go through Nebraska? Only
your hairdresser knows for sure.

end shamless plug,
rick

=====
MSL(CM )B™) PDL Minister
"Enjoy every sandwich."- Warren Zevon 1947-2003

"Satire is protected as free speech, even if the person being satired
doesn't get it." Al Franken- 3/31/04
Join Us http://www.md2020.org - The Games People Play
01 ZG- Mr Freeze; 03 GL- Hmmbee

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 18:55:58 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: riding in the rain, and being a newbie
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 18:55:47 -0400
> ... My heart doesn't feel like it's going to explode
> when I put my feet on the pegs and loose touch with the
> ground.

Strange - after 40+ years of riding, mine still does.

From happiness   :-)

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 14 20:38:18 2004
Date: Wed, 14 Apr 2004 20:36:17 -0400
Subject: lurking new rider
From: Bob McKeithen <bmckeithen@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Don't ever lose that feeling of wonder, respect and rational fear. It
will serve you well. Actually your first ride home may have been a good
idea. MSF teaches the most likely place for conflict is at
intersections. If you don't count on ramps then you had no
intersections. (grin)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 08:49:47 2004
From: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Cc: "'lurking444@XXXXXX'" <lurking444@XXXXXX>
Subject: Hello Gentlemen, and Ladies ;)
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 08:55:41 -0400

Lurking opined, "Ahh, reading John White's digest contribution brought
back
some recent memories."

[Carl]:
And reading your posts brought memories of my first years (including
dropping the bike because the kickstand was up whilst I ogled a fine
example
of femininity in some oh-so-well fitting shorts. Moral: Don't get
distracted; it could be fatal.)

A couple of thoughts on mid-80's bikes.
1. Tires:
You bought the bike used. Dunno how old the tires are but after tires
are
4-5 years old - even with lotsa tread - you should consider replacing
them.

The bonuses are:
   New tires rock! (after scrubbing them in natch.)
   Wet road traction is better.
Some mid eighties bike can be fitted with radial tires (My 85 Sabre has
Dunlop 205's, others have Avons). Check with the Radian or whatever
newsgroup for advice and experiences.
    The con is expense. A set of new tires runs ~$200 buying them mail
order and mounting them yourself (Ask around for help) ~$300 mounted at a
dealer -- but -- <broken record> Check out deals at the local Open Houses
in
the Spring and Fall </broken record>. In any case, new tires are cheap
health and life insurance.

2. Brakes:
Change the brake fluid at least every other year. If it ain't clear, it
needs changing.
OEM brake lines get flabby with age (just like our bodies). Consider
replacing them with stainless braided lines.
Several folks, e.g. Galfer, sell sets for ~$100. Or, you can make 'em up
yourself. I got the materials (four banjoes, seven feet of #3 line, and
a
bag of washers) for $70. <www.bakerprecision.com> and <
www.truechoice.com>


3. Learn to do it yourself:
See recent tool thread. Good tools aren't cheap, cheap tools aren't
worth
it.
Get a manual Yamaha, Clymer's, or Haynes. Read it, consult it, ask for
advice and help. Most of us started out unskilled, inexperienced and
ignorant. Some of us are now at least experienced. 8^P

4. Rain gear:
For those still in denial the cheap vinyl rain gear will work fine when
it's
reasonably warm. It'll fall apart like a Vegas stripper's outfit when
it's
cold. Coated cloth works best. After a few years riding, you'll realize
the cost of a 'Stich is well worth it.

Carl in Bethesda
Commuting into your nation's capital since 1981 through sun, rain, over
snow, and around road ragers.
'85 VF700S (Rocin-ahorito); '83 VF700F (666);
'97 Aerostich Roadcrafter (Fred the Red); '02 JR Phoenix: (Amarillo Joe)
Don't need no loud pipes; I got big honking tooters:
http://members.tripod.com/~v65_magna/sos_99/sat_lunch2.jpg
http://www.crosswinds.net/~denbrook/Motorcycles/Events/mmc-2-17-
01/Carls_Sab
re.jpg


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 08:52:06 2004
Subject: Morning
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 15 Apr 2004 08:48:41 -0400

Nice little ride this morning. Happy to not see any rain. Big hello to
all the guys on the road this morning. Missed you these past couple of
days :-)

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 08:56:47 2004
Subject: Bump!
From: Carl Schelin <cschelin@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: 15 Apr 2004 08:53:26 -0400

I must have hit one of the newly paved bumps in Springfield pretty hard
sometime this past week. There's a bit of fork fluid spillage behind my
left fork. Good thing I'll be putting her away for a week or so soon.
I'll have to get this fixed when we get to Denver.

Carl

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 10:18:34 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 07:18:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>
Subject: Ebay Sniping?
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

A few weeks back someone mentioned a ebay sniping
service they like/use? Any recommendations? I've
found some mc gear I'd like to bid on, and thought I'd
give it a try.

Thanks,

Brian




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 10:26:06 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 10:25:58 -0400

I use BitTamer

www.bidtamer.com

works very well and easy to use. You don't have to download their
application, it can all be run via your browser. Opt for the $8.95
monthly charge to allow unlimited bids and modifiable seconds to snipe
before end of auction.
I like the online snipe software because I don't have to be concerned
with my local internet speed and don't have to have my pc on for it to
work since it all runs from their site, not my pc.

I bid on 6 items in the past week and won all of them.


-aki

>
>   From: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/15 Thu AM 10:18:23 EDT
>   To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>   Subject: Ebay Sniping?
>
>   A few weeks back someone mentioned a ebay sniping
>   service they like/use? Any recommendations? I've
>   found some mc gear I'd like to bid on, and thought I'd
>   give it a try.
>
>   Thanks,
>
>   Brian
>
>
>
>
>   __________________________________
>   Do you Yahoo!?
>   Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
>   http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 10:42:44 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 07:42:40 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: adamme1@XXXXXX, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?




-----Original Message-----
From: adamme1@XXXXXX

I use BitTamer

www.bidtamer.com
works very well and easy to use. You don't have to download their
application, it can all be run via your browser. Opt for the $8.95
monthly charge to allow unlimited bids and modifiable seconds to snipe
before end of auction.

I like the online snipe software because I don't have to be concerned
with my local internet speed and don't have to have my pc on for it to
work since it all runs from their site, not my pc.

I bid on 6 items in the past week and won all of them.


-aki

>
> From: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>
>
> A few weeks back someone mentioned a ebay sniping
> service they like/use? >
> Thanks,
>
> Brian
>
------

I use eSnipe.   eSnipe only assesses fees when you "win."

In addition to Aki's comments, I prefer sniping because it prevents
emotional overbidding and cuts down on bidding wars. Set your best price
and forget it. It also tends to keep prices down, because you're not
revealing your interest in a item until the closing seconds of an
auction.




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 10:50:43 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 10:50:36 -0400

>>
> I use eSnipe. eSnipe only assesses fees when you "win."
>
> In addition to Aki's comments, I prefer sniping because it prevents
emotional overbidding and cuts down on bidding wars. Set your best price
and forget it. It also tends to keep prices down, because you're not
revealing your interest in a item until the closing seconds of an
auction.
>


I believe I looked at esnipe. Aren't they the ones that just recently
went to a fee based service? The reason I went with Bidtamer is because
it's free unless you want unlimited bids (I believe they limit you in the
free version to 3 auctions a week), where esnipe charges you a percentage
of the winning bid. The higher the winning bid, the more it will cost
you. I read some dejanews posts about, (IIRC esnipe) and everyone liked
it but dumped it when they went with their odd pricing scheme. Everyone
jumped over to bidtamer since it's still free.

But I agree, whatever sniping program you go with, definately go with one
that doesn't run on your desktop.


-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 10:57:25 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 10:57:15 -0400
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?

> But I agree, whatever sniping program you go with, definately go with
one that doesn't run on your desktop.

I like Auction Sniper (http://www.auctionsniper.com). They give you some
free snipes to start with, too!

-Sean

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 11:30:33 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 08:29:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

and this naive fool gets bent when something I want gets sniped out
from under me with seconds left. sniping is IMO not playing nice and
abusing the rules. I expect (hope!) ebay will kill snipers by
preventing bids from first time bidders on an auction item say within
1hr of auction close. I don't buy Paul's explanation about sniping
reduces engaging in emotinally-charged bidding. ebay has from the get
go had a bid-auto-increment feature where you set your max bid and it
bids on your behalf until your max is reached. Obviously nothing is
'won' till the bell sounds but sniping in it's current form needs to go
away.

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)
* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 11:32:14 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 11:31:53 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?


I understand about the time constraints ... but man, there is *nothing*
like firing off a sub-five second snipe with the mouse and reveling in
the knowledge that the guy who was trying to low-ball the item is
cursing your name :-D

- Roach


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 11:46:21 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: sean@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 11:46:11 -0400

If it's something I really want, I snipe. I'm guilty. I do it to old
fashioned way to. No sniping service for me. However, when I snipe, I
do
so with the highest amount I'm willing to pay. That way, like someone
mentioned before, it hides my interest in the item till the end. I do
hate
when newbies bid and beat me out though. You know they usually end up
being
deadbeat bidders. I do agree that newbies shouldn't be allowed to bid in
the last hour or half hour of an auction.


>From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
>To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
>Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 10:57:15 -0400
>
>>But I agree, whatever sniping program you go with, definately go with
one
>>that doesn't run on your desktop.
>
>I like Auction Sniper (http://www.auctionsniper.com). They give you some
>free snipes to start with, too!
>
>-Sean
>
_________________________________________________________________
Persistent heartburn? Check out Digestive Health & Wellness for
information
and advice. http://gerd.msn.com/default.asp

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 11:48:09 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 08:48:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: Leon Begeman <mriderleon@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX> wrote:
> and this naive fool gets bent when something I want
> gets sniped out
> from under me with seconds left. sniping is IMO not
> playing nice and
> abusing the rules. I expect (hope!) ebay will kill
> snipers by
> preventing bids from first time bidders on an
> auction item say within
> 1hr of auction close.

I also use ESnipe.

Implementing Matts suggestion is fine with me. Here's
how the scenario would change: I enter the current
minimum bid when I look at the item, then immediately
enter my normal ESnipe bid. Ebay lists me as a
bidder, ESnipe still wins the auction for me.

I know what I'm willing to pay, and I bid that amount.
 The only auctions I'm preventing anyone from winning
are those that are obviously underpriced. I don't
know what anyones bid is when I put in my ESnipe bid,
all I'm doing is ensuring it gets sold at or above
what I'm willing to bid for it. The rules are the the
same for everyone.

Leon Begeman




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 11:57:22 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 11:56:56 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?

matthew patton wrote:

> and this naive fool gets bent when something I want gets sniped out
> from under me with seconds left.

Then you didn't bid enough. The sniping had nothing to do with your
losing the auction.

eBay is a proxy bidding system. *When* you bid is irrelivent, the amount
you bid is. It is not intended to be a "going going gone" system where
you react to the other bidders. You are supposed to bid ONCE, and bid
the MAX you are willing to pay for the item. This is exactly what
sniping is - a late bid that no one can manually react to should it be
higher than their max bid.

If you had bid more than the sniper with your earlier proxy bid, you
would have won the auction. Period. Snipers do not know how much your
max bid is. If the current high bid (yours) is $4, and I snipe with a
max bid of $5, and your earlier proxy bid had a max of $6, you win. You
were willing to pay more for the item than I was.

What sniping prevents (to the sniper) is someone called a "nibbler"
raising the price of the item. "nibblers" will return to an auction time
and time again, bidding up the price to one increment over the highest
bidder. It's a stupid practice, but *millions* of bidders do this. If no
one else bids, they don't "nibble" up the price.

It also prevents shill bidding. The seller's friend can't react to your
bid.

*always* bid the most you are willing to pay. If you don't care about
nibblers and shill bidders, bid whenever you want. If you lose, you know
the other guy paid too much :)

- Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 12:13:32 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:13:01 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?




-----Original Message-----
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>

and this naive fool gets bent when something I want gets sniped out
from under me with seconds left. sniping is IMO not playing nice and
abusing the rules. I expect (hope!) ebay will kill snipers by
preventing bids from first time bidders on an auction item say within
1hr of auction close. I don't buy Paul's explanation about sniping
reduces engaging in emotinally-charged bidding. ebay has from the get
go had a bid-auto-increment feature where you set your max bid and it
bids on your behalf until your max is reached. Obviously nothing is
'won' till the bell sounds but sniping in it's current form needs to go
away.

-------------

Matt, it sounds like what you really want from an auction is the
functional equivalent of a discount retail experience. Nothing wrong
with that, as long as you're prepared to "lose" quite a few auctions.
Unfortunately, discount retail experiences are not in the nature of
auctions for things that are way underpriced. In this day and age of
widespread broadband service, I see no material difference in Brian
Roach's "self-sniping" versus my "auto sniping." Only difference is I
don't have to be plopped in front of the 'puter when the auction closes,
and I pay a fee for the privilege. More importantly, I don't get sucked
into a bidding war, should my "sniped" price get outbid in the closing
*hours* of an auction, which does happen quite a bit, if I'm in bargain
hunting mode. Does this mean I get outbid a lot? Yep, but I'm not over-
paying either and I'm a very patient person. :)




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 12:34:09 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 09:34:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

sniping is to me akin to a bolt-of-lightning coming out of the blue. In
any kind of "traditional" auction (auto, product, estate, farm) the
participating parties are very much in evidence and quite known to each
other. All those interested in the item can verify the interest levels
of the parties by watching the bid process. if at "going, going," and
about to hit the gavel somebody says "$XXX" the parties who thought the
matter was settled get pretty annoyed. Sometimes the sniper gets the
boot from the auctioneer but if not at least the parties get a chance
to assess their bids, how much they really want it, how much of a
premium over their value assessment makes sense (if any), and respond
accordingly.

IMO the online equivalent should occur. If you're interested enough to
bid on an item, bid on it in an upfront manner instead of gaming the
system. It used to be that ebay auto-extended an auction by 10 minutes
(or something) after the last bid before the time was up so all parties
could react if they were on-line. I guess they quit doing that which is
what has led to sniping. Putting a cap on when new bidders can enter an
auction (I don't mean low-karma ebay identities, I mean persons placing
a bid for the first time on something) help cut down on seller's friend
preventing a sale at the last second, and locks out malicious bidders.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 12:47:44 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:47:31 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

I agree. I think sniping should not be allowed on auction sites. I'm
sure there's a way of telling whether or not the user actually bid or
used sniping software. I hate bidding on something and then get outbid
in the last few seconds. I guess that's why I don't bid on much anymore.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/15/2004 11:29:52 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
pattonme@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> and this naive fool gets bent when something I want gets sniped out
> from under me with seconds left. sniping is IMO not playing nice and
> abusing the rules. I expect (hope!) ebay will kill snipers by
> preventing bids from first time bidders on an auction item say within
> 1hr of auction close. I don't buy Paul's explanation about sniping
> reduces engaging in emotinally-charged bidding. ebay has from the get
> go had a bid-auto-increment feature where you set your max bid and it
> bids on your behalf until your max is reached. Obviously nothing is
> 'won' till the bell sounds but sniping in it's current form needs to go
away.
>
> =====
> "If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
> not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
> -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)
>
> * A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
> the right person.
>
> * Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its
> stated intent.
> -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 12:48:49 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:48:32 -0400
>
> From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/15 Thu AM 11:29:52 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
>
> and this naive fool gets bent when something I want gets sniped out
> from under me with seconds left. sniping is IMO not playing nice and
> abusing the rules. I expect (hope!) ebay will kill snipers by
> preventing bids from first time bidders on an auction item say within
> 1hr of auction close. I don't buy Paul's explanation about sniping
> reduces engaging in emotinally-charged bidding. ebay has from the get
> go had a bid-auto-increment feature where you set your max bid and it
> bids on your behalf until your max is reached. Obviously nothing is
> 'won' till the bell sounds but sniping in it's current form needs to go
away.
>


Read ebays FAQ, they specifically address sniping:

From their policies section:

*********************************

 Someone bid on an item I was bidding on at the very last second and won
it! Is this allowed?



Yes, it is.

Within the eBay Community, this practice is called "sniping" and it means
to place a high bid in the closing seconds of an auction-style listing.

As frustrating as it can be to lose an item you really wanted, sniping is
part of the eBay experience, and all bids placed before a listing ends
are valid - even if they're placed only one second before the listing
ends.

One way to help avoid disappointment is to ensure that the maximum bid
you enter on the item page is the highest price that you're willing to
pay. The eBay system automatically increases your bid up to the maximum
price you specify, so entering a higher maximum may help prevent you from
being outbid in the closing seconds of a listing.

***********************************


Complaining about someone using snipe software, to me, is
no dumber than complaining that someone has a faster
internet connection than you do. Everyone can use sniping software and
in fact, ebay has no issue with it. You're only going to win if you have
a high enough max bid anyway.
-aki

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 12:50:23 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:49:37 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?

matthew patton wrote:

>
>IMO the online equivalent should occur. If you're interested enough to
>bid on an item, bid on it in an upfront manner instead of gaming the
>system.
>
I used to believe the same thing, until Brian showed me that sniping
works a lot better. And I've won everything I've bid on since.

Laura

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 12:54:38 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:54:26 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

OK, when you explain it that way, it makes sense. :-) Still don't like
auto-snipers though. If it's something I really want the I usually am
on-line for the closing minutes. Otherwise, I place my max bid on eBay
and let the chips fall. It just irks me when I am the only bidder and
then I get taken out in the last minute by a sniper. ;-)

Scooter (moving target)

In a message dated 4/15/2004 11:56:56 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
roach@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> matthew patton wrote:
>
> > and this naive fool gets bent when something I want gets sniped out
> > from under me with seconds left.
>
> Then you didn't bid enough. The sniping had nothing to do with your
> losing the auction.
>
> eBay is a proxy bidding system. *When* you bid is irrelivent, the
amount
> you bid is. It is not intended to be a "going going gone" system where
> you react to the other bidders. You are supposed to bid ONCE, and bid
> the MAX you are willing to pay for the item. This is exactly what
> sniping is - a late bid that no one can manually react to should it be
> higher than their max bid.
>
> If you had bid more than the sniper with your earlier proxy bid, you
> would have won the auction. Period. Snipers do not know how much your
> max bid is. If the current high bid (yours) is $4, and I snipe with a
> max bid of $5, and your earlier proxy bid had a max of $6, you win. You
> were willing to pay more for the item than I was.
>
> What sniping prevents (to the sniper) is someone called a "nibbler"
> raising the price of the item. "nibblers" will return to an auction
time
> and time again, bidding up the price to one increment over the highest
> bidder. It's a stupid practice, but *millions* of bidders do this. If
no
> one else bids, they don't "nibble" up the price.
>
> It also prevents shill bidding. The seller's friend can't react to your
bid.
>
> *always* bid the most you are willing to pay. If you don't care about
> nibblers and shill bidders, bid whenever you want. If you
> lose, you know
> the other guy paid too much :)
>
> - Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:04:14 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:04:06 -0400

>
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
> Date: 2004/04/15 Thu PM 12:54:26 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
>
> OK, when you explain it that way, it makes sense. :-) Still don't
like auto-snipers though. If it's something I really want the I usually
am on-line for the closing minutes. Otherwise, I place my max bid on
eBay and let the chips fall. It just irks me when I am the only bidder
and then I get taken out in the last minute by a sniper. ;-)
>
> Scooter (moving target)
>


I understand your frustration. I've lost auctions because of sniping
until I started to use it as well.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:19:34 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:19:30 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: adamme1@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping?



-----Original Message-----
From: adamme1@XXXXXX


>
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
>
> OK, when you explain it that way, it makes sense.   :-)   Still don't
like auto-snipers though.
>
> Scooter (moving target)
>


I understand your frustration. I've lost auctions because of sniping
until I started to use it as well.

-------------

I guess I'm trying to see who's being harmed here, except those who bid
too low on "sleeper" items that appear to be garnering little interest.
I dare say the auction house (who is, after all, acting as the seller's
agent) has little incentive to change the rules to facilitate your desire
to pay less than what another buyer is willing to pay.

Bid as much as you want to pay, by your prefered method.    That way you
"win" every time, whether you get the item or not.




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:34:12 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 10:33:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX


--- ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> max bid on eBay and let the chips fall. It just irks me when I am
> the only bidder and then I get taken out in the last minute by a
> sniper. ;-)
which was the point I made specifically in the 2nd post. Sniping has
come about because ebay changed their policies. I don't remember when
they changed but auctions used to be auto-extended and would not close
if bidding was actively occuring within the window. IMO ebay did their
users a considerable disservice by stopping that functionality. WHEN
you bid used to also be VITALLY important. If the two of you had
identical max bid's the person who initially bid on the item got the
nod. That feature probably still exists.

A bidding atmosphere is supposed to give the community a better idea as
to something's valuation. If I undervalued something (intentially or
unintentionally) then when somebody (or multiple) out-bid me then I
either realize it's not as cheap as I was hoping to get away with and
then make a more realistic bid. Sniping prevents the feedback loop and
robs other interested parties of a chance to respond with a markup
commensurate with their "desire" level.

For example a Muzzy full exhuast for a ZR-7 (not exactly a popular
bike) had absolutely no bids on it for 5+ days. and then suddenly went
for like $550 in the final seconds (MSRP ~$700). No, I wasn't bidding.
For 5 days interest was most assuredly there, just lurking in the
shadows. And that's not right. The auction has ceased to be transparent
and therein lies the problem. Auctions and markets are supposed to be
transparent. It has now become who can better guess what price it could
go for and get their snipe in within the allotted time.

No, ebay can't tell who's sniping and who's not aside from having a
good idea based on when the POST operation (hmm GET's might work too)
was attempted (well, they do know the source IP and could filter out
connections from the known snipe hosts). Another way to kill sniping is
to embed a changing hidden field in the page that has a timeout window.
But that would be too expensive in CPU time to be worthwhile. A rule
along the lines of my 1hr suggestion is far easier to implement and
fair.

Ebay very much used to be a "going, going, gone" system. But in the
digital world the 'proxy' bid is the only obvious way to implement it.

> > What sniping prevents (to the sniper) is someone called a "nibbler"

not at all. proxy-bidding reacts just fine to 'nibblers'. Sniping was
created/facilitated when ebay killed off the "going, going, gone" and
basically robbed the market of it's transparency. nibblers while
annnoying (and dumb, as in not understanding the concept of proxy
bidding) are in fact 'honest' in that they are reacting (albeit
reluctantly) to the rising price and their activity is visible. If a
nibbler bumps their bid .50 and loses to a person who is proxy-bidding
they are informed of that immediately, and the rest of the community
biding on the item is mercifully spared the constant change in status.
Well, till the highest proxy-bidder is outbid by a nibbler.

Killing nibblers is easy: you get a max of say 3 bids on an item. Ditto
shillers who will get caught by the same drag-net but at least you know
the shiller exists. Ebay has ceased to be 'fair' because they don't
enforce market transparency and pricing feedback and don't likewise
force the use of proxy-bidding.

Ever the bargain hunter I sometimes contact sellers with product
getting 0 bids after close and offer to buy at a reduced price.
Sometimes it works (got chains and brake pads at a decent price), other
times they tell me to shove off and promptly relist it hoping somebody
agrees with their original valuation.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:37:52 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:37:45 -0400

esnipe.com

works for me

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:40:13 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:40:03 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping? Bike related?

Great day for a ride.   Lunchtime wind was howling in Reston, perfect for
a
back road escape.

___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:41:17 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:40:53 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
CC: adamme1@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?

Paul Wilson wrote:

>>From: adamme@XXXXXX
>I understand your frustration. I've lost auctions because of sniping
until I started to use it as well.

No, you lost auctions because your max bid was too low, and someone else
bid a higher max :)

If you had sniped in one of these autions you lost (instead of bidding
early) with the same MAX bid, the outcome would have been the same - you
would have lost to the other sniper with a higher MAX bid.

Snipers don't automatically win. Time has no effect on the auction. You
only win if your MAX bid is higher than everyone else's.

> From Paul Wilson
>
> I guess I'm trying to see who's being harmed here, except those who bid
too low on "sleeper" items that appear to be garnering little interest.
I dare say the auction house (who is, after all, acting as the seller's
agent) has little incentive to change the rules to facilitate your desire
to pay less than what another buyer is willing to pay.
>
> Bid as much as you want to pay, by your prefered method. That way you
"win" every time, whether you get the item or not.

Exactly. The only people who are upset by snipers are those who are
trying to low-ball an item. You should bid your "true MAX" - the
absolute most you are willing to pay for a given item. When you place
the bid doesn't matter. If someone outbids you, then they were willing
to pay more. If you would have "reacted" to their bid ... then you
didn't bid your "true MAX".

- Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:42:06 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:41:59 -0400

> ebay has from the get
> go had a bid-auto-increment feature where you set your max bid and it
> bids on your behalf until your max is reached.

And you go away and someone else stays up until 03:00 and chews at your
proxy bid until they take the article for 50 cents more that your proxy.

eBay isn't a game - it's business. I will either use the "Buy it now"
feature or esnipe.

Michael J.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:50:28 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <ScooterFZR@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:50:21 -0400

>It just irks me when I am the only bidder and
>then I get taken out in the last minute by a sniper.

If you check, you will usually see three or four snipers in there at the
emd.

Michael J.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 13:54:11 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:42:35 -0400

Can somebody snipe me a new Delete key?   This thread has claimed another
one.

;)

Bike news....picked mine up from the shop today.   Now it's time to order
some parts!

Rob
'98 VFR800 (soon to be good as used!)

_________________________________________________________________
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Premium!
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us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 14:02:29 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 11:02:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sally Wood <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>
Subject: Cicadas
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
cicadas in '87? I know they're harmless but I am
curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
in...what's the splat-factor?).

Sally
'01 YZF600R




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 14:26:54 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 11:26:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Adam Reinhardt <ajreinhardt@XXXXXX>
Subject: E-bay "sniping"
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Now that I've started selling m/c parts on eBay, I've
seen the positive side of proxy bidding.

Take this example:

I listed a Honda Hurricane Corbin Seat three weeks ago
and it sold for $93. The winning bidder never payed
(!), so I relisted it.

Last week, the same eaxt seat sold for $270. Two
people drove up the price by both selecting very high
maximum bids, thinking that no one would bid up that
high and they would win over any last minute bids in
the $90-100 range. Unfortunately for them, and
fortunately for me, they played against each other and
the seat sold for more than twice what it should have.
 Oh, and this time I was payed!


Adam

89   CBR 600
91   GS500 (track)
89   GS500 (for sale)
94   GS500 (in pieces)




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 14:28:19 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 14:28:14 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas

At 02:02 PM 4/15/2004, you wrote:
>Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
>cicadas in '87? I know they're harmless but I am
>curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
>in...what's the splat-factor?).

Impact is the correct word. They hurt quite a bit. I will sort of feel
sorry for the squids come May this year. And anyone without a full face
helmet.

I was in high school last time around, doing mostly off road riding and
commuting to school on an '87 Hurricane. Several times the bugs left
large
red welts on my hand hanging out of the car window. They never hurt me
through my leather jacket on bike, nor at slow speed in the dirt. Nasty
welts on my neck under the full face though. And very messy, a glove
wipe
only makes you blind :-/



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 14:56:02 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 14:59:54 -0400
Subject: Re: Cicadas
To: Sally Wood <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: "garcia oliver" <garicao@XXXXXX>

Sally Wood <swood_yzf@XXXXXX> writes:
>Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
>cicadas in '87? I know they're harmless but I am
>curious about how they may impact our riding fun

The impact hurts.



>(as
>in...what's the splat-factor?).

Hard to see thru a layer of squished bug.   Also, there can be enough of
them to make the road slippery.

--garcia
)B―Why of course the people don't want war ... But after all it is the
leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it is always a
simple
matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist
dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship ... Voice or
no
voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders.
That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked,
and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the
country
to danger.)B‖ — Hermann Goering, Nazi leader, at the Nurnberg Trials
after
World War II

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 15:03:41 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:03:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Brian, you're beating the wrong horse. The point is the auctions have
ceased to be open and transparent which is a basic and fundamental
tenant of many/most auctions (they are exceptions like silent auctions
and blind auctions). Ebay has never forced proxy-bidding on it's users.
They *SHOULD*.

Ebay's customers are neither buyers or sellers but both. It is in their
interest to encourage a transaction taking place to conclusion. Indeed
looking at how ebay charges for it's services they get money no matter
if the item sells. so in some sense the more they can cause an item to
fail to sell and have it relisted, the more money they can collect.
Balanced obviously against the sellers deciding to take their offerings
elsewhere so it's not much of a margin to mess with.

Snipe or not, yes I lost the auctions because my MAX was lower than
somebody else's MAX. That's not the problem. My beef is with the lack
of transparency and price feedback. Ebay has degenerated into a
guessing game and bet hedging. Not unlike playing the spot market or
making margin calls in the dark. Even betting/gambling allow all kinds
of adjustments in the market price as the event is progressing. Ebay
has taken time and fluctuation out, or in othe words, self-correction
is non-existant any more. This is wrong.

You're a stock man, if you put a sell order in at 9am for AOL stock at
$23 (say that's $1 more than yesturday's close) to be acted upon at
16:59:59 today and at 12:20 somebody wanted to buy a million shares and
the selling price went up to $32, wouldn't you want to know that and
try to sell your shares at the higher price? Or are you going to tell
me you'd perfectly happy at your pricepoint when you could have made
$9/share more if you only knew about it? Sniping is holding the buy
order off till 16:59:59 and getting a steal on AOL shares be they yours
or some other poor slob who put his sell price at $21. None of the
participants has any idea what the value of AOL stock is all day long,
who has how many shares to sell/buy and at what price until the final
ticker is punched. Even NASDAQ doesn't engage in such a rediculous
setup.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 15:38:28 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 15:38:17 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Well....I wasn't on a bike at that time but, the splat factor in a car
was high. I think I wore out 2 or 3 sets of windshield wipers. =8-0 I
can only imagine what it's going to be like on a bike. Note to self, buy
small bottle of cleaner for visor. ;-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/15/2004 2:02:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
swood_yzf@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>   Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
>   cicadas in '87? I know they're harmless but I am
>   curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
>   in...what's the splat-factor?).
>
>   Sally
>   '01 YZF600R

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 15:46:52 2004
From: "Dave Yates" <Dave@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 15:48:31 -0400
X-ELNK-Trace:
956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79c90cc186aa76c3c4b7d3202db
b0432ec350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c

Sally asks:
> Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
> cicadas in '87? I know they're harmless but I am
> curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
> in...what's the splat-factor?).

[Dave] I was also in HS back in 87, I recall them being quite loud, but
not
hopping around on every square inch of soil. I cannot comment on the SpF
but given their ballistic coefficient, wear gear. Good gear. Stich
miminum, full face helmet....


Dave Y
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 15:50:26 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 15:42:45 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>, adamme1@XXXXXX,
   DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?

At 07:42 AM 4/15/04 -0700, Paul Wilson wrote:

>I use eSnipe. eSnipe only assesses fees when you "win."
<snip>
> It also tends to keep prices down, because you're not revealing your
interest in a item until the closing seconds of an auction.

One major reason why such software is likely to be short-lived. E-Bay,
and, more importantly, their sellers, make their money on exactly the
things that this sort of service eliminates. As soon as it becomes
widely
used, e-bay will be looking for ways to render it useless. The
alternative
is unhappy buyers (you'll *have* to use that stuff to play at all, and
then
the prices will start to climb for the service) and sellers (lower sale
prices), and reduced profits for e-bay.

There are several ways I can think of almost immediately for making
software like that worthless. I suspect e-bay is looking into it
already.
If this was a discussion list for internet software, I'd go into it more,
but since it's a moto list, I'll stop here.



-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 15:50:52 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Cicadas
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 15:50:29 -0400


>
>   From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
>   Date: 2004/04/15 Thu PM 03:38:17 EDT
>   To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>   Subject: Re: Cicadas
>
> Well....I wasn't on a bike at that time but, the splat factor in a car
was high. I think I wore out 2 or 3 sets of windshield wipers. =8-0 I
can only imagine what it's going to be like on a bike. Note to self, buy
small bottle of cleaner for visor. ;-)
>
> Scooter
>


..all I can say is that during a two week period it got so bad that I
just gave up riding totally. I saw huge dark clouds of those suckers
coming at me and by the time I got home, I was literaly covered from head
to toe with bug juice.

-aki

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 15:59:02 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 15:59:00 -0400
To: Sally Wood <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas

At 11:02 AM 4/15/04 -0700, Sally Wood wrote:
>Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
>cicadas in '87?

Yes.   Probably several of us.

>I know they're harmless but I am
>curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
>in...what's the splat-factor?).

I got one in the chest going through Rock Creek Park on the beltway
(between Georgia and Connecticut exits). I was (luckilly) wearing my
heavy
leather jacket, so I didn't get a bruise, and it didn't splatter...just
bounced. Whether it would have splattered if it had hit something
harder,
like my face shield, I don't know. If it had, visibility would have been
sharply reduced...

They had more impact on walking then on riding for me last time.      They
were
everywhere...watch your step!


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:05:37 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:05:15 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas




-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>

Sally asks:
> Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
> cicadas in '87? I know they're harmless but I am
> curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
> in...what's the splat-factor?).

[Dave] I was also in HS back in 87, I recall them being quite loud, but
not
hopping around on every square inch of soil. I cannot comment on the SpF
but given their ballistic coefficient, wear gear. Good gear. Stich
miminum, full face helmet....


Dave Y

---------------------

Fascinating creatures. Supposed the periodic cicadas of the Eastern US
have the longest cycle of any insect in the world. Hey: we're number
one! The little critters (larvae) live underground for seventeen years,
feeding on tree roots. If your trees are less than 17 years old: no
cicadas. They emerge, fly around a bit, mate, the males die after
mating, and the females go on to lay eggs on twigs. They tend not to fly
around much more than is necessary to accomplish these tasks. Note to
the squeamish, expect to see thousands of cicada corpses all over the
ground when they die.

Like Dave Y. sez, I just remember them being loud, but not a menace to
navigation.   They certainly can't be worse than big honking
grasshoppers. Riding through Kansas last year, those things are
noticeable when they hit at speed, even through my boots and Motoport.
And the front of the bike was covered in grasshopper guts. I would say:
woe unto the under-dressed squid. Or, I guess I should say: add that to
the under-dressed squid's woes.

See http://www.cicadamania.com
Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:05:41 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:05:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Bike related?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX


--- Troutman <mike@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Great day for a ride. Lunchtime wind was howling in Reston, perfect
for
> a
> back road escape.

I'm looking forward to the ride home. Three days of rain hasn't dampened
my riding enjoyment.

I'm out the door in a few minutes with one day left here at the office.
I've closed out mailing lists, shut down my personal web site, and
deleted
all files older than my last backup.

Tomorrow I'll snag the newest files and bookmarks, make sure the last of
the lists have acknowledged, delete my accounts and head over to the
after
work party in my honor. If you're in the area, feel free to drop by. 322
Mass.Ave NE, aka Cafe Berlin, about two blocks east of Union Station.
We'll be there from 3pm until we decide to go home.

Ride safe.

Carl

=====
02 Harley FXSTI
95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
76 Honda Chopper (in progress)




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:10:06 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 15:10:04 -0500
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Sean Jordan <eternity23@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
This is supposed to be a rather big emergence, too.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/03/0329_040329_cicadas.html

- Sean Jordan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:12:52 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:12:43 -0400
From: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
CC: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas

Paul Wilson wrote:

> Like Dave Y. sez, I just remember them being loud,
 > but not a menace to navigation.

Didn't we just have a round of Cicada's back in
1994, 1995? I wasn't riding then (got the KZ400
in the summer of 1996). I remember working at
the new DLA HQ in Fort Belvoir, and hearing all
the noise coming from the woods, stepping on all
the carcasses in the parking lots...ick.

Hork

--
Mandatory Second Line (Chatty Moron Trademark)

Dale Horstman - horkster@XXXXXX '98 Concours - BugSlayer
Dale City, Virginia, USA, Earth      '99 Concours - Grape Nehi
CM #001 NRA IBA COG                  '82 GS850G - Neat old bike

The Mason Dixon 20-20 Endurance Rally: The Games People Play
Come join us in 2004:   http://www.masondixon20-20.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:14:57 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:03:07 -0400

Sounds like I picked a good summer to study for my architecture license.

_________________________________________________________________
MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page   )B–
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:15:17 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Cicadas
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:15:10 -0400


>
> From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/15 Thu PM 03:59:00 EDT
> To: Sally Wood <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Cicadas
>
> At 11:02 AM 4/15/04 -0700, Sally Wood wrote:
> >Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
> >cicadas in '87?
>
> Yes. Probably several of us.
>
> >I know they're harmless but I am
> >curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
> >in...what's the splat-factor?).
>
> I got one in the chest going through Rock Creek Park on the beltway
> (between Georgia and Connecticut exits). I was (luckilly) wearing my
heavy
> leather jacket, so I didn't get a bruise, and it didn't splatter...just
> bounced. Whether it would have splattered if it had hit something
harder,
> like my face shield, I don't know. If it had, visibility would have
been
> sharply reduced...
>
>

they have the highest splat factor just after they get their wings
because they're still soft and squishy. The good news is that it's all
over in 3-4 weeks. But the 2nd and 3rd weeks is when it's the worst.
Very nasty.

And dogs LOVE the taste of them. Don't let your doggie
give you a big wet kiss after being outside. Bug goo stretches a good 6
or 7 inches...<don't ask>.



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:17:45 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:17:26 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas

Ditto on the HS thing, but I was too young to get a motorcycle license.
I did have a car though, and can remember hitting the things at any sort
of speed was rather startling, and made a huge mess on the windshield.

(I also remember gathering up hundreds of them in a trash bag and
letting them go inside my HS ... but that's not related :D )

- Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:21:07 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:16:50 -0400
To: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Bike related?

At 01:05 PM 4/15/04 -0700, Carl Schelin wrote:

>Tomorrow I'll snag the newest files and bookmarks, make sure the last of
>the lists have acknowledged, delete my accounts and head over to the
after
>work party in my honor.

Have a fun party!   Write when you find work!   (or just get an ISP! ;-)

Good luck!


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:22:17 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Ebay Sniping?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:22:10 -0400

> nibbler bumps their bid .50 and loses to a person who is proxy-bidding
> they are informed of that immediately, and the rest of the community
> biding on the item is mercifully spared the constant change in status.

I beg to differ - the item in question jumps up twice - once in response
to the nibbler and once again in response to the existing proxy.

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:32:51 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:33:41 -0400
To: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>,
   Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
Cc: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
At 04:12 PM 4/15/04 -0400, Dale Horstman wrote:

>Didn't we just have a round of Cicada's back in
>1994, 1995?

Probably. There are some every year. There are two "cohorts" that are
much larger though...and the 17 year group we are about to see is the
biggest of them all...over twice the size of the next largest group.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:39:14 2004
From: "Jim McGonigle" <jmcgonigle@XXXXXX>
Cc: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Cicadas
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:39:25 -0400


When do they come out?   Beginning of May, mid may?

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Bartman [mailto:omni@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 4:34 PM
To: Dale Horstman; Paul Wilson
Cc: Dave Yates; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas

At 04:12 PM 4/15/04 -0400, Dale Horstman wrote:

>Didn't we just have a round of Cicada's back in 1994, 1995?

Probably. There are some every year. There are two "cohorts" that are
much
larger though...and the 17 year group we are about to see is the biggest
of
them all...over twice the size of the next largest group.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:45:27 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: RE: Cicadas
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:45:21 -0400

Last word I heard on the news is that they're scheduled
for the first or second week of May.

-aki



>
> From: "Jim McGonigle" <jmcgonigle@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/15 Thu PM 04:39:25 EDT
> CC: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> Subject: RE: Cicadas
>
>
> When do they come out? Beginning of May, mid may?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Bartman [mailto:omni@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 4:34 PM
> To: Dale Horstman; Paul Wilson
> Cc: Dave Yates; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Cicadas
>
> At 04:12 PM 4/15/04 -0400, Dale Horstman wrote:
>
> >Didn't we just have a round of Cicada's back in 1994, 1995?
>
> Probably. There are some every year. There are two "cohorts" that are
much
> larger though...and the 17 year group we are about to see is the
biggest of
> them all...over twice the size of the next largest group.
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's
mistakes
> is better.
>
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:53:37 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:51:52 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: Sally Wood <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas

Sally Wood wrote:
>
> Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of
> cicadas in '87? I know they're harmless but I am
> curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
> in...what's the splat-factor?).
>
> Sally
> '01 YZF600R

yep.    had my GS550e at the time, and they hurt at speed.

I had one bounce off of my chest at low speed and it ended up in my
helmet, 1"
from my mouth. I know they're not biting or stinging or anything, but it
was
creepy. made it hard to focus on the road having it crawling around in
there.
<shudder>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 16:55:14 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:55:04 -0400
Subject: Re: Cicadas

Ground temp has to get to a sustained 64 degrees Fahrenheit for the lil'
buggers to dig their way out of the ground apparently.

It's kinda giving me the skeeves, if I think about it too much...
millions of these pre-historic looking, hibernating monsters just
waiting to crawl out of the dirt, cocoon themselves in the trees and
start chattering away at a thousand decibels before they die, fall out
of the trees, and onto the sidewalks, streets... my moto seat... under
the windscreen...

-Sean

adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:

> Last word I heard on the news is that they're scheduled
> for the first or second week of May.
>
> -aki

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 17:29:15 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 14:28:46 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ebay Sniping?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
--- matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX> wrote:
> and this naive fool gets bent when something I want gets sniped out
> from under me with seconds left. sniping is IMO not playing nice and
> abusing the rules.

"Playing nice"? Oh yes, you did say "naive". 8;)

When something gets sniped out from under you, you just didn't bid high
enough.
Think of it as submitted sealed bids.

Snipers set a maximum bid just as you do with a manual bid under eBay's
auto-increment practice. All you have to do is bid higher. You simply
have to do
it using your brain in advance instead of in fevered reaction to seeing a
higher
bid.

Sniping is definitely "within the rules". Philosophically, there is no
differnce
between automated sniping and manual last-minute bidding, assuming you
know how
to tell time and set a count-down timer. The problem is unavoidable so
long as
you're dealing with auctions that have a fixed ending time.

> I expect (hope!) ebay will kill snipers by
> preventing bids from first time bidders on an auction item say within
> 1hr of auction close.

As a seller, I certainly wouldn't like that.

Any rule you can come up with, snipers can probably circumvent. In this
case,
you'd just place an early, insignificant bid on the item, and then set
your
sniper as you do now.

Automated snipers are especially useful if you're going to be away or
busy when
an auction ends (or sleeping when one ends at 4am).

I use Bidnapper, which has both models -- monthly/annual fees for
unlimited
sniping, or a plan whereby you pay a fixed fee for a fixed number of
successful
snipes (no charge for unsuccessful snipes).

-- Larry
__________________________________
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Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 17:56:16 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 17:56:07 -0400
From: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas

Mike Bartman wrote:

> At 04:12 PM 4/15/04 -0400, Dale Horstman wrote:
>
>
>>Didn't we just have a round of Cicada's back in
>>1994, 1995?
>
>
> Probably. There are some every year. There are two "cohorts" that are
> much larger though...and the 17 year group we are about to see is the
> biggest of them all...over twice the size of the next largest group.

Oh joy. Thanks for the info. I might actually pity
the beanie-helmet-wearing crowd this summer...nah.

Looks like my aptly-named bike, "BugSlayer", is
in for a mighty satisfying couple of months... :)

Horkster


--
Mandatory Second Line (Chatty Moron Trademark)

Dale Horstman - horkster@XXXXXX '98 Concours - BugSlayer
Dale City, Virginia, USA, Earth      '99 Concours - Grape Nehi
CM #001 NRA IBA COG                  '82 GS850G - Neat old bike

The Mason Dixon 20-20 Endurance Rally: The Games People Play
Come join us in 2004:   http://www.masondixon20-20.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 18:14:02 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 18:15:04 -0400
To: Dale Horstman <horkster@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
At 05:56 PM 4/15/04 -0400, Dale Horstman wrote:
>Mike Bartman wrote:

>> Probably.   There are some every year.   There are two "cohorts" that
are

>Oh joy. Thanks for the info. I might actually pity
>the beanie-helmet-wearing crowd this summer...nah.

From
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/03/0329_040329_cicadas.html
:

"Magicicada cicadas synchronize their life cycles only in local areas.
There are 12 broods, or year classes, among the 17-year cicadas and three
broods of 13-year cicadas so that in almost any given year it is possible
to find adult periodical cicadas somewhere in the U.S."

There's a year/state distribution table for all of the broods at:

http://insects.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/fauna/michigan_cicadas/Periodical/Index
.ht
ml#Magicicada%20broods


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 18:47:46 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 15:47:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: sniping for moto accessories...
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Well, Matt, if you don't like what eBay has become, and think there are a
significant number of other people who feel as you do, it would seem
there's a
tremendous business opportunity just waiting for you to carpe some diem.

Acording to you right-wingers, America's greatness is derived solely from
open
markets and free competition, so have at it! We'll all snipe at you
afterward,
just as we do Bill Gates. 8;)

Seriously, there is no competing auction sites for motos and accessories,
is
there? I know of others for pool cues, etc., but no moto areas.
-- Larry




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 19:04:20 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:04:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I don't mind USA cicadas at all. They are so quiet and have songs that
last only a couple seconds. What's nifty about the Japanese ones (and
they've got a bunch) is that their common name describes what their
song sounds like. Every summer (june/july/aug) the Tokyo region at
least gets what we call "meeenmeeenzemi" which are actually Korean in
origin apparently.

Anyhow try http://homepage2.nifty.com/saisho/cicadasongwav_e.html or
http://tinyurl.com/ypo2l and check out the right most 3 of the Korean
entries to see what summer in Japan is like. A single 'song' is easily
30sec long. Of the native Japanese variety try Japonesis and Kuroiwae.

The Japanese ones don't fly about much unless spooked by preditors so
it's quite rare to hit one.

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 19:40:50 2004
From: "Dave Yates" <Dave@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 19:42:28 -0400
X-ELNK-Trace:
956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec7951f62af9a587b6b68d43fb859
eaf9fc2350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c

Anybody have any good cicada recipes to share ?
Dave Yates
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 4:55 PM
Subject: Re: Cicadas


> Ground temp has to get to a sustained 64 degrees Fahrenheit for the
lil'
> buggers to dig their way out of the ground apparently.
>
> It's kinda giving me the skeeves, if I think about it too much...
> millions of these pre-historic looking, hibernating monsters just
> waiting to crawl out of the dirt, cocoon themselves in the trees and
> start chattering away at a thousand decibels before they die, fall out
> of the trees, and onto the sidewalks, streets... my moto seat... under
> the windscreen...
>
> -Sean
>
> adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>
> > Last word I heard on the news is that they're scheduled
> > for the first or second week of May.
> >
> > -aki
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 20:32:57 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: sniping
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 20:32:49 -0400

Perhaps this is an opportune moment to resurrect the gun thread.

What are the general merits of Leupold scopes over, say, Zeiss or
Swarovski?

Or do you prefer Nikon?

Michael (running and ducking) J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 20:33:18 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 17:33:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Bike related?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX


--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 01:05 PM 4/15/04 -0700, Carl Schelin wrote:
>
>   >Tomorrow I'll snag the newest files and bookmarks, make sure the last
>   of
>   >the lists have acknowledged, delete my accounts and head over to the
>   after
>   >work party in my honor.
>
>   Have a fun party!   Write when you find work!   (or just get an ISP! ;-)
>

We're likely taking the summer off. Going to Greece to visit friends,
riding north to Idaho for a birthday and other visits and perhaps a ride
up into British Columbia and south into California. We'll see when we get
there.

> Good luck!
>

Thanks. It'll be fun.

>
> -- Mike B.
>

Carl


=====
02 Harley FXSTI
95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
76 Honda Chopper (in progress)




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 20:36:31 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Bike related?
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 20:36:24 -0400

>   We're likely taking the summer off. Going to Greece to visit
>   friends, riding north to Idaho for a birthday and other
>   visits and perhaps a ride up into British Columbia and south
>   into California. We'll see when we get there.

That's one way to dodge the cicadas...

Are you going to be in Greece during the Olympics?
Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 20:44:38 2004
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 20:44:28 EDT
Subject: The helmet is back - So Far. :-)
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

It didn't fit Skip's noggin. Too loose. Paul W., you're next in line
and
then Robert V. Skip must wear the same size as me as it fit the same.
It fits
like a M/L Shoei or a L/XL Arai. Paul, if you still want it, let me
know.

Scooter (2000 r/w/b YZF R6)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 20:48:39 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 17:48:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Bike related?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX


--- Michael Jordan <mjordan812@XXXXXX> wrote:
> > We're likely taking the summer off. Going to Greece to visit
> > friends, riding north to Idaho for a birthday and other
> > visits and perhaps a ride up into British Columbia and south
> > into California. We'll see when we get there.
>
> That's one way to dodge the cicadas...

Especially when wearing a beanie ;-)

>
> Are you going to be in Greece during the Olympics?

Nah. We figured it'd be a little expensive to try and be there then.
We're
looking at heading over in late May, possibly starting north of Athens
and
touring south. My friend is one of the sysadmins working the computers
used by some aspect of the Olympics so he's not going to be available to
be a tour guide very often.

>
> Michael J.
>

Carl

=====
02 Harley FXSTI
95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
76 Honda Chopper (in progress)




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 21:14:34 2004
From: "Dave Yates" <Dave@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: sniping
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 21:16:10 -0400
X-ELNK-Trace:
956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec799820e2498b5b2fe3f8eec1e4b
b90c33c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c

DCC MJ tests the waters...

> Perhaps this is an opportune moment to resurrect the gun thread.
>
> What are the general merits of Leupold scopes over, say, Zeiss or
Swarovski?
>
> Or do you prefer Nikon?
>
> Michael (running and ducking) J.

[Dave] OVER a zeiss? They're all good marques... I've got a lot of
work
to do... I just found out my neighbor has a C&R FFL, and at least 2x as
many
guns as me... That's unusual. It's downright scary. This
neighborhood's
looking better and better :-)

Dave

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 21:26:18 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Tire Breakin
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 21:26:08 -0400
X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original
Seal-Send-Time: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 21:26:08 -0400

Hey all. I'm sure you can help me here. I'm getting a new rear tire
installed on my bike so that I'll be able to enjoy this weekend's coming
weather. I'll pick it up from the stealership tomorrow. My question is
what is the breakin process for tires? I've seen/heard of scrubbing the
tire with sandpaper, or pouring some type of solvent over it. Or do you
just ride it out very carefully?   Thanks.

John

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 22:40:39 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 22:40:35 -0400
To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin

At 09:26 PM 4/15/2004, John White wrote:
>Hey all. I'm sure you can help me here. I'm getting a new rear tire
>installed on my bike so that I'll be able to enjoy this weekend's coming
>weather. I'll pick it up from the stealership tomorrow. My question is
>what is the breakin process for tires? I've seen/heard of scrubbing the
>tire with sandpaper, or pouring some type of solvent over it. Or do you
>just ride it out very carefully? Thanks.

Just ride it gingerly from the dealership until it heats up (stops and
starts heat the tire through flex - swervies don't help). Take the first
dozen corners easier than usual and you should be good to go. If you
have
any doubts, hit a gravel road for a mile then scrub off the rock dust
with
a few easy corners. After 20 miles or so they should be perfect.

I have found that brand new tires are more likely to slip in the rain
until
they are scrubbed in, but otherwise no big deal.

Sandpaper is just for the squids to rub off their chicken stripes ;-)



_____________________________________
   Mike Troutman
        mike@XXXXXX
        http://www.troutman.org/vfr

         '97 Honda VFR 750
         AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/
         NMA - http://www.motorists.org

         "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead."
                 - Jimmy Buffett

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 23:07:22 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 23:08:11 -0400

Take is easy for the first 50 miles IMO.     There is release compound to
help
the tire fall out of the mold. After a some miles you will see where it
was
and where it still is on the tire. I just gradually lean more and more
until
it's all rubbed off.

On my BT020's it's a white haze that start to rub off the tire with
contact to
the pavement. The sand paper stuff may help if you need to ride hard
right
away but you should get to know the tire b4 you do that anyhow.

Whose riding tomorrow :)    I know I am.

Rob

On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 21:26:08 -0400, John White wrote
> Hey all. I'm sure you can help me here. I'm getting a new rear
> tire installed on my bike so that I'll be able to enjoy this
> weekend's coming weather. I'll pick it up from the stealership
> tomorrow. My question is what is the breakin process for tires?
> I've seen/heard of scrubbing the tire with sandpaper, or pouring
> some type of solvent over it. Or do you just ride it out very
> carefully? Thanks.
>
> John


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 15 23:27:07 2004
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 20:26:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: sniping for moto accessories...
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX> wrote:

> Damn it, I want HTML v2.1 back. and Mosaic.

Newbie. I'm still sticking with Lynx. 8;)

-- Larry
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 00:48:20 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 00:48:10 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin

Rob Sharp wrote:

> Take is easy for the first 50 miles IMO. There is release compound to
help
> the tire fall out of the mold. After a some miles you will see where
it was
> and where it still is on the tire. I just gradually lean more and more
until
> it's all rubbed off.

Honestly, you don't have to be THAT carefully. We scrub tires in one lap
on the racetrack (usually about 2 miles). You just have to take it easy
for a couple miles and gradually increase your lean angle so your
contact patch isn't entirely composed of "virgin" rubber. The mold
release compound comes off almost instantly with the friction between
the tire and the road.

- Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 08:54:23 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 05:54:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
To: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Here ya go:
http://www.channelcincinnati.com/news/2968023/detail.html

You're a braver man than I.

Chris Weaver

--- Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Anybody have any good cicada recipes to share ?
>
> Dave Yates




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 08:57:03 2004
From: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Cc: "'swood_yzf@XXXXXX'" <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>
Subject: Cicadas
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 09:03:00 -0400

Sally Wescued us from the waskly snipe thread with:
"Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of cicadas in '87?"

Yup, commuting regularly on the mighty "Caballo-ante" (RIP) a 1980 GS
450E.
It had a Vetter Quicksilver fairing thus sparing me from the worst.

" . . . I am curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
in...what's the splat-factor?)."

Like others mentioned, they're an excellent argument for good gear.
Remember after the cicadas are gone, there will still be suicidal bees,
wasps, and june bugs. Oh and the occasional bit of crap thrown up by
another's tire could hurt like heck. So, even if you don't plan on
sliding
down the asphalt, protective gear is still a Good Thing.

Also, some of are "blessed" with tinnitus. So, we get to hear the
crickets
and cicadas all year long, especially after a cup of coffee. Use ear
protection.
You need not be saving lives with loud pipes to be affected. The wind
noise, even with a good helmet, can degrade your hearing over the years.
My
tinnitus didn't become evident until I was in my mid fifties so it took
me
decades of abuse. Yours may take less.

I like the Howard Leight Max plugs. A few years ago, several of use
chipped
in together and bought several boxes of the plugs. They were about $25
for
a box of 200.
Hmm Googling: Howard Leight Max

Yup. Still a good deal:
<http://www.tasco-safety.com/earplugs/earplugs.html>
<http://www.envirosafetyproducts.com/html/leight_hearing.htm#max1>
<http://www.medco-
school.com/Fast/Product.asp?leaf_id=10678&Section=114&Subs
ection=638>

Carl in Bethesda

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 09:05:55 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 06:05:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

C'mon, Roach, surely you're not suggesting that
scrubbing in tires at the track is comparable to doing
so on the street? It's a pretty different environment.


I can say from frightening experience that it takes
more than a couple of street miles to scrub in a tire.
Unless you live near a very twisty road, there just
aren't enough turns. Heating up the tire with stops
and starts is good, but on top of that warm rubber is
release compound that will still be on the tires
wherever they haven't touched the road. The best idea
I've heard yet is the one about riding through gravel
for a bit.

Chris Weaver


--- Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Rob Sharp wrote:
>
> > Take is easy for the first 50 miles IMO. There is
> release compound to help
> > the tire fall out of the mold. After a some miles
> you will see where it was
> > and where it still is on the tire. I just
> gradually lean more and more until
> > it's all rubbed off.
>
> Honestly, you don't have to be THAT carefully. We
> scrub tires in one lap
> on the racetrack (usually about 2 miles). You just
> have to take it easy
> for a couple miles and gradually increase your lean
> angle so your
> contact patch isn't entirely composed of "virgin"
> rubber. The mold
> release compound comes off almost instantly with the
> friction between
> the tire and the road.
>
> - Roach
>




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 09:10:03 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
CC: "'swood_yzf@XXXXXX'" <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 9:09:55 -0400


>
> From: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/16 Fri AM 09:03:00 EDT
> To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> CC: "'swood_yzf@XXXXXX'" <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>
> Subject: Cicadas
>
> Sally Wescued us from the waskly snipe thread with:
> "Was anyone around and riding during the last cycle of cicadas in '87?"
>
> Yup, commuting regularly on the mighty "Caballo-ante" (RIP) a 1980 GS
450E.
> It had a Vetter Quicksilver fairing thus sparing me from the worst.
>
> " . . . I am curious about how they may impact our riding fun (as
> in...what's the splat-factor?)."
>
> Like others mentioned, they're an excellent argument for good gear.
> Remember after the cicadas are gone, there will still be suicidal bees,
> wasps, and june bugs. Oh and the occasional bit of crap thrown up by
> another's tire could hurt like heck. So, even if you don't plan on
sliding
> down the asphalt, protective gear is still a Good Thing.


yup yup...I got hit right square in the middle of my visor a few years
back from some big ole pregnant bug. I only knew it was pregnant because
when it 'xploded it left hundreds (thousands?) of these tiny wiggling
maggot worm thingies sliding all over my visor and then quickly drying
out and sticking to it like little bits of rice. feh...
(How's THAT for a visual?) ;-)

>
> Also, some of are "blessed" with tinnitus. So, we get to hear the
crickets
> and cicadas all year long, especially after a cup of coffee.

..you too eh? It's especially bothersome at night in bed when it's
quiet. Can be maddening sometimes. Modern medicine can do little to
help to. I only got it about 5 years ago.
>Use ear
> protection.
> You need not be saving lives with loud pipes to be affected. The wind
> noise, even with a good helmet, can degrade your hearing over the
years. My
> tinnitus didn't become evident until I was in my mid fifties so it took
me
> decades of abuse. Yours may take less.

...I don't know what caused mine. I've always been pretty
careful about my hearing since my job in the military required annual
hearing exams and I always scored above average and I always wore ear
plugs when riding. I was told it could be hereditary and my mother has
it.



-aki

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 09:12:30 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Tire Breakin
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 9:12:23 -0400

>
>   From: Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/16 Fri AM 09:05:48 EDT
>   To: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>   Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
>
>   C'mon, Roach, surely you're not suggesting that
>   scrubbing in tires at the track is comparable to doing
>   so on the street? It's a pretty different environment.
>
>
>   I can say from frightening experience that it takes
>   more than a couple of street miles to scrub in a tire.
>   Unless you live near a very twisty road, there just
>   aren't enough turns. Heating up the tire with stops
>   and starts is good, but on top of that warm rubber is
>   release compound that will still be on the tires
>   wherever they haven't touched the road. The best idea
>   I've heard yet is the one about riding through gravel
>   for a bit.
>
>   Chris Weaver
>
>

..all I know is that the (older) Metzlers ME's were slick as hell.
Almost like someone had sprayed WD40 on the tires. You HAD to take it
easy or the first turn could be a pucker event of epic proportions!
-aki

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 09:40:10 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 09:39:53 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin

At 09:05 AM 4/16/2004, Chris Weaver wrote:
>The best idea
>I've heard yet is the one about riding through gravel
>for a bit.
>
>Chris Weaver

I don't have much of a choice there. Gravel driveway, and the two roads
heading towards work are both gravel. Of course with the budget issues,
VDOT seems to be napping and still hasn't recovered them for Spring.
Which
means they are more mud and potholes than gravel.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 10:02:49 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 07:02:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bryce <bster13@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas (Ear Plugs)
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Same NRR rating of 33, but $18 dollars for 200 pairs
as opposed to $24 for 100 pairs. That works out to
0.24/pair for the Max, and 0.09 for the EAR plugs.
Both fit real nice and are nice and supple.

Bryce


--- "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX> wrote:

> I like the Howard Leight Max plugs. A few years ago,
> several of use chipped
> in together and bought several boxes of the plugs.
> They were about $25 for
> a box of 200.
> Hmm Googling: Howard Leight Max
>
> Yup. Still a good deal:
> <http://www.tasco-safety.com/earplugs/earplugs.html>
>
<http://www.envirosafetyproducts.com/html/leight_hearing.htm#max1>
>
<http://www.medco-
school.com/Fast/Product.asp?leaf_id=10678&Section=114&Subs
> ection=638>
>
> Carl in Bethesda
>




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 10:19:29 2004
Subject: 211 Fatality follow-up
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 10:19:13 -0400
From: "Maurer, Aaron" <AMaurer@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
X-WSS-ID: 6C6134EB3679529-02-01

You might recall the deadly accident from last fall, where one
motorcyclist on 211 crossed the double yellow line, striking and killing
another motorcyclist.

I am a friend of the fallen rider's brother, who was riding behind his
brother on another bike that day and witnessed the entire thing. He
sent an e-mail advising on the outcome of the criminal trial of the
motorcyclist who crossed the double yellow:

> Virginia's law. To take a persons life in Virginia by crossing the
double line, killing
> my brother, being charged w/ reckless driving and then get a $2,500.00
dollar fine and
> not be able to drive in the Commonwealth of Virginia for 12 months. So
was justice
> served?



-Aaron (digested)
2003 R1150GS
------------------------------------------------------------


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============================================================

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 10:32:11 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: AMaurer@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: 211 Fatality follow-up
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 10:32:03 -0400

This is what he "advised", what happened, or both?

>From: "Maurer, Aaron" <AMaurer@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: 211 Fatality follow-up
>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 10:19:13 -0400
>
>You might recall the deadly accident from last fall, where one
>motorcyclist on 211 crossed the double yellow line, striking and killing
>another motorcyclist.
>
>I am a friend of the fallen rider's brother, who was riding behind his
>brother on another bike that day and witnessed the entire thing. He
>sent an e-mail advising on the outcome of the criminal trial of the
>motorcyclist who crossed the double yellow:
>
> > Virginia's law. To take a persons life in Virginia by crossing the
>double line, killing
> > my brother, being charged w/ reckless driving and then get a
$2,500.00
>dollar fine and
> > not be able to drive in the Commonwealth of Virginia for 12 months.
So
>was justice
> > served?

_________________________________________________________________
Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN
Premium!
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us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 10:34:49 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 10:34:52 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: 211 Fatality follow-up

At 10:19 AM 4/16/2004, Maurer, Aaron wrote:
>I am a friend of the fallen rider's brother, who was riding behind his
>brother on another bike that day and witnessed the entire thing. He
>sent an e-mail advising on the outcome of the criminal trial of the
>motorcyclist who crossed the double yellow:
>
> > Virginia's law. To take a persons life in Virginia by crossing the
>double line, killing
> > my brother, being charged w/ reckless driving and then get a
$2,500.00
>dollar fine and
> > not be able to drive in the Commonwealth of Virginia for 12 months.
So
>was justice
> > served?

If crossing the double yellow was purely accidental, then yes. You could
argue that the rider shouldn't have put himself in the situation that
caused him to cross the double yellow, but that is what an accident
is. They are never on purpose. What he a newbie, or just riding over
his
head?

Imagine living in the suburbs and not being able to drive for a year. If
that happened to me and I were unmarried, I'd be totally screwed. No bus
access, I'd have to taxi to a bus pickup and switch lines twice to get
from
Manassas to Reston.

I'm surprised he didn't get a year in jail.   That is an option for
reckless. But without more details.....



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 10:35:49 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: 211 Fatality follow-up
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 10:35:41 -0400


>
> From: "Maurer, Aaron" <AMaurer@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/16 Fri AM 10:19:13 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: 211 Fatality follow-up
>
> You might recall the deadly accident from last fall, where one
> motorcyclist on 211 crossed the double yellow line, striking and
killing
> another motorcyclist.
>
> I am a friend of the fallen rider's brother, who was riding behind his
> brother on another bike that day and witnessed the entire thing. He
> sent an e-mail advising on the outcome of the criminal trial of the
> motorcyclist who crossed the double yellow:
>
> > Virginia's law. To take a persons life in Virginia by crossing the
> double line, killing
> > my brother, being charged w/ reckless driving and then get a
$2,500.00
> dollar fine and
> > not be able to drive in the Commonwealth of Virginia for 12 months.
So
> was justice
> > served?
>
>


that's less than Jack-off got. Disgusting.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 11:06:14 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 11:06:01 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
CC: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin

Er, yes ... I am. You don't think I ever put a new set of tires on any
of my streetbikes? I have found little difference, if any.

The only difference I can even thik of is that because I'm used to doing
it so often, I don't find the process intimidating when I throw a new
set of tires on a streetbike.

  - Roach
Chris Weaver wrote:

> C'mon, Roach, surely you're not suggesting that
> scrubbing in tires at the track is comparable to doing
> so on the street? It's a pretty different environment.



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 11:09:06 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: mike@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 11:08:58 -0400

Okay, thanks a lot for all you guys tips. I'll be picking up the bike
today
just in time for the weekend. I'll be sure to breakin the tires fully
before I ride hard. Ride safe everyone and thanks again.


>From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
>Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 09:39:53 -0400
>
>At 09:05 AM 4/16/2004, Chris Weaver wrote:
>>The best idea
>>I've heard yet is the one about riding through gravel
>>for a bit.
>>
>>Chris Weaver
>
>I don't have much of a choice there. Gravel driveway, and the two roads
>heading towards work are both gravel. Of course with the budget issues,
>VDOT seems to be napping and still hasn't recovered them for Spring.
Which
>means they are more mud and potholes than gravel.
>
>
>
>___________________________________________
>     Mike Troutman
>         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
>         1997 Honda VFR 750
>            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
>            NMA http://www.motorists.org
>
>
>When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths
or
>any other kinds of
>dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
>     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146
>

_________________________________________________________________
Check out MSN PC Safety & Security to help ensure your PC is protected
and
safe. http://specials.msn.com/msn/security.asp

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 14:02:58 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 14:03:50 -0400
To: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, mike@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin

At 11:08 AM 4/16/04 -0400, John   White wrote:
>Okay, thanks a lot for all you   guys tips. I'll be picking up the bike
today
>just in time for the weekend.    I'll be sure to breakin the tires fully
>before I ride hard. Ride safe    everyone and thanks again.

You sure picked a nice weekend for it!    Even Monday is supposed to be
gorgeous! Have (safe) fun!!

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 21:32:00 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 18:31:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
To: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>,
   "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Cc: "'swood_yzf@XXXXXX'" <swood_yzf@XXXXXX>


--- "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Also, some of are "blessed" with tinnitus. So, we get to hear the
> crickets
> and cicadas all year long, especially after a cup of coffee. Use ear
> protection.
> You need not be saving lives with loud pipes to be affected. The wind
> noise, even with a good helmet, can degrade your hearing over the
years.
> My
> tinnitus didn't become evident until I was in my mid fifties so it took
> me
> decades of abuse. Yours may take less.
>
I've had Tinnitus for as long as I can remember, and I remember going for
my Marine physical at 17 and hoping it wouldn't be so bad it'd cause me
to
fail. Even though my pipes are louder than stock, I find it's the wind
that causes the short term reduction of hearing.

> Carl in Bethesda
>

Carl, heading to Denver

=====
02 Harley FXSTI
95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
76 Honda Chopper (in progress)




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 16 21:46:48 2004
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 18:46:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Carl Schelin <dm_gsxr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


--- adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>
> ..you too eh? It's especially bothersome at night in bed when it's
> quiet. Can be maddening sometimes. Modern medicine can do little to
> help to. I only got it about 5 years ago.
>

I've noticed that if I'm in bed and it's quiet, it gets louder. As soon
as
there's a noise, it fades into the background. There's also a brief
second
or two when it gets real loud just as I'm heading off to sleep.

I've had it for as long as I can remember. Some of the reading I've done
recently talked about some people who, in desperation, have had their
ears
surgically excised and it still rang. They suspect nerve damage of some
sort.

I don't know where I got mine though. I didn't get my first stereo until
I
joined the Marines and had a little pocket am radio before that. My first
concert was a Paul McCartney one in RFK stadium and we were in the nose
bleed seats (early 90's) so I don't think it was music related. I
remember
talking about an 'ear ring' when I was very young so possibly 40 years or
more.

> I was told it could be hereditary and my mother has
> it.
>

Some of the reading shows that caffeine can make it worse and I've always
been a heavy Dr. Pepper and now Diet Coke fiend. I can speculate about
when I was a kid, but I'll probably never know for sure.

>
>
> -aki
>

Carl

=====
02 Harley FXSTI
95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
76 Honda Chopper (in progress)




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 17 08:26:38 2004
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 08:26:29 -0400
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Aki Damme <adamme1@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Cicadas

At 09:46 PM 4/16/2004, Carl Schelin wrote:

>--- adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
> >
> > ..you too eh? It's especially bothersome at night in
> bed when it's
> > quiet. Can be maddening sometimes. Modern medicine
> can do little to
> > help to. I only got it about 5 years ago.
> >
>
>I've noticed that if I'm in bed and it's quiet, it gets
>louder. As soon as
>there's a noise, it fades into the background. There's
>also a brief second
>or two when it gets real loud just as I'm heading off to
>sleep.


I've tried background noise. I have a Brookstone "nature
sounds" player that
plays a continuous loops of wind, rain, brook or beach
waves. That seems to
help on the nights that it's really irritating and because
it sounds natural, it doesn't
bother Jen either. I've found it's especially helpful when
I'm in hotels where it's
difficult for me to sleep anyway.



>I've had it for as long as I can remember. Some of the
>reading I've done
>recently talked about some people who, in desperation,
>have had their ears
>surgically excised and it still rang. They suspect nerve
>damage of some
>sort.


I've read that for some it's something to do with the ear
drum/canal, and for others,
it's not even in the ear canal but, like you mentioned some
type of nerve damage
and/or it's in the brain.



>I don't know where I got mine though. I didn't get my
>first stereo until I
>joined the Marines and had a little pocket am radio before
>that. My first
>concert was a Paul McCartney one in RFK stadium and we
>were in the nose
>bleed seats (early 90's) so I don't think it was music
>related. I remember
>talking about an 'ear ring' when I was very young so
>possibly 40 years or
>more.

Like I mentioned earlier, I've always been careful about my
hearing. Hearing
damage usually occurs after *prolonged* abuse. The ears
are pretty good about
bouncing back after a loud concert and unless you're a band
*member* and
don't wear ear protection, I doubt that would of been the
cause.
-aki




> > I was told it could be hereditary and my mother has
> > it.
> >
>
>Some of the reading shows that caffeine can make it worse
>and I've always
>been a heavy Dr. Pepper and now Diet Coke fiend. I can
>speculate about
>when I was a kid, but I'll probably never know for sure.
>
> >
> >
> > -aki
> >
>
>Carl
>
>=====
>02 Harley FXSTI
>95 Suzuki GSXR 750W
>76 Honda Chopper (in progress)
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th
>http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 17 09:05:35 2004
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 06:05:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: can I buy a replacement tip for chain breakers?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Insult to injury I soome to have lost mine but it was pretty mashed up
from several riviting episodes. I got it at a dealer but it's not a
motion-pro unit that I can tell.

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 17 18:28:36 2004
From: "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: "matthew patton" <pattonme@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: can I buy a replacement tip for chain breakers?
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 18:28:41 -0400

Motion Pro lists part numbers for the replacement tips.    Perhaps they
will
fit your unit as well.

http://motionpro.com/Docs/chaintools.html

Paul in DC (who needs to get a new tip or two)
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "matthew patton" <pattonme@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2004 9:05 AM
Subject: can I buy a replacement tip for chain breakers?


>   Insult to injury I soome to have lost mine but it was pretty mashed up
>   from several riviting episodes. I got it at a dealer but it's not a
>   motion-pro unit that I can tell.
>
>   =====
>   "If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
>   not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
>     -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)
>
>   * A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
>   the right person.
>
>   * Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
>     -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 17 20:09:29 2004
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:09:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Adam Reinhardt <ajreinhardt@XXXXXX>
Subject: CBR Sealed/Non-sealed Battery question
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I'm in the process of trying to sell my 89 CBR600 with
a bad regulator/rectifier. The battery is old and
worn out and won't hold much of a charge. My question
is whether or not I can use one of the batteries from
my (4) GS500s. The CBR's battery is sealed, the
GS500's is not, and the GS500 battery actually
provides more starting power according to the
manufacturer's specs.

What would the disadvantages be of swapping battery's,
assuming that the GS500 battery fits into the CBR box,
which I think it will?

Thanks,

Adam




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 17 21:57:28 2004
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 21:57:28 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: CBR Sealed/Non-sealed Battery question

If it is a 12 volt on both and it fits, go for it. Or buy it a new one
at
Wal-Mart for $30. They carry compatible batteries. I have one on the
VFR
right now.

At 08:09 PM 4/17/2004, you wrote:
>What would the disadvantages be of swapping battery's,
>assuming that the GS500 battery fits into the CBR box,
>which I think it will?


_____________________________________
   Mike Troutman
        mike@XXXXXX
        http://www.troutman.org/vfr

          '97 Honda VFR 750
          AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/
          NMA - http://www.motorists.org

          "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead."
                  - Jimmy Buffett

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 18 08:39:02 2004
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 05:38:54 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
Cc: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

i'm with brian on this one. gradually lean the bike until
the edge is obtained (which i try to do only once the tires
are relatively warm). done.




--- Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Er, yes ... I am. You don't think I ever put a new set of
> tires on any
> of my streetbikes? I have found little difference, if
> any.
>
> The only difference I can even thik of is that because
> I'm used to doing
> it so often, I don't find the process intimidating when I
> throw a new
> set of tires on a streetbike.
>
>   - Roach
>
> Chris Weaver wrote:
>
> > C'mon, Roach, surely you're not suggesting that
> > scrubbing in tires at the track is comparable to doing
> > so on the street? It's a pretty different environment.




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 18 17:45:12 2004
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 14:45:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Where did he say that? IIRC, he said it only takes a
mile or two and the tires are broken in. I'd like to
see the streets where you can warm up your tires in a
mile or two. But whatever - you guys believe what you
want and I'll believe what I want.

Chris Weaver
--- Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX> wrote:
> i'm with brian on this one. gradually lean the bike
> until
> the edge is obtained (which i try to do only once
> the tires
> are relatively warm). done.




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 18 21:28:47 2004
From: "W.S." <mobacc@XXXXXX>
To: "DC-Cycles" <DC-Cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: London and Janklow etc.
Date: Sun, 18 Apr 2004 21:28:20 -0400

Two very poignant items from the May (highly regarded, for newbies)
Motorcycle Consumer News -

      o "British motorcycle commuters are calling on their government to
publicly recognize the *benefits of London traffic congestion relief from
greater motorcycle use.* A year after local authorities began charging
tolls for cars entering central London, yet exempting motorcycles, the
streets are safer.
           Motorcycle sales are up 20% in London, and despite a 20%
increase in motorcycle traffic in the city there has been a 15% fall in
motorcycle casualties, while the average speed of traffic in central
London
has rise by 15%."

     Area jam-bound politicos take note.

      o Fred Rau, resident MCN papa-san, takes a page+1/2 look at the
Janklow situation in part revealing a past not scribed in accounts I've
seen. www.mcnews.com

Which leads into a plug for the AMA "Justice for All" campaign as riding
season starts. Geared for max impact at Sturgis (2003 attendance 450K),
it's been said, it aims at nationwide pressure to insure bikers get a
fair
shake in accident situations. Lots of details at
http://www.amadirectlink.com/, click "JfA", click "JfA kit" (Stickers and
flyers to hand out for $8).


Bill S. / DC
'99 VN750 > In 2015 -- 4 to a space and lanesplitting.
Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun.
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 07:27:58 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:27:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that over
1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it
seems
this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?

Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 07:32:53 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 04:32:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

there were some mileage estimates (including somebody who
said 50). i'm with the guy whose comments indicated it
ISN'T mileage but rather actual scrubbing. that would seem
to be brian.



--- Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Where did he say that? IIRC, he said it only takes a
> mile or two and the tires are broken in. I'd like to
> see the streets where you can warm up your tires in a
> mile or two. But whatever - you guys believe what you
> want and I'll believe what I want.
>
> Chris Weaver
>
> --- Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX> wrote:
> > i'm with brian on this one. gradually lean the bike
> > until
> > the edge is obtained (which i try to do only once
> > the tires
> > are relatively warm). done.




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 07:38:29 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 04:38:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I would agree with this too. All that needs to be
done to "break in a tire" is to remove the releasing
agent/anti rot agent (the slippery stuff). You could
even do it with a piece of emory cloth without ever
hitting the street!

Miles mean nothing. A parking lot can do the trick
also. Just do lots of figures 8's.

Glenn

--- Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX> wrote:
> there were some mileage estimates (including
> somebody who
> said 50). i'm with the guy whose comments indicated
> it
> ISN'T mileage but rather actual scrubbing. that
> would seem
> to be brian.




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 08:30:52 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 05:30:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

It was 'warm' or 'hot' by some people's standards because the temps
were dramatically different than they have been to date. My observation
was that ONLY BMW riders (6) had full safety gear primarily
Aerostiches. To a man, cruiser riders were in jeans and t-shirt
(probably 30), and most sportbikers too except about 4/15 were wearing
their leather jackets to go with jeans. I didn't see any tank-tops or
shorts except twice and that was on a passenger.

I spent all weekend building a deck and doing this: http://www.zr-
7forums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9800
=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:01:48 2004
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Accident WAS Re: London and Janklow etc.
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:02:00 -0400
To: DC-Cycles <DC-Cycles@XXXXXX>

I feel somewhat ashamed for not being an AMA member.

I had an encounter with a Janklow-type driver yesterday who ignored a
yield sign at a traffic circle (I was already in the circle), bumping
me and sending my and my bike for a pavement ride. The bike landed on
my leg, but thanks to my armored riding pants and jacket, nothing's
broken, no road rash, just minor bruises, bumps and scrapes. I just
called the MD State Police to get a report, but I did find out from the
paramedics that the driver was cited for failure to yield. I was
worried until this morning that I'd have no recourse, but it looks as
though all the motorcyclists (and a bicyclist) who came to my aid made
sure to get the guy's tag number and insurance information. They also
chased him down when he tried to leave the scene, so that he'd be there
when the police showed up. A paramedic on a Harley and a firefighter
on a CBR helped me out while other moto-vigilantes kept an eye on the
driver. When I got out of the ER after x-rays, a friend of mine who
lives nearby helped me bend my footpeg bracket back into place and
temporarily replace my shift lever with a bolt and lots of duct tape.
I was actually able to ride home after that.

I don't know if we should crucify every driver who makes a boneheaded
mistake in the vicinity of a motorcyclist, but I do think that they
need to be held responsible for their actions, ticketed where
appropriate, and have their licenses taken away if necessary. And they
should pay damages, either through insurance or out of their pockets.
In Janklow's case, though, there is no punishment strict enough.
Reading Fred Rau's column made me so disgusted. Here is a guy who has
repeatedly broken the law, causing serious physical HARM to others, and
has always abused his privilege as a government official to get off
with a slap on the wrist.

I support the AMA's Justice for All campaign, and will sign up for a
membership today.

- Steve

On Apr 18, 2004, at 9:28 PM, W.S. wrote:
>   Two very poignant items from the May (highly regarded, for newbies)
>   Motorcycle Consumer News -
>       o Fred Rau, resident MCN papa-san, takes a page+1/2 look at the
>   Janklow situation in part revealing a past not scribed in accounts I've
>   seen. www.mcnews.com
>
>   Which leads into a plug for the AMA "Justice for All" campaign as
>   riding
>   season starts. Geared for max impact at Sturgis (2003 attendance
>   450K),
>   it's been said, it aims at nationwide pressure to insure bikers get a
>   fair
>   shake in accident situations. Lots of details at
>   http://www.amadirectlink.com/, click "JfA", click "JfA kit" (Stickers
>   and
>   flyers to hand out for $8).
>
>
>   Bill S. / DC
>   '99 VN750 > In 2015 -- 4 to a space and lanesplitting.
>   Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun.
>
>
>
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:03:24 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 06:03:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

OF COURSE the idea is to get rid of the release agent!
Since very few people take sandpaper/emery cloth/sand
blaster to their new tires or take them out on the
track or do figure eights in a parking lot before they
ride on the street on them, it seems to be to be just
a *little* more useful to tell them approximately how
many miles they should be careful during normal riding
conditions.

All the pedantic "yes, BUT in this case you don't have
to do that" comments are doing NOTHING to help new
riders reading the comments on this thread. All
they're doing is serving the egos of those people
posting them.

Chris Weaver


--- Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX> wrote:
> I would agree with this too. All that needs to be
>   done to "break in a tire" is to remove the releasing
>   agent/anti rot agent (the slippery stuff). You
>   could
>   even do it with a piece of emory cloth without ever
>   hitting the street!
>
>   Miles mean nothing. A parking lot can do the trick
>   also. Just do lots of figures 8's.
>
>   Glenn




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:14:00 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 06:13:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Now don't get your panties into a wad! All I'm saying
is telling people 50 miles, hell I've heard 100 miles
before is not really accurate. If you live near a
twisty road you could be done with one run down that
road. Telling someone "xx miles and you are good to
go" ain't the answer either.

Glenn

--- Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX> wrote:
> OF COURSE the idea is to get rid of the release
> agent!
> Since very few people take sandpaper/emery
> cloth/sand
> blaster to their new tires or take them out on the
> track or do figure eights in a parking lot before
> they
> ride on the street on them, it seems to be to be
> just
> a *little* more useful to tell them approximately
> how
> many miles they should be careful during normal
> riding
> conditions.
>
> All the pedantic "yes, BUT in this case you don't
> have
> to do that" comments are doing NOTHING to help new
> riders reading the comments on this thread. All
> they're doing is serving the egos of those people
> posting them.




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:21:18 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:21:06 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dan@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Yep. Saw my share of them this weekend. I wasn't one of them though.
Jacket, jeans, gloves, boots and helmet for me. :-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 7:27:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time, dan@XXXXXX
writes:

>
>
>   It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that over
>   1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
>   usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis
>   shoes, but it seems
>   this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
>
>   Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:24:55 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:13:14 -0400

Cruisers yesterday were almost all in shorts & t-shirts. Think it's the
beginning of the season & a lot of the noobie sportbike crowd don't have
pants or boots yet, saw a lot of jeans & work boots. Most had on jackets
&
gloves. Did see one guy in the mountains wearing shorts & t. Stopped in
the mountains to grab some food. Harley guys were having beers.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfee )B®
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:26:48 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Tire changing tips
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 9:26:41 -0400

I know many of you already change your own tires but for those of us that
don't normally do that kind of stuff, I found the following website that
provides tips and good visuals (as well as some humor) on tire changing.

http://www.clarity.net/~adam/tire-changing-doc.html

Speaking of, anyone have a tire changing, wheel balancing
setup? I'm willing to pay for use/help with it as I'll be ordering a new
set of tires for my Wideglide in about 2-3 weeks and Patriot wants to
charge me $36, off bike for each tire to r/r them.

cheers,
-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:29:35 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: dan@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:29:23 -0400

I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have a
couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?" I told them,
not
when I'm moving : ) Besides, I'd rather be hot than have my skin pulled
from my body.


>From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:27:49 -0400 (EDT)
>
>It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that over
>1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
>usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it
seems
>this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
>
>Dan
>

_________________________________________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:30:22 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:29:42 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: DC-Cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Accident WAS Re: London and Janklow etc.
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Steve,

Sorry to hear about your accident. It's a good thing you had all those
people around. Question, did they get his insurance info before or after
he tried to leave? If after, I personally would have gotten his plate,
made sure I could ID him and then let him take off. More of a penalty
for leaving the scene of an accident/hit and run. :-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 9:02:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
freecat@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>   I feel somewhat ashamed for not being an AMA member.
>
>   I had an encounter with a Janklow-type driver yesterday who ignored a
>   yield sign at a traffic circle (I was already in the circle), bumping
>   me and sending my and my bike for a pavement ride. The bike landed on
>   my leg, but thanks to my armored riding pants and jacket, nothing's
>   broken, no road rash, just minor bruises, bumps and scrapes. I just
>   called the MD State Police to get a report, but I did find out from the
>   paramedics that the driver was cited for failure to yield. I was
>   worried until this morning that I'd have no recourse, but it looks as
>   though all the motorcyclists (and a bicyclist) who came to my aid made
>   sure to get the guy's tag number and insurance information. They also
>   chased him down when he tried to leave the scene, so that he'd be there
>   when the police showed up. A paramedic on a Harley and a firefighter
>   on a CBR helped me out while other moto-vigilantes kept an eye on the
>   driver. When I got out of the ER after x-rays, a friend of mine who
>   lives nearby helped me bend my footpeg bracket back into place and
>   temporarily replace my shift lever with a bolt and lots of duct tape.
>   I was actually able to ride home after that.
>
>   I don't know if we should crucify every driver who makes a boneheaded
>   mistake in the vicinity of a motorcyclist, but I do think that they
>   need to be held responsible for their actions, ticketed where
>   appropriate, and have their licenses taken away if necessary. And they
>   should pay damages, either through insurance or out of their pockets.
>   In Janklow's case, though, there is no punishment strict enough.
>   Reading Fred Rau's column made me so disgusted. Here is a guy who has
>   repeatedly broken the law, causing serious physical HARM to others, and
>   has always abused his privilege as a government official to get off
> with a slap on the wrist.
>
> I support the AMA's Justice for All campaign, and will sign up for a
> membership today.
>
> - Steve
>
> On Apr 18, 2004, at 9:28 PM, W.S. wrote:
>
> > Two very poignant items from the May (highly regarded, for newbies)
> > Motorcycle Consumer News -
> >   o Fred Rau, resident MCN papa-san, takes a page+1/2 look at the
> > Janklow situation in part revealing a past not scribed in accounts
I've
> > seen. www.mcnews.com
> >
> > Which leads into a plug for the AMA "Justice for All" campaign as
> > riding
> > season starts. Geared for max impact at Sturgis (2003 attendance
> > 450K),
> > it's been said, it aims at nationwide pressure to insure bikers get a
> > fair
> > shake in accident situations. Lots of details at
> > http://www.amadirectlink.com/, click "JfA", click "JfA
> kit" (Stickers
> > and
> > flyers to hand out for $8).
> >
> >
> > Bill S. / DC
> > '99 VN750 > In 2015 -- 4 to a space and lanesplitting.
> > Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:34:35 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:34:10 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Exactly. That's what I tell people. I went down once without a jacket
on and I have the scars to prove it. Never again. I don't care how hot
it gets, I will always have on my gear.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 9:29:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
kokopellian@XXXXXX writes:
>
>
> I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have a
> couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?" I told them,
not
> when I'm moving : ) Besides, I'd rather be hot than have my skin
pulled
> from my body.
>
>
> >From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
> >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> >Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
> >Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:27:49 -0400 (EDT)
> >
> >It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that
over
> >1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
> >usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it
seems
> >this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
> >
> >Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:36:59 2004
Cc: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Accident WAS Re: London and Janklow etc.
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:37:07 -0400
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX

After. In all fairness: When they stopped him, he said he was just
going to go park it. It might have been true, but it looked to me like
he wanted to leave -- and it looked that way to the guys who went after
him. But we motorcyclists might be a little paranoid about that stuff,
given the hit-and-run cases we all hear about.

On Apr 19, 2004, at 9:29 AM, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:

> Steve,
>
> Sorry to hear about your accident. It's a good thing you had all
> those people around. Question, did they get his insurance info before
> or after he tried to leave? If after, I personally would have gotten
> his plate, made sure I could ID him and then let him take off. More
> of a penalty for leaving the scene of an accident/hit and run. :-)
>
> Scooter
>
> In a message dated 4/19/2004 9:02:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> freecat@XXXXXX writes:
>
>>
>>
>> I feel somewhat ashamed for not being an AMA member.
>>
>> I had an encounter with a Janklow-type driver yesterday who ignored a
>> yield sign at a traffic circle (I was already in the circle), bumping
>> me and sending my and my bike for a pavement ride. The bike landed on
>> my leg, but thanks to my armored riding pants and jacket, nothing's
>> broken, no road rash, just minor bruises, bumps and scrapes. I just
>> called the MD State Police to get a report, but I did find out from
>> the
>> paramedics that the driver was cited for failure to yield. I was
>> worried until this morning that I'd have no recourse, but it looks as
>> though all the motorcyclists (and a bicyclist) who came to my aid made
>> sure to get the guy's tag number and insurance information. They also
>> chased him down when he tried to leave the scene, so that he'd be
>> there
>> when the police showed up. A paramedic on a Harley and a firefighter
>> on a CBR helped me out while other moto-vigilantes kept an eye on the
>> driver. When I got out of the ER after x-rays, a friend of mine who
>> lives nearby helped me bend my footpeg bracket back into place and
>> temporarily replace my shift lever with a bolt and lots of duct tape.
>> I was actually able to ride home after that.
>>
>> I don't know if we should crucify every driver who makes a boneheaded
>> mistake in the vicinity of a motorcyclist, but I do think that they
>> need to be held responsible for their actions, ticketed where
>> appropriate, and have their licenses taken away if necessary. And
>> they
>> should pay damages, either through insurance or out of their pockets.
>> In Janklow's case, though, there is no punishment strict enough.
>> Reading Fred Rau's column made me so disgusted. Here is a guy who has
>> repeatedly broken the law, causing serious physical HARM to others,
>> and
>> has always abused his privilege as a government official to get off
>> with a slap on the wrist.
>>
>> I support the AMA's Justice for All campaign, and will sign up for a
>> membership today.
>>
>> - Steve
>>
>> On Apr 18, 2004, at 9:28 PM, W.S. wrote:
>>
>>> Two very poignant items from the May (highly regarded, for newbies)
>>> Motorcycle Consumer News -
>>>    o Fred Rau, resident MCN papa-san, takes a page+1/2 look at the
>>> Janklow situation in part revealing a past not scribed in accounts
>>> I've
>>> seen. www.mcnews.com
>>>
>>> Which leads into a plug for the AMA "Justice for All" campaign as
>>> riding
>>> season starts. Geared for max impact at Sturgis (2003 attendance
>>> 450K),
>>> it's been said, it aims at nationwide pressure to insure bikers get a
>>> fair
>>> shake in accident situations. Lots of details at
>>> http://www.amadirectlink.com/, click "JfA", click "JfA
>> kit" (Stickers
>>> and
>>> flyers to hand out for $8).
>>>
>>>
>>> Bill S. / DC
>>> '99 VN750 > In 2015 -- 4 to a space and lanesplitting.
>>> Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:37:55 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:37:49 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin

At 09:13 AM 4/19/2004, Glenn Dysart wrote:
>Now don't get your panties into a wad! All I'm saying
>is telling people 50 miles, hell I've heard 100 miles
>before is not really accurate. If you live near a
>twisty road you could be done with one run down that
>road. Telling someone "xx miles and you are good to
>go" ain't the answer either.

Doesn't anyone read the mail they get?

http://www.dccycles.com/arch/2004/4/234Re__Tire_Breakin

Everything covered this morning was covered last week.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:39:02 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:38:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Accident WAS Re: London and Janklow etc.

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, Stephen Miller wrote:

> sure to get the guy's tag number and insurance information. They also
> chased him down when he tried to leave the scene, so that he'd be there

Glad you had some good   folks around that chased him down. Accidents are
accidents, careless or   not, but leaving the scene, thats when it gets
personal. Get him for    all you can, and then some more. And remind him
that you know where he   lives so he doen't sleep so well.

Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:39:47 2004
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:39:57 -0400
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX

I can personally vouch for the First Gear Mesh-tex jacket. It doesn't
have quite as much airflow as a JR Phoenix, but the abrasion resistance
is excellent. I'll probably get the matching mesh pants, as my current
riding pants are lined and very very warm in the summer.

On Apr 19, 2004, at 9:34 AM, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:

> Exactly. That's what I tell people. I went down once without a
> jacket on and I have the scars to prove it. Never again. I don't
> care how hot it gets, I will always have on my gear.
>
> Scooter
>
> In a message dated 4/19/2004 9:29:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> kokopellian@XXXXXX writes:
>
>>
>>
>> I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have a
>> couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?" I told
>> them, not
>> when I'm moving : ) Besides, I'd rather be hot than have my skin
>> pulled
>> from my body.
>>
>>
>>> From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
>>> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>>> Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>>> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:27:49 -0400 (EDT)
>>>
>>>   It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that
>>>   over
>>>   1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
>>>   usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it
>>>   seems
>>>   this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
>>>
>>>   Dan
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:39:49 2004
Subject: Reflections
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:43:03 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>



6:45pm Sunday. Saw a group of riders called the Steel Brotherhood.
There motto appears to be 'Loud pipes save lives'. Saw two '04 R1's and
was jealous though not exactly sure why.


It is 12:35 AM Sunday night. I am heading towards DC on the Toll Road
after visiting a lady friend to watch the Sopranos. There is not a car
in sight. The limit is 55mph. I am tooling down the straight line road
at 60mph. My bike and I are more than capable of doing twice that. Due
to past circumstance, I have disciplined myself to respect all local
ordinances but part of me is slightly frustrated at having my riding
experience curtailed by a limit that seems at this time and hour to be
cruel and unusual punishment.



Sunday 3pm. Missed a ride to Harpers with a fellow lister and was
disappointed.

Sunday 1PM. Took a lunch date on my bike down the GW to Old Town. Saw
lots of bikers. I enjoy waving and being waved at and the sense of
camaraderie. I enjoy that I can park beside 15 or so Harley's and no
one appears to mind. It was her first ride and she did well. My
brother was in town and asked for a ride. I took him on a short
miserable trip. He could not relax and had the idea that sitting as
close to my seat as humanely possible would make him "safer". As his
protesting girlfriend looked on I took him up and down the street,
managed to bump helmets a few times and returned him to the sidewalk

Saturday circa 7pm. I am on the road back from Baltimore with the same
lady friend who is by far the most excellent passenger I have ever had.
This is not stopping me from urging her to get her own bike but she is
excellent company. The average speed is slightly higher than posted. I
hear a high pitch whine and a sportbike buzzes past us at 130mph plus
weaving in and out of traffic and splitting lanes. The passenger on the
back has a helmet, shorts and a tank top.

Gear, I went out on a short jaunt in a T-shirt. I had my gloves, jeans
and boots but went out once with just my shirt. I did not feel that
good about it so I went home and retrieved my mesh jacket and continued
riding.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:41:06 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:41:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, John White wrote:

> I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have a
> couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?" I told them,
not
> when I'm moving : ) Besides, I'd rather be hot than have my skin
pulled
> from my body.
>

Good line for those types of comments is "Its better to sweat than
bleed!"
Although, I don't do too much sweating in the Phoenix, keeps me nice and
cool, even while stopped.

Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:48:27 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:48:19 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, exupbrotherhood@XXXXXX,
   AFRA@XXXXXX
Subject: Rider Down - Cross Posted
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

A friend of my families lost his life this weekend doing what he loved.
His name was Bob Kovalcheck and he lived a few miles away from my parents
in PA. I didn't know him that well, hell I didn't even know he rode but,
he was my auto mechanic and a good guy.

He was leaving his shop Saturday and, according to the witnesses, he came
around a curve on his cruiser and smacked into the rear end of a car that
was stopped to allow another to turn left. He hit the car and was thrown
up and to the left, right under the tires of the other car as it was
making its turn. Since PA has gone helmetless, he was wearing one of
those beanie helmets that are more for fashion than protection. They say
the head trauma is what killed him.

This is the same curve where I totaled my dad's car about 12 years ago
coming the opposite direction and the same circumstance. Bob came to tow
it away. Couldn't convince him to drive it past the field my father was
working in though so that I didn't have to tell him. ;-)

Anyway, please drive a mile for Bob during this beautiful weather we're
having this week.

Scooter

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:54:18 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:54:06 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Oh, I've got the JR Phoenix Gear, both pants and jacket. I'll be
breaking them out this week(end). :-) I just wear leather for more
spirited rides. ;-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 9:39:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
freecat@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>   I can personally vouch for the First Gear Mesh-tex jacket. It doesn't
>   have quite as much airflow as a JR Phoenix, but the abrasion resistance
>   is excellent. I'll probably get the matching mesh pants, as my current
>   riding pants are lined and very very warm in the summer.
>
>   On Apr 19, 2004, at 9:34 AM, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>
>   > Exactly. That's what I tell people. I went down once without a
>   > jacket on and I have the scars to prove it. Never again. I don't
>   > care how hot it gets, I will always have on my gear.
>   >
>   > Scooter
>   >
>   > In a message dated 4/19/2004 9:29:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
>   > kokopellian@XXXXXX writes:
>   >
>   >>
>   >>
>   >> I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have
a
>   >> couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?" I told
>   >> them, not
>   >> when I'm moving : ) Besides, I'd rather be hot than have my skin
>   >> pulled
>   >> from my body.
>   >>
>   >>
>   >>> From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
>   >>>   To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>   >>>   Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>   >>>   Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:27:49 -0400 (EDT)
>   >>>
>   >>>   It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that
>   >>>   over
>   >>>   1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days.
I
>   >>> usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis
>   shoes, but it
>   >>> seems
>   >>> this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
>   >>>
>   >>> Dan
>   >

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 09:55:14 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: dan@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:55:06 -0400

LOL, I'll remember that line for sure! I have a Joe Rocket Ballistic
mesh
riding suit. I stay pretty cool with it on. It's only the helmet that
makes me sweat. I learned the art of wearing a doo-rag this weekend : )


>From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:41:02 -0400 (EDT)
>
>On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, John White wrote:
>
> > I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have
a
> > couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?" I told
them,
>not
> > when I'm moving : ) Besides, I'd rather be hot than have my skin
pulled
> > from my body.
> >
>
>Good line for those types of comments is "Its better to sweat than
bleed!"
>Although, I don't do too much sweating in the Phoenix, keeps me nice and
>cool, even while stopped.
>
>Dan
>

_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar )B– get it now!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 10:03:15 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 10:03:06 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: To the rider in Clifton

To the first rider in Clifton that I passed this morning.   Sorry for not
waving, I was in a daze.

To the second rider I passed and scared the crap out of, send me the
cleaning bill.

Halfway through the twisties close to town, my center line suddenly
became
a thick layer of rounded black gravel. The front tire wobbled and I
started to slide. This happened just at the apex of the curve, with an
approaching uphill dual sport. As soon as the gravel gave way, I leaned
hard and made the curve inside the double yellow. But just barely. The
whole thing took under a second. I expected a pucker mark and adrenaline
rush, but it never came. I guess beachy roads have become routine in the
Spring :-(

Gravel in and of itself doesn't bother me. I ride it every day. But
when
you spread it on curves on smooth asphalt, its kind of like throwing
marbles at the ROTC guys in Animal House. For a second anyway.

I didn't ride or wrench this weekend. I spread 90 bags of mulch and
still
need 20 more. The pickup made the job that much easier. It would have
been a lot more work in the old Durango. SOuthern States will drop a
pallet in your truck and give a discount for the quantity.

Try fitting that in your saddle bags ;-)


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 10:14:38 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Mike Bartman'" <omni@XXXXXX>,
   Dale Horstman
       <horkster@XXXXXX>
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Cicadas
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 10:14:19 -0400

LOL yeah that would hurt to get hit in the face with one of them. I just
dug
up some while digging up this stump in my back yard. Not looking forward
to
cleaning the perforated leather. Yuck.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Bartman [mailto:omni@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 6:15 PM
To: Dale Horstman
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Cicadas

At 05:56 PM 4/15/04 -0400, Dale Horstman wrote:
>Mike Bartman wrote:

>> Probably.   There are some every year.   There are two "cohorts" that
are

>Oh joy. Thanks for the info. I might actually pity
>the beanie-helmet-wearing crowd this summer...nah.

From
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/03/0329_040329_cicadas.html
:

"Magicicada cicadas synchronize their life cycles only in local areas.
There are 12 broods, or year classes, among the 17-year cicadas and three
broods of 13-year cicadas so that in almost any given year it is possible
to find adult periodical cicadas somewhere in the U.S."

There's a year/state distribution table for all of the broods at:

http://insects.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/fauna/michigan_cicadas/Periodical/Index
.ht
ml#Magicicada%20broods


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 10:22:25 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'ScooterFZR@XXXXXX'" <ScooterFZR@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Helmet for Sale :-)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 10:22:17 -0400

Well I got a KBC Wolf helmet size large for sale $100. The color is flat
black. I'll throw in a mirror shield too. Anyone interested email me
back.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 10:38:52 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:38:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Louis F. Caplan" <nighthawk700@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Accident WAS Re: London and Janklow etc.
To: DC-Cycles@XXXXXX

> Steve,
>
> Sorry to hear about your accident. It's a good thing you   had all those
> people around. Question, did they get his insurance info   before or
after he
> tried to leave? If after, I personally would have gotten   his plate,
made
> sure I could ID him and then let him take off. More of a   penalty for
leaving
> the scene of an accident/hit and run. :-)
>
> Scooter

The problem with this approach is the plates may not match the car. I
was hit
last year (I was in my car at the time). The guy took off. The police
and I
thought we were in good shape because not only did his plate leave an
impression on my car so they could read the license, but it actually fell
off,
so we had the plate AND the impression of it on my car. Only problem was
the
plate was from an F250 Pickup, and the car that hit me definitely wasn't
an
F250. (my brother owns an F150, so as soon as they told me the model, I
knew I
was screwed for the deductible).

Louis


=====
"Admiral" Louis Caplan   1998 Kawasaki Concours    Fairfax, VA
Please consider helping me support the Pediatric Brain Tumor Foundation
http://www.geocities.com/nighthawk700/rideforkids.htm

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 10:50:10 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Rider Down - Cross Posted
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 10:38:36 -0400

Sorry to hear the news, Scooter.

My condolences.

Rob
'98 VFR800


From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, exupbrotherhood@XXXXXX,
AFRA@XXXXXX
Subject: Rider Down - Cross Posted
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:48:19 -0400

A friend of my families lost his life this weekend doing what he loved.
His
name was Bob Kovalcheck and he lived a few miles away from my parents in
PA.
  I didn't know him that well, hell I didn't even know he rode but, he
was
my auto mechanic and a good guy.

He was leaving his shop Saturday and, according to the witnesses, he came
around a curve on his cruiser and smacked into the rear end of a car that
was stopped to allow another to turn left. He hit the car and was thrown
up
and to the left, right under the tires of the other car as it was making
its
turn. Since PA has gone helmetless, he was wearing one of those beanie
helmets that are more for fashion than protection. They say the head
trauma
is what killed him.

This is the same curve where I totaled my dad's car about 12 years ago
coming the opposite direction and the same circumstance. Bob came to tow
it
away. Couldn't convince him to drive it past the field my father was
working in though so that I didn't have to tell him. ;-)

Anyway, please drive a mile for Bob during this beautiful weather we're
having this week.

Scooter

_________________________________________________________________
Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your
waist.
http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=
et_pv_030104_lovehandles
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 10:55:40 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Tire changing tips
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 10:43:33 -0400

Aki,

CAD Cycles in Gaithersburg charges $17 per tire off bike, if you can get
them there.
301-977-7188. Not sure if it's convenient for you, but just an FYI.

Rob
'98 VFR800


From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Tire changing tips
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 9:26:41 -0400

I know many of you already change your own tires but for those of us that
don't normally do that kind of stuff, I found the following website that
provides tips and good visuals (as well as some humor) on tire changing.

http://www.clarity.net/~adam/tire-changing-doc.html

Speaking of, anyone have a tire changing, wheel balancing
setup? I'm willing to pay for use/help with it as I'll be ordering a new
set of tires for my Wideglide in about 2-3 weeks and Patriot wants to
charge
me $36, off bike for each tire to r/r them.

cheers,
-aki

_________________________________________________________________
Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your
waist.
http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=
et_pv_030104_lovehandles

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:09:53 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:09:42 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Rider Down - Cross Posted
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Thanks. My mom just called and they have an Obit up for him on
www.legacy.com. Nice write up about him.

Scooter
In a message dated 4/19/2004 10:38:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
robkeiser@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Sorry to hear the news, Scooter.
>
> My condolences.
>
> Rob
> '98 VFR800
>
>
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, exupbrotherhood@XXXXXX,
> AFRA@XXXXXX
> Subject: Rider Down - Cross Posted
> Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:48:19 -0400
>
> A friend of my families lost his life this weekend doing what he loved.
His
> name was Bob Kovalcheck and he lived a few miles away from my parents
in PA.
> I didn't know him that well, hell I didn't even know he rode but, he
was
> my auto mechanic and a good guy.
>
> He was leaving his shop Saturday and, according to the witnesses, he
came
> around a curve on his cruiser and smacked into the rear end of a car
that
> was stopped to allow another to turn left. He hit the car and was
thrown up
> and to the left, right under the tires of the other car as it was
making its
> turn. Since PA has gone helmetless, he was wearing one of those beanie
> helmets that are more for fashion than protection. They say the head
trauma
> is what killed him.
>
> This is the same curve where I totaled my dad's car about 12 years ago
> coming the opposite direction and the same circumstance. Bob came to
tow it
> away. Couldn't convince him to drive it past the field my father was
> working in though so that I didn't have to tell him. ;-)
>
> Anyway, please drive a mile for Bob during this beautiful weather we're
> having this week.
>
> Scooter

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:15:09 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:15:05 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Tire changing tips



-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Keiser <robkeiser@XXXXXX>

Aki,

CAD Cycles in Gaithersburg charges $17 per tire off bike, if you can get
them there.
301-977-7188. Not sure if it's convenient for you, but just an FYI.

Rob
'98 VFR800


From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>


I know many of you already change your own tires but for those of us that
don't normally do that kind of stuff, I found the following website that
provides tips and good visuals (as well as some humor) on tire changing.

http://www.clarity.net/~adam/tire-changing-doc.html

Speaking of, anyone have a tire changing, wheel balancing
setup? I'm willing to pay for use/help with it as I'll be ordering a new
set of tires for my Wideglide in about 2-3 weeks and Patriot wants to
charge
me $36, off bike for each tire to r/r them.

cheers,
-aki

-----------------

Last summer, I bought the bead breaker and balancer from Tire-Qwik.
www.tireqwik.com He sells you a complete kit, including rim protectors.

For the actual mounting, I have a 5/8" treaded rod secured to my
workbench. I built a little frame out of 2x3's to keep the brake rotors
off workbench surface. Still, a little sweat, tire lube and finesse is
required to lever the beads over the rim with 12" levers. The key is to
keep the tire centered in the well of the wheel. That reduces the
effective radius of the wheel.

The bead breaker is fine and works well, for a portable unit. And yes, I
have carried it on the bike. I don't have the kind of space needed for a
floor-mounted unit like the Coats, or the Harbor Freight. I changed a
set of tires (Pirelli Diablos on the VFR) yesterday, solo, with this
setup, in about two hours, including removing and installing the wheels.
Seems to be the season for tire-changing. With a friend's help I mounted
new tires on my KLR last week. A little different with that bike, since
you have to install tubes.



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:16:57 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: To the rider in Clifton
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:16:48 -0400


>
> From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 10:03:06 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: To the rider in Clifton
>
<snip>

>
> I didn't ride or wrench this weekend. I spread 90 bags of mulch and
still
> need 20 more. The pickup made the job that much easier. It would have
> been a lot more work in the old Durango.


yeesh...I did the same thing on Saturday only with 25 bags and I'll need
at least 25-30 more. Seriously shortchanged my estimates on how much I'd
need to do the back year. Backbreaking work having to carry those
suckers down a flight of steps in the back. Don't *even* dicuss
Durango's. I'm am so damn glad I finally got rid of my 99. (long
story).


> SOuthern States will drop a
> pallet in your truck and give a discount for the quantity.
>

...I'll probaby try and go the loose (non-bagged) type this next time
around. I'm told it's about half price even with delivery included, over
buying them bagged. Just need to check with the local landscaping places
to see who sells/delivers.

> Try fitting that in your saddle bags ;-)

Got my bike out on Sunday for a quick ride around and shakedown after
doing my 10k maintenance. Rear tire was almost 10lbs low..amazing how
"squishy" the rear end feels when it's not up to proper pressure. After
a couple of hours getting the cobwebs out of my and the bike, I took my
daughter on a quick run around Cascades area. Amazing how much they've
developed that area just from the last time I rode down to the end of
Cascades parkway last year. I *really* like the Boss Bags I bought last
year before Biketoberfest. Can't imagine what it would be like now with
them.

-aki




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:17:07 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: To the rider in Clifton
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:16:58 -0400


>
> From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 10:03:06 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: To the rider in Clifton
>
<snip>

>
> I didn't ride or wrench this weekend. I spread 90 bags of mulch and
still
> need 20 more. The pickup made the job that much easier. It would have
> been a lot more work in the old Durango.


yeesh...I did the same thing on Saturday only with 25 bags and I'll need
at least 25-30 more. Seriously shortchanged my estimates on how much I'd
need to do the back year. Backbreaking work having to carry those
suckers down a flight of steps in the back. Don't *even* dicuss
Durango's. I'm am so damn glad I finally got rid of my 99. (long
story).


> SOuthern States will drop a
> pallet in your truck and give a discount for the quantity.
>

...I'll probaby try and go the loose (non-bagged) type this next time
around. I'm told it's about half price even with delivery included, over
buying them bagged. Just need to check with the local landscaping places
to see who sells/delivers.

> Try fitting that in your saddle bags ;-)
Got my bike out on Sunday for a quick ride around and shakedown after
doing my 10k maintenance. Rear tire was almost 10lbs low..amazing how
"squishy" the rear end feels when it's not up to proper pressure. After
a couple of hours getting the cobwebs out of me and the bike, I took my
daughter on a quick run around Cascades area. Amazing how much they've
developed that area just from the last time I rode down to the end of
Cascades parkway last year. I *really* like the Boss Bags I bought last
year before Biketoberfest. Can't imagine what it would be like now with
them.

-aki




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:26:14 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:26:22 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)

At 11:16 AM 4/19/2004, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>...I'll probaby try and go the loose (non-bagged) type this next time
>around. I'm told it's about half price even with delivery included,
over
>buying them bagged. Just need to check with the local landscaping
places
>to see who sells/delivers.

There are dozens of places to get mulch free. I used to use the PWC and
Fairfax dumps as well as the Bull Run Marina parking lot. But then you
have to shovel it into your truck (or bags in your car) then shovel it
out
to a cart, then to the beds. With bags and a pallet, I move them once to
the bed then split and rake. Those of you with back problems understand
the necessity of moving this stuff as little as possible. Two years ago
we
had 18 yards delivered. It took me all summer to move it. Bags I spread
in a day.

If you go the free mulch pile route, try a pitchfork. Wins hands down
over
shovels. And use week killer - that free stuff brought more weeds with
it
than pine bark....



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org
When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:31:12 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:27:27 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Weekend riding and gear (was: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the
  increase?)

At 05:30 AM 4/19/04 -0700, matthew patton wrote:
>were dramatically different than they have been to date. My observation
>was that ONLY BMW riders (6) had full safety gear primarily
>Aerostiches. To a man, cruiser riders were in jeans and t-shirt
>(probably 30), and most sportbikers too except about 4/15 were wearing
>their leather jackets to go with jeans. I didn't see any tank-tops or
>shorts except twice and that was on a passenger.

I spent the weekend riding, mostly. Saturday was a HOG New Member Ride,
with about 13 bikes (and only one a new member ;) Did about 90 miles of
back roads in Montgomery County, and some in neighboring counties, that
day...60 of it on the ride, and another 30 on my own. Sunday was the
First
State Spring Poker Run. It was a 50 mile ride starting at Mike's Famous,
up near the Delaware Bridge. We left Olney, went 32 to I-95 north, to
I-295 to Mike's, then the Poker Run route (mostly south, south-west, down
Rt 9), which ended in New Castle at Hooters for a late lunch, bike show,
and D.J. music in the parking lot. We changed the return route to avoid
tolls ($9 to get out of Maryland, only $5 to get back in, but enough is
enough...) and headed down 301 to 50, across the Bay Bridge, up 3 to 32
and
back to Olney.

Note: when you hit the Bay Bridge, it's like someone opened a freezer
door
and you rode into it...temps dropped at least 15 degrees at the
bridge...it
was like a wall of cold air.

Also note: when you hit the tunnel in Baltimore, wearing sunglasses under
a
full face helmet, be ready for a surreal experience until your eyes
adjust...better yet, be prepared to lose the sunglasses ASAP! One place
where the beanie wearers had an advantage...

As for gear, I was wearing a full face helmet, FXRG jacket (heavy
leather),
over a leather vest, combat-style bike boots, and jeans. I had full
gloves
for the ride up, but got some fingerless ones for the ride back...the
full
ones were making my hands sweat too much. The fingerless were cooler,
and
let my arms function as air scoops to cool the jacket. I plan to locate
and buy a lighter-weight jacket for summer riding...some sort of
perforated
kevlar or something...protection, not warmth is the goal.

There were two other riders in the 17 bikes (all Harleys, 4 of them
Sportsters, and one a trike) making the Sunday trip that had a full face
helmet on...the rest had 3/4 or half-helmets...and several of those had
them strapped to the back for the Poker Run (Delaware doesn't require
helmets). Most had leather jackets on for the ride up (chilly morning),
but stuffed them into saddle bags or trunks once it warmed up...wearing
T-shirts and vests with the jeans the rest of the day. A few kept their
jackets on for the whole ride, but not many. Same went for the
passengers
(there were about 4 of those I think).

Saw hundreds of Harleys, a few metric cruisers, and only a few sport
bikes
(maybe half a dozen?). Didn't note what the sport bikers were wearing
though...they were all headed the other direction from us and I was
paying
more attention to the group I was in and the traffic I was trying not to
be
in.

Sunday was just over 300 miles total. My longest ride yet, and the most
interstate (first 110 miles). Was pretty sore when I got home last
night,
but I'm Ok now...mostly. ;-) I understand now, at a more personal level,
why the "Iron Butt" is named what it is named!

Time for the bike to get its 2500 mile checkup now...optional, but a good
idea I think. Considering the Stage 1 kit while it's in, and I want the
gas guage fixed...never has worked. They tell me I can have it back the
same day if I bring it in early, or drop it off the night before. They
prefer not working on bikes that are still hot from riding. ;-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:31:25 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:32:52 -0400
To: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 09:13 AM 4/19/04 -0400, rich hall wrote:

>gloves. Did see one guy in the mountains wearing shorts & t. Stopped
in
>the mountains to grab some food. Harley guys were having beers.

On the HOG ride yesterday only one rider in our group (17 bikes) had a
beer
with lunch. One beer. Despite it being at Hooters, with really cute
young
girls offering beers every 30 seconds to anyone who passed. I had
lemonade, most had Pepsi or iced tea.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:37:36 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: dan <dan@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:38:32 -0400

I was overheating in my Joe Rocket Jacket, Jeans. I made the mistake or
trying to take the outloop home (650 to 270) and it was a hot sweaty
gridlock.

I got no problem wearing gear till you get stuck in stop and go traffic.
Then
I hate it. I know the solution is to stay outta that situation but I was
just
riding around and didn't know I was screwed till I hopped on the beltway.

Rob


On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:27:49 -0400 (EDT), dan wrote
> It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that over
> 1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
> usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it
> seems this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
>
> Dan


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:38:05 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'dan'" <dan@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:37:56 -0400

I went to NC to visit some relatives and stuff and noticed every rider
and I
mean everyone I saw had no gear just a helmet on. I guess they spent all
there money on chrome and extended swing arm.

-----Original Message-----
From: dan [mailto:dan@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 7:28 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that over
1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it
seems
this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?

Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:38:24 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:38:13 -0400


>
> From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 11:26:22 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
>
> At 11:16 AM 4/19/2004, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
> >...I'll probaby try and go the loose (non-bagged) type this next time
> >around. I'm told it's about half price even with delivery included,
over
> >buying them bagged. Just need to check with the local landscaping
places
> >to see who sells/delivers.
>
> There are dozens of places to get mulch free. I used to use the PWC
and
> Fairfax dumps as well as the Bull Run Marina parking lot. But then you
> have to shovel it into your truck (or bags in your car) then shovel it
out
> to a cart, then to the beds. With bags and a pallet, I move them once
to
> the bed then split and rake. Those of you with back problems
understand
> the necessity of moving this stuff as little as possible.

..amen to that. That crap is *heavy*. I was told by a landscaper that
it's really important to get the shredded *bark* mulch. Don't just get
shredded mulch because (1) weed growth will be unbelievable, and (2)
Termites. Termites don't like bark so 100% (or as close to it as
possible) of shredded bark mulch is a good idea if you're putting mulch
around the house.


> Two years ago we
> had 18 yards delivered.   It took me all summer to move it.   Bags I
spread
> in a day.

Just 18 yards? Doesn't seem like much. The 25 bags I got were 3 cubic
feet each. Any idea how much it cost you? I figure I'll need about 25
more cubic yards of this stuff, (note to self, NEVER buy a house again
where the entire back yard doesn't grow grass).

And thanks for the tip on the pitchfork.   Trying to shovel bark mulch is
like ain't happenin'.

obmoto: For those that are Harley owners on the list I tried the Syn3
oil this go around. Don't waste your money. It doesn't cool any better
or shift any better than the old tried and true Mobil 1 15w50 only it
costs twice as much.

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:38:49 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:39:36 -0400
To: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, dan@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 09:29 AM 4/19/04 -0400, John White wrote:
>I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have a
>couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?"

I got a lot of that yesterday...my answer when asked "Aren't you hot?"
was
"That's what they tell me!" Got a good laugh from those assembled, and a
"Yep! You're a hottie alright!" from one of the cuter members of the
group. Made all the sweating worthwhile! ;-)
BTW, despite fairly heavy traffic on the interstate, I only saw one truly
boneheaded move from a 4 wheeler. Minivan changed lanes from the right,
without looking first, and almost took out the bike ahead of me. He was
in
the left track, so there was some room for him to hit the brakes and
avoid
the accident, and time for me and those behind me to do the same. Most
other drivers were pretty aware and polite yesterday...they didn't even
linger in the middle of the group much, and always signalled their lane
changes in time for us to make a hole for them to slip through for exits
or
whatever.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:40:19 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:41:14 -0400

I said 50 miles. But I agree that you can just look at the tire and see
the
compound wearing off until it's gone.  You guys are *WAY* to serious.

Rob

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 06:13:38 -0700 (PDT), Glenn Dysart wrote
> Now don't get your panties into a wad! All I'm saying
> is telling people 50 miles, hell I've heard 100 miles
> before is not really accurate. If you live near a
> twisty road you could be done with one run down that
> road. Telling someone "xx miles and you are good to
> go" ain't the answer either.
>
> Glenn
>
> --- Chris Weaver <chris_vtr@XXXXXX> wrote:
> > OF COURSE the idea is to get rid of the release
> > agent!
> > Since very few people take sandpaper/emery
> > cloth/sand
> > blaster to their new tires or take them out on the
> > track or do figure eights in a parking lot before
> > they
> > ride on the street on them, it seems to be to be
>   >   just
>   >   a *little* more useful to tell them approximately
>   >   how
>   >   many miles they should be careful during normal
>   >   riding
>   >   conditions.
>   >
>   >   All the pedantic "yes, BUT in this case you don't
>   >   have
>   >   to do that" comments are doing NOTHING to help new
>   >   riders reading the comments on this thread. All
>   >   they're doing is serving the egos of those people
>   >   posting them.
>
>
>
>   __________________________________
>   Do you Yahoo!?
>   Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
>   http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:40:53 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:40:43 -0400


>
> From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 11:32:52 EDT
> To: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>
> At 09:13 AM 4/19/04 -0400, rich hall wrote:
>
> >gloves. Did see one guy in the mountains wearing shorts & t. Stopped
in
> >the mountains to grab some food. Harley guys were having beers.
>
> On the HOG ride yesterday only one rider in our group (17 bikes) had a
beer
> with lunch. One beer. Despite it being at Hooters, with really cute
young
> girls offering beers every 30 seconds to anyone who passed. I had
> lemonade, most had Pepsi or iced tea.
>

ack!   What HOG ride yesterday?   From Patriot?   Missed that one.

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:42:26 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, dan@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:43:17 -0400

The correct answer is: This may be hot but it's 100x better than an air
conditioned hospital room.

:-)

Rob

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:29:23 -0400, John White wrote
> I definitely noticed it. Especially being a new rider. I even have
> a couple guys say to me "Aren't you hot in all that gear?" I told
> them, not when I'm moving : ) Besides, I'd rather be hot than have
> my skin pulled from my body.
>
> >From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
> >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> >Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
> >Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 07:27:49 -0400 (EDT)
> >
> >It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that
over
> >1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
> >usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it
seems
> >this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
> >
> >Dan
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Stop worrying about overloading your inbox - get MSN Hotmail Extra
> Storage!
http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-
us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:45:30 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 08:45:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ryan Santoso <santosor2001@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
To: "Silver, Arthur \(NIH/NIGMS\)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>,
   "'dan'" <dan@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX


I live in NC now (former DC resident) and that
observation is 100% true. Its amazing here, in the
Piedmont, we are literally few miles away from some of
the best twisties, yet majority of the folks have
their bikes extended. Its really strange, i would
think there would be far more canyon carvers.

Went to Deal's Gap (3 hours away from me) and most of
the folk there are from out of state (hardly any
locals).

As far as the gear goes, I may be one of the few that
uses a one piece leathers when i go out there. I value
my skin far more than most folks here i guess...

Ryan




--- "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)"
<Silvera@XXXXXX> wrote:
> I went to NC to visit some relatives and stuff and
> noticed every rider and I
> mean everyone I saw had no gear just a helmet on. I
> guess they spent all
> there money on chrome and extended swing arm.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dan [mailto:dan@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 7:28 AM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>
> It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I
> noticed it that over
> 1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going
> gearless these days. I
> usually see one or two people in
> shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it seems
> this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the
> same?
>
> Dan
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:50:16 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:50:59 -0400
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: To the rider in Clifton

At 11:16 AM 4/19/04 -0400, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>
>...I'll probaby try and go the loose (non-bagged) type this next time
around. I'm told it's about half price even with delivery included, over
buying them bagged. Just need to check with the local landscaping places
to see who sells/delivers.

Are you mulching for looks, or for organic content? If looks, your plan
sounds good. If you just want something to keep weeds down and to add
organic stuff to the soil as it rots, consider calling a tree service.
All
that stuff that flies ouf of those big chippers they use has to go
somewhere...and mostly it gets dumped in the driveways of people who want
it for mulch...it's free. Not as pretty as the pine bark stuff, but
free.

-- Mike B.

*************************************************************************
***
*       Mike Bartman       *   Puzzles Pondered    Obfuscation
Obliterated *
* Omniphiles International * Confusion Canceled       Opinions Offered
*
*    omni@XXXXXX     *  Options Outlined       Smiles Stimulated    *
*------------------------------------------------------------------------
--*
*            "We do it all! No job too small! No price too high!
*
*************************************************************************
***

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:57:17 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:58:55 -0400
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
At 11:38 AM 4/19/04 -0400, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:

>Just 18 yards? Doesn't seem like much. The 25 bags I got were 3 cubic
feet each. Any idea how much it cost you? I figure I'll need about 25
more cubic yards of this stuff, (note to self, NEVER buy a house again
where the entire back yard doesn't grow grass).

Ummm...assuming "18 yards" means "18 cubic yards", that would be
equivalent
to 162 of your bags...there are 27 cubic feet in a cubic yard...not 3.
18
cubic yards is 486 cubic feet.

>obmoto: For those that are Harley owners on the list I tried the Syn3
oil
this go around. Don't waste your money. It doesn't cool any better or
shift any better than the old tried and true Mobil 1 15w50 only it costs
twice as much.

I thought the benefit was in reduced wear, not cooking or shifting?

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:58:37 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:58:27 -0400


We're going for looks actually. Getting the soil richer back there won't
do any good. Too much shade. The soil is always damp and the doggies
track mud all over the house.

So in years past, we just lay down about 3" of bark mulch to keep the mud
level to a minimum. If I had my druthers, I'd lay down Astroturf or
rocks but momma doesn't like either option. ;-)

-aki

>
>   From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 11:50:59 EDT
>   To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>   Subject: Re: To the rider in Clifton
>
> At 11:16 AM 4/19/04 -0400, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
> >
> >...I'll probaby try and go the loose (non-bagged) type this next time
> around. I'm told it's about half price even with delivery included,
over
> buying them bagged. Just need to check with the local landscaping
places
> to see who sells/delivers.
>
> Are you mulching for looks, or for organic content? If looks, your
plan
> sounds good. If you just want something to keep weeds down and to add
> organic stuff to the soil as it rots, consider calling a tree service.
All
> that stuff that flies ouf of those big chippers they use has to go
> somewhere...and mostly it gets dumped in the driveways of people who
want
> it for mulch...it's free. Not as pretty as the pine bark stuff, but
free.
>
> -- Mike B.
>
>
*************************************************************************
***
> *       Mike Bartman       *   Puzzles Pondered    Obfuscation
Obliterated *
> * Omniphiles International * Confusion Canceled       Opinions Offered
*
> *    omni@XXXXXX    *   Options Outlined       Smiles Stimulated    *
> *----------------------------------------------------------------------
----*
> *            "We do it all! No job too small! No price too high!
*
>
*************************************************************************
***
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 11:59:43 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:01:13 -0400
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 11:40 AM 4/19/04 -0400, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>> From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>

>> On the HOG ride yesterday only one rider in our group (17 bikes) had a
beer
>> with lunch. One beer. Despite it being at Hooters, with really cute
young
>> girls offering beers every 30 seconds to anyone who passed. I had
>> lemonade, most had Pepsi or iced tea.
>>
>
>ack!   What HOG ride yesterday?   From Patriot?   Missed that one.

Montgomery County HOGs...sponsored by Battley's (Rockville H-D). The
Poker
Run itself was sponsored by a Delaware group and started from Mike's
Famous.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:01:22 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Ryan Santoso'" <santosor2001@XXXXXX>, "'dan'" <dan@XXXXXX>,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:01:12 -0400

Yeah I couldn't understand it. My folks are from the Halifax area and
there
is some sweet roads there and most of the guys/girls that ride there are
just in the high speed straight stuff. I plan on going to deals gap in
June
I can't wait.

-----Original Message-----
From: Ryan Santoso [mailto:santosor2001@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 11:45 AM
To: Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS); 'dan'; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?


I live in NC now (former DC resident) and that
observation is 100% true. Its amazing here, in the
Piedmont, we are literally few miles away from some of
the best twisties, yet majority of the folks have
their bikes extended. Its really strange, i would
think there would be far more canyon carvers.

Went to Deal's Gap (3 hours away from me) and most of
the folk there are from out of state (hardly any
locals).

As far as the gear goes, I may be one of the few that
uses a one piece leathers when i go out there. I value
my skin far more than most folks here i guess...
Ryan




--- "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)"
<Silvera@XXXXXX> wrote:
> I went to NC to visit some relatives and stuff and
> noticed every rider and I
> mean everyone I saw had no gear just a helmet on. I
> guess they spent all
> there money on chrome and extended swing arm.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dan [mailto:dan@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 7:28 AM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>
> It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I
> noticed it that over
> 1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going
> gearless these days. I
> usually see one or two people in
> shorts/t-shirt/tennis shoes, but it seems
> this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the
> same?
>
> Dan
>




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:06:49 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:06:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: That time of year... was Riders w/o Gear ...
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Seems as though the same temperature requirements that bring up the
cicadas bring
out the Harley guys (except of course the dc-cycles hard-core types). The
garage
in Crystal City this morning has the first six assorted HDs of the season
surrounding my lonely little Honda.

-- Larry
__________________________________
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Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:07:06 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:06:56 -0400


>
> From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon AM 11:58:55 EDT
> To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
>
> At 11:38 AM 4/19/04 -0400, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>
> >Just 18 yards? Doesn't seem like much. The 25 bags I got were 3 cubic
> feet each. Any idea how much it cost you? I figure I'll need about 25
> more cubic yards of this stuff, (note to self, NEVER buy a house again
> where the entire back yard doesn't grow grass).
>
> Ummm...assuming "18 yards" means "18 cubic yards", that would be
equivalent
> to 162 of your bags...there are 27 cubic feet in a cubic yard...not 3.
18
> cubic yards is 486 cubic feet.

ah..damn..been helping my daughter with her "new math" homework again.
8-P

>
> >obmoto: For those that are Harley owners on the list I tried the Syn3
oil
> this go around. Don't waste your money. It doesn't cool any better or
> shift any better than the old tried and true Mobil 1 15w50 only it
costs
> twice as much.
>
> I thought the benefit was in reduced wear, not cooking or shifting?

...actually the reduced wear was something they touted just because it's
a synthetic. Not because it's anything different than any other
synthetic out there. However, the dealers also state that it's better at
cooling and will shift better than "other" synthetics. Tis not true. My
wallet is the only thing that noticed any significant difference between
Syn3 and M1.

-aki



>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's
mistakes
> is better.
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:23:03 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:22:30 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin

Rob Sharp wrote:

> You guys are *WAY* to serious.

That's what I was just thinking.

I was going to post a clarification that millage is completely
irrelivant (given that you could hop on the highway and ride in a
straight line for 50 miles and not accomplish a thing) and that, as I
said in my original post, increasing lean angle gradually until the tire
is scuffed is the key ... but I'd just be stroking my ego some more.

- Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:25:54 2004
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:25:50 -0400
From: "Sean Brady" <sbrady@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

First time mailer here, so be gentle...

Gearwise I would say at least half the riders I passed were sans leather
coat. I wore my standard gear, but omitted the gloves (*hangs head in
shame*). I still got hot, but felt better given the number of crazy
cagers that were driving about.

I'm seeing more of those fake helmets, even in VA. I wear the full
faced ones, but I've pondered going for the open faced (but still DoT or
Snell approved). I cannot fathom why some ride with those pseudo german
helmets for protection... They may be the best riders in the world, but
all it takes is one idiot on 4 wheels and its all over.

Sean



-----Original Message-----
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 9:21 AM
To: dan@XXXXXX; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

Yep. Saw my share of them this weekend. I wasn't one of them though.
Jacket, jeans, gloves, boots and helmet for me. :-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 7:27:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
dan@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that
over
> 1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless these days. I
> usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis
> shoes, but it seems
> this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
>
> Dan




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:37:25 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:37:12 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Speaking of Helmets
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Paul W. came and picked it up last week. He rode home with it on so, I'm
assuming it fit OK. He said that if he decides not to keep it, Robert V.
is next in line. Then Aki and Chris W.

Scooter

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:44:54 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Speaking of Helmets
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:44:45 -0400
You did tell Paul and Robert about the "stuff" that was in the lining
right? I mean you *did* get it all cleaned out just like the Department
of Health required right?    ;-)


>
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon PM 12:37:12 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Speaking of Helmets
>
> Paul W. came and picked it up last week. He rode home with it on so,
I'm assuming it fit OK. He said that if he decides not to keep it,
Robert V. is next in line. Then Aki and Chris W.
>
> Scooter
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:47:22 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:47:11 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)

At 11:38 AM 4/19/2004, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>Just 18 yards? Doesn't seem like much. The 25 bags I got were 3 cubic
>feet each. Any idea how much it cost you? I figure I'll need about 25
>more cubic yards of this stuff, (note to self, NEVER buy a house again
>where the entire back yard doesn't grow grass).

18 yards is two small dump trucks, or one very large dump truck (it was
about the size of a sea trailer). Each bag is 3 cu feet. 9 bags per
yard. ~162 bags.

Lunch ride was great.   All vents opened along with the throttle.

They put a 5 Guys in Herndon at Lawyers / West Ox.   If only they had a
deck....



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:53:30 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:53:14 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
To: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Rob Sharp wrote:
>
> > You guys are *WAY* to serious.
>
> That's what I was just thinking.
>
> I was going to post a clarification that millage is
> completely
> irrelivant (given that you could hop on the highway and
> ride in a
> straight line for 50 miles and not accomplish a thing)
> and that, as I
> said in my original post, increasing lean angle gradually
> until the tire
> is scuffed is the key ... but I'd just be stroking my ego
> some more.

not to mention the harm you'd be doing to the newbies by
giving them accurate information/advice.



--
tg




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:53:52 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:53:39 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Tire Breakin
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162


Others might say you're stroking something other than your ego.   LOL

Scooter (sorry, couldn't resist.   ;-))
In a message dated 4/19/2004 12:22:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
roach@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Rob Sharp wrote:
>
> > You guys are *WAY* to serious.
>
> That's what I was just thinking.
>
> I was going to post a clarification that millage is completely
> irrelivant (given that you could hop on the highway and ride in a
> straight line for 50 miles and not accomplish a thing) and that, as I
> said in my original post, increasing lean angle gradually until the
tire
> is scuffed is the key ... but I'd just be stroking my ego
> some more.
>
> - Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:54:03 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:50:13 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 11:38 AM 4/19/2004, Rob Sharp wrote:
>I got no problem wearing gear till you get stuck in stop and go traffic.
Then
>I hate it. I know the solution is to stay outta that situation but I
was just
>riding around and didn't know I was screwed till I hopped on the
beltway.

When Clifton dead stops (yes, it happens daily) and I know it will be 15
minutes before I'm moving much again, I just stuff my jacket between my
crotch, legs and tank. If an oncoming driver swerves into the line of
stopped cars, I'm screwed, but at least I won't melt. I've suffered heat
stroke before. It isn't fun.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:54:52 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:54:45 -0400

Got dinner at a trendy place in DC with a ladyfriend on Sat. She's never
complained about having to wear a jacket, which I appreciate. She has
said
she feels like a dork in gear, which I understand. Any ways we're
waiting
at the hostess stand and about 8 girls were sitting waiting behind us.
One
of them asked her where she got her jacket. She says they'll have to ask
me. I told them where. They told her they thought the JR Phoenix (gray)
was cool.

>From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:41:02 -0400 (EDT)
>
>On Mon, 19 Apr 2004, John White wrote:
>Phoenix, keeps me nice and cool, even while stopped.

_________________________________________________________________
Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN
Premium!
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us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:56:35 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:56:27 -0400

They make perforated gloves.

>From: "Sean Brady" <sbrady@XXXXXX>
>To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:25:50 -0400
>
>Gearwise I would say at least half the riders I passed were sans leather
>coat. I wore my standard gear, but omitted the gloves (*hangs head in
>shame*). I still got hot, but felt better given the number of crazy
>cagers that were driving about.

_________________________________________________________________
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and
safe. http://specials.msn.com/msn/security.asp

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:57:09 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:57:00 -0400


>
> From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon PM 12:47:11 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
>
> At 11:38 AM 4/19/2004, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
> >Just 18 yards? Doesn't seem like much. The 25 bags I got were 3 cubic
> >feet each. Any idea how much it cost you? I figure I'll need about
25
> >more cubic yards of this stuff, (note to self, NEVER buy a house again
> >where the entire back yard doesn't grow grass).
>
> 18 yards is two small dump trucks, or one very large dump truck (it was
> about the size of a sea trailer). Each bag is 3 cu feet. 9 bags per
> yard. ~162 bags.


yeesh...probably half that amount would be enough then.   Just gotta find
out how much that is in $$ incl delivery.

>
> Lunch ride was great. All vents opened along with the throttle.
>
> They put a 5 Guys in Herndon at Lawyers / West Ox. If only they had a
deck....


yup yup..in Foxmill IIRC.   Used to be a Micky Dee's, never
much business.

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 12:59:33 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 12:59:20 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Fresh Meat. GET'IM!!! hehe Sean, welcome to the insanity that is DC
Cycles. You SHOULD hang you head in shame for not wearing gloves.
Shame, shame, SHAME!!! ;-) Next to a helmet, I think gloves are the
next most important pieces of gear to have. When you go down, the first
things to go out are your hands to try and stop you.   However, I think we
can forgive you. THIS time. Welcome aboard.

Oh, and the reason people ride in those pseudo helmets is called
Darwinism at Work. hehe

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 12:25:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
sbrady@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> First time mailer here, so be gentle...
>
> Gearwise I would say at least half the riders I passed were sans
leather
> coat. I wore my standard gear, but omitted the gloves (*hangs head in
> shame*). I still got hot, but felt better given the number of crazy
> cagers that were driving about.
>
> I'm seeing more of those fake helmets, even in VA. I wear the full
> faced ones, but I've pondered going for the open faced (but still DoT
or
> Snell approved). I cannot fathom why some ride with those pseudo
german
> helmets for protection... They may be the best riders in the world, but
> all it takes is one idiot on 4 wheels and its all over.
>
> Sean
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 9:21 AM
> To: dan@XXXXXX; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
>
> Yep. Saw my share of them this weekend. I wasn't one of them though.
> Jacket, jeans, gloves, boots and helmet for me. :-)
>
> Scooter
>
> In a message dated 4/19/2004 7:27:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> dan@XXXXXX writes:
>
> >
> >
> > It was a gorgeous weekend for riding! One thing I noticed it that
> over
> > 1/2 of the non cruiser riding crowd is going gearless
> these days. I
> > usually see one or two people in shorts/t-shirt/tennis
>   > shoes, but it seems
>   > this year its about 50%, anyone else notice the same?
>   >
>   > Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 13:04:57 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 13:04:38 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: adamme1@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Speaking of Helmets
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Shhhhhh.....that was supposed to be a secret. LOL Anyway, Paul
responded that it doesn't quite fit right on his "bowling ball shaped"
head so, if it doesn't fit his wife, it goes to the next contestant,
Robert Verde.

Scooter (The saga continues)

In a message dated 4/19/2004 12:44:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
adamme1@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> You did tell Paul and Robert about the "stuff" that was in the lining
right? I mean you *did* get it all cleaned out just like the Department
of Health required right?    ;-)
>
>
> >
> > From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
> > Date: 2004/04/19 Mon PM 12:37:12 EDT
> > To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > Subject: Speaking of Helmets
> >
> > Paul W. came and picked it up last week. He rode home with it on so,
I'm assuming it fit OK. He said that if he decides not to keep it,
Robert V. is next in line. Then Aki and
> Chris W.
> >
> > Scooter
> >
> >

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 13:07:35 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Speaking of Helmets
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 13:07:21 -0400


>
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon PM 01:04:38 EDT
> To: adamme1@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Speaking of Helmets
>
> Shhhhhh.....that was supposed to be a secret. LOL Anyway, Paul
responded that it doesn't quite fit right on his "bowling ball shaped"
head so, if it doesn't fit his wife, it goes to the next contestant,
Robert Verde.
>


damn! Last time I saw anything passed around like this was on liberty
when I was in the Navy. ;-)


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 13:15:28 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 13:15:18 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Speaking of Helmets
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

What can I say, no one's head seems to be the right shape or size yet.
It will find a permanent home eventually. I'm just glad it's outta my
closet. LOL

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 1:07:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
adamme1@XXXXXX writes:

> > From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
> > Date: 2004/04/19 Mon PM 01:04:38 EDT
> > To: adamme1@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > Subject: Re: Speaking of Helmets
> >
> > Shhhhhh.....that was supposed to be a secret. LOL Anyway, Paul
responded that it doesn't quite fit right on his "bowling ball shaped"
head so, if it doesn't fit his wife, it goes to the next contestant,
Robert Verde.
> >
>
>
> damn! Last time I saw anything passed around like this was
> on liberty when I was in the Navy. ;-)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 13:18:41 2004
From: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Tire Break-in
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 13:24:39 -0400

Gimer Touted, "i'm with brian on this one. gradually lean the bike until
the edge is obtained (which i try to do only once the tires are
relatively
warm).   done."

<ewww> I'm agreeing with Tom </ewww> & Roach.

FWIW, For the last set of tires, I found a nice nearby concrete parking
lot
(Top of a multi level lot) in the evening after most had left. Did a
bunch
of left hand circles, then repeated with right hand circles. (The
rent-a-cop watched me from the door.)
I suppose you could do the same with a traffic circle followed by a
cloverleaf -- but -- watch for the ikky-poo on the cloverleafs.

Carl in Bethesda
(So, who didn't ride this week end?)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 13:28:44 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 13:30:14 -0400
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)

At 12:06 PM 4/19/04 -0400, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>> From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>

>> >obmoto: For those that are Harley owners on the list I tried the
Syn3 oil
>> this go around. Don't waste your money. It doesn't cool any better or
>> shift any better than the old tried and true Mobil 1 15w50 only it
costs
>> twice as much.
>>
>> I thought the benefit was in reduced wear, not cooking or shifting?
>
>...actually the reduced wear was something they touted just because it's
a
synthetic. Not because it's anything different than any other synthetic
out there. However, the dealers also state that it's better at cooling
and
will shift better than "other" synthetics. Tis not true. My wallet is
the
only thing that noticed any significant difference between Syn3 and M1.

Thanks for the warning then.

My bike doesn't seem to have overheating problems anyway...even with
dinofluid. After the run up to Mike's yesterday it was still reading the
same 220 degrees it reads on local rides, or when stuck in traffic. The
ride up was mostly at 60-75 mph, with short bursts up to 80 or a little
over here and there to avoid problems or get formed up again after toll
plazas. Average traffic speed in other words...

-- Mike B.
'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 13:36:47 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 10:36:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: To the rider in Clifton (mulch)
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Actually a couple of the Fairfax locations have
loaders. Roll your truck up, push the button and the
bed is full.

Glenn

--- Troutman <mike@XXXXXX> wrote:
<snip> But then you
> have to shovel it into your truck (or bags in your
> car) then shovel it out
> to a cart, then to the beds. With bags and a
> pallet,




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 13:48:29 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 13:49:53 -0400
To: "Sean Brady" <sbrady@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 12:25 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Sean Brady wrote:

>I'm seeing more of those fake helmets, even in VA. I wear the full
>faced ones, but I've pondered going for the open faced (but still DoT or
>Snell approved). I cannot fathom why some ride with those pseudo german
>helmets for protection... They may be the best riders in the world, but
>all it takes is one idiot on 4 wheels and its all over.

If you mean the half-helmets (whether gloss black, flat black, mirrored,
or
covered with flags or whatever), they aren't "fake"...every one is DOT
approved. Check the labels. SNELL won't approve them, but DOT has lower
standards.
As to why they wear them, it's for the same reasons that people ride at
all. I got a cheapie version of one last week, and tried it out on a
ride
for gas last Friday night. You can hear better, see better, and feel the
wind better than with any full-face helmet. In fact, a full-face helmet
is
the next best thing to being in a car as far as experiencing the
environment goes.

That said, please note that I wore my full face helmet for the highway
ride
yesterday, despite the heat. I may wear the half-helmet for local rides
on
back roads sometimes, but for high speeds I'll take the full face...or
maybe a 3/4 someday.

The half-helmets are still bigger and beefier than bike helmets for pedal
bikes...and pedal bikes can easily hit 35-40 mph. If there's no problem
with a guy on a 10-speed with a beenie cap, why should there be on a
motorcycle rider at similar speeds? Heck, I never wore a helmet, or
safety
glasses, on a pedal bike until I was in my 30s! It was pretty much
completely unheard of when I was growing up (and all of my friends and
neighbors survived just fine anyway BTW).

As far as risk from cars goes, not everyone has the same philosophy when
it
comes to death as you do, just like yours is obviously different from
those
who wouldn't even consider a "two-wheeled death trap" for transport. You
ride a bike because the benefits to your life experience outweigh the
increased risk, in your opinion (and when it comes to your life, who
else's
counts?). The same is true for the half-helmet folks, and for the
no-helmet folks in areas where helmets are optional.

There's no reason to try to exist for 90 years if you are going to avoid
everything along the way that might reduce your chances of making it to
that age. Being bored stiff for 90 years is not a goal I think worth the
effort. If you agree with that, the rest is just opinions on what risks
are worth the rewards associated with taking them. Everyone has
different
conclusions on that. Some rule out bikes entirely. Some ride, but rule
out anything short of full race gear. Others go with jackets and jeans
and
full face, some are comfortable with T-shirt, leather vest and a
beenie...or just sunglasses. In all cases the one bearing the brunt of
any
"payment" for their decision is the person making the decision. Others
may
be affected, but in a society that's true of *anything* you do, or don't
do. In a free society we agree to accept that situation in return for
the
freedom. Many don't seem to find that good though, so our society isn't
as
free as it was when I was a kid. Not by a long shot, and it continues to
deteriorate as the do-gooders force their opinions about what risks are
acceptable onto everyone else, while patting themselves on the back for
taking away freedom. Fuck 'em.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:16:18 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Troutman'" <mike@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:16:07 -0400

Heat stroke is no fun been there before. I just got back from a ride
through
the park and to cycles to see the new Honda 1000rr :) more like drool but
I
was in a hurry this morning and just through on my vanson and forgot it
was
going to be HOT today. I thought I'd melt out there I am not used to the
heat yet. Got a phoenix that is great for the hot weather.

-----Original Message-----
From: Troutman [mailto:mike@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 12:50 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 11:38 AM 4/19/2004, Rob Sharp wrote:
>I got no problem wearing gear till you get stuck in stop and go traffic.
Then
>I hate it. I know the solution is to stay outta that situation but I
was
just
>riding around and didn't know I was screwed till I hopped on the
beltway.

When Clifton dead stops (yes, it happens daily) and I know it will be 15
minutes before I'm moving much again, I just stuff my jacket between my
crotch, legs and tank. If an oncoming driver swerves into the line of
stopped cars, I'm screwed, but at least I won't melt. I've suffered heat
stroke before. It isn't fun.
___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:19:59 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:19:54 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: More on Roof Boxer helmet

http://www.roof.fr/ro5boxer.htm

Interesting concept, just wish it fit my head shape.   :(



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:21:25 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:21:11 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: speaking of helmets

-----Original Message-----
From: adamme1@XXXXXX

You did tell Paul and Robert about the "stuff" that was in the lining
right? I mean you *did* get it all cleaned out just like the Department
of Health
required right?    ;-)


>
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX

>
> Paul W. came and picked it up last week. He rode home with it on so,
I'm assuming
it fit OK. He said that if he decides not to keep it, Robert V. is next
in line.
Then Aki and Chris W.
>
> Scooter
--------------

Actually it doesn't fit me all that well (too small, wrong shape.) If
the wife doesn't like
it, it'll be up for grabs to the next lucky contestant, Robert Verde.

Nice concept. I think it would make a nice city helmet. I found it a
bit hot in
the 80s, with the chinbar down and faceshield closed. There is no
internal ventilation
system. You need to crack the faceshield. It's as quiet as my Shoei
RF800 and
appears well made, just not DOT-certified. It meets the arguably tougher
EU standards.

If y'all are wondering what we're talking about, it's the Roof Boxer.
http://www.onyerbike.net/roof.htm

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:28:49 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:28:07 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: More on Roof Boxer helmet

At 02:19 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
>http://www.roof.fr/ro5boxer.htm
>
>Interesting concept, just wish it fit my head shape.   :(

Cool idea!   Best of two worlds!   Are they available locally?

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:28:49 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:30:24 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: speaking of helmets

At 02:21 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:

>system.   You need to crack the faceshield.   It's as quiet as my Shoei
RF800 and
>appears well made, just not DOT-certified.     It meets the arguably
tougher
EU standards.

If it isn't   DOT-certified, does it still keep the helmet police from
writing you   up? I thought helmets had to have a DOT sticker to qualify
for
road use in   the USA?   Otherwise, people would put a chin strap on a salad
bowl and go   riding.

On second thought, the DOT would probably certify that...

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI    (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:31:03 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: speaking of helmets
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:30:53 -0400

Just go to any swap meet or bike rally.     You can
buy a DOT sticker for a buck.

-aki

>
> From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/19 Mon PM 02:30:24 EDT
> To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: speaking of helmets
>
> At 02:21 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
>
> >system. You need to crack the faceshield. It's as quiet as my Shoei
> RF800 and
> >appears well made, just not DOT-certified. It meets the arguably
tougher
> EU standards.
>
> If it isn't DOT-certified, does it still keep the helmet police from
> writing you up? I thought helmets had to have a DOT sticker to qualify
for
> road use in the USA? Otherwise, people would put a chin strap on a
salad
> bowl and go riding.
>
> On second thought, the DOT would probably certify that...
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's
mistakes
> is better.
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:31:03 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:30:47 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: More on Roof Boxer helmet
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

If you do a Google search for +roof +boxer +helmet, you'll get a good
selection of sites that sell them (in English :-)) and a few reviews
also. Just remember, if you want to buy one, the sizes aren't what they
seem. I bought a small because I have a small Shoei RF700 head. I
should have bought an XS instead.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 2:19:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
viffermaniac@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>   http://www.roof.fr/ro5boxer.htm
>
>   Interesting concept, just wish it fit my head shape.   :(
>
>
>
>   Paul in DC
>   95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:32:40 2004
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:32:37 -0400
From: "Sean Brady" <sbrady@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


You misunderstand slightly... because I do not understand, does not make
me say "THOU SHALT DO AS I DO" -- I hate that about government. It does
makes me stop and say "Why? Or Why bother?"? -- your reply gives some
perspective on that, although I have yet to take my pedal bike above 25
for any sustained periods. And I rarely see a ten-speed on a major
highway driving along with other cars... but maybe I don't ride the same
roads where the pedal bikers ride =)

I do remember riding my ten speed as a youth, sans helmet. Then again,
I didn't live in an urban environment like Northern VA has become.

Interesting sideline... how many folks with the "German Army" helms also
have a windscreen on their bike? For those that do, doesn't the
windscreen impede the environment experience as much as a full helm?

If you want the "close to the car" experience, I'd suggest trying a
Honda Goldwing (with the heating, air conditioning, am/fm Stereo with
the plush leather seats). Those are closer to cars than a full helm.

For helmet choices, pick what you want, wear it as you want. Me, I'll
take my risks where I like, and the helmet isn't a place I choose to
compromise. I go no windscreen, and open the face plate up when I need
it... works for me.

Final point -- I said pseudo german helmet -- emphasizing fake german,
not fake helmets.

Sean


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Bartman [mailto:omni@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 1:50 PM
To: Sean Brady; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 12:25 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Sean Brady wrote:

>I'm seeing more of those fake helmets, even in VA. I wear the full
>faced ones, but I've pondered going for the open faced (but still DoT
or
>Snell approved). I cannot fathom why some ride with those pseudo
german
>helmets for protection... They may be the best riders in the world, but
>all it takes is one idiot on 4 wheels and its all over.

If you mean the half-helmets (whether gloss black, flat black, mirrored,
or
covered with flags or whatever), they aren't "fake"...every one is DOT
approved. Check the labels. SNELL won't approve them, but DOT has
lower
standards.

As to why they wear them, it's for the same reasons that people ride at
all. I got a cheapie version of one last week, and tried it out on a
ride
for gas last Friday night. You can hear better, see better, and feel
the
wind better than with any full-face helmet. In fact, a full-face helmet
is
the next best thing to being in a car as far as experiencing the
environment goes.

That said, please note that I wore my full face helmet for the highway
ride
yesterday, despite the heat. I may wear the half-helmet for local rides
on
back roads sometimes, but for high speeds I'll take the full face...or
maybe a 3/4 someday.

The half-helmets are still bigger and beefier than bike helmets for
pedal
bikes...and pedal bikes can easily hit 35-40 mph. If there's no problem
with a guy on a 10-speed with a beenie cap, why should there be on a
motorcycle rider at similar speeds? Heck, I never wore a helmet, or
safety
glasses, on a pedal bike until I was in my 30s! It was pretty much
completely unheard of when I was growing up (and all of my friends and
neighbors survived just fine anyway BTW).

As far as risk from cars goes, not everyone has the same philosophy when
it
comes to death as you do, just like yours is obviously different from
those
who wouldn't even consider a "two-wheeled death trap" for transport.
You
ride a bike because the benefits to your life experience outweigh the
increased risk, in your opinion (and when it comes to your life, who
else's
counts?). The same is true for the half-helmet folks, and for the
no-helmet folks in areas where helmets are optional.

There's no reason to try to exist for 90 years if you are going to avoid
everything along the way that might reduce your chances of making it to
that age. Being bored stiff for 90 years is not a goal I think worth
the
effort. If you agree with that, the rest is just opinions on what risks
are worth the rewards associated with taking them. Everyone has
different
conclusions on that. Some rule out bikes entirely. Some ride, but rule
out anything short of full race gear. Others go with jackets and jeans
and
full face, some are comfortable with T-shirt, leather vest and a
beenie...or just sunglasses. In all cases the one bearing the brunt of
any
"payment" for their decision is the person making the decision. Others
may
be affected, but in a society that's true of *anything* you do, or don't
do. In a free society we agree to accept that situation in return for
the
freedom. Many don't seem to find that good though, so our society isn't
as
free as it was when I was a kid. Not by a long shot, and it continues
to
deteriorate as the do-gooders force their opinions about what risks are
acceptable onto everyone else, while patting themselves on the back for
taking away freedom. Fuck 'em.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:37:39 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:35:39 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: More on Roof Boxer helmet

That, and they don't fit a lot of heads.

ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>
> If you do a Google search for +roof +boxer +helmet, you'll get a good
selection of sites that sell them (in English :-)) and a few reviews
also. Just remember, if you want to buy one, the sizes aren't what they
seem. I bought a small because I have a small Shoei RF700 head. I
should have bought an XS instead.
>
> Scooter
>
> In a message dated 4/19/2004 2:19:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
viffermaniac@XXXXXX writes:
>
> >
> >
> > http://www.roof.fr/ro5boxer.htm
> >
> > Interesting concept, just wish it fit my head shape. :(
> >
> >
> >
> > Paul in DC
> > 95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:44:59 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:44:39 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>, Sean Brady <sbrady@XXXXXX>,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?



-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>

At 12:25 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Sean Brady wrote:

>I'm seeing more of those fake helmets, even in VA. I wear the full
>faced ones, but I've pondered going for the open faced (but still DoT or
>Snell approved). I cannot fathom why some ride with those pseudo german
>helmets for protection... They may be the best riders in the world, but
>all it takes is one idiot on 4 wheels and its all over.

If you mean the half-helmets (whether gloss black, flat black, mirrored,
or
covered with flags or whatever), they aren't "fake"...every one is DOT
approved. Check the labels. SNELL won't approve them, but DOT has lower
standards.

---------
It's pretty easy to spot a salad bowl "novelty" helmet, even from a
considerable distance. The novelty jobs don't have the thick foam layer,
so they don't offer much projection off the rider's head. If it fits in
close and tight, it's prolly a non-DOT helmet.

--------

As to why they wear them, it's for the same reasons that people ride at
all. I got a cheapie version of one last week, and tried it out on a
ride
for gas last Friday night. You can hear better, see better, and feel the
wind better than with any full-face helmet. In fact, a full-face helmet
is
the next best thing to being in a car as far as experiencing the
environment goes.

--------

Erm, no. On both of my bikes, I'm up in the wind a good bit. I can
hear, see, taste, smell, "experience" the environment inside my full face
just fine. And there are parts of the environment I don't care to
experience, like the sting of bugs and rain at 70 per. Or the pigeon
parts that hurtled my way, after said bird hit the car in front of me, as
happened when I was cruising around Norfolk a couple of years again.

Personally, if I didn't wear a full face, I wouldn't ride at all. But,
it's your head...... At the risk of appearing vain, I like my chin, nose
and teeth just the way they are.

BTW, if you think the risk of crashing on short low-speed trips is lower
and therefore you can "get by" with less protection, Harry Hurt doesn't
agree with you.   Furthermore, if you can predict where, how and when
you're going to crash, you should quit your day job. Clairvoyance like
that should be rewarded handsomely by playing the ponies, the lottery and
the stock market.
-----------

The half-helmets are still bigger and beefier than bike helmets for pedal
bikes...and pedal bikes can easily hit 35-40 mph. If there's no problem
with a guy on a 10-speed with a beenie cap, why should there be on a
motorcycle rider at similar speeds?

-----------

Yeah and cyclists wear lycra shorts, ankle protection consisting of socks
and a thin jersey. You wanna wear that on a motorcycle? Didn't think
so. Different vehicle, different requirements. For one thing, cyclist
don't have the potential for 500 pounds-plus of hot metal and flammable
liquids chasing them when they go down. Also, it's very hard to high-
side a bicycle, get thrown into the air and land on your head.

[Rest deleted]   :)



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 14:59:22 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 11:59:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mary Canterbury <mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX>
Subject: On it's side (again)
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I guess my bike is cursed. Or I just don't live in a
very considerate neighborhood. I noticed something
shiney lying on the pavement next to my bike today. I
picked it up and it's a bolt connected to a cracked
piece of my fairing. I took the cover off the bike
and it's a wreck!!!

The fairing is all cracked to hell. Both turn signals
on the presumably downed side are hanging by a thread;
what's left of them. The brake lever is curled like
it was made out of tin foil. And the topper is that
the handle bar is bent to the point of almost touching
the gas tank.

UGH!!!

So, I've been looking up prices of parts. Whew! Then
the question is how to do I fix it all? Do I try to
fix it myself or take it somewhere.

I'm almost afraid to ask, but anyone have any
thoughts?
It's a 2000 EX500. It's been dropped (not by me) two
times that I know of. This time they really did a
number on it, but someone picked it back up because I
didn't see it on it's side this time...

Dismayed in Arlington,
Mary




=====
"Wrinkles only go where the smiles have been."




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:09:21 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Mary Canterbury'" <mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: On it's side (again)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:09:06 -0400

Sorry to hear that. You should try eBay or maybe someone on the list
knows
of a Motorcycle salvage place you can get your parts from. You can
usually
pick up some cheap parts there. A friend of mine has had his bike moved
out
of it's parking space to make room for some SOB's car.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mary Canterbury [mailto:mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 2:59 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: On it's side (again)

I guess my bike is cursed. Or I just don't live in a
very considerate neighborhood. I noticed something
shiney lying on the pavement next to my bike today. I
picked it up and it's a bolt connected to a cracked
piece of my fairing. I took the cover off the bike
and it's a wreck!!!

The fairing is all cracked to hell. Both turn signals
on the presumably downed side are hanging by a thread;
what's left of them. The brake lever is curled like
it was made out of tin foil. And the topper is that
the handle bar is bent to the point of almost touching
the gas tank.

UGH!!!

So, I've been looking up prices of parts. Whew! Then
the question is how to do I fix it all? Do I try to
fix it myself or take it somewhere.

I'm almost afraid to ask, but anyone have any
thoughts?

It's a 2000 EX500. It's been dropped (not by me) two
times that I know of. This time they really did a
number on it, but someone picked it back up because I
didn't see it on it's side this time...

Dismayed in Arlington,
Mary




=====
"Wrinkles only go where the smiles have been."




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:13:09 2004
Subject: RE: On it's side (again)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:16:23 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Mary Canterbury" <mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


I know your pain. Having had this happen to me. I checked out
www.bikebandit.com. I got the part numbers and shopped around. I found a
tail section on eBay and checked out a few other sites. Ultimately the
cheapest I found with shipping included was 1100. Coleman's did it for
me for 1300 and it was good work and quickly taken care of.
You can try calling around. I called to a few other local shops but had
trouble getting a quote. Hey I would suggest orange cones if it is your
regular spot.



-----Original Message-----
From: Mary Canterbury [mailto:mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 2:59 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: On it's side (again)

I guess my bike is cursed. Or I just don't live in a very considerate
neighborhood. I noticed something shiney lying on the pavement next to
my bike today. I picked it up and it's a bolt connected to a cracked
piece of my fairing. I took the cover off the bike and it's a wreck!!!

The fairing is all cracked to hell. Both turn signals on the presumably
downed side are hanging by a thread; what's left of them. The brake
lever is curled like it was made out of tin foil. And the topper is that
the handle bar is bent to the point of almost touching the gas tank.

UGH!!!

So, I've been looking up prices of parts. Whew! Then the question is
how to do I fix it all? Do I try to fix it myself or take it somewhere.

I'm almost afraid to ask, but anyone have any thoughts?

It's a 2000 EX500. It's been dropped (not by me) two times that I know
of. This time they really did a number on it, but someone picked it back
up because I didn't see it on it's side this time...

Dismayed in Arlington,
Mary




=====
"Wrinkles only go where the smiles have been."




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:13:38 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:13:20 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: On it's side (again)

At 02:59 PM 4/19/2004, Mary Canterbury wrote:
>I'm almost afraid to ask, but anyone have any
>thoughts?
Are you sure the wind didn't knock it over? Call the cops and report a
hit
and run, then contact your insurance company. Plastic bits are pricey
and
will add up quickly.

Two weeks ago I had to go to North Carolina on business. I was parked at
a
marina, and I saw a bike on its side under a bike cover. Strong wind
gusts
along the shore had picked up the center of the cover, acted like a sail
and thrown the bike over despite the owner using a bungee around the
middle
to keep that from happening.

Better to leave it uncovered and keep it upright.   Glad I have a garage
now!


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:16:17 2004
Subject: RE: On it's side (again)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:16:06 -0400
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "Mary Canterbury" <mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Mary;

Sorry to hear about the damage, Mary! Seems to be a recent thread about
motorists causing damage to motorcyclists... ;-/

I'm only speaking in generalities, but most of the parts should be
inexpensive as well as easy to replace, the one exception is probably the
faiing. Brake levers are usually under 20.00, depending on brand; turn
signals can be mildly expensive, but aftermarket replacements may be
cheaper. The fairing is the one piece I would guess is most expensive,
depending on the extent of damage and your sense of aesthetics, you may
wish to look at replacement plastic from someplace like the Plastic
Doctor (http://64.224.111.215/plasticdr/pricing.html). Replacement
fairings seem pretty pricy (checked a few online sources), insurance
might be the best route there.
Replacement should be a fairly easy matter, even for the handlebar, and
can probably be done with just the standard tool kit. Having access to a
decent socket set will ease the work, but in a pinch can be done without.
I'm sure there are folks on the list who can lend a hand, if you would
prefer that option (include me in the list, of course).

Regards,

Robert Verde



-----Original Message-----
From: Mary Canterbury [mailto:mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 2:59 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: On it's side (again)


I guess my bike is cursed. Or I just don't live in a
very considerate neighborhood. I noticed something
shiney lying on the pavement next to my bike today. I
picked it up and it's a bolt connected to a cracked
piece of my fairing. I took the cover off the bike
and it's a wreck!!!

The fairing is all cracked to hell. Both turn signals
on the presumably downed side are hanging by a thread;
what's left of them. The brake lever is curled like
it was made out of tin foil. And the topper is that
the handle bar is bent to the point of almost touching
the gas tank.

UGH!!!

So, I've been looking up prices of parts. Whew! Then
the question is how to do I fix it all? Do I try to
fix it myself or take it somewhere.

I'm almost afraid to ask, but anyone have any
thoughts?

It's a 2000 EX500. It's been dropped (not by me) two
times that I know of. This time they really did a
number on it, but someone picked it back up because I
didn't see it on it's side this time...

Dismayed in Arlington,
Mary


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:48:24 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:48:10 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: More on Roof Boxer helmet
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Not that I could find.   I had to order it online.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 2:28:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
omni@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> At 02:19 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
> >http://www.roof.fr/ro5boxer.htm
> >
> >Interesting concept, just wish it fit my head shape. :(
>
> Cool idea! Best of two worlds! Are they available locally?
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone
> else's mistakes
> is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:49:47 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:49:37 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: speaking of helmets
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Has anybody actually been pulled over and had their helmet checked to for
the DOT sticker? Hell, with all the custom paint jobs out there, how
would they know? :-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 2:30:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
omni@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> At 02:21 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
>
> >system. You need to crack the faceshield. It's as quiet as my Shoei
> RF800 and
> >appears well made, just not DOT-certified. It meets the arguably
tougher
> EU standards.
>
> If it isn't DOT-certified, does it still keep the helmet police from
> writing you up? I thought helmets had to have a DOT sticker to qualify
for
> road use in the USA? Otherwise, people would put a chin strap on a
salad
> bowl and go riding.
>
> On second thought, the DOT would probably certify that...
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone
> else's mistakes
> is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:52:50 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:52:37 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: More on Roof Boxer helmet
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

As we seem to be finding out.   LOL

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 2:35:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
skip@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> That, and they don't fit a lot of heads.
>
> ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> >
> > If you do a Google search for +roof +boxer +helmet, you'll get a good
selection of sites that sell them (in English :-)) and a few reviews
also. Just remember, if you want to buy one, the sizes aren't what they
seem. I bought a small because I have a small Shoei RF700 head.    I
should have bought an XS instead.
> >
> > Scooter
> >
> > In a message dated 4/19/2004 2:19:54 PM Eastern Daylight
> Time, viffermaniac@XXXXXX writes:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > http://www.roof.fr/ro5boxer.htm
>   >   >
>   >   > Interesting concept, just wish it fit my head shape.   :(
>   >   >
>   >   >
>   >   >
>   >   > Paul in DC
>   >   > 95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 15:55:58 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:55:47 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: On it's side (again)
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

In that event, some SOB's car would have had a few new additions to it.
;-)

Sorry to hear about your bike Mary.     At least they picked it up.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/19/2004 3:09:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
Silvera@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Sorry to hear that. You should try eBay or maybe someone on the list
knows
> of a Motorcycle salvage place you can get your parts from. You can
usually
> pick up some cheap parts there. A friend of mine has had
> his bike moved out
> of it's parking space to make room for some SOB's car.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mary Canterbury [mailto:mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 2:59 PM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: On it's side (again)
>
> I guess my bike is cursed. Or I just don't live in a
> very considerate neighborhood. I noticed something
> shiney lying on the pavement next to my bike today. I
> picked it up and it's a bolt connected to a cracked
> piece of my fairing. I took the cover off the bike
> and it's a wreck!!!
>
> The fairing is all cracked to hell. Both turn signals
> on the presumably downed side are hanging by a thread;
> what's left of them. The brake lever is curled like
> it was made out of tin foil. And the topper is that
> the handle bar is bent to the point of almost touching
> the gas tank.
>
>   UGH!!!
>
>   So, I've been looking up prices of parts. Whew! Then
>   the question is how to do I fix it all? Do I try to
>   fix it myself or take it somewhere.
>
>   I'm almost afraid to ask, but anyone have any
>   thoughts?
>
>   It's a 2000 EX500. It's been dropped (not by me) two
>   times that I know of. This time they really did a
>   number on it, but someone picked it back up because I
>   didn't see it on it's side this time...
>
>   Dismayed in Arlington,
>   Mary
>
>
>
>
>   =====
>   "Wrinkles only go where the smiles have been."
>
>
>
>
>   __________________________________
>   Do you Yahoo!?
>   Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
>   http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 16:01:30 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 15:30:33 -0400
To: "Sean Brady" <sbrady@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 02:32 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Sean Brady wrote:
>
>You misunderstand slightly... because I do not understand, does not make
>me say "THOU SHALT DO AS I DO" -- I hate that about government.

Sorry, didn't mean to imply you were a do-gooder.      I guess I trailed off
into a mini-rant there. A bit. ;-)

>It does
>makes me stop and say "Why?   Or Why bother?"?      -- your reply gives some
>perspective on that,

Good.   That's what I was going for.

>although I have yet to take my pedal bike above 25
>for any sustained periods.
Me either...hills aside.   I've don't 20-25 for several miles though...but
not recently. :)

>And I rarely see a ten-speed on a major
>highway driving along with other cars... but maybe I don't ride the same
>roads where the pedal bikers ride =)

Helmets aren't for cars. Helmets are for the ground, trees, or any other
hard surface you might land on. They can turn some fatal hits into
hospitalizations, and some hospitalizations into serious headaches, and
mild concussions into "Whew! That was close!". They aren't going to
protect you against everything, or even most things you'll encounter on a
highway.

If a car doing 50 hits you in the head, whether you are wearing a helmet
or
not, you are more than likely toast. Even if you were stopped at the
time.
 If you hit the wrong sort of hard thing while moving fast enough
yourself,
you are also done for (read about a guy who t-boned a car on his bike,
was
launched over the car, and went head first into the curb. He had a full
face helmet, but died instantly according to the autopsy. Skull
fractures,
compressed neck vertebrae, shutdown of critical systems (breathing,
heart,
etc.)...dead.

There were a number of discussions of things like concussion on an Aikido
list I used to be on. There was a lady doctor there who was a medical
examiner...she takes apart dead people to see what killed them, then
testifies about it in court. Her description of the brain was that it
was
kind of like a wet sponge...only not as strong. If you slosh it around
too
much, the connections separate, and you get brain damage...or death.
Even
if the skull stays intact. If the head accelerates too fast (either
speed
up or slow down), the skull may manage it, but the brain will "slosh"
inside the skull. When it slams into the inside of the skull, it can
bruise...that's a concussion (or worse). It can also bruise when it
sloshes back in some kinds of impact (one way they can tell the
difference
between a fall and a baseball bat injury). Helmets help here by having
crushable linings...by crushing they slow the skull down...but not all at
once. It stops over an inch or so of travel, and that lowers the
acceleration involved considerably...but if that's not enough, you get
injury anyway. They can also help with penetration injuries to an
extent,
by being tougher than bone, and spreading the impact over a larger area.
The upshot of this is that you can fall down while walking and hit your
head hard enough to kill you. Do you wear a helmet while walking? I
doubt
it. Someday that will probably be mandatory though...the do-gooders will
trot out some poor young person who tripped on their slippers and
permanently maimed themselves on the front steps, the politicians will
moan
about "for the children" and how much it costs to treat these people (in
dollars, where it's a scarry figure, not in percentage of the budget
where
it's almost invisible), and we'll get a mandatory helmet law for fetching
the newspaper. Laugh if you like, the current helmet and seatbelt laws
would have been just as silly-sounding when I was a kid, and they got
passed.

>I do remember riding my ten speed as a youth, sans helmet. Then again,
>I didn't live in an urban environment like Northern VA has become.

Did you have paved roads?   Trees?   Rocks?

>Interesting sideline... how many folks with the "German Army" helms also
>have a windscreen on their bike? For those that do, doesn't the
>windscreen impede the environment experience as much as a full helm?

I do. Depends what you consider "the experience" to be. Wind in your
face? No impairment. Smells? Sounds? Sights? No impairment.
Hurricane
trying to shove you off the rear of the bike? Ok, that part is impaired.
Of course, if I want that, I can remove my windsheild in 10 seconds
without
tools...and put it back on almost as fast.

>If you want the "close to the car" experience, I'd suggest trying a
>Honda Goldwing (with the heating, air conditioning, am/fm Stereo with
>the plush leather seats). Those are closer to cars than a full helm.

Depends whether you wear a helmet, and what kind.   :-)

>For helmet choices, pick what you want, wear it as you want. Me, I'll
>take my risks where I like, and the helmet isn't a place I choose to
>compromise. I go no windscreen, and open the face plate up when I need
>it... works for me.

I used the windshield yesterday, and opened the face shield when we were
below 40mph (the sunglasses protected my eyes well enough). Much faster
than that and it starts catching too much wind.

>Final point -- I said pseudo german helmet -- emphasizing fake german,
>not fake helmets.

You said that, but before you said that, you said, "I'm seeing more of
those fake helmets, even in VA." That's where I got the idea you meant
fake helmets. ;-)
-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 16:09:24 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 16:06:27 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   Sean Brady <sbrady@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 02:44 PM 4/19/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
>---------
>It's pretty easy to spot a salad bowl "novelty" helmet, even from a
considerable distance. The novelty jobs don't have the thick foam layer,
so they don't offer much projection off the rider's head. If it fits in
close and tight, it's prolly a non-DOT helmet.
>--------

On the "close and tight" thing, I agree...but the half-helmets with the
DOT
stickers do have padding...as much as my full-face does. They just don't
have it in as many places.

>wind better than with any full-face helmet. In fact, a full-face helmet
is
>the next best thing to being in a car as far as experiencing the
>environment goes.
>--------
>Erm, no.

Erm, yes.

>On both of my bikes, I'm up in the wind a good bit. I can hear, see,
taste, smell, "experience" the environment inside my full face just fine.

Have you ridden with a half-helmet? If not, you don't know what you are
talking about. I've done both now, half and full, and there is a very
large difference in the experience.

>Personally, if I didn't wear a full face, I wouldn't ride at all. But,
it's your head...... At the risk of appearing vain, I like my chin, nose
and teeth just the way they are.

I agree with you there...that's why I've always worn a full face helmet
when I've ridden, and why I wore one yesterday despite having a choice in
the closet when I left.

At 70 mph (or faster...) there's so much force involved in an impact, and
it will happen so fast, that doing much at all to limit injury is pretty
much out. I'm just a ballistic body at that point, and what I'm wearing
will protect me or not.

At slower speeds there's far less energy involved, and there's a fair
chance of my reacting in time to have some say in how I hit. I've
crashed
on pedal bikes at 10-15 mph before, with no protective gear at all
(wearing
shorts, sneakers and T-shirt in fact), and gotten nothing more than minor
scrapes...even on pavement (ok, once I managed to hit my forehead and got
a
slight concussion, but it had no lasting efffffffeeeeeecccccczzzzzzzzz at
all. Really!). I've crashed on dirt up to about 25 mph, and had time to
pick how I landed (I rolled...and I was wearing a helmet, but it didn't
hit
anything). My only street "wreck" so far on a moto-bike happened at
something under walking speed (I was doing 45 mph, but managed to lose
*almost* all of it before contact) and also didn't involve the helmet
hitting anything...in fact, I didn't go down...the bike did.

Based on the above experience, and knowing how I ride and where, there
are
times when a half-helmet will be perfectly adequate. It will protect me
from most of the likely circumstances well enough...though not as well as
a
full-face would. At other times, nothing less than a full-face is going
to
be acceptable (like the ride yesterday, which was mostly highway).

What I'd really like to do is figure out a simple, easy way to carry my
full-face when I'm not wearing it, and switch back and forth as seems
reasonable. The half helmet will fit in a saddle bag without problems,
but
the full-face won't. I don't trust cargo nets on sports racks all that
much or that would work. Too much chance for vibration to result in
rubbing that will damage the helmet. Maybe I'll make some sort of holder
to clamp on there.

>BTW, if you think the risk of crashing on short low-speed trips is lower
and therefore you can "get by" with less protection, Harry Hurt doesn't
agree with you.

The risk of crashing may or may not be different (too many factors for a
simple rule), but the energy involved and the speeds that events will
happen are very different for sure. The 35 mph trip through sleepy
residential streets on Friday was a very different thing from the 75 mph
group ride up I-95 north of Baltimore on Sunday. A half helmet protects
pretty well where it covers...it just doesn't cover as much. Lower face,
jawline, ears and above the neck in back are not protected like they
would
be with a full face. Slower speed crashes are less likely to cause
damage
there than high speed, and besides, at my age, who gives a damn? What, I
won't be *pretty* anymore?   :-/

>-----------
>The half-helmets are still bigger and beefier than bike helmets for
pedal
>bikes...and pedal bikes can easily hit 35-40 mph. If there's no problem
>with a guy on a 10-speed with a beenie cap, why should there be on a
>motorcycle rider at similar speeds?
>-----------
>
>Yeah and cyclists wear lycra shorts, ankle protection consisting of
socks
and a thin jersey. You wanna wear that on a motorcycle? Didn't think
so.
Different vehicle, different requirements.

Depends. At 30 mph they have the same crash energy, and are likely to
result in the same injuries. Are the bike riders insane for not wearing
leathers? Or are the moto-riders overly fearful?

Neither, really. Moto-riders dress for the potential, not for every
situation. They don't need all that much protection at 30 mph
either...they dress for 70. The pedal bikers can't get to 70 (unless
they
ride off a cliff), so they don't need to worry about that. Both have the
same concerns with cars...or, rather, the pedal bikers actually have
more,
since they have higher relative speeds than moto-bikers do.   If I'm
going
to ride at speeds similar to a pedal-biker on a given ride, I don't
really
need the protection designed for a 70 mph crash...on that ride. Next
ride
may be different. I might even get hit by a bus, in which case it won't
matter a fig what I'm wearing, or riding. Even wearing a Chevy wouldn't
help a whole lot.

>For one thing, cyclist don't have the potential for 500 pounds-plus of
hot
metal and flammable liquids chasing them when they go down.

So, how many riders wear Nomex with steel reinforcement to handle that?
And have built-in O2 supplies to let them get out of the flaming fuel
puddle with their lungs intact? I mean on the street, not on a
track...I'm
sure all the top fuel drag bikers wear that stuff. Their funny-car
friends
do.

> Also, it's very hard to high-side a bicycle, get thrown into the air
and
land on your head.
Really? Tough to do that on a moto at slower speeds too. I've high-
sided
a bicycle once or twice, but at slow speeds it's just awkward, not life
threatening. Completely hosed my front wheel once though, without my
falling down. No stops in the forks on a bicycle...when it goes
perpendicular to travel, it rolls under...spokes through inner tubes,
rider
staggers over the thing trying not to trip while losing velocity, etc..
Then you get to walk it home on the rear tire...something you can't do on
a
moto! ;-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 16:12:24 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 16:09:22 -0400
To: Mary Canterbury <mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: On it's side (again)

At 11:59 AM 4/19/04 -0700, Mary Canterbury wrote:

>So, I've been looking up prices of parts. Whew! Then
>the question is how to do I fix it all? Do I try to
>fix it myself or take it somewhere.
>
>I'm almost afraid to ask, but anyone have any
>thoughts?

What sort of insurance do you have on   it? Comprehensive? If so, your
insurance should cover repairs, minus   your deductible. If you like
working
on it, fix it yourself, otherwise pay   someone to do it...or, rather, let
your insurance pay someone to do it.    They might even insist on that.

I'd also look for your paint on the bumpers of cars in the area...
-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 17:30:44 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:30:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: it's been great but I gotta leave...
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I've enjoyed this absolutely fine community these past 4 years, as I
progressed from motorcycle newbie to instructor and then wannabe racer.
Due to circumstances out of my control I am moving to Chicago where
after over a year of looking I have been provided a job with Abbott
Labs. I will sorely miss the fine roads available here. My last day
will be this Friday. I will no doubt stay subb'd to the list if for no
other reason than to "stroke my ego" and reply to any and all posts
whether or not I have something useful to say...

It's been great to meet a lot of you, go on rides with some of you, and
do the odd bike-night together, wrench other people's bikes, and regale
you with my sorry travails.

Anyone want some size HeinGereki Pro Sport 44 leather boots in red and
black? Almost new (few weeks).

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 17:38:49 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: it's been great but I gotta leave...
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 17:38:40 -0400

Safe trip and best of luck!

Rob
'98 VFR800

PS.   Still loving my P5!


From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: it's been great but I gotta leave...
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 14:30:36 -0700 (PDT)

I've enjoyed this absolutely fine community these past 4 years, as I
progressed from motorcycle newbie to instructor and then wannabe racer.
Due to circumstances out of my control I am moving to Chicago where
after over a year of looking I have been provided a job with Abbott
Labs. I will sorely miss the fine roads available here. My last day
will be this Friday. I will no doubt stay subb'd to the list if for no
other reason than to "stroke my ego" and reply to any and all posts
whether or not I have something useful to say...

It's been great to meet a lot of you, go on rides with some of you, and
do the odd bike-night together, wrench other people's bikes, and regale
you with my sorry travails.

Anyone want some size HeinGereki Pro Sport 44 leather boots in red and
black? Almost new (few weeks).

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
   -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
   -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar )B– get it now!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 18:19:56 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: speaking of helmets
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 18:19:45 -0400

>   >   I thought helmets had to have a DOT sticker to
>   >   qualify for road use in the USA? Otherwise, people would
>   >   put a chin strap on a salad bowl and go riding.
>   >
>   >   On second thought, the DOT would probably certify that...

Actually, the D.O.T. (notice the periods) standard is pretty good, and
may
be better than Snell in low speed impacts. Ya gotta remember that the
Snell
specification is primarily aimed at racing, not road use. That being
said,
I've used Snell certified brain buckets exclusively since the '70s.

Please don't confuse D.O.T. with DOT. A lot of the novelty helmets have a
round colored sticker on the back that has the word "DOT" printed on it.
If
you look closely, you will see that it is, indeed, a dot. Maybe even a
polka
dot, if on a Polish biker's lid.
Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 18:25:27 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 18:25:18 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Aki Damme <adamme1@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: it's been great but I gotta leave...


It's not going to be the same without you here Matt. Glad
to hear that
you'll remain subbed. You'll have to tell us about how the
riding is up
in them part of d' woods. A lot flatter I would assume.

Ride safe.

-aki


At 05:30 PM 4/19/2004, matthew patton wrote:
>I've enjoyed this absolutely fine community these past 4
>years, as I
>progressed from motorcycle newbie to instructor and then
>wannabe racer.
>Due to circumstances out of my control I am moving to
>Chicago where
>after over a year of looking I have been provided a job
>with Abbott
>Labs. I will sorely miss the fine roads available here. My
>last day
>will be this Friday. I will no doubt stay subb'd to the
>list if for no
>other reason than to "stroke my ego" and reply to any and
>all posts
>whether or not I have something useful to say...
>
>It's been great to meet a lot of you, go on rides with
>some of you, and
>do the odd bike-night together, wrench other people's
>bikes, and regale
>you with my sorry travails.
>
>Anyone want some size HeinGereki Pro Sport 44 leather
>boots in red and
>black? Almost new (few weeks).
>
>=====
>"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject
>what you do
>not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
>   -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)
>
>* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person;
>it's being
>the right person.
>
>* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its
>stated intent.
>   -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 19 22:29:33 2004
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 2004 19:29:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Tire Break-in
To: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>,
   "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

--- "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Gimer Touted, "i'm with brian on this one. gradually
> lean the bike until
> the edge is obtained (which i try to do only once the
> tires are relatively
> warm). done."
>
> <ewww> I'm agreeing with Tom </ewww> & Roach.

stroker!


--
icky poo




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 07:26:23 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 04:26:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: it's been great but I gotta leave...
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX> wrote:
>
> I will no doubt stay subb'd to the
> list if for no
> other reason than to "stroke my ego" and reply to any and
> all posts
> whether or not I have something useful to say...

i'm sorry, matt.... that position has already been filled.
good luck.


--
tg

=====
Thomas H. Gimer <tgimer@XXXXXX>
MURPHY & GIMER, LLC
7940A Wisconsin Avenue
Bethesda, MD 20814
301 913-0060 ext. 11; 301 913-5415 (fax)
http://www.murphygimer.com

**This material is being sent by a law firm and is intended only for the
addressee. Various legal protections including the attorney-client
privilege can apply to this material and no consent is given to its being
read or used by anyone other than the intended recipient. Any other use
is unlawful.




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 07:36:17 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 04:36:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: 8k mile service
To: John White <kokopellian@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

sorry if this post has already been addressed. figure
~$200 for a service plus another ~$170 for rear
tire/mount/balance. cycle accessory discounters in
gaithersburg is reasonable and stocks a few different
brands of performance tires for your bike.

good idea to pick up a service manual (or 2) for your ride
and learn to do the basic stuff in-house.



--- John White <kokopellian@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Well, I'm coming up on 8k for my 2002 YZF600R. I'm going
> to have to go
> to a stealership for the service because I don't have the
> tools, room to
> work, or know how to do the job myself. (I envy you guys
> that do)
> Anyway, I have a couple questions. What price should I
> expect to pay
>   for the service? Also, I know I need a rear tire. How
>   much should I
>   expect to pay for an OEM brand mounted and everything? I
>   was going to
>   call the stealership for a quote, but I only know of two
>   shops in the
>   area (both Coleman) and I figure they have the monopoly
>   anyway. Does
>   anyone know of any other reliable shops that can do the
>   work? Thanks in
>   advance folks.
>
>
>   John
>


=====
Thomas H. Gimer <tgimer@XXXXXX>
MURPHY & GIMER, LLC
7940A Wisconsin Avenue
Bethesda, MD 20814
301 913-0060 ext. 11; 301 913-5415 (fax)
http://www.murphygimer.com

**This material is being sent by a law firm and is intended only for the
addressee. Various legal protections including the attorney-client
privilege can apply to this material and no consent is given to its being
read or used by anyone other than the intended recipient. Any other use
is unlawful.




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 07:51:28 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'matthew patton'" <pattonme@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: it's been great but I gotta leave...
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 07:51:19 -0400

Good luck to you and stay in touch with the list let us know how the
roads
are up there.

-----Original Message-----
From: matthew patton [mailto:pattonme@XXXXXX]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 5:31 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: it's been great but I gotta leave...
I've enjoyed this absolutely fine community these past 4 years, as I
progressed from motorcycle newbie to instructor and then wannabe racer.
Due to circumstances out of my control I am moving to Chicago where
after over a year of looking I have been provided a job with Abbott
Labs. I will sorely miss the fine roads available here. My last day
will be this Friday. I will no doubt stay subb'd to the list if for no
other reason than to "stroke my ego" and reply to any and all posts
whether or not I have something useful to say...

It's been great to meet a lot of you, go on rides with some of you, and
do the odd bike-night together, wrench other people's bikes, and regale
you with my sorry travails.

Anyone want some size HeinGereki Pro Sport 44 leather boots in red and
black? Almost new (few weeks).

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 08:08:39 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 08:07:33 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Dan Brown <brown@XXXXXX>
Subject: Moto wreck on Carlin Springs rd last night??


Driving to dinner last night my wife and I saw what appeared to be   the
aftermath of a motorcycle v. SUV wreck on Carlin Springs Road last   night,
just south of Rt. 50. Didn't actually see the happening, and there   were
several people already congregated - didn't look like any serious
injuries
and we could hear police sirens approaching. We didn't stop to see   what
had
transpired. [1]

Appeared to be between a smaller silver   colored SUV and a sport bike of
some
sort. The guy who I think was the rider   was wearing shorts, t-shirt and
a bandana - helmet was off to the side.   He and another person were moving
the bike off into the parking circle at   the school there, with the driver
of
the SUV (I presume) looking on.

This is a bad intersection - lots of stopping and turning, there's a busy
7/11 right there. I'd imagine that there are plenty of accidents all the
time.

Was this anyone here?



[1] Yes, if it had appeared that I could have offered any help, I would
have
stopped. I didn't see the accident, only the aftermath, and there wasn't
anyone laying on the ground appearing injured. There were plenty of
people
already around. Adding to the chaos, confusion and traffic congestion was
not something I wanted to do.



--
Resist or Serve

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 08:20:18 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 08:19:07 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Dan Brown <brown@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 04:06 PM 4/19/2004 -0400, Mike Bartman wrote:

>What I'd really like to do is figure out a simple, easy way to carry my
>full-face when I'm not wearing it, and switch back and forth as seems
>reasonable. The half helmet will fit in a saddle bag without problems,
but
>the full-face won't. I don't trust cargo nets on sports racks all that
>much or that would work. Too much chance for vibration to result in
>rubbing that will damage the helmet. Maybe I'll make some sort of
holder
>to clamp on there.


I'm pretty happy with a Givi Top case. Plenty of room for my lid and
and my 'stitch pants.

http://tinyurl.com/3gyx5

Might not fit the lines of your Harley, but, seems pretty natural on
the back of my RT. YMMV.



--
Resist or Serve

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 10:48:22 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 10:49:58 -0400
To: Dan Brown <brown@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Riders w/o Gear on the increase?

At 08:19 AM 4/20/04 -0400, Dan Brown wrote:
>At 04:06 PM 4/19/2004 -0400, Mike Bartman wrote:
>
>>What I'd really like to do is figure out a simple, easy way to carry my
>>full-face when I'm not wearing it, and switch back and forth as seems

>I'm pretty happy with a Givi Top case. Plenty of room for my lid and
>and my 'stitch pants.
>
>http://tinyurl.com/3gyx5
>
>Might not fit the lines of your Harley, but, seems pretty natural on
>the back of my RT. YMMV.

They make a tourpak that matches the styling of my bike, and it will hold
a
full-face helmet, but it's a) expensive, b) not going to fit with some of
the things I've already added to the bike (like the sports rack), and c)
not really the look I'm going for (i.e. tour bike). Here's a picture:

http://www.harley-
davidson.com/gma/gma_product.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=84552
4441988463&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302288803&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=
253
4374302288803&bmUID=1082472300657&bmLocale=en_US

I'm thinking more along the lines of a padded bag that will attach to the
sports rack I already have, and that can be removed when it isn't needed
(which will be most of the time). I figure I can make something like
that
myself...when I get time...

Thanks for the help though!

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 11:13:08 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 08:13:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Michael Jordan <mjordan812@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: speaking of helmets
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Jordan <mjordan812@XXXXXX>

Actually, the D.O.T. (notice the periods) standard is pretty good, and
may
be better than Snell in low speed impacts. Ya gotta remember that the
Snell
specification is primarily aimed at racing, not road use. That being
said,
I've used Snell certified brain buckets exclusively since the '70s.

Please don't confuse D.O.T. with DOT. A lot of the novelty helmets have a
round colored sticker on the back that has the word "DOT" printed on it.
If
you look closely, you will see that it is, indeed, a dot. Maybe even a
polka
dot, if on a Polish biker's lid.

Michael J.

-----------

Huh? The DOT sticker on my Shoei RF800 (pretty sure it's not a novelty
helmet) says "DOT", i.e., no punctuation.

Comparison of Snell and DOT standards:

http://www.smf.org/articles/dot.html



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 12:03:06 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 12:01:17 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: speaking of helmets



Paul Wilson wrote:

> Comparison of Snell and DOT standards:
>
> http://www.smf.org/articles/dot.html


from:   http://www.smf.org/articles/mcomp2.html#Impact
Regarding straps...

Free End Retention:
velcro forbidden


how come? what safety issue is addressed by not having the free end of
the
helmet strap secudred with velcro?

--skip

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 12:06:28 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 12:04:40 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: speaking of helmets



Skip wrote:
>
> Paul Wilson wrote:
>
> > Comparison of Snell and DOT standards:
> >
> > http://www.smf.org/articles/dot.html
>
> from: http://www.smf.org/articles/mcomp2.html#Impact
>
> Regarding straps...
>
> Free End Retention:
> velcro forbidden
>
> how come? what safety issue is addressed by not having the free end of
the
> helmet strap secudred with velcro?
>
> --skip


the more accurate link is:
http://www.smf.org/articles/mcomp2.html#Retention

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 13:04:26 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 13:04:16 -0400
To: dc-cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Aki Damme <adamme1@XXXXXX>
Subject: They're Coming!!!!



Orchards Brace For Bugs
POSTED: 11:21 am EDT April 20, 2004

FREDERICK, Md. -- Maryland orchard owners are preparing to
wrap their trees in nets and spray insecticide to combat
the millions of cicadas that have begun emerging from 17
years underground.

The large, red-eyed insects lay their eggs inside tree
branches, making young fruit trees especially vulnerable to

bough breakage, fruit growers say.

The first Maryland cicadas from the massive generation
known as Brood X began emerging last week in Montgomery
County, said Charlie Metz, a horticulture specialist in
Frederick County with the Maryland Cooperative Extension
service.

Entomologists said a wide swath of the eastern United
States will be visited this spring by the noisy insects.

Female cicadas lay their eggs inside slits they make in the

bark of tree limbs.

Henry Allenberg, who grows apples, peaches and cherries on
100 acres near Smithsburg, Md., told The Frederick
News-Post that damage from the last major cicada swarm cost

him 15 percent of the peaches from a cluster of 3-year-old
trees. He said he will wrap about 900 of his 13,000 fruit
trees with netting, starting in mid-May, ahead of the June
egg-laying peak.

Allenberg, president of the Maryland Apple Promotion Board,

said the work is labor-intensive but he prefers it to
spraying chemicals that could wipe out beneficial insects.

"I don't want to mess up the balance," he said.

Owners of Pryor's Orchard in Thurmont are more worried that

cicadas will mess up their crop.

"If the cicadas come out, we're going to spray them," Gary
Hauver said.

His wife, Martha, said the trouble occurs in the summer,
when maturing fruit weighs down branches. On young trees
with relatively thin boughs, the damaged bark causes the
limbs to break, she said.
The cicada infestation of 1987 was less severe than in
1970, Mrs. Hauver said.

"You could walk outside and hear them crawling up and down
the trees," she said. "When we sprayed them, the ground was

covered. We were picking them up by the buckets."

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 13:44:38 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 10:44:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Riding in the Dead Zone -- a great and chilling read
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/kiddofspeed/

-- Larry




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 14:55:57 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 14:56:06 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   Michael Jordan <mjordan812@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: speaking of helmets

At 08:13 AM 4/20/04 -0700, Paul Wilson wrote:
>From: Michael Jordan <mjordan812@XXXXXX>

>Please don't confuse D.O.T. with DOT. A lot of the novelty helmets have
a
>round colored sticker on the back that has the word "DOT" printed on it.
If
>you look closely, you will see that it is, indeed, a dot. Maybe even a
polka
>dot, if on a Polish biker's lid.
>-----------
>
>Huh? The DOT sticker on my Shoei RF800 (pretty sure it's not a novelty
helmet) says "DOT", i.e., no punctuation.

Ditto for my H-D (HJC) Snell-approved full face: "DOT" is what it says
right under "Snell" on the back (the serialized Snell sticker is inside,
as
usual). No periods.
The new half-helmet (not a "novelty" helmet at all, just not a full-face)
also says "DOT" on the back.

Even better, the U.S. Department of Transportation (http://www.dot.gov/),
uses "DOT" on their main web page:

     :
     Get a DOT number online
     Questions about DOT numbers
     :

Apparently they are "confused" too...or maybe they're just out of periods
this week? Must have given them all to NASA, who hasn't had any for
years.
 Or maybe the DOD? The FDA? FAA? HUD? Seems to be a serious period
shortage in the area! No wonder they are stealing them from our helmets
and confusing us!



-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 15:02:23 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:02:37 -0400
To: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>, Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: speaking of helmets
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

At 12:01 PM 4/20/04 -0400, Skip wrote:

>from: http://www.smf.org/articles/mcomp2.html#Impact
>
>Regarding straps...
>
>Free End Retention:
>velcro forbidden
>
>
>how come? what safety issue is addressed by not having the free end of
the
>helmet strap secudred with velcro?

It's not a safety issue, it's a testing issue I expect.

If you allow Velcro to secure the free end during the test, you are
opening
up a way to "cheat". You aren't just testing fastener strength, you are
also testing the Velcro, and the purpose of the test is to test the
helmet-securing system, not the loose strap securing system...which may
or
may not actually get used on a given user's head (guy with a quadruple
chin
might not have enough strap left to reach the Velcro pad... ;-)

That's my guess anyway...if you want certainty, ask Snell.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 15:15:23 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>, John White <kokopellian@XXXXXX>,
   DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: 8k mile service
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:16:16 -0400

I send CAD Cycles (Cyclce accessory discounters).   I have taken the VFR
for
inspection and new tires. They did a good job.

Rob


On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 04:36:09 -0700 (PDT), Tom Gimer wrote
> sorry if this post has already been addressed. figure
> ~$200 for a service plus another ~$170 for rear
> tire/mount/balance. cycle accessory discounters in
> gaithersburg is reasonable and stocks a few different
> brands of performance tires for your bike.
>
> good idea to pick up a service manual (or 2) for your ride
> and learn to do the basic stuff in-house.
>
> --- John White <kokopellian@XXXXXX> wrote:
> > Well, I'm coming up on 8k for my 2002 YZF600R. I'm going
> > to have to go
> > to a stealership for the service because I don't have the
> > tools, room to
> > work, or know how to do the job myself. (I envy you guys
> > that do)
> > Anyway, I have a couple questions. What price should I
> > expect to pay
> > for the service? Also, I know I need a rear tire. How
> > much should I
>   >   expect to pay for an OEM brand mounted and everything? I
>   >   was going to
>   >   call the stealership for a quote, but I only know of two
>   >   shops in the
>   >   area (both Coleman) and I figure they have the monopoly
>   >   anyway. Does
>   >   anyone know of any other reliable shops that can do the
>   >   work? Thanks in
>   >   advance folks.
>   >
>   >
>   >   John
>   >
>
>   =====
>   Thomas H. Gimer <tgimer@XXXXXX>
>   MURPHY & GIMER, LLC
>   7940A Wisconsin Avenue
>   Bethesda, MD 20814
>   301 913-0060 ext. 11; 301 913-5415 (fax)
>   http://www.murphygimer.com
>
>   **This material is being sent by a law firm and is intended only for
>   the addressee. Various legal protections including the attorney-
>   client privilege can apply to this material and no consent is given
>   to its being read or used by anyone other than the intended
>   recipient. Any other use is unlawful.
>
>
>
>   __________________________________
>   Do you Yahoo!?
>   Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
>   http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 17:05:30 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 17:03:39 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: [Fwd: RE: Velcro]

and there ya go!

--skip

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: RE: Velcro
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 13:50:12 -0700
From: "Ed Becker" <ed@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: <ed@XXXXXX>
To: <skip@XXXXXX>

Dear Mr. Smith,

Thanks for your query about velcro. The restriction came about because
riders were seen just looping the strap through both D-rings and not
threading the strap back through the inside ring to secure it. Instead,
they used the velcro as the buckle as well as a means of securing the
strap's free end. The up-shot was that when a rider got bumped off his
bike, the same bump was often enough to detach the velcro and spill the
helmet off the rider's head. It was frustrating to see someone go to the
trouble of buying and wearing a helmet only to have it go awol when he
needed it most so the directors reckoned velcro to be an attractive
nuisance
and banned it from use in Snell certified helmets. They do not have any
restriction on plastic snaps for the same purpose, largely because
there's
no adjustment in snaps and they figure that most reasonable people would
not
mistake them for a chin strap closure.

Thanks for your interest.

Ed Becker

-----Original Message-----
From: General Mail [mailto:info@XXXXXX]
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 12:43 PM
To: Ed Becker
Subject: Fw: Velcro



----- Original Message -----
From: "Skip" <skip@XXXXXX>
To: <info@XXXXXX>
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 12:19 PM
Subject: Velcro


> Sirs,
>
> I was reading the table at
http://www.smf.org/articles/mcomp2.html#Retention and
> I saw that with regard to straps, free end retention with velcro
> precludes
snell
> certification, and I am curious to know why that is.
>
>
>
> Thanks for all your work.
>
> --skip smith
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 17:32:30 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 17:33:00 -0400
To: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: RE: Velcro]

Thanks for checking!   Makes sense.

-- Mike B.

At 05:03 PM 4/20/04 -0400, Skip wrote:
>and there ya go!
>
>--skip
>
>-------- Original Message --------
>Subject: RE: Velcro

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 18:41:11 2004
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 15:41:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: RE: Velcro]
To: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


--- Skip <skip@XXXXXX> wrote:
> and there ya go!
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> From: "Ed Becker" <ed@XXXXXX>

> Thanks for your query about velcro. The restriction came about because
> riders were seen just looping the strap through both D-rings and not
> threading the strap back through the inside ring to secure it.
Instead,
> they used the velcro as the buckle as well as a means of securing the
> strap's free end.

It's interesting to note that he doesn't specify whether they were doing
this
intentionally (for convenience) or through ignorance, or whether or not
Snell
investigated that aspect of the problem.

> ....so the directors reckoned velcro to be an attractive nuisance
> and banned it from use in Snell certified helmets.
I thought Snell was in the business of evaluating what is provided and
used
properly, rather than denying approval to adequate products because some
idiot
might not use it in the correct way. Seems to me that "attractive
nuisances" are
none of smf's business. Any idiot can mis-use the D-rings themselves. So
why not
ban them and while we're at it, deny approval to helmets with "attractive
nuisance" cooling slots, since some moron might run a bungee cord from
there to
his front fork?

This smacks of social legislation by a supposedly scientific
organization, and
drives another nail into the coffin of our least-common-denominator
society.

-- Larry




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 20 21:39:02 2004
From: "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>, "Skip" <skip@XXXXXX>,
   "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: RE: Velcro]
Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 21:38:48 -0400

----- Original Message -----
From: <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>

>
> I thought Snell was in the business of evaluating what is provided and
used
> properly, rather than denying approval to adequate products because
some
idiot
> might not use it in the correct way. Seems to me that "attractive
nuisances" are
> none of smf's business. Any idiot can mis-use the D-rings themselves.
So
why not
> ban them and while we're at it, deny approval to helmets with
"attractive
> nuisance" cooling slots, since some moron might run a bungee cord from
there to
> his front fork?
>
> This smacks of social legislation by a supposedly scientific
organization,
and
> drives another nail into the coffin of our least-common-denominator
society.
>
> -- Larry

Seems to me like Snell is a private foundation that advocates sound
helmet
design and helmet use. As such, they can write the rules any way they
want
if a manufacturer wants their coveted stamp of approval. They could
mandate
that all Snell-approved MC helmets be day-glo orange and 100% reflective
if
they wanted, whether it made sense or not. It also seems to be a
reasonable
precaution against unintentional misuse of the product, unlike your more
off
the wall example bungee cord example, which would constitute intentional
misuse. While we seem to turn out better idiots in response to every
idiot-proofing attempt, this seems to be a case where they are on track.
To
many people "Velcro" means "fastener." Think of how many moto-specific
items you have in your possession where hook and loop is used as a
fastener.

The little notch doohickey on my Shoei works just fine at securing the
flapping end, just as well as Velcro would. I guess I fail to see the
harm.

Thanks Skip, for going to the source and getting the skinny.   I learned
something new about helmets today.

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 09:23:57 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 09:23:44 -0400
From: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>
Subject: Fwd: Zx list:Stolen ZX9R
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Forwarded from the ZX-list:


>Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 9:10:35 -0400
>From: Kirk Roy <kirkroy@XXXXXX>
>Subject: Zx list:Stolen ZX9R
>To: <zx@XXXXXX>
>
>I've been a list lurker for the last couple months since
buying my ZX9R. Unfortunately, it was stolen from my home in
Frederick, MD last night. I was really loving this bike (put
on 2k miles in 2 months from feb to now).
>
>Here are the details:
>Silver 2003 ZX9R
>Stock, outside of electric jacket hookup, tank bra, and tank
bag straps
>VIN #JKAZX2F133A006771
>
>Dang,
>
>Kirk
>
>_______________________________________________
>Zx mailing list    -    Zx@XXXXXX
>http://www.motohaus.org/mailman/listinfo/zx
>"While the rest of the world is wrenching, Kawasaki owners
are riding."
>-- G[a-z]+
Dave Yates

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 10:17:07 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 10:17:02 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Rural roads beware!

MASSILLON, Ohio -- A man who had complained about speeders on the rural
road in front of his Stark County home decided to take action on his own
after a speeding car hit his dog.

Authorities said Scott VanDenberg, 42, cut a six- to eight-inch deep
trench
across the road to create a sort of speed bump in reverse.

VanDenberg was charged with criminal damaging. The first-degree
misdemeanor
could get him six months in jail and a $5,000 fine.

Police Chief Charles McCullough said if a car had hit the trench going
the
speed limit it would have been damaged. He said it also is possible the
trench could have caused a crash.

Police say VanDenberg admitted cutting the trench and agreed to fill it
in.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org


When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 10:20:05 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 07:20:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Fwd: Zx list:Stolen ZX9R
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Kirk is on DC Cycles too.

Glenn


--- Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Forwarded from the ZX-list:
>
>
> >Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 9:10:35 -0400
> >From: Kirk Roy <kirkroy@XXXXXX>
> >Subject: Zx list:Stolen ZX9R
> >To: <zx@XXXXXX>
> >
> >I've been a list lurker for the last couple months
> since
> buying my ZX9R. Unfortunately, it was stolen from my
> home in
> Frederick, MD last night. I was really loving this
> bike (put
> on 2k miles in 2 months from feb to now).
> >
> >Here are the details:
> >Silver 2003 ZX9R
> >Stock, outside of electric jacket hookup, tank bra,
> and tank
> bag straps
> >VIN #JKAZX2F133A006771
> >
> >Dang,
> >
> >Kirk
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Zx mailing list    -    Zx@XXXXXX
> >http://www.motohaus.org/mailman/listinfo/zx
> >"While the rest of the world is wrenching, Kawasaki
> owners
> are riding."
> >-- G[a-z]+
> Dave Yates
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 10:38:24 2004
From: Sunil Doshi <sdoshi@XXXXXX>
Subject: The Mother of All Parking Tickets
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 10:38:17 -0400
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Starting a few weeks ago, I began parking at a new set of motorcycle
spaces on M St. between Vermont and 15th (at least new to me). I've
been parking there and dutifully paying the meter for a few weeks now.

Last night, when I left work around 6:00 and went out to the bike, I
found a ticket waiting for me. I imagined it was for the fact that the
bike has been in the same spot for more than 4 hours. I always pay the
meter, but I was going to wait for the first ticket before I started
the 4-hour cycle of moving the bike a space over. I was shocked when I
opened it and saw a fine for $100. There are probably some moving
violations that cost less than that. What was I charged with? No
Stopping/Standing During Rush Hour (4-6:30PM).

I did not knowingly park there during rush hour. The signs that flanked
the motorcycle spaces only said "4 Hour Parking, Motorcycles Only,
7AM-6:30PM, Monday-Friday." (shown at the URLs below) They didn't have
any additional sign on the same pole, indicating the rush hour
restriction. Other signs further down the street, near car parking, did
say such a thing, but I had only taken notice of the signs near where
I'm parking.

Does anyone know if there should have been additional signage to
indicate the rush hour restriction? Or am I out $100?

http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking1.jpg
http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking2.jpg

sunil
http://widepipe.org/ride/
'03 Honda Shadow ACE 750

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 10:42:08 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Glenn Dysart'" <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Fwd: Zx list:Stolen ZX9R
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 10:41:53 -0400

Will keep my eyes open and pass this along. That just sucks. I'm sorry to
hear the news. Thieves suck!

-----Original Message-----
From: Glenn Dysart [mailto:glenn_dysart@XXXXXX]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 10:20 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Fwd: Zx list:Stolen ZX9R

Kirk is on DC Cycles too.

Glenn


--- Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Forwarded from the ZX-list:
>
>
> >Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 9:10:35 -0400
> >From: Kirk Roy <kirkroy@XXXXXX>
> >Subject: Zx list:Stolen ZX9R
> >To: <zx@XXXXXX>
> >
> >I've been a list lurker for the last couple months
> since
> buying my ZX9R. Unfortunately, it was stolen from my
> home in
> Frederick, MD last night. I was really loving this
> bike (put
> on 2k miles in 2 months from feb to now).
> >
> >Here are the details:
> >Silver 2003 ZX9R
> >Stock, outside of electric jacket hookup, tank bra,
> and tank
> bag straps
> >VIN #JKAZX2F133A006771
> >
> >Dang,
> >
> >Kirk
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Zx mailing list    -    Zx@XXXXXX
> >http://www.motohaus.org/mailman/listinfo/zx
> >"While the rest of the world is wrenching, Kawasaki
> owners
> are riding."
> >-- G[a-z]+
> Dave Yates
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 10:47:29 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Troutman'" <mike@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Rural roads beware!
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 10:47:11 -0400

Dang that could be bad for a bike. I've seen people blow grass in the
road.
Could they be charged if a bike crashed?

-----Original Message-----
From: Troutman [mailto:mike@XXXXXX]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 10:17 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Rural roads beware!

MASSILLON, Ohio -- A man who had complained about speeders on the rural
road in front of his Stark County home decided to take action on his own
after a speeding car hit his dog.

Authorities said Scott VanDenberg, 42, cut a six- to eight-inch deep
trench
across the road to create a sort of speed bump in reverse.

VanDenberg was charged with criminal damaging. The first-degree
misdemeanor
could get him six months in jail and a $5,000 fine.

Police Chief Charles McCullough said if a car had hit the trench going
the
speed limit it would have been damaged. He said it also is possible the
trench could have caused a crash.

Police say VanDenberg admitted cutting the trench and agreed to fill it
in.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org
When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 10:53:06 2004
Subject: Southward Bound
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 10:56:45 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


I have never been to Miami or Key West and am thinking of planning a
little trip.
I was considering motorcycling all the way but will also consider taking
the auto-train for the leg down to about Jacksonville. Has anyone taken
the train? Do bikes tend to get damaged on the way down? Is there a
good guide on how best to secure a sportbike, specifically an R6. How
many tie-downs and bungee cords etc?



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 10:59:16 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Speaking of Helmets....Formerly Velcro
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 10:48:06 -0400

Remember that picture floating around a number of months ago where the
girl
on the scooter was wearing her helmet backwards?

Well,   last night going home from work, I actually saw this in the flesh.

A woman on 355 in Germantown was riding a tiny scooter with quite the odd
looking helmet. As I could best see, it was just like the one in that
picture..and she was as clueless as could be. (had I been traveling in
the
same direction, YES, I would have approached her.)

The only thing worse, was the fact that she had a small girl riding in
front
of her on the scooter. At least her bicycle helmet looked to be on
straight.

Unbelievable.   I could only shake my head until home.

Rob
'98 VFR800 (temporarily on a '96 CBR900)

_________________________________________________________________
Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar )B– FREE!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 11:04:28 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 11:04:19 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: The Mother of All Parking Tickets
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

You definitely have a good case for fighting this ticket and having it
dropped. Especially with the pics of the signs. It clearly says you are
allowed to park there until 6:30pm and no signs otherwise. If there had
been a rush hour restriction, the signs would have ended at 4pm instead
of 6:30pm. Sounds like some meter maid just had their panties in a twist
that day. Go to court with the pics and fight it.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/21/2004 10:38:17 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
sdoshi@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>   Starting a few weeks ago, I began parking at a new set of motorcycle
>   spaces on M St. between Vermont and 15th (at least new to me). I've
>   been parking there and dutifully paying the meter for a few weeks now.
>
>   Last night, when I left work around 6:00 and went out to the bike, I
>   found a ticket waiting for me. I imagined it was for the fact that the
>   bike has been in the same spot for more than 4 hours. I always pay the
>   meter, but I was going to wait for the first ticket before I started
>   the 4-hour cycle of moving the bike a space over. I was shocked when I
>   opened it and saw a fine for $100. There are probably some moving
>   violations that cost less than that. What was I charged with? No
>   Stopping/Standing During Rush Hour (4-6:30PM).
>
>   I did not knowingly park there during rush hour. The signs that flanked
>   the motorcycle spaces only said "4 Hour Parking, Motorcycles Only,
>   7AM-6:30PM, Monday-Friday." (shown at the URLs below) They didn't have
>   any additional sign on the same pole, indicating the rush hour
>   restriction. Other signs further down the street, near car parking, did
>   say such a thing, but I had only taken notice of the signs near where
>   I'm parking.
>
>   Does anyone know if there should have been additional
>   signage to
>   indicate the rush hour restriction? Or am I out $100?
>
>   http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking1.jpg
>   http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking2.jpg
>
>   sunil
>   http://widepipe.org/ride/
>   '03 Honda Shadow ACE 750
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 11:13:26 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 11:11:31 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
CC: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: The Mother of All Parking Tickets

Sunil Doshi wrote:
> Does anyone know if there should have been additional signage to
> indicate the rush hour restriction? Or am I out $100?
>
> http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking1.jpg
> http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking2.jpg

Yes, there should have been signs to indicate the rush hour restriction.
Yes
you have good, reasonable grounds to fight it. Yes, you're going to get
fucked
for $100.

definately fight it, though.

--skip

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 11:15:04 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Southward Bound
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 11:14:57 -0400

> I was considering motorcycling all the way but will also consider
taking
> the auto-train for the leg down to about Jacksonville. Has anyone
taken
> the train?

They have a number of rolling pallets that hold two bikes each. You drive
your bike up on a platform that is level with the pallet.

At the front of the pallet are a pair of "LA Chock" type of wheel
supports. You roll your bike into the chock and they proceed to tie the
bike down to the pallet.

I do believe that they could turn the whole thing upside down and the
bike wouldn't fall off.

I would recommend that you spring for a sleeper as opposed to the "Coach
seating"

I was comfortable in the sleeper, and a guy that I met who opted for the
cheaper method said that the coach seating was absolutely horrible. YMMV

It was an interesting experience, but a tad expensive.
Ya pays yer nickle, ya takes yer chances.

Michael J.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 11:38:13 2004
From: Jason Picton <j_picton@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: The Mother of All Parking Tickets
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 11:37:52 -0400

Sunil,

LOL - I walk by that spot daily on my way to work.... I am fairly sure
the
officer in question has made a mistake... The no parking during rush hour
re-striction is one block further..My understanding is that many DC
Parking
Ticket Cops run on automatic pilot and don't look at the signs.. I know
allot of folks that just pay their tickets rather than deal with the DC
traffic system... If there is a time listed on your ticket before 6:30 -
you
should be able to beat it - even if the meter was expired and you were
past
the time alloted - you are NOT being charged with NOT paying the meter..
If
the ticket was 30-40 bucks I would pay it rather than take time off from
work, but 100 bucks is outrageous, especially when your being ticketed
with
something that is incorrect..

Good luck...

Jason

-----Original Message-----
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 11:04 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: The Mother of All Parking Tickets


You definitely have a good case for fighting this ticket and having it
dropped. Especially with the pics of the signs. It clearly says you are
allowed to park there until 6:30pm and no signs otherwise. If there had
been a rush hour restriction, the signs would have ended at 4pm instead
of
6:30pm. Sounds like some meter maid just had their panties in a twist
that
day. Go to court with the pics and fight it.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/21/2004 10:38:17 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
sdoshi@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>   Starting a few weeks ago, I began parking at a new set of motorcycle
>   spaces on M St. between Vermont and 15th (at least new to me). I've
>   been parking there and dutifully paying the meter for a few weeks now.
>
>   Last night, when I left work around 6:00 and went out to the bike, I
>   found a ticket waiting for me. I imagined it was for the fact that the
>   bike has been in the same spot for more than 4 hours. I always pay the
>   meter, but I was going to wait for the first ticket before I started
>   the 4-hour cycle of moving the bike a space over. I was shocked when I
>   opened it and saw a fine for $100. There are probably some moving
>   violations that cost less than that. What was I charged with? No
>   Stopping/Standing During Rush Hour (4-6:30PM).
>
>   I did not knowingly park there during rush hour. The signs that flanked
>   the motorcycle spaces only said "4 Hour Parking, Motorcycles Only,
>   7AM-6:30PM, Monday-Friday." (shown at the URLs below) They didn't have
>   any additional sign on the same pole, indicating the rush hour
>   restriction. Other signs further down the street, near car parking, did
>   say such a thing, but I had only taken notice of the signs near where
>   I'm parking.
>
>   Does anyone know if there should have been additional
>   signage to
>   indicate the rush hour restriction? Or am I out $100?
>
>   http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking1.jpg
>   http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking2.jpg
>
>   sunil
>   http://widepipe.org/ride/
>   '03 Honda Shadow ACE 750

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 11:55:24 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 11:55:03 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: The Mother of All Parking Tickets


-----Original Message-----
From: Jason Picton <j_picton@XXXXXX>


Sunil,

LOL - I walk by that spot daily on my way to work.... I am fairly sure
the
officer in question has made a mistake... The no parking during rush hour
re-striction is one block further..My understanding is that many DC
Parking
Ticket Cops run on automatic pilot and don't look at the signs..
Good luck...

Jason

-------------

FWIW, there has been a crackdown of sorts underway on rush hour parking
restriction violators. Sunil got caught in the dragnet. I this case,
Jason is correct, the parking enforcer erred. It makes no sense to
ticket if it says "MC only parking 7AM - 6:30 PM."

Take some more pictures, including the exact position of your bike. You
need pictures to provide context. The pictures on the site just show a
sign, buildings and sky. I'd say Sunil has a good (but by no means
guaranteed) chance of prevailing at adjudication.



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 12:05:11 2004
From: Sunil Doshi <sdoshi@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: The Mother of All Parking Tickets
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 12:05:04 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Paul,
Good point. I'll go out at lunch and get a few more pictures.

I also heard they are going to go full throttle on parking enforcement
this summer to bump up revenue for the city. That's fine with me, as
long as I'm in the wrong. It's just hard when the rules aren't clear.

I'll let you guys know how it goes. Thanks for all the advice.

On Apr 21, 2004, at 11:55 AM, Paul Wilson wrote:

>   Take some more pictures, including the exact position of your bike.
>   You need pictures to provide context. The pictures on the site just
>   show a sign, buildings and sky. I'd say Sunil has a good (but by no
>   means guaranteed) chance of prevailing at adjudication.


sunil
http://widepipe.org/ride/
'03 Honda Shadow ACE 750

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 12:32:32 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Rob Keiser'" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Speaking of Helmets....Formerly Velcro
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 12:32:20 -0400

People just don't think or just have no common sense. That's just like
people who don't at least buckle/use a car seat there kids in their cars.

-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Keiser [mailto:robkeiser@XXXXXX]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 10:48 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Speaking of Helmets....Formerly Velcro

Remember that picture floating around a number of months ago where the
girl
on the scooter was wearing her helmet backwards?

Well,   last night going home from work, I actually saw this in the flesh.

A woman on 355 in Germantown was riding a tiny scooter with quite the odd
looking helmet. As I could best see, it was just like the one in that
picture..and she was as clueless as could be. (had I been traveling in
the
same direction, YES, I would have approached her.)

The only thing worse, was the fact that she had a small girl riding in
front

of her on the scooter.   At least her bicycle helmet looked to be on
straight.

Unbelievable.   I could only shake my head until home.

Rob
'98 VFR800 (temporarily on a '96 CBR900)

_________________________________________________________________
Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar - FREE!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200414ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 12:55:45 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 09:55:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: mjordan812@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Southward Bound



-----Original Message-----
From: mjordan812@XXXXXX
Sent: Apr 21, 2004 8:14 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Southward Bound
> I was considering motorcycling all the way but will also consider
taking
> the auto-train for the leg down to about Jacksonville. Has anyone
taken
> the train?

They have a number of rolling pallets that hold two bikes each. You drive
your bike up on a platform that is level with the pallet.

At the front of the pallet are a pair of "LA Chock" type of wheel
supports. You roll your bike into the chock and they proceed to tie the
bike down to the pallet.

I do believe that they could turn the whole thing upside down and the
bike wouldn't fall off.

I would recommend that you spring for a sleeper as opposed to the "Coach
seating"

I was comfortable in the sleeper, and a guy that I met who opted for the
cheaper method said that the coach seating was absolutely horrible. YMMV

It was an interesting experience, but a tad expensive.

Ya pays yer nickle, ya takes yer chances.

Michael J.

-------------

The Auto-Train terminal is in Sanford, just north of Orlando. That puts
you two hours south of Jacksonville. A-T makes no intermediate stops.
It runs through, Lorton to Sanford. Lorton terminal is right off 95, at,
not surprisingly, Lorton Rd.

I've ridden Amtrak quite a bit, including a long trip to the West Coast.
The "standard" sleeper (it may be called "economy" now) is pretty cozy,
esp. for two and it helps being on intimate terms if you share this
accommodation. Upper and lower berths. Upper folds up into the ceiling.
Lower makes two seats that face each other during the day. At 5'11" I
can stretch out fully, just, in the upper berth. Great way to see the
country, even miles and miles and miles of piney woods between here and
Fla. Next best thing to seeing the country from atop a motorcycle.

The Auto-Train is a little different than other Amtrak trains in that
meals are included, even in coach. Meal service consists of a buffet-
style arrangement. And there always seem to be interesting "characters"
and conversationalists you meet on trains, like no other public
conveyance here in the States.

Last year I made a reservation for the A-T, in order to get back from
Daytona. I came down with a touch of the flu and wasn't sure I'd be up
for the return trip. Would have set me back about $250 one way in a
coach seat. $250 v. 900 miles of I-95, especially when you're sick.
Hmmm.... Anyway, I canceled, since I felt better when departure day
rolled around.




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 13:18:24 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 13:19:49 -0400
To: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Southward Bound

At 11:14 AM 4/21/04 -0400, mjordan812@XXXXXX wrote:
>> I was considering motorcycling all the way but will also consider
taking
>> the auto-train for the leg down to about Jacksonville. Has anyone
taken
>> the train?

It ends in Sanford, FL...which is much closer to Orlando than to
Jacksonville. Starts in Lorton, which is convenient.

>I would recommend that you spring for a sleeper as opposed to the "Coach
seating"

How big are the sleepers? Do you have to fit on an R1 to fit in one?     Or
are they adult-sized? :-)

>It was an interesting experience, but a tad expensive.

How much? I know it varies by season, but last I checked it was
somewhere
between $250 and $550, or thereabouts, for a round-trip ticket with your
bike. That's not bad, really, if you don't have the time, ability or
interest to ride it. If you ride it, and aren't into the Iron Butt
thing,
you'll end up spending some cash on a motel or two along the way anyway,
as
well as on 7-10 or more fillups.

I guess the only way to be sure if it's expensive or a bargain is to try
it
both ways and compare... ;-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 13:18:32 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 13:09:30 -0400
To: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Speaking of Helmets....Formerly Velcro

At 10:48 AM 4/21/04 -0400, Rob Keiser wrote:
>A woman on 355 in Germantown was riding a tiny scooter with quite the
odd
>looking helmet. As I could best see, it was just like the one in that
>picture..and she was as clueless as could be. (had I been traveling in
the
>same direction, YES, I would have approached her.)

Just be careful you don't get charged with attempted murder for daring to
talk to her...

>The only thing worse, was the fact that she had a small girl riding in
front
>of her on the scooter. At least her bicycle helmet looked to be on
>straight.
>
>Unbelievable. I could only shake my head until home.

Then you'd better not look at any of those pictures from India, Shri
Lanka,
China or wherever that show a family of 5 on a 250cc bike...with their
chickens and other purchases.

People do stupid things all the time. That particular form of stupid
just
isn't as common here I guess. We have others.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 13:18:44 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 13:18:22 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Rob Keiser <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Speaking of Helmets....Formerly Velcro

Rob Keiser wrote:
> A woman on 355 in Germantown was riding a tiny scooter with quite the
> odd looking helmet. As I could best see, it was just like the one in
> that picture..and she was as clueless as could be. (had I been
> traveling in the same direction, YES, I would have approached her.)
>
> The only thing worse, was the fact that she had a small girl riding in
> front of her on the scooter. At least her bicycle helmet looked to be
> on straight.
>
> Unbelievable. I could only shake my head until home.
>
I, too, agree that's unbelievable....how hard could putting a helmet on
be? But at the same time, I feel her pain. When I bought my first
bike, I told them I needed a helmet and said I wear an XS...to that
statement I got "there's no way you need an XS. You probably are a
small." Since I had very little experience, and here I was faced with
these men who obviously knew what they were talking about, I bought a
small when they told me that that's how it should fit. Thank God I
never went down because the helmet was too loose (unbenownst to me who
thought it was fine). Not only was I riding with a bad helmet, but was
also out $350 'cause I had to buy another one!

LAR

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 15:25:48 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 15:25:43 -0400
From: "Chris Norloff" <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: <cnorloff@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Southward Bound

My daughter and I and a motorcycle took the AutoTrain to Daytona a couple
years ago. The fee included food, a movie, and an open snack/coffee bar
on the train.

The motorcycle tie-downs were all very professional. The ride was good,
though you don't see a lot of majestic views! Much is at night so you're
trying to sleep anyway. We took the sleeper/recliner seats (the cheapest)
- not great, but a bed was just too expensive.

In my opinion it's a good way to get to Florida, but it's not a great
way.

Chris Norloff


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 17:18:34 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 14:18:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Adam Reinhardt <ajreinhardt@XXXXXX>
Subject: Leathers Question
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
I recently lowsided at about 90mph at the track and
scraped up my one-piece Fieldsheer Alpha suit pretty
bad, ripping it at both elbows.

I also have an older Vanson suit that has been down
before. The leather, while scraped in places on the
sleeves, back, and butt section, is fully intact.

I guess my question is at what point does a suit lose
its protective qualities and need to be replaced?

Thanks

Adam




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 17:29:50 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 17:29:05 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Adam Reinhardt <ajreinhardt@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Leathers Question

Adam Reinhardt wrote:

>I recently lowsided at about 90mph at the track and
>scraped up my one-piece Fieldsheer Alpha suit pretty
>bad, ripping it at both elbows.
>
>I also have an older Vanson suit that has been down
>before. The leather, while scraped in places on the
>sleeves, back, and butt section, is fully intact.
>
>I guess my question is at what point does a suit lose
>its protective qualities and need to be replaced?
>
>
>
It depends on what you mean by ripped, when talking about your
Fieldsheer suit. As long as you haven't ripped any seams or holes in
the suit, it is *usually* fine...but be aware that any scrapes you have,
when scraped again, are more likely to wear through. Can you be more
specific about the elbow rips?

Roach has leathers that he's crashed in about 7 times, and although beat
up, he could still wear them. However, with the great deals he gets on
leathers, I made him buy another set.
LAR



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 17:57:20 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Southward Bound
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 17:56:26 -0400

> The Auto-Train is a little different than other Amtrak trains
> in that meals are included, even in coach. Meal service
> consists of a buffet-style arrangement.

Meals were served restaurant style (at least for the sleeping compartment
class).

Comparing notes with the guy who opted for the cheaper ticket, we ate
marginally better.

Still - think "Airline +"

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 18:06:30 2004
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 18:05:02 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Dan Brown <brown@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Leathers Question


>Adam Reinhardt wrote:
>
>>I recently lowsided at about 90mph at the track and
>>scraped up my one-piece Fieldsheer Alpha suit pretty
>>bad, ripping it at both elbows.
>>
>>I also have an older Vanson suit that has been down
>>before. The leather, while scraped in places on the
>>sleeves, back, and butt section, is fully intact.

I believe that Vanson has a repair service. You might check their
website.


--
Resist or Serve

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 21 21:20:39 2004
From: "W.S." <mobacc@XXXXXX>
To: "DC-Cycles" <DC-Cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: The Mother of All Parking Tickets
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 21:20:17 -0400
$100!!!!!! Peruse this industrial grade site --
http://www.parkingticket.com/. Written up in the Post not too long ago
it
sounds like a possible time and money saver. Might cost some but if it
nulls it . . ..

And if you use it, others are curious.

Bill S. / DC
'99 VN750 > Invisible cloaking spray for parking on perennial wishlist
Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun.

PS -- 10m in and out at Georgetown DMV for registration renewal today.


From: Sunil Doshi <sdoshi@XXXXXX>

Starting a few weeks ago, I began parking at a new set of motorcycle
spaces
on M St. between Vermont and 15th (at least new to me). I've been parking
there and dutifully paying the meter for a few weeks now.

Last night, when I left work around 6:00 and went out to the bike, I
found a
ticket waiting for me. I imagined it was for the fact that the bike has
been
in the same spot for more than 4 hours. I always pay the meter, but I was
going to wait for the first ticket before I started the 4-hour cycle of
moving the bike a space over. I was shocked when I opened it and saw a
fine
for $100. There are probably some moving violations that cost less than
that. What was I charged with? No Stopping/Standing During Rush Hour
(4-6:30PM).

I did not knowingly park there during rush hour. The signs that flanked
the
motorcycle spaces only said "4 Hour Parking, Motorcycles Only, 7AM-
6:30PM,
Monday-Friday." (shown at the URLs below) They didn't have any additional
sign on the same pole, indicating the rush hour restriction. Other signs
further down the street, near car parking, did say such a thing, but I
had
only taken notice of the signs near where I'm parking.

Does anyone know if there should have been additional signage to indicate
the rush hour restriction? Or am I out $100?

http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking1.jpg
http://widepipe.org/images/misc/parking2.jpg

sunil
http://widepipe.org/ride/
'03 Honda Shadow ACE 750
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 00:30:04 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 00:29:50 EDT
Subject: Re: Southward Bound
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/21/2004 11:15:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mjordan812@XXXXXX writes:

> At the front of the pallet are a pair of "LA Chock" type of wheel
supports.
> You roll your bike into the chock and they proceed to tie the bike down
to
> the pallet.

Been there done that with my Honda ST1100. All I would add is that you
can
tie it down yourself with your own ties if you want to (they will make
you sign
a release) I took advantage of that since they did not have any of the
handlebar bridging straps that allow the tie straps to clear the fairing.
And they
really, really, REALLY wanted to over tighten those straps, which would
have
bent the handlebars. I do understand they get a lot of damage claims, but
have no
first hand knowledge of that since I had no problems.

As for the sleeper vs coach. We had a sleeper which rocked back and forth
rather violently, looked to me like the _huge_ coach seats might just
have been
more comfortable, just a _lot_ less private.


New "bumper sticker" on the ST1100.

"Eat right, stay fit,
 DIE ANYWAY!"

John Walters (Long John)
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Up near DC

Honda ST1100X Pan European
BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles
Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 02:00:23 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 01:59:08 -0400
From: "Steven C. Di Pietro" <steven.dipietro@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: They're Coming!!!! and Suzuki Owners Club - USA Event in NY
X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out008.verizon.net
from [151.196.251.139] at Thu, 22 Apr 2004 01:00:19 -0500


Someone asked for recipes for cicadas.

Here it is.......................   It's in a PDF form

http://www.urhome.umd.edu/newsdesk/pdf/cicada%20recipes.pdf


Also, If anyone can make it up to New York early next month, The Suzuki
Owners Club - USA has a huge Charity event

http://www.buffalopier.com/marisrideforroswell.htm on May 2nd at

  http://www.buffalopier.com/index.htm       It's a fund raiser for
Cancer Research where 100% of all money raised goes to
http://www.roswellpark.org/ . The event includes a Ride, Music Festival
(2 stages with Rock and Blues bands), a Bike and Compact Car Show, and a
50 /50 Split Raffle. Also, there's a 2004 Suzuki Volusia 800, donated by
the American Suzuki Motor Corporation as a door prize. The Bike comes
with a MSF beginners or experienced Riders course.



Steven C. Di Pietro
Interim National Director
The Suzuki Owners Club -USA
16 W. Jeffrey Street
Baltimore Md. 21225-1713
http://www.soc-usa.org
1996 Suzuki Katana 600
2001 Suzuki Marauder 800


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 06:18:25 2004
From: Steve McCollom <steven.mccollom@XXXXXX>
To: <PenguinBiker@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Southward Bound
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 5:18:22 -0500
X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out008.verizon.net
from [192.168.1.5] at Thu, 22 Apr 2004 05:18:22 -0500


> From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
> Date: 2004/04/21 Wed PM 11:29:50 CDT
>
> As for the sleeper vs coach. We had a sleeper which rocked back and
forth
> rather violently, looked to me like the _huge_ coach seats might just
have been
> more comfortable, just a _lot_ less private.
>
...and it's guaranteed that somebody will open the (noisy) doors to pass
between the coach cars at least once every 15 minutes all... night...
long. We took coach on the trip south; upgraded to a sleeper for the
return leg.

Steve

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 07:23:02 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Southward Bound
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 7:22:55 -0400

> a release) I took advantage of that since they did not have any of the
> handlebar bridging straps that allow the tie straps to clear the
fairing.

They ran the straps up inside the fairing along the fork legs and
arrached close to the bar clamps on mine.

Michael J.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 08:21:36 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 08:19:40 -0400
From: Tom <tdeboeser@XXXXXX>
To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Leathers Question

Laura Roach wrote:

>   However, with the great deals he gets on leathers, I made him buy
> another set.

Wow, I wish my wife "made" me buy MC stuff ;).


Tom de '98 VTR

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 08:46:20 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 05:45:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Leathers Question
To: Tom <tdeboeser@XXXXXX>,
   "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

--- Tom <tdeboeser@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Laura Roach wrote:
>
> >   However, with the great deals he gets on leathers, I
> made him buy
> > another set.
>
> Wow, I wish my wife "made" me buy MC stuff ;).

trade her in on a better model....?

mine has been insisting for some time on a new helmet
purchase.


--
tg




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 08:56:20 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 08:55:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Southward Bound

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004, Steve McCollom wrote:

> ...and it's guaranteed that somebody will open the (noisy) doors to
pass
> between the coach cars at least once every 15 minutes all... night...
> long. We took coach on the trip south; upgraded to a sleeper for the
> return leg.

One of the nice things about being a motorcycleist and a Lab Saftey
Supply
customer is having a generous supply of earplugs readily at hand.


http://www.labsafety.com/store/product_group.asp?dept_id=12619&cat_prefix
=4WA



--
Dan Brown
brown@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:02:56 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 06:02:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>
Subject: FWD: selling the bike
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Cc: ethan nonofyurbizniz <thanos_doc@XXXXXX>
Forwarding for a friend. If interested, please
contact Etan directly - thanos_doc@XXXXXX

--- ethan nonofyurbizniz <thanos_doc@XXXXXX>
wrote:
> One too many cage drivers almost hit me again.
>
> Anyone know anybody interested in a 1998 BMW R1200C.
> I got it August 2002
> on consignment from MotoEuropa in Richmond.
>
> specs:
>
> approx 10,500 miles
> ABS
> Beemer Auxillary power jack/trickle charger
> tires are 1 season old about 1000 miles
> battery is 1 season old
> full fairing
> back seat with backrest
> back rack rated for 15-20 pounds
> corbin beetle bags--a few scratches on the left
> one--there's guy down the
> street that can fix it for about 100 bucks and he
> does good work
> full service records: all work done at either
> MotoEuropa, Bob's BMW in
> Jessup Md, Mortons BMW in Spotsylvannia VA; and
> Rockville HD in MD.
>
> for price: check out KBB, Ebay or Cycletrader; It's
> finally depreciated to
> the below market price I picked it up for.
>
> If there's a serious buyer from out of town they can
> come down or I might be
> willing to drive a few hours as long as there's a
> certified check on the
> other end. Only thing: no novices. I don't want
> the bike taking a spill on
> a test drive and me being stuck with scrap metal.
>
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:18:21 2004
Subject: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:21:57 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Laura Roach" <laura@XXXXXX>,
   "Adam Reinhardt" <ajreinhardt@XXXXXX>
Cc: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

As I have yet to get some protective pants, all the reading here
prompted me to elevate this to priority 1. What's the deal on the mesh
gear..will it save your ass as much as leather if you go down once?

I noticed a lack of leather suits in the area dealer I went to browse
at. Instinctively I want to avoid Joe Rocket.. What is the best way to
go about getting a good quality leather suit that fits well. Any brand
recommendations here?


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:19:37 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:18:51 -0400
From: Tom <tdeboeser@XXXXXX>
To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Leathers Question

Tom Gimer wrote:

>--- Tom <tdeboeser@XXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
>>Laura Roach wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> However, with the great deals he gets on leathers, I
>>>
>>>
>>made him buy
>>
>>
>>>another set.
>>>
>>>
>>Wow, I wish my wife "made" me buy MC stuff ;).
>>
>>
>
>trade her in on a better model....?
>
>

Naw, she's pretty good. three years ago She made me get a new (to me)
bike... I can't really complain.


Tom de
>
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:30:43 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 06:30:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Have you thought about Cordura riding gear? Having
used both, I prefer Cordura for the street as its
easier to take care of and provides as good as
protection as regular street leather (race leathers
provide the best protection). Plus Cordura drys
quicker (and usually comes waterproof, when combined
with Goretex) and when it gets dirty you can throw it
in the washing machine. I like the stuff from
Riderwearhouse (AKA Aerostich)
http://www.aerostich.com/riderwearhouse.store and I
like the gear from Motoport http://www.motoport.com/

Glenn

--- Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX> wrote:
> As I have yet to get some protective pants, all the
> reading here
> prompted me to elevate this to priority 1. What's
> the deal on the mesh
> gear..will it save your ass as much as leather if
> you go down once?
<snip>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:36:35 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:36:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004, Julian Halton wrote:
> As I have yet to get some protective pants, all the reading here
> prompted me to elevate this to priority 1. What's the deal on the mesh
> gear..will it save your ass as much as leather if you go down once?
Probably not, but it will probably be cooler. It will be better than
jeans
or shorts though.

> I noticed a lack of leather suits in the area dealer I went to browse
> at. Instinctively I want to avoid Joe Rocket.. What is the best way
to
> go about getting a good quality leather suit that fits well. Any brand
> recommendations here?

For Leather, Vanson is well respected. They're available locally at
Motorcycle Leather Exchange -- DC-Cycles readers, actual motorcycle
riders,
and genuinely good folks!

http://www.motorcycleleatherexchange.com/

I ride in a pair of Aerostitch Darien pants. They're comfortable, easy
to
put on and take off, are good over top of work clothes and are much
better
than just jeans, etc. Most of my riding is done in situations other than
the race track. My current ones are black - a set of Hi-Vis is what I
plan
to replace these with in the future, both for the slightly "cooler"
coloration and for the better (in theory) visibility.

Go Here: http://www.aerostich.com/riderwearhouse.store

Search for product 155.


--
Dan Brown
brown@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:37:21 2004
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:37:37 -0400
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Mesh is not quite as good as leather, but an order of magnitude better
than jeans. NewEnough.com has some links to reviews of various mesh
gear, I think. Try different types on, if possible. If it fits well,
and the armor will stay in place, it'll work pretty well.


On Apr 22, 2004, at 9:21 AM, Julian Halton wrote:

> As I have yet to get some protective pants, all the reading here
> prompted me to elevate this to priority 1. What's the deal on the mesh
> gear..will it save your ass as much as leather if you go down once?
>
>   I noticed a lack of leather suits in the area dealer I went to browse
>   at. Instinctively I want to avoid Joe Rocket.. What is the best way
>   to
>   go about getting a good quality leather suit that fits well. Any brand
>   recommendations here?
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:43:46 2004
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:47:24 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Stephen Miller" <freecat@XXXXXX>, "DC-Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

This sport can be expensive at times. I am looking for something that
will allow me out on the track. Quite a few listers recommend
Aerostitch. I have a Vanson leather jacket....the cobra CSR2..Maybe the
smart investment would be pants from Vanson.

-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Miller [mailto:freecat@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 9:38 AM
To: DC-Cycles
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

Mesh is not quite as good as leather, but an order of magnitude better
than jeans. NewEnough.com has some links to reviews of various mesh
gear, I think. Try different types on, if possible. If it fits well,
and the armor will stay in place, it'll work pretty well.


On Apr 22, 2004, at 9:21 AM, Julian Halton wrote:

> As I have yet to get some protective pants, all the reading here
> prompted me to elevate this to priority 1. What's the deal on the
> mesh gear..will it save your ass as much as leather if you go down
once?
>
> I noticed a lack of leather suits in the area dealer I went to browse
> at. Instinctively I want to avoid Joe Rocket.. What is the best way
> to go about getting a good quality leather suit that fits well. Any
> brand recommendations here?
>
>




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:48:32 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:48:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
On Thu, 22 Apr 2004, Julian Halton wrote:
> This sport can be expensive at times.

This and many other "gear intensive" sports, yes. But, what is more
expensive, leather pants or skin-grafts? I'm pretty sure I know which
hurts more.

> I am looking for something that
> will allow me out on the track. Quite a few listers recommend
> Aerostitch. I have a Vanson leather jacket....the cobra CSR2..Maybe
the
> smart investment would be pants from Vanson.

If you have a Vanson jacket - note the zipper around the waist line -
Vanson pants should zip together.

Again, I can't say enough about New Enough.

--
Dan Brown
brown@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 09:55:48 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 06:55:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Julian -

Yeah, this sport *can* be expensive; the bike is
merely the first step.

It's hard to find gear that will do it all, from hot
to cold to wet to track. If you try, you'll wind up
with something that does none well.

I've never seen the vanson pants, but if they don't
breathe well, you won't wear them, and gear hanging in
the closet gives you no protection. I know, I've got
a devent set of textile pants, and they'll probably be
too hot for the summer. Already I don't like wearing
them for short rides, yet I'm uncomfortable with only
jeans. Mesh pants are probably in my future.

From what I know, leather is best for track, textiles
are best for everyday use & touring. Of course, this
is a broad generalization.

You may think about getting summer gear for now, track
gear when you need it, and cool-weather gear later.
Of course, you'll get the best prices on cool-weather
gear now.....
--- Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX> wrote:
> This sport can be expensive at times. I am looking
> for something that
> will allow me out on the track. Quite a few listers
> recommend
> Aerostitch. I have a Vanson leather jacket....the
> cobra CSR2..Maybe the
> smart investment would be pants from Vanson.
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 10:07:21 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 10:07:20 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Wrenching with Matt

Mr. Patton came over last night to use Paul's chain press tool which I
had
borrowed and not used yet. We performed simultaneous chain and sprocket
installations which went fairly well. Matt continued by installing a new
rear shock, and I changed my oil and swapped on my new rear D220 using
the
Harbor Freight tire changer to get the old one off, and brute force to
get
the new one on. Thanks Matt!

No major issues, but I did manage to over torque the rear sprocket bolts
and snap off two heads. Doh! Stupid air ratchet operator. I'm not
riding
it until I pick up six new ones and lightly torque them to spec
tonight. Live and learn, hopefully for the least amount of money and
pain
possible.

Not sure how much money I saved by installing everything myself.
Probably
$150 or so. And a sense of satisfaction.


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org
When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or
any other kinds of
dogmas or goals, it's always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.
     - Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, 146

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 11:03:15 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 10:51:25 -0400

I have the JR Phoenix pants. Realize not what you're looking for. But
for
cold weather riding I'll just throw my cheap rain pants over top of them.
Since they're cheap rain pants, not only are they waterproof, but
windproof
too.
The JR are easy to throw on over pants, for commuting. Friend has the
Alpinstar version, says the same about them.
I also have a pair of Draggin Jeans. Kevlar in the knees & arse w/ the
optional knee pads. In order to keep the protective stuff where it needs
to
be they are tight. I like nice baggy jeans, these are by far the
tightest
pair I own, which makes me not want to wear them when I'm off the bike.
They make a baggier version now as well as a cargo khaki version. They
cost
almost as much as the JR Phoenix pants. I feel a lil more protected
wearing
both at the same time.

>From: Brian Ray <bdaleray@XXXXXX>
>To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
>Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 06:55:36 -0700 (PDT)
>
>You may think about getting summer gear for now, track
>gear when you need it, and cool-weather gear later.
>Of course, you'll get the best prices on cool-weather
>gear now

_________________________________________________________________
From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring
Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 11:22:09 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 08:22:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
--- Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX> wrote:
> What's the deal on the mesh
> gear..will it save your ass as much as leather if you go down once?

depends at what speed you go down and what you hit. But generally no.
Mesh gear is when you want to tip the scales in favor of comfort over
protection. Leather is the other way. Though perf leather is rather
cooler than solid.

> at.   Instinctively I want to avoid   Joe Rocket..

I don't   know your reasons why and one could argue where JR stacks up
against   FirstGear, HJC, and so forth, but JR stuff does right fine.
Hey, if   it's good enough for Nicky Hayden... (ok, I'm kidding, like it
matters   at all what some guy wears...)

> go about getting a good quality leather suit that fits well. Any
> brand recommendations here?

Do you mean for commutting or only-on-sat/sun joyride duty? Unless you
ride like a maniac any leather suit (1 or 2 piece) of $300+ will do
what it needs to do. Be it made of Goatskin, Cow, or Cordura/Ballistic
Nylon. Suits protect against road rash but do very little in regards to
hitting solid objects like rocks, trees, vehicles, poles, and
guardrails.

I wear my JR ballistics every day rain or shine. For cool/cold weather
the Ballistic v3 jacket and Ballistic pants and for warmer/hot weather
the Alter-Ego jacket (more robust than a Phoenix with removable
over-panels if I want the full mesh experience) and Phoenix pants. The
Ballistic pants I wear in any kind of wet and they are almost always
perfectly dry. The jacket is a different story altogether but probably
could be fixed with some seam sealer. (I probably ought to wash the
thing, too.) I have crash tested the Ballistics at 80+mph on extremely
rough textured and hot concrete. If the armor pocket had been internal
instead of sewn on externally I would probably have spared myself a bit
of the impact abrasion but the sleeve material itself was fully intact.
I suffered lacerations on the knees thru the pants and thru my kevlar
reinforced jeans (Draggin' jeans) and despite the GP grade armor which
didn't help me much because I was tumbling and because pant legs rotate
since they aren't fastened to anything.

When buying textile gear try to find stuff with armor contained INSIDE
the main jacket sleeve/pant leg instead of applied externally. But I
also don't recommend crashing at 80+mph in the first place.

For track outings I have my Italian (as opposed to
Pakistani/Korean-made) AGV 1-piece suit that I got from the most
excellent www.leatherexchange.com back with the prior proprietor.

I cringe every time my friend rides his bike in slacks and dress shoes.
Thankfully he doesn't ride much in retrospect.

I have a almost new 2-piece leather suit that I really never wear. It's
"Kawasaki" apparel but actually top-shelf JR. Jacket size 40, pants 34
or 36. All the good GP armor. Anybody want it before I haul it back to
Chicago?

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 11:25:47 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: HEAVY leather Joe Rocket Jacket
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 11:25:38 -0400

Hi everyone. My wife just bought me a new leather jacket (color matched
to
my bike) so I'm selling my black leather Joe Rocket jacket. It's a size
XXL. I'm 6'2" 225lbs and it fits me very loosely. The jacket is supple
and
in great shape with no damage. It has a removable winter liner as well
(worked great this past winter!). I can email pictures on request. I'm
asking for $120 obo.

_________________________________________________________________
From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring
Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 11:55:07 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 11:55:01 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash



-----Original Message-----
From: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>

This sport can be expensive at times. I am looking for something that
will allow me out on the track. Quite a few listers recommend
Aerostitch. I have a Vanson leather jacket....the cobra CSR2..Maybe the
smart investment would be pants from Vanson.

------
OK, this is not aimed at Julian, since he's on the right track and wants
to protect his lower half regardless of cost. And it's probably harsh,
judgmental, preachy and all that stuff, but it needs to be said.

Pet peeve time. I hear the "proper gear's just too expensive" line from
newbies all the time. First of all, it just isn't all that expensive if
you know how to shop around or are willing to wear pre-loved gear.
Secondly, how can it be that people with decent jobs, people who can
afford a late model motorcycle (what's essentially a "toy" to most
people) costing anywhere from $7K to $10K +, can afford to insure and
maintain said bike, and yet good gear is "too expensive"? I can see
maybe the rider of a 15-year-old ratbike used as transportation saying
this, but a lot of the people I see riding around half-dressed on
motorcycles are obviously credit-worthy, or else the dealership would not
have tossed them the keys to a brand new bike. Or does this really mean
"the credit union won't let me finance a 'Stich or leathers"? If it's
really a financial hardship to buy good gear, get thee to the Washington
Post classifieds or Craigslist, buy a five-year-old bike and put a
portion of the savings into gear. <yi
lding the soapbox>



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 11:55:42 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: julian@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 11:44:04 -0400

Julian,

What size are you?   I have a couple year old 'stich Roadcrafter Suit that
I'm about to sell.   Two piece.

Drop me a line if you'd like more details.

Rob
'98 VFR800 (temporarily on a soon to be sold '96 CBR900)


From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Stephen Miller" <freecat@XXXXXX>, "DC-Cycles"
<dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:47:24 -0400

This sport can be expensive at times. I am looking for something that
will allow me out on the track. Quite a few listers recommend
Aerostitch. I have a Vanson leather jacket....the cobra CSR2..Maybe the
smart investment would be pants from Vanson.
-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Miller [mailto:freecat@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 9:38 AM
To: DC-Cycles
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

Mesh is not quite as good as leather, but an order of magnitude better
than jeans. NewEnough.com has some links to reviews of various mesh
gear, I think. Try different types on, if possible. If it fits well,
and the armor will stay in place, it'll work pretty well.


On Apr 22, 2004, at 9:21 AM, Julian Halton wrote:

 > As I have yet to get some protective pants, all the reading here
 > prompted me to elevate this to priority 1. What's the deal on the
 > mesh gear..will it save your ass as much as leather if you go down
once?
 >
 > I noticed a lack of leather suits in the area dealer I went to browse
 > at. Instinctively I want to avoid Joe Rocket.. What is the best way
 > to go about getting a good quality leather suit that fits well. Any
 > brand recommendations here?
 >
 >

_________________________________________________________________
Watch LIVE baseball games on your computer with MLB.TV, included with MSN
Premium!
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/mlb&pgmarket=en-
us/go/onm00200439ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 12:17:48 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 12:17:55 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
CC: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

Paul Wilson wrote:

>Pet peeve time. I hear the "proper gear's just too expensive" line from
newbies all the time. First of all, it just isn't all that expensive if
you know how to shop around or are willing to wear pre-loved gear.
Secondly, how can it be that people with decent jobs, people who can
afford a late model motorcycle (what's essentially a "toy" to most
people) costing anywhere from $7K to $10K +, can afford to insure and
maintain said bike, and yet good gear is "too expensive"? I can see
maybe the rider of a 15-year-old ratbike used as transportation saying
this, but a lot of the people I see riding around half-dressed on
motorcycles are obviously credit-worthy, or else the dealership would not
have tossed them the keys to a brand new bike. Or does this really mean
"the credit union won't let me finance a 'Stich or leathers"? If it's
really a financial hardship to buy good gear, get thee to the Washington
Post classifieds or Craigslist, buy a five-year-old bike and put a porti!
> on of the savings into gear. <yielding the soapbox>
>
>
>

Can I get an AMEN? We have people coming into the shop all the time
saying "where can I get a cheap helmet??" That is the LAST question I'd
ever ask. Safety gear is exactly that, safety gear. It is the only
thing that will save you between you and the pavement. Your head should
be the most important item on your body, don't skimp on safety gear.

I will admit...when I first started riding, I was BAD! I rode in jeans
and a light jacket. Didn't wear any leather. After crashing on the
track in leathers, I learned I did not want to crash on the street in
anything but leathers. I learned my lesson. Save up for safety gear
people...It's your life.

Ok, I just "soapboxed" too, but I feel very strongly about this! :)
Laura

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 12:39:01 2004
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 12:39:24 -0400
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I think Julian's dilemma is that he's looking for the ONE gear purchase
that is a good track day suit, good on the street, offers top crash
protection, is warm in cold weather, and breathes well in hot weather.

There is no such piece of gear.

An Aerostich is great, by all accounts. But there's no way it's going
to be as comfortable in August traffic as one of the many mesh suits
out there. If you want to do track days AND ride in the summer AND
ride in colder weather AND be comfortable, I'd say you need two sets of
gear minimum, ideally three:

1. Leathers, back protector, etc. for track days and weekend sport
riding. If this is all you do, this may be all you need.
2. Summer mesh gear. On hot days there is no substitute. I like the
First Gear stuff, but many people make them (JR, AGV, Fieldsheer,
etc.), and they're all better than jeans and a t-shirt. Some are
1-crash pieces, some seem to be able to withstand more than that.
3. A heavy duty waterproof textile suit (jacket and pants or 1-piece)
for colder weather.

Then you still need a rainsuit to cover up the leathers and mesh gear.
You still need at least two pairs of gloves, light and heavy. You might
want two pairs of boots, one waterproof street-oriented pair and one
high-tech track-designed pair. For very cold days you'll want some
electric gear.
Now everyone can tell me what I forgot, or how no, no, my heavy jacket
is just fine in the summer.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 12:51:38 2004
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 12:55:17 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Stephen Miller" <freecat@XXXXXX>, "DC-Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

After deliberating I will get the field gear titanium pants. They are
109 at the dreaded C but if motorcycleleatherexchange can beat that I
will run up Persimmon Tree road and pick em up. Thanks for the
invaluable advice. The bottom line is whenever you try and compromise
you lose something so I guess I just have to plan on three sets of gear.



-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Miller [mailto:freecat@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 12:39 PM
To: DC-Cycles
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

I think Julian's dilemma is that he's looking for the ONE gear purchase
that is a good track day suit, good on the street, offers top crash
protection, is warm in cold weather, and breathes well in hot weather.

There is no such piece of gear.

An Aerostich is great, by all accounts. But there's no way it's going
to be as comfortable in August traffic as one of the many mesh suits out
there. If you want to do track days AND ride in the summer AND ride in
colder weather AND be comfortable, I'd say you need two sets of gear
minimum, ideally three:

1. Leathers, back protector, etc. for track days and weekend sport
riding. If this is all you do, this may be all you need.
2. Summer mesh gear. On hot days there is no substitute. I like the
First Gear stuff, but many people make them (JR, AGV, Fieldsheer, etc.),
and they're all better than jeans and a t-shirt. Some are 1-crash
pieces, some seem to be able to withstand more than that.
3. A heavy duty waterproof textile suit (jacket and pants or 1-piece)
for colder weather.

Then you still need a rainsuit to cover up the leathers and mesh gear.
You still need at least two pairs of gloves, light and heavy. You might
want two pairs of boots, one waterproof street-oriented pair and one
high-tech track-designed pair. For very cold days you'll want some
electric gear.

Now everyone can tell me what I forgot, or how no, no, my heavy jacket
is just fine in the summer.
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 12:56:33 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:56:18 -0700 (PDT)
From: Adam Reinhardt <ajreinhardt@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
To: Rob Keiser <robkeiser@XXXXXX>, julian@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX

The sport really gets expensive when you start
crashing at the track. Between entrance fees, bike
repair and gear replacement, a day at the track gone
wrong can easily cost an arm and a leg.

I think you're best bet for track days is a used
leather suit in good condition (i.e. one that hasn't
been down at speed) Here you have two options as I
see: 1) Purchase the best suit possible, like a Z
Custom suit and have it repaired if you go down and 2)
buy a cheaper suit, perhaps AGV or Fieldsheer, and if
it goes, then just replace it.

Don't forget the importance of a good back protector.

Right now I'm looking at replacing my Shoei X-tec with
a HJC AC-11. After doing some research on-line it
seems that the HJC is nearly as good a helmet a much
more affordable price. Replacing helmets isn't cheap
either.

Of course the third and best option is: don't crash!

Adam


> From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>

>
>   This sport can be expensive at times. I am looking
>   for something that
>   will allow me out on the track. Quite a few listers
>   recommend
>   Aerostitch. I have a Vanson leather jacket....the
>   cobra CSR2..Maybe the
>   smart investment would be pants from Vanson.




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 12:57:20 2004
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 13:01:00 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Laura Roach" <laura@XXXXXX>,
   "Paul Wilson" <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Cc: "DC-Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

FYI... I don't skimp when it comes to safety. I have a Shoei helmet and
a Vanson jacket.
I was just observing that it is expensive to get everything for All
Seasons. And just as a data point I paid 6k CASH for my bike. Working
long hours at a second job to pay for it. Credit cards
suck.....especially at 29% APR...

-----Original Message-----
From: Laura Roach [mailto:laura@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 12:18 PM
To: Paul Wilson
Cc: DC-Cycles
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

Paul Wilson wrote:

>Pet peeve time. I hear the "proper gear's just too expensive" line
from newbies all the time. First of all, it just isn't all that
expensive if you know how to shop around or are willing to wear
pre-loved gear. Secondly, how can it be that people with decent jobs,
people who can afford a late model motorcycle (what's essentially a
"toy" to most people) costing anywhere from $7K to $10K +, can afford to
insure and maintain said bike, and yet good gear is "too expensive"? I
can see maybe the rider of a 15-year-old ratbike used as transportation
saying this, but a lot of the people I see riding around half-dressed on
motorcycles are obviously credit-worthy, or else the dealership would
not have tossed them the keys to a brand new bike. Or does this really
mean "the credit union won't let me finance a 'Stich or leathers"? If
it's really a financial hardship to buy good gear, get thee to the
Washington Post classifieds or Craigslist, buy a five-year-old bike and
put a port!
  i!
> on of the savings into gear. <yielding the soapbox>
>
>
>

Can I get an AMEN? We have people coming into the shop all the time
saying "where can I get a cheap helmet??" That is the LAST question I'd
ever ask. Safety gear is exactly that, safety gear. It is the only
thing that will save you between you and the pavement. Your head should
be the most important item on your body, don't skimp on safety gear.
I will admit...when I first started riding, I was BAD! I rode in jeans
and a light jacket. Didn't wear any leather. After crashing on the
track in leathers, I learned I did not want to crash on the street in
anything but leathers. I learned my lesson. Save up for safety gear
people...It's your life.

Ok, I just "soapboxed" too, but I feel very strongly about this! :)
Laura




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 13:04:58 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 13:04:52 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: bolt shear followup

$40 for 6 bolts, washers and nuts to hold the rear sprocket, and they
won't
be in until Tuesday.

Doh!


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 13:17:29 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 13:16:45 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>
CC: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

Julian Halton wrote:

>FYI... I don't skimp when it comes to safety. I have a Shoei helmet and
>a Vanson jacket.
>I was just observing that it is expensive to get everything for All
>Seasons. And just as a data point I paid 6k CASH for my bike. Working
>long hours at a second job to pay for it. Credit cards
>suck.....especially at 29% APR...
>
>
>

That was not directed at you at all, Julian.   It was an "in general"
comment. I agree everything is expensive, and it totally sucks. I was
just saying we get a lot of people that come into the shop riding a
brand new bike, with tons of aftermarket stuff on it, and then they
don't want to pay for the safety gear. It gets very irritating because
you want people to be safe. Riding is inherently dangerous.

It was not a dig at you at all. I promise.

LAR

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 13:21:04 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 13:22:21 -0400
To: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>, DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash

At 12:39 PM 4/22/04 -0400, Stephen Miller wrote:

>Now everyone can tell me what I forgot, or how no, no, my heavy jacket
>is just fine in the summer.

Actually, my FXRG jacket was acceptable, even over a leather vest, in the
well-over-80 temps last Sunday for that 300+ mile group ride I went on.
Of
course, I adapt well to temperature changes, don't mind sweating a
little,
and have had some training by oriental masters in controlling my
body...but
even so, the 15 degree temperature drop at the Bay Bridge felt *really*
good! ;-)

I'm looking for a cooler jacket for summer, but until then, I'll keep
wearing the FXRG. Wore it yesterday and was ok for instance.

The rest of your list sounds good. It's close to what I have
now...except
I've got 4 pairs of gloves: heated heavy winter (for temps below 32F),
medium-heavy spring/fall (32F-55F), uninsulated leather gauntlets
(55F-85F), and fingerless ones with holes in the backs (for rides in
temps
over 85F). Yeah, I know, the fingerless ones will only protect my palms
in
a crash, and won't stop bug impacts at high speeds...but they also help
keep my hands from sweating and aid in cooling all of me by letting air
go
up the sleeves of the jacket. I also don't have to take them off to fish
for change, to fasten my helmet strap or whatever.

I still need to add something to waterproof my feet...the boots I have
didn't soak any up, but they let it in. Gaiters may do it.

-- Mike B.
'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 13:59:48 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 10:59:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bryce <bster13@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I disagree. Of course you are making concesssions by
selecting one set of riding gear for do-it-all purpose
but the Motoport Ultra II Cordura suit fits the bill
best if I had to select one (shit, I DID select the
setup b4 I purchased my Barnacle Bill custom 1piece
race leathers)

The Ultra II has 1000 denier Cordura as opposed to
5-600 with the Aerostich . It also is not laminated
or coated with any sort of waterproofing protection
like the port, thus it breathes pretty darn good when
compared to the mesh jackets out there. For
waterproofing they use good old Goretex liners
underneath.

As for abrasion resistance, the Motoport has 1000
cordura compared to the lesser Aerostich as well as
come stock with back pad, where as stich is an addon.


Best of all, the Motoport IS actually waterproof as
advertised, no dreaded crotch leak with Aerotstich.

Worst of all, Motoport has shity customer service and
takes a long time to get the gear, so order early.

Good luck,

Bryce
--- Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX> wrote:
> I think Julian's dilemma is that he's looking for
> the ONE gear purchase
> that is a good track day suit, good on the street,
> offers top crash
> protection, is warm in cold weather, and breathes
> well in hot weather.
>
> There is no such piece of gear.
>
> An Aerostich is great, by all accounts. But there's
> no way it's going
>   to be as comfortable in August traffic as one of the
>   many mesh suits
>   out there. If you want to do track days AND ride in
>   the summer AND
>   ride in colder weather AND be comfortable, I'd say
>   you need two sets of
>   gear minimum, ideally three:
>
>   1. Leathers, back protector, etc. for track days and
>   weekend sport
>   riding. If this is all you do, this may be all you
>   need.
>   2. Summer mesh gear. On hot days there is no
>   substitute. I like the
>   First Gear stuff, but many people make them (JR,
>   AGV, Fieldsheer,
>   etc.), and they're all better than jeans and a
>   t-shirt. Some are
>   1-crash pieces, some seem to be able to withstand
>   more than that.
>   3. A heavy duty waterproof textile suit (jacket and
>   pants or 1-piece)
>   for colder weather.
>
>   Then you still need a rainsuit to cover up the
>   leathers and mesh gear.
>   You still need at least two pairs of gloves, light
>   and heavy. You might
>   want two pairs of boots, one waterproof
>   street-oriented pair and one
>   high-tech track-designed pair. For very cold days
>   you'll want some
>   electric gear.
>
>   Now everyone can tell me what I forgot, or how no,
>   no, my heavy jacket
>   is just fine in the summer.
>
>




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 14:39:46 2004
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 14:39:45 -0400
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Call me a skeptic, but there's no way it breathes like the mesh gear
does. The first time I wore a mesh jacket I felt like I was riding
naked. I have a very nice Gericke jacket that, with the liner removed,
breathes remarkably well. It is comfortable *at speed* up to about 90
degrees.    But my mesh jacket is comfortable on the hottest of hot
days. And even in-stop and go traffic flows mucho air.

On Apr 22, 2004, at 1:59 PM, Bryce wrote:

> The Ultra II has 1000 denier Cordura as opposed to
> 5-600 with the Aerostich . It also is not laminated
> or coated with any sort of waterproofing protection
> like the port, thus it breathes pretty darn good when
> compared to the mesh jackets out there. For
> waterproofing they use good old Goretex liners
> underneath.
http://cornersolution.com

The only blog you need to read.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 14:58:14 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 11:58:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bryce <bster13@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

You're a skeptic. :p

Seriously....of course it's not like the paper tissue
mesh jackets, but u are realizing the full
protectiveness of a top of the line cordura jacket,
and breathing as well as a mesh jacket @ about 95%.
I'm fine up to 95 or so.

Bryce
--- Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Call me a skeptic, but there's no way it breathes
> like the mesh gear
> does. The first time I wore a mesh jacket I felt
> like I was riding
> naked. I have a very nice Gericke jacket that, with
> the liner removed,
> breathes remarkably well. It is comfortable *at
> speed* up to about 90
> degrees.    But my mesh jacket is comfortable on the
> hottest of hot
> days. And even in-stop and go traffic flows mucho
> air.
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 15:00:51 2004
Subject: Technique question
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:04:31 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "DC-Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>



I was close to the apex of a left turn last night at approximately
53mph. I was leaning left while trying to keep my body posture upright.
I was approximately in between the inside line and center of the turn. I
was feeling good.
My front tire hit some uneven pavement and wobbled.

I had two reactions.
- I stopped rolling on the throttle
- I squeezed harder on the bars
Per MSF training I realized I had made two classic mistakes as a
response to sudden stress.
I discussed this with two of the other riders with me. Both are track
and race veterans.
Rider 1 said I was correct to stop rolling on the throttle and incorrect
to grab the bars tighter
Rider 2 said I should have tried to brake and straighten up ( movement
taught at MSF BRC course )

Thoughts and also:
1) What if it had been a patch of oil?

I realize I have been a chatty Kathy today so I thank all listers in
advance.



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 15:17:03 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:16:28 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>
CC: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Technique question

Julian Halton wrote:

> I was leaning left while trying to keep my body posture upright.
>I was approximately in between the inside line and center of the turn.
>
>Rider 1 said I was correct to stop rolling on the throttle and incorrect
>to grab the bars tighter
>Rider 2 said I should have tried to brake and straighten up ( movement
>taught at MSF BRC course )
>
>
>
What do you mean by leaning left while trying to keep your body posture
upright? I'm trying to picture this and I am unsure.

As long as you didn't chop the throttle or laid off the throttle, you
did the right thing. You always, during a mistake (like you said) want
to keep the throttle on or roll on it a little more...but never go
backwards with your throttle...that will transfer all your weight to the
front wheel.

Braking and standing straight up...not sure I agree with that. If you
were in a turn, that would send you out of the turn (don't ask me how I
know this)...and what if there is a tree in your immediate path? This is
how most riders get killed. Feeling as if they can't make a turn (for
any reason) and not giving it more gas and more lean. It's better to
try and make the turn, because 98% of the time you WILL, even if you
feel like you won't. The track will definitely teach you this. And if
you don't make the turn, better to low side than to high side or hit
something that is off of the road.

You made a common error that we all make, and it will take you a while
to untrain your mental habit to make reactions like that. Don't beat
yourself up about it. You are analyzing what you did and I bet you do
it better next time. :)

LAR

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 15:22:39 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>, Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>
CC: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:22:32 -0400


>
> From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/22 Thu PM 01:16:45 EDT
> To: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>
> CC: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
>    DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
><snip>>
> >
>
> That was not directed at you at all, Julian. It was an "in general"
> comment. I agree everything is expensive, and it totally sucks. I was
> just saying we get a lot of people that come into the shop riding a
> brand new bike, with tons of aftermarket stuff on it, and then they
> don't want to pay for the safety gear. It gets very irritating because
> you want people to be safe. Riding is inherently dangerous.
>
> It was not a dig at you at all. I promise.
>
> LAR
>

Laura,

What surprises me is the Harley crowd. We spend upwards of
$25k for a bike and then bitch about how much synthetic
oil changes and maintenance cost.

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 15:24:50 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>, DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:24:43 -0400


>
>   From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/22 Thu PM 02:39:45 EDT
>   To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>   Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
>
>   Call me a skeptic, but there's no way it breathes like the mesh gear
>   does. The first time I wore a mesh jacket I felt like I was riding
>   naked. I have a very nice Gericke jacket that, with the liner removed,
>   breathes remarkably well. It is comfortable *at speed* up to about 90
>   degrees.    But my mesh jacket is comfortable on the hottest of hot
>   days. And even in-stop and go traffic flows mucho air.
>


I have to agree with the mesh jackets. I have a Draggin Jeans Airflow II
and that jacket is like wearing nothing at all. Down right chilly to
wear in the evenings with just a t-shirt on underneath. Definately the
way to go in the summertime. I have a HG California II that has very
good ventilation but it's nowhere near the Airflow II.

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 15:28:14 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:27:31 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Bryce <bster13@XXXXXX>, DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash
-----Original Message-----
From: Bryce <bster13@XXXXXX>


You're a skeptic. :p

Seriously....of course it's not like the paper tissue
mesh jackets, but u are realizing the full
protectiveness of a top of the line cordura jacket,
and breathing as well as a mesh jacket @ about 95%.
I'm fine up to 95 or so.

Bryce
--- Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Call me a skeptic, but there's no way it breathes
> like the mesh gear
> does. ...

Data point: this is my third "season" (for those who observe that
particular convention) with the Motoport Ultra II jacket and pants. I
absolutely love these garments, and they're at a lower price point than
the "equivalent" Aerostich. Actually, there is no equivalent Aerostich
product. The armor is markedly superior to the 'Stich. The jacket comes
with a real bona-fide back protector for instance. The other features of
the Motoport work and work as advertised. When they say breathable...yup
it's breathable right through the cordura fabric. When they say "100%
waterproof" with the Gore-tex liners they are not blowing smoke. This is
gear that works people. I will say, though, all the breathability in the
world is not going to help you when the 14th St. Bridge is a parking lot
and its 95 degrees and there's not a breath of wind.

I do have a JR Phoenix jacket/pants that I wear for commuting in warm
weather. It's a compromise I'm willing to accept for around town use.



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 15:53:58 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 15:51:47 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
CC: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash



Paul Wilson wrote:
[snip]
> Pet peeve time. I hear the "proper gear's just too expensive" line
from newbies all the time.
[snip]

you want an "expensive gear" sport where you really cannot afford to
compromise,
take up skydiving.

You pays your money, you takes your chances.   get good gear.   your life
is worth
it in retrospect.

everyone has heard the following:
 It's not if- you're going to go down, it's -when-.

the logic that follows is:
since you -know- that you will crash, you'd be a fool not to prepare.


--skip, shopping for pants also.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 16:35:01 2004
From: bernescut@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 16:34:32 -0400

I searched for quite awhile for pants before settling on two options.
For
many seasons I rode year round in MotoPort Voyager pants which kept me
warm
all year round :) The fabric eventually lost it's capacity to be
waterproof
and the velcro closures no longer held their grip so I went to replace
them
but MotoPort gear is no longer in the budget (why does that darn kid has
to
eat EVERY day?) so I got the First Gear Hypertex pants. They are
comfortable and slip on over my work clothes. I haven't tested their
capacity to be waterproof but that might change on the way home tonight.
For hot weather I have the Fieldsheer mesh pants which have very good
armor
and padding, but are tight and tend to wrinkle my work clothes, so it's a
trade off. I prefer showing up at the office with wrinkles instead of
all
sweaty. Since the mesh pants tend to less than waterproof I'm looking
for
some rainpants that are small enough to cram under the seat of the bike.
Anyone here tried Frog Toggs?
Cedric Bernescut
2000 CBR600F4
Annandale, VA

>SELECT * FROM Users WHERE clue > 0

0 rows returned
the logic that follows is:
since you -know- that you will crash, you'd be a fool not to prepare.


--skip, shopping for pants also.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 16:52:24 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 16:52:17 -0400

I have a set of Frog Toggs. Silver. Never wore them but they are very
light, almost paper-like. I've since purchased another set of Kirkland
raingear. Don't know what your size is but if you're interested in them,
ping me off-list.

-aki


>
> From: bernescut@XXXXXX
> Date: 2004/04/22 Thu PM 04:34:32 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
>
> I searched for quite awhile for pants before settling on two options.
For
> many seasons I rode year round in MotoPort Voyager pants which kept me
warm
> all year round :) The fabric eventually lost it's capacity to be
waterproof
> and the velcro closures no longer held their grip so I went to replace
them
> but MotoPort gear is no longer in the budget (why does that darn kid
has to
> eat EVERY day?) so I got the First Gear Hypertex pants. They are
> comfortable and slip on over my work clothes. I haven't tested their
> capacity to be waterproof but that might change on the way home
tonight.
> For hot weather I have the Fieldsheer mesh pants which have very good
armor
> and padding, but are tight and tend to wrinkle my work clothes, so it's
a
> trade off. I prefer showing up at the office with wrinkles instead of
all
> sweaty. Since the mesh pants tend to less than waterproof I'm looking
for
> some rainpants that are small enough to cram under the seat of the
bike.
>   Anyone here tried Frog Toggs?
>   Cedric Bernescut
>   2000 CBR600F4
>   Annandale, VA
>
>   >SELECT * FROM Users WHERE clue > 0
>
>   0 rows returned
>
>
>
>
>   the logic that follows is:
>   since you -know- that you will crash, you'd be a fool not to prepare.
>
>
>   --skip, shopping for pants also.
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 17:25:50 2004
From: Michael Lynch <MLynch@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: RE: Dressing for the crash
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 17:29:30 -0400

The GF and I bought 2 sets of Frogg Toggs when we rented a bike for a 2
week
tour around England, Wales and Ireland.

They are extremely lightweight, to the point of being a major fault.
It's
like wearing a paper tarp. We sized them to be able to fit over our
normal
gear. Because of that, the necks were huge and the water just ran down
our
backs. There is no adjustment around the collar. We later would put the
hood up (pulled out of the zipper collar), then put our helmets on over
it,
which was kinda annoying. The left leg on my pants ended up totally
shredded from putting my foot down at stops and getting caught on the peg
feeler on the way up. When it would catch, it would just tear. Later, I
used just the jacket and found that in a good long downpour the water did
actually soak straight through the fabric.

IMO, they weren't worth the $80per (IIRC) that it cost. If you're going
to
buy something that lightweight, might as well go to Walmart, Costco, etc.
and save yourself $70.

Mike - now a Goretex mil-surplus fan.

XR400 - back from Hatfield-McCoy where it rained the whole freakin time
other bikes


> -----Original Message-----
> From:     adamme1@XXXXXX [SMTP:adamme1@XXXXXX]
> Sent:     Thursday, April 22, 2004 4:52 PM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: RE: Dressing for the crash
>
> I have a set of Frog Toggs. Silver. Never wore them but they are very
> light, almost paper-like. I've since purchased another set of Kirkland
> raingear. Don't know what your size is but if you're interested in
them,
> ping me off-list.
>
> -aki
>
>
> >
> > From: bernescut@XXXXXX
> > Date: 2004/04/22 Thu PM 04:34:32 EDT
> > To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
> >
> > I searched for quite awhile for pants before settling on two options.
> For
> > many seasons I rode year round in MotoPort Voyager pants which kept
me
> warm
> > all year round :) The fabric eventually lost it's capacity to be
> waterproof
> > and the velcro closures no longer held their grip so I went to
replace
> them
> > but MotoPort gear is no longer in the budget (why does that darn kid
has
> to
> > eat EVERY day?) so I got the First Gear Hypertex pants. They are
> > comfortable and slip on over my work clothes. I haven't tested their
> > capacity to be waterproof but that might change on the way home
tonight.
> > For hot weather I have the Fieldsheer mesh pants which have very good
> armor
> > and padding, but are tight and tend to wrinkle my work clothes, so
it's
> a
> > trade off. I prefer showing up at the office with wrinkles instead
of
> all
> > sweaty. Since the mesh pants tend to less than waterproof I'm
looking
> for
> > some rainpants that are small enough to cram under the seat of the
bike.
>   >   Anyone here tried Frog Toggs?
>   >   Cedric Bernescut
>   >   2000 CBR600F4
>   >   Annandale, VA
>   >
>   >   >SELECT * FROM Users WHERE clue > 0
>   >
>   >   0 rows returned
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >   the logic that follows is:
>   >   since you -know- that you will crash, you'd be a fool not to prepare.
>   >
>   >
>   >   --skip, shopping for pants also.
>   >
>   >

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 22:15:29 2004
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 19:15:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott Moyer <smoyer72@XXXXXX>
Subject: Ducati stuff at Coleman PowerSports
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Just an FYI here...

I am by no means a fan of Coleman PowerSports. I am fairly convinced
most of the
products the resell are overpriced, but out of laziness I usually swing
by to pick up oil
and filters when the time comes for a change for the bike.

I went in the side door this evening to pick a filter up and, while
waiting at the
service counter, I noticed some Ducati brochures. The service tech saw
this and
mentioned that Coleman is hosting what they're calling Italian Night
tomorrow evening at
their shop. They'll be serving some eats and coffee, but more to the
point they have _a
lot_ of Ducatis in the showroom now. I am supposing they've become a
reseller for the
brand. Most of the Hondas and Yamahas usually found in the showroom have
been moved to
the back or put into the garage and they have to have something like 30
to 40 new model
Ducatis in the showroom now.

In addition to this, some local collector is helping them with their
Ducati night theme
and has set up about a dozen vintage Ducatis a roped off section of the
showroom giving
the place something of a motorcycle show feel.   I saw a lot of 1960s and
1970s 750 and
900 models while there this evening.

While they usually close by 7 I was told they plan on staying open until
around 9
tomorrow night to for their Italian Night evening affair.

S. Moyer




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 22 22:57:14 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 22:56:59 -0400
Subject: Re: Ducati stuff at Coleman PowerSports

Which Coleman store? There's one in Falls Church and one in the
Woodbridge/Springfield area I believe.

-Sean

Scott Moyer wrote:
> Just an FYI here...
>
> I am by no means a fan of Coleman PowerSports. I am fairly convinced
most of the
> products the resell are overpriced, but out of laziness I usually swing
by to pick up oil
> and filters when the time comes for a change for the bike.
>
> I went in the side door this evening to pick a filter up and, while
waiting at the
> service counter, I noticed some Ducati brochures. The service tech saw
this and
> mentioned that Coleman is hosting what they're calling Italian Night
tomorrow evening at
> their shop. They'll be serving some eats and coffee, but more to the
point they have _a
> lot_ of Ducatis in the showroom now. I am supposing they've become a
reseller for the
> brand. Most of the Hondas and Yamahas usually found in the showroom
have been moved to
> the back or put into the garage and they have to have something like 30
to 40 new model
> Ducatis in the showroom now.
>
> In addition to this, some local collector is helping them with their
Ducati night theme
> and has set up about a dozen vintage Ducatis a roped off section of the
showroom giving
> the place something of a motorcycle show feel. I saw a lot of 1960s
and 1970s 750 and
> 900 models while there this evening.
>
> While they usually close by 7 I was told they plan on staying open
until around 9
> tomorrow night to for their Italian Night evening affair.
>
> S. Moyer
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
> http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 04:35:04 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 01:34:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bryce <bster13@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Dressing for the crash
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

To replenish the waterproofing ability of your pants
as well as protect them from UV rays, try 303
Fabricguard. Available online and at West Marine
stores locally. They are used in the sailing industry
all the time.

Good luck,

Bryce

--- bernescut@XXXXXX wrote:
> I searched for quite awhile for pants before
> settling on two options. For
> many seasons I rode year round in MotoPort Voyager
> pants which kept me warm
> all year round :) The fabric eventually lost it's
> capacity to be waterproof
> and the velcro closures no longer held their grip so
> I went to replace them
> but MotoPort gear is no longer in the budget (why
> does that darn kid has to
> eat EVERY day?) so I got the First Gear Hypertex
> pants. They are
> comfortable and slip on over my work clothes. I
>   haven't tested their
>   capacity to be waterproof but that might change on
>   the way home tonight.
>   For hot weather I have the Fieldsheer mesh pants
>   which have very good armor
>   and padding, but are tight and tend to wrinkle my
>   work clothes, so it's a
>   trade off. I prefer showing up at the office with
>   wrinkles instead of all
>   sweaty. Since the mesh pants tend to less than
>   waterproof I'm looking for
>   some rainpants that are small enough to cram under
>   the seat of the bike.
>   Anyone here tried Frog Toggs?
>   Cedric Bernescut
>   2000 CBR600F4
>   Annandale, VA
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 07:06:44 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 07:06:33 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves

Re: Mesh gear (ballistic jackets, etc)

Has anyone here actually crashed at speed in one of these things? We've
got some customers that wear them but I don't know of anyone that's
crash tested one.

The reason I ask is that I like the idea ... but my experience with
crashing (while racing) is that you don't always land/slide on the
conveniently placed armor/padding. My old leathers are scraped and
rashed all over the place. I'm concerned that they're more of a placebo
for the little safety voice in the head than actually protective.

> Pet peeve time. I hear the "proper gear's just too expensive" line
from newbies all the time.

How about this one: "Hey ... anyone know where I can get a cheap helmet?"

Really. All the time. It makes me cringe.

- Roach
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 08:11:51 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 08:11:35 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

I've heard a couple people on my other list talk about crash testing
them. Other than a couple bruises, they said they did their job.
However, one said his was shredded afterwards and another other said he
wouldn't trust it for another getoff. I've got a set and I trust them
for at least one accident. YMMV

Scooter

In a message dated 4/23/2004 7:06:33 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
roach@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Re: Mesh gear (ballistic jackets, etc)
>
> Has anyone here actually crashed at speed in one of these things? We've
> got some customers that wear them but I don't know of anyone that's
> crash tested one.
>
> The reason I ask is that I like the idea ... but my experience with
> crashing (while racing) is that you don't always land/slide on the
> conveniently placed armor/padding. My old leathers are scraped and
> rashed all over the place. I'm concerned that they're more of a
placebo
> for the little safety voice in the head than actually protective.
>
> > Pet peeve time. I hear the "proper gear's just too expensive" line
from newbies all the time.
>
> How about this one: "Hey ... anyone know where I can get a
> cheap helmet?"
>
> Really. All the time. It makes me cringe.
>
> - Roach

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 08:37:50 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 05:37:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I haven't crashed the phoenix or the phoenix with the leathr arm/back
(Reactor?). For moderate street get-off's I think they are up to the
task, really. Will they necessarily prevent any/all skin injury? No,
probably not. but the outcome will be a damn sight better than wearing
shorts or jeans and a t-shirt or worse, office attire.
How much "injury insurance" do we want? And what are we willing to pay
in comfort and money? I AM rather disappointed in that there is no
published spec to which anybody has to rate the eqiupment. We should
have a DOT?SNELL for clothing.

they are all one-use garments IMO. Even leathers have been known to be
one-shot items depending on the crash and surface, etc. My really bad
crash showed the standard ballistic material was fine and handled the
abrassion quite well. Just choices in construction was not up to snuff.
If I had been wearing no gear (excepting helmet) I would have probably
shattered both arms and required extensive skin grafts and probably
other stuff. I was sewn up and released in 12 hrs. Leather pants with
their tight-fitting nature would have saved my knees from injury I
should expect. And yes had I been wearing my JR Bulldog my arm would
have probaby only been chafed and flesh not gouged out since the armor
would have stayed in place and the leather is simply a LOT thicker and
spongier than the ballistic textile. The crash in question had almost
no traditional sliding component but was a wild tumble horizontally
with a small vertical aspect thrown in for good measure.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 09:15:53 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 09:15:47 -0400
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves

At 07:06 AM 4/23/2004, Brian Roach wrote:
>How about this one: "Hey ... anyone know where I can get a cheap
helmet?"
>
>Really. All the time. It makes me cringe.

Perhaps they mean to say "inexpensive".

Personally, I don't mind spending more on a lid to make me
comfortable. The standard Shoei 800/900/1000 is still around $300 with
basic paint - and it has plenty of comforts. My spare HJC was $120 and
feels about 1/2 as comfortable as the Shoei. It also smells like a new
Hyundai inside.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 09:45:01 2004
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 09:45:31 -0400
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

  I only slid about 5 feet on my First Gear Mesh Tex jacket, but it was
basically unmarked, while my JR Ballistic riding pants developed a
couple of tiny holes. Abrasion-wise, it seems to work better than I'd
expect a JR Phoenix to work. The armor is chincy, but it worked well
for me, keeping me from being bruised on my forearm where it hit the
pavement. A nice thing about that jacket, though, is that the armor is
removable, and could be replaced with better stuff.


On Apr 23, 2004, at 7:06 AM, Brian Roach wrote:

> Re: Mesh gear (ballistic jackets, etc)
>
> Has anyone here actually crashed at speed in one of these things?
> We've got some customers that wear them but I don't know of anyone
> that's crash tested one.
>
> The reason I ask is that I like the idea ... but my experience with
> crashing (while racing) is that you don't always land/slide on the
> conveniently placed armor/padding. My old leathers are scraped and
> rashed all over the place. I'm concerned that they're more of a
> placebo for the little safety voice in the head than actually
> protective.
>
>> Pet peeve time. I hear the "proper gear's just too expensive" line
>> from newbies all the time.
>
> How about this one: "Hey ... anyone know where I can get a cheap
> helmet?"
>
> Really. All the time. It makes me cringe.
>
> - Roach
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 09:48:53 2004
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Sunil Doshi <sdoshi@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Ducati stuff at Coleman PowerSports
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 09:48:50 -0400
To: Scott Moyer <smoyer72@XXXXXX>

At the Falls Church store, they had the the vintage Ducatis there last
weekend as well. They always have sold Ducatis, but inexplicably never
had them on the floor...

On Apr 22, 2004, at 10:15 PM, Scott Moyer wrote:

> Just an FYI here...
>
> I am by no means a fan of Coleman PowerSports.   I am fairly convinced
> most of the
>   products the resell are overpriced, but out of laziness I usually
>   swing by to pick up oil
>   and filters when the time comes for a change for the bike.
>
>   I went in the side door this evening to pick a filter up and, while
>   waiting at the
>   service counter, I noticed some Ducati brochures. The service tech
>   saw this and
>   mentioned that Coleman is hosting what they're calling Italian Night
>   tomorrow evening at
>   their shop. They'll be serving some eats and coffee, but more to the
>   point they have _a
>   lot_ of Ducatis in the showroom now. I am supposing they've become a
>   reseller for the
>   brand. Most of the Hondas and Yamahas usually found in the showroom
>   have been moved to
>   the back or put into the garage and they have to have something like
>   30 to 40 new model
>   Ducatis in the showroom now.
>
>   In addition to this, some local collector is helping them with their
>   Ducati night theme
>   and has set up about a dozen vintage Ducatis a roped off section of
>   the showroom giving
>   the place something of a motorcycle show feel. I saw a lot of 1960s
>   and 1970s 750 and
>   900 models while there this evening.
>
>   While they usually close by 7 I was told they plan on staying open
>   until around 9
>   tomorrow night to for their Italian Night evening affair.
>
>   S. Moyer
>
>
>
>
>   __________________________________
>   Do you Yahoo!?
>   Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
>   http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash
>
>

sunil

:: proteus / changing your shape for the future
      sunil doshi, senior interface designer
       tel [202.452.6800 x101] [202.452.6866] fax
        http://proteus.com



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 12:12:34 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:12:35 -0400
To: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves

At 05:37 AM 4/23/04 -0700, matthew patton wrote:

>published spec to which anybody has to rate the eqiupment. We should
>have a DOT?SNELL for clothing.

There appears to be something like that.   The MSF bibliography page shows
these:

Woods, R.I. (1994a). Specification of Motorcyclists Protective Clothing
Designed to Reduce Road Surface Impact Injuries, Performance of
Protective
Clothing. Fifth Volume, ASTM STP 1237, American Society for Testing and
Materials.

Woods, R.I. (1994b). Testing of Protective Clothing for Motorcyclists:
Validation of Laboratory Tests by Results from a Simulated Accident, and
by
Results from Crash-Damaged Clothing Performance of Protective Clothing.
Fifth Volume, ASTM STP 1237, American Society for Testing and Materials.

They are at:
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/pedbimot/motorcycle/00-NHT-212-
motorc
ycle/references77-79.html

Amazine what you can find in 30 seconds with a Google search...that one
was
with this search string: "protective clothing motorcycle crash test".

There's also a standard in Europe.   Some info on that here:

http://www.pva-
ppe.org.uk/PART%203%20THE%20EUROPEAN%20MOTORCYCLE%20CLOTHING%
20STANDARDS%20EXPLAINED.htm


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 13:21:34 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 10:21:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>, DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves



-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>


Re: Mesh gear (ballistic jackets, etc)

Has anyone here actually crashed at speed in one of these things? We've
got some customers that wear them but I don't know of anyone that's
crash tested one.

----------

Dunno about "at speed" but out of 79 reviews of the JR Phoenix jacket on
this site, 7 involve get-offs. Including one guy whose bike slammed into
a low-boy trailer. The people who seem generally happy with the level of
protection. Not a scientific survey, by any means.

http://www.motorcyclegearreview.com/reviews.php?prodID=404

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 13:49:19 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 13:49:04 EDT
Subject: Re: Technique question
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/22/2004 3:01:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
julian@XXXXXX writes:

> I should have tried to brake and straighten up ( movement
> taught at MSF BRC course )

Straighten THEN brake!!!!!

Brake as you straighten is for slow, easy, predicted stop.
Straighten then brake is the "holy shit!" technique.


New "bumper sticker" on the ST1100.

"Eat right, stay fit,
 DIE ANYWAY!"

John Walters (Long John)
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Up near DC
Honda ST1100X Pan European
BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles
Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 14:47:05 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 14:46:57 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: severe weather alert

The Nws Storm Prediction Center Has Issued A Severe Thunderstorm Watch
For
Portions Of
District Of Columbia Delaware Maryland New Jersey Virginia West Virginia
Coastal Waters

Effective This Friday Afternoon And Evening From 240 PM Until 700 PM EDT.

Hail To 2 Inches In Diameter... Thunderstorm Wind Gusts To 70 Mph... And
Dangerous Lightning Are Possible In These Areas.

The Severe Thunderstorm Watch Area Is Along And 90 Statute Miles East And
West Of A Line From 35 Miles North Of Baltimore Maryland To 35 Miles
South
Southwest Of Richmond Virginia.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 15:16:06 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 15:15:33 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: severe weather alert

Troutman wrote:

> The Nws Storm Prediction Center Has Issued A Severe Thunderstorm Watch
> For Portions Of
> District Of Columbia Delaware Maryland New Jersey Virginia West
> Virginia Coastal Waters
>
> Effective This Friday Afternoon And Evening From 240 PM Until 700 PM
EDT.
>
> Hail To 2 Inches In Diameter... Thunderstorm Wind Gusts To 70 Mph...
> And Dangerous Lightning Are Possible In These Areas.
>
> The Severe Thunderstorm Watch Area Is Along And 90 Statute Miles East
> And West Of A Line From 35 Miles North Of Baltimore Maryland To 35
> Miles South Southwest Of Richmond Virginia.
>
That blows since we'll be driving through the DC area around 6 in a 31'
RV...The beast doesn't like wind all that much. Should be fun!

LAR

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 15:29:24 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:29:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Dressing for the crash / peeves
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX


--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> There appears to be something like that. The MSF bibliography page
> shows these:
>
> Woods, R.I. (1994a). Specification of Motorcyclists Protective
> Clothing
> Designed to Reduce Road Surface Impact Injuries, Performance of
> Protective
> Clothing. Fifth Volume, ASTM STP 1237, American Society for Testing
> and
> Materials.

available from
http://www.astm.org/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/BOOKSTORE/PUBS/272.htm
apparently.

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 15:30:15 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 15:31:58 -0400
To: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>, Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: severe weather alert
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

At 03:15 PM 4/23/04 -0400, Laura Roach wrote:

>That blows since we'll be driving through the DC area around 6 in a 31'
>RV...The beast doesn't like wind all that much.   Should be fun!

You might want to consider finding a restaurant with a nice big covered
parking area...or at least a narrow alley...to stop in for a few hours if
it starts looking ugly out.

At the moment it's not bad near Rockville. Sunny and warm, white puffy
clouds (not Cumulo Nimbus, just Cumulus). Probably still to the
southwest.


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 15:34:25 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 15:32:09 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
CC: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>, DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: severe weather alert

Mike Bartman wrote:
>
> At 03:15 PM 4/23/04 -0400, Laura Roach wrote:
>
> >That blows since we'll be driving through the DC area around 6 in a
31'
> >RV...The beast doesn't like wind all that much. Should be fun!
>
> You might want to consider finding a restaurant with a nice big covered
> parking area...or at least a narrow alley...to stop in for a few hours
if
> it starts looking ugly out.
>
> At the moment it's not bad near Rockville. Sunny and warm, white puffy
> clouds (not Cumulo Nimbus, just Cumulus). Probably still to the
southwest.

Still sunny and calm in Herndon, next to Dulles.

--skip

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 16:15:54 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 16:15:41 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: severe weather alert
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162
Still nice here in beautiful downtown DC.   :-)   TGIF

Scooter

In a message dated 4/23/2004 3:32:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
skip@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Mike Bartman wrote:
> >
> > At 03:15 PM 4/23/04 -0400, Laura Roach wrote:
> >
> > >That blows since we'll be driving through the DC area around 6 in a
31'
> > >RV...The beast doesn't like wind all that much. Should be fun!
> >
> > You might want to consider finding a restaurant with a nice big
covered
> > parking area...or at least a narrow alley...to stop in for a few
hours if
> > it starts looking ugly out.
> >
> > At the moment it's not bad near Rockville. Sunny and warm, white
puffy
> > clouds (not Cumulo Nimbus, just Cumulus). Probably still
> to the southwest.
>
> Still sunny and calm in Herndon, next to Dulles.
>
> --skip

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 16:35:46 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 16:32:53 -0400
From: Kelly Norton <kajotaene@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: severe weather alert

Big ugly ominous clouds hanging over Dulles..

ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:

>Still nice here in beautiful downtown DC. :-) TGIF
>
>
>
>Scooter
>
>
>
>In a message dated 4/23/2004 3:32:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
skip@XXXXXX writes:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>Mike Bartman wrote:
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>At 03:15 PM 4/23/04 -0400, Laura Roach wrote:
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>>That blows since we'll be driving through the DC area around 6 in a
31'
>>>>
>>>>
>
>
>
>>>>RV...The beast doesn't like wind all that much. Should be fun!
>>>>
>>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>You might want to consider finding a restaurant with a nice big
covered
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>>parking area...or at least a narrow alley...to stop in for a few hours
if
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>>it starts looking ugly out.
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>At the moment it's not bad near Rockville. Sunny and warm, white
puffy
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>>clouds (not Cumulo Nimbus, just Cumulus). Probably still
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>to the southwest.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>Still sunny and calm in Herndon, next to Dulles.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>--skip
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 17:08:56 2004
Subject: RE: severe weather alert
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 17:08:52 -0400
From: "Sean Brady" <sbrady@XXXXXX>
To: "Kelly Norton" <kajotaene@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Dang, heading right into Herndon.   Heck the bike needed a wash anyway...


Sean

-----Original Message-----
From: Kelly Norton [mailto:kajotaene@XXXXXX]
Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 4:33 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: severe weather alert

Big ugly ominous clouds hanging over Dulles..

ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:

>Still nice here in beautiful downtown DC. :-) TGIF
>
>
>
>Scooter
>
>
>
>In a message dated 4/23/2004 3:32:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
skip@XXXXXX writes:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>Mike Bartman wrote:
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>At 03:15 PM 4/23/04 -0400, Laura Roach wrote:
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>>That blows since we'll be driving through the DC area around 6 in a
31'
>>>>
>>>>
>
>
>
>>>>RV...The beast doesn't like wind all that much. Should be fun!
>>>>
>>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>You might want to consider finding a restaurant with a nice big
covered
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>>parking area...or at least a narrow alley...to stop in for a few
hours if
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>>it starts looking ugly out.
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>At the moment it's not bad near Rockville. Sunny and warm, white
puffy
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>>clouds (not Cumulo Nimbus, just Cumulus). Probably still
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>>to the southwest.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>Still sunny and calm in Herndon, next to Dulles.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>--skip
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 17:46:51 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 17:43:24 -0400
To: Kelly Norton <kajotaene@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: severe weather alert

They're here....

Getting rain, green air, dark a couple of hours early, etc.. Still no
wind, hail or lightning, but it looks ugly to the southwest...

-- Mike B.

At 04:32 PM 4/23/04 -0400, Kelly Norton wrote:
>Big ugly ominous clouds hanging over Dulles..
>
>ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>
>>Still nice here in beautiful downtown DC. :-)      TGIF
>>In a message dated 4/23/2004 3:32:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
skip@XXXXXX writes:
>>
>>>Mike Bartman wrote:

>>>>At the moment it's not bad near Rockville. Sunny and warm, white
puffy
>>>>clouds (not Cumulo Nimbus, just Cumulus). Probably still
>>>to the southwest.

>>>Still sunny and calm in Herndon, next to Dulles.
>>>
>>
>>>--skip

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 23 23:13:03 2004
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 23:12:46 -0400
From: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: gear, kneedraggers, wv

i just ordered a pair of the Icon TiMax pants from kneedraggers.com.
they're waiting for me at the office, i'll report back once i've tried
them out.

also wanted to put in a plug for kneedraggers. i've done thousands of
dollars of online purchasing over the years. this was the first
instance where an hour after plugging in the CC#, i got an actual CALL
from someone at KD letting me know that they didn't have the pants in
stock, but they would in a few days. true to their word, the pants
were ordered from partsunlimited within that same hour and they were
delivered to me a week later. excellent customer service and the
cheapest price on the net.

ups ground from delaware is SUPER fast as well (1 day). okay, enough
plugging.

logged chuck's "into WV" ride for the second weekend in a row last
week. 6+ hours of smiles.

coupla pix: http://www.egoinc.org/mtarchives/gsDesktop01-640.jpg
            http://www.egoinc.org/mtarchives/gsDesktop02-640.jpg

___________________________________________

corey

[journal] www.egoinc.org
[portfolio] www.blanksky.com

It's not what you do for a living, it's what you live for doing.
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 24 21:12:43 2004
From: "Paul Wilson" <dchondarider@XXXXXX>
To: "DC-CYCLES" <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>
Subject: Massanutten Mtn. /Fort Valley ramble
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 21:12:47 -0400

I was able to take the KLR out for its first real ride today.   Ran the
gamut
from the slab of I-66 to a backwoods trail.

Some photos here:

http://community.webshots.com/user/dchondarider/1   (Massanutten folder)

First out 66, Kendas humming away on the slab. I notice something new.
The
Metrorail yard at West Falls Church. On the VFR I'm too low to see much
over the Jersey wall. Not on this bike. :)

VA 647, then 211, the usual suspects. Stop at the Forest Service
visitors
center on 211 at New Market Gap to get some maps of the national forest.
I
pick some routes and start noodling around. Off Edinburg Gap Rd., at
what's
called the Tasker's Gap OHV Complex, are some dirt bike/ATV trails I'd
like
to try out, and I take a couple of gravel Forest Service roads to get
there.
The only vehicle I pass getting there is a motorcycle. Looks like I came
to
the right place.

Forest Service OHV trail link:

http://www.southernregion.fs.fed.us/gwj/lee/forest/maps/ohv_brochure.shtm
l

Map of Tasker's Gap

http://www.southernregion.fs.fed.us/gwj/lee/forest/maps/images/ohv/tasker
s_g
ap_map.jpg

The trail I picked was blazed orange, meaning "easy." Don't think I'll
be
taking the heavy KLR on "moderate" level trails any time soon, with my
skill
level.

Lots of mud and soft areas, boulders and deep ruts. I definitely need
more
practice. After a couple of miles, I've had enough, so I turn around and
get back to the main road. Turn left and go down the mountain into
Edinburg, in search of lunch.

After lunch, north a bit, to Woodstock and pick up the road to the
Woodstock
fire tower. The road goes up the mountain on a series of very steep
switchbacks. The gravel in the turns looks very loose, but I see the
ooze
of tar. Turns out to be chip seal and there's plenty of traction. The
switchbacks are steep unless you swing way wide. Found myself in second
gear once, when I should have been in first. Lugged and stalled the
engine.
Oops. Descend the other side and then cruise the main road through the
Fort
Valley, ending on 55 west of Front Royal. Overall a beautiful day to be
out
and this is a beautiful area for dual sporting and all within an easy two
hours of DC. I hope to go back soon and explore some more roads.

Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Apr 24 21:53:50 2004
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 18:53:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Kozyn <mr_vfr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 04/24/04
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

> From: corey <corey@XXXXXX>

> logged chuck's "into WV" ride for the second weekend in a row last
> week. 6+ hours of smiles.

Very cool, that's a real nice loop. I like too repeat loops myself too,
helps me learn them better, I guess.

Today however, me and some (of the more unpleasant ;) fellows on this
list logged some miles into WV today also. We went via 211 to 81 to 42
to 250 all the way up to Elkins, then 33 back to 613 to 259, back to
211, then 641, 647 and I-66. Just about 500 miles from A'ton.

250 is very special on a sporty-type bike, as were all the sets of
twisties we hit on 33. 211 speaks for itself, I guess, but upon our
return, we also had the misfortune of seeing a guy down on the roadway
as we were descending east.

It didn't look like a healthy situation at all. If anyone has news of
this (~1800 hrs Saturday) please inform us. I hope he made it.

John Kozyn (D-mode)
1999 900SS
1995 VFR750F
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 25 21:34:25 2004
Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 21:32:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: stripped sparkplug hole... need help

I'm helping a friend with his F3, seems the sparkplug hole on #1 is
stripped and it had a helicoil in it. What are our options? Is this
something your typical machine shop can fix (we already pulled the head
out)? Any recommendations?

Thanks,

Dan

--

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 25 21:43:11 2004
From: "Gary Foreman" <lists@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Last weekend's Race Photos
Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 21:45:48 -0400

Sorry it took so long to post.   Been a busy week :-)



http://www.2wheeljunkie.com/photos/race_index.htm


Gary Foreman


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 25 22:22:43 2004
Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 22:22:12 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Gary Foreman <lists@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos/chopper flight update

Gary Foreman wrote:

>Sorry it took so long to post. Been a busy week :-)
>
>
>
>http://www.2wheeljunkie.com/photos/race_index.htm
>
>
>Gary Foreman
>
>

Great pics, Gary. The guy who got choppered (I saw you asked on the
WERA board) is doing pretty well and is probably almost out of the
hospital. had a broken arm (which bent the plate already in his arm to
a 90 degree angle) so it had to be replated. He also had a collapsed
lung (which is why they choppered him)...so all in all, definitely
better than we all expected.

Laura

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 25 23:19:02 2004
From: "Shigeru Honda" <shonda3@XXXXXX>
To: "Gary Foreman" <lists@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 12:18:57 +0900

wow, so that was how the helicopter incident looked like...
I was at Jefferson Memorial Hospital during that event after crashing at
Clubman race.
The guy on TZR (#97) passed me (#881) on turn 8 then went down right in
front of me, I hit his bike & went way up in the air...
Luckily I walked away with just fractured elbow & shoulder... & the guy
on
TZR wasn't hurt.
http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49137


----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Foreman" <lists@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 10:45 AM
Subject: Last weekend's Race Photos


> Sorry it took so long to post. Been a busy week :-)
>
>
>
> http://www.2wheeljunkie.com/photos/race_index.htm
>
>
> Gary Foreman
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Apr 25 23:46:33 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 23:46:21 EDT
Subject: Re: stripped sparkplug hole... need help
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/25/2004 9:34:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dan@XXXXXX
writes:

> Is this
> something your typical machine shop can fix (we already pulled the
head
> out)? Any recommendations?

It is possible that a tine-sert type of insert would be large enough to
replace the plug threads even with the enlarging due to the heli coil.

I _may_ have some in the size you need, let me know if you cannot find
one.


New "bumper sticker" on the ST1100.

"Eat right, stay fit,
 DIE ANYWAY!"

John Walters (Long John)
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Up near DC

Honda ST1100X Pan European
BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles
Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 07:45:25 2004
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 07:45:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: jdonovan@XXXXXX
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004, Gary Foreman wrote:

> Sorry it took so long to post.   Been a busy week :-)
>
>

I've been thinking about going out to watch some of the races and drag my
camera gear along. What are the rules, if any for shooting pictures
during
the practice and/or races?

-john

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 09:31:50 2004
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 09:31:29 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: jdonovan@XXXXXX
CC: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos

jdonovan@XXXXXX wrote:

> I've been thinking about going out to watch some of the races and drag
my
> camera gear along. What are the rules, if any for shooting pictures
during
> the practice and/or races?
>
> -john

No rules on shooting pics, just don't wear a bright yellow or red shirt
since you're going to be in close proximity to the track.

- Roach

--
http://www.speedwerks.com
The one-stop shop for all your motorcycling needs!
(302) 672 - 7223

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 10:21:08 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 10:09:10 -0400

Sorry to hear of the wrecks.

Get better soon!

Rob
'98 VFR800


From: "Shigeru Honda" <shonda3@XXXXXX>
To: "Gary Foreman" <lists@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 12:18:57 +0900

wow, so that was how the helicopter incident looked like...
I was at Jefferson Memorial Hospital during that event after crashing at
Clubman race.
The guy on TZR (#97) passed me (#881) on turn 8 then went down right in
front of me, I hit his bike & went way up in the air...
Luckily I walked away with just fractured elbow & shoulder... & the guy
on
TZR wasn't hurt.
http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49137


----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Foreman" <lists@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 10:45 AM
Subject: Last weekend's Race Photos


 > Sorry it took so long to post. Been a busy week :-)
 >
 >
 >
 > http://www.2wheeljunkie.com/photos/race_index.htm
 >
 >
 > Gary Foreman
 >
 >

_________________________________________________________________
From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring
Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 12:03:12 2004
From: Jason Picton <j_picton@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: OT - Hawk GT for Sale
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 12:02:44 -0400


1989 Honda NT650 Hawk GT - 11000 Miles - Red - Very Good Condition. Adult
Owned, Extras (installed) - SuperTrapp Superlight Exhaust System (has
been
professionaly dyno tuned), Targa Fairing. L&P Rear Stand (original center
stand removed - but in box, as well as the original exhaust) comes with
2nd
set of of stock OEM rims, and cbr 900RR shock conversion (not currently
on
bike). This was my backup sport bike - Not abused and hate to sell - but
but
impending wedding costs and buying a new house (not to mention track
addiction - not with this bike) lead me to sell it.... $2750

Thanks
Jason

Pics available upon request...

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 12:08:27 2004
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 12:08:36 -0400
From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
To: Shigeru Honda <shonda3@XXXXXX>
CC: Gary Foreman <lists@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos

Shigeru Honda wrote:
>wow, so that was how the helicopter incident looked like...
>I was at Jefferson Memorial Hospital during that event after crashing at
>Clubman race.
>The guy on TZR (#97) passed me (#881) on turn 8 then went down right in
>front of me, I hit his bike & went way up in the air...
>Luckily I walked away with just fractured elbow & shoulder... & the guy
on
>TZR wasn't hurt.
>http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49137
>
>
>
Damn, I knew your name sounded familiar! Didn't connect you between WERA
and DC Cycles! I hope you're healing up well. Saw you hit Jeff's bike
and it wasn't pretty!!!!

Laura (LAR)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 12:54:21 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 12:30:35 -0400

Is Shigeru Honda your real name, isn't that the president of Honda's
name?

>From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
>To: Shigeru Honda <shonda3@XXXXXX>
>CC: Gary Foreman <lists@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos
>Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 12:08:36 -0400
>
>Shigeru Honda wrote:
>
>>wow, so that was how the helicopter incident looked like...
>>I was at Jefferson Memorial Hospital during that event after crashing
at
>>Clubman race.
>>The guy on TZR (#97) passed me (#881) on turn 8 then went down right in
>>front of me, I hit his bike & went way up in the air...
>>Luckily I walked away with just fractured elbow & shoulder... & the guy
on
>>TZR wasn't hurt.
>>http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49137
>>
>Damn, I knew your name sounded familiar! Didn't connect you between WERA
>and DC Cycles! I hope you're healing up well. Saw you hit Jeff's bike
and
>it wasn't pretty!!!!
>Laura (LAR)

_________________________________________________________________
MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page   )B–
FREE
download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 13:04:19 2004
From: "Shigeru Honda" <shonda3@XXXXXX>
To: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 13:02:22 -0400

that's my real name... the founder of Honda motor co. is Soichiro Honda.
unfortunately, I'm not related in any way... darn, I wish I did!

---------------------
Shigeru Honda
98 SuperHawk (Street)
99 750 SS (Track #881)
02 MZ Skorpion Tour (Commuter)

----- Original Message -----
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 12:30 PM
Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos


> Is Shigeru Honda your real name, isn't that the president of Honda's
name?
>
> >From: Laura Roach <laura@XXXXXX>
> >To: Shigeru Honda <shonda3@XXXXXX>
> >CC: Gary Foreman <lists@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> >Subject: Re: Last weekend's Race Photos
> >Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 12:08:36 -0400
> >
> >Shigeru Honda wrote:
> >
> >>wow, so that was how the helicopter incident looked like...
> >>I was at Jefferson Memorial Hospital during that event after crashing
at
> >>Clubman race.
> >>The guy on TZR (#97) passed me (#881) on turn 8 then went down right
in
> >>front of me, I hit his bike & went way up in the air...
> >>Luckily I walked away with just fractured elbow & shoulder... & the
guy
on
> >>TZR wasn't hurt.
> >>http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49137
> >>
> >Damn, I knew your name sounded familiar! Didn't connect you between
WERA
> >and DC Cycles! I hope you're healing up well. Saw you hit Jeff's
bike
and
> >it wasn't pretty!!!!
> >Laura (LAR)
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page
  )B·FREE
> download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 13:57:23 2004
From: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: stripped sparkplug hole... need help
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 13:37:40 -0400

Since you've got the head off, there are some options.

1. Re do the Heli Coil (maybe)

2. weld up the head, rebore and thread.

3. install an insert (similar idea as helicoil, but usually needs a
larger starter hole

The hard part is getting the head off

Michael J.


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 14:32:46 2004
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 14:31:43 -0400 (EDT)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: stripped sparkplug hole... need help

On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 mjordan812@XXXXXX wrote:

> 1. Re do the Heli Coil (maybe)

He tried, that's what did it in...

>
> 2. weld up the head, rebore and thread.
>

Sounds like the best and longest lasting fix.   Anyone do this locally?

> 3. install an insert (similar idea as helicoil, but usually needs a
larger starter hole
>

This would be option 2, any recommendations?
Thanks,

Dan

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 16:16:35 2004
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 16:18:20 -0400
To: <mjordan812@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: stripped sparkplug hole... need help

At 01:37 PM 4/26/04 -0400, mjordan812@XXXXXX wrote:
>Since you've got the head off, there are some options.
>
>1. Re do the Heli Coil (maybe)
>
>2. weld up the head, rebore and thread.
>
>3. install an insert (similar idea as helicoil, but usually needs a
larger
starter hole

4. Replace the head?

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Apr 26 18:38:07 2004
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 15:37:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Hooliganism...
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

It's not just us:

http://cgibin.rcn.com/fillmore.dnai/cgi-bin/sviewer.pl?selectdate=4/13/04

-- Larry




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25 )B¢
http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 08:46:40 2004
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 08:46:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: I hate days like this...


When its fr'cking beautiful out, and the roads are just itching to be
ridden.

The ride to work was most excellent. If only there wasn't that damn Work
stuff involved.



--
Dan Brown
brown@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 11:18:11 2004
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 11:20:19 -0400
To: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: I hate days like this...

At 08:46 AM 4/27/04 -0400, Daniel H. Brown wrote:
>
>When its fr'cking beautiful out, and the roads are just itching to be
>ridden.
>
>The ride to work was most excellent. If only there wasn't that damn Work
>stuff involved.

I agree. Got to do something about this food addiction and that living
indoors habit...

There's always lunch time!

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 15:27:57 2004
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 15:27:51 -0400
From: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: tars... local and online
X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with
any abuse report
X-AntiAbuse:   Primary Hostname - victory.vs4dns.net
X-AntiAbuse:   Original Domain - dc-cycles.org
X-AntiAbuse:   Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12]
X-AntiAbuse:   Sender Address Domain - egoinc.org

any particular online retailers or (gasp) local stores i should hit up
for a new set of BT45s? i've found them for $168 + $12 shipping from
chapparal. is it CAD cycles that will change tires for
$16 each?

i'm leaning towards chaparral, because i can also order a MX chest
protector for cicada-season ;>

___________________________________________

corey

[journal] www.egoinc.org
[portfolio] www.blanksky.com
[listserv] www.blanksky.com/bikefolk

What happens if you get scared half to death twice?

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 15:35:20 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 15:35:04 EDT
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/27/2004 3:28:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
corey@XXXXXX writes:

> i'm leaning towards chaparral, because i can also order a MX chest
> protector for cicada-season ;>

Hot Damn!
You just reminded me that I have one of those.    And tear offs for my
visor.....

Cool! I am all set.

John.
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 15:39:10 2004
From: "Perry Coleman" <perrycoleman@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: tars... local and online
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 15:37:59 -0400

CAD will definitely mount them and not take you to the cleaners. You
might
check to see how much they would charge for the tires, but they may have
trouble beating Chapparal. I mail-ordered my last tires because I could
get
them WAY cheaper but CAD mounted them with no problems.

Perry

>From: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
>Reply-To: corey <corey@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: tars... local and online
>Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 15:27:51 -0400
>
>any particular online retailers or (gasp) local stores i should hit up
>for a new set of BT45s? i've found them for $168 + $12 shipping from
>chapparal. is it CAD cycles that will change tires for
>$16 each?
>
>i'm leaning towards chaparral, because i can also order a MX chest
>protector for cicada-season ;>
>
>___________________________________________
>
>corey
>
>[journal] www.egoinc.org
>[portfolio] www.blanksky.com
>[listserv] www.blanksky.com/bikefolk
>
>What happens if you get scared half to death twice?
>

_________________________________________________________________
Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your
waist.
http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=
et_pv_030104_lovehandles

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 15:43:22 2004
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 15:43:15 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 03:27 PM 4/27/2004, you wrote:
>any particular online retailers or (gasp) local stores i should hit up
>for a new set of BT45s? i've found them for $168 + $12 shipping from
>chapparal. is it CAD cycles that will change tires for
>$16 each?

Occasionally I'll hear crap for not going local with my purchases, so I
went to Manassas Honda for my 6 new sprocket bolts. They ordered them
Thursday, and I'm still waiting. My online sources, or even HOM
(California brick and mortar loved for cheap RRs) would have had them in
my
hand by now. So I may be biased, but get them online. That is a good
price. $16 each is a great change price, it is probably 'off the bike'
though, and doesn't include old tire disposal.

>i'm leaning towards chaparral, because i can also order a MX chest
>protector for cicada-season ;>

I saw my first one Sunday moving firewood in Annandale. ABout the size
and
looks of a grub with tiny wings and beady red eyes. Tasty.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 15:58:43 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 15:46:59 -0400

Last time I had tires done at CAD Cycles, I brought them the wheels, with
the old rubber, and the new tires and it was $15 + $2 disposal for each
one
to mount and balance.

In fact, I will   be doing this pretty soon.

Rob
'98 VFR800 (now getting a bath courtesy of Mother Nature)

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfee )B®
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Apr 27 19:38:41 2004
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 16:38:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: matthew patton <pattonme@XXXXXX>
Subject: 2001 Kawi ZR-7s for sale
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I can't do this anymore. My wife is killing me with legal costs (I get
to pay for her to slit my throat whether or not *I* get to have let
alone afford legal representation is irrelevant before the courts).

Nice red color. 30,000 miles. Stainless front brakes. ZX6e forks with
full internals, ZX6e calipers, EBC full-floating rotors and new front
HH pads (1 or 2 finger braking a definate option). New front tire, 2
brand new rear tires (Pirelli Diablo + Maxxis SuperMax), new chain, new
rear sprocket. Needs new front sprocket. Pyramid hugger, Scott Oiler.
Genmar Risers. Racetech and Progressive springs (.85kg/mm and model
1145), Racetech Goldvalve Emulators with multiple spring choices, brand
spanking new Wilburs rear shock for 170lb rider (you won't BELIEVE how
vastly superior it is), Corbin seat. Fully jetted and WAY better than
stock. Jardine stainless street exhaust. Luggage rack and bags from
Ventura. Also have the Matisse shorter dogbones installed (IMO a
required upgrade).

$4200 in Chicago west suburbs. Will deliver to THE Allied's national
central hub to be shipped anywhere on the bike pallets (worked there so
know exactly how it's done). You pay for shipping (typically ~$400). Or
I'll haul it back to DC on a trailer on my next trip (probably
mid-may).

I also have the stock can, stock seat, stock forks with calipers, stock
shock with 600lb spring and a Hagon shock with a 550 spring. If you
don't like the price I'll undo the various upgrades to suit. MCN's
value is $3575 for a stock bike.

Price includes personalized email and telephone tech support. Pics are
available as much as you want, of whatever you want. My phone is 703-980-
6716.

=====
"If you believe what you like in the Gospels, and reject what you do
not like, it is not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."
  -- Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430)

* A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being
the right person.

* Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent.
  -- Jim Quinn (www.warroom.com)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 07:45:51 2004
From: "Joe Rail" <celicajoe@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Honda Dream
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 07:34:19 -0400

Does anyone know anything or any history about Honda Dream motorcycles? I
saw one for sale over the weekend, a 1963 Dream 305cc. The bike was
complete
and ran. Asking price was $800. Was very tempting to buy, but what year
and
model would be best? (Some of these bikes look like glorified mopeds) I
think they were made from '60-'69 with 2 models: a 105cc and a 305cc?
Could
this be correct?

_________________________________________________________________
From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring
Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 08:13:31 2004
From: Bob Meyer <rmeyer9@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: rmeyer9@XXXXXX
To: "Joe Rail" <celicajoe@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Honda Dream
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 8:13:24 -0400

You should be able to get answers to all your questions here:

http://www.honda305.com/forum/

(Google is a wonderful thing).


>
> From: "Joe Rail" <celicajoe@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/28 Wed AM 07:34:19 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Honda Dream
>
> Does anyone know anything or any history about Honda Dream motorcycles?
I
> saw one for sale over the weekend, a 1963 Dream 305cc. The bike was
complete
> and ran. Asking price was $800. Was very tempting to buy, but what year
and
> model would be best? (Some of these bikes look like glorified mopeds) I
> think they were made from '60-'69 with 2 models: a 105cc and a 305cc?
Could
> this be correct?
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the
Spring
> Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx
>
>

Bob   Meyer, STOC @ 1157
'01   ST1100 A, "teSTarossa"
'92   ST1100, "red STag"
'02   919, "still looking for a name"

A steady job and a wife have ruined more good bikers....

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 08:34:40 2004
From: "Thomas Jordan" <thomasajordan@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Honda Dream
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 08:34:34 -0400
And then there is the new Honda Dream, which MFI has on the showroom
floor.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 08:59:34 2004
From: Stephen Miller <freecat@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Honda Dream
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 09:00:23 -0400
To: DC-Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

$800 isn't bad for a running bike, especially one that is potentially a
good restoration project. I'm partial to the 305 SuperHawk myself, but
the Dream was much more popular (I think).


On Apr 28, 2004, at 7:34 AM, Joe Rail wrote:

>   Does anyone know anything or any history about Honda Dream
>   motorcycles? I saw one for sale over the weekend, a 1963 Dream 305cc.
>   The bike was complete and ran. Asking price was $800. Was very
>   tempting to buy, but what year and model would be best? (Some of these
>   bikes look like glorified mopeds) I think they were made from '60-'69
>   with 2 models: a 105cc and a 305cc? Could this be correct?
>
>   _________________________________________________________________
>   From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the
>   Spring Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 09:00:30 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 06:00:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Honda Dream
To: Joe Rail <celicajoe@XXXXXX>
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Joe Rail <celicajoe@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Does anyone know anything or any history about Honda Dream motorcycles?
I
> saw one for sale over the weekend, a 1963 Dream 305cc. The bike was
complete
> and ran. Asking price was $800. Was very tempting to buy, but what year
and
> model would be best? (Some of these bikes look like glorified mopeds) I
> think they were made from '60-'69 with 2 models: a 105cc and a 305cc?
Could
> this be correct?

250 and 305 in this country, so far as I remember. First bike I ever rode
was a
red 250 Dream, 1963. Nice, smooth road bike, easy to maintain.

-- Larry
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 09:05:42 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 06:05:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" <pltrgyst@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Honda Dream
To: rmeyer9@XXXXXX
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Bob Meyer <rmeyer9@XXXXXX> wrote:
> You should be able to get answers to all your questions here:
>
> http://www.honda305.com/forum/

That site is a Superhawk site, CB/CL 72/77, and barely mentions the
Dreams,
unfortunately.

We've got a local guy, ex-Patent Office employee, who collects old
Dreams,
Superhawks, etc. and exhibits them occasionally. I'll see if I can come
up with
his name later today.

-- Larry




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 09:14:08 2004
From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 09:13:53 EDT
Subject: Re: Honda Dream
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

In a message dated 4/28/2004 7:46:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
celicajoe@XXXXXX writes:

> Does anyone know anything or any history about Honda Dream motorcycles?

Do you mean other then owning and riding one back in my youth?
A CA77, 305 Dream was my second bike (First was a 150 Dream.) Single
carb,
low power (even for the day, the Super Hawk had much more.)

I will check my Honda model guide when I get home if you would like.


New "bumper sticker" on the ST1100.

"Eat right, stay fit,
 DIE ANYWAY!"

John Walters (Long John)
PenguinBiker@XXXXXX
Up near DC

Honda ST1100X Pan European
BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles
Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:11:20 2004
From: "Custer, Carl" <Carl.Custer@XXXXXX>
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Cc: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
Subject: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:17:22 -0400

corey chummed:
"Any particular online retailers or (gasp) local stores i should hit up
for
a new set of BT45s? i've found them for $168 + $12 shipping from
chapparal.
is it CAD cycles that will change tires for $16 each?

[Carl]: Sounds like a good price. FWIW, I've found Chaparral's Magazine
ad
prices better than their web prices. If you're really cheep, Dennis Kirk
will knock another buck each off the ad prices.

i'm leaning towards chaparral, because i can also order a MX chest
protector
for cicada-season ;>

[Carl]: IIRC, their tire shipping charge is independent of the rest of
your
order.

CAD's cheap mounting price is for off the bike wheels - but - you'll want
to
do that any way for the opportunity to clean and primp the nether regions
of
your bike. You can also save the tire disposal price by dropping them
off
yourself at the Montgomery County recycle station just south of Shady
Grove
on Rt 355.

Last time I shopped for tires was last year.    Here are some of the sites
I
checked with comments from other folks:

Subject: On_line tire sources _ a good report
I just received a new D205 rear for my VFR from
http://www.tireexpress.com.
They're affiliated with Competition Accessories http://www.compacc.com
(according to their Network Solutions whois info).

Ordered a 170/60zr17 at 3:00 PM on Tuesday. It arrived today. Total
price
$110.95 ($101.95 plus $9.00 shipping/handling). This is a pretty good
price, better than all 4 of these places Jack H posted:

http://www.discountmotorcycletire.com    $109 plus $14 shipping

http://www.chaparral_racing.com    $133.99 plus shipping ???
(Magazine ad always cheaper)

http://www.cycledepot.net    $106.74 plus actual shipping ???

http://www.parts411.com     $128.38 plus actual shipping ???

And everybody's favorite (not) MAW (Motorcycle Accessory Whorehouse)
http://www.accwhse.com $106.95 plus shipping (and they won't have it in
stock, but tell you it is. Expect 3 days to 3 weeks for delivery.

And from tire express's sister company
http://www.compacc.com $107.05 plus shipping.

> Just go to swmototires.
I have had nothing but good deals, service, and fast shipping from them.
I
ordered more then a dozen tires last season alone from them.
Another good place is Kim Leong at Casporttouring.com. Not much of a web
page but if you call him, his prices are a couple bucks cheaper then SW
and
he carries disco's on stuff like Givi.
  1_888_799_5445
Store Hours 9:00 AM _ 6:30 PM PST Tuesday_Saturday
929 Alhambra Ave.
Martinez, CA 94553

>Just go to swmototires.
Ron Ayers is killing them on price, in fact he's the best I've found.
<http://www.ronayers.com/tires/choosetire.cfm> __ Jack S

Just to chime in here....the $8.00 shipping per tire still doesn't
overwhelm
the large difference in price...with the shipping ron ayers is still
almost
$23 cheaper for a set of tires. I don't know about other people but $23
is
significant enough to make me choose Ron Ayers. YMMV

Carl in Bethesda (Headed for Ohio Thursday - SME8.9 & COTU)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:28:03 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400

<snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>

Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD?   They
do Harley rims?

I'm in Herndon, long drive there?

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:28:32 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:28:23 -0400

<snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>

Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD?   They
do Harley rims?

I'm in Herndon, long drive there?

-aki


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:34:54 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:36:05 -0400

Tire disposal fee HAHA. Just takes shred them up and spread them down I-
81
thats what the big rig drivers do when their tires get old. I-81 is like
a
old tire grave yard.

Rob
On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 15:43:15 -0400, Troutman wrote
> At 03:27 PM 4/27/2004, you wrote:
> >any particular online retailers or (gasp) local stores i should hit up
> >for a new set of BT45s? i've found them for $168 + $12 shipping from
> >chapparal. is it CAD cycles that will change tires for
> >$16 each?
>
> Occasionally I'll hear crap for not going local with my purchases,
> so I went to Manassas Honda for my 6 new sprocket bolts. They
> ordered them Thursday, and I'm still waiting. My online sources, or
> even HOM
> (California brick and mortar loved for cheap RRs) would have had
> them in my hand by now. So I may be biased, but get them online.
> That is a good price. $16 each is a great change price, it is
> probably 'off the bike' though, and doesn't include old tire disposal.
>
> >i'm leaning towards chaparral, because i can also order a MX chest
> >protector for cicada-season ;>
>
> I saw my first one Sunday moving firewood in Annandale. ABout the
> size and looks of a grub with tiny wings and beady red eyes. Tasty.
>
> ___________________________________________
>      Mike Troutman
>          http://www.troutman.org/vfr
>          1997 Honda VFR 750
>             AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
>             NMA http://www.motorists.org


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:37:37 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:34:46 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: almost there!

it is in my posession, working on title-tags-insurance today

what is it?

and 85 v65 Sabre in very, very good condition.


I --almost--   took it out for a spin last night sans tags, but I talked
myself
out of it.
[drool, drool]

-skip, giddy as a schoolgirl.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:39:06 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Cc: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:40:14 -0400

Gaithersburg MD.    It's a drive from Herdon.

Rob

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400, adamme1 wrote
> <snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>
>
> Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD?   They
> do Harley rims?
>
> I'm in Herndon, long drive there?
>
> -aki


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:41:41 2004
From: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:30:02 -0400

Gaithersburg, MD.   About 35 minutes from Herndon.

301-977-7188.

Not sure about Harley rims , but worth a call.

Rob
'98 VFR800


From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400

<snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>

Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD?   They
do Harley rims?

I'm in Herndon, long drive there?

-aki

_________________________________________________________________
From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the Spring
Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:49:01 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:50:12 -0400

Whats the difference between a 'Harley' rim and a 'non Harley' rim except
Price? :-D

Rob

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:30:02 -0400, Rob Keiser wrote
> Gaithersburg, MD. About 35 minutes from Herndon.
>
> 301-977-7188.
>
> Not sure about Harley rims , but worth a call.
>
> Rob
> '98 VFR800
>
> From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
> To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
> Subject: Re: tars... local and online
> Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400
>
> <snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>
>
> Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD? They
> do Harley rims?
>
> I'm in Herndon, long drive there?
>
> -aki
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> >From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the
Spring
> Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:50:25 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:50:16 -0400

Ok thanks. Found it     on mapquest. About 30 miles
and a 40 min drive.     Not that bad really. I'll give
them a call to check    if they do Harley rims and how
long I should expect    to wait for them.

thanks!
-aki

>
>   From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/28 Wed AM 11:40:14 EDT
>   To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>   CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
>   Subject: Re: tars... local and online
>
>   Gaithersburg MD.   It's a drive from Herdon.
>
>   Rob
>
>   On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400, adamme1 wrote
>   > <snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>
>   >
>   > Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD?   They
>   > do Harley rims?
>   >
>   > I'm in Herndon, long drive there?
>   >
>   > -aki
>
>
>   --
>   Rob Sharp
>   1996 Honda VFR 750
>   2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
>   SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
>   Network Security Engineer
>
>
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 11:57:07 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 08:56:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Rob Sharp <rob@XXXXXX>, Rob Keiser <robkeiser@XXXXXX>,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online


-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Sharp <rob@XXXXXX>


Whats the difference between a 'Harley' rim and a 'non Harley' rim except
Price? :-D

Rob

I assume they do tube rims, depending on which Harley Aki has.   BYOT.
Bring your own tubes, or a new rim strip, if you need one.

Since I hate driving even more than I hate changing tires, I just do 'em
myself. Taking off and reinstalling the wheels is about 30% of the work
anyway. As for tire disposal, I just save 'em up. The "evil,
incompetent, dysfunctional" DC gov't will come and get 'em, if you call
for a bulk household waste pickup. Or just walk 'em down the block to
the service station on the corner.




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 12:04:49 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 12:05:52 -0400

I dropped off the bike and picked it up like 6 hours later. I think they
would of done it quicker if I was just waiting. It's within walking
distance
of a couple bars/pool halls so you can kill time/eat.

Disclaimer: Don't drink and ride.

Rob

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:50:16 -0400, adamme1 wrote
> Ok thanks. Found it on mapquest. About 30 miles
>   and a 40 min drive. Not that bad really. I'll give
>   them a call to check if they do Harley rims and how
>   long I should expect to wait for them.
>
>   thanks!
>   -aki
>
>   >
>   >   From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
>   >   Date: 2004/04/28 Wed AM 11:40:14 EDT
>   >   To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>   >   CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
>   >   Subject: Re: tars... local and online
>   >
>   >   Gaithersburg MD.   It's a drive from Herdon.
>   >
>   >   Rob
>   >
>   >   On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400, adamme1 wrote
>   >   > <snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>
>   >   >
>   >   > Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD?   They
>   >   > do Harley rims?
>   >   >
>   >   > I'm in Herndon, long drive there?
>   >   >
>   >   > -aki
>   >
>   >
>   >   --
>   >   Rob Sharp
>   >   1996 Honda VFR 750
>   >   2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
>   >   SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
>   >   Network Security Engineer
>   >
>   >


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 12:19:45 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 12:19:37 -0400

that's just it. Many indy shops don't like doing Harley
rims because if they damage them, they cost an arm and
a leg to replace. Personally I think it's bs but many
won't do them. I know for example, my Thunderstar rims
were $600 and $800 each.

-aki

>
> From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/28 Wed AM 11:50:12 EDT
> To: "Rob Keiser" <robkeiser@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: tars... local and online
>
> Whats the difference between a 'Harley' rim and a 'non Harley' rim
except
> Price? :-D
>
> Rob
>
> On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:30:02 -0400, Rob Keiser wrote
> > Gaithersburg, MD. About 35 minutes from Herndon.
> >
> > 301-977-7188.
> >
> > Not sure about Harley rims , but worth a call.
> >
> > Rob
> > '98 VFR800
> >
> > From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
> > To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> > CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
> > Subject: Re: tars... local and online
> > Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400
> >
> > <snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>
> >
> > Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD? They
> > do Harley rims?
> >
> > I'm in Herndon, long drive there?
> >
> > -aki
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > >From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the
Spring
> > Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx
>
>
> --
> Rob Sharp
> 1996 Honda VFR 750
> 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
> SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
> Network Security Engineer
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 12:29:00 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 12:28:51 -0400


>
> From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/28 Wed PM 12:05:52 EDT
> To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online
>
> I dropped off the bike and picked it up like 6 hours later. I think
they
> would of done it quicker if I was just waiting. It's within walking
distance
> of a couple bars/pool halls so you can kill time/eat.

cool beans. I'd just drop off the tires/rims and get a time check when
to return and go do lunch or something.
How are their prices on tires btw? Maybe just ordering
directly from them, if the price isnt' that far off from
the internet would just be easier all the way around.


>
> Disclaimer: Don't drink and ride.

Nah...between the pain meds and the dark visor I can't see shit anyway.
;-)
>


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 13:37:32 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 13:34:32 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

the chrome, silly!

--skip, heading for DMV at 4, incase anyone gives a rat's arse



Rob Sharp wrote:
>
> Whats the difference between a 'Harley' rim and a 'non Harley' rim
except
> Price? :-D
>
> Rob
>
> On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:30:02 -0400, Rob Keiser wrote
> > Gaithersburg, MD. About 35 minutes from Herndon.
> >
> > 301-977-7188.
> >
> > Not sure about Harley rims , but worth a call.
> >
> > Rob
> > '98 VFR800
> >
> > From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
> > To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> > CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
> > Subject: Re: tars... local and online
> > Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400
> >
> > <snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>
> >
> > Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD? They
> > do Harley rims?
> >
> > I'm in Herndon, long drive there?
> >
> > -aki
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > >From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the
Spring
> > Travel Guide! http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx
>
> --
> Rob Sharp
> 1996 Honda VFR 750
> 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
> SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
> Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 13:52:27 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 13:51:56 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Ummmm.......non-Harley rims actually get used and need the tires replaced
more than every 10 years? ;-) Sorry, couldn't resist.

Scooter (ducking and running)
In a message dated 4/28/2004 11:50:12 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
rob@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Whats the difference between a 'Harley' rim and a 'non Harley' rim
except
> Price? :-D
>
> Rob
>
> On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:30:02 -0400, Rob Keiser wrote
> > Gaithersburg, MD. About 35 minutes from Herndon.
> >
> > 301-977-7188.
> >
> > Not sure about Harley rims , but worth a call.
> >
> > Rob
> > '98 VFR800
> >
> > From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
> > To: "'DCCycles'" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> > CC: "'corey@XXXXXX'" <corey@XXXXXX>
> > Subject: Re: tars... local and online
> > Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 11:27:54 -0400
> >
> > <snip GREAT info on tires..thank you!>
> >
> > Ok, just one stupid question, where/what is CAD? They
> > do Harley rims?
> >
> > I'm in Herndon, long drive there?
> >
> > -aki
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > >From must-see cities to the best beaches, plan a getaway with the
Spring
> > Travel Guide!
> http://special.msn.com/local/springtravel.armx
>
>
> --
> Rob Sharp
> 1996 Honda VFR 750
> 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
> SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
> Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 14:02:19 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 14:01:47 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

I believe Robert meant this for the list.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/28/2004 1:59:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
Robert.Verde@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Declining to swat at flies, I nonetheless am curious about the fate of
folks who spend the big bucks on tasty custom roundels from Performance
Machine and similar firms. If I spend two large (or more) on a carbon-
fiber wheel, where would I take it to get tires mounted?   What kind of
shop works on these?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 1:52 PM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Re: tars... local and online
>
>
> Ummmm.......non-Harley rims actually get used and need the tires
replaced more than every 10 years? ;-) Sorry,
> couldn't resist.
>
> Scooter (ducking and running)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 14:22:38 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 14:24:37 -0400
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 01:51 PM 4/28/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>Ummmm.......non-Harley rims actually get used and need the tires
replaced
more than every 10 years? ;-) Sorry, couldn't resist.
>
>Scooter (ducking and running)

Yeah, you'd better run, if you don't want over half a ton of motorcycle
and
rider running over you for remarks like that! :-)

As for riding then, how many miles did *you* get logged since last
October?
 Despite the first few weeks being spent in the local neighborhood and
parking lots getting used to riding again, I've got a bit over 2600 miles
since then. That's not a huge total for some, but it *was* winter for
most
of it...

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 15:54:39 2004
Subject: Motorcycling 201
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 15:58:15 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a week
but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making me
feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to check
tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a service
will do.
Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.

For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head ala
Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer 600
and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit he
dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in preparation
for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched him
slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he said
he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2 grand
in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps to
him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
as opposed to spirited riding.

Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here are my
201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.

Technical\Street Riding
When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
downshifts while at a stop
3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and put
it all in one package
..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?

When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then go
back into neutral?

When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
intended destination etc.?

According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off. Interesting
thing to think about.

Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
sell that fits an R6 please let me know.

Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice major
cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
everyone is enjoying the sunshine.




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 16:29:21 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 16:29:06 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Nah....I can walk and still outrun ya.   LOL

I probably put about 1200 miles on it since last October. I don't ride
to work, 15 minute walk, so I don't think that's too bad for occasional
weekend/evening riding. :-)

I'm close to 24000 since getting it in February 2000.

Scooter

In a message dated 4/28/2004 2:24:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
omni@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> At 01:51 PM 4/28/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> >Ummmm.......non-Harley rims actually get used and need the tires
replaced
> more than every 10 years? ;-) Sorry, couldn't resist.
> >
> >Scooter (ducking and running)
>
> Yeah, you'd better run, if you don't want over half a ton of motorcycle
and
> rider running over you for remarks like that! :-)
>
> As for riding then, how many miles did *you* get logged since last
October?
> Despite the first few weeks being spent in the local neighborhood and
> parking lots getting used to riding again, I've got a bit over 2600
miles
> since then. That's not a huge total for some, but it *was* winter for
most
> of it...
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone
> else's mistakes
> is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 16:38:47 2004
From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 16:39:57 -0400

They charge a lot more for tires than you can get them on the net.
I decided to support my local business and buy them from CAD and have
then
mounted on the bike (brought the whole bike in and let them take off the
rims). I think it was 70 bux for mounting and balancing (on the bike)
and the
cost of the tires(YMMV).


Rob

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 12:28:51 -0400, adamme1 wrote
> >
> > From: "Rob Sharp" <rob@XXXXXX>
> > Date: 2004/04/28 Wed PM 12:05:52 EDT
> > To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online
> >
> > I dropped off the bike and picked it up like 6 hours later. I think
they
> > would of done it quicker if I was just waiting. It's within walking
distance
> > of a couple bars/pool halls so you can kill time/eat.
>
> cool beans. I'd just drop off the tires/rims and get a time check
> when to return and go do lunch or something. How are their prices on
>   tires btw? Maybe just ordering directly from them, if the price
>   isnt' that far off from the internet would just be easier all the
>   way around.
>
>   >
>   > Disclaimer: Don't drink and ride.
>
>   Nah...between the pain meds and the dark visor I can't see shit
>   anyway. ;-)
>   >


--
Rob Sharp
1996 Honda VFR 750
2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme
SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA
Network Security Engineer

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 16:51:46 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 16:51:45 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Motorcycling 201

At 03:58 PM 4/28/2004, you wrote:

I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched him
>slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he said
>he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
>into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.     Not
>hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
>day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway.

Don't ride with him any more.

>Technical\Street Riding
>When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
>1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
>2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
>downshifts while at a stop
>3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and put
>it all in one package
>..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?

What about engine brake, squeeze in the clutch and brake to a stop while
tapping down to 1st. Be careful with engine braking. If you drop too
soon, it is fairly easy for the rear to lock and slide. I've had it
happen
a couple of times.

>When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
>control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
>first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then go
>back into neutral?

Wet clutches are designed to offer you finite control in stop and go
traffic. My left hand is exhausted when I get home after an hour stuck
in
heavy traffic.

>When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
>perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
>intended destination etc.?

Look where you want to go and try not to outrun the corner. Personally,
if
I can't see the exit, I don't like running much faster than I can stop to
avoid the problem ahead (stopped car, deer, etc). I ignore my mirrors in
corners unless I have a tailgater.

>According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
>actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off. Interesting
>thing to think about.

Try ignoring your speedo and just read the tac, make a guess then check
the
speedo. Learn what your revs sound like in each gear and you can easily
learn your speed. Not within a few miles an hour necessarily, but we
can't
all be top racers ;-)

>Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
>sell that fits an R6 please let me know.

I have a K&N that I clean. It is due for it tonight.     Simple and messy
process. Paper filters get tossed and replaced.
___________________________________________


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 16:54:22 2004
From: Michael Lynch <MLynch@XXXXXX>
To: "'Julian Halton'" <julian@XXXXXX>,
   "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'"
       <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 16:57:59 -0400

      >He logged it as 31/34.   I checked Sunday and
I had 37/39 (front, rear).
36/42 on the VFR, FWIW
      >he
      dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in
preparation
for a right turn.
Riding with this guy will get you (pick any 3):
A) associated with the wrong people
B) in trouble with the law
C) hurt or worse

     >After-action, he said
     he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3)
slide
into the intersection.

I love his choices! Hit you? He slid past you without hitting you
anyway.
Dump it? What is this, the lessons of 70 years ago where you "lay it
down"
when you get in over your head? And unless he has incredible powers of
balance and BOTH wheels were skidding into the intersection, it sounds
like
Mr. Man there wasn't braking to the bike's fullest ability, not to
mention
that the bike would have stoppied (with zero skidding involved) had the
brakes been applied properly. Clearly, there's no need to get into the
right wrist problem that he has, that got him there in the first place.

     >all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
     as opposed to spirited riding.

Do not misunderstand spirited riding with squidly behavior.      I have been
on
plenty of smooth spirited rides. None in traffic, however.

      >Technical\Street Riding
      When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
      1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
      2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do
multiple
      downshifts while at a stop
      3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and
put
      it all in one package
Personally, I use #3 for both the compression braking and the use of the
brakes which turns on the brake light which lets the BDC behind be know
that
I'd rather not be a hood ornament.

      >When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea   to    use clutch
control to move the bike slowly along?

If for some reason I haven't lanesplit by then, I play the slow race with
myself and see how slow I can go (feathering the clutch and throttle,
rear
brake) without putting my foot down and gauging the traffic (red light)
so
that I don't have to stop because I've run out of space in front (car or
crosswalk). There's no reason to believe that the clutch can't handle
it,
especially on a modern wet clutch bike.

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From:     Julian Halton [SMTP:julian@XXXXXX]
> Sent:     Wednesday, April 28, 2004 3:58 PM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Motorcycling 201
>
>
> I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a week
> but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making me
> feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to check
> tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
> I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
> adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a service
> will do.
> Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
> appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.
>
> For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head ala
> Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
> matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer 600
> and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit he
> dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in preparation
> for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched him
> slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he said
> he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
> into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
> hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
> day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2
grand
> in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps to
> him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
> as opposed to spirited riding.
>
> Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
> noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here are
my
> 201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.
>
> Technical\Street Riding
> When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
> 1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
> 2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
> downshifts while at a stop
> 3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and put
> it all in one package
> ..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?
>
> When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
> control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
> first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then go
> back into neutral?
>
> When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
> perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
> intended destination etc.?
>
> According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
> actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off.
Interesting
> thing to think about.
>
> Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
> sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
>
> Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice major
> cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
> everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
>
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 16:55:13 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 16:54:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: dan <dan@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Motorcycling 201

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004, Julian Halton wrote:
> Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
> sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
>
http://www.handyindustries.com/ has an adequate set for a good price.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 16:55:29 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 16:55:26 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Re: tars... local and online

At 04:39 PM 4/28/2004, Rob Sharp wrote:
>They charge a lot more for tires than you can get them on the net.
>I decided to support my local business and buy them from CAD and have
then
>mounted on the bike (brought the whole bike in and let them take off the
>rims). I think it was 70 bux for mounting and balancing (on the bike)
and the
>cost of the tires(YMMV).
Many dealerships have two prices for mounting. One if you buy the tires
from them and another, twice as high if you buy them from a catalog.
That
irks me, which is why I started doing them at home.


___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 16:58:56 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 16:32:02 -0400

In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?

>From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
>To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: Motorcycling 201
>Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 15:58:15 -0400
>
>
>I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a week
>but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making me
>feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to check
>tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
>I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
>adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a service
>will do.
>Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
>appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.
>
>For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head ala
>Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
>matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer 600
>and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit he
>dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in preparation
>for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched him
>slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he said
>he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
>into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
>hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
>day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2 grand
>in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps to
>him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
>as opposed to spirited riding.
>
>Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
>noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here are my
>201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.
>
>Technical\Street Riding
>When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
>1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
>2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
>downshifts while at a stop
>3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and put
>it all in one package
>..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?
>
>When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
>control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
>first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then go
>back into neutral?
>
>When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
>perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
>intended destination etc.?
>
>According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
>actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off. Interesting
>thing to think about.
>
>Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
>sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
>
>Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice major
>cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
>everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
>
>
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfee )B®
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:01:11 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:01:13 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures

At 04:57 PM 4/28/2004, Michael Lynch wrote:
>         >He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
>I had 37/39 (front, rear).
>36/42 on the VFR, FWIW

They vary bike to bike and tire to tire, but those numbers sound really
high Mr. Lynch.
I run Dunlop 220s at 29 front and 31 rear on the '97 VFR.   42 is very
close
to max pressure on the 220s.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:04:24 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:04:10 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Motorcycling 201



-----Original Message-----
From: Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX>
....
 Not
hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2 grand
in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps to
him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
as opposed to spirited riding.

-------------
Yeah, the Whitehurst with its jersey walls and no shoulders sounds like a
wonderful place to play....not.

-------------

...........

Technical\Street Riding
When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
downshifts while at a stop
3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and put
it all in one package
..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?

-------------
The bike doesn't much care, mechanically speaking. That's what brakes
and wet clutches are for. You should be primarily concerned with
control. I prefer #3, keeping the gearing matched to road speed at all
times. That way, when it's time to get back on the gas again, you're in
the right gear.

-------------

When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then go
back into neutral?

-------------
I keep it in gear and feather the clutch at all times, unless it's
hopeless and you won't be moving for a long time.

-------------

When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
intended destination etc.?

-------------
Keep your main focus on the exit (or as far as you can see *towards* the
exit.) Pick up the other info with your peripheral vision. Your mirrors
don't exist.

-------------

According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off. Interesting
thing to think about.

-------------
Once you've ridden your bike for a while, you won't pay much attention to
the speedo. Go more by the tach and the feel of the bike.

-------------




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:06:17 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:06:20 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201

At 04:32 PM 4/28/2004, rich hall wrote:
>In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
1. Get the chain hot with a good ride
2. Get off of the bike :-)
3. Center stand or wheel stand
4. Neutral, bike OFF
5. Spin the rear tire and spray your (WD40|3in1|Chain Wax|Kerosene|Virgin
Blood) on the chain
6. Let it sit and drip all over the carpet while you watch Speed channel



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:07:49 2004
From: Michael Lynch <MLynch@XXXXXX>
To: "'rich hall'" <richallmc@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:11:38 -0400

Moose Chain Scrubber

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From:     rich hall [SMTP:richallmc@XXXXXX]
> Sent:     Wednesday, April 28, 2004 4:32 PM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
>
> In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
>
> >From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
> >To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> >Subject: Motorcycling 201
> >Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 15:58:15 -0400
> >
> >
> >I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a
week
> >but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making
me
> >feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to
check
> >tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday
and
> >I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
> >adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a
service
> >will do.
> >Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
> >appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.
> >
> >For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head ala
> >Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
> >matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer
600
> >and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit
he
> >dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in preparation
> >for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched him
> >slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he
said
> >he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
> >into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
> >hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
> >day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2
grand
> >in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps to
> >him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
> >as opposed to spirited riding.
> >
> >Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
> >noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here are
my
> >201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.
> >
> >Technical\Street Riding
> >When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
> >1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
> >2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
> >downshifts while at a stop
> >3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and
put
> >it all in one package
> >..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?
> >
> >When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
> >control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
> >first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then
go
> >back into neutral?
> >
> >When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
> >perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear
view,
> >intended destination etc.?
> >
> >According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
> >actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off.
Interesting
> >thing to think about.
> >
> >Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
> >sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
> >
> >Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice major
> >cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
> >everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfee )B®
> Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:11:32 2004
From: "John White" <kokopellian@XXXXXX>
To: julian@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:11:24 -0400

Same here Julian. I just got my 8k service completed on my YZF600R. New
tires to boot. And you're not kidding, it does feel like a new/smoother
bike. As for riding, I tend to take it smooth and easy for the most part
for reasons you named in your post. Also, I'm not very skilled on my
bike
yet (only been riding for 4 months total). As for your last question, I
tend to use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and
put
it all in one package when I stop at lights. It seems very smooth and
natural to me to do that.


>From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
>To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: Motorcycling 201
>Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 15:58:15 -0400
>
>
>I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a week
>but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making me
>feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to check
>tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
>I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
>adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a service
>will do.
>Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
>appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.
>
>For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head ala
>Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
>matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer 600
>and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit he
>dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in preparation
>for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched him
>slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he said
>he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
>into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
>hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
>day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2 grand
>in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps to
>him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
>as opposed to spirited riding.
>
>Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
>noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here are my
>201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.
>
>Technical\Street Riding
>When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
>1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
>2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
>downshifts while at a stop
>3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and put
>it all in one package
>..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?
>
>When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
>control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
>first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then go
>back into neutral?
>
>When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
>perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
>intended destination etc.?
>
>According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
>actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off. Interesting
>thing to think about.
>
>Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
>sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
>
>Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice major
>cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
>everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
>
>
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Stop worrying about overloading your inbox - get MSN Hotmail Extra
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:12:37 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:12:33 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures

-----Original Message-----
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Sent: Apr 28, 2004 5:01 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures

At 04:57 PM 4/28/2004, Michael Lynch wrote:
>         >He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
>I had 37/39 (front, rear).
>36/42 on the VFR, FWIW

They vary bike to bike and tire to tire, but those numbers sound really
high Mr. Lynch.

I run Dunlop 220s at 29 front and 31 rear on the '97 VFR.   42 is very
close
to max pressure on the 220s.

-------------------
Holy smokes. If I ran those low pressures on the street, the VFR would
prolly feel like the rear tire was flat.   For the VFR, those sound like
track pressures. The KLR would like them though. Mike's pressures sound
pretty good to me, especially with luggage or a passenger and lots of
slab riding.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:16:27 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:10:03 -0400

Chain wax cleans & lubes then?

>From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
>Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:06:20 -0400
>
>At 04:32 PM 4/28/2004, rich hall wrote:
>>In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
>
>1. Get the chain hot with a good ride
>2. Get off of the bike :-)
>3. Center stand or wheel stand
>4. Neutral, bike OFF
>5. Spin the rear tire and spray your (WD40|3in1|Chain
Wax|Kerosene|Virgin
>Blood) on the chain
>6. Let it sit and drip all over the carpet while you watch Speed channel
>
>
>
>___________________________________________
>     Mike Troutman
>         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
>         1997 Honda VFR 750
>            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
>            NMA http://www.motorists.org
>

_________________________________________________________________
MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page   )B–
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:17:19 2004
From: Michael Lynch <MLynch@XXXXXX>
To: "'Troutman'" <mike@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:21:09 -0400

Indeed it does vary from bike to bike Mr. Troutman, but on page 1-12 of
the
FSM for the VFR, recommended cold pressures are 36/42. If I'm not
mistaken,
Hondasan also printed it on the chain guard, but I can't see mine thru
the
chain lube goo. Could try'un go see when I go home to confirm, if'n ya
want.

Mike

>   -----Original Message-----
>   From:     Troutman [SMTP:mike@XXXXXX]
>   Sent:     Wednesday, April 28, 2004 5:01 PM
>   To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>   Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures
>
>   At 04:57 PM 4/28/2004, Michael Lynch wrote:
>   >         >He logged it as 31/34.   I checked Sunday and
>   >I had 37/39 (front, rear).
>   >36/42 on the VFR, FWIW
>
>   They vary bike to bike and tire to tire, but those numbers sound really
>   high Mr. Lynch.
>
>   I run Dunlop 220s at 29 front and 31 rear on the '97 VFR.   42 is very
>   close
>   to max pressure on the 220s.
>
>
>
>   ___________________________________________
>        Mike Troutman
>            http://www.troutman.org/vfr
>            1997 Honda VFR 750
>               AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
>               NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:26:40 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:26:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Motorcycling 201

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004, Julian Halton wrote:
> When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
> perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
> intended destination etc.?

IIRC MSF teaches looking through turns and corners, generally to the
intended destination. (And I'm sure I'll be corrected if I've got that
wrong) Look at where you want to go, not at what you want to avoid. One
think I do know, from experience, target fixation will get you into
trouble, quickly. Don't look at the pot hole, look at the place where
where the pothole isn't -- where you want the motorcycle to go.

Re: clutching - as mentioned by others, I tend to feather the clutch and
shift down as I slow down -- and this holds for any slowing, be it for a
stop light, or in traffic or simply backing down as I'm picking the right
line and entry speed for a curve or turn. I feel like I have more
control
with the engine in gear, and in a proper gear, than not. Being in the
right gear means it's easier to roll on as I'm exiting the turn or curve.

As always, YMMV. These are my opinions. If you've got a half ton worth
of Harley and Harley rider, things may be radically different.



--
Dan Brown
brown@XXXXXX
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:27:52 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:27:43 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004, Troutman wrote:
>
> At 04:32 PM 4/28/2004, rich hall wrote:
> >In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
>
> 1. Get the chain hot with a good ride
> 2. Get off of the bike :-)
> 3. Center stand or wheel stand
> 4. Neutral, bike OFF
> 5. Spin the rear tire and spray your (WD40|3in1|Chain
Wax|Kerosene|Virgin
> Blood) on the chain
> 6. Let it sit and drip all over the carpet while you watch Speed
channel


Optionally, you can always just buy a bike with a shaft drive.


--
Dan Brown
brown@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:42:47 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:43:56 -0400
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 04:29 PM 4/28/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>Nah....I can walk and still outrun ya. LOL
>
>I probably put about 1200 miles on it since last October. I don't ride
to
work, 15 minute walk, so I don't think that's too bad for occasional
weekend/evening riding. :-)

I don't commute at all (my office is in my house). I thought you sport
bike guys *rode*? You are always ragging on Harley owners for never
riding
their bikes, but it seems that this newbie Harley rider has over twice
the
mileage since October that you do...want some ketchup with that crow? :-
)

>I'm close to 24000 since getting it in February 2000.
That's 4 *years* though! If I keep riding at the rate I did when first
starting up again, and over the winter, I'll get ~5000 miles a year,
which
is ~20,000 in 4 years. However, I really expect to get a lot more miles
per year now that it's warning up, and I'm going on longer rides (up to
306
mi for a longest day now). October was mostly short rides (<40 miles)
and
parking lot practice. November started inching up the length, but I
didn't
hit 100 mile days until January.

We won't even mention Evil Overlord Carl, whose 2002 H-D had over 24,000
miles on it when I first joined this list last year...

Looks like sportbikers are the ones with the "garage jewelry"...   :-)

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:42:49 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:35:37 -0400
To: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Motorcycling 201

At 03:58 PM 4/28/04 -0400, Julian Halton wrote:

>Technical\Street Riding
>When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
>1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
>2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
>downshifts while at a stop
>3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and put
>it all in one package
>..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?

I do #3. Part of that is due to learning to drive in a '67 VW Beetle,
which wouldn't stop from 50 mph in a hurry without fading the brakes
badly
(small drums, narrow shoes), so you *had* to use downshifting. Part of
that is that it sounds cool when you downshift a bike. Part of that is
wanting the bike to be capable of switching back to acceleration if
anything happens that requires that (light changes, someone tries to run
over me, etc.). Part of that is due to not wanting the yutz behind me to
fail to notice that I'm slowing down, so I want a red light glowing
behind
me to at least give him a shot at a clue.   The only option that gets me
all
of that is #3.

>When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
>control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
>first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then go
>back into neutral?

If it doesn't look like a really long wait, I leave it in gear, and just
move up. If necessary, I can relocate a lot faster that way. It's a bit
harder on the clutch (and my left hand), but I know where they sell more
clutches, and I don't mind my forearm getting bigger.

If I spend too long doing that (like 30 minutes or so) the clutch can
start
to get "grabby". Only time that's happened so far was leaving Arlington
Cemetary parking garage after the wreath laying last fall...30 minutes
into
the creep-and-wait routine it started objecting, so I started using
neutral. Once it cooled off, it was happy again.

>When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
>perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear view,
>intended destination etc.?

By "wide angle vision" do you mean what martial artists call "soft eyes"?
Sort of a not-really-focused-on-anything deal, where you are paying as
much
attention to your peripheral vision as you are to the center of vision?

>According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
>actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off. Interesting
>thing to think about.

My dad tested me on that when I was learning to drive. He covered the
speedometer, on the interstate, and said to put it at 65 (the speed limit
at the time). When I said I was there, he uncovered it. I was off by
about 3 mph (low). I always thought he was hoping to make some sort of a
point, and I blew it for him. ;-)

Doing stuff like that is fun, and a good way to test how well you can
function if your instruments go toes up. It's a normal part of pilot
training, but not done too often with cars or bikes. Probably because
other than ticket avoidance, most instruments in cars aren't all that
necessary. The engine ones can be if something goes wrong, but it's hard
to test yourself on things like oil temp... :-) On a bike, the less time
you have to spend looking down at the speedo, the more time you can spend
looking around for problems...so it's probably a useful skill to develop.

>Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice major
>cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
>everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
Haven't seen any yet...or heard them.    I think they are still getting
dressed for the party...



-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 17:49:24 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:51:52 -0400
To: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201

At 05:27 PM 4/28/04 -0400, Daniel H. Brown wrote:
>On Wed, 28 Apr 2004, Troutman wrote:
>> At 04:32 PM 4/28/2004, rich hall wrote:
>> >In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
>
>Optionally, you can always just buy a bike with a shaft drive.

Or a belt...


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.    Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 18:06:00 2004
From: Kirk Roy <kirkroy@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 18:05:53 -0400

Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 04:29 PM 4/28/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> >Nah....I can walk and still outrun ya. LOL
> >
> >I probably put about 1200 miles on it since last October. I don't
ride to
> work, 15 minute walk, so I don't think that's too bad for occasional
> weekend/evening riding. :-)
>
> I don't commute at all (my office is in my house). I thought you sport
> bike guys *rode*? You are always ragging on Harley owners for never
riding
> their bikes, but it seems that this newbie Harley rider has over twice
the
> mileage since October that you do...want some ketchup with that crow?
:-)

Shoot, both of you guys need to get out and ride. I put about 2.2k miles
on a new bike feb-apr and the bike was parked 2 weeks in there (once for
snow, once because I was taking care of my wife post surgery). Shoot,
I've put 2k miles on a bike in a 3 day weekend and I'm not a terribly
high mileage rider.

Unfortunately, the bike with 2.2k miles on it was stolen about a week
ago. It was recovered completely submerged in a creek in Adamstown, MD.
http://users.adelphia.net/~abcwkroy/zx9r/

Kirk

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 21:44:31 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 21:33:20 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: fuel tube tank pull

Finished putting the bike back together tonight - everything is working
well. Came back and started taking the tank off to clean the air filter,
and I can't get the fuel tube off. It is wedged on. Any tips on
loosening
without breaking the hose?


_____________________________________
   Mike Troutman
        mike@XXXXXX
        http://www.troutman.org/vfr

         '97 Honda VFR 750
         AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/
         NMA - http://www.motorists.org

         "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead."
                 - Jimmy Buffett

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 21:44:31 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 21:43:57 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 (shafties, belts and tire pressure)

At 05:51 PM 4/28/2004, Mike Bartman wrote:
> >Optionally, you can always just buy a bike with a shaft drive.
>
>Or a belt...

Blasphemers!

Now, on to tire pressure.

I scraped the gunk off of my chain guard and you are right - it does say
36
front, 42 rear. But the tire also says 42PSI cold max in the rear. I
went
looking for recommendations and found this :

http://www.rmh-d.com/service/tire_info.php290 kpa (42 psi) Cold

"This indicates the maximum amount of air pressure that the tire should
hold when the motorcycle is fully loaded. Take note that this is the
maximum air pressure for the tire, not the recommended pressure for the
tire. It is usually recommended by the manufacturer that a tire is
inflated
to a few psi less than the maximum pressure rating ... how much less will
depend on the tire and the manufacturer (see
<http://www.avontires.com>Avon,
<http://www.bridgestone-usa.com>Bridgestone,
<http://www.chenshintires.com>Cheng Shin,
<http://www.conti-online.com>Continental,
<http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com>Dunlop,
<http://www.us.metzlermoto.com>Metzler,
<http://www.motous.webmichelin.com>Michelin,
<http://www.us.pirellimoto.com>Pirelli, and other tire manufacturers for
more information). For instance, the tire in our example has a maximum
tire
pressure of 42 psi; however, the recommended tire pressure (according to
the Dunlop website) is between 36 and 40 psi."
So, it would seem I have been running a bit too low all these years, but
you might rethink running at the max PSI (if your tires are 42 Max that
is).

YMMV literally ;-)




_____________________________________
   Mike Troutman
        mike@XXXXXX
        http://www.troutman.org/vfr

         '97 Honda VFR 750
         AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/
         NMA - http://www.motorists.org

         "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead."
                 - Jimmy Buffett
From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Apr 28 22:37:03 2004
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 22:36:52 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: fuel tube tank pull

At 10:13 PM 4/28/2004, you wrote:
>vice grips and twist, twist, twist. then pull.

I tried that but it looked like the fuel line might tear.

 >Use a the metal ink refill to an ink pen, pointy end in. Push it
gently
in and then pull it out and use the
 >loose space to spray some WD40 in. Repeat every 1/4". It'll come
loose
if you just twist NOT pull it.

Tight space, but I'll give that a shot.

Thanks!


_____________________________________
   Mike Troutman
        mike@XXXXXX
        http://www.troutman.org/vfr

          '97 Honda VFR 750
          AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/
          NMA - http://www.motorists.org

          "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead."
                  - Jimmy Buffett

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 01:13:57 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 01:16:30 -0400
To: Kirk Roy <kirkroy@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 06:05 PM 4/28/04 -0400, Kirk Roy wrote:
>Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
>> At 04:29 PM 4/28/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:

>> >I probably put about 1200 miles on it since last October. I don't
ride to
>>
>> bike guys *rode*? You are always ragging on Harley owners for never
riding
>> their bikes, but it seems that this newbie Harley rider has over twice
the
>> mileage since October that you do...want some ketchup with that crow?
:-)
>
>Shoot, both of you guys need to get out and ride.

Tell me about it...work is acting up again.   All I managed to do today
other than work is cut the grass...

I'm riding more now. When I first got the bike, after a 12 year layoff,
I
didn't put many miles on it too fast. Being cautious until I was used to
riding again. Took almost a month to get to 500 miles. I put a little
over 300 on it in a day last week (the Delaware Spring Poker Run trip).
I
expect that with the warmer weather there will be more and longer rides
happening.

>Shoot, I've put 2k miles on a bike in a 3 day weekend and I'm not a
terribly high mileage rider.

Ummm...I may disagree there. 700+ mile days are fairly long
rides...almost
Iron Butt level. They *are* Iron Butt level if you didn't ride every day
of that 3 day weekend.

>Unfortunately, the bike with 2.2k miles on it was stolen about a week
ago.
It was recovered completely submerged in a creek in Adamstown, MD.
>http://users.adelphia.net/~abcwkroy/zx9r/

That sucks.   Is the insurance going to total it, or fix it?

Hope you have another to ride in the mean time. Being bikeless with the
nice weather coming would make a bad situation worse...though if that's
the
case, at least you'll avoid the Cicadas...


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI    (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 07:17:27 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 04:17:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Skip <skip@XXXXXX> wrote:
> the chrome, silly!
>
> --skip, heading for DMV at 4, incase anyone gives a rat's
> arse

you go, schoolgirl!




>   Rob Sharp wrote:
>   >
>   > Whats the difference between a 'Harley' rim and a 'non
>   Harley' rim except
>   > Price? :-D
>   >
>   > Rob




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 07:23:43 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 04:23:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

34f/36r for me with michelin pilot sports on the street.



--- Troutman <mike@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 04:57 PM 4/28/2004, Michael Lynch wrote:
> >         >He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
> >I had 37/39 (front, rear).
> >36/42 on the VFR, FWIW
>
> They vary bike to bike and tire to tire, but those
> numbers sound really
> high Mr. Lynch.
>
> I run Dunlop 220s at 29 front and 31 rear on the '97 VFR.
> 42 is very close
> to max pressure on the 220s.
__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 07:38:42 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 04:38:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 04:29 PM 4/28/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> >Nah....I can walk and still outrun ya. LOL
> >
> >I probably put about 1200 miles on it since last
> October. I don't ride to
> work, 15 minute walk, so I don't think that's too bad for
> occasional
> weekend/evening riding. :-)
>
> I don't commute at all (my office is in my house). I
> thought you sport
> bike guys *rode*? You are always ragging on Harley
> owners for never riding
> their bikes, but it seems that this newbie Harley rider
> has over twice the
> mileage since October that you do...want some ketchup
> with that crow? :-)

jesus h., you put a quarter of the mileage on one ride on
the SLAB two weeks ago. the rest of the mileage sounds
like it has been logged riding to battleys and back.
please get over yourself!




>   >I'm close to 24000 since getting it in February 2000.
>
>   That's 4 *years* though! If I keep riding at the rate I
>   did when first
>   starting up again, and over the winter, I'll get ~5000
>   miles a year, which
>   is ~20,000 in 4 years. However, I really expect to get a
>   lot more miles
>   per year now that it's warning up, and I'm going on
>   longer rides (up to 306
>   mi for a longest day now). October was mostly short
>   rides (<40 miles) and
>   parking lot practice. November started inching up the
>   length, but I didn't
>    hit 100 mile days until January.
>
>    We won't even mention Evil Overlord Carl, whose 2002 H-D
>    had over 24,000
>    miles on it when I first joined this list last year...
>
>    Looks like sportbikers are the ones with the "garage
>    jewelry"... :-)

it takes a big leap to attribute scooter's habits to the
rest of us.

as for carl, we all know he commuted ~100 miles per day.
should we worship him for choosing an h-d over an econobox?


--
tg




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 07:55:27 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Michael Lynch'" <MLynch@XXXXXX>,
   "'rich hall'"
       <richallmc@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 07:55:11 -0400

Those are great really gets the chain and rear sprocket clean.

-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Lynch [mailto:MLynch@XXXXXX]
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 5:12 PM
To: 'rich hall'; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201

Moose Chain Scrubber

Mike

>    -----Original Message-----
>    From:     rich hall [SMTP:richallmc@XXXXXX]
>    Sent:     Wednesday, April 28, 2004 4:32 PM
>    To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>    Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
>
>    In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
>
> >From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
> >To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> >Subject: Motorcycling 201
> >Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 15:58:15 -0400
> >
> >
> >I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a
week
> >but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making
me
> >feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to
check
> >tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday
and
> >I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
> >adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a
service
> >will do.
> >Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
> >appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.
> >
> >For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head ala
> >Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
> >matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer
600
> >and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit
he
> >dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in preparation
> >for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched him
> >slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he
said
> >he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
> >into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
> >hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that a
> >day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2
grand
> >in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps to
> >him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth riding
> >as opposed to spirited riding.
> >
> >Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
> >noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here are
my
> >201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.
> >
> >Technical\Street Riding
> >When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
> >1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
> >2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do multiple
> >downshifts while at a stop
> >3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and
put
> >it all in one package
> >..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?
> >
> >When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
> >control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to engage
> >first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then
go
> >back into neutral?
> >
> >When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
> >perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear
view,
> >intended destination etc.?
> >
> >According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
> >actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off.
Interesting
> >thing to think about.
> >
> >Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand to
> >sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
> >
> >Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice major
> >cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
> >everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfee(r)
> Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 08:10:17 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 05:10:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Hmm lets see my last three weeklends accounted for
this:

April 9th: ~300 miles
April 17th: 440 miles
April 24th: 500 miles

looks like I don't fit your grouping of sportbike
riders...

Glenn


> --- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
<snip> >

  Looks like sportbikers are the ones with the
> "garage
> > jewelry"... :-)
>




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 08:12:50 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 08:02:41 -0400

Most shops carry these?

>From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
>To: "'Michael Lynch'" <MLynch@XXXXXX>,    "'rich hall'"
><richallmc@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
>Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 07:55:11 -0400
>
>Those are great really gets the chain and rear sprocket clean.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael Lynch [mailto:MLynch@XXXXXX]
>Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 5:12 PM
>To: 'rich hall'; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
>
>Moose Chain Scrubber
>
>Mike
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: rich hall [SMTP:richallmc@XXXXXX]
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 4:32 PM
> > To:    dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > Subject:     RE: Motorcycling 201
> >
> > In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
> >
> > >From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
> > >To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> > >Subject: Motorcycling 201
> > >Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 15:58:15 -0400
> > >
> > >
> > >I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a
week
> > >but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making
me
> > >feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to
check
> > >tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday
and
> > >I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
> > >adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a
service
> > >will do.
> > >Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
> > >appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.
> > >
> > >For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head
ala
> > >Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
> > >matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer
600
> > >and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit
he
> > >dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in
preparation
> > >for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched
him
> > >slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he
said
> > >he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
> > >into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
> > >hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that
a
> > >day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2
>grand
> > >in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps
to
> > >him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth
riding
> > >as opposed to spirited riding.
> > >
> > >Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
> > >noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here
are
>my
> > >201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.
> > >
> > >Technical\Street Riding
> > >When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
> > >1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
> > >2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do
multiple
> > >downshifts while at a stop
> > >3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and
put
> > >it all in one package
> > >..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?
> > >
> > >When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
> > >control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to
engage
> > >first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then
go
> > >back into neutral?
> > >
> > >When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
> > >perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear
view,
> > >intended destination etc.?
> > >
> > >According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
> > >actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off.
>Interesting
> > >thing to think about.
> > >
> > >Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand
to
> > >sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
> > >
> > >Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice
major
> > >cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
> > >everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
>McAfee(r)
> > Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>

_________________________________________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 08:29:29 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'Tom Gimer'" <t_gimer@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 08:29:20 -0400

That's about what I use for my Pilots on my gixxer.

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Gimer [mailto:t_gimer@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 7:23 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201 tire pressures

34f/36r for me with michelin pilot sports on the street.



--- Troutman <mike@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 04:57 PM 4/28/2004, Michael Lynch wrote:
> >         >He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday and
> >I had 37/39 (front, rear).
> >36/42 on the VFR, FWIW
>
> They vary bike to bike and tire to tire, but those
> numbers sound really
> high Mr. Lynch.
>
> I run Dunlop 220s at 29 front and 31 rear on the '97 VFR.
> 42 is very close
> to max pressure on the 220s.




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 08:31:31 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'rich hall'" <richallmc@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 08:31:17 -0400

I got mine from cycles USA. I also have seen them at Hudson trail
Outfitters
and Performance bicycles.

-----Original Message-----
From: rich hall [mailto:richallmc@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 8:03 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201

Most shops carry these?

>From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
>To: "'Michael Lynch'" <MLynch@XXXXXX>,   "'rich hall'"
><richallmc@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
>Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 07:55:11 -0400
>
>Those are great really gets the chain and rear sprocket clean.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael Lynch [mailto:MLynch@XXXXXX]
>Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 5:12 PM
>To: 'rich hall'; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: RE: Motorcycling 201
>
>Moose Chain Scrubber
>
>Mike
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: rich hall [SMTP:richallmc@XXXXXX]
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 4:32 PM
> > To:     dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> > Subject:      RE: Motorcycling 201
> >
> > In addition, what is the best way to clean a chain while on the bike?
> >
> > >From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
> > >To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> > >Subject: Motorcycling 201
> > >Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2004 15:58:15 -0400
> > >
> > >
> > >I just got my 8000 mile service on my '02 R6. I chain lube once a
week
> > >but the service dude's instructions reminded me to lube it up making
me
> > >feel like I was not doing an adequate job. I was also reminded to
check
> > >tire pressure every ride. He logged it as 31/34. I checked Sunday
and
> > >I had 37/39 (front, rear). The bike "feels" like a new bike after
> > >adjusting the carbs and cleaning the air filter. Amazing what a
service
> > >will do.
> > >Riding around in my summer jacket is invigorating and makes me
> > >appreciate my Vanson on cooler days.
> > >
> > >For the past weeks, I have had a deep voice in the back of my head
ala
> > >Darth Vader, saying that if you have not yet wrecked, it is only a
> > >matter of time. Last week a client from my bar bought a new Gixxer
600
> > >and I invited him on a ride. We took the toll road and off the exit
he
> > >dialed it up to 80mph while I was slowing down to 15mph in
preparation
> > >for a right turn. I heard the sound of locked brakes and watched
him
> > >slide by me into the intersection on a red light. After-action, he
said
> > >he had three choices: 1) hit me. 2) dump the brand new bike 3) slide
> > >into the intersection. I told him to dial it down and chill.    Not
> > >hearing from him in three days, I called him only to find out that
a
> > >day later he wrecked coming westbound on the Whitehurst freeway. 2
>grand
> > >in damage but thanks to Vanson leathers, only minor bumps and lumps
to
> > >him. Well, all this gets me thinking more and more about smooth
riding
> > >as opposed to spirited riding.
> > >
> > >Have been reading lots including Twist of the Wrist 1 and 2 and am
> > >noting many of the same principles taught in the MSF course. Here
are
>my
> > >201 technical and maintenance questions for the week.
> > >
> > >Technical\Street Riding
> > >When stopping at a light, pick the best option:
> > >1) engine brake and let the bike slow down
> > >2) squeeze the brakes until speed is next to nothing then do
multiple
> > >downshifts while at a stop
> > >3) use a combo of braking and engine braking, try to match rpms and
put
> > >it all in one package
> > >..any comments on what is mechanically best for bike?
> > >
> > >When in stop and go traffic, is it not a good idea to use clutch
> > >control to move the bike slowly along? Is it better practice to
engage
> > >first, completely release clutch quickly move your position and then
go
> > >back into neutral?
> > >
> > >When taking corners, do you prefer to maintain a wide angle vision
> > >perspective or move your eyes rapidly scanning road surface, rear
view,
> > >intended destination etc.?
> > >
> > >According to Code, top racers can instinctively judge speed to the
> > >actual mile. I have tried to guess speed and am usually off.
>Interesting
> > >thing to think about.
> > >
> > >Do you all self-clean your air filters? If anyone has a wheel stand
to
> > >sell that fits an R6 please let me know.
> > >
> > >Cheers. I know this topic has been beaten to death but I notice
major
> > >cicada phobia at any sizeable gathering of moto enthusiasts. Hope
> > >everyone is enjoying the sunshine.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
>McAfee(r)
> > Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get rid of annoying pop-up ads with the new MSN Toolbar - FREE!
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 09:17:33 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 09:17:26 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online



-----Original Message-----
From: Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>

Hmm lets see my last three weeklends accounted for
this:

April 9th: ~300 miles
April 17th: 440 miles
April 24th: 500 miles

looks like I don't fit your grouping of sportbike
riders...

Glenn


> --- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
<snip> >

  Looks like sportbikers are the ones with the
> "garage
> > jewelry"... :-)
>


As much as I dislike these odometer/penile measurement contests....but
since Bartman started this
Picked up the VFR on 5/1/01 - mileage 14,093
 4/29/04 - mileage 61,256

Over the next two days, I expect to rack up ~600 miles or so, putting me
at 16,000 a year, give or take.

That doesn't count the mileage on my other bikes.   I've put about 1,000
miles on the KLR in the month that I've had it.

And, I'm still not even in the same league at Horkster and Leon.



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 09:22:49 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 09:22:38 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: fuel tube tank pull


-----Original Message-----
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>

Finished putting the bike back together tonight - everything is working
well. Came back and started taking the tank off to clean the air filter,
and I can't get the fuel tube off. It is wedged on. Any tips on
loosening
without breaking the hose?

---------

Mike, that main fuel line wayyyy under the tank on the VFR is a huge
PITA. Here's what I do. Just leave it on the tank and disconnect the
fuel line at the fuel filter. It's out in the open and accessible. Just
remember to shut off the fuel valve first. DAMHIK.




Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 10:09:40 2004
From: rjmoran@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Clutch Question
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:09:30 +0000
X-Authenticated-Sender: cmptb3JhbkBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA==
Hey all,

This morning on my way to work I noticed the dreaded "taching up" on
heavy acceleration that indicates a clutch going bad. The bike is a '90
FZR400 that I've put (maybe) 200 miles on for a total of 15,400 or so.
I'm the second owner, so I'm guessing the clutch is the original and that
the plates have had enough. My question is this: should I just go ahead
and replace the springs while I'm in there?

RPM

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 10:18:40 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 10:18:12 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Motorcycling 201 (moose chain scrubber)

Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS) wrote:
> I got mine from cycles USA. I also have seen them at Hudson trail
Outfitters
> and Performance bicycles.

$20 + shipping from Dover, DE :)

They work great, just need a mild degreaser from any parts store and a
spray bottle.

- Roach

--
http://www.speedwerks.com
The one-stop shop for all your motorcycling needs!
(302) 672 - 7223

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 10:30:03 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 10:29:49 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Clutch Question

Check clutch cables and oil level first.   15k isn't much for a clutch.

At 10:09 AM 4/29/2004, you wrote:
>Hey all,
>
>This morning on my way to work I noticed the dreaded "taching up" on
heavy
>acceleration that indicates a clutch going bad. The bike is a '90 FZR400
>that I've put (maybe) 200 miles on for a total of 15,400 or so. I'm the
>second owner, so I'm guessing the clutch is the original and that the
>plates have had enough. My question is this: should I just go ahead and
>replace the springs while I'm in there?
>
>RPM
___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:04:45 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:04:26 -0400
Subject: Clutch cable

My clutch lever is a study in carpal tunnel syndrome right now
(incredibly stiff) and I'm going to replace it. I've never tried it
before -- Clymer makes it look pretty easy.

Are there any clutch cable replacement tips or tricks from the list?

Thanks,

-Sean
1992 Seca II

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:12:40 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:12:28 -0400
Subject: Re: Clutch cable

Re-reading this just now... I'm replacing the *cable* not the lever. The
lever's fine and dandy, thankyouverymuch, and I've narrowed the
stiffness problem down to the clutch cable itself (dirty, old, stiff).

-Sean

Sean Steele wrote:

>   My clutch lever is a study in carpal tunnel syndrome right now
>   (incredibly stiff) and I'm going to replace it. I've never tried it
>   before -- Clymer makes it look pretty easy.
>
>   Are there any clutch cable replacement tips or tricks from the list?
>
>   Thanks,
>
>   -Sean
>   1992 Seca II

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:14:58 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:14:42 -0400
From: Brian Roach <roach@XXXXXX>
To: Sean Steele <sean@XXXXXX>
CC: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Clutch cable


Have you tried lubing it? More than likely that's all you need.

A cable luber comes in handy, but even without, a penetrating spray
lubricant with the little straw can be shot into the top of the cable,
then working the clutch and letting gravity work might get the job done.

- Roach


Sean Steele wrote:

>   My clutch lever is a study in carpal tunnel syndrome right now
>   (incredibly stiff) and I'm going to replace it. I've never tried it
>   before -- Clymer makes it look pretty easy.
>
>   Are there any clutch cable replacement tips or tricks from the list?
>
>   Thanks,
>
>   -Sean
>   1992 Seca II
>
>


--
http://www.speedwerks.com
The one-stop shop for all your motorcycling needs!
(302) 672 - 7223

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:16:59 2004
Subject: RE: Clutch cable
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:16:51 -0400
From: "Verde, Robert" <Robert.Verde@XXXXXX>
To: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>, "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Only thing I'd suggest is making sure the new cable is nicely lubed prior
to installation, it's a lot easier to do with it off the bike.

Robert


-----Original Message-----
From: Sean Steele [mailto:sean@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 11:12 AM
To: DC Cycles
Subject: Re: Clutch cable
Re-reading this just now... I'm replacing the *cable* not the lever. The
lever's fine and dandy, thankyouverymuch, and I've narrowed the
stiffness problem down to the clutch cable itself (dirty, old, stiff).

-Sean

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:17:06 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:17:01 -0400
To: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 04:38 AM 4/29/04 -0700, Tom Gimer wrote:
>--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:

>> I don't commute at all (my office is in my house). I
>> thought you sport
>> bike guys *rode*? You are always ragging on Harley
>> owners for never riding
>> their bikes, but it seems that this newbie Harley rider
>> has over twice the
>> mileage since October that you do...want some ketchup
>> with that crow? :-)
>
>jesus h., you put a quarter of the mileage on one ride on
>the SLAB two weeks ago. the rest of the mileage sounds
>like it has been logged riding to battleys and back.
>please get over yourself!

Let's see, 306 times four is....1224. That's not real close to "a bit
over
2600" now, is it? Was it the reading comprehension or the math that you
skipped in school?

>> Looks like sportbikers are the ones with the "garage
>> jewelry"... :-)
>
>it takes a big leap to attribute scooter's habits to the
>rest of us.

No bigger than the one that attributes one's favorite Harley non-rider to
all Harley riders.

Oh, and a free clue for you: the ":-)" sequence is called a "smiley".
It
indicates that the statement made is not intended seriously. Note that
there isn't one on this response.

>as for carl, we all know he commuted ~100 miles per day.
>should we worship him for choosing an h-d over an econobox?

Sounds like a plan.

-- Mike B.
'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:17:16 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:19:25 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 09:17 AM 4/29/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:

>As much as I dislike these odometer/penile measurement contests....but
since Bartman started this

Correction: Scooter started this.   I was just first responder.

>And, I'm still not even in the same league at Horkster and Leon.

Evil Overlord Carl might be.   I'm sure not.   Doubt many are.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:31:35 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:31:16 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>, Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online



-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>

At 09:17 AM 4/29/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:

>As much as I dislike these odometer/penile measurement contests....but
since Bartman started this

Correction: Scooter started this.   I was just first responder.
---------------------

Tis true about the mileage statement, but by "starting it" I recall
you're the one who chimed in on the (inevitable?) marque and bike type
generalizations. And, IIRC, Scooter has been cross country on his R6.
Let us know when yours leaves the eastern time zone. ;-) << note smiley.



Paul in DC
95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:33:50 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Clutch cable
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:14:39 -0400

Try lubing it first?
I had a Seca II, the clutch was much stiffer than that on my SVS.

>From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
>To: "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>Subject: Re: Clutch cable
>Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:12:28 -0400
>
>Re-reading this just now... I'm replacing the *cable* not the lever. The
>lever's fine and dandy, thankyouverymuch, and I've narrowed the
stiffness
>problem down to the clutch cable itself (dirty, old, stiff).
>
>-Sean
>
>Sean Steele wrote:
>
>>My clutch lever is a study in carpal tunnel syndrome right now
(incredibly
>>stiff) and I'm going to replace it. I've never tried it before --
Clymer
>>makes it look pretty easy.
>>
>>Are there any clutch cable replacement tips or tricks from the list?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>-Sean
>>1992 Seca II
>

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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:46:29 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 08:46:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I am reminded by posts like this why I left the list
for a few months.

--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 09:17 AM 4/29/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
>
> >As much as I dislike these odometer/penile
> measurement contests....but
> since Bartman started this
>
> Correction: Scooter started this. I was just first
> responder.
>
> >And, I'm still not even in the same league at
> Horkster and Leon.
>
> Evil Overlord Carl might be. I'm sure not. Doubt
> many are.
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI
> for the non-Harley folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from
> someone else's mistakes
> is better.
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:47:00 2004
From: Michael Lynch <MLynch@XXXXXX>
To: "'rjmoran@XXXXXX'" <rjmoran@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Clutch Question
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:50:42 -0400

Definitely.   I've brought a clutch back to life by *just* replacing the
springs with some heavy duty Barnett ones.   YMMV.

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From:     rjmoran@XXXXXX [SMTP:rjmoran@XXXXXX]
> Sent:     Thursday, April 29, 2004 10:10 AM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: Clutch Question
>
> Hey all,
>
> This morning on my way to work I noticed the dreaded "taching up" on
heavy
> acceleration that indicates a clutch going bad. The bike is a '90
FZR400
> that I've put (maybe) 200 miles on for a total of 15,400 or so. I'm the
> second owner, so I'm guessing the clutch is the original and that the
> plates have had enough. My question is this: should I just go ahead and
> replace the springs while I'm in there?
>
> RPM

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 11:57:40 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:57:36 -0400
From: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Cc: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

<snippage>
>Oh, and a free clue for you: the ":-)" sequence is called
>a "smiley". It indicates that the statement made is not
>intended seriously. Note that there isn't one on this
>response.

[Dave] Well... You get what you pay for. :-) The above
ascii reference is more correctly referred to as
an "emoticon", but in slang, 'smiley' is acceptable in some
cases... However, this emoticon :-( is not a smiley... (is
it a frownie?) And the correct use of emoticons is to convey
elements of voice inflection, body language, etc. missed from
a phone or person to person conversation to email. It's not
necessarily indicative of not being serious, but can
sometimes mean that. FWIW, emoticons, and smileys in
particular absolutely enrage Gimer, who I guess is a closet
ascii purist or something - ;-)

HTH
Dave Yates

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 12:03:47 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 09:03:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
To: DC Cycles <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in 2004.
The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few events
at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in Adams
Morgan.

We really need some list help in promoting these
events. Nothing too intense, just some web help,
postering at local shops and posting on other
messageboards.

With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design me
a slick little webpage? All I am thinking about is a
one pager with some nice graphics and details on the
event location, hours, etc. I can then modifiy it (I
have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver) each
time to suit the particular date and location. The
only links would be to the actual location's website
and/or a map. If no one volunteers we continue to use
the previous version of the Bike Night website:

http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/

One critical element of the webpage is that it needs
to be printable for use as a poster (normal paper
size) for posting at local bike shops.

Once that is set, I will need some of you to volunteer
to print and post the poster at your local bike shop.
This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike
nights.

One note: We will be working with Motorcycle Leather
Exchange to provide free softdrinks for these events.
Thanks Lisa and Jay.

If you can help with the web design, email me asap.

Thanks

Mark




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 13:21:13 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 13:21:01 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Yes, I must unfortunately take responsibility for starting this latest
round of "pick on the Harley owners." But, I was tricked into it. :-)

"Tonight on Fox 5, When good jokes lead to bad e-mail threads."   LOL

Scooter (some of my best friends are Hardley owners.   ;-))

In a message dated 4/29/2004 11:19:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
omni@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> At 09:17 AM 4/29/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
>
> >As much as I dislike these odometer/penile measurement contests....but
> since Bartman started this
>
> Correction: Scooter started this. I was just first responder.
>
> >And, I'm still not even in the same league at Horkster and Leon.
>
> Evil Overlord Carl might be. I'm sure not. Doubt many are.
>
> -- Mike B.
>
> '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)
>
> Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone
> else's mistakes
> is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 13:23:02 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 13:22:51 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Thanks for the support Paul. :-) Anyone know what the next thread topic
is supposed to be? Have we done the Sping Air thread yet? ;-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/29/2004 11:31:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
viffermaniac@XXXXXX writes:

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
>
> At 09:17 AM 4/29/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:
>
> >As much as I dislike these odometer/penile measurement contests....but
> since Bartman started this
>
> Correction: Scooter started this. I was just first responder.
>
> ---------------------
>
> Tis true about the mileage statement, but by "starting it" I recall
you're the one who chimed in on the (inevitable?) marque and bike type
generalizations. And, IIRC, Scooter has been cross country on his R6.
Let us know when yours leaves
> the eastern time zone.   ;-) << note smiley.
>
>
>
> Paul in DC
> 95 VFR - 96 KLR650 - www.wilsonline.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 13:34:59 2004
Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 13:38:34 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Mark Kitchell" <markkitchell@XXXXXX>,
   "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


Look,
I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but I work at a nice
lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good tapas and outdoor
seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams Morgan. ( A one and a
half block walk from Asylum. . I work there Friday's, we have pool,
eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation dispensation which
means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are welcome any time I am
working to introduce yourself and chill. I can customize music, drinks
and even to a certain degree food.

Cheers


-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
To: DC Cycles
Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help

Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in 2004.
The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few events
at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in Adams Morgan.
We really need some list help in promoting these events. Nothing too
intense, just some web help, postering at local shops and posting on
other messageboards.

With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design me a slick little
webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager with some nice graphics
and details on the event location, hours, etc. I can then modifiy it (I
have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver) each time to suit the
particular date and location. The only links would be to the actual
location's website and/or a map. If no one volunteers we continue to
use the previous version of the Bike Night website:

http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/

One critical element of the webpage is that it needs to be printable for
use as a poster (normal paper
size) for posting at local bike shops.

Once that is set, I will need some of you to volunteer to print and post
the poster at your local bike shop.
This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike nights.

One note: We will be working with Motorcycle Leather Exchange to provide
free softdrinks for these events.
Thanks Lisa and Jay.

If you can help with the web design, email me asap.

Thanks

Mark




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 13:55:44 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 13:55:31 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Hey Mark and Chuck, I think we just got our first volunteer "host" for
Bike Night. ;-) Julian, I'll have to stop in Zucchabar one Friday. I
live in DC and can walk to Adams Morgan quite easily. :-)
Scooter

In a message dated 4/29/2004 1:38:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
julian@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
>
> Look,
> I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but I work at a nice
> lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good tapas and outdoor
> seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
> Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams Morgan. ( A one and a
> half block walk from Asylum. . I work there Friday's, we have pool,
> eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation dispensation which
> means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are welcome any time I am
> working to introduce yourself and chill. I can customize music, drinks
> and even to a certain degree food.
>
> Cheers
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
> To: DC Cycles
> Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>
> Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in 2004.
> The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
> Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few events
> at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in Adams Morgan.
>
> We really need some list help in promoting these events. Nothing too
> intense, just some web help, postering at local shops and posting on
> other messageboards.
>
> With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design me a slick little
> webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager with some nice
graphics
> and details on the event location, hours, etc. I can then modifiy it
(I
> have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver) each time to suit the
> particular date and location. The only links would be to the actual
> location's website and/or a map. If no one volunteers we continue to
> use the previous version of the Bike Night website:
>
> http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
>
> One critical element of the webpage is that it needs to be printable
for
> use as a poster (normal paper
> size) for posting at local bike shops.
>
> Once that is set, I will need some of you to volunteer to print and
post
> the poster at your local bike shop.
> This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike nights.
>
> One note: We will be working with Motorcycle Leather
> Exchange to provide
> free softdrinks for these events.
> Thanks Lisa and Jay.
>
> If you can help with the web design, email me asap.
>
> Thanks
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
> http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:07:20 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:09:48 -0400
To: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
Cc: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

At 11:57 AM 4/29/04 -0400, Dave Yates wrote:
><snippage>
>>Oh, and a free clue for you: the ":-)" sequence is called
>>a "smiley". It indicates that the statement made is not
>>intended seriously. Note that there isn't one on this
>>response.
>
>[Dave] Well... You get what you pay for. :-) The above
>ascii reference is more correctly referred to as
>an "emoticon", but in slang, 'smiley' is acceptable in some
>cases...

"More correctly" according to whom? Has the ISO set up an emoticon
standards group or something? One that is unfamiliar with long-standing
practice?

I'm well aware of the terminology. "Smiley" is a particular "emoticon".
"Emoticon" is the generic term for all little punctuation collections
intended to convey intent (as is done in person with facial expression)
in
e-mail. "Smiley" is the name of the one for "smiling". The ones for
"sticking tongue out", "wry look", "surprise", etc. are not "smileys". I
used a "sniley", so the term is perfectly correct.

>FWIW, emoticons, and smileys in
>particular absolutely enrage Gimer, who I guess is a closet
>ascii purist or something - ;-)

Drat.   I guess I should have put a few in the reply to him then...   :-/

BTW, it's "ASCII", not "ascii". It's an acronym for "American Standard
Code for Information Interchange. Speaking of "proper"... :-)



-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:09:15 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:01:38 -0400
To: Paul Wilson <viffermaniac@XXXXXX>,
   Glenn Dysart <glenn_dysart@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 11:31 AM 4/29/04 -0400, Paul Wilson wrote:

>And, IIRC, Scooter has been cross country on his R6. Let us know when
yours leaves the eastern time zone. ;-) << note smiley.

Willdo! Though I expect my initial longer rides to be north-south,
rather
than east-west. The HOGs are heading to Va. Beach in June, and upstate
NY
somewhere around then too. I'm trying to work out a way to get the time
off to go along.

-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:10:16 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:10:09 -0400

Watch out Julian, us Harley types just might take
you up on your offer and you *know* what a bad
influence we are to bars. ;-)

-aki


>
> From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/29 Thu PM 01:38:34 EDT
> To: "Mark Kitchell" <markkitchell@XXXXXX>,
>    "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>
>
> Look,
> I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but I work at a nice
> lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good tapas and outdoor
> seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
> Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams Morgan. ( A one and a
> half block walk from Asylum. . I work there Friday's, we have pool,
> eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation dispensation which
> means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are welcome any time I am
> working to introduce yourself and chill. I can customize music, drinks
> and even to a certain degree food.
>
> Cheers
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
> To: DC Cycles
> Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>
> Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in 2004.
> The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
> Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few events
> at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in Adams Morgan.
>
> We really need some list help in promoting these events. Nothing too
> intense, just some web help, postering at local shops and posting on
> other messageboards.
>
> With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design me a slick little
> webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager with some nice
graphics
> and details on the event location, hours, etc. I can then modifiy it
(I
> have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver) each time to suit the
> particular date and location. The only links would be to the actual
> location's website and/or a map. If no one volunteers we continue to
> use the previous version of the Bike Night website:
>
> http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
>
> One critical element of the webpage is that it needs to be printable
for
> use as a poster (normal paper
> size) for posting at local bike shops.
>
> Once that is set, I will need some of you to volunteer to print and
post
> the poster at your local bike shop.
> This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike nights.
>
> One note: We will be working with Motorcycle Leather Exchange to
provide
> free softdrinks for these events.
> Thanks Lisa and Jay.
>
> If you can help with the web design, email me asap.
>
> Thanks
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
> http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover
>
>
>
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:10:18 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:12:53 -0400
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online

At 01:22 PM 4/29/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>Thanks for the support Paul. :-) Anyone know what the next thread
topic
is supposed to be? Have we done the Sping Air thread yet? ;-)

Yeah, we did that one last month when it started getting warm. I think
Cicadas are next (though we already did the thread on them too).

How about "Why emoticons should be used everywhere"?   :-O
-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI   (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:16:30 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:04:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Yes. I am thinking about a Thursday event mid-summer
for Guarapo.


--- ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> Hey Mark and Chuck, I think we just got our first
> volunteer "host" for Bike Night. ;-) Julian, I'll
> have to stop in Zucchabar one Friday. I live in DC
> and can walk to Adams Morgan quite easily. :-)
>
> Scooter
>
> In a message dated 4/29/2004 1:38:34 PM Eastern
> Daylight Time, julian@XXXXXX writes:
>
> >
> >
> >
> > Look,
> > I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but
> I work at a nice
> > lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good
> tapas and outdoor
> > seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and
> Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
> > Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams
> Morgan. ( A one and a
> > half block walk from Asylum. . I work there
> Friday's, we have pool,
> > eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation
> dispensation which
> > means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are
> welcome any time I am
> > working to introduce yourself and chill. I can
> customize music, drinks
> > and even to a certain degree food.
> >
> > Cheers
>   >
>   >
>   > -----Original Message-----
>   > From: Mark Kitchell
>   [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
>   > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
>   > To: DC Cycles
>   > Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>   >
>   > Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in
>   2004.
>   > The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
>   > Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few
>   events
>   > at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in
>   Adams Morgan.
>   >
>   > We really need some list help in promoting these
>   events. Nothing too
>   > intense, just some web help, postering at local
>   shops and posting on
>   > other messageboards.
>   >
>   > With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design
>   me a slick little
>   > webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager
>   with some nice graphics
>   > and details on the event location, hours, etc. I
>   can then modifiy it (I
>   > have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver)
>   each time to suit the
>   > particular date and location. The only links
>   would be to the actual
>   > location's website and/or a map. If no one
>   volunteers we continue to
>   > use the previous version of the Bike Night
>   website:
>   >
>   > http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
>   >
>   > One critical element of the webpage is that it
>   needs to be printable for
>   > use as a poster (normal paper
>   > size) for posting at local bike shops.
>   >
>   > Once that is set, I will need some of you to
>   volunteer to print and post
>   > the poster at your local bike shop.
>   > This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike
>   nights.
>   >
>   > One note: We will be working with Motorcycle
>   Leather
>   > Exchange to provide
>   > free softdrinks for these events.
>   > Thanks Lisa and Jay.
>   >
>   > If you can help with the web design, email me
>   asap.
>   >
>   > Thanks
>   >
>   > Mark
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > __________________________________
>   > Do you Yahoo!?
>   > Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
>   >
>   http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:19:47 2004
Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:23:23 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Mark Kitchell" <markkitchell@XXXXXX>, <ScooterFZR@XXXXXX>,
   <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I am more than willing to help out any way I can.

I read in the WP Style suggestion about a restaurant\bar out towards
Columbia where a lot of bikers go. I forget the name but it sounded like
an interesting excursion. Two other fun ideas would be the Tiki party
at McGarveys in Annapolis or maybe a ride out to Red Eyes on a Sunday.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 2:04 PM
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help

Yes. I am thinking about a Thursday event mid-summer
for Guarapo.


--- ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> Hey Mark and Chuck, I think we just got our first volunteer "host" for

>   Bike Night. ;-) Julian, I'll have to stop in Zucchabar one Friday.
>   I live in DC and can walk to Adams Morgan quite easily. :-)
>
>   Scooter
>
>   In a message dated 4/29/2004 1:38:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
>   julian@XXXXXX writes:
>
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > Look,
>   > I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but
>   I work at a nice
>   > lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good
>   tapas and outdoor
>   > seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and
>   Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
>   > Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams
>   Morgan. ( A one and a
>   > half block walk from Asylum. . I work there
>   Friday's, we have pool,
>   > eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation
>   dispensation which
>   > means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are
>   welcome any time I am
>   > working to introduce yourself and chill. I can
>   customize music, drinks
>   > and even to a certain degree food.
>   >
>   > Cheers
>   >
>   >
>   > -----Original Message-----
>   > From: Mark Kitchell
>   [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
>   > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
>   > To: DC Cycles
>   > Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>   >
>   > Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in
>   2004.
>   > The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
>   > Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few
>   events
>   > at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in
>   Adams Morgan.
>   >
>   > We really need some list help in promoting these
>   events. Nothing too
>   > intense, just some web help, postering at local
>   shops and posting on
>   > other messageboards.
>   >
>   > With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design
>   me a slick little
>   > webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager
>   with some nice graphics
>   > and details on the event location, hours, etc. I
>   can then modifiy it (I
>   > have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver)
>   each time to suit the
>   > particular date and location. The only links
>   would be to the actual
>   > location's website and/or a map. If no one
>   volunteers we continue to
>   > use the previous version of the Bike Night
>   website:
>   >
>   > http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
>   >
>   > One critical element of the webpage is that it
>   needs to be printable for
>   > use as a poster (normal paper
>   > size) for posting at local bike shops.
>   >
>   > Once that is set, I will need some of you to
>   volunteer to print and post
>   > the poster at your local bike shop.
>   > This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike
>   nights.
>   >
>   > One note: We will be working with Motorcycle
>   Leather
>   > Exchange to provide
>   > free softdrinks for these events.
>   > Thanks Lisa and Jay.
>   >
>   > If you can help with the web design, email me
>   asap.
>   >
>   > Thanks
>   >
>   > Mark
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > __________________________________
>   > Do you Yahoo!?
>   > Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
>   >
>   http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:20:46 2004
Subject: RE: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:24:23 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: <adamme1@XXXXXX>, <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

Seriously come on in and say Hello anytime.

-----Original Message-----
From: adamme1@XXXXXX [mailto:adamme1@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 2:10 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help

Watch out Julian, us Harley types just might take you up on your offer
and you *know* what a bad influence we are to bars. ;-)

-aki


>
>   From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/29 Thu PM 01:38:34 EDT
>   To: "Mark Kitchell" <markkitchell@XXXXXX>,
>      "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>   Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>
>
>   Look,
>   I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but I work at a nice
>   lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good tapas and outdoor
>   seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
>   Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams Morgan. ( A one and a

>   half block walk from Asylum. . I work there Friday's, we have pool,
>   eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation dispensation which
>   means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are welcome any time I
>   am working to introduce yourself and chill. I can customize music,
>   drinks and even to a certain degree food.
>
>   Cheers
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
> To: DC Cycles
> Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>
> Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in 2004.
> The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
> Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few events
> at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in Adams Morgan.
>
> We really need some list help in promoting these events. Nothing too
> intense, just some web help, postering at local shops and posting on
> other messageboards.
>
> With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design me a slick little
> webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager with some nice
> graphics and details on the event location, hours, etc. I can then
> modifiy it (I have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver) each
> time to suit the particular date and location. The only links would
> be to the actual location's website and/or a map. If no one
> volunteers we continue to use the previous version of the Bike Night
website:
>
> http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
>
> One critical element of the webpage is that it needs to be printable
> for use as a poster (normal paper
> size) for posting at local bike shops.
>
> Once that is set, I will need some of you to volunteer to print and
> post the poster at your local bike shop.
> This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike nights.
>
> One note: We will be working with Motorcycle Leather Exchange to
> provide free softdrinks for these events.
> Thanks Lisa and Jay.
>
> If you can help with the web design, email me asap.
>
> Thanks
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
> http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover
>
>
>
>
>




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:33:27 2004
From: Jason Picton <j_picton@XXXXXX>
To: "'Julian Halton'" <julian@XXXXXX>,
   Mark Kitchell
       <markkitchell@XXXXXX>, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:32:48 -0400

There's a biker joint in Columbia??? Holy Crap - where!!!

-----Original Message-----
From: Julian Halton [mailto:julian@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 2:23 PM
To: Mark Kitchell; ScooterFZR@XXXXXX; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help


I am more than willing to help out any way I can.

I read in the WP Style suggestion about a restaurant\bar out towards
Columbia where a lot of bikers go. I forget the name but it sounded like
an interesting excursion. Two other fun ideas would be the Tiki party
at McGarveys in Annapolis or maybe a ride out to Red Eyes on a Sunday.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 2:04 PM
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help

Yes. I am thinking about a Thursday event mid-summer
for Guarapo.


--- ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
> Hey Mark and Chuck, I think we just got our first volunteer "host" for

>   Bike Night. ;-) Julian, I'll have to stop in Zucchabar one Friday.
>   I live in DC and can walk to Adams Morgan quite easily. :-)
>
>   Scooter
>
>   In a message dated 4/29/2004 1:38:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
>   julian@XXXXXX writes:
>
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > Look,
>   > I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but
>   I work at a nice
>   > lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good
>   tapas and outdoor
>   > seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and
>   Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
>   > Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams
>   Morgan. ( A one and a
>   > half block walk from Asylum. . I work there
>   Friday's, we have pool,
>   > eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation
>   dispensation which
>   > means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are
>   welcome any time I am
>   > working to introduce yourself and chill. I can
>   customize music, drinks
>   > and even to a certain degree food.
>   >
>   > Cheers
>   >
>   >
>   > -----Original Message-----
>   > From: Mark Kitchell
>   [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
>   > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
>   > To: DC Cycles
>   > Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>   >
>   > Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in
>   2004.
>   > The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
>   > Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few
>   events
>   > at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in
>   Adams Morgan.
>   >
>   > We really need some list help in promoting these
>   events. Nothing too
>   > intense, just some web help, postering at local
>   shops and posting on
>   > other messageboards.
>   >
>   > With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design
>   me a slick little
>   > webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager
>   with some nice graphics
>   > and details on the event location, hours, etc. I
>   can then modifiy it (I
>   > have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver)
>   each time to suit the
>   > particular date and location. The only links
>   would be to the actual
>   > location's website and/or a map. If no one
>   volunteers we continue to
>   > use the previous version of the Bike Night
>   website:
>   >
>   > http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
>   >
>   > One critical element of the webpage is that it
>   needs to be printable for
>   > use as a poster (normal paper
>   > size) for posting at local bike shops.
>   >
>   > Once that is set, I will need some of you to
>   volunteer to print and post
>   > the poster at your local bike shop.
>   > This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike
>   nights.
>   >
>   > One note: We will be working with Motorcycle
>   Leather
>   > Exchange to provide
>   > free softdrinks for these events.
>   > Thanks Lisa and Jay.
>   >
>   > If you can help with the web design, email me
>   asap.
>   >
>   > Thanks
>   >
>   > Mark
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > __________________________________
>   > Do you Yahoo!?
>   > Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
>   >
>   http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover



From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:35:15 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:34:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Daniel H. Brown" <brown@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help

On Thu, 29 Apr 2004, Mark Kitchell wrote:

>   Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 11:04:29 -0700 (PDT)
>   From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
>   To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>   Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>
>   Yes. I am thinking about a Thursday event mid-summer
>   for Guarapo.

While I really dig the food there, the parking lot is... difficult on a
good night. Might want to at least warn the other businesses in the
same strip.



--
Dan Brown
brown@XXXXXX

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:35:24 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:35:12 -0400
Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help

Wait are these the same Harley types that trailer their bikes out to
Sturgis and back?? Sounds like you'll need to stock up on Dewar's and
Heineken, Julian...

;-)

-Sean

adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:

> Watch out Julian, us Harley types just might take
> you up on your offer and you *know* what a bad
> influence we are to bars. ;-)
>
> -aki
>
>
>
>>From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
>>Date: 2004/04/29 Thu PM 01:38:34 EDT
>>To: "Mark Kitchell" <markkitchell@XXXXXX>,
>>   "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
>>Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>>
>>
>>Look,
>>I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but I work at a nice
>>lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good tapas and outdoor
>>seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and Thursday. (Gua-rapo 2039
>>Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams Morgan. ( A one and a
>>half block walk from Asylum. . I work there Friday's, we have pool,
>>eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation dispensation which
>>means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are welcome any time I am
>>working to introduce yourself and chill. I can customize music, drinks
>>and even to a certain degree food.
>>
>>Cheers
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
>>Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
>>To: DC Cycles
>>Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>>
>>Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in 2004.
>>The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
>>Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few events
>>at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in Adams Morgan.
>>
>>We really need some list help in promoting these events. Nothing too
>>intense, just some web help, postering at local shops and posting on
>>other messageboards.
>>
>>With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design me a slick little
>>webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager with some nice
graphics
>>and details on the event location, hours, etc. I can then modifiy it
(I
>>have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver) each time to suit the
>>particular date and location. The only links would be to the actual
>>location's website and/or a map. If no one volunteers we continue to
>>use the previous version of the Bike Night website:
>>
>>http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
>>
>>One critical element of the webpage is that it needs to be printable
for
>>use as a poster (normal paper
>>size) for posting at local bike shops.
>>
>>Once that is set, I will need some of you to volunteer to print and
post
>>the poster at your local bike shop.
>>This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike nights.
>>
>>One note: We will be working with Motorcycle Leather Exchange to
provide
>>free softdrinks for these events.
>>Thanks Lisa and Jay.
>>
>>If you can help with the web design, email me asap.
>>
>>Thanks
>>
>>Mark
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>__________________________________
>>Do you Yahoo!?
>>Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
>>http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:49:02 2004
From: "Perry Coleman" <perrycoleman@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Rockville Barnes and Noble
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:48:50 -0400

Anyone doing the Thursday night hangout at Barnes and Noble in Rockville?

Perry

_________________________________________________________________
MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page   )B–
FREE
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 14:52:09 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:49:23 -0400
From: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>
To: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>
CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online



Dave Yates wrote:
> FWIW, emoticons, and smileys in
> particular absolutely enrage Gimer, who I guess is a closet
> ascii purist or something - ;-)
whelp, guess he'll hate me.   :~)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 15:04:19 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 15:04:09 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Gimer hates everyone.    That's his charm.   :-)

Sorry TG, you did sorta stick up for me but, it was just too easy to
respond to this one. LOL

Scooter

In a message dated 4/29/2004 2:49:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
skip@XXXXXX writes:

>
>   Dave Yates wrote:
>   > FWIW, emoticons, and smileys in
>   > particular absolutely enrage Gimer, who I guess is a
>   closet
>   > ascii purist or something - ;-)
>
>
>   whelp, guess he'll hate me.   :~)

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 16:00:11 2004
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 12:59:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX,
   dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
> At 04:38 AM 4/29/04 -0700, Tom Gimer wrote:
> >--- Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX> wrote:
>
> >> I don't commute at all (my office is in my house). I
> >> thought you sport
> >> bike guys *rode*? You are always ragging on Harley
> >> owners for never riding
> >> their bikes, but it seems that this newbie Harley
> rider
> >> has over twice the
> >> mileage since October that you do...want some ketchup
> >> with that crow? :-)
> >
> >jesus h., you put a quarter of the mileage on one ride
> on
> >the SLAB two weeks ago. the rest of the mileage sounds
>    >like it has been logged riding to battleys and back.
>    >please get over yourself!
>
>    Let's see, 306 times four is....1224. That's not real
>    close to "a bit over
>    2600" now, is it? Was it the reading comprehension or
>    the math that you
>    skipped in school?

i basically skipped every class ever offered.

as for my calculation, does is sound any better that you're
patting yourself on the back for, in a 6 month period, 8
rides rather than 4?



>    >> Looks like sportbikers are the ones with the "garage
>    >> jewelry"... :-)
>    >
>    >it takes a big leap to attribute scooter's habits to the
>    >rest of us.
>
>    No bigger than the one that attributes one's favorite
>    Harley non-rider to
>    all Harley riders.

?



>    Oh, and a free clue for you: the ":-)" sequence is
>    called a "smiley". It
>    indicates that the statement made is not intended
>    seriously. Note that
>    there isn't one on this response.

:|



>    >as for carl, we all know he commuted ~100 miles per day.
>
>    >should we worship him for choosing an h-d over an
>    econobox?
>
>    Sounds like a plan.

:|



--
tg
=====
Thomas H. Gimer <tgimer@XXXXXX>
MURPHY & GIMER, LLC
7940A Wisconsin Avenue
Bethesda, MD 20814
301 913-0060 ext. 11; 301 913-5415 (fax)
http://www.murphygimer.com

**This material is being sent by a law firm and is intended only for the
addressee. Various legal protections including the attorney-client
privilege can apply to this material and no consent is given to its being
read or used by anyone other than the intended recipient. Any other use
is unlawful.




__________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Apr 29 16:06:54 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2004 16:06:47 -0400

I'll have you know sir that I only drink 18yo scotch and only an idiot
trailers to Sturgis. That's what air conditioning, a recliner and the
Discovery channel is for. But I DO wear my do-rag when it's on. Does that
count? :-P

-aki


>
>   From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
>   Date: 2004/04/29 Thu PM 02:35:12 EDT
>   To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>   Subject: Re: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
>
>   Wait are these the same Harley types that trailer their bikes out to
>   Sturgis and back?? Sounds like you'll need to stock up on Dewar's and
>   Heineken, Julian...
>
>   ;-)
>
>   -Sean
>
>   adamme1@XXXXXX wrote:
>
>   > Watch out Julian, us Harley types just might take
> > you up on your offer and you *know* what a bad
> > influence we are to bars. ;-)
> >
> > -aki
> >
> >
> >
> >>From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
> >>Date: 2004/04/29 Thu PM 01:38:34 EDT
> >>To: "Mark Kitchell" <markkitchell@XXXXXX>,
> >>   "DC Cycles" <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
> >>Subject: RE: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
> >>
> >>
> >>Look,
> >>I don't mean to come across as a self promoter but I work at a nice
> >>lounge in Arlington complete with live music, good tapas and outdoor
> >>seating.   I bartend there every Tuesday and Thursday. (Gua-rapo
2039
> >>Wilson Blvd.) I also work At Zucchabar in Adams Morgan. ( A one and
a
> >>half block walk from Asylum. . I work there Friday's, we have pool,
> >>eighties music DJ and I am in control of libation dispensation which
> >>means I can arrange Julian specials. You guys are welcome any time I
am
> >>working to introduce yourself and chill. I can customize music,
drinks
> >>and even to a certain degree food.
> >>
> >>Cheers
> >>
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
> >>Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 12:03 PM
> >>To: DC Cycles
> >>Subject: Bike Nights 2004: Request for Help
> >>
> >>Chuck and I are going to do some Bike Nights in 2004.
> >>The first event is planned for Sunday, May 23rd at
> >>Carpool.   We are also planning to have a few events
> >>at the newly renovated (and enlarged) Asylum in Adams Morgan.
> >>
> >>We really need some list help in promoting these events. Nothing too
> >>intense, just some web help, postering at local shops and posting on
> >>other messageboards.
> >>
> >>With that in mind, can someone volunteer to design me a slick little
> >>webpage? All I am thinking about is a one pager with some nice
graphics
> >>and details on the event location, hours, etc. I can then modifiy it
(I
> >>have a basic knowledge of HTML and Dreamweaver) each time to suit the
> >>particular date and location. The only links would be to the actual
> >>location's website and/or a map. If no one volunteers we continue to
> >>use the previous version of the Bike Night website:
> >>
> >>http://www.geocities.com/bikenight/
> >>
> >>One critical element of the webpage is that it needs to be printable
for
> >>use as a poster (normal paper
> >>size) for posting at local bike shops.
> >>
> >>Once that is set, I will need some of you to volunteer to print and
post
> >>the poster at your local bike shop.
> >>This is vital to getting in new blood for the bike nights.
> >>
> >>One note: We will be working with Motorcycle Leather Exchange to
provide
> >>free softdrinks for these events.
> >>Thanks Lisa and Jay.
> >>
> >>If you can help with the web design, email me asap.
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >>
> >>Mark
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>__________________________________
> >>Do you Yahoo!?
> >>Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
> >>http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
>

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 10:02:47 2004
From: bernescut@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Repair Manual Offered / Needed
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 10:02:15 -0400

Anyone out there recently upgrade to a new bike and have a Honda shop
manual
for a 2000 CBR600F4 that they may want to part with? I thoght I'd check
before forking over the $55.00 the dealership wants. Maybe with IT
budgets
growing someone out there has recently traded up their F4 on something
bigger and no longer needs the repair manual? Since my original
Hurricane
and I have parted company, I have two Honda repair manuals available; one
covers the 87 CBR600F and the other one covers the 87-90 CBR600F. I'd be
willing to trade them for a tiny modicum of fresh ale or lager.

Cedric Bernescut
2000 CBR600F4
Annandale, VA

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 10:14:49 2004
From: "rich hall" <richallmc@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Repair Manual Offered / Needed
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 10:05:59 -0400

Tried Ebay?   That's where I got my Seca II manual.

>From: bernescut@XXXXXX
>To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
>Subject: Repair Manual Offered / Needed
>Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 10:02:15 -0400
>
>Anyone out there recently upgrade to a new bike and have a Honda shop
>manual
>for a 2000 CBR600F4 that they may want to part with? I thoght I'd check
>before forking over the $55.00 the dealership wants. Maybe with IT
budgets
>growing someone out there has recently traded up their F4 on something
>bigger and no longer needs the repair manual? Since my original
Hurricane
>and I have parted company, I have two Honda repair manuals available;
one
>covers the 87 CBR600F and the other one covers the 87-90 CBR600F. I'd
be
>willing to trade them for a tiny modicum of fresh ale or lager.
>
>Cedric Bernescut
>2000 CBR600F4
>Annandale, VA
>

_________________________________________________________________
MSN Toolbar provides one-click access to Hotmail from any Web page   )B–
FREE
download! http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200413ave/direct/01/

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 10:18:18 2004
From: "Sean Steele" <sean@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 10:18:06 -0400
Subject: Re: Repair Manual Offered / Needed

ebay might help you out: http://tinyurl.com/27yya

-Sean

bernescut@XXXXXX wrote:

> Anyone out there recently upgrade to a new bike and have a Honda shop
manual
> for a 2000 CBR600F4 that they may want to part with? I thoght I'd
check
> before forking over the $55.00 the dealership wants. Maybe with IT
budgets
> growing someone out there has recently traded up their F4 on something
> bigger and no longer needs the repair manual? Since my original
Hurricane
> and I have parted company, I have two Honda repair manuals available;
one
> covers the 87 CBR600F and the other one covers the 87-90 CBR600F. I'd
be
> willing to trade them for a tiny modicum of fresh ale or lager.
>
> Cedric Bernescut
> 2000 CBR600F4
> Annandale, VA

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 11:05:30 2004
From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" <Silvera@XXXXXX>
To: "'bernescut@XXXXXX'" <bernescut@XXXXXX>, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE: Repair Manual Offered / Needed
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 11:05:04 -0400

Check eBay I got mine for my gixxer off of eBay for 30.

-----Original Message-----
From: bernescut@XXXXXX [mailto:bernescut@XXXXXX]
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 10:02 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Repair Manual Offered / Needed

Anyone out there recently upgrade to a new bike and have a Honda shop
manual
for a 2000 CBR600F4 that they may want to part with? I thoght I'd check
before forking over the $55.00 the dealership wants. Maybe with IT
budgets
growing someone out there has recently traded up their F4 on something
bigger and no longer needs the repair manual? Since my original
Hurricane
and I have parted company, I have two Honda repair manuals available; one
covers the 87 CBR600F and the other one covers the 87-90 CBR600F. I'd be
willing to trade them for a tiny modicum of fresh ale or lager.

Cedric Bernescut
2000 CBR600F4
Annandale, VA

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 11:25:11 2004
From: "Doug Allis" <dhallis@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: RE Mileage Bragging Rights
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 11:13:49 -0400

You guys are really long distance motorcycle WIMPS! 1200 miles, 2,400
miles
or 5,000 miles a year? Don't talk to me about being a real rider until
you
approach 10,000 miles a year. Q: Which form of transportation do you
prefer
when you are alone and rain is likely? If it is a car, you are not
really a
high mileage rider (unless you live in a desert). Are you comfortable
riding
your bike in heavy rain? If not then you ought to think about how
serious a
rider you really are.

Me? 59,800 miles since May 1999 on my "new" bike. Before that I never
really
bothered to keep track, but 10,000 miles a year is prob a fair guess for
1993-1999.    I now do "slightly" less than 12,000 miles a year average.
Most in one year... close to 15,000, when I rode the Blue Ridge Parkway
and
Skyline Drive down to the dragon, then over to Carolina Beach, back to DC
on
the same route, and then two trips up and around the Finger Lakes in NY
over
some long weekends and a vacation.   My PC-800 likes long twisty rides
the
most, but is comfy enough for the boringest highways that we all have to
deal with sometime. The best part is that the seat is comfy for up to 4
hours at a time, with only streach breaks, the second best part... 4,000
miles on the thing without doing anything but check the oil and air
pressure. True tist not the sportiest bike, but it is one that grows on
you
as you pile on the miles.

Oh, and compared to others that own this bike, I'm a wimp. There are
guys
on the PCcycles list that have put over 200,000 miles on this bike.... in
about 10 years.

_________________________________________________________________
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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 11:48:35 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 11:48:17 -0400
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Troutman <mike@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: RE Mileage Bragging Rights

At 11:13 AM 4/30/2004, Doug Allis wrote:
>You guys are really long distance motorcycle WIMPS! 1200 miles, 2,400
>miles or 5,000 miles a year? Don't talk to me about being a real rider
>until you approach 10,000 miles a year. Q: Which form of transportation
>do you prefer when you are alone and rain is likely? If it is a car,
you
>are not really a high mileage rider (unless you live in a desert). Are
you
>comfortable riding your bike in heavy rain? If not then you ought to
>think about how serious a rider you really are.

Yea for you.

I used to do 10k a year, then back problems and time stealers got in the
way. I don't have the free time on the weekend to ride all day Saturday
or
Sunday, so I commute 60 miles a day on board.

I have a bout 40k on my '97 VFR I bought in '99. If I had more than one
bike, I would be putting well under 5k a year on each bike. I am a
serious
rider that knows better than to judge someone based on the odometer.

And by car standards, your 12k a year is low to average.   I put that many
miles on our spare car running groceries.



___________________________________________
     Mike Troutman
         http://www.troutman.org/vfr
         1997 Honda VFR 750
            AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/
            NMA http://www.motorists.org

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 11:49:47 2004
Subject: Bike Night at Guarapo
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 11:53:23 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>


Checked with the owner of Gua-rapo and he was enthusiastic about a mixed
crowd of half smartly-styled sport bike riders, and half raggedy,
ruffian looking cruiser riders. That ladies and gents, was a Friday
morning joke. Seriously absolutely everybody is welcome. Now given the
detail oriented crew here I will provide some basic info.

2-floor restaurant lounge
Outdoor seating
Parking at back and side on a first come first serve basis

Drinks
Specialty drinks include mojitos ( think mint rum, lime, cane sugar),
caiperinas ( think lime, cane sugar, Brazilian cane liquor) and our
named after the house drinks mixed with various fruit purees
We also have Guinness, Bass, Pilsner, Heineken, Amstel, Miller, Corona,
Sierra Nevada, Negra Modelo, Yuengling by the bottle

Food. The food is Latin-American, central American themed. There is a
mix of tapas (small appetizers) such as ceviche, chorizo, empanadas and
vegetarian dishes, We also serve a decent steak, salmon, tuna and
halibut and sides include rice, lentils, yucca, (large size fries) etc.

Music.
Downstairs after 9:45..we typically have a house band playing Spanish,
Latin American themed tunes. I really like Duende Camaron and they are
usually there Thursdays. Upstairs there is a DJ playing a mix of house
music.

Location.close to 66, 110 and GW Parkway.

It is a fairly laid back, chill type of environment that gives you a
couple of options\environments. If you really don't feel at home there
is also the Irish pub, three doors down.

Cheers all.




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 12:09:11 2004
From: <adamme1@XXXXXX>
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: RE Mileage Bragging Rights
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 12:09:01 -0400


>
> From: "Doug Allis" <dhallis@XXXXXX>
> Date: 2004/04/30 Fri AM 11:13:49 EDT
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: RE Mileage Bragging Rights
>
> You guys are really long distance motorcycle WIMPS! 1200 miles, 2,400
miles
> or 5,000 miles a year? Don't talk to me about being a real rider until
you
> approach 10,000 miles a year. Q: Which form of transportation do you
prefer
> when you are alone and rain is likely? If it is a car, you are not
really a
> high mileage rider (unless you live in a desert). Are you comfortable
riding
> your bike in heavy rain? If not then you ought to think about how
serious a
> rider you really are.

this coming from someone who rides a Pacific Coast? I wouldn't even
consider that a *motorcycle*. More like a huge butt ugly scooter.

Try 15k a year on a 454LTD including freezing rain, snow and even an
occassional hurricane. Bah..the miles I racked up wasn't cruising the
Blueridge Parkway. It was going to work because it was the only mode of
transporation I had so no matter what the weather was, I rode. I'm
willing to bet I racked up 15-20k a year years before momma ever squirted
your PC800 riding butt out on the back seat of that yellow cab.

Now, I don't have that necessity. If it's fucking raining, or even if
the weatherdroid is *thinking* it might rain in another *state*. I'm
riding the cage in. I've earned the right to do that.

>
> Me? 59,800 miles since May 1999 on my "new" bike. Before that I never
really
> bothered to keep track, but 10,000 miles a year is prob a fair guess
for
> 1993-1999.    I now do "slightly" less than 12,000 miles a year
average.

you just started riding in 1993???? Jeezus. Come back when you've got
some REAL riding experience behind you. My first bike was a Honda SL90
in *1973*.

How many miles you've got under your butt doesn't qualify you as "real*
biker any more than owning a GPZ make you a professional racer.

> Most in one year... close to 15,000, when I rode the Blue Ridge Parkway
and
> Skyline Drive down to the dragon, then over to Carolina Beach, back to
DC on
> the same route, and then two trips up and around the Finger Lakes in NY
over
> some long weekends and a vacation.   My PC-800 likes long twisty rides
the
> most, but is comfy enough for the boringest highways that we all have
to
> deal with sometime. The best part is that the seat is comfy for up to
4
> hours at a time, with only streach breaks,

..there are people on this list that ride well past 4 hours without a
stretch break. Don't come waving your little dingie around here thinking
that will impress anyone.
> the second best part... 4,000
> miles on the thing without doing anything but check the oil and air

..unless it get about 500 mpg, I hope you checked the gas
too. ;-)

> pressure. True tist not the sportiest bike, but it is one that grows on
you
> as you pile on the miles.

...like mold.   No thank you.   But to each their own.


>
> Oh, and compared to others that own this bike, I'm a wimp.

..how many people do you share this bike with?   Do you get it every other
weekend? Who pays the insurance? 8-P


> There are guys
> on the PCcycles list that have put over 200,000 miles on this bike....
in
> about 10 years.

...that's not fair, you have a whole army riding the same bike.


:-)   <--- for the humor impared.

  _________________________________________________________________
> FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar )B– get it now!
> http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
>
>


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 12:35:08 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 09:35:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mary Canterbury <mayor_canterbury@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Bike Night at Guarapo
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

I love the place too, but I still think parking is an
issue....


--- Julian Halton <julian@XXXXXX> wrote:
>
> Checked with the owner of Gua-rapo and he was
> enthusiastic about a mixed
> crowd of half smartly-styled sport bike riders, and
>   half raggedy,
>   ruffian looking cruiser riders. That ladies and
>   gents, was a Friday
>   morning joke. Seriously absolutely everybody is
>   welcome. Now given the
>   detail oriented crew here I will provide some basic
>   info.
>
>   2-floor restaurant lounge
>   Outdoor seating
>   Parking at back and side on a first come first serve
>   basis
>
>   Drinks
>   Specialty drinks include mojitos ( think mint rum,
>   lime, cane sugar),
>   caiperinas ( think lime, cane sugar, Brazilian cane
>   liquor) and our
>   named after the house drinks mixed with various
>   fruit purees
>   We also have Guinness, Bass, Pilsner, Heineken,
>   Amstel, Miller, Corona,
>   Sierra Nevada, Negra Modelo, Yuengling by the bottle
>
>   Food. The food is Latin-American, central American
>   themed. There is a
>   mix of tapas (small appetizers) such as ceviche,
>   chorizo, empanadas and
>   vegetarian dishes, We also serve a decent steak,
>   salmon, tuna and
>   halibut and sides include rice, lentils, yucca,
>   (large size fries) etc.
>
>   Music.
>   Downstairs after 9:45..we typically have a house
>   band playing Spanish,
>   Latin American themed tunes. I really like Duende
>   Camaron and they are
>   usually there Thursdays. Upstairs there is a DJ
>   playing a mix of house
>   music.
>
>   Location.close to 66, 110 and GW Parkway.
>
>   It is a fairly laid back, chill type of environment
>   that gives you a
>   couple of options\environments. If you really don't
>   feel at home there
>   is also the Irish pub, three doors down.
>
>   Cheers all.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>




__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 13:23:09 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 13:22:51 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: XM Radio on the bike?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Anyone using XM Radio on their bike? I'm looking at picking up the XM
Roady for a greater variety than my MP3 player and wanted to know if
anyone had experience with this yet?

Scooter

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 13:30:25 2004
From: "customtankbags" <customtankbags@XXXXXX>
To: "Dc-Cycles" <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: XM Radio on the bike?
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 13:30:24 -0400

Quite a few of the LDRiders are running these. There is some problem
with
interference with a GPS, but other than that, everyone seems happy.

LindaT.
http://www.customtankbags.com
Now - TankBags for 1800 Wings
Hollywood, FL
AMA IBA HSTA BMWBMW
99 R1100RT Mr. Buzzy
95 F3 Purple Haze
00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing


-----Original Message-----
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX]
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 1:23 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: XM Radio on the bike?
Anyone using XM Radio on their bike? I'm looking at picking up the XM
Roady
for a greater variety than my MP3 player and wanted to know if anyone had
experience with this yet?

Scooter


From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 13:39:45 2004
From: Bob Meyer <rmeyer9@XXXXXX>
Reply-To: rmeyer9@XXXXXX
To: <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Bike Night at Guarapo
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 13:39:39 -0400

OK, the question becomes....WHEN?

Bob

>
> Checked with the owner of Gua-rapo and he was enthusiastic about a
mixed
> crowd of half smartly-styled sport bike riders, and half raggedy,
> ruffian looking cruiser riders. That ladies and gents, was a Friday
> morning joke. Seriously absolutely everybody is welcome. Now given
the
> detail oriented crew here I will provide some basic info.
>
> 2-floor restaurant lounge
> Outdoor seating
> Parking at back and side on a first come first serve basis
>
> Drinks
> Specialty drinks include mojitos ( think mint rum, lime, cane sugar),
> caiperinas ( think lime, cane sugar, Brazilian cane liquor) and our
> named after the house drinks mixed with various fruit purees
> We also have Guinness, Bass, Pilsner, Heineken, Amstel, Miller, Corona,
> Sierra Nevada, Negra Modelo, Yuengling by the bottle
>
> Food. The food is Latin-American, central American themed. There is a
> mix of tapas (small appetizers) such as ceviche, chorizo, empanadas and
> vegetarian dishes, We also serve a decent steak, salmon, tuna and
> halibut and sides include rice, lentils, yucca, (large size fries) etc.
>
> Music.
> Downstairs after 9:45..we typically have a house band playing Spanish,
> Latin American themed tunes. I really like Duende Camaron and they are
> usually there Thursdays. Upstairs there is a DJ playing a mix of house
> music.
>
> Location.close to 66, 110 and GW Parkway.
>
> It is a fairly laid back, chill type of environment that gives you a
> couple of options\environments. If you really don't feel at home there
> is also the Irish pub, three doors down.
>
> Cheers all.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Bob   Meyer, STOC @ 1157
'01   ST1100 A, "teSTarossa"
'92   ST1100, "red STag"
'02   919, "still looking for a name"

A steady job and a wife have ruined more good bikers....

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 13:48:07 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 10:44:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: XM Radio on the bike?
To: Dc-Cycles <DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX>

Paul Wilson does. He is riding his bike to Ohio as we
speak. Ask him next week.


--- customtankbags <customtankbags@XXXXXX> wrote:
> Quite a few of the LDRiders are running these.
> There is some problem with
> interference with a GPS, but other than that,
> everyone seems happy.
>
> LindaT.
> http://www.customtankbags.com
> Now - TankBags for 1800 Wings
> Hollywood, FL
> AMA IBA HSTA BMWBMW
> 99 R1100RT Mr. Buzzy
> 95 F3 Purple Haze
> 00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 1:23 PM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: XM Radio on the bike?
>
>
> Anyone using XM Radio on their bike? I'm looking at
> picking up the XM Roady
>   for a greater variety than my MP3 player and wanted
>   to know if anyone had
>   experience with this yet?
>
>   Scooter
>
>




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 13:50:25 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 10:43:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Mark Kitchell <markkitchell@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: Bike Night at Guarapo
To: rmeyer9@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Hey. We will def. have a BIke Night there this
summer.

However, the frist official Bike Night is May 23rd at
Carpool. PLease put this on your calenders.

Mark


--- Bob Meyer <rmeyer9@XXXXXX> wrote:
> OK, the question becomes....WHEN?
>
> Bob
>
> >
> > Checked with the owner of Gua-rapo and he was
> enthusiastic about a mixed
> > crowd of half smartly-styled sport bike riders,
> and half raggedy,
> > ruffian looking cruiser riders. That ladies and
> gents, was a Friday
> > morning joke. Seriously absolutely everybody is
> welcome. Now given the
> > detail oriented crew here I will provide some
> basic info.
> >
> > 2-floor restaurant lounge
> > Outdoor seating
> > Parking at back and side on a first come first
> serve basis
> >
>   > Drinks
>   > Specialty drinks include mojitos ( think mint rum,
>   lime, cane sugar),
>   > caiperinas ( think lime, cane sugar, Brazilian
>   cane liquor) and our
>   > named after the house drinks mixed with various
>   fruit purees
>   > We also have Guinness, Bass, Pilsner, Heineken,
>   Amstel, Miller, Corona,
>   > Sierra Nevada, Negra Modelo, Yuengling by the
>   bottle
>   >
>   > Food. The food is Latin-American, central
>   American themed. There is a
>   > mix of tapas (small appetizers) such as ceviche,
>   chorizo, empanadas and
>   > vegetarian dishes, We also serve a decent steak,
>   salmon, tuna and
>   > halibut and sides include rice, lentils, yucca,
>   (large size fries) etc.
>   >
>   > Music.
>   > Downstairs after 9:45..we typically have a house
>   band playing Spanish,
>   > Latin American themed tunes. I really like Duende
>   Camaron and they are
>   > usually there Thursdays. Upstairs there is a DJ
>   playing a mix of house
>   > music.
>   >
>   > Location.close to 66, 110 and GW Parkway.
>   >
>   > It is a fairly laid back, chill type of
>   environment that gives you a
>   > couple of options\environments. If you really
>   don't feel at home there
>   > is also the Irish pub, three doors down.
>   >
>   > Cheers all.
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>
>   Bob   Meyer, STOC @ 1157
>   '01   ST1100 A, "teSTarossa"
>   '92   ST1100, "red STag"
>   '02   919, "still looking for a name"
>
>   A steady job and a wife have ruined more good
> bikers....
>




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 14:14:41 2004
Subject: RE: Bike Night at Guarapo
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 14:18:16 -0400
From: "Julian Halton" <julian@XXXXXX>
To: "Mark Kitchell" <markkitchell@XXXXXX>, <rmeyer9@XXXXXX>,
   <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>

I am in. the 22nd is my birthday so it should be a great week. Saw a
triumph cruiser on Wilson near Ballston this morning, so same at
Shirlington for lunch, is someone on a Triumph (blue and white) stalking
me?

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Kitchell [mailto:markkitchell@XXXXXX]
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 1:44 PM
To: rmeyer9@XXXXXX; dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Bike Night at Guarapo

Hey.   We will def. have a BIke Night there this summer.

However, the frist official Bike Night is May 23rd at Carpool.   PLease
put this on your calenders.

Mark


--- Bob Meyer <rmeyer9@XXXXXX> wrote:
> OK, the question becomes....WHEN?
>
> Bob
>
> >
> > Checked with the owner of Gua-rapo and he was
> enthusiastic about a mixed
> > crowd of half smartly-styled sport bike riders,
> and half raggedy,
> > ruffian looking cruiser riders. That ladies and
> gents, was a Friday
> > morning joke. Seriously absolutely everybody is
> welcome. Now given the
> > detail oriented crew here I will provide some
> basic info.
>   >
>   > 2-floor restaurant lounge
>   > Outdoor seating
>   > Parking at back and side on a first come first
>   serve basis
>   >
>   > Drinks
>   > Specialty drinks include mojitos ( think mint rum,
>   lime, cane sugar),
>   > caiperinas ( think lime, cane sugar, Brazilian
>   cane liquor) and our
>   > named after the house drinks mixed with various
>   fruit purees
>   > We also have Guinness, Bass, Pilsner, Heineken,
>   Amstel, Miller, Corona,
>   > Sierra Nevada, Negra Modelo, Yuengling by the
>   bottle
>   >
>   > Food. The food is Latin-American, central
>   American themed. There is a
>   > mix of tapas (small appetizers) such as ceviche,
>   chorizo, empanadas and
>   > vegetarian dishes, We also serve a decent steak,
>   salmon, tuna and
>   > halibut and sides include rice, lentils, yucca,
>   (large size fries) etc.
>   >
>   > Music.
>   > Downstairs after 9:45..we typically have a house
>   band playing Spanish,
>   > Latin American themed tunes. I really like Duende
>   Camaron and they are
>   > usually there Thursdays. Upstairs there is a DJ
>   playing a mix of house
>   > music.
>   >
>   > Location.close to 66, 110 and GW Parkway.
>   >
>   > It is a fairly laid back, chill type of
>   environment that gives you a
>   > couple of options\environments. If you really
>   don't feel at home there
>   > is also the Irish pub, three doors down.
>   >
>   > Cheers all.
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>
>   Bob   Meyer, STOC @ 1157
>   '01   ST1100 A, "teSTarossa"
>   '92   ST1100, "red STag"
>   '02   919, "still looking for a name"
>
>   A steady job and a wife have ruined more good bikers....
>




__________________________________
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http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover




From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 14:30:18 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 14:30:06 -0400
From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX
To: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: XM Radio on the bike?
X-AOL-IP: 65.86.98.162

Cool.     I don't use my GPS much so, it shouldn't be a problem.   Thanks.
:-)

Scooter

In a message dated 4/30/2004 1:30:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
customtankbags@XXXXXX writes:

>
>
> Quite a few of the LDRiders are running these. There is some problem
with
> interference with a GPS, but other than that, everyone seems happy.
>
> LindaT.
> http://www.customtankbags.com
> Now - TankBags for 1800 Wings
> Hollywood, FL
> AMA IBA HSTA BMWBMW
> 99 R1100RT Mr. Buzzy
> 95 F3 Purple Haze
> 00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX]
> Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 1:23 PM
> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
> Subject: XM Radio on the bike?
>
>
> Anyone using XM Radio on their bike? I'm looking at picking up the XM
Roady
> for a greater variety than my MP3 player and wanted to know
> if anyone had
> experience with this yet?
>
> Scooter

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 15:28:03 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 12:27:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Tom Gimer <t_gimer@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: Skip <skip@XXXXXX>, Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>
Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

--- Skip <skip@XXXXXX> wrote:
>
>
> Dave Yates wrote:
> > FWIW, emoticons, and smileys in
> > particular absolutely enrage Gimer, who I guess is a
> closet
> > ascii purist or something - ;-)
>
>
> whelp, guess he'll hate me. :~)

an emoticon thread?

where is chuck f-ing pena when you need him?   %^)



--
tg




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From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 15:46:44 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 15:46:38 -0400
From: Dave Yates <Dave@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: tars... local and online
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Gimer quizically asks:

>an emoticon thread?
>
>where is chuck f-ing pena when you need him?   %^)

[Dave] Don't know his whereabout T, but ever time he's on
the no spin zone, he holds up little placards with those
pesky emoticons (not smileys) to relay to Bill what he's
trying to convey.
Dave Yates

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 17:37:41 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 17:39:12 -0400
To: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX
From: Mike Bartman <omni@XXXXXX>
Subject: Re: XM Radio on the bike?

At 01:22 PM 4/30/04 -0400, ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote:
>Anyone using XM Radio on their bike? I'm looking at picking up the XM
Roady for a greater variety than my MP3 player and wanted to know if
anyone
had experience with this yet?

There are a   couple of local HOGs who have them. Usually mounted in a
fairing, or   on a RAM mount. One guy has his antenna on the rear fender,
just behind   the passenger pillion. I pointed out that this put a limit
on
the size of   rider he could haul and still have his tunes... ;-)


-- Mike B.

'04 FLSTCI    (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley
folks)

Learning from your mistakes is good.   Learning from someone else's
mistakes
is better.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 17:50:10 2004
From: "Michael Jordan" <mjordan812@XXXXXX>
To: "'Mike Bartman'" <omni@XXXXXX>, <ScooterFZR@XXXXXX>,
   <dc-cycles@XXXXXX>
Subject: RE: XM Radio on the bike?
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 17:49:55 -0400

> >Anyone using XM Radio on their bike?

Quite a few on the LDRider list

Michael J.

From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Apr 30 19:51:24 2004
Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2004 16:51:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Kozyn <mr_vfr@XXXXXX>
Subject: Paging Mr Roach
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX

Hey Brian,

Can you ping me off list?

Tx,
JK




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